Found one of these bikes on the side of the road. They’d thrown it away bc the jack shaft broke. I just straight chained it and had it running in a couple hours. Got it doing 38. Bought a torque converter yesterday though
@@epicvedios6478 You can get 18lb springs if you want be they do not come into play with a torque converter and actually waste a fraction of HP because the engine has to work harder with them installed. The stock springs allow 5000 RPM. But the gearing of the torque converter does not allow RPM anywhere near 5000 RPM, even with a 60 tooth. You run out of engine due to gearing and load. This is also why it is a waste of time to remove the governor on this bike when a torque converter is going to be installed. The guy in this video is very smart. No BS and an easy 37 mph.
No no with a decently built hisum and a 30 series you want taller gearing. A 40 tooth rear, 30 series cvt, Mikuni carb, header, and 8 degree flywheel key and I’m doing 50 on mines. Real responsive in the low end too
I think the least you can do with the Governor is tap the fin that contacts the limit screw flat. It only gives you a little bit more throttle movement but you feel it for sure
This guy did it the right way. Very smart. No need to take out the governor and alter the original throttle linkage. If the governor reacts at top speed just back out the throttle screw until it doesn't. If you have a Coleman and want better low end and higher top speed this is the way to do it. Just get a torque converter.
Very nice, just for clarification no governor removal or bypass ? very nice results. I don't want to mess with the governor, these are interference motors, if the exhaust valve hangs a split second, Bang. But these little engines are cheap to replace and life's short. Thanks again for some nice content.
Yep, I didn't mess with the governor or anything else on the motor. After I made this video I replaced the belt (the old one was worn really thin compared to new) and I gained 3mph top speed.
There is no need to touch the governor. With his setup if he hits the governor at top speed all he would have to do is turn out the throttle adjustment screw until it doesn't hit the governor. This guy did this the right way. Nice and easy no screwing around.
@@kickboxs77 Always a good idea if you mess with your governor. I made the decision to keep mine stock. Mine does 47 with just a torque converter. China makes a lot of crap, but the the engineers did a good job stealing Honda's design on this little engine.
@@kickboxs77 For the bike in this video heavier valve springs would be a waste of time and help nothing. The stock valve springs could easily handle the maximum RPM it's getting.
I thought about doing that but there is only about 3/4" clearance above the exhaust. I figured that even if I raised the engine so that the exhaust was nearly touching the upper frame, it still wouldn't be enough to clear that frame part that I cut off. I suppose the engine could be raised up higher if I removed the exhaust heat shield but I didn't want to do that.
I have the same bike that I got with a broken crank. I put a ¾" crank in and removed the governor. I have a header and a vm22 carb. My top speed was 42. The torque converter limits your RPM's. I don't rev high at all because the gearing is in overdrive. You can add a different bushing to lock out the overdrive. The next thing to do is change the engagement RPM by using lighter weights or stiffer springs.
Alex's Bikes and Motors okay thank you I ordered a torque converter I have the CT200U I got it cheap and fixed it up I j bypassed the governor with a zip tie zip tie the governor spring and it goes 30
Alex's Bikes and Motors when my TC arrives and I put it on I’m hoping to go like 45 but I might in bypass my governor cause I hear it messes the engine up
Basically the torque converter IS your governor with that gearing so no need to remove it. Even with 9 tooth 60 tooth combo it'll go 51 MPH down a hill without hitting governor RPM (I have GPS vid to show it). If you use 8t/60t, then you might possibly be able to rev engine faster than governed RPM down a hill.. With TC might as well leave governor alone unless you get a Juggernaut.
@@Smegma_pirate You got to be kidding? So you think that small tube with near 90 degree bends above and away from its attachment points is going to provide structural strength? It did make a nice chainguard attachment point, but that's about it. Know that these bikes are not new and dozens and dozens of people have done this without a problem. Hope that eases your concern.
honeydewbunson yeah man it’s just a chain guard mount. The main hoops of the frame are what create it’s strength. The engine plate stays (bars it is mounted to) and rear axle make that chain guard mount completely redundant. People think it is “part of the frame” but it is just something extra attached to the frame.
Considering that my stock EX is hitting 21mph carrying my 260 pounds I'd say that 37 isn't too bad for skinny guys. Change that rear sprocket and you might get a little closer to 40.
