Now Is The Best Time To Quit X-Men Comics For Good
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- čas přidán 4. 09. 2024
- Marvel threw a Hail Mary moving Tom Brevoort from Avengers to X-Men. But it's very clear X-Men comics aren't getting better anytime soon. And the best time to quit X-Men is before From the Ashes even begins. Brevoort is flooding the shelf with stupid solo titles and irrelevant teams all replaying the greatest hits from the past 50 years with far worse comic writers. Wes and Dok talk about the new Mystique and Sentinels comics coming during X-Men From the Ashes. Now is the best time to quit X-Men comics for good.
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#marvel #xmen #comicbooks
Remember roughly seven years ago, a veteran collector told me, “Marvel just seems to want to hastily build a new fan base…” Haven’t seen that guy in a while, I missed his conversations in the comic book shop. Yet, seven years later his words are prophetic. What. A. Mess. Even when Marvel was given a gift of possibilities, the Krakoa era…they ran it into the ground. They’ve managed to make every mutant unlikable. When poor writers who never read a comic book start making Jedis the bad guys, Star fleet into villains, Professor X as a turncoat, Batman into a privileged orphan… there’s really no coming back from that. Cause if every one of us is a piece of shit there’s nothing to aspire to. And that’s why Marvel can’t wipe their ass. It’s just verbal diarrhea.
They’ve successfully ruined the X-men.
Long time fan of gaming, novels, films and shows, but when films and shows droppped off in general quality and fun I had a entertainment gap to fill. People crave the new, but does the new have to be shiny new or just a new experience? Over three years ago I tried comics as a replacement entertainment for the drop off in films/shows. Pricing wise cost more even in trade format, but time wise comparable to a movie or a show so they filled the gap. I started with all the old as it was a new read and still loving it. Reading such random stuff now way to long to list, but my main wheelhouse is older big two and older 2000 AD.
Every weekend I get a mini horde of the kids, kids visiting and some always stopping. Their Dad works a lot and tries to compsentate with presents. Unlike my grandad and dad I am the interactive parent type sports & gaming. Now the kids, kids are older I can show them the good old that is all new to them. They are more invested in stuff decades old before they was born even buying merch. I got round the modern movie/show franchise fails by trying something old that is a new experience as in comics. The kids, kids it's way easier just showing them older movies/shows all as a new experience. That is how I have got around the lack of inspiring content for this old and the really young ones in the family.
The ironic thing big entertainment corporations are alway trying to nostaliga bait us olds with the old inspiring stuff. For us to convince the kids or the kids, kids to watch it with us. The corporations want that generational legacy to pass things on, but don't make the stuff we was invested in to pass on anymore. After JJ Star Trek I watched the JJ TFA alone. I figured out the game they was playing then.
@@DrDetfink I remember telling my father that Marvel was circling the drain 2-3 years before it made the main stream media. Its not rocket science. If you truly love the product you will have a discerning eye focused on its good qualities and denouncing its bad... and if you pay attention you will see it going south en masse with sudden collective trends.
The switch towards mass marketing was such a trend.
The replacing of the aging fanbase was another obvious shift. At a time when they were losing readers to digital media, and manga were growing in popularity, they could have ridden the wave of the MCU popularity by aiming for the iconic characters and holding the films to doing the same, but they listened to marketing, making changes to "fill the seats," by courting new potential fans over older tried and tested fans with disposable income, hiring young adult-thinking writers... and missed the mark entirely.
The MCU was more hit than miss, but probably would have had more legs if they stayed truer to (movie adapted) continuity - a "good parts version" of Marvel history.
@@sardomarcrowe5723 The problem with replacing the aging fan base is that the younger generation really doesn’t read and collect comics all that much. They might get into it here or there but they do not sustain the market. They get their superhero kicks from Netflix ,video games and Hollywood now. Sadly, I see the medium of superhero comics going the way of stamp collecting or baseball cards.
@@RamManNo1sadly I agree. There are things that manga do that perhaps appeal to younger readers, but many of them are NOT why I read comics. Courting the YA audience with YA writers has been disastrous for both Marvel and DC... and that doesn't include the retconns to the story and especially the characters.
Fun fact: Sebastian Shaw actually was shown to have a good relationship with his father in his backstory PRIOR to that most recent retcon. That really pissed me off actually. I know no one cares about Shaw's backstory but me, but I was annoyed Gillen took one of the few good father/son dynamics (especially among villains) and changed it to the most generic one. Didn't seem to have done any research on the character at all.
