HOLY- not only the spider lighter can be a symbol of the Web's control through addiction, but John being a smoker has facilitated the plot (aka Web's plan) in the past, mainly him going for a cigarrette and leaving Leitner alone for Elias to bash him with the pipe
My explanation for the Great Twisting timeline weirdness is that someone in-universe just misread a date. We know from Season 1 that Archivists can misread dates, so it isn't impossible.
Definitely a good explanation. My personal headcanon was that Gertrude was just purposefully mis dating statements since we know she actively kept the archive unorganised
Unless of course it is supposed to be like that and it was actually Agnes’ ghost who killed Emma, thereby supporting the idea that what Lynne/Celia saw was indeed Agnes
Pre-learning about the portal at hilltop Rd, I fully believed that the Leitners were previous statements from a previous archive (like alexandria), and after time, the statements manifest power based on their relevant entity. Now that we know more, im CERTAIN that that they're the equivalent of statements from previous cycles, seeing as the tapes were so integral to the web's plan and eventually became the literal Web Annabel sat on. Also, the way multiple leitners are different versions of actual books (boneturners tale being the Canterbury tales, and tales of a field hospital). I think the stories from previous timelines happen again, but different (like the magnus institute being in Manchester rather than london)
Fun fact for those who have not listened to the Q and As eighty million times as I have (I have a problem lol) -- Alex was arguing for having an internet/technology based fear, but he could not come up with something that was not already covered by the other fears (especially the extinction)
God I remember when season 5 first came out and I saw so many people trying to deny that the web was related to the tapes. like, the ART for the PODCAST is of a TAPE RECORDER made of WEBS! i was always so frustrated on tumblr lmao
My favorite way to find old discussions and theories on this series is to go to the tumblrs of people who have been in the fandom for a long time and sort through their tma tag chronologically. You'll find tons of interesting discussions, images, and fanfics from when the show was way newer! It's like reading through a time-capsule! The best place to start would probably be Centauri Anthropology who wrote up detailed analyses on each episode as they went up starting on season two. Their blog is also great since you can find lots of other old blog interacting with the posts who have their own theories and discussions! Sorry for the long comment, I just love doing stuff like this in my free time!
Thank you for the reco ! I'll definitely go have a look to nourish my obsession 🫶 (for others who might read this, I can also recommand to read the reddit thread of each episode, there are some speculations and theories there too)
The way I had no idea about the fear entities until we were specifically told about them and also didn't realise the tapes were a web thing until the final two episodes. I really was just listening to this podcast with no brains in my head. (I listened to the fear explanation sitting in my car in a car park eating sushi. It's a very strong memory for me)
Binary is spiral?? I always saw it as flesh aligned. It took a while but eventually i found it obvious. Its about Sergey's horror, his desire to escape his body, then his failure, how much his existence is changed without a body. How it hurts to think, how cold it is without blood. This is all body horror.
It’s intended to be spiral but is fairly ambiguous. I think the beginning of the statement puts its the most clearly: “Well, that’s what’s terrifying, isn’t it? Your mind is all you are, there’s no backup, or you know, reset, If it goes.“ It’s about preventing the loss of your mind.
Ahh, this one was the subject of so much debate. I remember the wiki for this episode changed the associated entity multiple times before settling on the Spiral. It even had the Extinction listed once. Personally, I would have put my money on the End, what with the whole trying to use technology as means of escaping death and instead becoming trapped in a hellish existence, doomed to be a permanent reminder to others that there is no real escape. Still, I can see why the Spiral also makes sense with the mind connection. Maybe this is one of those cases where multiple entities domains are bleeding into each other.
I thinks Its also worth noting that many stories show that each statement can incorporate multiple Fears. It’s not always one specific one. For example the one about the astronaut in the isolation experiment incorporated elements of the lonely, the vast and the dark. I like your interpretation of it being body horror, and thus flesh aligned. That’s one I hadn’t considered before, and I think it’s fair to say that it could encompass both.
I've had trouble separating certain fears while listening to the show as well but i feel like i kinda figured the Desolation and the Slaughter out. Slaughter is more about faceless violence, like war. It's specifically about ending lives and getting to it as fast as possible and at any cost. (contary to the Hunt that values the chase more than the actual end goal of it) While Desolation is about destroying physical stuff. It's keeping a person alive just so they can watch their house and all their memories burn down. Even if it ends in death, It's about causing pain and suffering to those that survive. I dont know if anyone needed this on a 2months old video but there you all go XD
A bit late but I was around and caught up right before the mid-Season-3 hiatus after episode 100 and I can completely attest to the fact that the fandom figured out Smirke’s Fourteen months before it was revealed in 111, and they got it perfectly right.
