2024 Honda CBR650R and CB650R (EClutch) Review - how does it work?
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- čas přidán 31. 05. 2024
- #honda #motorcycle #review
Honda's CBR650R and CB650R have both been updated for 2024 with a fresh look, a light dusting of new bits and, most curiously of all, an optional new system called E-Clutch. An innovative blend of manual gearbox and automatic clutch, it’s a completely different setup to Honda’s love-it-or-hate-it DCT. So, does E-Clutch successfully bridge the gap between auto and manual worlds?
Martin Fitz-Gibbons picks up the testing baton for BikeSocial...
Head to BikeSocial for the full and detailed review of each bike:
➡️ CBR650R: t.ly/eH0bX
➡️ CB650R: t.ly/qwDBU
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CHAPTERS
00:00 - What's this video about?
01:25 - How does eClutch work?
04:25 - Pricing
05:40 - eClutch verdict
08:03 - CB650R updates
12:18 - Chassis, suspension, brakes and tyres
13:15 - Weight
13:45 - CBR650R updates
21:00 - Q&A: BikeSocial Facebook Group
30:34 - Bennetts ad
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this is what i like in an extra feature, the eclutch adds a feature without forcing you to have to use it. so many new features replace how things have worked for years, like the DCT. i see this being useful for those who have weaker hands, well done honda!
Perhaps you should catch the bus if your hands are that weak.
Slip and assist clutches are feather light these days.
It's not always because of weaker hands lol my bro went DCT because of not being arsed to gear changing to and from work and the sheer ease on touring what with cruise control etc
@@TheCaretaker555 of course, i'm probably more concious of it because of my uncle who i ride with (he's 70). He has arthritis in his left hand from an injury. he's stubbon enough to push through the pain but would clearly benefit from something like this because he doesn't want a DCT lol
@@demonnick666 moped : 👀
Unlike some riders keep emphasizing how skillful people should be to ride properly, I really appreciate manufactures like Honda introducing more technologies to make riding more friendly and expand rider population. Operating clutch lever is not necessarily the fun of riding.
Ikr?, I'm new to riding, and I ride a burgman 125, and I hate the way "real riders" talk smack to my scooter, and how it's not a "real bike".
@@vincewilliamshortelano9404 I'm pretty sure that burgman will leave most of them in the dust on a back road. Any idiot can whack the throttle open.
It is actually the fun of riding for some people im not against e-clutches but they sure as hell shouldn't make it a standard,only a option.
@@jeremyclarkson-69 Not sure which market/country you’re in. Our dealership sells both E-clutch and normal version. And e-clutch can be switched off anyway.
@@AnthonioChen I commented this before watching the full video and feel asleep before deleting this comment.
I already did a review on this and I'm back again I finished the video and I can truly say that you are one of the best I've come across....you have a lot of talent for this and I just had to come back and say this after finishing the video..... five stars...and for me to give that you truly have earned it....thank you so much for your time that you have put into this...also when and it will happen that a manufacturer gets hold of your content you are going to blow up bigger than most.... good luck five 🌟
Finally, a detailed review of the E-clutch in English! Been waiting for this one. Thx!
same :)
This is a fantastic invention, well done Honda 👏
Best and most honest review I've seen so far and I'm looking at CB650R for almost 6 months now. I'm sold on it, thank you mate !
Mister Fitz-Gibbons is fast becoming my favourite reviewer. Affable. Good knowledge. Clear explanations and details things other reviewers don't come close to covering. Top notch. Not sold on the clutch, though. I'm extremely distrustful of anything using solenoids. Solenoid goes. New solenoid? Nope. New eclutch. The whole thing.
100%, except Simon would be a tie. The two of them are a great pair!
@@naustin09 Yeah, very true
The attention to the details especially on a fairly technical launch like this is where Martin excels!!
Thanks 🙏
I'd say the E-clutch is probably the best piece of tech that has come out of Honda and I'm so excited to put my booking in at the end of the month! Great video!