I liked old school Shaw a lot. Not a psychopath, not an egomaniac nor a classic super villain, but ambitious and cunning with enough charisma to lead. Him having a good relationship with his father is imo more fitting, because his type of villainy shouldn’t be based on any kind of trauma or mental disorder, it should just be good old human greed and ambition.
@@davidgantenbein9362 Me too! I'm a huge fan of the old school Shaw. Anything after 2009-2010 is basically a different guy to me, especially with the "stupid abusive misogynist" makeover he got. He's way better as representative of pure greed and ambition gone awry, like you said. Nice to find someone else with this opinion!
Your comment is what I've been missing since Immortal X-Men started : People pointing out how much Gillen enjoys retcons and breaking backstories, long established relationships and character dynamics.
*I* was also deeply troubled by how he altered Shaw backstory and his relationship with his father because the whole point was that his harsh upbringing wasn't due to internal factors like an abusive father but external ones like financial struggles, lower class discrimination, ... With his father being the pillar of strength, hard work and support that build his character and mindset on all that is his ideology, to aim high and make your way to it through sheer personal effort. All those things are what made him break out of poverty and thus fully embodying the concept of the "American dream".
Shaw's father was an ideal to him and while nowadays he gained a higher social status and was no longer financially struggling, that lifestyle left a mark on him that he only survived through thanks to his father : It wasn't his father who left a negative mark on his life but his harsh environment that ended up *taking* his father from him due to a sickness they had no financial or physical means to cure him from before it was too late.
Shaw was not abusive to Shinobi because his own father was abusive to him : He was abusive because he *only* knows how to achieve his *own* definition of greatness and full potential through *intense stress and struggling* that needs to be pushed through to reach an end goal. Shinobi wasn't born into poverty and struggle so Shaw decided to give him all the possibilities that were denied to him while growing up in exchange of his being the best and on top of all of them, even if it meant damaging him on different levels.
It was not the right thing to do but it was what made most sense in his mind even though he didn't grow up with a toxic father.
@@spinningtornado4543 Your comment made me so happy! It's very rare I encounter someone who "gets" my fave bad guy on this level! These are my thoughts exactly and it's so strange to see them from someone else, but it absolutely made my day!
@@marymauney3235 I'm glad it made your day : I hope it keeps improving on your side.
The early 90's heyday of the X-Men have never been more dead.
Actually the krakoan theme could be the new x man rise you know, (after the mess they did in house of m until avx) but, they choose to double down the mistake and at the end got fuck up by the reader
Other than some small arcs and mini series, as far as I am concerned, X-Men ended with Dark Angel Saga (2012). The Age of Apocalypse story was wrapped up, none of the characters were flanderized, and, at that point, there were no major lore destroying arcs.
I kind of like the idea of the series ending with a SWAT team of select mutants going across the multiverse, wiping out the evil versions of the X-Men, without the bloat that the Spiderman Totem multiverse had. Kind of bitter sweet.
Heh, so the Mayan calendar was spot on!
Thanks for that annotation on the dark angel saga, I always wondered where I should create my own endpoint for the X-Men series. I read and thought that the Claremont X-Men the end trilogy would be a good wrap up for the entire X-Men line but always wondered where I should stop during the current run. I wanted to at least include AvX but wondered where I should stop after that. Because I've only read up through operation zero tolerance but however have been buying and collecting all X-Men titles since like a good little consumer, up to when they announced the Hellfire Gala and I completely dropped all their books. 1962 (or was it '63?) - 2012 sounds like PLENTY of good reading material to last the rest of my natural lifetime.
Yep! Too many solo titles, and ongoings that are quietly shifted to limited series. The 90's X-Men Format was the best: Uncanny, X-Men, X-Foce, X-Factor, Excalibur, Wolverine, Cable, Generation X and the 1-3 limited series throughout the year.
What is funny is when the story become so differ but it just came back to the series you said at the end of krakoan era and you right should have follow the same formula. Really wanted to know the true reason why the many of the best writer left
I was actually thinking about how in these years they have told us that they have to continue writing comics in this way with the threat that otherwise we will return to the comics of the 90s as if there could be no middle ground or anything else that could happen and now the only movie that can save the situation is Deadpool and Wolverine. Embarrassing
What ? Cause there was still people reading it after hickman left the ship ?
