Pastors should NOT receive salaries | 1 Tim
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- čas přidán 6. 09. 2024
- I offer some additional thoughts on 1 Tim 5:17 which is a text many christian use to defend the idea that pastors are worthy of some kind of salary for their work.
1 Tim 5:17 Let the elders that rule well be counted worthy of double honour, especially they who labour in the word and doctrine.
Here is the link I reference in the video which entails an article written by Dr Russel Kelley about how he also doesn't think 1 Tim 5:17 is referring to salary. He believes its referring to respect/value etc. is to be shown to elders, particular in the context of them being accused of something.
www.tithing-ru...
Here is the more full teaching I did long ago in regard to 1 Tim 5:17
• Should elders/pastors/...
Please realize that most if not all pastors will not agree with my position. It shouldn't be too surprising as their livelihood depends on me being wrong so can't really approach this issue in an unbiased way. They potentially have much to lose (their job!) if they acknowledge they are wrong so they can't really be very objective and unbiased. However, I actually would have something to gain by being wrong. Namely, if it can be shown that I am wrong, one might argue that I'm entitled to some kind of financial reimbursement for all the work and teaching I've done in the Bible over the years.
You make some interesting points in this video and the other one. Do you think it is wrong to give a pastor a salary or do you just think that he is not entitled to one? To the degree that I have thought about it before I have generally thought of it from a practical perspective. Certainly no one should charge for the message of salvation. Attending church should always be free. Also, it seems that if one is going into ministry primarily to make good money that they have their priorities mixed up. That said, ministry can be demanding, especially if we want to train up our clergy with seminary education and entrust them with the authority to manage a congregation which might end up becoming rather large. It's a fair point that we should consider distributing some of the responsibilities to the laity, but in many cases the lead pastor is a manager of sorts who is responsible for overseeing staff, buildings, and numerous events. If he has to hold another job on top of those responsibilities, and if he has a family also, he will end up with burnout. It does not seem unreasonable to me to pay a clergyman a modest salary so that he is freed from the burden of supporting himself (and his family if he has one) and can focus on ministry. The Bible may not require that as you have demonstrated in these videos, but does it prohibit it? It's not always possible for churches to support clergy; some congregations are small and require their clergy to support themselves, but if a congregation is able, I don't see why it would be wrong. In many places the cost of living is high, and in order to have pastors in those places it can make their lives a lot easier if the church can provide them with something to live on.
Hi Nacho,
Thanks for watching and commenting. I appreciate the questions. Yes, I believe it is wrong to give a pastor a salary in exchange for his labors as it turns his work into a business which is something Christ doesn’t want as the house of God is not to be turned into a house of merchandize. Christ also forbids his servants from taking money for the use of their spiritual gifts. So even regularly offering a pastor money for their work can be tempting him to sin. No, I don’t believe a pastor is entitled to any kind of salary, nor any other member of the body for their spiritual labors. If a person is given to pray for many hours a day, that can be a great ministry and something that is valuable to the body of Christ, but its still not to get rewarded with money. The only people who are entitled to financial support according to the NT are those who are unable to work due to physical/emotional limitations such as the aged or women who are widows and can’t support themselves. Also, gospel workers (which are not pastors) are entitled to support as 1 Cor 9 indicates due to the nature of their work which is that of being an itinerant workers and one who tends to the spiritual needs of spiritual babies. Its basically a form of spiritual day care comparable to someone tending to the needs of babies and toddlers. That’s far more work than tending to healthy teens or adults who are generally far more independent. A pastor generally oversees a flock of people who have been in the faith for a relatively longer period of time and are generally more independent than spiritual infants that have been newly saved.
“That said, ministry can be demanding, especially if we want to train up our clergy with seminary education and entrust them with the authority to manage a congregation which might end up becoming rather large. “
There is no need for seminary education. All the training a person needs can be done within the context of church community where people study in their free time. Overseeing a congregation is a spiritual work and doesn’t require one to do it full time. If the church gets larger, the church can simply meet in multiple homes and more men will generally become available to oversee the church. Just like in earthly families, elders arise naturally over time as the time goes on and the family increases in size. The norm in the NT was for their to be a plurality of elders for each church and not one sole pastors.
“ It's a fair point that we should consider distributing some of the responsibilities to the laity, but in many cases the lead pastor is a manager of sorts who is responsible for overseeing staff, buildings, and numerous events. “
The Bible doesn’t teach the concept of a lead pastor. I will address the origin of this in a video I plan to publish today. Can you clarify what you mean by staff? No where does the NT call for church buildings.
“ If he has to hold another job on top of those responsibilities, and if he has a family also, he will end up with burnout. “
The reason many pastors experience burnout is because they have taken upon themselves responsibilities the NT never gives them (i.e. preaching long sermons every week which can be time consuming to prepare). The very fact that Paul charges elders such as those in Ephesus in Acts 20 to work with their own hands to support themselves is proof that Paul didn’t think the role of an elder / would pastor made it impossible for them to hold a regular job. Thanks again for your questions.
I read the article and listened to your thoughts. Do you think writing a book about the gospel and selling it above cost or at a profit is the same as teaching the gospel for hire? Looking over the chapers in Dr Kelley's book it is interesting that he is ok with paid ministers. How does he justify that position?
Hi Tim, Yes, I believe trying to make a profit from a theological book is similar to preaching for hire. Imagine the apostle Paul trying to sell some of his letters or John selling the book of Revelation for a profit. Even though these books are FAR more valuable than any book a mortal man could write, we see God wanting to have these words given away for *free*. How much more should christians today give away their far inferior works for free and not seeking to make a profit. Christ taught us, freely you have received, freely give. My spiritual gifts, both salvation and any spiritual gifts I have, were given for free and its inappropriate and disrespectful to God and quite repulsive for me to try to make a buck off of that.
In regard to Russel, he had no Biblical justification for his position on why Pastors should be salaried. His justification was that pastors are just so busy doing such things as giving sermons, weddings, funerals, visiting the sick that they wouldn’t be able to hold a full time job. But I sought to explain to him that none of these things are responsibilities that God puts entirely upon a pastor. For example, no where does God ever charge a pastors to prepare a 40 minute sermons to give each week. That’s a tradition of men. The reason so many pastors think they can’t handle a full time job is simply because they have taken upon themselves responsibilities that God *never* gave them. When one realizes the whole body is to function at the church gathering and not one man doing most of the talking, it is easy to see how elders in the early church could in fact have regular jobs as they weren’t expected to spend 30 + hours a week preparing some long monologue to give on Sunday. I mention the sermon as this is one of the things that some pastors will claim is what they get paid for. I was at a church meeting one time and the pastor basically stated that it was his *job* to spend all week long preparing a sermon to give to the congregation. It’s quite sickening to see how the church has been turned into a business and a house of merchandize which I believe angers Christ much the perversion of temple worship into a house of merchandize upset him.
I'm in full agreement. Alot of these preachers complain about book printing costs to justify it. Whenever I tell them to do a free pdf I get crickets 😂
That's a good point. What do you think about selling the book at the cost of printing no profit made?
@timoaks1372 me personally I still wouldn't do it personally. With free mediums like youtube,email,zoom etc. Not to be a stick in the mud but my contention is that after being given eternal life and the means to work a job free is not too much of anybody carrying the gospel