Honda Africa Twin 1100 DCT Adventure Sports TEST & Honest Review
Vložit
- čas přidán 4. 06. 2022
- Electric office chairs from Power Seats: powerseats.eu
This is my personal opinion on a Honda Africa Twin 1100 with an automatic DCT transmission and in the Adventure Sports version. Meeting the legend was a cool experience but if you want to own one yourself and consider this particular specification, I believe that this video may help you decide. Enjoy!
My Instagram page: / thevtold
Background music by DJ Goblin licensed under 3.0 license. - Auta a dopravní prostředky
With DCT and you want to overtake simply push the (-) paddle and the gears change quickly. With a manual traditional gearbox most people will always be riding in a gear or two too high anyway. In that case you clutch and knock it down a gear or two to get better acceleration. It's the same with DCT. You can intervene anytime you wish with the paddles. The shifts are still faster and smoother than a traditional manual. If you nail the throttle and let the DCT change down on its own it might be a slight delay. Quick shifters attempt to draw a balance between the two types of transmission. I find I have no issue in any mode. The DCT takes input from sensors and various data to try and learn your riding requirements at the time and adjust the shift points appropriately. All things being considered DCT has enhanced my riding enjoyment enormously. I'm a true DCT convert. 😁
You've explained this trans very well! I have 1800km on my twin. My two buds and I agree whole heartedly with you, and we're all MX guys. For this adventure bike style and ride it's incredible. Won't be going back on these bikes. Have you tried the electronic suspension on these twins? Mind blowing ride change and the press of a finger, toggle of a switch. I love the versatility of this no effort all good suspension in different terrains, with different payload. Cheers from Canada, ride fun 🇨🇦
Oh yes, the gearshifts are lightning quick and amazingly smooth - totally right. I think that DCT may grow on may riders, myself included. It's convenient, doesn't really make mistakes, is safe, sounds amazing with Africa's engine, and actually offers enough modes and ways of using it for most to find their preferred way. However, being there and having to deal with it and all of the buttons on the left and right side of the handlebar... one may need months to really get the flow. Thanks for this nice comment!
I am on my 4th year with DCT's. You are correct. Using the paddle shifter to downshift is the key to enjoying this transmission. I find that I am using the paddles more frequently now, especially on the twisty, rural roads. When I get back on the stop and go highway with lights, I appreciate the automatic mode. My biggest day was about 625 miles. I definitely appreciate the DCT for long haul touring.
@@Rocketman25 Looks like you have mastered DCT Oak forest :-) I'm not going back to a manual on these bikes. Keep enjoying bud :-) Cheers from Canada
With a lot of these reviews, I see these riders with limited experience with DCT. DCT has been around for awhile. great explanation. 2021 AF AS ES DCT is what I currently ride. Best bike I've owned.
Got the same unit! Electric suspension is the bomb! Via TFT you soften for offroad, stiffen for touring of packing panniers. It's so compliant within seconds :-) Just put on 300km more today. Ride in the Canadian Rockies and BC province, pavement, gravel, offroad. Mitas E07 tires are a game changer. We don't lane split around here. DCT is awesome, just learn it. Drag back brake for stability. Rode in +46'C last summer through mountains on fire, when Litton burnt down. We survived and bike didn't brake a sweat. 450 - 500km range most days on a tank of fuel. Just manual downshift (override) in auto if your in a hurry. Adjust your engine braking on TFT. The buttons become very comfortable after a few trips. Muscle memory takes over. Once again, learn DCT. I wouldn't get a foot lever. I use manual trans levers when in auto when ever I make a split second decision, like a regular bike. Android auto to phone with Cardo communicator works awesome with left buttons. Nice! 18000 km on my ATAS DCT, and ride it as much as possible! My seat broke in around 2000 km, or my ass did, lol. My Z06 and Boss 302 sit in the garage. ATAS Honda is reliable, super fun, comfortable, relaxing when touring, a beast off-road when wanted. Win/Win!Two buds and I own DCT's and will buy these again when shopping in a couple years :-) Rx MX and Baja racers. Thanks for the video, but you really need a two week tour on forestry roads across mountain ranges, and big hiway trips, to get comfortable and learn this bikes abilities. Plus we have Honda support across Canada, but not much for BMW. Cheers ehhh 🇨🇦 Have a great riding season :-)
I enjoyed reading and I'm happy that you like the bike as it's truly unique. I bet that with time one gets more comfortable with the whole setup and the location of the buttons, as you mentioned. Using rear brake may be a way, but that's still a task requiring a lot of precision, so a solution of the last resort I guess. Now, come on, get that seat fixed! :) I'm shocked as breaking it means that there's something tougher (and likely harder) than this super tough seat. Lots of respect for breaking it! All the best with your Africa!