5 years ago would have been a good time too, at least 3 years ago, but if you ain’t leaving now then you’re just a glutton for punishment.
The time to quit Marvel forever was yesterday and I did just that...yes, I miss REAL Marvel but the pain and sadness fades. I walked away and I watch these reviews to verify staying away is the right call.
Doc needs a hug and a snickers bar. X-men is dead
Why Marvel insist in to portray Mystique ,a murderous ammoral terrorist like a misguided anti-hero so much? And I'm cheering for the Sentnels now because mutants can be dangerous killers like Krakoa Era showed us and just don't care or feel any sympathy for these plant clones that are the X-Men today. Brevoort think that full the market with multiples X titles can fix all the damage that the latest Era did to the franchise and he's dead wrong. We don't need be a fortune teller to see that this new Era will fail badly already. Even the 90's nostalgia can't save the X books anymore. X-Men is a walking dead brand now.
I also don’t get why they’re suddenly pretending she was a great, loving parent to Nightcrawler when she threw him off a cliff to save her own skin. “(Disguises herself as an ordinary human woman) Look, see, here I am, an ordinary human woman! I found this horrible demon baby, so to show I’m just an ordinary human woman and you can trust me… (throws baby Kurt like Dan Marino) There, you go! I’m a good person, right?!” Years later it was said that Kurt survived due to the action of Azazel, who was evil and only wanted Kurt as part of his evil plan, but still cared whether he lived or died.
@@karaoconnoraliasraidra Modern Marvel love write villains like anti-heroes and turning the heroes in killers in nowadays. 616 universe It's a complete ammoral place now.
@@karaoconnoraliasraidra The writers at Marvel think they finally got Mystique away from the attempted infanticide charges because of Spurrier's retcon from last year, which was as bad as it was nonsensical.
They also think they finally fixed her relationship with Nightcrawler and turned her into the best mom ever for him by, get this, taking his adoptive mother (the only parental figure Nightcrawler considers as his actual mother, who loved and cared for him unconditionally) and turning her into a wicked child kidnapper and a member of Orchis, the anti-mutant group created for Krakoa, that infected mutantkind with an incurable magic disease and sold her adoptive son to them for cash.
@@spinningtornado4543 My gosh, that’s dumb…
I actually heard a term earlier this week- moral scapegoat. It’s when writers try to claim, “It’s actually okay that this one character is evil because this other character is so much worse!” That what this feels like.
@@karaoconnoraliasraidra That's pretty accurate to the situation.
Ironically enough, Marvel used Azazel as a scapegoat too for why Nightcrawler needed to be premeditatedly abandoned by his biological parents, grew up having a terrible childhood with his adoptive family (when he used to call those times the happiest he's ever been), be nice by design and upbringing, look exactly the way he does (because even that was premeditated), just suffer through hardship after hardships (when he only had his first big hardship as an adult with the Stefan incident) and be part of the X-Men (or Azazel kills him, even tho he needs him for all of his takeovers which Spurrier seems completely unaware of).
It's ironic because "Azazel" is what gave its origin to the word "scapegoat".
Marvel Comics has completely destroyed the X-Men line. I have come to accept it and I’ll never buy another current X title again. But I do have back issues from the 80’s and 90’s that I can buy
I'm honestly surprised one of the Sentinels in that book was not called "SafeSpace...."
I can already see where the "sentinels" comic is going. "Hey remember those sentinels from the xmen? The ones that act like terminators but instead of humans they're programmed to wipe out all mutants in existence....let's humanize them".
Marvel Comics….Print books to print books. Not because anyone has an interesting idea. They have to print a certain amount of copies to justify all their jobs. It’s like the origin of comic books. Printers needed the printers to run 24/7 so publishers reprinted cartoon strips in comic book form. Marvel is doing the same thing for a different reason.
Gambit, Wolverine and Cable are the only ones that can carry a solo. Deadpool... He's his own thing
@@DonMegaPLP Yeah. He's live-action Bugs Bunny.
Looking back on it now, I think the X-men started slowly dying when Bendis took over. The Central Park X-men put them in hospice, and the Krakoan age pulled the plug. We'll always have our X-Men classics to read, but the X-men are DONE. Brevoort will bury them. Still, I think his greatest sin is that hat.
This is what happens when you let women call the shots at your company.
Yeah, I said it.
