Haha... good since of humor buddy... way to keep it lively... Thanks for the video..it helps and shared something lots of folks needed to know.. If not for practically and measure than fir culture and history.. you did grand!
No-one is right or wrong. It's just your method (which always works, I have to say) so that's that. I use a different method that also works but that's just my preference. Interestingly, you didn't say this was the only way to install strings, just how to tie a luthier's knot. Thanks for taking the time to produce your excellent videos.
Been playing since 1974. This is the method I learned back then, and used for decades. I found a much easier way to secure the strings about 15 years ago. The first wrap of the string goes on top. Never had a slip, and removing the strings from the post is WAY easier than the knot.
Someone showed me this years ago, and I forgot all about it! I have a guitar right here I'll be stringing soon. This wee discussion will be very useful!
Yep. I work as a tech and builder. Having restrung hundreds of guitars, one wrap over and the rest under is perfectly stable, no weird knots to tie, and you don’t have to mangle the string and poke your finger to get it off. I can’t tell you how many guitars are strung up in such ridiculous ways I spend half the setup time just untangling and snipping strings from the tuners.
indeed, but I used to get blasted by others for using this what was called the Gibson wrap in the 70's because every Gibson came with a piece of paper showing this method, but as you stated and I always say, just one wrap above the string and the rest under grips the string without slippage and is far easier to remove, I've met many famous guitarists and none of them use this...they all do it the way you described...I really can't believe I'm seeing this pushed after so many decades.
Yes when I'm playing live if a string breaks, which it seldom does, I want it to fall off quickly so I don't wrestle with a knot. When I change strings on my acoustic I take the string end to the post I want, add the distance to the next post and that's good for over 2 full rotations on the capstan, there I put a 90 degree bend in the string. Slot in the post hole wrap over the top first winding then others go under. On my Telecasters I add the distance between 2 tuning pegs. Of course on the old Tele you had to put a 90 degree bend in the string and snip off the waste to insert in the hole before wrapping the string on the tuning peg. I try to avoid knots. :)
Also known as the "self locking" method If you buy a set of SIT brand strings, you'll find their Stay In Tune guarantee only applies if you use this method (as per their instructions) Good to see Gibson using it too
As a luthier and guitar tech, this winding technique is one of my biggest pet peeves. It’s such a chore to remove strings wound this way, and it doesn’t offer any greater tuning stability. It’s just a way to end up poking your finger and needing pliers to get the string off. I always wonder how players that wind like this remove a broken string during a show- “hang on while I bleed everywhere and mess around with these pliers”
@@gabedamien I don't know a better knot but I have a personal thing that I will share here. I use the same knot but I do NOT BELIEVE IN ALL THOSE COILS. WHY NOT? I suspect that LESS COILS (ON THIS MAN MADE SPRING) HELPS TO ADD A SLIGHT TUNING STABILITY. JUST MY HUMBLE & PERSONAL 2 CENTS.
Just cut it off and push it back the other way. Moaning about taking it off is lazy attitude. The knot works way better than any other method. Invented by Martin guitars when they first used steel strings. If you were my guitar tech I’d fire you in a heartbeat for complaining that it’s hard to get off.
@@MrPantera123456 Full time repair man at Lewiston music in NY. 49 years professional guitar player. Started working on guitars in 72, with my pal Bill, built guitars ( from boards) in the early eighties, stopped that when I realized I couldn’t compete . Still with my pal ,who worked at Gryphon at Palo Alto under the great Frank Ford. I do about 500 repairs a year. I’m putting in a new 5th string tuner on a banjo right now. I will tie the knot on that too. It works for me and all my customers. Making guitars Stay in tune is my job, taking them off is not a problem, wiring a sustainiac is hard, I’ll still do it.
Speed is not an issue for me,and whatever works for you is great! Congratulations on your success. Hope your days are filled with more success and you and your guitars keep on rocking!
I've just been straight up winding my strings up exactly like you just said that you're not supposed to do and I've been doing it for 30 years with pretty much zero problems. I do a lot of bends and stretches on the strings almost constantly so that pretty much pulls all the slack out of whatever is in the headstock.
@@hudson3535 yeah once you start bending the strings and doing a lot of lead they usually straighten out with a couple hours of playing. And if you have a double lock tremolo with a lock nut at the top of the neck it doesn't matter how you string it up because once it's locked into place it ain't going nowhere
I have changed at least a thousand sets of guitar strings, I did try this method one time but when I went to change the strings the next time, it was a real pain to remove them. I have found all you need to do is wrap the strings around the peg a couple times, stuff it thru the hole, bend it over, tighten it up, cut off the excess, done.
If you take a rope, wrap it around a post once, it slips. Twice it still slips but not as much. 3 times it won't slip. Same goes for strings. 3 wraps underneath the hole, done. The only time i've had a string slip is when i tried one of these unecessary so called luthier knots.
Was having crazy trouble locking my baritone, this is the only video that explains to add extra slack before winding, makes all the difference. Thanks brother
I learned how to do this back in 1975 from the mandolin instruction book titled “Bluegrass Mandolin”, written by Jack Tottle. I’ve been using this technique ever since. I had no idea there was a term for it. Thanks Jake!
I've been using this technique for a year or so & it works great! I never knew it was called a Luthier's Knot. I'm looking forward to dropping that term in casual conversation! 😄
I've been using this method for years and never knew it had a name. I honestly don't even remember where I learned it, but it's a great trick and this was an excellent presentation of it.
Excellent. I've been using this knot since I learned how to play (30+ years ago). The camera work and specific instructions will make it perfect for my guitar students.
I bought a Martin D35 in 1987 and there was instructions included to string this way. I don't recall it being called a "luthier's knot" but I've been using the method ever since. I don't know that I have ever run into anyone else who uses it. It does work well for me, never have had an issue with slippage. Thanks for sharing.
You mean “The rabbit goes around the tree, then under the sideways tree, then back up around the second tree, then the rabbit runs off. Then the first tree starts spinning around and the second tree gets like stuck under itself and gets pulled into the first tree. Or something.” wasn’t a clear and concise explanation?
I was gifted a banjo and I watched about 5 videos that did not help so gave up for 2 weeks and finally found this 🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼 Exactly what I needed thank you!
A clear how-to demonstration and explanation. I don't restring my guitars nearly often enough, by the next time I've forgotten how this is done. I refer to videos like this every time. Good video, thanks! 👍👍👍😏😏😏
Been doing this for years but, I like to measure and then bend the string into a 45 deg. angle and that allows me to pull up the slack until I hit the bend, then wrap it under. Same thing, just the way I do it. Nice video.
Thanks dude, I used this on my 50 year old Maton guitar today, the tuners aren't concave and the hole is very close to the bottom, works a treat and heck of alot faster to string up, you bloody ripper 👍🇦🇺
How about using physics and the design of the tuner post to insure that you don't need a knot. If you notice, most new tuning posts are concave and flare out above and below the string hole. After you put the string through the hole put the first wind over the top of the string coming through the hole, then all successive winds below the string end coming through the hole. The concave part of the tuning post then cinches the string tight from the top and bottom compressing the winds against the string end and making it almost impossible to slip. Cut off the leftover string. This makes it a lot easier to change strings in the future.
Absolutely correct! That's the way I've been doing my strings since the age of 13 in 1979. And I'm a "get this fucker in tune and keep it that way!" kind of detail man. I watched this video to see what sort of backwoods method was being taught. And while it might work out fine, there is no better way than what you've described here. Hopefully, most newbies will question and scroll down to read your comments! Marc ⚡
This style of wrap is fine for players that don't gig. If you gig, or tech for other bands, this method absolutely creates issues when removing the strings. In most cases, needle nose pliers and good lighting are needed to remove the broken part of the string that is still wound on the tuner. This can really make it difficult to quickly change out a strings. I prefer the method of wrapping the first winding above tuner hole and the rest below. This will create enough tension to keep the strings in place without wasting time trying to remove the leftover broken string.
Right, well I gigged for decades and used the mandolin method (AKA luthier's knot). I'm afraid I simply don't agree with your objections. First, if you change your strings as often as I think you should, you will RARELY break one. Second, there's a mindlessly simple way to remove strings. Cut them and push them back through the tuner. It takes seconds. This method works fine for gigging players, as do several other methods. Use the one you like. Again, this one works and works well if you do it correctly.
I do the "one over, and the rest under" method too. Three full wraps on the wound strings, and five or six on the unwound. Unless you're playing on cat-gut strings, they ain't slipping at all! None! Once they're stretched-in, if anyone has tuning issues it's probably because they didn't put graphite in the NUT slots, or they don't know that you have to always tune UP. If you need to go down, you have to go farther down, and then come back up. I tie knots when I rock climb, not when I Rock the Casbah.