It was so fun to watch ! I listened TMA for the first time way after the ending and it was really cool to read the CZcams comments because, spoilers apart, it was like experiencing, years after, being in the fandom ! And people had some really cool theories back there
So I also found the slaughter’s borders were pretty blurry so I made a slaughter oc that embraced that (The Jagged Blade by Artysal on Ao3 if you are interested). I found that the slaughter is very versatile and with a small bit of free will an avatar could aid most if not all of the powers. (If you disagree let me know, I’m interested others opinions).
Also with the idea that the Magnus protocol is our world it could line up canonically considering the arg took place, could also mean nothing but it could root tmagp in our world, if it’s not strictly said it could probably still be an interpretation
What an amazing video omg!!! I'm so happy I found your channel!!! One suggestion (which is purely subjective) - It might be nice to have some sort of very quiet background music? It's nice to set the mood of the video, and also to mask possible imperfections in audio :) So excited to watch more!!!!
interesting! i always struggle to tell apart the stranger and the spiral, i dont know what it is about their statements but being unable to properly perceive reality and the whole, people not being who they seem or being different to you then the rest of the world always are so similar to me
When you comment that Binary is Spiral related, that was the original intention but I think even real life John recognises in a Q&A that it could be somewhat related to Extinction, as it has a lot of its trademarks, in the sense that no fear is really that separated and all bleed into each other
I always try going off of what fear it instils in the statement giver over textual similarities because some entities can manifest differently. But it’s one of those things where it can be up to interpretation yeah!
Btw, I relistened to episode 35 recently and looked at the wiki because i wasnt paying attention to my first listen through, and i think the reason that the person in that tumblr post thought there were 13 fears originally is that in those tunnels that jerry lead the statement giver to, there were 13 branching paths. Of course that isnt taking into account the path that they came in through, making it 14
Love how much people were gunning for Agnes and how she can still win when Annabelle is right there and she CAN and WILL still win and stays going to win!
Web!Martin feels like something that could have happened if things happened slightly different and he was pushed towards the web rather than the lonely. His manipulative behaviour is a trama response but everything he did to become lonely allined kinda felt like a trama response too. In saying that, I think if martin was going to be truly web allined he would have been happy about the fact everyone underestimates him. Way easier to manipulate people if everyone thinks you're incapable of thinking up schemes youself and you're just doing everything your partner wants you to do.
I really hoped for the web Martin theory to be true He's just so Idk Nice(?) - specifically didn't use kind here, he's got specifically nice vibes As u said his default response to danger is fawn (probably bc of his mother being atrocious) and I really wanted it to be a front for something sinister =w= I do like the story he got tho, especially the ending, it's just so fing tragic Also back in season 2 I think I had a small theory that we're gonna get a hint that we are some kind of character as players that received the tapes n r now investigating them for some reason - I'm not sure why exactly but I fully expected to finish an episode and after the click of the tape recorder there would be something different happening I think it was bc I like knowing why exactly in universe I'm hearing this - I don't mind not getting an explanation but I do like em Like in "the Maclwraith statements" where it's all stated to be uploaded to the public to clear one of the characters names and later on to also be proof in case something happens to the main character bc she's investigating shady shizz I really wanted an explanation as to why exactly we're hearing all this essentially=w=
i cant watch this video, sorry.. im mainly listening, so id be required to read the posts in question first and then listen to your comments on them. i think ill search for posts on my own since im a new tma fan and it seems like a fun activity. glad tma fandom is still alive!
@@PinkelotjeArtI mean dutch people usually seem to either have a caveman accent or an almost british-australian hybrid accent and you definitely have the latter, it's your name that gave it away lol
![The Magnus Protocol theories and thoughts [ep. 11-20]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/Euxa3vOkE9A/mqdefault.jpg)
![The Magnus Protocol theories and thoughts [ep. 11-20]](/img/tr.png)
HOLY- not only the spider lighter can be a symbol of the Web's control through addiction, but John being a smoker has facilitated the plot (aka Web's plan) in the past, mainly him going for a cigarrette and leaving Leitner alone for Elias to bash him with the pipe
Yeeeees. I've always loved that connection.
My explanation for the Great Twisting timeline weirdness is that someone in-universe just misread a date. We know from Season 1 that Archivists can misread dates, so it isn't impossible.