I jumped off after House of X.
After the first krakoan series, damn man not a single chance you gave😂😂😂😂
Wise choice.
@frelatrz9246 I was reading in trade so knowing what was ahead I figured that was a good stopping point.
House of X / Powers of X (Ten) is THE perfect jumping off point. Or, at least to when Hickman leaves.
"Evil cannot create, it can only destroy." - Tolkien. This is why the current "creators" just rehash the same ideas over and over. They can't create, because they are evil. X-men (and all associated mutant books) have been dead for over a decade. It's never coming back to the style that made it the juggernaut it once was. I moved on years ago. I don't consider anything these people have put out to be canon and never will. Fortunately, I have many *great* X-men books written by Claremont that I'll always treasure and re-read whenever I want a good X-men fix.
Dude, saying that any of the current writers are 'evil' is an absolutely insane take.
@@mladen8127I mean, they ain't great people but, but evil is *really* stretching it....
Kelly Sue Deconnick on the other hand....
Reviving the Defunct Marvel UK book Warheads would be better than any of these X-books.
Guess Battle Chaser wasn’t enough for Dok to get back into comics.
Dang, I forgot that Gail Simone wrote Domino. What Domino is doing nowadays.
3:33 Yup, Glorying Mystique’s Wedding is like glorying Jeffrey Dahmer for pride month.
I do like Declan’s Old Dog. The comic is fine. He crowdfunded his another Old Dog project which is a success.
I didn’t read his Thundercats. But I am not really felling Declan’s Mystique. And it is odd cause Mystique has done spy stuff before. It works with her powers.
Last thing Remember Mystique did something Spy relate was in X Men Black one shot.
7:44 This is where I am more interested in.
Dok, Sentinel One was a limited series. The Sentinel ongoing was just about a boy and his robot. I don’t remember if has any connected to the x men. The Sentinel ongoing did got cancelled but still have a limited sequel.
Shame the Boy from Sentinel comic dies in Avengers Arena.
10:13 I do believe this idea can work if Sentinel Soliders were victims of mutants’ actions during the Krakoa Era. Like Armageddon Girl has killed a lot innocent people. X Men started a lot people. The Sentinel soliders spawn from Mutants’ consequences.
Like Graydon Creed has mutants because his mother Mystique abandons him.
The lady who main villain of X Men gold hates mutants because her Mutant father abuses her.
They are villains, but you still understand why they do it.
That can work if a mutant was present those events(except World War Hulk that would ruins continuity) it could work. The driven these Soldiers become Sentinel.
And I want these soldiers to be full villains. Don’t drag them down with Misunderstood, misguided, sympathetic or any stagnation. Do not play it safe. It is Bad enough that mystique’s wedding got stagnation.
Just make them embrace being villains. They can have motivation that the reader can understand and empathize(empathize if different from sympathize)
I do believe that The Sentinels should do a crossover with either Jed McKay’s X Men or Geoffrey Throne’s X Force.
Brian K,Vaughan did a phenomenal Mystique solo series run
True.
That Mystique is a thousand times more interesting than the one that came out of Krakoa.
Already did 😊 reading nothing really past the CC run.
Mystique looks like Marilyn Manson. Not ready for the new dope show
Mystique is a 5 issues mini and not an ongoing
It's already too much and too late to have one of these.
Still unnecessary
My favorite title, that I haven't missed an issue of in 48 years, and I'm done. Shit. 😵
Join the club
You’ll be better off in the long run. Sorry for your loss.
For me: 1991-2021 R.I.P. X-Men
Why are all the villains becoming “good” guys? Magneto, juggernaut, sentinels, mystique, etc?
Because the evil minded mutants are the people Marvel hires to write this shit. And these purple haired freaks most identify with the comic book bad guys.
Some argue that this is deliberate to erode any kind of morality in order to promote more aggressively whatever the writer considers „good“. For the same reason all benevolent characters (i.e. Charles Xavier) needed to become monstrous and evil.
But it’s as likely that they just follow the trend of „defy expectations“ or „outrage marketing“ or „owning the chuds“ that Marvel/Disney loves so much.
"Good and evil are subjective."
@@VALonCZcams no they’re not. People only say that to justify their evil
@@chrischreative2245 🙂 Hence the quotation marks.