Well done! The camera angle was perfect, and you gave a good explanation…and it's a short video! I'm going to save this so I can show it to my students.
Great tip - I have done it differently for years, but your method is easier, quicker and still locks down the string. Also saves me time in my workshop - thanks!
Thank you very much. New bassist 400 hours and first time I have replaced my strings. The shop I went to previously closed down after covid and I live in the country and now the closest city has lost the guitar shop. This was a great help now I am fiddling with the height of the string compared to the previous setup. I think my string gauge is larger so strings getting in my way. I will check out your other vids they may have the answer.
Thank you sir! I had begun to think I was the only guy alive that strung guitars this way. My teacher showed me how to do this when I was 12. I still do it at 65. He said “ this is how they do it at the factory” I guess that is now “the good ole days” Keep up the good work sir! Peace!!
Great video. Been doing it with one wind at the top and rest underneath for years. Tried this today and love it. Also like the inch and a half measurement. Will do this from now on. Cheers!
Martin. I suspect they do itt save time, then the customers have to try to undo the mess. Both of my Martins came knotted, and cursed them trying get the strings off the post.
I am older than dirt and have been playing since the sixties. In all that time, I never knew how to properly start a new string installation. Thank you very much!
Thanks Jake! I was taught to use this knot in the late 60's, holds great! Another thing I was taught to do while the strings were off was to check the tightness of the tuning machine nuts to make sure they weren't walking around, about ten inch pounds is good. If the machine nuts are loose it can damage the head stock by wallowing out the machine head bores and cause the instrument to loose tune.
@@christineblack4654 The nut is on the face of the head around the tuning post where you palace the new string thru the pin. It's very important that you don't over tighten the nut as it will damage the head. Don't tighten more than 10in"pounds ( just a little more than finger tight). Not all tuners are attached this way, some are screwed on to the back side of the head. When in doubt take the guitar to the shop.
Beginner at restringing here. Thank you so much, your video is the clearest and easiest to follow of all the ones I've watched. And done very classy! Some folks forget that beginners learn best when distractions are lower and the teacher is calm and kind. 😊
Top notch Ben. I've been playing 50 years and never used (or even heard of) this technique. Gonna restring my Les Paul tonight and see how it goes. One thing the inch/inch and a half thing, I tend to pull the string back a frets length instead of guessing how much slack I need. Playing with what's left of the Easybeats Jan 13th so Ill give it a go! Cheers again.
This is by far the best video on how to do this on youtube. No one else zooms in with the good camera angles to show exactly what they're doing like this video does. Great job.
I've used this method for about 15 years and found it to be precise, but I try and keep the windings to a minimum (between one and two winds), and I don't bother going above the string at all so I can just flip the end back over while there is still tension when replacing, and it doesn't stretch as much over time. People find their own ways but I would say if I was charging to restring guitars, I would want to make certain the user will have zero issues every time and this method makes certain of that. A very informative video, I'm sure a lot of people are finding it helpful.
I agree. He puts too much slack before coming back around. You don't have to put any slack into it. Just go back around and under with no slack. His peg now has too many wraps on it which can stretch and loosen. If you go without slack, there is no extra to stretch and loosen. The lock is already there even if you don't wrap extra times as he does. The extra wraps are doing nothing good.
What a great video! I've seen a lot of other guys make this sooo complicated. Just changed my strings...not as pretty of a knot as yours, but close! Thanks for posting.
As a guitar builder/player, I used to do this but removing strings after was very aggravating. Decided to use locking tuners and haven’t looked back since!
@@silverfr3ak i ain't that fussy, western music is out of tune with the harmonic series any way and all good music has micro tonal quirks that give it soul, its possible to be too in tune, just like how it's possible to be too in time.. to play with these things sometimes is what makes it human and gives it swag, though, also, yeah, tuning sucks, mine stay in cus i bend up to 5 frets and use compound bends and stuff, i play hard in some styles too and guess got lot of vibratos going on in my hand.. interesting subject, like how van hallen dropped his b string so he could play A major bar shapes and the third would be purer / more in tune against that one note, same on my lap slide guitar, the B string is always flat because it's an open G chord, , if you tweak every note in a chord, you can make it pure, but if you change chord you end up, needing, many, sharper and flatter versions of each note, madness lol, hence we have 12TET.
Thanks for the great tip Ben. After 65 years of playing, and stringing instruments, this is the most efficient I've experienced. That being said, it's very difficult or next to impossible to utilize the knot on A and B strings when using a gauge below 12s. For these 2 strings, I wrap the strings 4 times around the post, then pass the strings through the post hole and over the top of the wrap. Holds tight, clean wind and easy to remove old strings when the time comes.
I learned this after buying my first "high-end" guitar... It's been a great asset for string life and tuning accuracy, now I service my 10 guitars, mostly acoustics, and use the Luthier's knot where a string goes through a post.
Good presentation. I used the same knot for a few decades but then dropped it about 15 years ago. I found it unnecessary and not having the knot makes it easier and faster to remove the string from the post when restringing. When I put a new string on, I thread the string through the post pretty much the same as you show, but I then kink the string on both sides of the post: toward the inside of the headstock above the post and toward the outside below the post. I then crank the tuner and wind the string with all the windings going on the post below the string and post hole. The two kinks lock the string and give more than enough friction so that I never have slippage or tuning problems. Works on all the strings even the high E string on acoustic guitars, electric guitars, and mandolins.
Thank you so much Ben for sharing this trick. I once knew a luthier in Seattle named Phil Tafoya who taught me this trick. This was back when we didn't have those little clip on tuners, so tuning was an even bigger deal than now. I was playing 5-7 nights a week in those days an breaking strings fairly regularly. Also, I was (and still am) a big fan of the two-fret bend. Needless to say, the Tafoya knot, as I call it, was a game changer. One more thing. Phil was specific about going just once around the peg if possible. The more you wrap, the more they stretch. I find that once around works great. What's funny is whenever I show this trick to others, they think I'm nuts. They are correct, but it's not because of this knot.
I've always done it like this. Tip for the right amount of slack is to use 1st and 2nd fret. Pull the string tight, grab the string at the 1st fret and pull it back to the 2nd fret and that's your slack. Then do the knot.
That’s smart. I always tried to use the distance of the tuning pegs as my measurement adjustments, but that’s way more consistent and easier than guesstimating on the D and G on 3x3s or the B and E on in-lines. I’m definitely trying this next string change.
This was a phenomenal how-to. I started playing guitar about a month ago and the stock high e snapped while a friend and I were doing a "pinch harmonic squeal-off" and like a knuckle-head I snapped the string bringing it up too high. I was having such a difficult time trying to re-string the guitar until I watched your video a few times and I nailed it. Thank you so much! This is something I'll definitely be using for the rest of my life.
I've been doing this for about the last 4 of my 18 years of playing. Gives me so much more confidence in the first few tunings. It's so satisfying when you look at how the string grabs itself and locks into position.
Interesting to see how many variations there are for "luthiers knots". I have actually been using this version of luthiers knot for the past couple of decades, since learning it from a guitar maintenance book, and it has pretty much eliminated all potential tuning issues. Possibly more time consuming than other "string wrapping" methods, but in my experience, it is well worth the extra time for the tuning stability. Excellent demonstration Ben!
I have been using the Luthier's Knot for decades and find it quite easy. One thing I was taught is to go just once around the peg. Phil Tafoya, who taught me, was very specific about this.
Thanks for the reminder. I used to do this all the time but it's been a really long time now. Also someone told me once to change them one at a time so you don't put the instrument through too much of a change in pressure from releasing all the strings at once. One of these days would like to get back in the saddle again.
I wrap all the winds progressively down over the “tail” and the last wind under it, on the G, B, and high E. On the E, A, and D, I wrap one wind over the tail and the rest under. Works great on guitars with tremolos. It’s a modification of something I was taught when I worked for a guitar building shop.
This is the way all Martin guitars are strung at the factory. It allows you to group the tasks. Use the knot to put all the strings on, then come back and tighten, then stretch each string, then tune to pitch. The stretching part is important because when you tune to pitch, it stays in pitch.
Been doing this since my guitar came back from the luthier strung that way. For no technical reason whatsoever, I just think it looks cool. So it's really between myself and my guitar headstock. Good explanation, and very well shot. 👏👏👏
Yeah, I've only been changing strings for 50+ odd years, and this is the first time I've heard of this knot. I'm gonna get some new strings for my acoustic and try this. Thanks Ben!!
