I mean that's the only way they can match the amount of *moniis* they make from steam. Half of CS2's active players are bots that farms drops and the other half are cheaters. And they do nothing because the gambling addicts spends over a billion dollars on lootboxes despite the rampant cheating problem. Valve only cares about money.
It's insane that Valve is doing absolutely nothing about bots not only ruining their game, but also quite literally sending links to sites that contain something which shares the same acronym as Control Point.
That's not all. They're sending [CHEESE PIZZA] links in game now. In the words of someone else, they are FLAUNTING how much illegal crap they can get away with.
Surely they have direct contact to someone from valve so they should be able to get answers such as if valve cant talk about it due to legal issues etc
"If Valve doesn't care about supporting their games, why should we care about Deadlock?" Thanks for putting it bluntly, man. I've seen quite a few people going "Deadlock doesn't look that bad" or "Deadlock doesn't deserve to be caught in the TF2 crossfire" when tbh it very much should be. Not only is Valve making an Overwatch clone despite pioneering the hero shooter genre, but if Valve doesn't bother with supporting their still popular games outside of MTX, why should we trust the Deadlock servers aren't just gonna be the same clusterfuck of bots their other games are? The Deadlock backlash isn't because people are mad about TF2. It's because Valve has burnt a lot of their good will over the years by making bank off of MTX while their games are in absolute dumpsterfire states competitively. And Deadlock is only hammering that home even harder now.
I joined a server where it was only me and some other guy. It was on pl_pier. No bots, but also no other players. Then, the guy left and I was the only fella on the battlefield. Team fortress 2 is not supposed to be that quiet. Another server I played on was ctf_twofort. Our whole team was engineers, and we built sentries and dispensers to prevent bots from killing us. The whole of red team was bots, and we were keeping them on the server in order to prevent them from flooding other ones. I joined in 2020, and my dad got steam in order to play tf2 with me. I just want to play tf2 with my dad.
I had a similar experience on 2fort, a bunch of Engies set up sentries on the battlements & used The Wrangler to get Snipers before they could get to us while some of us kept nonstop repairing the sentries to keep their ammo up. It's sad as hell that a game can become this. I've been a fan of TF2 for around a decade now & it hurts to see a game that made me who I am today be treated w such disrespect from the creators
Its fucking wild because like a year back some members of the community decided to make their own version of TF2 to fix the bot problem. Valve struck it down because they used TF2 assets for their alpha period (They had planned to swap out assets and were just using them for testing) which shows that they're still watching the community. They'll instantly respond if it'll cut out a portion of their profit but they'll sit there with their hand in their ass about the bots because the game still gets sales without them doing anything. Its so fucking sad.
say it for the people in the back. whats absurd are the excuses made for Valve when they did that when you damn well know they wouldn’t have worked for any other company
@@darthgamer9861 Gamers chastise others for defending AAA companies. At the same time, they slurp/slurp for Valve. And before that, it was Microsoft with Game Pass lmao. Yeah, Steam fanboys have NO room to be berating others for their opinions whatsoever.
I think they don't touch the bots because it's profitable to them. Bot to get items, bots to trade, and two thirds go to valve himself, once through steam cut, the other through dev cut. They make money out of those bots
@@lycanwarrior2137 Tbh i find it idiotic that people hail Gaben and steam and then shit on epic, while steam TAKES 30% off developer sales and hardly ever update their own games even while theyre massively popular (TF2, cs2, dota2). People are sheep
TF2 brought me to Steam 12 years ago and I have nearly 1800 games on their platform now, and over 110 Steam badges. Valve not taking care of this community is absolutely insane.
The problem with bad actors in TF2 goes so much deeper than what's on the surface, and valve KNOWS. It's constantly reported to them and they keep showcasing a horrendous amount of negligence. Thank you for shining light on the situation.
Can we say Valve is the laziest company ever, or is that just an understatement? I remember they tried to make a TV series out of Team Fortress 2, but only the first episode was animated before the budget ran out. It's frustrating that a multimillion-dollar company couldn't afford to create an animation from Team Fortress. And now, when they seem to not care about the bot crisis in their games.
they don’t shit on them? they just ignore it because the code is so messed up that there is no way to fix it and bots are still a problem even you get rid of them they will comeback in some way or somehow.
What makes it worse is that it isn't _JUST_ TF2, it's Valve's major Online games as well. Their Valve Anti-Cheating system has NOT been improved. The whole reason the Bots can run rampant, is because the VAC system doesn't work at all. I heard Rumors that Alpha test runs with Deadlocked on a network, had the game rapidly become Overrun with Bots. It isn't just TF2, Valve is starting to become absurd with their disinterest to actually _STOP_ the Bot Problem.
What really sad is: they can really easily fix the cheating bot problem with their neural network by just detecting inhuman movements and strange shooting patterns. They just need to ramp up the tickrate used by demos (32 tick is max for demos by now. You need more tickrate E.g. to have a better resolution of the crosshair movement) for later bans and simply train the damn thing to automatically detect those bots. Boom instant ban either after few seconds or first kill by normal VAC (see further below my example how to deal with it), or after a delay with their upgraded neural network. Optional: Tie any item drop system to using VAC and the server being listed. Boom no idle bots either since at least CS2 (TF2 not sure) needs you to actually play, kill players and finish a few rounds before the drop happen anyway. For now thousands of bots are actively playing against each other on unlisted servers for said drops. Joke about it is that SEVERAL open source based anti cheats already handled a similar problem since at least the Source 1 era (HL2/CS:S/DOD:S shortly after release) with spin/aim hacking (and similar cheats) players. 99,9% legit ban rate and decent community servers were clean of those fools. All of that without a neural network to begin with. The only issue was wall hack (and similar radar hacks), so a good admin/mod team was still irreplaceable. But that part can be exactly dealt with either their neural network and/or the already existing overwatch system.
Apparently CS:2 is plagued with cheating far far FAR worse than something like Valorant, which has its own proprietary Kernal Level Anti Cheat in a similar vain to something like Easy Anti Cheat, just with the cavieat being that it checks at all times for cheating so that you can't enable any scripts prior to opening the game. Botting is like, the most simple shit to solve, but Valve makes billions off of their taxation of publishers.
@@lotion5238 Sadly, your view on Valorant is heavily biased. That game is plagued with cheaters as well. But since everybody got the placebo kernel level anti cheat, we got from the one extreme "everybody better than me cheat" to the other "nobody cheat because rootkit". All you need is a budget of about 10€ to get an Arduino (or clone), an USB controller hat where you plug in your mouse, get some open source pixel aim bot code, set it up on your PC and boom, rootkit doesn't do shit as it can't detect software running on external hardware. Also I can tell you, as someone working in the IT field since years and also knowing people involved in OS development that everyday use of rootkit is a no go. Even more exposing it to the Internet. Good example for this is what happened to the Genshin Impact rootkit about a year ago. You don't need a rootkit to stop cheating. Most obvious one can be detected without being invasive. Valve had the right idea with it's neural network and community oversight with over watch. Valve just need to gets its shit together and finally configure VAC decently and finalize the neural network as I stated in my last post. They also need to allow community server in the matchmaking queue, with some restriction of course, as cheating is nearly non existent on decent over sighted community server. But we all know it won't happen, since Valve is printing money with the inflicted Item economy of both TF2 and CS2. Bots farming and crafting actually helps them boost said economy and as a company they would be fools to undo that.
@@prrish Says the person who acts like he's played Deadlocked already... Which according to you, should not be the case, since you don't have any videos of you playtesting the alpha version. I pointed out that if _Valve_ doesn't fix their problem that is plaguing ALL their Networked games, it _will_ bite them in the arse. The fact that you focused ONLY on the Deadlocked part seems to tell me that you are either trying to run Damage Control for Valve, never mind that your antics will only hurt them in the long term... ...Or, and this seems more likely, You're a Bothoster who benefits from all this damage and thus don't care if Valve Fizzles out. Either way, You should NOT tell me things when you are actively ignoring the problem, that Valve NEEDS to fix their VAC, as it is connected to ALL their networked games.
MVM is probably one of the few reasons they still keep the game running, players are paying for high odds of not getting a good skin instead of buying them off the market for way cheaper???
Its clear valve wont do anything. I got over 2k hours on tf2 and its pretty much dead to me, i wouldnt rather waste my time on this fixtf2 stuff since i know its useless.