I don't mind them doing solo mini-series for certain characters. Also, Havok lasted in his own title, Mutant X, for 3 years. Granted it was also kind of a team book, but he was the lead stranded in an alternate universe. I'd love for him to get another spotlight. Although that being said, they'd probably hire dregs, so maybe not.
Interesting point. I used to honestly go, oh, cool, lesbian character. Now I go, oh God no, not another lesbian character.
I feel silly for not bringing him up before, especially considering I've been re-reading his series for the past 2 weeks (I'm up to issue 13), but X-Man (Nate Grey) was another X character able to hold his own title for 75 issues. Granted, he's an alternate younger version of Cable, but he NEVER felt like an imitation. He always felt like a new character.
I'm even more aggravated by the passive brain dead "fans" that think any release by Marvel at this stage is a winner. It's one of the reasons why I have a disdain for the MCU.
Cuz those fans are only fleeting comic fans. They like comics for “funzies”. They have never read good comics because they are only into it temporarily to be “different”. Or they are the type that like the shows and movies and only go to cons to play dress up. They are not invested in the medium itself.
Bout Plus Ultra Ultimate Marvel? John Hickman and his current crop a partners seem to be doing good with it
We have Jed MacKay writing on X-Men and Avengers and I bet his next “big event” will be another AvX. We don’t need that story again.
bruh i recommend the book The Starving Vulture by Miguel Montaña, interesting Steampunk Premise with the Roman Empire running around during the 1500s
So im guessing the main cast of the sentinels are people who were or had family trapped in the crossfire during these events and now are turning themselves into sentinels to stop something like that from happening again, so basically the xmen equivalent of the gamma corps
Also re "they made lesbians boring to straight guys": I'm a lesbian and they're boring to me. I was actually talking with another gay fan the other night about how they and Poison Ivy/Harley Quinn have just become boring as fuck since Marvel decided to make them into heroes (despite them....really not being such at all? like they're all awful?) since I guess gay women can't commit crimes or be awful people. I was never the biggest Mystique fanatic, but I did appreciate her as a great villain and, yes, little middle school me did think it was cool that she also happened to be in love with Destiny and that they had raised Rogue together. I think a lot of people felt that way. We liked her for the terrible person she actually was, and found it interesting that despite being a terrible person she still had someone she loved (who is also pretty terrible) Trying to make her into this person we're supposed to root for and who never did anything REALLY bad (like pitching Nightcrawler over a waterfall to save herself---nope, didn't happen!) just takes away her complexity and what made her fun to read about in the first place. TBQH, there aren't really any gay characters I find interesting right now, despite there being now more than ever. Which would be fine, as I don't need my faves to be gay, I don't care, but all the straight characters seem pretty boring too, to say nothing of the continuity fuckery. Anyway, tl; dr, even the lesbians hate this.
Not all of the heteros are boring that it did have variety to spice things up, but yeah.
Mystique?? Sentinels???... Can they not learn anything from the success of X-Men 97?? Just put together a team of A List X-Men, give them a a big bad guy to fight, and send them on an action adventure!! Come on!!
It'd require the writers to know enough about the characters they have to properly use them in the story.
At Marvel, they're at a point where they don't even read their respective Wikipedia page.
Already did about 16 years ago, in fact I haven't bought a dc or marvel comic for aboit 15 years or so
I remember that first Mystique mini-series. Hell, I have the entire collection. Not a big fan of the character, but Vaughan was at his peak around that time, and that first issue cover looked awesome, so I couldn't resist. For this new installment, I sincerely have no idea who Shalvey is, and if that's the cover to the first issue, I'm sure I won't ever touch anything he illustrates.
I already quit reading new comics, I'm so done and fed up with Marvel and DC Comics at this point it's not even funny.
I actually like the Sentinel book with the Iron Giant premise. I only recently read it, however, so I never had the opportunity to support the work on release, but it was always a book I hoped would do well due to how much I love the Sentinels and the Iron Giant. Wish the Juston Seyfert was still around with his Sentinel, would love to see more stories with that duo.
I think you guys need to double down on your emphasis that anyone worth their salt either does not wanna work for Marvel and/or Marvel just won’t pay good talent enough. It’s really that simple. They are stuck with what you see.
I stopped reading Xmen a while ago. But like Spiderman I had hope that they will eventually get back to form. And just like Spiderman I had given hope. RIP Xmen, you were fun until they ruined you.