Thank you Bennetts for this superb review of the new Honda CBR650R and CB650R. By far the best informed for teaching about the eClutch. I am upgrading to the CBR650R this week and have been looking for good videos explaining the eClutch in every detail, and now I found it. Confirmed Bennetts customer here!
Thank you for the very descriptive review. Very helpful. The best review Ive watched. Martin you're awesome.
It’s Martin on video and not just a disembodied podcast voice. Woot woot!
Thanks for explaining I finally understand what it does! Seems like a cool feature.
Love the video presentation nice chap very informative and without to much jargon.
Finally you can deliver Noodles with a CBR650R with one hand as you would do with a Super Cub. The day that every one was waiting for.
Thank you so much for your detailed review of both bikes you make it very interesting when it comes to explaining what the new e- clutch do , the cosyt weights and the whole shebang .Honda once again created a new stuff for riders to enjoy and definitely gives the riders choices when riding👍👍, more power to your show Sir and ride safe always, looking forward to your next upload😅
Excellent review thank you
Fantastic insightful review Mufga I have my test ride booked for May 2 already, I tested the regular clutch model CBR650R a month or so ago along with a GSX8R and got on really well with the Honda so I’ve been waiting for the e clutch to arrive, big thumbs up to Bridge motorcycles help and test rides. 👏👏👍
Nice review mate, well done. Call me old fashioned but rev matching going down the box is a wonderful part of finessing the bike....I for one love as much interaction as possible on a 'proper' bike I have an auto forza300 which I thoroughly enjoy but my others, well...i love as much involvement as possible.
Really good review. Fascinating new technology.
Great review: And Great information 👍👍
Nice review! Puts the CB650 R on my shopping list 😀
I’ve had a DCT gearbox car for the last four and half years, it’s phenomenal. It’s never gone wrong, it works on inclines etc and has three modes from yawn, to sprightly, to oh my god.
I would love BMW to bring out DCT on my GS, purely because the quick shifter isn’t the sharpest tool in the box.
As for e-clutch, you still have to clonk the gear lever with your toe. After 47 years I’m happy to move on
BMW cars no longer have DCT, they have changed to a conventional but finessed auto.
How to wheelie on DCT?
@@mggarcia19I learnt over 45 years ago that wheelies never impressed women, much as they weren’t impressed by handbrake turns in a Capri.
On the positive side the unintentional wheelie I pulled on my FS-1E in 1975 (throttle stuck open) just missed the side of the bus as I dropped it on its side at the T junction.
You can keep your wheelies for the chavs on the pit bikes - other motorcyclists are available and this does not constitute the view of the management
@@FairladyS130but the 3 Series still only comes with indicators as an optional extra and usually never used by the owners……
Honda has a patent on DCT for motorcycles. That’s why no other company can do automatic motorcycles 🤷♂️
Great video 👍
I suspect the £100 is an introductory offer, I imagine this system is perfect for city commuters hopefully they add it to their 500cc range.
in europe it's 500e
I bet you everything that this will be available in every honda model
I hope they can get as low as 150cc model
The centrifugal semi-auto can only withstand 12 kilowatt (~15 hp) which eliminates anything above 125cc bike.
Having spent 25 years converting clutches to right hand operation, I'm really interested trying this....thanks Mufga!
Definitely sold on the CB650R it has the tech, the look and the performance. Dealer told me I need to wait till the end of the year though :/
Where are you based? UK dealers have started to receive them, so says Honda's PR team this morning.
Yeah I’m in us and would buy one right away but are they coming to the us?
@@bennettsbikesocial Not based in the UK.. that's great maybe it will not take that long then..
Interesting review Mufga, I like how open-minded you are to new technology. I've got a DCT NT1100 and I'll see if I can get a test ride on one of these when my bike goes in for a service this year.
Love the video! Thank you for the clear and informative presentation. I think this system would be perfect for Honda's 500cc range. Great invention, good job Honda.