@@d1_town_01 you may as well put in your input for the movement, maybe or may not it could amount to nothing but if it does it'd be best if you put your petition in and whatnot to help it
It’s actually been 8 years since the bots starting to infest official Valve servers. They still kept releasing cases after they squeezed out that tweet 2 years ago. They’re now working on another game while TF2 is in the shitter and CS2 slowly going into the same ditch as well. They have all the resources available to fix this game to a playable state.
the likely cause of why someone would start botting is the headset skull indent increasingly becoming larger after each year the person passes being chronicaly online
For those wondering, The “Band-Aid Fix” basically paywalled new players from using any source of communication in game preventing teamwork in a team based game. Truely masterminds at work over at valve.
Chef Faliszek maintains that some of the smartest people work at valve but I really have a hard time believing it. He's probably one of the smarter ones for leaving them lol
That happened before the savetf2 movement. The bandaid fix they did after that movement was people being able to make 2 votekick votes at the same time, one in RED and one in BLU, lol.
When we're all old and talking about this game I want the conversation to be more like "remember that game we used to play? that was so fun" or some shit not like "Remember that game we used we used to play? Its a shame what happened to it."
2:58 I want to highlight that roughly 60 000 of those daily 80 000 players are idle bots and, a few other thousands cheater bots. And then there is additional trading bots. Currently there is around 20 000 players active at any given time, tho many are discouraged by the bots and the game's miserable state. So if that got fixed, TF2 could see a rise in real player numbers, probably close to actual 40 000 to 50 000 humans every day..
Great observation! However, I don't believe the concurrent player numbers will consistently peak at what you suggested. While that may be beneficial to the game, there are a lot of people who follow the FixTF2 movement because they want to be part of something bigger - not necessarily due to their interest in actually playing the game. In my humble observation and prediction, it'll gain 5,000 players at best in the long term of the game. Surely, fixing the game would draw a crowd that'll try the game for a couple days, though you were suggesting a returning player base which I don't see happening.
@@fraizie6815 fair enough. i can live with an optimistic 25k to 30k estimation. at least it'd be an honest number, and still be around the top 50 of most played games on steam.
@@fio_lume that many real people is a reach ngl, I agree with fraizie, if they fixed TF2, they would get at most a few thousand consistent players. At this point in time over 90% of the "players" you can find in game are not real players. Even when I rarely get on tf2, multiplayers is just so boring, you get 1/15 games where it's not full of bots and cheaters, and it gets ruined by the end of the game. MannVMachine is the only thing that you wouldn't have cheaters ruining your experience, but we all know cheaters plague mvm too just for the rewards. At this point, the legit players spending money on the game need to move on. Stick it to valve and let them know they can't make money off of them anymore. Leave tf2 play something else, the bots and cheaters will remain with no one to target, and valve will make less and less until they shut the game down or fix it.
@@SplarcieRS i also agree with fraizie. but keep in mind: the current average player base is roughly around 18-23k daily. Save TF petition has now over 328K signatures. even if only 3% of people who signed the petition return to play the game regularly, that would put it into the top 50 most played games on steam. And I heavily disagree with "simply moving on". tbh i see this FixTF2 as a very legit last ditch effort to get the company to do something pro-customer. reminder that the social media outcry is coupled with a petition and a soon-to-happen boycott when the next wave of cosmetics release. if nothing happens after that, then yeah, move on. the big problem is that there is no other game that is quite like TF2. it's so different from all the other hero shooters and normal team shooters that nothing has successfully breached into its niche yet. imo The Finals might be the closest current thing yet. all i want is Valve go either "yeah we gonna fix the bot issue" and follow up on it, or say "no lmao" so i know where exactly we stand in their eyes.
The illegal stuff that the bot hosters are doing that Charlie didn't mention includes a Spamming CP links in chat, doxxing, swatting, sending fake bomb threats, and impersonating peoples voices with AI. And just to add salt to injury know that its been proven at least 70% of the playerbase is actually just bots.
*~50% of the players are idle bots, while 20% are cheating bots. (a little less than 50% of the playing players are cheating bots, this is an estimate with the source of I made it the fuck up and I don't have statistics other than 50% of queuing players being bots.)
Unfortunately these problems didn’t start with TF2 and they won’t end, it’s just an effect of a larger problem growing online. There is so much dirty money being made for absolutely no effort at all, a lot of it has to do with “cell block one” types of content/services being sold, if you know what I mean.
@@GolfinhoVoador There's a bot hoster claiming in his profile that he now has 95 active bots and that he is the third biggest bot hoster. I don't think there's as many cheating bots as we thought. Farming bots though... of those there are thousands and thousands.
I want to point out the fact that most of the steamchart players are bots, almost 70% of them are. However there are over 200k players signing the petition
@randomvideoboy1 TF2 is literally not more popular than OW2 even if TF2 wasn’t 70% bots lol, what the fuck are you on. Why are you even bringing up OW2, you just got a hate boner? Why you just making shit up lol.
You know, the next step in case Valve keeps on doing nothing should be to file a class-action lawsuit against Valve for allowing potentially criminal activities within their product's reach. They should be held accountable for the harassment, doxxing, DDOS attacks, endorsing child pornography, swatting and scamming that bot hosters have been allowed to do thanks to their obsolete moderation systems.
@@miguelantunes43 well, i probably would have loads of money, and very little resposibilities, so i wouldnt really care what happens because im set for the rest of my life
Where's the Rockstar Games-like motivation when you need it the most. They got shit done against the GTA6 leaker and he ended up in jail or something like that. Meanwhile Valve is scratching their asses 24/7.
An important correction is that our player numbers are inflated because of those bots & the item farm bots. HOWEVER, many players like myself haven’t joined regularly BECAUSE the bots. They need to fix this shit.
@@huntish3760 ZestyJesus did a great video covering the estimated amount. That said though, while most of us aren’t going to as dedicated to game time like bots, I’d play more often and even participate in case updates if they weren’t a problem.
@@superlife2091 exactly! If it wasn't for the spinbots, there would be so many more actual players at any given moment. I know I would play more often if casual wasn't infested.
this is what happens whenever you philosophically are opposed to "privacy invasion". Games need access to your computer on some level and valve refuses to do it and people still shittalk kernel level anticheat. THIS and COUNTERSTRIKE are the RESULT of this philosophy. Congratulations.
Pretty much. They’ve made it known they hate what they deem “treadmill work”, or work where they keep putting in effort, but it gets them nowhere. They fail to realize though that treadmills help in maintaining health. In short, yeah it’s basically “why should I fix it if I’ll just have to fix it again in the near future?”
when Charlie speaks up, you KNOW the target has fucked up bad. Thanks Charlie (again) for pointing this out and bringing the attention to it, this really needs to work this time.
Imagine a Colosseum where bots who have been compromised are teleported to the map, and they have to duke it out, and the bots that die are banned, even the winners
On the “fixtf2” day my friends and I noticed that some bots were actually starting to miss, seemingly because the hosters were running so many bots all at once their computer was being overloaded
I’m pretty sure we already have the location of one prominent hoster, Omegatronic is Russian. I don’t know Russian laws but it might be harder to get him dealt with.
Not to mention because of valve's changes to "combat" the bots, the bot accounts now have to buy premium before they can do so. Which they do. Which means Valve is currently profiting from letting people advertise and share CP in their game.
Even just buying goods now, you gotta deal with large-scale scalpers buying up stock and selling it at higher prices. ESP for goods people actually need like when there’s shortages, or shoes or concert tickets etc, it’s a nightmare getting any of these three things nowadays unless your adding to the problem yourself
If they don't fix anything, it absolutely will because the VAC system doesn't work. Their business will dissolve if their brand new game is just as unplayable as all their neglected games the same day it comes out.
The problem is bigger than just bots cheating. The owners of the bots are actually harassing players. They are threatening to dox them and are demanding sums of money from players in order to remove the bots from the servers. This isn't just a mere gameplay problem, this is straight up Valve turning a blind eye to their players becoming online victims of predatory and abusive behavior.
Lmao, remember what happened to FluxConure? He beat a cheater and the cheater spammed bots of him all over TF2, getting him banned and kicked a bunch of times.