I'm not sure why in this video the guy uses so many winds, but it's really not necessary. The point of that "tie," is to decrease the number of winds so that the wind itself doesn't stretch on the key as you wind up. I generally pull the slack until you got slight tension. Then use the key to crimp the string of the desired length then use this tie. Gives you a good one, one half winds and you just need turn the tuning machine a few times.
I just wrap one wind on top of the tag end, and the rest underneath. It "clamps" the tag end in place, just like this knot, except it's easier. I've never had an issue in 20+ years. I do know a lot of luthiers who swear by this method, so I'm sure there's something to it, but I've never seen a reason to change.
Yep! I usually pull the string tight and throw 2 or 3 or 4 wraps (depending on which string) around the post before I push the through the hole and under the 1st wind. Then give the end a sharp 90 degrees up. Then it only takes a little wind to get up to pitch. Saves a lot of key turning.
I've found this knot works for me for plain strings on a classical guitar (on the wound ones I just use "one over, the rest under" technique). The nylon strings are more slippery and with this knot it's easier to keep them in tune. I don't have an acoustic guitar, but I guess it's similar to an electric, where indeed I've never had a problem with just 2-3 turns, without any knots. As always, YMMV.
My dad (rip) taught me this when I was sixteen because he was sick of changing my strings, his dad taught it him at thirteen, I taught my daughter it when she was eleven. She is twenty one now doing a music degree, I am fifty six. I watched this to confirm/teach 😂 Like deployed 👍
At 5, after 2 lessons, my piano teacher told me mum "He could be a prodigy." My "dad" (I WISH he was RIP instead of yours), cancelled the lessons when hockey season started. My mum's brother gave me his acoustic at age 8. "Dad" put it in the attic. 4 years later he brought it down cuz unc was coming for a visit for a week. When he left he told my mom, 'He's a natural. Really good ear too'. "Dad" cut the strings off. I was 22 before I got a guitar in uni. You're lucky AF dad only got upset about changing your strings mate.
@@ROOKTABULA fair play, that's just, well you know what it is and I feel for you, my old man loved the music and was to all intents and purposes a respected member of the community, he reintergrated physically and mentally disabled people back into the community after a full career teaching them prior to that. He was also lionised by every musician in our small town as the pinnacle to aspire to, he also mapped a way for that integration that was picked up and ran with by not only our council but county ( possibly country wide). When I grew up every woman within his sphere of age acted as if he was a Demi-god and he played and acted to it, when I was eleven one of them 16 years his junior took him away until I was 17 and it was me that found him. Of the 6 children that he had it was only me that remained communicating with him continuously. He was everything to everyone except the people that mattered, I held his hand as he died and told him that I truly loved him, which I did, but he was a shit to all that loved him and if he knew he did not care one jot. All dad's are dick's. 🫂❤️ Edit:- I don't discount myself in this, though I truly wish that I could, for shame 😔, does anyone ever learn🤔
Not all dads are dicks dude how can you say that? My father was a great guy, and I'm trying to be as much of a good father like he was. Sorry you had these experiences but not all fathers are like that!
.. ... And that can kinda work sometimes..." - Works 100% of the time for me, for the last 12 years. This can also make a lot of people play old rusty strings rather than lose nerves trying to unknot and restring. Fresh strings are important, it doesn't only apply in studio enviroment.
I learned this method from my guitar teacher some 44 years ago and have since found it unnecessary and makes removing strings troublesome. Just push string thru hole 1 5/8 - 2", depending on the thickness of the string... pull it back. I do 1st wind over the top of the hole and the rest underneath. Strings do not loosen I know this because if the string loosened as much as 3/16" it would pull right through the hole.
I've been doing one over, the rest under for years as well. This "luthier's knot" seems like a great way to scratch the piss out of a headstock and be a total annoyance come removal time. I'll take this video as advice on techniques to avoid 😆
Just came across this . . . Good old CZcams! Very simple but highly useful. No more slipping birdsnests for me! Thank you for positing AND for explaining it so well.
I've been a full-time repair-tech for over 40 years ('Guitar Tech' - in the SF Bay Area), and in my opinion, this video is almost - but not completely - wrong. As has been said below, this 'knot' is completely unnecessary On The Wound Strings. However, on electric guitars using very light-gauge strings (9-42 or 8-38 sets), it can be very useful to perform this process on the 1st (high E) and 2nd (B) strings, because these strings (especially an .008"-gauge 1st string!) can be flexible enough to 'creep' through the tuner-hole, even when sharply-bent correctly, during installation. A 3rd string is too stiff to 'creep' (and the wound strings have plenty of friction against their adjacent windings), so this is not necessary for those strings. Stephen White
Good point! I've always just put one wind over the tag, and the rest under, and never have I had a string slip...but I don't use 9s. I use 13s on acoustic and 16s on Resonators, more cables than strings.
I love the knot, never looked back. However I do the tension tight so there's max one wind. That way theres no string binding against itself on the post which is the main cause of tuning instability. Looks clean too. The trick is experimenting with your individual guitar on where to position the hole for each string. I use the 54432 (o'clock) method on my strat.
Hi Rich, I suppose one reason to have several "windings" going down the post would be to increase the "break angle" of the string (from nut to post) a little bit, to the extent that is important.
@donturnock5176 of course you can back that up right?.cause you in your infinite wisdom and Supreme over-arcing judgement can just see through the web and brush aside thousands of guitars and hundreds upon hundreds of satisfied customers to make this on high proclamation. Take a pass Don next time it occurs to you to chime in something you know so very little of.post script: I will never waste my time or anyone else's tying instrument strings into birds nests in a futile attempt to skip the critical steps of properly installing strings.and every time another guitar shows up with that mess I will curse the rubes who believe in f@#$ing the next guy with their inability to reason themselves out of someone else's delusios.
I’ve been restringing my own guitars for 40 years. My technique is to make sure I have 2 1/2 to 3 turns. For most 3+3 headstocks this means measuring to the next tuner post and cutting it off there. For inline 6 it’s just past the next or about half way to the 2nd. I start the first wrap above the becket and the rest below, just to keep the coil from bottoming out. Have never had slipping or tuning issues. I’ve been changing strings on pianos and even harpsichords for nearly 40 years. Some harpsichords don’t even have holes drilled in the pins. If piano makers tied their strings on you’d never been able to get them off the pin. You *may* need to do this for nylon, but with steel strings it is completely unnecessary.
@@ahhthatsjustgrand6502 Haha! Fantastic. I agree. Tying is unnecessary, especially on wound strings--which he uses for his demo! As long as there's a good kink where the string enters and exits the peg, and a couple of winds around, there'll be no problem.
I agree with tannertuner! I have been playing guitar for 50 years. I have also been a piano tech for about the same amount of time. I just changed my high e string to test luthier knot. Didn’t notice any real difference, and yes, I bend a lot of strings playing straight ahead blues! The key is a good tight becket(piano tech term for the bend at the hole), and 2( for wound) and 3(for plain steel) tight coils. Most guitar players do a sloppy restring, so I suppose the luthier knot will help in that case.
I've just started using this knot on my acoustic, and it does stay in tune better than my previous non-knot tuning method. I like how people have become so angry about the spectrum of knots on this channel.
This seems like a solution looking for a problem. I learned early on to just counter-wrap without the knot. It makes cleaner wraps and has all the same benefits.
This knot used to be in a little flyer inside Addario strings back in the last century. It's easier to apply when you start off by turning the tuner post bt 90 degrees. Been doing this since 1981 and never had a string slip, nor be impossible to remove on the fly. It also translates well to the nylon string guitar as well as to nylon strings with wooden tuning pegs (where I actually DO line up the post hole with the string direction)
I remember in the old days I would first wind the string around the post several times (WITHOUT running it through the post hole), with the windings properly "stacked", and THEN complete the process by sticking it through the post hole and bending it in the opposite direction of the cranking movement. Kind of "backing into it", I guess you could say. Probably not the wisest technique, but I didn't know any better, and it did the job! But the method shown here is great!
another tech tip that many people might scoff at is tinning the bridge side of the string where it meets the eyelet with solder. i don’t do it every time but if the iron is conveniently at hand then why not. anything to help lessen the stretching of the string to maintain pitch is great in my opinion.