My previous bike was a nearly new 21 CBR650R (first big bike). I quickly bought the Honda Quick Shifter and fitted it myself, a fairly easy job, If buying a new one now I would definitely go for the e-clutch version. Having moved onto a bike with a good quickshifter/blipper for up/down shifts (Ducati Panigale V2,) I would have appreciated that on the Honda and at £100 with little impact on running costs or normal functionality, I can’t see Honda supplying many without the e-clutch!
My guess is also that the £100 is barely covering the costs on this!
Well done Honda!
I think this is a great Honda 'engineered' product and at launch a solution for a bike which fits a segment where as an inline 4 it is pretty unique. Opening up an up and down auto style change to engines/gearboxes without that option today, plus removing the need to even touch the clutch lever will give a group of riders (commuters, new bikers and those who find an all day ride with a clutch to operate physically difficult) the opportunity to enjoy biking. Be super to see it grow through the Honda range as an alternative to their quick shifter, I'd like to try it on Hornet 750 and possibly Hornet 1000 ?
Cheers N🥳Martin love the e clutch, I had a saab 900 turbo sensonic in the 90s, same idea, full manual box, but auto clutch ( no clutch pedal unlike the Honda). Unfortunately not popular, but i liked it.
Oh I’d have loved to have that the other day as my hand was cramping up in stop/go traffic. Well done Honda for continuing to innovate, I’d much rather have this over a QS or DCT.
⁷⁷7
I have a bike with loads of electronics and a bike that has the bare necessity, abs, traction control.
I enjoy both. One lets me enjoy more on the ride, the other lets me enjoy the drive.
Brilliant overview of the bikes and the system. The one topic that never seems to be mentioned is clutch less shifting. It’s a skill I picked up years ago and once mastered, is just as good os a quick shifter. When quick shifters came along, I was initially excited but, now, I’m not sure I would choose one over full manual. E clutch looks like amazing tech but, adds to the potential of crippling service and maintained e costs after warranty has expired.
Clutchless shifting is faster than conventional shifts, for sure. But quickshifters are faster than clutchless shifts because you keep the throttle open - I timed & tested this with an R1 and a dyno on Bike magazine in 2010. And Honda says E-Clutch shifts 20% faster than a quickshifter.
As for "crippling service and maintenance costs", Honda's engineers told me the only difference is a little extra calibration work when it comes time to replace the whole clutch. Other than that, nowt.
This has to be best innovation we have in a while in two wheeler segment. I would really love to buy one of this even though I never owned or ride any sports bike. Not above 160cc atleast.
Must appreciate Honda for making things easy for riders like me who can still buy big bike without worrying about all of this technical stuff and just up and down the gear without any tension 😅.
Can wait to get the new cbr with eclutch sounds awesome for town heavy traffic
Cheers for that 👍
Thanks Mufga 👍🏼
Can you blip on the downshift to smooth the shift? Would that confuse the e-clutch?
cb650r is my perfect bike now.. wish they kept the perfectly round headlight though, perfect shape
Thanks for the detailed review on the eclutch. I have a bike with DCT, and one with a quickshifter. The eclutch, for me, brings together the best features of each system. Question: if you were to take off from a dead stop with the bike in a high gear, would the bike still slowly accelerate away while dragging the clutch?
Yes. It'll pull away from a dead start in sixth gear. It won't do your clutch any good, but it'll do it.
That would be quite nice at the lights when you cant find neutral so normally have to sit there the whole time pulling the clutch lever in.
Fantastic, i've been gagging to see something like this prior to jumping in to buy 1. Currently i'm on a 2019 CB650 Neo with a Recluse clutch, as i only have my Left arm.....
Love the channel. So the E-Clutch does the same thing as a Rekluse clutch... with extra steps? I rode the MV with the Rekluse, and it was very good. Does the "E Clutch" have any advantage over the Rekluse?