@@rory8182According to some commentors it wasn't actual CP, just drawings, thankfully, so no cashflow to Epstein & Friends. Still wish they'd stuck to offensive memes like they did in 2020
For those who are unaware or not invested in the TF2 Community. Bot hosters have threatened, slanderred, harrassed and worst of all doxxed and swatted people who spoke out against them and most recently, the bots have been spamming links to Child Porn
@@duckyduckington9736 They are, actually, because nothing they're doing is against the law (since the "CP" in question is just fictional drawings and all the other shit was just made up)
@@joketrainShould add that if doxxing leads to harassment that is a crime, alongside that one thing that is not mentioned is Swatting and DDoS attacks, both of which are illegal
@joketrain friend, at least under U.S. law, simulated CP is still highly illegal to distribute when held obscene, even if possession may still be legal under the First Amendment.
also like 3 or 4 years ago they updated the chat, first you needed to spend 1 dollar in the ingame store to talk in text chat, they voice chat, and after that you couldnt even use the voice commands, like "Medic" (by the way the medic voiceline that classes say has a pre set bind to it) and of course some people didnt bother buying anything for any amount and bot hosters still happily did to spam the chats
If Valve is going to continue to add micro-transactions, then they have the responsibility to upkeep the game to SOME resemblance of playability. it seems they have forgotten this.
Valve's run by Gabe Newell, and his strategy for business is literally just "Do nothing, have competitors repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot, profit". We need Valve to give a damn, not turn into Ubisoft.
Getting your idea of how Valve runs itself from a meme isn't the best way to find its true business philosophy. It isn't really indicative of how Valve operates. For one, Gabe Newell personally has publicly spoken out against shady business practices like cryptocurrency and NFTs. He's a big loudmouth regarding how other companies run their businesses. As the face of the company, Newell doesn't exactly 'do nothing'. He's extremely vocal. With that in mind, Newell's role in Valve's creative or technical output has remained minimal throughout his career, almost exclusively fulfilling the business and funding parts of the company. So if you're trying to point fingers at Gabe Newell for how Valve is neglecting Team Fortress 2, as weird as it sounds, it's unlikely that decision's coming from him. See, outside of executive management, Valve also doesn't have bosses. They switched to a flat organizational structure after Half-Life 2, and haven't looked back. Everyone is free to work on whatever they like, but are also responsible for everything they submit or any potential shortcomings. They also used stacked ranking, meaning a system where workers are compensated based on their contributions in comparison to other workers. Both systems are unique but flawed, and have resulted in positive as well as negative outcomes for the company. But that's a bigger topic for a different conversation. In summary, it's likely Valve's negligence of Team Fortress 2 comes from a genuine lack of desire from its employees to work on Team Fortress 2. I will also add that based on outside speculation, interviews with executive management, and testimony from Valve employees themselves, Half Life: Alyx heavily motivated Valve workers to focus on new projects. Keeping up with an ancient live service game when company morale is high and a lot of energy is being poured into exciting new creative endeavors is counterintuitive for Valve. Not just for the executives, but for the workers.
@@MegaRekless The whole 'work on what you like' system has been dropped in recent years already, and staff is moved to all focus on current 'main' projects, whatever it may be at the time. Be it stuff like steam deck, Half Life Alyx, etc. They could technically move a portion of their team to TF2 and handle the issue... Except the problem with botting crisis is much more complicated due to the fact that they're nigh impossible to actually accurately detect. I'm not talking the aimbotting snipers, I'm talking stuff like bots spamming chat and just votekicking real players whenever they can while pretending to play normally. Aimbotting snipers is fixable with anti-aimbot measures, but there are others, much more devious methods of bot-based griefing already being used that Valve would need to basically implement industry-brand-new countermeasures for that make the whole ordeal simply a waste of time. Valve keeps releasing lootboxes for the game, but it's all community-created content, it's just Valve giving people the absolute minimum. Even that other update a while back was just a bunch of community maps and community gamemodes.
@@Heroman3003 So what you are saying is. We all should go back to playing on Community servers over playing Casual. Like we have before. Before the big Competitive update. That took out the actual Casual Rotation servers among the community servers. Yea not gonna lie I like the idea. Let casual servers rot. Play community only.
@@Heroman3003 I want to believe going back to the old system is the right way. In the same breath, I don’t want to praise Team Fortress 2’s old matchmaking experience. Annoying video intros, constant ads, bad staff, and a litany of other issues that you get when including an unruly crowd of gamers and their servers in server queues. If Valve wants to pass the torch to the players by bringing back community server matchmaking, it has to be exclusive. Uncle Dane, LazyPurple, and other trusted community members who already run multiple well moderated servers need to be at the forefront of this effort. Going back to the exact way things were in the past invites another era of a toxic, poorly moderated, beginner hostile Team Fortress 2.
I think the worst part is there was even a small community dev team that tried to work on getting tf2 fixed an getting it on source 2, all valve did is shut the project down and sue anybody that was willing to continue the Project so they hold the game in the state that its in on Purpose they surely never want to fix it themself but also THEY WONT LET ANYBODY ELSE FIX IT
Alright, if it's treadmill work valve, make single player games. Give us stuff like Portal and Half Life. Alyx proved they still have the talent to do so. Bots can't fuck with you if you're playing a SP game. But they won't, everything has to be live service or they're not interested.
Thank you for making this video Charlie, I knew you'd make one about the situation. TF2 is the favorite game of many people, it's the reason I met great friends today that I hang out with all the time. It just sucks to see it get destroyed like that and let it be abandoned by Valve.
The person in question was Megascatterbomb, a player of TF2 who was trying to create anticheat. They made bomb threats under his name to a school discord server, and MSB has to talk it out with the law enforcement and explain it.
So they're hiring bots to fight Bots kind of like the actual lore of Team Fortress 2 guys hire a elite team of mercenaries to combat each other that have the same ability
For anybody curious, if you play on late nights or the weekend you can get lucky enough to have a slightly normal match, with the occasional bot that gets kicked pretty quickly
@@squidboiwoomy there isnt a pure vanilla community server, there's always some kind of gimmick or things that try ti be vanilla but have class limits and such.
@squidboiwoomy The problem with community servers is the time zone differences. I went to 2nd shift, and the servers that are populated are in another country. Sure, I can join that, but at the cost of 100+ ping and a lack luster expirence. It's like equipping the lock and load. It messes with ALL of your timing.
@@seaweeb2258 that is true, there is definitely not enough community servers, i really hope that this whole movement causes less people to play casual and brings more attention to community servers, causing more people to start hosting them
12 hours after this video is released with 730000 views, the petition has only gained 10k signatures. Really shows how important a link in the description actually is.
He mentioned enough of the petition that if people were to care enough, nothing’s stopping them from googling it and finding it themselves. I’m sorry bro, but this is a nuanced issue so not everyone watching the video cares enough
@DaShikuXI lack of a link in the description immediately made me hesitate. and while I've never played tf2, I think valve is evil as well as the bot hosters and I want their actions to have consequences I'm going to Google it to sign the petition, but I'm certain that a link in the description is extremely important for anyone that cares but doesn't care enough to Google things (which is more common than you appear to think) Edit: ..so the site is giving me a 500 server error. that's PROBABLY contributing to the lack of signs if I'm not the only one experiencing that
something everybody needs to realize, is that the protests can't stop until valve tweets that they'll fix tf2. they need to continue until an actual update is released
Just throwing this in there cause Charlie didn't mention it. The bots insta-killing players isn't the only problem, what happens is bots will recognize other bots on the other team and avoid killing each other whilst completing objectives. To make matters worse, Team Fortress 2 has gamemodes revolving around capturing points, or moving a payload cart to the end zone, in all modes players must capture points or push the cart to progress the match, bots will also capture objectives but if both teams have bots and they'll both simultaneously try to capture the same point, and the point (or the cart) will not sway to either team until only one team is capturing it. This creates deadlocks where the match will not progress at all and becomes a standstills for both teams and when you're up against the only insta-kill infinite range sniper with perfect aim and always knows where you are it makes it impossible to do anything about it. And, steam charts lie to you when it comes to TF2 because bots still contribute to player base. Also, the bots sell child pr0n...
Thanks a ton for bringing attention to this issue Charlie, your voice matters to our community more than you know.
Hey, glad to see you here!
