I tried Eevee Next... Here's What I Learned
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- čas přidán 3. 07. 2024
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A major overhaul of Eevee render engine is coming in Blender 4.2. I gave it a try, to prepare you for the awesome changes that are coming our way. Realtime Raytracing, HDRi shadow, displacement and more!
Timestamps:
00:00 - Intro
00:32 - HDRi upgrades
02:27 - Raytracing
04:10 - Human characters
05:43 - GPU Compositor
05:53 - Displacement
06:15 - Outro
#EeveeNext #Blender #realtime #eevee #raytracing - Krátké a kreslené filmy
It's good to see that even if Blender takes 2 steps back, at least they're taking 6 steps forward. I think I can live with that. Shadows from HDRI's in Eevee is FANTASTIC and I've been begging for it for a long time now
does anybody has problem with transferring preferences from 4.1 to 4.2. After it is done addon and extensions window are blank
@@Alex-wg1mb If you don't find a solution, best to write a bug report. Else, they can not improve it.
@@Raimund58 Dug almost the same report, using some workaround until final fix
Let's hope post-process bloom will get much more love!
Things like tint, clamping, and fine-tuning the threshold can be done by adding extra nodes. So the node replacement is just core functionality, you can customize it further than the post effect.
the “fog glow” mode also has more options
@@kenziemac130Of course everything can be done by most basic image manipulation nodes. but why do we have bloom node? you can make it by levels and blur nodes as well , you will use levels to make highlights bright then blur it and then make a node called bloom, thats how people do in adobe premiere etc. if no bloom node exist., and for blender, simple things like vignette was never easy to do in blender for long. So its a big time loss. Therefore point is same goes for those extra settings for bloom, so its wrong to make people be node or image manipulation expert to do simple things. There will be various usermade nodegroups that cause lack of standards, its always better to have best or standard implementation of things Compositor is always longer way to do things for simple post processing due to the fact its missing many pratical nodes . They should just add same settings to compositor at least, its not that hard
yes they always downgrade and we wait for love so they fix something to old version. Even commercial softwares make old settings legacy for long time so people wont feel suddenly that a setting they always use is gone. Thats the only side commercial softwares are better. They dont easily get rid of some features by big changes
@@Ericaandmac or deliver it in a node-group
realtime displacement is a really big thing in my opinion, especially if you look at programms like gaea or world creator, who all utilize map displacement for insane terrain generation, just immagine beeing able to paint in a little house into the displacement and see it realtime, could be super awsome for big enviroment shots, with cycles it was always a pain imo
Enable refractions in material propertions tab - render method Dithered - raytraced transmission
And For bloom also was not lost a lot of settings, each setting can be repeated in the composer and change colours, just need to add a little more than one node, but this can be fixed by creating a group of nodes once and saving the project, maybe they will add in the future at once preset for bloom likes a eevee olds
Thanks! Oh surely, one can achieve the same effect adding more nodes, still, having the same options as in the old Bloom menu right away would be nice :)
May be u cou do tut on these node's 😅@@MartinKlekner
@MartinKlekner if they're completely changing the workflow under the hood, a redundant boom would only hurt things.
@@MartinKlekner yes who cares about workarounds, then we also dont need bloom node cuz people can do bloom from blur and levels or exposure nodes easily so noone need bloom node as well (or udont need color ramp or map range node cuz u can do it by math nodes) (or we shouldnt have gotten principled bsdf, we can use blendergurus pbr shader groups). , the point is not wheter u can make it nor not, its about official implementation that is standardized for all users without always making things yourself and doing things easily and not getting downgrade from previous workflows..
@@MartinKlekner Or may be instead of a redundant node, the greate thing would be to have nodes presets. Finally.
Personnaly I find that Blender is lacking a solid global presets system. It's good to pull information from data blocks of other projects, but you literally have to organize folders by your own and keep track of them all.
In Houdini for example you can make everything a preset, so next time you open a new project, you have you preset for anything right at one or two clicks away. And not even talking about HDAs.
Great video, Martin, thanks for sharing, very useful. Love the new HDRI lighting and shadows and realtime displacement. 🤩 ~Zach
Glad you enjoyed it, Zach 🤩
I didn’t realize this was going to be such a big update. I’m so excited now.
This is what I've been waiting for. Unreal Engine was always too much of a learning curve for the stuff I do so seeing EEVEE start to catch up is super exciting!
