GHOST BURR SHOWDOWN: Fuji Royale vs Xeoleo
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- čas přidán 27. 08. 2024
- Have you ever heard of ghost burrs? Does this geometry intrigue you? Curious to hear your thoughts below!
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Router Speed Controller (AC motors only)
www.ecrater.co...
So awesome to meet Lance today at Only Coffee Project in Sydney. If anyone is wondering. Yes Lance is just as awesome in person as he seems in his videos. He happily chatted to a group of fans/coffee nerds for hours despite arriving in Sydney only two hours earlier. No visible jet lag or loss of energy from the man! Huge fan! Extraordinary coffee knowledge.
Can we get some love for Lance?! Love your content! Very intriguing to say the least!
Thank you so much! Videos have been in a major slump lately with views and interaction so I appreciate this loads!
Def heard of the Apex.
Was saving up for it, but life happened.
One day.
Lance on the mission to test and compare every grinder on the planet!
I wish you already had made this video a while back when I was convinced the Xeoleo was a great deal and got one. Never really got a good cup out of it.
Anyways, great work! Always love how your videos have such a deep and quality content and still pretty fun.
I have a smaller Xeoleo with 65mm ghost teeth burrs (the one James Hoffmann trashed) I quite enjoyed the coffee from my Hario switch using it. I use the internal shaker to get rid of the ultra fines. As it only cost me £65 from Amazon I am very happy with it. Obviously my palate is much less refined than yours and I tend to avoid light roasts it suits me.
I've seen these ghost burr grinders used mainly as spice grinders.
Yes!!!! Absolutely love the interview with Zach's brother Seth😂! If you haven't watched the outtakes from that interview, do yourself a favor and check it out, it's hilarious!
Also best thumbnail ever.
I have owned a Fuji Royal R-220 for about 3 years now and have been loving it. I'd always wondered if the Xeoleo did the same thing, so I'm glad to hear that my extra money was well spent. Thanks for the video, Lance!
Yeah common in smaller cafés in Asia, so tried it many times, I 100% agree with the astringency.
For sure. It's funny- the bulk of the fines always spit out at the end. Perhaps one could grind like 5 grams extra and pull the dose cup away before done grinding for a better distribution haha
Havent seen the video yet, just left a comment for the algorithm. Let‘s stop the slump!
Thank you so much!
Commenting for the algo to hopefully boost the views on your work
Thank you so much! Sorely needed lol
I’ve been quite happy with my Xeoleo actually. My palate definitely isn’t as refined as some coffee people but for my Chemex and I, I like it :)
Yep, I've ben enjoying the Fuji Royal too! If anyone wants one, I have two!
I'd love to give one a try! I'm in Houston, TX, USA...
Informative and entertaining as always!
Thanks for doing this!
One small correction: Fengjen (in Taiwan), from whom I bought my R-220, confirmed that it has a brushed DC motor. The speed controller you’re using is listed as compatible with either AC or DC, I believe.
Re: taste, I don’t agree about the astringency, but I grind into that same sort of catch cup with a sieve inside that you mentioned and do a few shakes before dispensing, so maybe fines have something to do with what you noticed.
OE’s Apex is great! I use mine less now that I have the Fuji due mostly to laziness.
Cheers from FL.
Ah yes. I forgot the speed controller works with both ac and BRUSHED DC. I'm used to grinders either having AC or brushless DC lol
And interesting on astringency! It is certainly there for me but to each their own!
(Should be noted I pit almost everything in reference to my ode with ssp and the bentwood)
@@LanceHedrick Thanks for the replies! To follow up, do you know how old this R-220 is that you borrowed? Also, I assume you're running it with a transformer--if so, do you have the transformer plugged into the wall and the speed controller plugged in between the transformer and the grinder?
@@LanceHedrick Fuji is a famous traditional Japanese dark roast grinder. Can't expect a very clean taste for medium to light roasted coffee on it, but it's sweet and delicate when the coffee getting cooler. I often switch to comandante when brewing lighter roast though. For light roast, the Japanese Kalita grinders and Fuji with flat burr seem more popular in Asia.
@@zeppzepp1234i heard the same. However i dont understand how ghost burrs arent good with light roasts, or what is the effect on light roast brews. Maybe you or @LanceHedrick can tell me 🙂
I have a commercial bulk grinder at home (Grindmaster) and it has ghost teeth burrs. I don’t know how well you could dial it in, but it definitely goes fine enough for espresso. Enough to choke my Flair. It even had a Turkish setting. I don’t use it for espresso, as it has rather large steps, but perhaps it would work with a stepless mod. Just thought I’d mention since you said ghost burrs can’t grind fine. Definitely not these grinders, but some models can.