I’M BETTER THAN PENGUINZO + I EXPOSED KOD420 AND HES AFRAID
I’M BETTER THAN PENGUINZO + I EXPOSED KOD420 AND HES AFRAID
I’M BETTER THAN PENGUINZO + I EXPOSED KOD420 AND HES AFRAID
I’M BETTER THAN PENGUINZO + I EXPOSED KOD420 AND HES AFRAID
Valve has the guts to let their games die but still release lootboxes.
I mean that's the only way they can match the amount of *moniis* they make from steam. Half of CS2's active players are bots that farms drops and the other half are cheaters. And they do nothing because the gambling addicts spends over a billion dollars on lootboxes despite the rampant cheating problem. Valve only cares about money.
@randomvideoboy1if you’re going to spam that, then at least correct it
Not really. Bots account for a large portion of that player count.
More like the audacity
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts.
'84,000 players online right now!'
How do we tell him...
Most of them are bots 😔
@@ELIX99999 yes
@@ELIX99999 60-70% to be exact
he didn't even notice how unhealthy the lines looked :(
A good bit of it's still humans though - for a game that's that old it's pretty good.. could be better but.. bots.
It's insane that Valve is doing absolutely nothing about bots not only ruining their game, but also quite literally sending links to sites that contain something which shares the same acronym as Control Point.
Holy shit that's diabolical
I love control point, best gamemode
are they sending links to workshop maps?
@@UnderpaidGuardD9 cp_cheesepizza
@@UnderpaidGuardD9I think we are both thinking of very different MWPS here pal 😂
Now, I agree that it's insane not to do anything about this, but the bandaid fix they put on it was so that they could make money off of the bots
Bot hosters sent fake DMCA claims to the fixtf2 site owner. yikes
If you think that’s bad they did much WORSE.
It's just saying what we need to know about them, they're a bunch of losers with too much time on their hands.
They spam cp links in game
They swatted a guy
That's not all. They're sending [CHEESE PIZZA] links in game now. In the words of someone else, they are FLAUNTING how much illegal crap they can get away with.
The fact that the VA for Medic tweeted about this is sad. He really cares about the community
And the sniper, too.
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
@@Proclesty You threw my neighbor's dog into a woodchipper whilst singing lewd nursery rhymes. You can't be trusted.
Surely they have direct contact to someone from valve so they should be able to get answers such as if valve cant talk about it due to legal issues etc
The voice actors are really genuinely cool people.
"If Valve doesn't care about supporting their games, why should we care about Deadlock?"
Thanks for putting it bluntly, man. I've seen quite a few people going "Deadlock doesn't look that bad" or "Deadlock doesn't deserve to be caught in the TF2 crossfire" when tbh it very much should be. Not only is Valve making an Overwatch clone despite pioneering the hero shooter genre, but if Valve doesn't bother with supporting their still popular games outside of MTX, why should we trust the Deadlock servers aren't just gonna be the same clusterfuck of bots their other games are?
The Deadlock backlash isn't because people are mad about TF2. It's because Valve has burnt a lot of their good will over the years by making bank off of MTX while their games are in absolute dumpsterfire states competitively. And Deadlock is only hammering that home even harder now.
Whats MTX
@@self-proclaimedanimatorif I had to guess? Micro transactions
And we have proof of bots in csgo2 as well, so they have even abandoned their most recent game as well.
Micro Transactions@@self-proclaimedanimator
but now im sure if they took legal action like actualizing the privacy policies they sure could make it so they have to pay millions of dollars
I joined a server where it was only me and some other guy. It was on pl_pier. No bots, but also no other players. Then, the guy left and I was the only fella on the battlefield. Team fortress 2 is not supposed to be that quiet.
Another server I played on was ctf_twofort. Our whole team was engineers, and we built sentries and dispensers to prevent bots from killing us. The whole of red team was bots, and we were keeping them on the server in order to prevent them from flooding other ones.
I joined in 2020, and my dad got steam in order to play tf2 with me. I just want to play tf2 with my dad.
yeah the best servers are the ones where there's just 6 engineers that spawncamp the other team of bots
I had a similar experience on 2fort, a bunch of Engies set up sentries on the battlements & used The Wrangler to get Snipers before they could get to us while some of us kept nonstop repairing the sentries to keep their ammo up. It's sad as hell that a game can become this. I've been a fan of TF2 for around a decade now & it hurts to see a game that made me who I am today be treated w such disrespect from the creators
Did a similar thing on upward used vac medics and demos to arch projectiles on blu and engies on red
:(
Happy fathers day to your dad
Its fucking wild because like a year back some members of the community decided to make their own version of TF2 to fix the bot problem. Valve struck it down because they used TF2 assets for their alpha period (They had planned to swap out assets and were just using them for testing) which shows that they're still watching the community.
They'll instantly respond if it'll cut out a portion of their profit but they'll sit there with their hand in their ass about the bots because the game still gets sales without them doing anything. Its so fucking sad.
say it for the people in the back. whats absurd are the excuses made for Valve when they did that when you damn well know they wouldn’t have worked for any other company
@@darthgamer9861 Gamers chastise others for defending AAA companies. At the same time, they slurp/slurp for Valve. And before that, it was Microsoft with Game Pass lmao. Yeah, Steam fanboys have NO room to be berating others for their opinions whatsoever.
I think they don't touch the bots because it's profitable to them. Bot to get items, bots to trade, and two thirds go to valve himself, once through steam cut, the other through dev cut. They make money out of those bots
@@lycanwarrior2137 Tbh i find it idiotic that people hail Gaben and steam and then shit on epic, while steam TAKES 30% off developer sales and hardly ever update their own games even while theyre massively popular (TF2, cs2, dota2). People are sheep
to be completely fair, that specifically was fair to remove
"So, TF2 is full of bots and fans complain, but the portal series is about bots and players love them? Make up your minds, people."
_-Valve, probably_
Underrated 💀
Lmao
"At least bot aren't annoying in portal"
-Someone else
@@m1nor1ty30 "SPAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAACE!"
Exactly
TF2 brought me to Steam 12 years ago and I have nearly 1800 games on their platform now, and over 110 Steam badges. Valve not taking care of this community is absolutely insane.
Bro I've been using steam since 2012 and I only found out that the trading cards give you badges a week ago
The fact that the creator of omegatronic insulted Rick May...
what's omegatronic?
@@haywirejello a bot creator
@@just57uck even more diabolical
The problem with bad actors in TF2 goes so much deeper than what's on the surface, and valve KNOWS. It's constantly reported to them and they keep showcasing a horrendous amount of negligence. Thank you for shining light on the situation.
Hopefully this brings more people to the cause
Tis the shork man. Nah, this is correct as it gets though, it’s a terrible look of negligance
Valve's customer support is an absolute joke.
Yoo Wssp shork, thanks for all the work on save tf2 and fixtf2!
Can we say Valve is the laziest company ever, or is that just an understatement? I remember they tried to make a TV series out of Team Fortress 2, but only the first episode was animated before the budget ran out. It's frustrating that a multimillion-dollar company couldn't afford to create an animation from Team Fortress. And now, when they seem to not care about the bot crisis in their games.
TF2 players are some of the most loyal, most devoted players in the gaming industry, and valve just shits on them. FixTF2
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
Your pfp is my soldier loadout
they don’t shit on them? they just ignore it because the code is so messed up that there is no way to fix it and bots are still a problem even you get rid of them they will comeback in some way or somehow.
The fact that the community puts up with this sort of treatment is precisely why valve does what it does. Because it can.
Tf2 in gaming is Mona Lisa, too bad Leonardo turned into a trolldier.
What makes it worse is that it isn't _JUST_ TF2, it's Valve's major Online games as well.
Their Valve Anti-Cheating system has NOT been improved. The whole reason the Bots can run rampant, is because the VAC system doesn't work at all.
I heard Rumors that Alpha test runs with Deadlocked on a network, had the game rapidly become Overrun with Bots. It isn't just TF2, Valve is starting to become absurd with their disinterest to actually _STOP_ the Bot Problem.
What really sad is: they can really easily fix the cheating bot problem with their neural network by just detecting inhuman movements and strange shooting patterns. They just need to ramp up the tickrate used by demos (32 tick is max for demos by now. You need more tickrate E.g. to have a better resolution of the crosshair movement) for later bans and simply train the damn thing to automatically detect those bots. Boom instant ban either after few seconds or first kill by normal VAC (see further below my example how to deal with it), or after a delay with their upgraded neural network.