Great job breaking down the changes Martin! Awesome work as always. :)
Thank you! 😊
holy smokes... this looks fantastic :O My new years resolution was to start learning UE5 for it's real-time rendering, but now I think I will reconsider ;)
DEFINITELY learn Unreal bro. Blender does not even come anywhere close to rivaling the kind of technology in UE. Everything you're seeing here is grounded in incredibly dated screen space technology, something Unity and UE were already doing as early as 2015. If you want to be able to render massive worlds in seconds with trillions of polys, and GI nearly on the level of cycles without having to worry about so much CPU bottle necking, you definitely wanna go with the tool that is leading the industry right now. As a Blender user myself, I can't even begin to explain to you the benefits of UE5 over Eevee because there is just so much to cover. It's one of those things where you cannot fully understand it until you start really using UE, and then you'll be saying to yourself: "OMFG, why in the world did I EVER try to do this in Blender!!!??"
Take the leap as I did, and I promise you that you will NOT be disappointed. UE is not as hard as you think it is, its actually very easy once you get used to it, Unity is fantastic too.
Displacement in evee is so great we have been waiting for it for ages
Thanks For this! Love your content 🎉🎉🎉🎉
Take the image output, hit it with rgb curve to clip the blacks down, blur it, blend it over the original image on screen mode, there's your bloom. Done.
Not the point. Of course, there is milion ways to do it. Previously, though, it was more convenient and with more immediate options.
@@MartinKlekner They don't get it bro. They just don't. I feel ya tho. Shame that they nixed it.
I strongly disagree with the bloom refactor, it was really nice and convenient as it was in 4.1. Big mistake in my opinion
@@MartinKlekner I can see the immediacy returning with the use of the library system to create a sort of post fx layer stack, with compositing node setups packed up as assets. There's no real evidence that this kind of solution is on the horizon, but it's the only reason that comes to mind that they'd remove the previous one click solution.
Ow that's a good tip. But you get ghosting is I'm correct. I know this sort of effect from photoshop. You still see the sharp edges. Unless you can make some kind of mask for edges
Awesome video Martin! Eevee Next is super exciting
Thank you Cov! 🤗
This is very exciting, and a great video to introduce it - thanks!
Glad you liked it!
Thanks!!! Great Overview!!! 👌😁
Great video! Thank you!
4:50 for the eyes not refracting. Change the alpha blending to dithered instead of the blended option in the material for the eye. It should fix it hopefully.
been following eevee next for years finally it came
Martin the best easy-friendly teacher of all time with knowledge beyond measure! Thank you!
Haha, appreciate it buddy 🙏☺️
Super handy, thanks man! Here's hoping the glare node gets some bloom like settings.
Thank yoou, Louis! 😉 Let's hope!
I enjoy your videos so much
Amazing video.
Love it!
Wow, I can’t believe they changed bloom. Used it on most of my eevee renders 😭
Starts to look like Unreal!
if you’re still having refraction issues after turning on raytraced refraction in the *material settings*, setting thickness, and enabling refraction eevee setting, and also making sure the material is no longer set to use the “alpha blend” mode… it may be that the shader is not using the standard PBR shader? some networks/nodes might not work properly in eevee. You may have to remake the material with a more simple basic PBR setup. But refraction definitely works.
I do miss the bloom settings :(. Oh well, still a great alternative render engine!
Thank you Martin! Great video
Thank you for this video..
Fantastic !!
Better mention a few points :
- Raytracing, as super cool it is, is screenspace based : If an object that emit light (direct emission or from an other source) is out of the window, the indirect light it occurs simply don't exist. Always keep that in mind (specially in animation).
- Displacement looks also super cool but AFAIK, require an high poly mesh to properly work.
This looks good
Not having Bloom, Refraction and Ambient occlusion settings are a deal breaker for me. Will not upgrade to this anytime soon.
I've waited so long for displacement to work in EEVEE. Hail Blender.
Not on topic, but your linothorax models are so very good. All your hoplite armors are majorly on point.
Thank you, sir, always a pleasure to meet a fan of ancient history & warfare 🙂
Lovely, considering that at tme studios we are working on a short movie that is to be done in eveee, this is perfect
it doesn't hate to rival UE. the amount of hoops you have to jump through when doing, well, VFX-ey shot in UE is no joke. anyway, cool stuff, i hope all of it gets ported to macos as well
Hey Martin, I think the problems with the refraction of the cornea can be resolved with the new options within the material properties tab where it now provides an option for raytraced refraction
Fantastic
you can go to shader then press n and you can enable the refraction settings
Thanks but not sure what you mean, I see no refraction settings in Shader editor shelf...