Unreadable X-men! Mutant Fantasy Island ! Round Boy needs to be let go! Marvel needs an enema! RIP X-Men🙏💰🚽
the art for Mystique and Sentinels does not look appealing. In fact, the art seems like the type of effort you would see in the last issue of a cancelled book. It does not look like Marvel is putting their best foot forward.
"Sentinels" 🙄🙄🙄 they might as well have made a "Reavers" series. 😒
Shiny.
Is it a coincedence that you can apply this sentiment to every medium in entertainment now
After this month I don't think my shop will care marvel or DC on there racks the sells are low.there starting to see people walk always from them and getting more Indies.
Nobody wants a Mystique book... nobody
All of the new titles is more then likely just renewing/saving Trademarks. After so many years you have to do that to keep title names in house
Awesome work guys
I did not like the new Thundercats reboot. Dropped it after a few issues.
Trans-flag-coloured Sentinel team?
PASS.
Damn, getting triggered by that. I never thought and X-Men fan would be toxic bigots
@maxmazzotti6651 the only ones filled with hate these days is your side...
I was going to give X-Men and Uncanny a shot but now after reading 700 fuck this. I am reading Energon, I asked my LCS to hold Ghost Machine for me, and I am waiting for Flash Gordon. That is it except for a couple of upcoming minis.
I feel the same. Energon, Flash Gordon, plus my old Spidey and X-Men collections. That's enough to keep me going. Never really read X-Force (90s) properly, that will be like a new comic for me.
Bout Plus Ultra Ultimate Spider-Man?
The only point I think they could convincingly have made Mystique into an anti-hero was during and just after her stint as leader of Freedom Force (in stories like Hama's Crunch Conundrum).
She was kind of going in that direction there in the late 80's to early 90's, and even then Marvel would have had to put some effort into making her at least semi-reformation believable.
After that, she doubled down into villainy and betrayal, and became even more messed up and evil then she had been portrayed before then.
It would take allot of work on a redemptive story to even begin to make her role as even an anti-hero believable.
Marvel doesn't even seem interested in doing that (do the writers even see she's a villian anymore, given how they wrote everyone in Krakoa?).
Just make her the femme fatale villain she's meant to be (channeling noir femme fatales) and Destiny her twisted mentor (have them be married if you want, I don't care).
You can't just slap a hero or anti-hero label on a villain and think anyone will buy it. Particularly when they keep acting like a villain.
Honestly, Get Mystique was probably the last story I can think of with Mystique that I really liked her in, as the seductive, evil and badass femne fatale villian she is.
I am just wondering how are any of these X-Men series are supposed to grow and have room to breath to maybe grow their story with ALL these series.
Challenge accepted. Xmen are DONE.
I had no faith in anything Marvel let alone X-men. This is just another reason.
I’d bet money all these new Sentinels were injured by superhumans in those events mentioned, which is why they have joined this new program to get revenge on super humans.
Correct. Hence those references to past events In that teaser art
@@MatthewLoh-ru1mw The dudes in the video didn’t seem to get that and mentioned that they didn’t remember Sentinels being a part of those events?
It seems they are smartly making these Sentinels with an axe to grind in every corner of the MCU so they aren’t just confined to X-Men stories.
@@brianlabelle9543 yes, so that they will have "an axe to grind" with the rest of the superhero community as well
Why are there sentinels getting a new series?
Hard pass : Even though it is a mini, I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole because the central character in it lost all that made her interesting in the past five years.
I know the bar is really low but Sentinels sounds more interesting than most of the relaunch titles
Heroes are villains, villains are heroes, sexuality is characterization. Marvel blows.
society in a nutshell rn, sexuality is identity and business model...nobody's business but your own
I know, right?! Especially at the Big Two
Unless you want to be preached to by marvel/Disney by their"message", go support the Indies or kickstarter books.
I totally agree with after Krakoan Era, Marvel just watering down Xmen. I am not interested. From the ashes feels like dcs "Dawn of Dc", trash.
I quit marvel a long, long time ago. Well that’s not entirely true. I get marvel content from this channel. Watch Wes so you don’t have to read Marvel.
Interesting how nostalgia works. As soon as Wes and Dok referenced Mystique's murderous streak, my mind went instantly back to X-Men: Evolution from the early 2000s -- more specifically S2, in which Scott saves younger mutants like Bobby, Jubilee, and Ray from being annihilated by Mystique. It just so happens to be the same season that introduced Trask to fans of the show.