Optional: Tie any item drop system to using VAC and the server being listed. Boom no idle bots either since at least CS2 (TF2 not sure) needs you to actually play, kill players and finish a few rounds before the drop happen anyway. For now thousands of bots are actively playing against each other on unlisted servers for said drops.
Joke about it is that SEVERAL open source based anti cheats already handled a similar problem since at least the Source 1 era (HL2/CS:S/DOD:S shortly after release) with spin/aim hacking (and similar cheats) players. 99,9% legit ban rate and decent community servers were clean of those fools. All of that without a neural network to begin with. The only issue was wall hack (and similar radar hacks), so a good admin/mod team was still irreplaceable. But that part can be exactly dealt with either their neural network and/or the already existing overwatch system.
Apparently CS:2 is plagued with cheating far far FAR worse than something like Valorant, which has its own proprietary Kernal Level Anti Cheat in a similar vain to something like Easy Anti Cheat, just with the cavieat being that it checks at all times for cheating so that you can't enable any scripts prior to opening the game.
Botting is like, the most simple shit to solve, but Valve makes billions off of their taxation of publishers.
@@lotion5238 Sadly, your view on Valorant is heavily biased. That game is plagued with cheaters as well. But since everybody got the placebo kernel level anti cheat, we got from the one extreme "everybody better than me cheat" to the other "nobody cheat because rootkit". All you need is a budget of about 10€ to get an Arduino (or clone), an USB controller hat where you plug in your mouse, get some open source pixel aim bot code, set it up on your PC and boom, rootkit doesn't do shit as it can't detect software running on external hardware.
Also I can tell you, as someone working in the IT field since years and also knowing people involved in OS development that everyday use of rootkit is a no go. Even more exposing it to the Internet. Good example for this is what happened to the Genshin Impact rootkit about a year ago.
You don't need a rootkit to stop cheating. Most obvious one can be detected without being invasive. Valve had the right idea with it's neural network and community oversight with over watch.
Valve just need to gets its shit together and finally configure VAC decently and finalize the neural network as I stated in my last post. They also need to allow community server in the matchmaking queue, with some restriction of course, as cheating is nearly non existent on decent over sighted community server.
But we all know it won't happen, since Valve is printing money with the inflicted Item economy of both TF2 and CS2. Bots farming and crafting actually helps them boost said economy and as a company they would be fools to undo that.
Deadlocked never had a single bot. "I heard rumors" is not a good argument
@@prrish Says the person who acts like he's played Deadlocked already... Which according to you, should not be the case, since you don't have any videos of you playtesting the alpha version.
I pointed out that if _Valve_ doesn't fix their problem that is plaguing ALL their Networked games, it _will_ bite them in the arse.
The fact that you focused ONLY on the Deadlocked part seems to tell me that you are either trying to run Damage Control for Valve, never mind that your antics will only hurt them in the long term...
...Or, and this seems more likely, You're a Bothoster who benefits from all this damage and thus don't care if Valve Fizzles out.
Either way, You should NOT tell me things when you are actively ignoring the problem, that Valve NEEDS to fix their VAC, as it is connected to ALL their networked games.
When Charlie comes back for a part 2 after years you know it’s serious.
Can’t believe we are now at a point where the US Justice System is more likely to fix the game than Value
value?
that's when you know sht is fcked
Delete your account please 🙏@@Norelphy
@@Norelphy You know what he meant
@@Norelphy yeah, you know what he meant
Valve be like: "Fine, here. Bots are removed."
**removes MvM mode**
Valve when tf2 community finally dies 3 millenia from now(because the games just that good):Who could have done such a thing
MF I spilled my coffee 😂
@@nitulthaparKilled by bots this community was not, by the developer it was.
MVM is probably one of the few reasons they still keep the game running, players are paying for high odds of not getting a good skin instead of buying them off the market for way cheaper???
well at least all the toxic MvM players would vanish and hop on fortnite to be toxic there ig.
If it dies, it dies.
We are not staying where we are right now, victory or defeat, WE MARCH
Its clear valve wont do anything. I got over 2k hours on tf2 and its pretty much dead to me, i wouldnt rather waste my time on this fixtf2 stuff since i know its useless.
@@d1_town_01 I rather push Valve to do something that backfires and destroys the game for good.
@@TheTSense no more TF2
@@d1_town_01 you may as well put in your input for the movement, maybe or may not it could amount to nothing but if it does it'd be best if you put your petition in and whatnot to help it
@@d1_town_01 The Pfp checks out
Pretty much a Soyjack
I just realized this mab doesn't need good thumbnails , he just has his face and people click
It’s actually been 8 years since the bots starting to infest official Valve servers.
They still kept releasing cases after they squeezed out that tweet 2 years ago.
They’re now working on another game while TF2 is in the shitter and CS2 slowly going into the same ditch as well.
They have all the resources available to fix this game to a playable state.
the likely cause of why someone would start botting is the headset skull indent increasingly becoming larger after each year the person passes being chronicaly online
MÖNKEY
MONKEY IS HERE!!!
theyre out of touch man, the greed has gotten too strong
Valve: The embodiment of Sloth and Greed
(Also nice to see you here, Mönkey, love your videos)
For those wondering, The “Band-Aid Fix” basically paywalled new players from using any source of communication in game preventing teamwork in a team based game. Truely masterminds at work over at valve.
And most bot hosters can just buy any cheap item for the bots to spam shit in chat, so we're not even back at square one, we're even further back 💀
Hey you gotta give the potted plant some credit
Chef Faliszek maintains that some of the smartest people work at valve but I really have a hard time believing it. He's probably one of the smarter ones for leaving them lol
That happened before the savetf2 movement.
The bandaid fix they did after that movement was people being able to make 2 votekick votes at the same time, one in RED and one in BLU, lol.
That's been a thing even before savetf2
When we're all old and talking about this game I want the conversation to be more like "remember that game we used to play? that was so fun" or some shit not like "Remember that game we used we used to play? Its a shame what happened to it."
2:58
I want to highlight that roughly 60 000 of those daily 80 000 players are idle bots and, a few other thousands cheater bots. And then there is additional trading bots.
Currently there is around 20 000 players active at any given time, tho many are discouraged by the bots and the game's miserable state.
So if that got fixed, TF2 could see a rise in real player numbers, probably close to actual 40 000 to 50 000 humans every day..
Great observation! However, I don't believe the concurrent player numbers will consistently peak at what you suggested. While that may be beneficial to the game, there are a lot of people who follow the FixTF2 movement because they want to be part of something bigger - not necessarily due to their interest in actually playing the game.
In my humble observation and prediction, it'll gain 5,000 players at best in the long term of the game.
Surely, fixing the game would draw a crowd that'll try the game for a couple days, though you were suggesting a returning player base which I don't see happening.
@@fraizie6815 fair enough. i can live with an optimistic 25k to 30k estimation. at least it'd be an honest number, and still be around the top 50 of most played games on steam.
@@fio_lume that many real people is a reach ngl, I agree with fraizie, if they fixed TF2, they would get at most a few thousand consistent players. At this point in time over 90% of the "players" you can find in game are not real players. Even when I rarely get on tf2, multiplayers is just so boring, you get 1/15 games where it's not full of bots and cheaters, and it gets ruined by the end of the game. MannVMachine is the only thing that you wouldn't have cheaters ruining your experience, but we all know cheaters plague mvm too just for the rewards. At this point, the legit players spending money on the game need to move on. Stick it to valve and let them know they can't make money off of them anymore. Leave tf2 play something else, the bots and cheaters will remain with no one to target, and valve will make less and less until they shut the game down or fix it.
@@SplarcieRS i also agree with fraizie. but keep in mind: the current average player base is roughly around 18-23k daily. Save TF petition has now over 328K signatures. even if only 3% of people who signed the petition return to play the game regularly, that would put it into the top 50 most played games on steam.
And I heavily disagree with "simply moving on". tbh i see this FixTF2 as a very legit last ditch effort to get the company to do something pro-customer. reminder that the social media outcry is coupled with a petition and a soon-to-happen boycott when the next wave of cosmetics release.
if nothing happens after that, then yeah, move on. the big problem is that there is no other game that is quite like TF2. it's so different from all the other hero shooters and normal team shooters that nothing has successfully breached into its niche yet. imo The Finals might be the closest current thing yet.
all i want is Valve go either "yeah we gonna fix the bot issue" and follow up on it, or say "no lmao" so i know where exactly we stand in their eyes.