@@VToldsMotoShow Thank you :-) I very much enjoy this bike. I have and have had many toys ( muscle cars, mountain sleds, ATV's, dirt bikes, ATV's, in river boats, RV's), but I think the best one is, the one you can afford, to get out and see the world we live in. Thanks for showing a great way to do it :-)
Fajna recenzja. Wycisnąłem z niej więcej nich z wielu innych innych. Dobra robota 🥂
I own an ATAS DCT, and it’s amazing. Pretty much as you described it. I always stay in s1 mode since I feel like it’s perfect for me. I totally agree that the location of the turn signal and the horn is absurd. At the end of the day, I care about safety and that’s why I chose the dct. I never want to go back because now I focus on the road 300% more than with the manual gearbox.
Thanks for sharing and it's great that you're enjoying the bike. It's also good to see that I'm not the only one who prefers the "S" modes than the "D" mode. I was wondering what it would be like after a year and if the "D" one would grow on me but judging by your feedback, the rest suits the bike better. Cheers!
@@VToldsMotoShow yeah D mode is horrendous but it’s good for fuel economy 👍
I have a 2020 version of this and fully optioned including the foot change. To me the best of all worlds and the DCT the main driver of the purchase. I sold my 2014 GSA for it and I’m happy with it especially for traffic riding which is important for me. Off-road isn’t a consideration like most real-world buyers. I’ve added a wind deflector on the tank which has made a huge difference to the low frequency hum that I was getting. I’ll add bar risers and possibly lower foot pegs. The GSA riding position is better for me but not a deal breaker. Around town fuel economy is poor but steady 60 to 70mph is superb. The range is over 300 miles and something that I want to help with fuel supply and protestor morons.
Thanks for sharing and I'm very glad that you're enjoying your Africa Twin. I wonder how you compare the low speed balancing of the GSA and your current Africa Twin. This is a good topic to analyse I guess.
@VToldsMotoShow when he said traffic, he meant just stay behind the cars in traffic with all 3 boxes attached 🤪🤪
Awesome review, thank you.
Thanks, I'm glad that you like it.
For those how say the DCT it's not worth it,they just have to try it!!!💯💯💯
I have a 2019 ADV Sports DCT and it is awesome! Footpeg is my next mod
Most of these reviewers i can tell within a few minutes that they are hoodwinking the viewers as they have only taken the bike out for a test drive to put up another review for their subscribers 🤔
They haven't had enough time to understand the difference of riding DCT or are just too mentally challenged to figure it out ,
1 easy way to tell how long they've had the bike is when they talk about low speed control being jumpy 😂
This means they haven't learned about the rear brake properly and how it works with the DCT !
Or they don't understand mixing the manual shifters with the auto box !
This takes time to get your head around but once you do you won't go back to manual
It definitely needs trying and even more - getting used to as gatti493 sort of provocatively stated. But I think that the idea is correct as it's very different to riding a bike with a traditional gearbox. Still, some may know very quickly if they like it or not. To me, that's Africa's main selling proposition.
@@VToldsMotoShow Dragging the rear brake is not specific to DCT. It’s a technique that can and should be used on any bike. But with DCT you don’t need to operate the third control being the clutch lever. I’ve been using this technique for the last 32 years, long before DCT was even thought about.