Definitely a good explanation. My personal headcanon was that Gertrude was just purposefully mis dating statements since we know she actively kept the archive unorganised
@@PinkelotjeArt Uuuuu that is a very fun theory that I honestly haven't thought of
Unless of course it is supposed to be like that and it was actually Agnes’ ghost who killed Emma, thereby supporting the idea that what Lynne/Celia saw was indeed Agnes
Pre-learning about the portal at hilltop Rd, I fully believed that the Leitners were previous statements from a previous archive (like alexandria), and after time, the statements manifest power based on their relevant entity.
Now that we know more, im CERTAIN that that they're the equivalent of statements from previous cycles, seeing as the tapes were so integral to the web's plan and eventually became the literal Web Annabel sat on.
Also, the way multiple leitners are different versions of actual books (boneturners tale being the Canterbury tales, and tales of a field hospital). I think the stories from previous timelines happen again, but different (like the magnus institute being in Manchester rather than london)
That's a freaking cool theory
Fun fact for those who have not listened to the Q and As eighty million times as I have (I have a problem lol) -- Alex was arguing for having an internet/technology based fear, but he could not come up with something that was not already covered by the other fears (especially the extinction)
As someone who didnt get into the fandom until a couple months ago, this is especially amazing
I find allot of enjoyment in reading old posts
same!!
God I remember when season 5 first came out and I saw so many people trying to deny that the web was related to the tapes. like, the ART for the PODCAST is of a TAPE RECORDER made of WEBS! i was always so frustrated on tumblr lmao
came for the social pressure, stayed for that cat
good to know the cat is more important then me, I understand
Sad to learn you just figuered that out@@PinkelotjeArt
My favorite way to find old discussions and theories on this series is to go to the tumblrs of people who have been in the fandom for a long time and sort through their tma tag chronologically. You'll find tons of interesting discussions, images, and fanfics from when the show was way newer! It's like reading through a time-capsule!
The best place to start would probably be Centauri Anthropology who wrote up detailed analyses on each episode as they went up starting on season two. Their blog is also great since you can find lots of other old blog interacting with the posts who have their own theories and discussions! Sorry for the long comment, I just love doing stuff like this in my free time!
Thank you for the reco ! I'll definitely go have a look to nourish my obsession 🫶 (for others who might read this, I can also recommand to read the reddit thread of each episode, there are some speculations and theories there too)
The way I had no idea about the fear entities until we were specifically told about them and also didn't realise the tapes were a web thing until the final two episodes. I really was just listening to this podcast with no brains in my head. (I listened to the fear explanation sitting in my car in a car park eating sushi. It's a very strong memory for me)
Binary is spiral?? I always saw it as flesh aligned. It took a while but eventually i found it obvious. Its about Sergey's horror, his desire to escape his body, then his failure, how much his existence is changed without a body. How it hurts to think, how cold it is without blood. This is all body horror.
It’s intended to be spiral but is fairly ambiguous. I think the beginning of the statement puts its the most clearly: “Well, that’s what’s terrifying, isn’t it? Your mind is all you are, there’s no backup, or you know, reset, If it goes.“ It’s about preventing the loss of your mind.
I THOUGHT IT WAS WEB?????
Ahh, this one was the subject of so much debate. I remember the wiki for this episode changed the associated entity multiple times before settling on the Spiral. It even had the Extinction listed once.
Personally, I would have put my money on the End, what with the whole trying to use technology as means of escaping death and instead becoming trapped in a hellish existence, doomed to be a permanent reminder to others that there is no real escape.
Still, I can see why the Spiral also makes sense with the mind connection. Maybe this is one of those cases where multiple entities domains are bleeding into each other.
Oh jeez I was convinced Binary was Eye. With a focus on the isolating effects of unwanted knowledge
I thinks Its also worth noting that many stories show that each statement can incorporate multiple Fears. It’s not always one specific one. For example the one about the astronaut in the isolation experiment incorporated elements of the lonely, the vast and the dark. I like your interpretation of it being body horror, and thus flesh aligned. That’s one I hadn’t considered before, and I think it’s fair to say that it could encompass both.
I've had trouble separating certain fears while listening to the show as well but i feel like i kinda figured the Desolation and the Slaughter out. Slaughter is more about faceless violence, like war. It's specifically about ending lives and getting to it as fast as possible and at any cost. (contary to the Hunt that values the chase more than the actual end goal of it)
While Desolation is about destroying physical stuff. It's keeping a person alive just so they can watch their house and all their memories burn down. Even if it ends in death, It's about causing pain and suffering to those that survive.
I dont know if anyone needed this on a 2months old video but there you all go XD
A bit late but I was around and caught up right before the mid-Season-3 hiatus after episode 100 and I can completely attest to the fact that the fandom figured out Smirke’s Fourteen months before it was revealed in 111, and they got it perfectly right.