I've not ridden or tested a Rekluse clutch, but my understanding is that's a purely mechanical system working on centrifugal force alone. That would mean clutch engagement is linked just to engine rpm. And that would mean, for example, the clutch can't disengage when you're changing gears. E-Clutch, being electronic rather than mechanical, is able to have far greater and more flexible control over the clutch.
Interesting review. The E-clutch is a novel & clever thing but I don't see why I would want one. Especially when it adds weight, cost (minimal I know, but still) & just feels like an answer to a question nobody asked. I can see the application & how it could be appealing to some, but equally I just don't see the point personally. I would have preferred Honda to have focused on improving the suspension, brakes & making them lighter.
still curious on how the e-clutch will adapt as the clutch plates worn off and the biting point recess.
so is the difference between this and a dct is that you still have to shift with your foot?
Love the video! I really want this bike but I am 5'3/5'4 height, would it still be worth considering or should I stick to Ninja 400 territory?
Does anyone know if it's possible to convert the taillight from the 2024 variant to the 2023 variant?
Would be really cool if it worked because I think the front of the 2023 looks better than the 2024 front :)
Would be a good combination with the 2023 front and 2024 rear lights.
Hey mate, what mic are you using?
Wooowww!!!
Finally a sports bike for riders without left hand fingers 🤣👍🍻
The naked is still a good looking bike, and has an excellent finish.
I'm a big fan of a lighter clutch pull, and one less cable to lubricate. I can see this being a real game changer in traffic as well.
Is the bike classed as a manual or semi-automatic? I have a NC750X DCT and I have a disability in my left hand, which means that I am unable to use a clutch. I passed my bike test on a DCT so I can only ride automatic bikes.
Looked at the cb650 today, as in the market for a new bike. Love the look of it, just not sure I fit it correctly at 6ft and not a small bloke worried I might look abit big. How tall are you?
I'm 5ft 9in tall and it fits me fine - hope that helps.
Can someone please clarify - the e clutch is not fully automatic. All I need to do is to release the throttle in the right rpm range and the clutch activates on its own but I still need to manually change the gear? So I don't have to touch the clutch but I still have to manually change gear. Thanks
I own A CBR650R with the quick shifter thats a great addition. I will say this about the Eclutch - first impressions is its a big ugly lump of metal sticking out of the side of the crankcase is what struck me initially.
If the eclutch fails, does the override also fail?
So does it work like a quick shifter?
Well well well. I was salivating over the new 600RR and here comes the 650R with E clutch. Decisions decisions hmmm.
Hello Martin nice 2 meet u lol
If I had arthritis or carpal tunnel, this could be a welcome solution. However the fun is doing all this myself. I also like driving trucks with manual road ranger gearboxes which is rear now so I’m “so” old school.😅
Question:
Upon start up, regardless of gear selected, it appeared the operator could not engage the manual clutch lever. As you showed, the lever was floppy, as if needing adjustment. Is that correct?
If so, at what point or travelling speed is the clutch lever able to be used by the operator? Is it as soon as the wheels begin rotating? It it a pre-determined speed? Is it after the operator shifts to second?
I knew this system was coming. Thought it was ‘clutch by wire’, like throttle by wire. But in these bikes, it’s e-clutch and cable throttle. Therefore, no cruise control. If e-clutch is paired with throttle by wire, it then gains those TBW benefits. How then, it that not a better system than DCT for a GoldWing?
Hmmm… what are we missing or what is Honda not telling us? 🤔
I’ve owned three different bikes - Rebel 1100, Africa Twin, and GoldWing - with DCT. My only complaint/concern was in those very slow, tight manoeuvres and Oh-Sh*t moments when I needed a manual clutch lever to have maximum control. E-clutch seems to be the answer.
I do wonder… do you have the answer?
Excellent video and review. Thanks for sharing!
🍻🍻🍻
Thanks. The lever is floppy when you switch the ignition on, but if you pull the lever all the way in it switches E-Clutch off and you get full manual clutch control right from the go. E-Clutch then switches back on once you're rolling and haven't touched the clutch lever for a few seconds.