If this movement ever happens a third time before Valve fixes it. We would have counted to 3 before they did
I’M BETTER THAN PENGUINZO + I EXPOSED KOD420 AND HES AFRAID
3rd time’s the charm
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
What in the FUCK is this reply section.
We’re gonna, we all know it.
“Valve isn’t going to want to interact with a community that does this”
They actually don’t anyway
Haha bro 🤣
They don’t interact with the community at all
Or the game for that matter
I’M BETTER THAN PENGUINZO + I EXPOSED KOD420 AND HES AFRAID
@@Proclestyur such a loser irl go talk to ur parents
@@SussyGabrielOFFICIALain’t no one scared of yo bot comments lil bro 😭😭🙏
The bots are so bad both teams are teaming to kill the bots and trying to kick them only for them to get added again
Plot twist, Sneako broke into Charlie's house and adjusted his camera to make him look smaller
Sneako is quite sneaky
The illegal stuff that the bot hosters are doing that Charlie didn't mention includes a
Spamming CP links in chat, doxxing, swatting, sending fake bomb threats, and impersonating peoples voices with AI. And just to add salt to injury know that its been proven at least 70% of the playerbase is actually just bots.
*~50% of the players are idle bots, while 20% are cheating bots. (a little less than 50% of the playing players are cheating bots, this is an estimate with the source of I made it the fuck up and I don't have statistics other than 50% of queuing players being bots.)
Unfortunately these problems didn’t start with TF2 and they won’t end, it’s just an effect of a larger problem growing online. There is so much dirty money being made for absolutely no effort at all, a lot of it has to do with “cell block one” types of content/services being sold, if you know what I mean.
@@Capiosusthere are around 11k real/cheating bot players in peak hours btw
@@GolfinhoVoador There's a bot hoster claiming in his profile that he now has 95 active bots and that he is the third biggest bot hoster. I don't think there's as many cheating bots as we thought. Farming bots though... of those there are thousands and thousands.
@@Mavis847 Found the cheater
I want to point out the fact that most of the steamchart players are bots, almost 70% of them are. However there are over 200k players signing the petition
Bot numbers are actually around 70% Zesty Jesus did the math.
@@TamakiDamoismyhusbando Right, I'm gonna correct it
@@pitbowl 👍
There are around ~30k real players and the rest are supposedly bots.
@randomvideoboy1 TF2 is literally not more popular than OW2 even if TF2 wasn’t 70% bots lol, what the fuck are you on. Why are you even bringing up OW2, you just got a hate boner? Why you just making shit up lol.
Someone needs to show him the zestyjesus video "TF2: Nobodys Home"
exactly, the numbers for the playernumbers are mostly botnets
You know, the next step in case Valve keeps on doing nothing should be to file a class-action lawsuit against Valve for allowing potentially criminal activities within their product's reach. They should be held accountable for the harassment, doxxing, DDOS attacks, endorsing child pornography, swatting and scamming that bot hosters have been allowed to do thanks to their obsolete moderation systems.
There he is
Took a bit but now i think we‘re back on the map with this movement
Greeting workshop review guy
Time is all it takes, and time is the only thing we can wait on to see if valve does Fucking Anything.
Can you comment on :The First Stand-Up Comedy Special Written Entirely By Bots.
@@KFCcycletrash
Now it's a waiting game to see what valve does
CS2 is full of bots too. Valve forgot how to be a company.
They simply don't care because they only care about money
@@AMD_H.16Can’t make money if you've killed off your player bases. They’re practically shooting themselves in the foot.
Tbh if i was an executive at valve i wouldnt really care
@@determinationincarnation lol, explain
@@miguelantunes43 well, i probably would have loads of money, and very little resposibilities, so i wouldnt really care what happens because im set for the rest of my life
Where's the Rockstar Games-like motivation when you need it the most. They got shit done against the GTA6 leaker and he ended up in jail or something like that.
Meanwhile Valve is scratching their asses 24/7.
We even have the voice actor for medic on our side and they still won't bloody listen
An important correction is that our player numbers are inflated because of those bots & the item farm bots. HOWEVER, many players like myself haven’t joined regularly BECAUSE the bots. They need to fix this shit.
Yeah it's player number is around 70% bots
@@huntish3760 ZestyJesus did a great video covering the estimated amount. That said though, while most of us aren’t going to as dedicated to game time like bots, I’d play more often and even participate in case updates if they weren’t a problem.
20k max that are bots. It's impossible to even have 5k bots on other games
@@superlife2091 exactly! If it wasn't for the spinbots, there would be so many more actual players at any given moment. I know I would play more often if casual wasn't infested.
this is what happens whenever you philosophically are opposed to "privacy invasion". Games need access to your computer on some level and valve refuses to do it and people still shittalk kernel level anticheat.
THIS and COUNTERSTRIKE are the RESULT of this philosophy. Congratulations.
10:34 “why would I wipe my butt after shitting if I’m gonna have to do it again?” So valve lets it crust?! 💀
It's a burnt crust from the amount of heat they're getting.
Pretty much. They’ve made it known they hate what they deem “treadmill work”, or work where they keep putting in effort, but it gets them nowhere. They fail to realize though that treadmills help in maintaining health.
In short, yeah it’s basically “why should I fix it if I’ll just have to fix it again in the near future?”
that's the analogy yeah.
@@InfernalBanana "why live when we'll die" ahh mentality
Yeah because it creates a layer of armour that prevents the toilet water from splashing their ass 😭
when Charlie speaks up, you KNOW the target has fucked up bad.
Thanks Charlie (again) for pointing this out and bringing the attention to it, this really needs to work this time.
Imagine a Colosseum where bots who have been compromised are teleported to the map, and they have to duke it out, and the bots that die are banned, even the winners
On the “fixtf2” day my friends and I noticed that some bots were actually starting to miss, seemingly because the hosters were running so many bots all at once their computer was being overloaded
Lmfao the bot hosters are so dumb they have no concept of hardware limits
There own success has been their downfall it seems
is that actually how it works?
That's not a new thing. I've seen them miss for months now
my farts are better than Charlie’s farts
Im getting SO SICK of having to basically force corporations into doing the absolute bare minimum.
We're going to have to get used to it considering the absurd amount of boot-lickers and mindless consumers that keep supporting them.
The drive to provide actual quality is a human trait, and most corpo drones have hollowed out their humanity to make room for more money
Valve is the laziest game company ever half their games are fan made mods they just bought 💀
my farts are better than Charlie’s farts
@@jordanbaird8681I don’t think that’s the case of valve
Actually the real playercount is closer to 20,000 than 80,000 as we've since learned, most listed players in the playercount are idle bots.
fun fact- most of the bots are idlers. they actually just exploit daily drops to make bot hosters millions. hence the 70k
The owners of the bots need to be located and legally reprimanded because they are going after players
I’m pretty sure we already have the location of one prominent hoster, Omegatronic is Russian. I don’t know Russian laws but it might be harder to get him dealt with.
We’ll give Putin Ukraine if he gives us the botters
@@robert9016 seems about fair lmao
@@robert9016TRADE OFFER
Putin receives: Ukraine
We receive: Omegatronics head on a pike
@@robert9016hell nah bruv
The worst things I've heard about the bots is that some of them try to solicite and sell CP.
why go in such a roundabout way for it though lol, really? tf2? you already have roblox for that
@@magical571 Perps feel more safe when they go a roundabout way. They often think "there's no way they'll investigate a video game"
Not to mention because of valve's changes to "combat" the bots, the bot accounts now have to buy premium before they can do so. Which they do.
Which means Valve is currently profiting from letting people advertise and share CP in their game.
@@MateAndMeadThey don't buy it, they steal accounts that already have premium.
source? include evidence for a claim like selling CP
At 3:20 he mentions player numbers, about 30%-40% are both accounts afaik
Heard that number is actually closer to *70%*
60,000-70,000 of "players" shown on steam charts are actually idle bots
Bots are becoming a huuuuge problem for the Internet. Gaming/commerce/dating - there is no aspect of the Internet that isn't in serious jeopardy
Dead Internet theory
Even just buying goods now, you gotta deal with large-scale scalpers buying up stock and selling it at higher prices. ESP for goods people actually need like when there’s shortages, or shoes or concert tickets etc, it’s a nightmare getting any of these three things nowadays unless your adding to the problem yourself
who knows you might even be a bot, hell maybe even i am
it could be you it could be me !