@@VToldsMotoShow
I don't mean to be provocative pal, I'm just being straight, its not a bike you can just take for a spin and give an honest and ACCURATE ! review and as an owner of this bike I know the learning curve with the back brake so I also know when someone mentions that the bike is jumpy that it is themselves that simply haven't had long enough on the bike to figure out that you have to mix the rear brake with the throttle and you can indeed have very fine slow speed control.
I have had people comment to me while I'm out that they've heard these bikes are jumpy when trying to drive slowly?? And i know what causes these poorly informed opinions??
Poor reviews giving information that is not gained from the experience required to give an accurate review on DCT operation , no provocation intended 😇😉👍
Excellent review, I just picked my AT dct up first bike I owned. I definitely needed these riding tips and in comments too.Thankyou
Yeah, I'm glad it was useful to you and I agree that the DCT riding tips may be helpful.
how is it for a first bike mate ? I am 40 and thinking of getting my first bike too
Just subscribed, great video lad.
I'm glad you like it, thanks!
I went with the standard and love it. The AT is an amazing bike.
So the traditional approach in here. Good to know that there aren't only DCT fans riding Africas.
Base model with tubed tyres? The thought of a blow out at speed put me off! Bloody great bike to ride thou!
Nice one mate. That is probably the BEST review I have seen, and I agreed with almost every word. I have a 2021 Adventure Sport, and at 60, I did a 400 mile round trip 2 weeks ago with minimal stops and could easily have done 200 more miles - and that's with some hip and knee issues. I was bikeless for over 40 years, but a lifelong Honda man (and boy). I could not even THINK of a GS. However, loving the DCT on a run as I do, I MUST say, that very slow speed manoeuvring, without a clutch to squeeze is a problem for me, as is 12 to 16 MPH down our gravel lane, in gravel mode, and gear changes when I don't want 'em. I will have another for sure, but next time, manual, with quick shifter, as I prefer to have no surprises when making slow / off road manoeuvres.
Thanks a lot for sharing! I'm glad that you're enjoying the Africa. It's a truly legendary name and if you're taking it off the roads, I believe that could be a proper machine to live with. Yet 400 miles on its hard seat I consider a big achievement. On the other hand the knee angle is super, super helpful. All the best with your current and future Africas!
You need to see more reviews then. He is having trouble riding the break at low speeds and giving people a bad impression of the DTC.
G-class comparison quite explained it all 😁
Maybe a softer mode could be a software update? I find it strange in gravel mode u can't turn off abs for the rear. U have to be in off road to turn abs off?
Fantastic video, thank you!
I'm glad you like it - thanks for letting me know!
I‘ve ridden the AT with DCT several times and really love it - but decided to buy a Ténéré World Raid because of the off-road qualities at slower speed when it gets more technical …
Thanks for sharing as this is in fact very specific insight. I've seen one of the Teneres recently and it also makes a solid impression. It looks much lighter, and you triggered my interest mentioning slower manoeuvres. Actually made me very curious.
I'm new to off roading but rode the T7, I did feel it was more capable than me! I don't wanna do technical stuff, so after riding a few adventure bikes, AT adventure sport es dct for me!
Cool bike, and good man👍😉
Right - at your service!
For touring around Europe, this or the VERSYS 1000?
How are the engine vibrations? Noticeable?
Your comments regarding slow speed and trottle response is in my view not correct. With a DCT you should use the rearbreak more at (very) slow speeds to keep tension on the bike where you would feather the clutch on a normal bike.
Thanks, that's right. I've heard about that technique but I don't think that it's necessary as the bike doesn't have any "minimum speed" like it does with manual transmission. So it's rather about being able to control the throttle more precisely, which maybe would be possible to design. Today, yes, we'd have to do as you say to reach the same desired effect. As for low speed manoeuvring, my complaints are mostly about the lack of good balancing of the bike and it being very top heavy, so in other words - hard to ride precisely as you want it to at low speed.