Wow! Another grindmaster user here!
I have a GM ghost burr as well, and I love it for filter coffee. It gives incredible body, and the acidity is always inviting and rounded. I have never made a sharp, harsh, or bitter brew with it.
Although it’s incredibly big and it looks ridiculous on my coffee bar.
Mine gets very fine, and I pull shots on my la pavoni, and the shots are AMAZING.
@@braxtonjens7839 I started looking into the Grindrmaster 810S, which is a bit more compact I think and there is one on sale for Amazon for under $1000. However when I talked to so-called coffee experts, they all dismissed it is as being crude, too big, for commercial use, not variable enough, etc., and said I should get a modern one built for home use, which can cost a lot less for a good one but as much, also. Some of them probably want to sell you coffee grinders that they sell, but one seller on eBay who was selling the Grindmaster 810S, when I asked if it was overkill, should I should get the Breville Smart Brew, which he also sold, so he wasn't necessarily trying to upsell me. I think now my initial instincts were correct, that the Grindmaster would be the best for drip coffee. The only thing is that it seems more difficult to take apart to clean, or does not need cleaning that often inside?
Found router controller to slow down the Xeoleo speed as I did made a big difference. Original RPM on the Xeoleo spins too fast with 120v input as it was designed for 100-110v feeds. Ideal speed control between 8-9 on dial. Below 8 can cause stalling.
Whoa! Saw in another comment you took a trip to Sydney? Sweet, hopefully that means some even more awesome content coming soon, miss my flat whites from my time there!
Been using a Grindmaster 100 series for a while, nice brews. Picked it up for a steal. But it’s not counter friendly, so a smaller grinder is on my mind 🤔💭
Would love to get an apex! Great video. Learned a lot!
Thank you! Appreciate the love
I love my Apex; I would love to see a direct comparison between the Fuji & Apex. :)
@@ogunther1 Lance has been hoping to borrow an Apex from someone........
@@ogunther1 Not to steal Lance's thunder, but I have both grinders on my counter, and both are broken in. I just haven't gotten around to comparing them on HB yet--hopefully over the summer.
@@JoshuaViau Oh nice! If you think about it, give me a shout when you do as I’d definitely be interested in what you find out. :)
Sup Mr. Lance! Keep up the good work man 👊🙌
Love the video Lance!
Thank you!
Fuji and Kalita, can we have a test on this combo too ? They are the benchmark in Japan cafes !
Yes, and the MHW-3Bomber.
Wondering if there is any chance of a Fuji Royal vs OE Apex comparison?
I have a Curtis sitting behind my roaster with burrs like this, used it back in the day before I made a bunnzilla for batch grinding.
Oh nice! I just got in a Bunn for a fun video...
Is your bunnzilla with Lab sweets?
@@LanceHedrick sadly no, just regular 804. I’m not going to be using it anymore, selling the burrs if you want 🤣🤣
Awesome video it was great to hear some more info about ghost burrs. I am currently thinking about getting a dedicated flat burr grinder for my drip/pour over setup. Ode, the Orphan Apex and the vario are currently in the running. (Vario just adds in an availability for espresso which isn’t a bad thing)
I like to see review of the new Timemore Sculpture 078 with 78 mm newly designed ghost burrs, variable speed control, etc. Although I think it is only available in 220 V currently.
0:45 "to grind other things"
Thank you very much for a rare and good review. This grinder is praised as the absolute best in Japan but I was not sure about that because sometimes coffee ground by roastery tastes much better than the one ground by this. I understand why and will explorer better one.
Another great video, Lance! Any chance to see a comparison between the Apex and the Fuji?
I love my Apex but I’m curious if the slower rpm and different ghost burrs produce a better cup than the Fuji?
Also the Apex seems to be know as high retention grinder (I regularly lose 1-2g trying to get 15g out); does the Fuji suffer from the same issue?
I haven't been able to locate one or I would!
@@LanceHedrick ...I also want some Lance mojo on an Apex.
Hi, which machine is better. 1- Delonghi La Specialista Arte Espresso. 2 - BREVILLE VCF153 Barista Max. 3 DELONGHI Dedica EC685M + Sage The Dose Control Pro Coffee Grinder Stainless. Thanks for any responses
I wonder why the fuji creates better cups, maybe it has to do with the burrs being cast? probably is the same reason why the lab sweet burrs are so good, but as of rn we don't have much clue as to why cast burrs make sweeter cups.
My guess is the cast burrs create highly soluble fines to the point where they are almost disolved in the resulting liquid, but thats just a shot in the dark.