As for GoldWings and DCT, the big difference is that E-Clutch doesn't change gear for you, whereas DCT can. DCT gearchanges also feel smoother, so for two-up riding I think I'd prefer DCT.
@@Mufga81 Gotcha. Thank you. I might have been in the minority of DCT owners that regularly rode my DCT bikes in manual mode, especially the Rebel and Africa Twin. The GoldWing’s DCT was better than the other two, but I still preferred to hold the gear longer, and shifted gears when preferred. Thanks for responding. 🍻
fantastice bike
I want this in every bike, not as an upgrade!.
If eclutch is activated, do I have to briefly take off the accelerator when changing gear?
Nope - for upshifts you can hold the throttle open, at any position you like, just like you're using a quickshifter.
I hope they put it on the next CB1000-R I’m bout rdy to trade up from my CB650R. Had it 4 years now.
To car people, this is semi-automatic. Great bike and video
So apart from it pulling the clutch in and out from a stop. What is the difference of this and a up down quick shifter? What is better for in a performance stand point. ?
According to the Honda engineers who designed the system, E-Clutch shifts are faster and smoother than a quickshifter alone. They say upshifts are 20% quicker. That's the performance benefit.
@Mufga81 the reviewer said its slower on a down shift. Of it was faster it would be used in a race application.
@@chriswest2290 Hi, I am the reviewer, nice to meet you. E-Clutch downshifts on the 650s feel a little clunkier than the best autoblipper systems I've tested on other bikes. The 650s don't have a blipper. That's a limit of the 650s' throttle cables, not E-Clutch. Would E-Clutch + blipper be faster than blipper alone? Don't know - it'd be interesting to test.
@@Mufga81 thanks for the update.
Apart from down shifts (until RBW) , I can see E Clutch being better than Quickshifter as you sometimes don't get smooth up changing with Quickshifter.
With E Clutch do you have to close the throttle on changing up, or does the ignition cut like Quickshifter?.
You don't have to close the throttle to upshift. E-Clutch works with a quickshifter, which cuts fuel & spark to allow the next gear to slot in.
@@Mufga81What about on down shift?
@@ChrisSauer-oe5ve Like a two-way quickshifter, it's meant for you to shift down with a completely closed throttle. E-Clutch will, however, change down even if you have the throttle open somewhat.
I know that voice! He’s one of those hilarious Poms from FEC! 😂
"Hilarious"
How many times will someone come up at a meet and blip the throttle on one of these, and it takes off because it was still in 1st gear? It almost happened to me on my Rekluse KTM, fortunately I was in neutral at the time, but the dude could not have known.
Those elevated crossings are made for you to slow down!
I'd like this on my rebel. I already have DCT because it's my absolute chill bike. That said, i wouldn't mind being able to choose my gear(with my foot) and see how that would be.
How quickly does it get off the line? Are perfect fast starts now guaranteed no matter your ability? Literally the first question that came to mind when this system was announced.
I don't know about "perfect" fast starts, but they'd probably be more consistent with E-Clutch.
This is yet another option from Honda which I'm happy to see as I have limited dexterity in my left hand which makes clutch manipulation difficult and cumbersome. My question is, as a taller rider, how are the ergonomics?
Man, the naked 650s are gorgeous. Even the exhaust pipes are better looking than cb1000r’s
I love the CB's downpipes too. A nod to the CB400 for those who know.
Can’t wait for this to make its way to cars, the manuals will return en-masse probably then.
In town at very low speed, you would still need to work the clutch right? At first gear opening and closing the throttle it's gonna be abrupt and jerky like a horse.
You don't *need* to work the clutch lever - E-Clutch is capable of operating the clutch for you even at very low speeds without stalling. But if you prefer, you can use the manual lever and have full control. E-Clutch gives you the choice.