I doubt just a torque converter he gained 11-15 mph. These things top around 28-32. I own one with a stage 1 kit and governor removed she'll do 50 mph easy tops at 58 but takes long to get there lol need to add the 18 lb valve spring so she doesnt bog as much. Looks like they may have a tillosten which make this possible as they are made better and have better performance out the box
Once you do away with the jackshaft and add a torque converter you go from 24 to 40 it’s not what I say it’s facts just a torque converter will increase your speed that much
And to hit 50 you would have to have done away with the jack shaft facts stage 1 and governor removed with the jackshaft isn’t gonna do much so it’s the same principle
The reason adding a torque converter made such a difference is because in order to you have to remove the jack shaft setup therefore taking away the gear reduction
The jack couch it comes with gives the bike more tork for off road trail riding. The tork converter will give you 3-5 miles an hour faster, but you lose tork I have the same bike and all I did was take out the throttle screw and top speed I get is 37mph, with the jack clutch.
I’ve got the same bike. The clutch sucks and burns up off road. The CVT give you way better low end. You do burn up belts a little but they’re way cheaper to replace than the damn clutches.
37 mph is probably more than safe speed for this thing considering the brakes and structural design. But another way to make it faster is just changing the gear ratio by getting smaller sprocket in the back or bigger in front. Of course giving up some of the acceleration. Nice video!
thanks! I agree that 37mph is probably too fast. It is a dirt bike after all. If anything I would lower the gearing. Maybe swap the 50t rear sprocket to 60t or 65t
Torque converter gives a higher gear ratio at top speed than a clutch so how can a clutch be faster? Also no one ever uses a centrifugal clutch on any serious performance build so I'm pretty sure you're wrong and they're slower. You might be right about the valve springs although I've personally never seen or heard of valves hitting the piston on a stock engine. Every failure I've seen is the rod breaking or rod seizing to crank and breaking.
@@alexsbikesandmotors Think you need to do your homework on clutch go to a go cart race and see what they use watch other comparison videos they all say the same thing CVT more torque Clutch for high speed up to you i dont care i just know what works for me.
@@StansWorld Go kart kiddo. With a k. Now a centrifugal clutch maybe faster as far as complete engagement under a load in a controlled distance but not over the entire capability of the power curve because maximum RPM would be unachievable under duress. A torque converter literally does just that, it carries the load throughout the entire torque range until top speed is achieved usually limited by gearing rather than the engines capacity. Coleman ct200u (ua, b200x, ex, exr) are all centrifugal clutches driving a primary gear before a final ratio determined by the sprocket at the wheel. The clutch has to engage and manipulate the primary which drags the secondary whereas the torque converter keeps the primary under constant tension. When you release the throttle on the clutch you are dropping the load completely and then reengaging the entire load again at whatever RPM the clutch is set for regardless of actual engine speed. This greatly reduces the benefit of being able to accurately apply throttle when necessary not just because you have to. Add obstacles such as hills, deep turns, loose turf...... centrifugal clutch doesn't hang. If you really want to support the clutch program I recommend you check out HotRodMiniBike.com they are the leaders in billet jack shafts and clutches for the ct200's. Real classy, top of the line stuff. For TAV 30 I'd contact Eric at OMBWarehouse.com or check out TheGreyGoat that's his channel. Boy knows his stuff now. Instructed me on my 15+ HP build and I love it! Good luck, either way your winning with a mini bike!
I wanna see a stock one
Thanks for the reply. Your vid put me over edge on doing the TC. Some day I’ll do the stage 1, but for a few mph probably just for looks.
I got my son same bike. Disabled the governor and throttle stop. Gps shows 34mph with him on it. He loves it. Torque converter next.
Found one of these bikes on the side of the road. They’d thrown it away bc the jack shaft broke. I just straight chained it and had it running in a couple hours. Got it doing 38. Bought a torque converter yesterday though
Yeah u can get good speed with the clutch running directly to the rear sprocket but acceleration is pretty bad. Torque converter is much better
Thanks glad I stubbled across your video.
Can you show the exact link to the 30 series torque converter off ebay?
And a 60 tooth rear sprocket. And 18lb springs ull be good running 48 mph with the set up u mentioned
Even with a 60 tooth you don't need springs. The stock springs can easily handle top speed RPM with a torque converter.
@@Deucealive75 no stock springs won't let u rev as high
@@epicvedios6478 You can get 18lb springs if you want be they do not come into play with a torque converter and actually waste a fraction of HP because the engine has to work harder with them installed. The stock springs allow 5000 RPM. But the gearing of the torque converter does not allow RPM anywhere near 5000 RPM, even with a 60 tooth. You run out of engine due to gearing and load. This is also why it is a waste of time to remove the governor on this bike when a torque converter is going to be installed. The guy in this video is very smart. No BS and an easy 37 mph.