Dude what a help this was! All the top videos on changing banjo strings failed to properly explain this or show closeups... Kept kinking my strings! Thanks
Great practical tip! I learnt this way nearly 50 years ago when I first started playing and for me is the only way to secure the string to the post. I am convinced the popularity of locking tuners on electrics is partly due to players not knowing how to attach their strings correctly and thinking that their machine heads are at fault. Lol I am starting to sound and think like an old man🤣
Locking tuners to me are mainly an aid to speed up and simplify string changes, since you eliminate the need to do any wraps(the method in this video also works great with minimal wrapping). Thought I'd agree, many people have no clue how to do most of their basic guitar maintenance lol
Cool video, but there's a much easier way and you'll never get pricked by the sharp end of the string poking out after you've tuned up! Just let the first wind around pass under the hole as you tighten each string (and each successive pass should go under the previous one), and make sure you leave enough slack to make 3-4 passes (except for the thicker strings, where you can get away with 2-3). That puts enough upward pressure on the part of the string that's going through the hole so that it will not come out. Finish tuning the string to whatever note it's designed for (EADGBE), and twist the end of the string back and forth until it snaps off clean. No cutter needed, no sharp end sticking out, and no goofy-looking loops made out of the extra string! Problem solved; no Luthier's knot needed. This works for the mandolin as well, and I am sure it would work for the banjo, although I don't have one and so I've never tried it.
literally came to the comments to mention exactly this. i've been breaking off strings at the post (after three wraps) for about thirty years now, and never once have i had a string slip or come undone. it's faster, safer, and easier.
@@lunacatfish it pretty much just works for bare metal strings or wound strings with a metal core, so it that rules out nylon/gut strings and most flat-wound strings for classical instruments(which often have gut/fiber cores) - i tried it on an electric bass once to no avail, never even bothered to attempt it on my upright
@@lunacatfish I don't have much knowledge on those instruments, so I would consider what @TypewriterJustice said in Reply to you, whatever of it applies to your situation. Sorry!
I played for a living for many years and never dealt with using a knot when changing strings; it made things much easier when removing them and changing again, which I did at least once a week. The key is giving the strings a very good stretching after the new ones are put on. (this was on a 73 LP with non-locking machine heads). Again, the real key is in the stretching...my opinion.
I love to use this knot when I want to mess with the next guy that has to change strings on the guitar. It’s really hard to get the strings off without pliers to unkink the string. It’s extremely frustrating if it happens to them during a set 😂. Personally I just do one over the tag, one under and it locks it in and taking them off is easy and fast but I appreciate the video. I always wondered where guys learn this knot that I seriously curse whenever I change strings with an instrument that has it. 😂. I’m Sure it’s my lack of knowledge or skills but I’m not a fan of it.
Exactly! In 43 years of playing I've come across far too many guitars that had various knots at the tuning post. When I do, I usually follow-up with a rant full of curse words expounding why it was completely unnecessary to do so. The closest thing to a "knot" I use is to install tie-on classic guitar strings. But, those "knots" are extremely easy to release at the next sting change; requiring no tools to do so.
I used to work at Guitar Center. Martin and Gibson tend to string their guitars from the factory with this "Luthier's Lock" and I hated it! Pain in the *ss to remove the strings haha.
wow big strory not funny. ever hear of clippers. omg they make it soooo easy it's like magic. you cut and pull on the bite of string and omg and they sell them every were, it's crazy like that lol
I’ve played guitar since I was 16 - (I feel like I’m 200 now 😋), I just changed some strings last weekend and noticed some slipping as I was tuning - this is a MARVELOUS TECHNIQUE for preventing slippage!! Thank you so much for this tip - PROPS! 😎👍💯
Banjo Ben - I used this technique for years and I abandoned it as a bad job. Too many times, I tore bloody holes in my fingers trying to undo that "kink", particularly on the stiff B string (0.018 medium gauge). Same technique without the reverse bend holds very well and is far safer for the poor schnook (usually me) who has to take those strings off in a few weeks.
I hear you! I've been using the "Martin" knot for almost 40 years. As my eyes got worse, I discovered a solution. I leave 3/8ths inch of the string tag instead of clipping right next to the post. It's much easier to free the bend without donating/sacrificing blood.
Why not unwrap the knot from the other side? If you are using an acoustic loosen the string and remove the peg in the bridge then unwrap it from the long end. With an electric you cut the string and again unwrap it from the other end.
@@CDRaff that doesn't help, especially with the B string. It's folded over like a tight u-turn, and the string is rigid. There's barely enough string to grab, and usually ends up stabbing your finger tip. That's why I cut them off to a 3/8ths length after winding, so I can grab it with needle nose pliers. Even with that, you have to be careful to avoid scraping the tool, or the string end, against the peghead. This knot prevents the string slipping either direction. You can't push it through with the long end until the fold is released.
I use to do this. Makes for a sloppy, bulging look. Make a hard Z then one wrap above the post and transition below. Locks it tight. Looks clean and tidy. No slip.
Your description is how I've done it for nearly 40 years. One wind above and the rest below. If the string windings are flush to the post, they aren't going to slip, and this knot is overkill. Ain't much more to say about it.
Now I know...at my next Thanksgiving family meal, I will not discuss religion, politics, or the Luthier's Knot.
Haha... good since of humor buddy... way to keep it lively...
Thanks for the video..it helps and shared something lots of folks needed to know..
If not for practically and measure than fir culture and history.. you did grand!
That is the right way to lock the string. Or I learned it from the old guys.
No-one is right or wrong. It's just your method (which always works, I have to say) so that's that. I use a different method that also works but that's just my preference. Interestingly, you didn't say this was the only way to install strings, just how to tie a luthier's knot. Thanks for taking the time to produce your excellent videos.
I found this very helpful
Lol. People act like you dont do this for a living. Thanks!
Been playing since 1974. This is the method I learned back then, and used for decades. I found a much easier way to secure the strings about 15 years ago. The first wrap of the string goes on top. Never had a slip, and removing the strings from the post is WAY easier than the knot.
Someone showed me this years ago, and I forgot all about it! I have a guitar right here I'll be stringing soon. This wee discussion will be very useful!
Yep. I work as a tech and builder. Having restrung hundreds of guitars, one wrap over and the rest under is perfectly stable, no weird knots to tie, and you don’t have to mangle the string and poke your finger to get it off. I can’t tell you how many guitars are strung up in such ridiculous ways I spend half the setup time just untangling and snipping strings from the tuners.
indeed, but I used to get blasted by others for using this what was called the Gibson wrap in the 70's because every Gibson came with a piece of paper showing this method, but as you stated and I always say, just one wrap above the string and the rest under grips the string without slippage and is far easier to remove, I've met many famous guitarists and none of them use this...they all do it the way you described...I really can't believe I'm seeing this pushed after so many decades.
Yes when I'm playing live if a string breaks, which it seldom does, I want it to fall off quickly so I don't wrestle with a knot. When I change strings on my acoustic I take the string end to the post I want, add the distance to the next post and that's good for over 2 full rotations on the capstan, there I put a 90 degree bend in the string. Slot in the post hole wrap over the top first winding then others go under. On my Telecasters I add the distance between 2 tuning pegs. Of course on the old Tele you had to put a 90 degree bend in the string and snip off the waste to insert in the hole before wrapping the string on the tuning peg. I try to avoid knots. :)
Also known as the "self locking" method
If you buy a set of SIT brand strings, you'll find their Stay In Tune guarantee only applies if you use this method (as per their instructions)
Good to see Gibson using it too
As a luthier and guitar tech, this winding technique is one of my biggest pet peeves. It’s such a chore to remove strings wound this way, and it doesn’t offer any greater tuning stability. It’s just a way to end up poking your finger and needing pliers to get the string off. I always wonder how players that wind like this remove a broken string during a show- “hang on while I bleed everywhere and mess around with these pliers”
Which way do you prefer?
@@gabedamien I don't know a better knot but I have a personal thing that I will share here. I use the same knot but I do NOT BELIEVE IN ALL THOSE COILS.
WHY NOT? I suspect that LESS COILS (ON THIS MAN MADE SPRING) HELPS TO ADD A SLIGHT TUNING STABILITY.
JUST MY HUMBLE & PERSONAL 2 CENTS.
Just cut it off and push it back the other way. Moaning about taking it off is lazy attitude. The knot works way better than any other method. Invented by Martin guitars when they first used steel strings. If you were my guitar tech I’d fire you in a heartbeat for complaining that it’s hard to get off.
@@MrPantera123456
Full time repair man at Lewiston music in NY. 49 years professional guitar player. Started working on guitars in 72, with my pal Bill, built guitars ( from boards) in the early eighties, stopped that when I realized I couldn’t compete . Still with my pal ,who worked at Gryphon at Palo Alto under the great Frank Ford. I do about 500 repairs a year. I’m putting in a new 5th string tuner on a banjo right now. I will tie the knot on that too. It works for me and all my customers. Making guitars Stay in tune is my job, taking them off is not a problem, wiring a sustainiac is hard, I’ll still do it.
Speed is not an issue for me,and whatever works for you is great! Congratulations on your success. Hope your days are filled with more success and you and your guitars keep on rocking!