@@Iron_Arnie shut up
"The burning you feel? It is shame, valve. "
“Hm? Did you say something?”
Valve, looking up from their money pile
Whenever I used to play, I had about 7 people tell me that there was a bot with my username in their lobby, so apparently they can steal usernames too
Bro anyone can change a username. These bots have been copying people's actual voices
@@jackg6887 Pardon? They can WHAT NOW??
I’m actually hoping that deadlock gets botted because then valve will have to do something about it right? RIGHT?!
If they don't fix anything, it absolutely will because the VAC system doesn't work. Their business will dissolve if their brand new game is just as unplayable as all their neglected games the same day it comes out.
In an alternative universe, bots got fixed and moist became a TF2uber
The good ending
The problem is bigger than just bots cheating.
The owners of the bots are actually harassing players. They are threatening to dox them and are demanding sums of money from players in order to remove the bots from the servers. This isn't just a mere gameplay problem, this is straight up Valve turning a blind eye to their players becoming online victims of predatory and abusive behavior.
And, you know, the CP. That is a slight problem now too
Lmao, remember what happened to FluxConure? He beat a cheater and the cheater spammed bots of him all over TF2, getting him banned and kicked a bunch of times.
@@rory8182Atleast Overwatch has adult porn, Now TF2 has CP lol
@@rory8182According to some commentors it wasn't actual CP, just drawings, thankfully, so no cashflow to Epstein & Friends. Still wish they'd stuck to offensive memes like they did in 2020
I'd wouldn't be surprised this would be foreshadowing and lore-accurate to the next TF2 comic we all hoped for.
Hell yeah. Now we need just one additional thing.
We need the Helldivers to assist us in the badlands.
We weren’t expecting special forces.
Hopefully Charlie can bring major attention to it.
@@DrBright5558 I’m 99% sure we already have their attention, but they’re just unwilling to respond.
Thats the point, sergeant
@@BlueSoulGamer maybe if big influencers talk about it, valve will finally move their asses and do something
Professionals have standards.
"Deadlock is not far out, it's on the horizon." Charlie forgot about Valve Time...
Still holding my breath for Half Life 3.
@CertifiedDoc can't believe we still aint get that yet 😂
@@CertifiedDoc valve cant count to 3, and they kill 2
@@CertifiedDoc I wouldn't L4D2 is 15 years old this year and we never got a sequel to that either. They clearly hate the number 3 lol
Well the game is closed beta right now. They already had to ban cheaters.
Chair suspension drops as the chair gets older. It’s likely sitting lower than it used to.
Valve employees waking up every morning is treadmill work.
I like to think someones breaking into Charlie's house JUST to adjust his camera 1° at a time until he notices
Yeah that's me
@@longshucksgaming Please keep going thx
@jocm99 every time I think he suspects something, I change directions. Also moving his coffee table so he hits his toe
Shrinking is not a joke jim, millions of families suffer every year!
For those who are unaware or not invested in the TF2 Community. Bot hosters have threatened, slanderred, harrassed and worst of all doxxed and swatted people who spoke out against them and most recently, the bots have been spamming links to Child Porn
makes sense, they're criminals and dont realize they aren't safe against the law
@@duckyduckington9736 They are, actually, because nothing they're doing is against the law (since the "CP" in question is just fictional drawings and all the other shit was just made up)
@@joketrainShould add that if doxxing leads to harassment that is a crime, alongside that one thing that is not mentioned is Swatting and DDoS attacks, both of which are illegal
@@joketrain they can sue them for defamation dawg, they can just hold them in court until they go poor.
@joketrain friend, at least under U.S. law, simulated CP is still highly illegal to distribute when held obscene, even if possession may still be legal under the First Amendment.
also like 3 or 4 years ago they updated the chat, first you needed to spend 1 dollar in the ingame store to talk in text chat, they voice chat, and after that you couldnt even use the voice commands, like "Medic" (by the way the medic voiceline that classes say has a pre set bind to it) and of course some people didnt bother buying anything for any amount and bot hosters still happily did to spam the chats
If Valve is going to continue to add micro-transactions, then they have the responsibility to upkeep the game to SOME resemblance of playability.
it seems they have forgotten this.
my farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
@@p-__ get a job
Amen brother
@@artificalthcenthusiast for some reason if you reply directly to the bot, CZcams flags it as a real account....
L-L-L-LONG THE DOOR????
Valve's run by Gabe Newell, and his strategy for business is literally just "Do nothing, have competitors repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot, profit". We need Valve to give a damn, not turn into Ubisoft.
Getting your idea of how Valve runs itself from a meme isn't the best way to find its true business philosophy. It isn't really indicative of how Valve operates.
For one, Gabe Newell personally has publicly spoken out against shady business practices like cryptocurrency and NFTs. He's a big loudmouth regarding how other companies run their businesses. As the face of the company, Newell doesn't exactly 'do nothing'. He's extremely vocal. With that in mind, Newell's role in Valve's creative or technical output has remained minimal throughout his career, almost exclusively fulfilling the business and funding parts of the company.
So if you're trying to point fingers at Gabe Newell for how Valve is neglecting Team Fortress 2, as weird as it sounds, it's unlikely that decision's coming from him.
See, outside of executive management, Valve also doesn't have bosses. They switched to a flat organizational structure after Half-Life 2, and haven't looked back. Everyone is free to work on whatever they like, but are also responsible for everything they submit or any potential shortcomings. They also used stacked ranking, meaning a system where workers are compensated based on their contributions in comparison to other workers. Both systems are unique but flawed, and have resulted in positive as well as negative outcomes for the company. But that's a bigger topic for a different conversation.
In summary, it's likely Valve's negligence of Team Fortress 2 comes from a genuine lack of desire from its employees to work on Team Fortress 2. I will also add that based on outside speculation, interviews with executive management, and testimony from Valve employees themselves, Half Life: Alyx heavily motivated Valve workers to focus on new projects. Keeping up with an ancient live service game when company morale is high and a lot of energy is being poured into exciting new creative endeavors is counterintuitive for Valve. Not just for the executives, but for the workers.
@@MegaRekless The whole 'work on what you like' system has been dropped in recent years already, and staff is moved to all focus on current 'main' projects, whatever it may be at the time. Be it stuff like steam deck, Half Life Alyx, etc. They could technically move a portion of their team to TF2 and handle the issue... Except the problem with botting crisis is much more complicated due to the fact that they're nigh impossible to actually accurately detect. I'm not talking the aimbotting snipers, I'm talking stuff like bots spamming chat and just votekicking real players whenever they can while pretending to play normally. Aimbotting snipers is fixable with anti-aimbot measures, but there are others, much more devious methods of bot-based griefing already being used that Valve would need to basically implement industry-brand-new countermeasures for that make the whole ordeal simply a waste of time. Valve keeps releasing lootboxes for the game, but it's all community-created content, it's just Valve giving people the absolute minimum. Even that other update a while back was just a bunch of community maps and community gamemodes.
@@Heroman3003 So what you are saying is. We all should go back to playing on Community servers over playing Casual. Like we have before. Before the big Competitive update. That took out the actual Casual Rotation servers among the community servers.
Yea not gonna lie I like the idea. Let casual servers rot. Play community only.
@@GikamesShadow MyM was for TF2 what Overwatch 2 was for Overwatch.
@@Heroman3003 I want to believe going back to the old system is the right way. In the same breath, I don’t want to praise Team Fortress 2’s old matchmaking experience. Annoying video intros, constant ads, bad staff, and a litany of other issues that you get when including an unruly crowd of gamers and their servers in server queues.
If Valve wants to pass the torch to the players by bringing back community server matchmaking, it has to be exclusive. Uncle Dane, LazyPurple, and other trusted community members who already run multiple well moderated servers need to be at the forefront of this effort. Going back to the exact way things were in the past invites another era of a toxic, poorly moderated, beginner hostile Team Fortress 2.
The way he described Bot bodyguards is pretty much Horizon Zero Dawn before the apocalypse
3:19 what he doesn't know is that nobody's home.