@@VToldsMotoShow This balance issue you mention goes away if you drag the rear brake against the throttle. With practice it is possible to come to a complete standstill easily without putting your feet down.
Well done, excellent review!! I was a Ducati owner for about 10 years and changed 4 Ducati. I had multistrada 1100s, multistrada 1200s, multistrada 1260s and finally multistrada 950s. I sell the last few days ago and I bought the same bike just the one you have tested. I have to say that I am excited!!! Built quality is outstanding, painting quality is above criticism and bike feels to be exceptional. I was sure that I wanted the adventure sport edition with electronic suspensions but I had serious doubts about DCT. I have to say that DCT is a very good and clever system. I am still learning it but seems that I will get use to it since my use is a daily road use and travels from time to time. I will not try any serious enduro mainly due to the bike's weight and secondly due to the DCT's behavior in slow speed.
However, I am very disappointed with two issues I came across.
1) On speeds between 60-90 KLM only and when you lift your hand from the wheel, then the wheel is trembling like crazy!!! If you just touch it it stops...
I report this to HONDA and they told me that this is known & acceptable. It's really disappointing.
i don't have topcase and they told me that if I put one on the wheel will tremble even more... Really unexpected for a motorcycle that expensive.
2) The electronics are very very slow, the menu is changing options very slowly, also diaponting. This maybe can be solved with an update at the 1st service I guess.
I have to say that i didn't expect these from HONDA. And I certainly can say that Ducati is miles ahead in technology...
Keep up the very good work, greetings from Greece
You've mentioned an interesting behavior. I wouldn't say that handlebar shaking is a normal thing if you let it go. Maybe they're installing wrong tires in the first place. I don't think that this explanation is so much cool. As for the instrument panel, then yeah, its long loading time is a known thing and all of them have it. Maybe Honda manages to upgrade it over time but I doubt. Some old car systems behave in the same way - before they load everything, you're long gone and back home after going for shopping. It's a pity and I also wonder how they could leave it this way with today's technology. But hey... we've got to love these bikes DESPITE their imperfections. Africa has a lot of character though, A LOT! I'd really enjoy having one with DCT myself but find it a bit too difficult to ride at low speeds for my often city tours.
Never understood the complaints about D mode or downshifting under throttle twist. Guys... There are SI-III modes. You can downshift with the click of one button. You'd remember on a manual, you'd have had to shift with your left foot, left hand, and if you wanna rev match, your right hand. All these complaints, like "too many buttons and too complicated electronics" are NOT an issue if you aim to be an owner. JUST SPEND TIME WITH IT. These are the complaints of 1 day reviewers, test riders, 'first ride' videos, etc. Just be teachable. Auto mode is for cruising and slow riding, for when you don't want to think. Other than that, just use the buttons... It's still simpler than shifting on a manual bike. IT JUST TAKES GETTING USED TO till it becomes muscle memory. D mode will save you gas. Each has its purpose.
Curious what your opinions are on low speed riding now that they updated the DCT software?
Not sure I'm going to be trying again but I think that DCT was working perfectly in S modes. I wasn't entirely happy with the steering precision, balance and control, so low speed handling. DTC - I'm hugely impressed. If they've made it even better, it must be reading minds.
I wish had $17k laying around. I'd love to get one of these with the manual transmission with a quick shifter instead of the DCT.
as a first time owner and beginner. im not worried about size, but in essence would it be a bike you would recommend? all of it is my likes and DCT sounds like pleasant cruises
I was - and still am - truly impressed by he DCT. Started off super sceptical but very quickly became an ambassador of how great it is. Not sure I would want it on my bike regardless of what model it would be, but if I wanted something different, the this definitely can serve the purpose. On the other hand, the rest of Africa's capabilities can be matched and beaten by other bikes in every category I believe. So I say it is the best at anything specific but the best big adventure bike with a DCT... Yeah, it's the only one currently.
l love this bike! Man, you're going to get me back on 2 wheels! 😻🏍
Yeah, it sure looks badass. I saw one on the streets a few days ago and it does make an impression! Sounds really cool. I actually heard it before I saw it. And it may probably be one of the best choices for long cross country trips on unpaved tracks ;)
Thank you, I just crossed the Africa Twin off my list, mainly for what you said about the front brakes and the display taking so long to boot up.