I've just been straight up winding my strings up exactly like you just said that you're not supposed to do and I've been doing it for 30 years with pretty much zero problems. I do a lot of bends and stretches on the strings almost constantly so that pretty much pulls all the slack out of whatever is in the headstock.
I agree...my Grover tuners just don't slip once the string itself settles.
@@hudson3535 yeah once you start bending the strings and doing a lot of lead they usually straighten out with a couple hours of playing. And if you have a double lock tremolo with a lock nut at the top of the neck it doesn't matter how you string it up because once it's locked into place it ain't going nowhere
I’ve just always done the first wrap around above the excess string and the rest of them below it in a coil fashion. That seems to work well for me.
Same concept different approach 👌
Me too
I have changed at least a thousand sets of guitar strings, I did try this method one time but when I went to change the strings the next time, it was a real pain to remove them. I have found all you need to do is wrap the strings around the peg a couple times, stuff it thru the hole, bend it over, tighten it up, cut off the excess, done.
Only an ass needs to make it appear hard to do,.....Pathetic.
Yeah but, You don't get to brag about using a luthier's knot so nady nady. lol
If you take a rope, wrap it around a post once, it slips. Twice it still slips but not as much. 3 times it won't slip. Same goes for strings. 3 wraps underneath the hole, done. The only time i've had a string slip is when i tried one of these unecessary so called luthier knots.
You'll never have to change strings again.....until the next time! That was great!! Thanks for a really well-explained way to do this!
He was 100% right. I didn't have to change my stings until the next time.
I never change my strings until the next time! Who does that?
Yes indeed Brad your comment says just what I thought, so yeah that, and regards from LONDON 😍🇬🇧
You have to change strings?😄
😂😂😂
Was having crazy trouble locking my baritone, this is the only video that explains to add extra slack before winding, makes all the difference. Thanks brother
I learned how to do this back in 1975 from the mandolin instruction book titled “Bluegrass Mandolin”, written by Jack Tottle. I’ve been using this technique ever since. I had no idea there was a term for it. Thanks Jake!
I've been using this technique for a year or so & it works great! I never knew it was called a Luthier's Knot. I'm looking forward to dropping that term in casual conversation! 😄
I've been using this method for years and never knew it had a name. I honestly don't even remember where I learned it, but it's a great trick and this was an excellent presentation of it.
Same. I always see people saying it's overkill, but I don't see any reason no to do it.
Same here, being doing this technique without knowing it had a name. I always thought it was my idea. Gosh darnit.
I learned this very early in my guitar playing 33-35 years ago. I didn’t know this had a name until now other than “the right way.”
Excellent. I've been using this knot since I learned how to play (30+ years ago). The camera work and specific instructions will make it perfect for my guitar students.
Helpful, after being out 25yrs and then having two different setups show up this was a great refresher. Thanks.
I bought a Martin D35 in 1987 and there was instructions included to string this way. I don't recall it being called a "luthier's knot" but I've been using the method ever since. I don't know that I have ever run into anyone else who uses it. It does work well for me, never have had an issue with slippage. Thanks for sharing.
I’ve seen a few explanations for the luthier’s knot, but this one makes the most sense!
Thank you, Connie! We aim to please!
I agree! Now I'm excited for my strings to go bad so I can change them!
AND it's not a 30 minute introductory video but straight to the point how-it's-done.
You mean “The rabbit goes around the tree, then under the sideways tree, then back up around the second tree, then the rabbit runs off. Then the first tree starts spinning around and the second tree gets like stuck under itself and gets pulled into the first tree. Or something.” wasn’t a clear and concise explanation?
@@dudebro7698 🤣🤣🤣
I was gifted a banjo and I watched about 5 videos that did not help so gave up for 2 weeks and finally found this 🙌🏼🙌🏼🙌🏼 Exactly what I needed thank you!
A clear how-to demonstration and explanation. I don't restring my guitars nearly often enough, by the next time I've forgotten how this is done. I refer to videos like this every time. Good video, thanks! 👍👍👍😏😏😏
Been doing this for years but, I like to measure and then bend the string into a 45 deg. angle and that allows me to pull up the slack until I hit the bend, then wrap it under. Same thing, just the way I do it. Nice video.
I have been playing the guitar for 59 years and I have always wanted to be able to do this. Thank you for being so clear!
seriously? 59 years and you didnt even do it once by accident?
This is "my special" method . I "developed" this 35 years ago. :-)
Same here. Been changing guitar strings for 40 years but didn't know about this knot.
Same here at 65 years. I knew there was a method but everyone I asked had different ideas.
@@dyers1210 lol
Thanks dude, I used this on my 50 year old Maton guitar today, the tuners aren't concave and the hole is very close to the bottom, works a treat and heck of alot faster to string up, you bloody ripper 👍🇦🇺
I have been playing guitar for 16 years and never heard of this. Thanks for sharing, this looks awesome. 👏👏👏
This is ancient magic wizardry.
How about using physics and the design of the tuner post to insure that you don't need a knot. If you notice, most new tuning posts are concave and flare out above and below the string hole. After you put the string through the hole put the first wind over the top of the string coming through the hole, then all successive winds below the string end coming through the hole. The concave part of the tuning post then cinches the string tight from the top and bottom compressing the winds against the string end and making it almost impossible to slip. Cut off the leftover string. This makes it a lot easier to change strings in the future.
Yep.
Thank you...this is the best way. I don't care for the knot when removing them.
You should post a video.
That's the way I learned about 60 years ago, It has done me OK all this time.
Absolutely correct! That's the way I've been doing my strings since the age of 13 in 1979. And I'm a "get this fucker in tune and keep it that way!" kind of detail man.
I watched this video to see what sort of backwoods method was being taught. And while it might work out fine, there is no better way than what you've described here.
Hopefully, most newbies will question and scroll down to read your comments!
Marc
⚡
This style of wrap is fine for players that don't gig. If you gig, or tech for other bands, this method absolutely creates issues when removing the strings. In most cases, needle nose pliers and good lighting are needed to remove the broken part of the string that is still wound on the tuner. This can really make it difficult to quickly change out a strings. I prefer the method of wrapping the first winding above tuner hole and the rest below. This will create enough tension to keep the strings in place without wasting time trying to remove the leftover broken string.
Right, well I gigged for decades and used the mandolin method (AKA luthier's knot). I'm afraid I simply don't agree with your objections. First, if you change your strings as often as I think you should, you will RARELY break one. Second, there's a mindlessly simple way to remove strings. Cut them and push them back through the tuner. It takes seconds. This method works fine for gigging players, as do several other methods. Use the one you like. Again, this one works and works well if you do it correctly.
I do the "one over, and the rest under" method too. Three full wraps on the wound strings, and five or six on the unwound. Unless you're playing on cat-gut strings, they ain't slipping at all! None! Once they're stretched-in, if anyone has tuning issues it's probably because they didn't put graphite in the NUT slots, or they don't know that you have to always tune UP. If you need to go down, you have to go farther down, and then come back up. I tie knots when I rock climb, not when I Rock the Casbah.
@@mxgr194 I absolutely agree. ALSO, if you gig with a guitar strung with this method, less tuning is required!!!!
@@truculenttones Yes, been doing this knot for 20+ years. I teach this to every guitarist who comes to my shop. Definitely the most stable for sure.
Under/over, it doesn't get any simplier. Unwind one turn, pull, and your string is off the post.
Been doing this for 20 years and it works a treat. Great vid!
Ever since I watched this video when in came out, it has been so much easier to change strings on my guitars. Such a simple thing, but so very useful!
"Hope it helps."? Heck yeah it helps! I've heard of the Luthiers Knot but never seen it explained and demonstrated so simply before.
Thanks a bunch!
Well done! The camera angle was perfect, and you gave a good explanation…and it's a short video! I'm going to save this so I can show it to my students.
Great tip - I have done it differently for years, but your method is easier, quicker and still locks down the string. Also saves me time in my workshop - thanks!
Thank you very much. New bassist 400 hours and first time I have replaced my strings. The shop I went to previously closed down after covid and I live in the country and now the closest city has lost the guitar shop. This was a great help now I am fiddling with the height of the string compared to the previous setup. I think my string gauge is larger so strings getting in my way. I will check out your other vids they may have the answer.
I like how short, simple and clear this was. Thank you!
Thank you sir! I had begun to think I was the only guy alive that strung guitars this way. My teacher showed me how to do this when I was 12. I still do it at 65. He said “ this is how they do it at the factory” I guess that is now “the good ole days” Keep up the good work sir! Peace!!
Great video. Been doing it with one wind at the top and rest underneath for years. Tried this today and love it. Also like the inch and a half measurement. Will do this from now on. Cheers!
which factory?