I'm not sure. I would say some does have to do with the exact geometry. The spiked tops on the xeoleo seems a bit sus
@@LanceHedrick file the tops down and see what happens
@@LanceHedrick Maybe the cast iron has a rougher texture and grips the beans better, acts more like a mortar and pestle.
I would have liked to see extraction info on french press, as I think of ghost burrs as being best for coarse grind
extraction difference - perhaps different particle surface texture? Kruve sieve eval would be interesting
Yeah I considered it but phew. That's a lot of work to do adequate testing. And sifting only removes portions.
Closing in on 90k subscribers! 👀
Yes! Hopefully by end of weekend! Then the race to 100k!
@@LanceHedrick 🚀
1393 rpm looks like about 60 rpm due to the fps video speed!
I wonder how do those ghost burrs compair to 078 turbo burrs?
I haven’t heard of Fuji Royals rated for outside Japan which is 100V 60Hz AC. Is yours? If not, it probably is spinning at higher RPM. It’s just a motor so probably not such a big deal, but using AC voltage adjuster scares me, and I also wonder if it’s really producing a stable voltage output for consistent RPM. Anyway, I would also add that the selling point of Fuji Royal is that it’s commercial grade, and its build quality and longevity is why the same model is still in production today. Great grinder imho.
They sold 110 volt version in Taiwan only market.
And, China had a 220 volt version (got mine there). Not sure if they RPM is the same though i imagine it should be.
I am wondering how a Xeoleo cup with rpm's reduced actually is. Or whether I still would be better off with a good hand grinder?
I think you can't buy a new cast ghost burrs R-220 now, Fuji Royal change to use stainless steel machined burrs after 2018 or 2019 I guess. Some people say the machined version has a cleaner profile, but I am not sure about that.
I just saw they also now have the cut type burrs as an option, maybe that's what you're thinking of.
Will this router speed controller will work on my Ceado E37SD? is it AC Motor? if so, from a base of 1150 RPM how much can I get it down?
I punched out at 1:41. Hahahaha!
Generally, is there a frequency to adjust burrs on a grinder? Or once every time we change them?
When you say adjust, you mean align or calibrate?
@@LanceHedrick I meant align to get a consistent grind. Speaking of flat burrs
Crazy Question - could you put the 80mm SSP burrs in the Xeoleo to make espresso?? Too high RPM? Could use a speed controller? Would love to see it tested if it could work. Thanks!
They don't fit. This is actually 75mm. And way too thin so the construction can't handle it. You best believe that was my first thought lol
Would you be able to put Fuji burrs on the Xeoleo for an improvement for the less expensive machine?
I doubt it as the fuji burrs are about 1.4mm bigger or so. I'll need to check but currently flying to Australia lol
How are you able to tell percentage wise if one coffee had more extraction than the other?
Using a refractometer! I go over this way of measuring in detail pn my introduction to pourover video!
Are the burrs interchangeable?
What's the sifter you showed at the end? Any link?
Thanks!
It's made by akirakoki!
Do the Fuji burs fit on the Xeoleo?
YEET!
Small rant incoming: shopping for a grinder is a terribly frustrating experience. Unless you're lucky enough to live near a distributor with a store front, there is no meaningful way to compare products. And if you're looking at one of the trendy products that ships direct? Forget about it. Are there any coffee conventions a consumer can go to to taste results from a number of grinders side by side?
A similar problem started over 20 years ago in shopping for stereo hi-fi equipment--fewer and fewer places where you could audition the equipment.
Look like SSPs are still flat burr kings
For me, they certainly are
Can you do a dimmer switch mod to move the rpm control internal?
Yes! I've done it on a grinder (in my budget grinder showdown). Just be careful and have it unplugged, etc
aaargh my eyes! again!
Did you test the grinder in the lowest speed?
Yeah! They both tasted better but the advantage was still largely on fuji
@@LanceHedrick this is so strange, I wonder if is because the geometry or because the roughness of the cast iron, the only reason that I can think of is because more fine are present in the Fuji
Btw for a cast iron burrs did you still rdt the beans?
🎉
🥰🥰🥰
yeet!
If I'm not mistaken, both the xeoleo and Fuji, both use 60mm burrs? Would buying just the Fuji's ghost burrs and placing it in the xeoleo improve it? And I guess to that end, could you just install casted ghost burrs into any of the other 60mm budget grinders (e.g. the Akira koki) yield similar results?
No these use 75mm or so burrs. I measure them in the video somewhere. Not the same as the xeoleo flat burr grinders.
Yo!
Thank you !
Bombdiggity
To avoid astringency, just buy fancier coffee that's not astringent 🙃
Lol good one. I wish that were the case