The new realism is neat and all, but how does it handle NPR? Did they gimp it in hopes that Eevee will be the "we have cycles at home" renderer?
I want a comparison video between the evee, evee next, and cycles... that would be great...
Good idea for future video.
Excellent video. The Auto-Eye addon creator need to fix this for 4.2, hopefully. It must be related to the shader setup
there's a refraction option in the material tab settings where the alpha clip/hashed setting is. That will fix the eye problem. I think at least, it did for me.
Worked in some cases but not for these eyes, thanks for the tip though! Ill try to fiddle with settings some more :)
@@MartinKlekner I have an eye setup that was originally based on Auto-eye and I got it working about 90%. You should set the refraction type to "sphere" not slab and also you need to connect a value to the "thickness" value on the Material Output node of your Cornea material. If I understand the node correctly setting the value to Zero actually makes it use the objects volume to calculate the refraction and works basically like classic eevee. It's fine on all but extreme closeups which have a tiny white infinite distance square in the refraction for some reason. if you don't connect any value to thickness it just seems to use the scene default thickness set in render options which is often way too big for something like eyes
5:44 Real time compositor is always GPU my friend
The example with the eyes make the refraction issue seem like small thing but it's going to mess up the scene if you have water and/or glass I suppose? Let's hope they prioritise fixing it in the full release
It was an issue in the shader of the AutoEye addon ☺️ czcams.com/users/shortsyzZT6JoVljQ?si=hEECboOKMcnV8Jpk
@@MartinKlekner ah got it!
Nice sneak peak thanks. Didnt have any chance to give it a try but the lighting looks so much better now and this is just a beginning. But what do you think about cycles vs eevee for realism. Could eevee rival with cycles with new ray tracing feature?
They also replaced subsurface scattering with a mix colour node set up.
I'm thinking I'm going to take a pass at 4.2
Screenspace Refraction/Transparency and Refraction to Shader RGB is indeed missing and sorely needed to fully migrate..
I've been waiting for this stuff desperately. Eevee is great for quick animatics, but turning that renders into some worthy stuff demands an enormous amount of side-works and workarounds. Especially if you try to keep the character's lighting properly with some combat animation. And sometimes it is much more proficient to switch to cycles. Or switch to Unreal Engine 5. All the updates sounds great but I have never stumbled across anything about light linking in Eevee. And that is a sad thing. Now my workflow is based on rendering separate layers with different light collections and honestly speaking, that's a huge pain. That would be great to have at least something like light channels in Unreal.
Oh yes, agreed, linking in Eevee would be awesome 🙂
Hope someone make addon for old bloom
nice
Blender Internal did the raytracing first but it was offline, Cycles has path tracing ... now since tech developed further and becomes more realtime, they go back to raytracing then going forth to a faster and realtime path tracing and where we are going next ...
i knew this day will come..and it head to head with UE5 lumen render
To fix the eye refraction go to material > sitting > thickness and change the mode from sphere to slap , and don’t forget to set the thickness output to 0 as you did
Sadly, not working, but thank you! :-)
@@MartinKlekner I just figured out basically if you have back light it will break throughout mesh, jest delete the back light, or make the cornea another sphere with glass shader.
Getting closer to Lumen tho it's still a long way to go.
😍
4:56 It definitely must be a bug, we encountered the same problem when rendering one of our scenes in our latest animation. Strangely for us when rendering the image sequence the effect reduced, compared to rendering a single image, or viewing it in the viewport.
It is somehat unpredictable at this point, hope they can fix it or provide solutions :)
Damn, HDRI shadows???!!!
"They butchered my boy" killed me lmaoooo I feel you man
🤭
It's everything I've wanted in EEVEE since 2.8! 🥹 I'M SO EXCITED!!!!
HDRIs with proper shadows!!
I think I just had a nerdgasm 😳
The bloom being gone isn't a downgrade imo, you do it in post anyway. With their push for the live compositor, it makes sense to not have it in two different places.
Yes, it makes sense, but as I mention in the video, stripping it off most of the very useful and fast settings is a downgrade, in my opinion..
@@MartinKlekner I see :p But I think having it in two different places means you could accidentally leave it on in the legacy menu and potentially ruin a very long render. Having to double check in two different places is quite an inconvenience.
@@stargazestudios Definitely, Im just arguing for giving the new Bloom effect inside the Glare node the same capabilities as the previous Bloom menu. The way it is right now, its downgrade.
Yeah, I just LOVE having to go through my entire compositing tree of nodes I don't need right now just to see what bloom looks like, compared to a simple checkbox. That was sarcasm by the way.