Martin. I suspect they do itt save time, then the customers have to try to undo the mess. Both of my Martins came knotted, and cursed them trying get the strings off the post.
Kudos to the videographer. The angles shown made it very easy to visualize what was going on.
Easy Peasy! Probably the BEST video here on CZcams that I have seen on the luthiers knot by far!
I am older than dirt and have been playing since the sixties. In all that time, I never knew how to properly start a new string installation. Thank you very much!
Thanks Jake! I was taught to use this knot in the late 60's, holds great! Another thing I was taught to do while the strings were off was to check the tightness of the tuning machine nuts to make sure they weren't walking around, about ten inch pounds is good. If the machine nuts are loose it can damage the head stock by wallowing out the machine head bores and cause the instrument to loose tune.
Foot-pound, hand-pound, bro. 😆 this is good info too, thx!
what is the tuning machine nuts. lol
@@christineblack4654 The nut is on the face of the head around the tuning post where you palace the new string thru the pin. It's very important that you don't over tighten the nut as it will damage the head. Don't tighten more than 10in"pounds ( just a little more than finger tight). Not all tuners are attached this way, some are screwed on to the back side of the head. When in doubt take the guitar to the shop.
Beginner at restringing here. Thank you so much, your video is the clearest and easiest to follow of all the ones I've watched. And done very classy! Some folks forget that beginners learn best when distractions are lower and the teacher is calm and kind. 😊
Top notch Ben. I've been playing 50 years and never used (or even heard of) this technique. Gonna restring my Les Paul tonight and see how it goes. One thing the inch/inch and a half thing, I tend to pull the string back a frets length instead of guessing how much slack I need. Playing with what's left of the Easybeats Jan 13th so Ill give it a go! Cheers again.
This is by far the best video on how to do this on youtube. No one else zooms in with the good camera angles to show exactly what they're doing like this video does. Great job.
I've used this method for about 15 years and found it to be precise, but I try and keep the windings to a minimum (between one and two winds), and I don't bother going above the string at all so I can just flip the end back over while there is still tension when replacing, and it doesn't stretch as much over time. People find their own ways but I would say if I was charging to restring guitars, I would want to make certain the user will have zero issues every time and this method makes certain of that.
A very informative video, I'm sure a lot of people are finding it helpful.
I agree. He puts too much slack before coming back around. You
don't have to put any slack into it. Just go back around and under
with no slack. His peg now has too many wraps on it which can
stretch and loosen. If you go without slack, there is no extra to
stretch and loosen. The lock is already there even if you don't wrap
extra times as he does. The extra wraps are doing nothing good.
What a great video! I've seen a lot of other guys make this sooo complicated. Just changed my strings...not as pretty of a knot as yours, but close! Thanks for posting.
Thank you so much for doing it so slowly with an excellent closeup shot. That is the best demonstration I have found on CZcams!
As a guitar builder/player, I used to do this but removing strings after was very aggravating. Decided to use locking tuners and haven’t looked back since!
locking tuners are life quality of life!
I’ve seen a lot of people complain about removing this knot. I don’t understand why. I have it down to a science.
@@petemoore8923 only just seen it but yeah, that would be easy to me already! lol.
@@silverfr3ak i ain't that fussy, western music is out of tune with the harmonic series any way and all good music has micro tonal quirks that give it soul, its possible to be too in tune, just like how it's possible to be too in time.. to play with these things sometimes is what makes it human and gives it swag, though, also, yeah, tuning sucks, mine stay in cus i bend up to 5 frets and use compound bends and stuff, i play hard in some styles too and guess got lot of vibratos going on in my hand.. interesting subject, like how van hallen dropped his b string so he could play A major bar shapes and the third would be purer / more in tune against that one note, same on my lap slide guitar, the B string is always flat because it's an open G chord, , if you tweak every note in a chord, you can make it pure, but if you change chord you end up, needing, many, sharper and flatter versions of each note, madness lol, hence we have 12TET.
I thought we ALL did that? I use the knot on my acoustics but locking nut is way to go.
Thanks for the great tip Ben. After 65 years of playing, and stringing instruments, this is the most efficient I've experienced. That being said, it's very difficult or next to impossible to utilize the knot on A and B strings when using a gauge below 12s. For these 2 strings, I wrap the strings 4 times around the post, then pass the strings through the post hole and over the top of the wrap. Holds tight, clean wind and easy to remove old strings when the time comes.
I learned this after buying my first "high-end" guitar... It's been a great asset for string life and tuning accuracy, now I service my 10 guitars, mostly acoustics, and use the Luthier's knot where a string goes through a post.
Good presentation. I used the same knot for a few decades but then dropped it about 15 years ago. I found it unnecessary and not having the knot makes it easier and faster to remove the string from the post when restringing. When I put a new string on, I thread the string through the post pretty much the same as you show, but I then kink the string on both sides of the post: toward the inside of the headstock above the post and toward the outside below the post. I then crank the tuner and wind the string with all the windings going on the post below the string and post hole. The two kinks lock the string and give more than enough friction so that I never have slippage or tuning problems. Works on all the strings even the high E string on acoustic guitars, electric guitars, and mandolins.
I have watched several videos on changing acoustic strings and this one is, by far, the clearest and best-thanks!
Thank you so much Ben for sharing this trick. I once knew a luthier in Seattle named Phil Tafoya who taught me this trick. This was back when we didn't have those little clip on tuners, so tuning was an even bigger deal than now. I was playing 5-7 nights a week in those days an breaking strings fairly regularly. Also, I was (and still am) a big fan of the two-fret bend. Needless to say, the Tafoya knot, as I call it, was a game changer. One more thing. Phil was specific about going just once around the peg if possible. The more you wrap, the more they stretch. I find that once around works great. What's funny is whenever I show this trick to others, they think I'm nuts. They are correct, but it's not because of this knot.
Also called “The Martin Knot.” The factory does it this way and in my “Care Booklet” it shows this method. Very useful video and practical knowledge!
Thank you sir. 30 years of stringing guitars now and then. My way works, but I will for sure try this next time, tywm.
I've always done it like this. Tip for the right amount of slack is to use 1st and 2nd fret.
Pull the string tight, grab the string at the 1st fret and pull it back to the 2nd fret and that's your slack. Then do the knot.
That’s smart. I always tried to use the distance of the tuning pegs as my measurement adjustments, but that’s way more consistent and easier than guesstimating on the D and G on 3x3s or the B and E on in-lines. I’m definitely trying this next string change.
1.5 frets thickest 2 strings.. 2 full frets on the rest.
This was a phenomenal how-to. I started playing guitar about a month ago and the stock high e snapped while a friend and I were doing a "pinch harmonic squeal-off" and like a knuckle-head I snapped the string bringing it up too high. I was having such a difficult time trying to re-string the guitar until I watched your video a few times and I nailed it. Thank you so much! This is something I'll definitely be using for the rest of my life.
I've done that for decades but had no idea what it was called. Thank you much! Best!
Ben thats the best demo I have ever seen. Just restrung my Les Paul and all strings look tidy and tight Thank You
I've been doing this for about the last 4 of my 18 years of playing. Gives me so much more confidence in the first few tunings. It's so satisfying when you look at how the string grabs itself and locks into position.
Interesting to see how many variations there are for "luthiers knots". I have actually been using this version of luthiers knot for the past couple of decades, since learning it from a guitar maintenance book, and it has pretty much eliminated all potential tuning issues. Possibly more time consuming than other "string wrapping" methods, but in my experience, it is well worth the extra time for the tuning stability. Excellent demonstration Ben!
Variations? Those would be different knots. There's only one way to do that knot and that's how it was shown.
I have been using the Luthier's Knot for decades and find it quite easy. One thing I was taught is to go just once around the peg. Phil Tafoya, who taught me, was very specific about this.
Metal can strip lol
Only if is lossen too much
Thanks for the reminder. I used to do this all the time but it's been a really long time now. Also someone told me once to change them one at a time so you don't put the instrument through too much of a change in pressure from releasing all the strings at once. One of these days would like to get back in the saddle again.
Excellent Ben..... like you said most of us understand the Bridge/ pin part. Thank you for a clear explanation. You’re a pro👍 Best to you.
I wrap all the winds progressively down over the “tail” and the last wind under it, on the G, B, and high E.
On the E, A, and D, I wrap one wind over the tail and the rest under. Works great on guitars with tremolos.
It’s a modification of something I was taught when I worked for a guitar building shop.
Please post a video thanks for info like this
Was about to suggest if you could post of video, but that's already done... so... please?
Can't really picture that from the description.
This is the way all Martin guitars are strung at the factory. It allows you to group the tasks. Use the knot to put all the strings on, then come back and tighten, then stretch each string, then tune to pitch. The stretching part is important because when you tune to pitch, it stays in pitch.