No no with a decently built hisum and a 30 series you want taller gearing. A 40 tooth rear, 30 series cvt, Mikuni carb, header, and 8 degree flywheel key and I’m doing 50 on mines. Real responsive in the low end too
Nice job! Now I want one!! (sub'd)
I think the least you can do with the Governor is tap the fin that contacts the limit screw flat. It only gives you a little bit more throttle movement but you feel it for sure
Just an FYI....The side cover and rocker cover gaskets for this engine are still available at studzracing.com
Best video i have seen in You Tube
This guy did it the right way. Very smart. No need to take out the governor and alter the original throttle linkage. If the governor reacts at top speed just back out the throttle screw until it doesn't. If you have a Coleman and want better low end and higher top speed this is the way to do it. Just get a torque converter.
How is the braking? Is the stock rear drum enough?
Braking on the road is decent. But it tends to lock the wheel when braking on sand or dirt.
I thought mines was the only one
Where do you buy that Torque Converter
Bought the torque converter on ebay and we didnt remove the governor. Engine is totally stock apart from that torque converter.
Where did you get the converter at?
ebay
@@alexsbikesandmotors how much was it
What size rear and front sprockets do u have?
10t torque converter sprocket. Not sure the rear sprocket but its the one the bike came with
Does the fly wheel need to be upgraded at those speeds ?
No it has the stock flywheel
Flywheels rated for rpm not speeds.
Can a hydraulic brake be added to this bike?
Yes go power sports sells them.
The governor is removed right?!
No it still has the governor
Very nice, just for clarification no governor removal or bypass ? very nice results. I don't want to mess with the governor, these are interference motors, if the exhaust valve hangs a split second, Bang. But these little engines are cheap to replace and life's short. Thanks again for some nice content.
Yep, I didn't mess with the governor or anything else on the motor. After I made this video I replaced the belt (the old one was worn really thin compared to new) and I gained 3mph top speed.
There is no need to touch the governor. With his setup if he hits the governor at top speed all he would have to do is turn out the throttle adjustment screw until it doesn't hit the governor. This guy did this the right way. Nice and easy no screwing around.
Heavier valve springs
@@kickboxs77 Always a good idea if you mess with your governor. I made the decision to keep mine stock. Mine does 47 with just a torque converter. China makes a lot of crap, but the the engineers did a good job stealing Honda's design on this little engine.
@@kickboxs77 For the bike in this video heavier valve springs would be a waste of time and help nothing. The stock valve springs could easily handle the maximum RPM it's getting.
Can you link the website for the torque converter
ebay
@@alexsbikesandmotors ok thanks
I used 1 1/4 square tubing and made risers that moved engine up and forward. I didn't have to cut anything on frame.
I thought about doing that but there is only about 3/4" clearance above the exhaust. I figured that even if I raised the engine so that the exhaust was nearly touching the upper frame, it still wouldn't be enough to clear that frame part that I cut off. I suppose the engine could be raised up higher if I removed the exhaust heat shield but I didn't want to do that.
I have the same bike that I got with a broken crank. I put a ¾" crank in and removed the governor. I have a header and a vm22 carb. My top speed was 42. The torque converter limits your RPM's. I don't rev high at all because the gearing is in overdrive. You can add a different bushing to lock out the overdrive. The next thing to do is change the engagement RPM by using lighter weights or stiffer springs.
@@lukeschuckenbrock5370 I was thinking of just replacing the crank but I figured the rod would be different. Cool to know they're interchangeable.
Is this with the governor on or off
This is with the governor. Engine is completely stock.
Alex's Bikes and Motors okay thank you I ordered a torque converter I have the CT200U I got it cheap and fixed it up I j bypassed the governor with a zip tie zip tie the governor spring and it goes 30
Alex's Bikes and Motors when my TC arrives and I put it on I’m hoping to go like 45 but I might in bypass my governor cause I hear it messes the engine up
Basically the torque converter IS your governor with that gearing so no need to remove it. Even with 9 tooth 60 tooth combo it'll go 51 MPH down a hill without hitting governor RPM (I have GPS vid to show it).
If you use 8t/60t, then you might possibly be able to rev engine faster than governed RPM down a hill.. With TC might as well leave governor alone unless you get a Juggernaut.
what's a juggernaut
It's a special front pulley for the TC that's made for higher RPM engines.. They have them at Gopowersports, etc. Cool for a built engine.
BWX I just ordered mine
Why would you compromise your frame ? That was completely unnecessary
It doesn't hurt anything at all whatsoever. Trust me
Right right. The rear crossmember is just extra... lol 😂
@@Smegma_pirate You got to be kidding? So you think that small tube with near 90 degree bends above and away from its attachment points is going to provide structural strength? It did make a nice chainguard attachment point, but that's about it. Know that these bikes are not new and dozens and dozens of people have done this without a problem. Hope that eases your concern.
honeydewbunson yeah man it’s just a chain guard mount. The main hoops of the frame are what create it’s strength. The engine plate stays (bars it is mounted to) and rear axle make that chain guard mount completely redundant. People think it is “part of the frame” but it is just something extra attached to the frame.