@@MartinKlekner They or someone else just need to create a nodegroup that recreates the original internal bloom. There are probably already examples of it out there somewhere :)
Thank you for the detailed video. Looks awesome. I'm moving over from Vue to Blender and I have my eye on your CGBoost 3D Environments course. Would the course require any different steps if I used the new Beta version of Blender or should I hold off from updating it?
Thanks again for the video. Your channel is damn impressive
Awesome! The course uses mostly Cycles, so no changes in Eevee influence it :)
@@MartinKlekner awesome. Thank you for the very quick reply. Have a great day
problem with these tools is while they are cool they are VERY complex to learn and figure out., plus not only that but you have to have detailed assets to use it and if your like me and dont 3d model that can cost a lot to get AND worse that with marketplace assets other users likely already have it as well so what you have is not truely unique . this is where i think ai will come in. with ai youll be able to create worlds where your not just using premade assets it can generate new content and i hope with the rise of ai we will get that point where we can easily create detailed 3d worlds and customize it in the way we want far easier.
i think your eye problem can be fixed with turning on "raytraced Transmission" in the material settings
i don't know if it is alredy on there but i just guess here but still great video!
Thank you! Already fixed by the author of the addon :-) czcams.com/users/shortsyzZT6JoVljQ
Blender scenes look so nice & realistic with minimum efforts, beats UE everytime in realism..
Only missing thing is Nanite like tech, i want infinite geometry (not for details, but for saving time on multiple iterations of optimization)
That's literally what adaptive subdivision is. We've had it for years.
@@choo_choo_ no that's different nanite is real time auto lod, it's decimating geometry based on how far the object from camera
Lol, Blender is following UE.
@@zedeon6299 Adaptive subdivision is doing the exact same thing. More geometry close to the camera, less far away. For more extreme decimation, geometry nodes handles that extremely simply.
@@choo_choo_ if so then why it increase memory usage instead of reducing it?
The post process compositer bloom is so horrible. I do my bloom effect outisde of blender.
is there adaptive sampling in eevee?
HDRi Shadows in Eevee Next don't seem to be working for me. I just get a weird shaped shadow on the side of my geometry instead of cast from objects occluding the HDRi light. I have the latest 4.2 beta download and have tried multiple HDRi's. Any idea of another setting that needs to be changed/checked?
Wonder if they can uodate cycles displacement as well, since thats very heavy computing wise
I don't care about Eevee, but those renders are beautiful. Keep up the good work.
Thanks a lot! :-))
Not even as a faster preview so you can wysiwyg model your scenes before cycles? that's how I use it most. The closer eevee is to cycles the more convenient for me.
Great video thanks Martin!! How's the performance in viewport please? I use a lot of CC characters like you but there is a lot of slowdown in viewport in Eevee. Is this more similar to UE re realtime please? Looking forward to the release.
Great to hear! :-) When it comes to lots of CC characters, economy is still the key, so I recommend using LODs and as few smaller size textures as possible. Overall though, the viewport performance seems better!
@@MartinKlekner Thanks for the reply. No i am talking with only a couple characters and only 2K textures. 32gb Ram and RTX 2080Ti my PC Specs and UE5 runs loads of assets from CC/Kitbash etc and no slow down so wondering if Blender is on the same scale as Uneal yet re realtime.
I normally do 1v1 fight sequences, so I don’t have loads of characters on screen like your epic videos. Usually 2 CC characters, and assets from kitbash etc, but it slows down to a crawl in the viewport. (Using normal Eevee.)
Wow, didnt ever expect raytracing to be implemented into eevee!
Glad I didn't delete displacement map on my texture folder lol
@3m9s actually the old method mainly relied on using light probes to fake GI
Not ideal still
Oh yeah forgot to mention that thanks 😊 This new workflow is so much better
@@MartinKlekner yeah most definetely :)
I hope we get even better gpu accelerated raytracing for eevee soon !
Where are some good resources for ancient Greek/Greek myth for places, characters and objects in blender? I really enjoy making them, I've already handmade some characters I'd like to put them in nice places
Current EEVEE next is better than Unreal in my opinion. The Lumen update time is worst, the quality is only better on reflection sharpness, but all the rest simulates better in EEVEE next. Made the test on Unreal 5.3 and it's not even close.
Those UE5 Lumen and Nanite makes more sense with Blender
Why no mention subsurface scattering, which is hugely improved as well?
Maybe a topic for next time ;-)
What's the bake time and render time?
lets see if finally can compete with unreal in real time
i am stil waiting for hdr support in viewport, would go nicely with eevee next, but heard the apple shit is holding them back.