Been doing this since my guitar came back from the luthier strung that way. For no technical reason whatsoever, I just think it looks cool. So it's really between myself and my guitar headstock. Good explanation, and very well shot. 👏👏👏
Yeah, I've only been changing strings for 50+ odd years, and this is the first time I've heard of this knot. I'm gonna get some new strings for my acoustic and try this. Thanks Ben!!
I'm not sure why in this video the guy uses so many winds, but it's really not necessary. The point of that "tie," is to decrease the number of winds so that the wind itself doesn't stretch on the key as you wind up. I generally pull the slack until you got slight tension. Then use the key to crimp the string of the desired length then use this tie. Gives you a good one, one half winds and you just need turn the tuning machine a few times.
I just wrap one wind on top of the tag end, and the rest underneath. It "clamps" the tag end in place, just like this knot, except it's easier. I've never had an issue in 20+ years. I do know a lot of luthiers who swear by this method, so I'm sure there's something to it, but I've never seen a reason to change.
Yep! I usually pull the string tight and throw 2 or 3 or 4 wraps (depending on which string) around the post before I push the through the hole and under the 1st wind. Then give the end a sharp 90 degrees up. Then it only takes a little wind to get up to pitch. Saves a lot of key turning.
@@brin57 I've done that, too. I always give the tag end an upwards, 90 degree tug before I clip it, too. Never once have I had an issue.
I've found this knot works for me for plain strings on a classical guitar (on the wound ones I just use "one over, the rest under" technique). The nylon strings are more slippery and with this knot it's easier to keep them in tune.
I don't have an acoustic guitar, but I guess it's similar to an electric, where indeed I've never had a problem with just 2-3 turns, without any knots. As always, YMMV.
Good Luthiers will never recommend this. Knots belongs on fishing lines not guitars
@@larry6686st Old dogs CAN learn new tricks that work well.
My dad (rip) taught me this when I was sixteen because he was sick of changing my strings, his dad taught it him at thirteen, I taught my daughter it when she was eleven. She is twenty one now doing a music degree, I am fifty six. I watched this to confirm/teach 😂
Like deployed 👍
Wow it runs in the family
Why would this mean you change strings less?
Surely it’s purpose is just to reduce the amount you have to keep tuning it?
At 5, after 2 lessons, my piano teacher told me mum "He could be a prodigy." My "dad" (I WISH he was RIP instead of yours), cancelled the lessons when hockey season started. My mum's brother gave me his acoustic at age 8. "Dad" put it in the attic. 4 years later he brought it down cuz unc was coming for a visit for a week.
When he left he told my mom, 'He's a natural. Really good ear too'. "Dad" cut the strings off. I was 22 before I got a guitar in uni.
You're lucky AF dad only got upset about changing your strings mate.
@@ROOKTABULA fair play, that's just, well you know what it is and I feel for you, my old man loved the music and was to all intents and purposes a respected member of the community, he reintergrated physically and mentally disabled people back into the community after a full career teaching them prior to that. He was also lionised by every musician in our small town as the pinnacle to aspire to, he also mapped a way for that integration that was picked up and ran with by not only our council but county ( possibly country wide). When I grew up every woman within his sphere of age acted as if he was a Demi-god and he played and acted to it, when I was eleven one of them 16 years his junior took him away until I was 17 and it was me that found him. Of the 6 children that he had it was only me that remained communicating with him continuously. He was everything to everyone except the people that mattered, I held his hand as he died and told him that I truly loved him, which I did, but he was a shit to all that loved him and if he knew he did not care one jot. All dad's are dick's.
🫂❤️
Edit:- I don't discount myself in this, though I truly wish that I could, for shame 😔, does anyone ever learn🤔
Not all dads are dicks dude how can you say that? My father was a great guy, and I'm trying to be as much of a good father like he was. Sorry you had these experiences but not all fathers are like that!
Good job anticipating questions. So clear. Well done.
After I've changed the strings I pull on each one to take out the stretching...helps them stay in tune.
Great video. 👍
.. ... And that can kinda work sometimes..." - Works 100% of the time for me, for the last 12 years.
This can also make a lot of people play old rusty strings rather than lose nerves trying to unknot and restring. Fresh strings are important, it doesn't only apply in studio enviroment.
I learned this method from my guitar teacher some 44 years ago and have since found it unnecessary and makes removing strings troublesome. Just push string thru hole 1 5/8 - 2", depending on the thickness of the string... pull it back. I do 1st wind over the top of the hole and the rest underneath. Strings do not loosen I know this because if the string loosened as much as 3/16" it would pull right through the hole.
Ditto
I've been doing one over, the rest under for years as well. This "luthier's knot" seems like a great way to scratch the piss out of a headstock and be a total annoyance come removal time. I'll take this video as advice on techniques to avoid 😆
@@stinkychickentitty lol
YEP---your way holds just as well, and doesn't cause problems later.
Same here. It's worked for me since 1977. 😃
Just came across this . . . Good old CZcams! Very simple but highly useful. No more slipping birdsnests for me! Thank you for positing AND for explaining it so well.
I learned this knot by looking at it when it came back from the guitar shop and I do ever since. Never let me down.
I've been a full-time repair-tech for over 40 years ('Guitar Tech' - in the SF Bay Area), and in my opinion, this video is almost - but not completely - wrong. As has been said below, this 'knot' is completely unnecessary On The Wound Strings. However, on electric guitars using very light-gauge strings (9-42 or 8-38 sets), it can be very useful to perform this process on the 1st (high E) and 2nd (B) strings, because these strings (especially an .008"-gauge 1st string!) can be flexible enough to 'creep' through the tuner-hole, even when sharply-bent correctly, during installation. A 3rd string is too stiff to 'creep' (and the wound strings have plenty of friction against their adjacent windings), so this is not necessary for those strings.
Stephen White
Good point! I've always just put one wind over the tag, and the rest under, and never have I had a string slip...but I don't use 9s. I use 13s on acoustic and 16s on Resonators, more cables than strings.
Stephen White brilliantly repaired/set-up/modded many of my guitars and basses in the early 90s… I’ll follow his advice on this topic 👍🏻
I love the knot, never looked back. However I do the tension tight so there's max one wind. That way theres no string binding against itself on the post which is the main cause of tuning instability. Looks clean too. The trick is experimenting with your individual guitar on where to position the hole for each string. I use the 54432 (o'clock) method on my strat.
Hi Rich, I suppose one reason to have several "windings" going down the post would be to increase the "break angle" of the string (from nut to post) a little bit, to the extent that is important.
Excellent demonstration/teaching ! God bless ! Thank you.
Thanks Ben! I've been CLOSE for 50 years but I'll never differ from this method from here on out, no "tinks" or "creeks" since trying this method
Just watched a video on things techs hate that customers do. This was number one.....
As a tech for 45 years,I can concur. No benefits, only hassles
@@bradsmith7311 Obviously not a very good tech.....
@donturnock5176 of course you can back that up right?.cause you in your infinite wisdom and Supreme over-arcing judgement can just see through the web and brush aside thousands of guitars and hundreds upon hundreds of satisfied customers to make this on high proclamation. Take a pass Don next time it occurs to you to chime in something you know so very little of.post script: I will never waste my time or anyone else's tying instrument strings into birds nests in a futile attempt to skip the critical steps of properly installing strings.and every time another guitar shows up with that mess I will curse the rubes who believe in f@#$ing the next guy with their inability to reason themselves out of someone else's delusios.
I’ve been restringing my own guitars for 40 years. My technique is to make sure I have 2 1/2 to 3 turns. For most 3+3 headstocks this means measuring to the next tuner post and cutting it off there. For inline 6 it’s just past the next or about half way to the 2nd. I start the first wrap above the becket and the rest below, just to keep the coil from bottoming out.
Have never had slipping or tuning issues.
I’ve been changing strings on pianos and even harpsichords for nearly 40 years. Some harpsichords don’t even have holes drilled in the pins. If piano makers tied their strings on you’d never been able to get them off the pin.
You *may* need to do this for nylon, but with steel strings it is completely unnecessary.
but still good.
You don’t bend strings much if that method works. They don’t bend piano strings.
I think tying is what we learned in like 1100 when strings were made of suet and sinew and not finely crafted wound metal wires
@@ahhthatsjustgrand6502 Haha! Fantastic. I agree. Tying is unnecessary, especially on wound strings--which he uses for his demo! As long as there's a good kink where the string enters and exits the peg, and a couple of winds around, there'll be no problem.