This is the perfect small channel recommendation from CZcams omg
It was so fun to watch ! I listened TMA for the first time way after the ending and it was really cool to read the CZcams comments because, spoilers apart, it was like experiencing, years after, being in the fandom ! And people had some really cool theories back there
So I also found the slaughter’s borders were pretty blurry so I made a slaughter oc that embraced that (The Jagged Blade by Artysal on Ao3 if you are interested). I found that the slaughter is very versatile and with a small bit of free will an avatar could aid most if not all of the powers. (If you disagree let me know, I’m interested others opinions).
Also with the idea that the Magnus protocol is our world it could line up canonically considering the arg took place, could also mean nothing but it could root tmagp in our world, if it’s not strictly said it could probably still be an interpretation
What an amazing video omg!!! I'm so happy I found your channel!!! One suggestion (which is purely subjective) - It might be nice to have some sort of very quiet background music? It's nice to set the mood of the video, and also to mask possible imperfections in audio :) So excited to watch more!!!!
interesting! i always struggle to tell apart the stranger and the spiral, i dont know what it is about their statements but being unable to properly perceive reality and the whole, people not being who they seem or being different to you then the rest of the world always are so similar to me
When you comment that Binary is Spiral related, that was the original intention but I think even real life John recognises in a Q&A that it could be somewhat related to Extinction, as it has a lot of its trademarks, in the sense that no fear is really that separated and all bleed into each other
I always try going off of what fear it instils in the statement giver over textual similarities because some entities can manifest differently. But it’s one of those things where it can be up to interpretation yeah!
was such a dumb little tma listener. i had no theories. no thoughts head empty just listening
Btw, I relistened to episode 35 recently and looked at the wiki because i wasnt paying attention to my first listen through, and i think the reason that the person in that tumblr post thought there were 13 fears originally is that in those tunnels that jerry lead the statement giver to, there were 13 branching paths. Of course that isnt taking into account the path that they came in through, making it 14
That actually makes sense!
Love how much people were gunning for Agnes and how she can still win when Annabelle is right there and she CAN and WILL still win and stays going to win!
Came from tiktok stayed for cats(I'm gonna compare these theories with the theories of my friend who hasn't finished tma)
The cat is a payed actor
Web!Martin feels like something that could have happened if things happened slightly different and he was pushed towards the web rather than the lonely. His manipulative behaviour is a trama response but everything he did to become lonely allined kinda felt like a trama response too.
In saying that, I think if martin was going to be truly web allined he would have been happy about the fact everyone underestimates him. Way easier to manipulate people if everyone thinks you're incapable of thinking up schemes youself and you're just doing everything your partner wants you to do.
I really hoped for the web Martin theory to be true
He's just so
Idk
Nice(?) - specifically didn't use kind here, he's got specifically nice vibes
As u said his default response to danger is fawn (probably bc of his mother being atrocious) and I really wanted it to be a front for something sinister =w=
I do like the story he got tho, especially the ending, it's just so fing tragic
Also back in season 2 I think I had a small theory that we're gonna get a hint that we are some kind of character as players that received the tapes n r now investigating them for some reason - I'm not sure why exactly but I fully expected to finish an episode and after the click of the tape recorder there would be something different happening
I think it was bc I like knowing why exactly in universe I'm hearing this - I don't mind not getting an explanation but I do like em
Like in "the Maclwraith statements" where it's all stated to be uploaded to the public to clear one of the characters names and later on to also be proof in case something happens to the main character bc she's investigating shady shizz
I really wanted an explanation as to why exactly we're hearing all this essentially=w=
18:30
That's weird, I tend to conflate the Flesh and the Corruption.
does anyone know where the best place for community discussion is now that protocol is out? I'd love to be more involved this time round
I personally love tumblr for magnus stuff since it’s community is very active.
Me personally I blame Jack Magnet
i cant watch this video, sorry..
im mainly listening, so id be required to read the posts in question first and then listen to your comments on them.
i think ill search for posts on my own since im a new tma fan and it seems like a fun activity.
glad tma fandom is still alive!
Same, she does not enunciate well enough for me to fully understand without also reading the text 🥲
Why are you dutch,,,,
(I'm dutch)
Is my accent that obvious 😭??
@@PinkelotjeArtI mean dutch people usually seem to either have a caveman accent or an almost british-australian hybrid accent and you definitely have the latter, it's your name that gave it away lol
@@Nikowo1610 I forgot for a second that my name exists, yeah that’s a very obvious gave away lol