Can you imagine EEVEE actually rivaling UE5?
bro nice video but the whole time i was focused on ur voice, ik this sounds weird but it reminds me of someone that would be narrating for the elder scrolls series 😭😭🙏🙏
They could get into improving performance of shader compilation and performance overall because it's getting worse every new release.
Hell yes Evee. I found it so shit to work with, now I might give it a try
What is your pc specs?
👏I. 👏HAVE. 👏BEEN. 👏WAITING. 👏FOR. 👏THIS. 👏FOR. 👏5. 👏YEARS. 👏
if these upgrades come live, why ever use cycles?
curious about this. anyone knows??
Cycles can still handle heavier scenes with more textures better, and give you slightly more realistic result, either overall softer light quality. But Eevee is slowly getting there…
But Eevee bloom was just a compositing effect, right? I mean, it should be possible to replicate it 100%?
Yes, the point is though that while it was super easy and convenient before, now its more complicated - and that’s a step back in my opinion…
Thanks! But you should compare it to Cycles, not Eevee.
HDRI shadows???!! WHAT????!!!
Is it compatible with every gpu?
of course, I'm literally using a 1050ti
@@godwinyo5206 o nice I'm using rx 560
bro if blender change to games development shee winning the game💀
The previous Bloom adjustment was simply simple and easy to apply. The compositor is too difficult and requires an additional learning curve
Gain some, loose some. Bloom is a post processing effect, it was weird that it was in render in the first place.
And eevee is meant to be physically accurate as possible, while staying real time, bloom is not a physical effect, but a stylistic one.
Photographers apply it also after they made the picture.
Volumetric halos like in mist are physicall, but you can still do that in eevee with volumetrics.
@@DrTheRich sure, but ease of use and ergonomic conveniences are nice and user friendly. Why remove it? To properly categorize so specialists can feel it's now in it's proper place? There was a clear advantage to having it where it was.
@@enigmawstudios4130 Because if you went with your method with everything, the entire program would become a mess and no one would be able to make sens of anything at all.
Putting things in their proper place IS to make things more user friendly. But you can only see that as the whole picture. Some individual cases it might look less user friendly.
If you're looking for post processing effect called bloom, you now know to find it with all other post processing effects in the compositor. And no one gets confused anymore why there are two different bloom effects. Not to mention the final result will be more consistent now between eevee and cycles.
I suspect the color management panel will eventually also move to the compositor.
Yes there was a clear advantage to having it where it was, there are more advantages to having it where it's now.
They just have to upgrade the bloom compositor node a bit so it's as powerful as the old settings, but i'm sure they will. Or you can submit that yourself, it's opensource blender is made by everyone who wants to contribute.
@@DrTheRich not sure how that's a realistic conclusion, as it isn't "my method" lol it was Blender's!
@@enigmawstudios4130 With "your method" i don't mean the specific bloom settings. I mean the idea of lets just go with what just seems most convenient on a surface level without regards for structure.
But you're right, that WAS blender's method in the past. And that's why blender user interface sucked. I've been using blender for 15+ years now, i know what it was like.
Blender UI is a dream now compared to when i first started. And i've had the feeling you had many times on the way, but looking back, I don't miss anything about the old way.
One thing to think about, is to try to see the different between if something is actually convenient, or it's convenient because you're used to it. That's really really hard to separate. And the blender developers only became good at that, after they created a purposeful UI team. And these decisions aren't made on a whim. They have lengthy discussions you can read about on the blender development sites.
And if you think you're view is important, join in these discussions, and help make blender a better program. Instead of just complaining.
I AM blown away simply because we have something between EEVEE and Cycles. The creative control and freedom you can have now with what is *effectively* cycles but can render *so much faster* on many more systems is insane.
Will it make people switch from Unreal engine?
Weeell, don’t think so, but for Blender users, it gives us even more powerful tools, slowly gaining on Unreal :)
I use both depending on the complexity of my scenes.
does it matter tho? in most cases the userbases overlaps anyways, any big leap for any of these two sofwares is a win for us users no need to pick a camp they complement each other very well
None of this makes any difference for animation projects. The view port still gets bogged down very easily by just adding some polygons to the scene. There is no realtime animation playblack like in unreal engine, not even close. The real game changer for blender would be if they updated their view port to handle lots of polygons while maintaining animation playblack. Realtime render + Realtime animation playback. We are moving from blender to Unreal Engine because of that. Also they never updated their cloth simulation, which is so needed.
Blender is trying to catch up with unreal