That show's Mystique is the one I'll always remember.
@@spinningtornado4543 Nice.
@@spinningtornado4543For me, it's the OG 90's animated series's version, since she is closely based on Claremont's Mystique
@@MatthewLoh-ru1mw That's fair.
So sentinels are now cylons or advance b.a.t.s. from modern gi-joe.....most writers here don't know the characters which will be shitty..
I think your both right. the X-Men should EARN viewers back in their graces again... Like I said Before... your watching OLD People with OLD ideas... and this is not an agesism thing I'm speaking from I'm speaking in terms of desire... and motivation.. these people around are not there...
The X-Men are basically ruined by these modern writers since the Krakoa Era crap, they are making villains like Magneto, Mystique and Juggernaut the good guys, Stan Lee and Jack Kirby are turning in there graves right now if they see this abomination. X-Men: The Trial Of Magneto written by Leah Williams is the worst book i ever read in my life they ruined Wanda's character by making her a daddy's girl to a madman like Magneto and considering him her father, and Magneto killed her on purpose, Scarlet Witch and Quicksilver should stay far away from this madman and Krakoa. The Krakoa Era is the worst thing that ever happened in the X-Men franchise and Marvel universe they making the villains that the X-Men have been fighting against the good guys.
And turning the X-Men in plant clones and killers.
Im excited every time i see Doks screen😂
The only way to get me interested in Sentinels is if Jed MacKay's #1 is on the level of Hox/Pox
Dude, that was ten years ago.
Yeah I was wanting to give this a chance but these series ideas are so stupid my head hurts. Jabba the Cebulski and the hamster in the fedora need to quit. I understand now why Avengers sucked for so long.
Marvel is so stunning and brave Wes 😂😂
That’s interesting that a writer named a character called VOIVOD.
Shalvey is an ok artist, imo. Kinda 2000AD style, but for sure nothing to be excited about
X-Men writers are grabbing ideas from the past to entice the die-hard fans that left is like the popular kid pleading as those around begin walk away after getting caught doing something embarrassing. I bet they're going to bring back the Neo when they see what they can strip from the Revolution/Revelations saga
And the Mystique series is about... Chasing Mystique? Wow, so original. There's been stories and series with that exact same story. They should quit beating that dead horse. She was once forced to work for X-Factor. Why not beat that horse for a while.
I’m just reading Ultimate X-Men now, the book with no X-Men in it. It’s a lovely distraction from this dumpster fire since Marvel can’t let go of Krakoa.
Doc hit the nail on head! 😂Agreed! Great Video Wes!
Now? Joke's on you, as i ended collecting x-men BEFORE Onslaught happened... And it seems i was right all along. 😏😎🤟
This is creative diarrhea and I wouldn't wish it on President Dementia.😂
Marvel screws over the guy who screwed himself over first 😂
Milk Toast Incarnate. Lol.
Just sad
Who was the co-host today?
$10 bucks these new “sentinels” show up in the M She U’s X-People’s movie lol
Voivod is the vulture lol...remember in the nightcrawlwr series when he was Spiderman and vulture was doing sentinel research?
I don't think either of them has read that mini.
It wasn't worth a read.
@@spinningtornado4543 so true....heaven firbid today's writers would learn the history of the charecters they write
No
Hickman ruined X-Men, he turned them into Supes from the Boys.
This relaunch will at least have Cyclops as a central character so I'm ok with.
Well it was fun while it lasted I guess...😆😆
So be honest the Sentinels book interests me. Getting little tired of the bitch fest galore. Mystique is only a mini series which was left out. Declan Shelvy is the wrong person to do this book. His style is completely wrong for the character and won't help sales. If you can find the Vaughn Mystique series read it as it was quite good. There's nothing wrong with picking through eras and having title or two focus on chosen themes. However I agree that it's rather shotgun in nature, and relying on too many characters that can't support more then a mini. WTF20.
I recommend Vaughn's solo too. It was a nice read.
@@spinningtornado4543 It was. Even McKeever's stuff following him was pretty good.
Ororo: Hail Mary is my long lost sister.
This reboot is not looking very good or promising. I’m going to give them a chance
I feel like ya'll are going overboard here. Mystique and Sentinels are minis. Nothing wrong with either of those ideas. Sentinels obviously isn't about "big dumb robots that say destroy" they're enhanced humans that have been harmed in some way by mutants or superheros. You should see the reaction from the woke people on this book as they think it's some glorification of bigots or something. There are going to be good books and good stories in this new line and there are going to be some duds, like there always are. I for one am just glad they're not all living on a magical fantasy island, holding hands with supervillains and knowing they can't die anymore. Baby steps, people.