Considering that my stock EX is hitting 21mph carrying my 260 pounds I'd say that 37 isn't too bad for skinny guys. Change that rear sprocket and you might get a little closer to 40.
We replaced the torque converter belt and did the zip tie governor mod and got it up to 43mph
45 yeah ok
What you don’t believe it
I doubt just a torque converter he gained 11-15 mph. These things top around 28-32. I own one with a stage 1 kit and governor removed she'll do 50 mph easy tops at 58 but takes long to get there lol need to add the 18 lb valve spring so she doesnt bog as much. Looks like they may have a tillosten which make this possible as they are made better and have better performance out the box
Once you do away with the jackshaft and add a torque converter you go from 24 to 40 it’s not what I say it’s facts just a torque converter will increase your speed that much
And to hit 50 you would have to have done away with the jack shaft facts stage 1 and governor removed with the jackshaft isn’t gonna do much so it’s the same principle
The reason adding a torque converter made such a difference is because in order to you have to remove the jack shaft setup therefore taking away the gear reduction
What torque converter is that
Series 30 converter
Mine has the clutch and it does 44 mph
make a video then. I call bs
@@alexsbikesandmotors It is BS. On a Coleman 200 with a jackshaft and stock gearing 44 mph would take over 7500 RPM to get there.
You can blow the engine still I blew mine the pistons are bad on mine now
How would he blow the engine? It is still governed. The RPM never gets high enough to be a concern.
Lol'
The jack couch it comes with gives the bike more tork for off road trail riding. The tork converter will give you 3-5 miles an hour faster, but you lose tork I have the same bike and all I did was take out the throttle screw and top speed I get is 37mph, with the jack clutch.
I’ve got the same bike. The clutch sucks and burns up off road. The CVT give you way better low end. You do burn up belts a little but they’re way cheaper to replace than the damn clutches.
37 with the throttle screw backed out? Doubt it. This was on a Coleman 200?
37 mph is probably more than safe speed for this thing considering the brakes and structural design. But another way to make it faster is just changing the gear ratio by getting smaller sprocket in the back or bigger in front. Of course giving up some of the acceleration. Nice video!
thanks! I agree that 37mph is probably too fast. It is a dirt bike after all. If anything I would lower the gearing. Maybe swap the 50t rear sprocket to 60t or 65t
a cluth will always be faster top end than a CVT and stock valve springs WILL float and blow if over rev . you are not a motor guy i can tell.
Torque converter gives a higher gear ratio at top speed than a clutch so how can a clutch be faster? Also no one ever uses a centrifugal clutch on any serious performance build so I'm pretty sure you're wrong and they're slower. You might be right about the valve springs although I've personally never seen or heard of valves hitting the piston on a stock engine. Every failure I've seen is the rod breaking or rod seizing to crank and breaking.
@@alexsbikesandmotors Think you need to do your homework on clutch go to a go cart race and see what they use watch other comparison videos they all say the same thing CVT more torque Clutch for high speed up to you i dont care i just know what works for me.
@@StansWorld Go kart kiddo. With a k. Now a centrifugal clutch maybe faster as far as complete engagement under a load in a controlled distance but not over the entire capability of the power curve because maximum RPM would be unachievable under duress. A torque converter literally does just that, it carries the load throughout the entire torque range until top speed is achieved usually limited by gearing rather than the engines capacity. Coleman ct200u (ua, b200x, ex, exr) are all centrifugal clutches driving a primary gear before a final ratio determined by the sprocket at the wheel. The clutch has to engage and manipulate the primary which drags the secondary whereas the torque converter keeps the primary under constant tension. When you release the throttle on the clutch you are dropping the load completely and then reengaging the entire load again at whatever RPM the clutch is set for regardless of actual engine speed. This greatly reduces the benefit of being able to accurately apply throttle when necessary not just because you have to. Add obstacles such as hills, deep turns, loose turf...... centrifugal clutch doesn't hang. If you really want to support the clutch program I recommend you check out HotRodMiniBike.com they are the leaders in billet jack shafts and clutches for the ct200's. Real classy, top of the line stuff. For TAV 30 I'd contact Eric at OMBWarehouse.com or check out TheGreyGoat that's his channel. Boy knows his stuff now. Instructed me on my 15+ HP build and I love it! Good luck, either way your winning with a mini bike!
stan535 Valve springs are not a concern with this engine and gearing because the RPM at top speed is nowhere near valve float.
This is what a centrifugal clutch is for czcams.com/video/hzu-FC66Nw4/video.html
get your helmet on not to smart
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