I agree with tannertuner! I have been playing guitar for 50 years. I have also been a piano tech for about the same amount of time. I just changed my high e string to test luthier knot. Didn’t notice any real difference, and yes, I bend a lot of strings playing straight ahead blues! The key is a good tight becket(piano tech term for the bend at the hole), and 2( for wound) and 3(for plain steel) tight coils. Most guitar players do a sloppy restring, so I suppose the luthier knot will help in that case.
Just about to change a string or six. Always nice to be an expert! Thanks.
I've just started using this knot on my acoustic, and it does stay in tune better than my previous non-knot tuning method.
I like how people have become so angry about the spectrum of knots on this channel.
This seems like a solution looking for a problem. I learned early on to just counter-wrap without the knot. It makes cleaner wraps and has all the same benefits.
Same here
Took me a while .lol had guitar worked on came back that way.
All i needed
I hate when people lock wrap like this. It makes it more annoying taking the strings off.
Yea, this vid is a joke..you wrap 3 times before threading, then feed it through, pull tight and then wind the knob..no problem ever with tuning
lol theres zero problems with this.
This knot used to be in a little flyer inside Addario strings back in the last century. It's easier to apply when you start off by turning the tuner post bt 90 degrees. Been doing this since 1981 and never had a string slip, nor be impossible to remove on the fly. It also translates well to the nylon string guitar as well as to nylon strings with wooden tuning pegs (where I actually DO line up the post hole with the string direction)
I remember in the old days I would first wind the string around the post several times (WITHOUT running it through the post hole), with the windings properly "stacked", and THEN complete the process by sticking it through the post hole and bending it in the opposite direction of the cranking movement. Kind of "backing into it", I guess you could say. Probably not the wisest technique, but I didn't know any better, and it did the job! But the method shown here is great!
Excellent video! Thank you for the clear, and concise explanation.
Good but in addition I prefer that the first wrap Goes over the top of the knot.
another tech tip that many people might scoff at is tinning the bridge side of the string where it meets the eyelet with solder. i don’t do it every time but if the iron is conveniently at hand then why not. anything to help lessen the stretching of the string to maintain pitch is great in my opinion.
Dude what a help this was! All the top videos on changing banjo strings failed to properly explain this or show closeups... Kept kinking my strings! Thanks
That makes sense. Thank you for the great tip. From now on, I will use your method when I change my guitar strings
Great practical tip! I learnt this way nearly 50 years ago when I first started playing and for me is the only way to secure the string to the post. I am convinced the popularity of locking tuners on electrics is partly due to players not knowing how to attach their strings correctly and thinking that their machine heads are at fault. Lol I am starting to sound and think like an old man🤣
Locking tuners to me are mainly an aid to speed up and simplify string changes, since you eliminate the need to do any wraps(the method in this video also works great with minimal wrapping). Thought I'd agree, many people have no clue how to do most of their basic guitar maintenance lol
There are slip-proof ways to do it that don't involve the knot.
Cool video, but there's a much easier way and you'll never get pricked by the sharp end of the string poking out after you've tuned up! Just let the first wind around pass under the hole as you tighten each string (and each successive pass should go under the previous one), and make sure you leave enough slack to make 3-4 passes (except for the thicker strings, where you can get away with 2-3). That puts enough upward pressure on the part of the string that's going through the hole so that it will not come out. Finish tuning the string to whatever note it's designed for (EADGBE), and twist the end of the string back and forth until it snaps off clean. No cutter needed, no sharp end sticking out, and no goofy-looking loops made out of the extra string! Problem solved; no Luthier's knot needed. This works for the mandolin as well, and I am sure it would work for the banjo, although I don't have one and so I've never tried it.
literally came to the comments to mention exactly this. i've been breaking off strings at the post (after three wraps) for about thirty years now, and never once have i had a string slip or come undone. it's faster, safer, and easier.
@@TypewriterJustice Haha exactly!
Hi, your technique seems simple, would it also work for violin and ukulele strings? For bass? Thanks.
@@lunacatfish it pretty much just works for bare metal strings or wound strings with a metal core, so it that rules out nylon/gut strings and most flat-wound strings for classical instruments(which often have gut/fiber cores) - i tried it on an electric bass once to no avail, never even bothered to attempt it on my upright
@@lunacatfish I don't have much knowledge on those instruments, so I would consider what @TypewriterJustice said in Reply to you, whatever of it applies to your situation. Sorry!
Been playing guitar for 45 years and at last I know how to put a string on. Thanks, Ben.
Banjo Ben Clark, thank you for keeping it simple.
The knot can make changing strings very difficult and if strung properly no need.
Agreed....its a headache.
Amen! This is passing on ignorance at it's finest.
I've never used it yet
dfficult really? lol ever try clippers. omg they work soooo well.
Yup!
I played for a living for many years and never dealt with using a knot when changing strings; it made things much easier when removing them and changing again, which I did at least once a week. The key is giving the strings a very good stretching after the new ones are put on. (this was on a 73 LP with non-locking machine heads). Again, the real key is in the stretching...my opinion.
I agree. Stretching the strings and a properly cut nut will keep your guitar in tune. I think the knot is useless.
yep stretching and also tuning the guitar in playing position is most important
Outstandingly perfect video, good sir!!!
Excellent! Thanks, Ben. All the best!
I've been a guitar player for 53 years and even made a living at it for a couple... I've never seen that. So much simpler than the way I was taught.
Same here, 50+ years. This is a revelation. Should be the first thing taught to all new players in Guitar 101
I love to use this knot when I want to mess with the next guy that has to change strings on the guitar. It’s really hard to get the strings off without pliers to unkink the string. It’s extremely frustrating if it happens to them during a set 😂. Personally I just do one over the tag, one under and it locks it in and taking them off is easy and fast but I appreciate the video. I always wondered where guys learn this knot that I seriously curse whenever I change strings with an instrument that has it. 😂. I’m
Sure it’s my lack of knowledge or skills but I’m not a fan of it.
I'm totally with you on that.
Exactly! In 43 years of playing I've come across far too many guitars that had various knots at the tuning post. When I do, I usually follow-up with a rant full of curse words expounding why it was completely unnecessary to do so. The closest thing to a "knot" I use is to install tie-on classic guitar strings. But, those "knots" are extremely easy to release at the next sting change; requiring no tools to do so.
@@kenfoland A pity Nigel Ng isn't into guitars (as far as I know); I can just hear his 'Haiyaaa!'. :-)))
I used to work at Guitar Center. Martin and Gibson tend to string their guitars from the factory with this "Luthier's Lock" and I hated it! Pain in the *ss to remove the strings haha.
wow big strory not funny. ever hear of clippers. omg they make it soooo easy it's like magic. you cut and pull on the bite of string and omg and they sell them every were, it's crazy like that lol
I’ve played guitar since I was 16 - (I feel like I’m 200 now 😋), I just changed some strings last weekend and noticed some slipping as I was tuning - this is a MARVELOUS TECHNIQUE for preventing slippage!!
Thank you so much for this tip - PROPS! 😎👍💯
So simple and yet, such a very useful presentation! 👍👍👍
Banjo Ben - I used this technique for years and I abandoned it as a bad job. Too many times, I tore bloody holes in my fingers trying to undo that "kink", particularly on the stiff B string (0.018 medium gauge). Same technique without the reverse bend holds very well and is far safer for the poor schnook (usually me) who has to take those strings off in a few weeks.
I hear you! I've been using the "Martin" knot for almost 40 years. As my eyes got worse, I discovered a solution. I leave 3/8ths inch of the string tag instead of clipping right next to the post. It's much easier to free the bend without donating/sacrificing blood.
Why not unwrap the knot from the other side? If you are using an acoustic loosen the string and remove the peg in the bridge then unwrap it from the long end. With an electric you cut the string and again unwrap it from the other end.
@@CDRaff that doesn't help, especially with the B string. It's folded over like a tight u-turn, and the string is rigid. There's barely enough string to grab, and usually ends up stabbing your finger tip. That's why I cut them off to a 3/8ths length after winding, so I can grab it with needle nose pliers. Even with that, you have to be careful to avoid scraping the tool, or the string end, against the peghead.
This knot prevents the string slipping either direction. You can't push it through with the long end until the fold is released.
@@JonNewquist I have been doing this well over 20 years, no it doesn't.
@@CDRaff I've been doing it for forty. Maybe your eyes are better than mine, maybe your pinch strength is stronger than mine. 😁
I use to do this. Makes for a sloppy, bulging look. Make a hard Z then one wrap above the post and transition below. Locks it tight. Looks clean and tidy. No slip.
Your description is how I've done it for nearly 40 years. One wind above and the rest below. If the string windings are flush to the post, they aren't going to slip, and this knot is overkill. Ain't much more to say about it.
Really good camera angles so we could see exactly what you were doing. Thanks for making this.