I think the worst part is there was even a small community dev team that tried to work on getting tf2 fixed an getting it on source 2, all valve did is shut the project down and sue anybody that was willing to continue the Project so they hold the game in the state that its in on Purpose they surely never want to fix it themself but also THEY WONT LET ANYBODY ELSE FIX IT
I'm surprised valve didn't hire them in this scenario because of valve's history of hiring community members.
@@Capiosus Apparently, not when it involves saving a game the company is murdering.
I remember when Valve did this people ran all the defense in the world for them. No more.
Valve really said: how DARE they make an independent tf2 game? Its MY IP to sit on and do nothing with! We must stop them, and fast!
valve described it as "treadmill work"
I guess I should stop breathing because that's treadmill work
"If I stay ontop of my health to stay alive, I will just keep having to deal with those problems, so I guess I should kms" valve logic
Well Gabe is a very rotund individual. Of course his company would describe actually getting something done as "treadmill work"
@@iamthehype3684 Gabe lost a lot of weight though. Nothing rotund about Gabe to be seen now.
@@iamthehype3684
he's actually thin now, he looks like a different person
Alright, if it's treadmill work valve, make single player games. Give us stuff like Portal and Half Life. Alyx proved they still have the talent to do so. Bots can't fuck with you if you're playing a SP game.
But they won't, everything has to be live service or they're not interested.
I wonder if the source spaghetti is so tangled that they no longer remember how to untangle the code...
"Good shot, mate."
"You know what this team needs? Five more sniper"
*275,000 signed this petition*
You’ve done me proud boys, every one of you deserves a medal!
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
Screamin eagles!
Who even are you
@@jdg1251Clearly RichFloyd dude mf can you read!?!
Don't circle jerk
Thank you for making this video Charlie, I knew you'd make one about the situation.
TF2 is the favorite game of many people, it's the reason I met great friends today that I hang out with all the time.
It just sucks to see it get destroyed like that and let it be abandoned by Valve.
its THE MRswipez. FixTF2 because I need more pubstomp spy videos
You're one of my major inspirations to main spy, and it sucks that Valve is trying to ruin their own game.
@@DrBright5558 @colewalshaw158 ❤
Best case cenario is they’re just putting all their resources on deadlock and once it’s out they’re gonna fix bots
6:33 there is a weird bass boost thing. I think he hit the mic
Valve 🤝 Respawn
Not fixing TF2
Clever pun involving Titanfall 2 there
I Sallute you for making a good joke
That’s a good one
lol nice
Wasn't there a massive Titanfall 2 late last year
the bot hosters are bad, they even sent the swat team to a tf2 members house and had him almost shot. very scary
Welp if they can’t continue to waste their lives trying to destroy a beloved game, then why not be the direct reason why someone died?
The person in question was Megascatterbomb, a player of TF2 who was trying to create anticheat. They made bomb threats under his name to a school discord server, and MSB has to talk it out with the law enforcement and explain it.
He wasn't almost shot
@@lonewolfinthetardis2640 i heard they come with guns drawed
@@nkeppy123I heard there were only two officers and they were able to just talk it out, dont know anything about guns
0:12 Your chair actually lowers when you sit on it too much. I too need to readjust my chairs height back up every couple of months.
When i first encountered bots they would talk about how you should go to some website and say you got botted for a chance to win a free cosmetic
So they're hiring bots to fight Bots kind of like the actual lore of Team Fortress 2 guys hire a elite team of mercenaries to combat each other that have the same ability
I hate the fact that people have to make such a massive uproar just to get companies to make their games not even optimized but just plain playable
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
The old Valve is dead, we just see it's body double.
The game became pretty optimized after the x64 update, it's just unplayable because of the bots
Would you rather:
play the game with low frames?
or
Play the game with unplayable matches?
@randomvideoboy1 isnt OW 2 2 years old
Turning tf2 into an RTS mixing and matching different units and trying to take out the other bot-master
WOW I never thought I’d see the day I really hope this does something because I miss playing this with my buddies more than anything
For anybody curious, if you play on late nights or the weekend you can get lucky enough to have a slightly normal match, with the occasional bot that gets kicked pretty quickly
or you could play community servers, sure it's not as easy as just playing casual but there's not a bot in sight
@@squidboiwoomy there isnt a pure vanilla community server, there's always some kind of gimmick or things that try ti be vanilla but have class limits and such.
@@squidboiwoomy that too
@squidboiwoomy The problem with community servers is the time zone differences. I went to 2nd shift, and the servers that are populated are in another country. Sure, I can join that, but at the cost of 100+ ping and a lack luster expirence. It's like equipping the lock and load. It messes with ALL of your timing.
@@seaweeb2258 that is true, there is definitely not enough community servers, i really hope that this whole movement causes less people to play casual and brings more attention to community servers, causing more people to start hosting them
80.000 players and 60.000 bots in private servers farming item drops....
10k bots lmao
Fr??
@@ChurroFreakyep. About a thousand or two of that 60k are the cheater bots
I think zesty Jesus worked it out or had a theoretical amount of bots, it’s like 60-70%
The playerbase is still nothing to scoff at, especially since a lot of the players are eagerly awaiting a fix to return.
I am not trapped in a facility of robots, YOU are all trapped in here with ME!
-solider tf2
damn, that cameras practically on the floor
VALVE: We've tried nothing and we're all out of ideas!
the 64bit update left tf2 basically fine for 1 day
My farts are better than Charlie’s farts 💨
@@p-__ no his are better
@@p-__ Acckshuall y MY FaRTS arte better than youra
Don't respond to bots dumbasses. You're just making them harder to take down.
Nope, 3 entire hours. When the patient woke up from the update, his skeleton was missing, and the doctor was never heard from again!
ill be back in 2 years when this movement pops up again
Damn, even Charlie is on in the action
12 hours after this video is released with 730000 views, the petition has only gained 10k signatures. Really shows how important a link in the description actually is.
Yeah I'm surprised he didn't put a link
Or maybe, just maybe, less people in here actually care than you think.
Why would he? If someone cares about the game they will google it? Why need someone holding your hand with links? Facepalm @@ZentaBon
He mentioned enough of the petition that if people were to care enough, nothing’s stopping them from googling it and finding it themselves. I’m sorry bro, but this is a nuanced issue so not everyone watching the video cares enough
@DaShikuXI lack of a link in the description immediately made me hesitate. and while I've never played tf2, I think valve is evil as well as the bot hosters and I want their actions to have consequences
I'm going to Google it to sign the petition, but I'm certain that a link in the description is extremely important for anyone that cares but doesn't care enough to Google things (which is more common than you appear to think)
Edit: ..so the site is giving me a 500 server error. that's PROBABLY contributing to the lack of signs if I'm not the only one experiencing that
0:01 Minicritical would go hard Ngl
minicrit
the earbud wires hitting the mic made me think i was having a break-in
The vas are actually talking out about it as well, I think we actually have a shot
something everybody needs to realize, is that the protests can't stop until valve tweets that they'll fix tf2. they need to continue until an actual update is released
Valve is a billion-dollar company that acts like it's still a million-dollar company.
Hahah what?? 😂 even a million dollar company could take care of these bots
A million dollar company would actually give a damn about the community, this analogy is weird af
A small business would care
my farts are better than Charlie’s farts
The bigger a company gets, the less they care about their customers imo
thank you! this was much needed
well what can we do we can only just wait
Just throwing this in there cause Charlie didn't mention it. The bots insta-killing players isn't the only problem, what happens is bots will recognize other bots on the other team and avoid killing each other whilst completing objectives. To make matters worse, Team Fortress 2 has gamemodes revolving around capturing points, or moving a payload cart to the end zone, in all modes players must capture points or push the cart to progress the match, bots will also capture objectives but if both teams have bots and they'll both simultaneously try to capture the same point, and the point (or the cart) will not sway to either team until only one team is capturing it. This creates deadlocks where the match will not progress at all and becomes a standstills for both teams and when you're up against the only insta-kill infinite range sniper with perfect aim and always knows where you are it makes it impossible to do anything about it.
And, steam charts lie to you when it comes to TF2 because bots still contribute to player base.
Also, the bots sell child pr0n...
It probably won't be long before the aimbots get programmed to kill human players that are on the same team.
Wait, actually? Like, advertising it, not just linking to it for shock value? Brooooo 💀💀💀
@@acceptablecasualty5319 nah I think it is just shock, ive heard of them sending gore and weird fetish stuff to