@@Mufga81 What if I were to lug the engine, say ride 3rd-4th gear at 10-15km/h. Will the bike still run just fine? It's still not gonna stall?
@@anvu518 I believe E-Clutch won't let the bike stall in this scenario - it'll slip the clutch as needed. I can't imagine it'll do your clutch any good, just as if you rode in 4th at 10kmh slipping the clutch yourself.
@@Mufga81 Interesting. I was just pondering a case of emergency brake where you were cruising in 3rd gear and had to slam on the brake without having time to downshift, the bike would not stall and potentially upset rider balance
@@anvu518 No, absolutely no chance. You could be in sixth gear, do an emergency stop and, so long as you don't touch the clutch lever, E-Clutch will prevent stalling.
for people who loves to ride a proper sports bike but in a comfortable way
This would be brilliant on a dirt bike. I hope we see it on a CRF450RL
With cable throttle, cable clutch, and a simple shift sensor, I see no reason this can't be sold as a retrofit with a piggyback controller for existing bikes like the 500 series. I think a large part of the 500 class would love to opt for this, myself included.
At 7.31...im sure you know Martin lots of bikes still have throttle cables but still are fly by wire (my vfr12 for example)
Sure. On those bikes (early Yam rbw systems were the same, I think) the cables from the twistgrip don't go to the throttles, but push & pull a sensor. On these 650s the cables go directly to the throttle bodies.
@@Mufga81 Ah I get that, thank you 👍
What's are your thoughts about this against the Daytona 660?
I wouldn't want to pre-empt a group test that Bennetts BikeSocial might be planning for later in the year... ;)
@@Mufga81 Cheers Mr! 😁
Stay tuned - you might just find out soon
I really like the look of the new CBR650R however, it’s the heaviest option in its class, which puts me off. If it was as light, or close to the Aprilia RS660, I would buy one in a heartbeat! I love the Honda tech though. Clever engineering!
For sure, Aprilia aside though it does have the most power in its segment . Also can’t beat an i4 which is the only one in its class. Either way honestly the weight is completely manageable . If your really needing to shed some weight to ride really aggressive your probably gonna want to lean towards the 600cc class anyways. Or even like a ninja400 ,
Can also shed some weight pretty easy. Full exhaust system shaves about 15lbs off instantly over stock set up.
interesting. so effectively it works as a quickshifter and auto blipper. i love technology
What is that helmet model name, I can't find the same color one
My lid is an X-Lite X-803 Ultra Carbon. I think the rider(s) in Honda's B-roll footage are wearing Sharks.
Its basically typical underbone(Asia's staple bikes) shifting such as xrm125 and the like, manual gearbox minus clutch lever in this case they left the clutch lever available still for some reason
Obviously £100 is not the cost of the e clutch. What's the price of the replacement part when it gets damaged in a drop/crash?
On that note, it looks like if you drop the bike on that side, because it sticks out a little way it's going to damage the clutch itself at the same time. 🤔
Well described, can you imagine how confusing that would've been if Mr Hargreaves was doing it 😱😱
Didn't the old honda cubs have a manual gearbox with no clutch?
They used a centrifugal clutch and a manual gearbox.
Semi-Auto ?
So it feels like a centrifugal clutch on the supercub?
As far as coming to a stop and pulling away goes - I guess, perhaps. But centrifugal clutches don't disengage during gearchanges, so this is a much more sophisticated system with masses more control and smoothness.
E-clutch vs quickshifter? Would this make a quickshifter pointless?
That's answered in the QA section
You can always rev it out. You're in 3rd. Downshift to 2nd or 1st. You'll be there.
E clutch, less wear and tear on the gear box compared with a quick shifter
E-Clutch = Quickshifter/Blipper ?
Would have considered it if it were an actual automatic. Shame the smallest automatic is an 1100 here in Aus.
How to wheelie in e-clutch?
Same as normal. Switch the traction control off first. The instant you pull in the manual clutch lever the E-Clutch system will switch off.