See, shit like this is where a multi verse story would make sense. Every title is it's own universe with it's own flavor. It auto corrects any continuity problems between titles and since they don't care about continuity anymore anyway just make an infinite number of them. Every run is it's own universe and it's all being observed by the Watchers who pick a mish mash of characters to do "multiversal" missions as the crossover events.
God damnit I'm putting more thought into a universe I haven't cared about in decades than the thr people actually writing it for the same time frame.
Hire me as EIC to fix your company Marvel, after 20 years of not hiving AF about your product I still care about the characters enough to at least try and save them and come up with a plausible excuse to ignore anything you don't like later after we find some new talent and can get rid of the garbage tier writers.
In the meantime first I'm going to fix Peter and MJ. Second I'm going to reach out to famous Manga creators and offer them a mini series with a character of their choice, call it something like the "Universal Hero Series" and play up these characters being so iconic worldwide they've inspired great writers around the globe. Have the authors write a little forward about why they chose the character they did and put some of the shine back on the characters reminding people how iconic they really are and why. And grab the eyes of some of hat sweet sweet Manga audience while we're at it.
And third I will create a secret council of honest and critical comic content creators, sign them to an NDA, and abuse their combined nerd power and inability of all nerds to resist saying "well actually...." to check all continuity by the most pedantic and judgemental actual comic lovers on the planet.
Give me the job. I have no experience and I will probably fail spectacularly, but at least it will be a spectacular failure in the right direction.
The new sentinel characters will probbly be bystanders who will hurt in the battles..secret empire..king in black..onslaught etc..or let's say a guy was in shield and got hurt..or someone's family member got hurt or killed ..so now they hate mutants and did a procedure to become sentinels
This also was done before..wolverine injured/killed hellfire employees and they came back as the reavers..niw hating mutants ....they threw in O.N.E and the reavers and operation zero tolerance..where humans were turned into sentinel human hybrids... lol..house of ideas 😂
Correct. That's the premise behind these Sentinels
Please fire Kathleen Kennedy and end the (make it gay and lame) misery. 5:29
I loved comics in the 1970s. Couldn't stop reading them. Punisher, X-Men, Avengers.
Nothing I've seen in the decades since I moved on makes me think I'm missing anything.
Maybe...MAYBE...comics really are for kids? Then you can, like me, have nothing but positive memories of how much pleasure they gave you until you moved on? How many times can you read about the characters in costumes fighting? (ducks)
Declan Shalvey is obviously a hard working artist. He’s on a lot of projects. I just can’t get into his art. It’s just so basic and sterile looking. If I had to describe his art style, I would say he tries to look like he uses 3D assets without actually using 3D assets. It’s not bad, it’s not good it’s just average. He’s like a baseball player whose greatest asset is he plays 162 games every year without injury. Every other metric he hovers around the league average.
get real, Leifeld is a garbage writer (and honestly, has a very limited range in terms of art)
he wasn't the one who made Cable and Deadpool popular (and judging by the recent minis Marvel gave him to try and also write them, he can't really tell a good story with them after they were fleshed out by other writers)
Love or hate him Liefeld makes money. He draws an audience.
@@Damackism he does?!
Any time in the last 10-15 years?
@@KainGerc Yeah! He has sold more books that he has worked on. More than the no talented hacks that are working at Marvel now.
He did work on a Gi Joe Snake Eyes series a few yrs ago. And did work on few Marvel books over the past 7 to 8 yrs as well.
He has sold more comics in his first 6 yrs in his comic career than all of the creative teams working at Marvel now.
Like I said love him or hate him he has sold millions of comic books. And has created characters that Marvel has made 100s of millions of dollars off of.
You cant argue against that. No matter how you twist your arguement, use semantics to bolster your arguement, or push a narrative to back your arguement. You have no indisputable facts to back your argument.
Liefeld is a successful comic book artist/ creator. And has made a name and a legacy for himself.
Good or Bad he will always be remebered.
@@Damackismpreach
His art was actually pretty good back in the day. The internet has kinda turned his “bad art” into a meme at this point. But the internet isn’t real life.