The display is a real, real pain. However, you could improve the brakes yourself as likely it's a matter of components used. So If you could just ignore the display while liking other things about the bike, then well... One more thing is that there's this second, smaller display below the main one that shows you at least speed, so it seems like either Honda knew, or we're lucky with this "backup" one there. But you're not entirely lost and forgotten there this way.
@@VToldsMotoShow really? Key in, by the time you put your gloves on....ready to go! Ps..the ktm 1290sas seat is much harder imo.
A good review for the environment you were riding in. I have a standard 2021 AT DCT with a foot shifter and it’s an absolute blast. Not top heavy and can be ridden like a proper old school motorcycle with a clutch and advanced riding techniques. Try down shifting while accelerating with a quick shifter. DCT allows you to do this.
D mode is best because most people ride in too low a gear most of the time. The AT engine is built for low down torque, but most are not familiar how to use this.
The front brake is weaker but this is for a reason. A powerful front brake on a loose or muddy surface is not a good option as it is more likely to wash out. The front brake comes into its own when used in conjunction with the back brake on grippy paved surfaces.
I agree about the horn button and have had that exact same situation as you. You do get used to the layout, the downshift problem was much worse on the CRF1000 and on the 1100 is not that bad.
I encourage you to go and ride a standard DCT bike with the low standard screen with a foot shifter fitted. Use manual mode and the rear brake in car parks and slow city streets and you will have a different opinion.
It is possible to just start the bike and ride away. You do not need to wait for the TFT screen. Eventually it will default to the riding information mode. Until this happens you can monitor the vital riding info on the smaller bottom LCD.
Thanks for the feedback. I wish I could try a DCT one equipped with the foot lever added. True about the screen - it's not required to wait for it to load unless you want to know what setting you're in etc. But yeah, it's a good point here. I still wonder about the front brake. You're not the only one who mentions that it may be this way for a reason, but I'm actually not convinced. I guess I'll make up my mind after trying one of the KTMs that are also focused on offroad more than some other bikes. Still, GS bikes have awesome brakes and are claimed to be some of the most common choices when it comes to offroading. Thanks again for sharing!
Very thoroughly thought out review, if one is in the market for a bike like this, this channel is probably the best one when it comes to the nitty gritty of each bike, an other great reviewer is Big Rock Moto that is very thorough also.
I know the Super Tenere has been discontinued in many markets as rumors are that a new one is on its way, I think it was a bike way before it’s time and there are some very good deals on the market.
Is there any chance you could test one, I think it is still competitive and for me the best looking one when fully equipped.
Thanks for your work.
Thanks for your feedback. I'm glad you enjoyed watching and I hope it's as helpful as possible each and every time. I've ridden one of the earliest Super Tenere 1200 models and I liked it overall. But that was a long time ago and I also didn't have the perspective of having ridden pretty much every bike in the category (except for a KTM 1290 Super Adventure), so I wouldn't be able to reliably tell much. Searching for a used one to test might be too much of a challenge I believe. I remember that it seemed similar to the pre 2013 BMW R1200GS. Looked better, had similar power, better sound and not enough space between the fairings and rider's knees. Being 183 cm tall, I found resting my knees against that fairing not an option while sliding forward at all times. Sort of an unsolvable thing for me. Those things got stuck in my memory. not sure how helpful that is but for shorter riders it may work. And with a drive shaft - damn, I'm just waiting for Yamaha's comeback here! Cheers!
@@VToldsMotoShow Thanks for taken time to reply, am a bit puzzled about hitting the fairing, I am 190cm and did not have a problem sitting on the 2021 model! But I have not ridden it, so maybe that would be different.
I really like the Tenere 700 in the looks department, but I would hope the new super Tenere would keep the organic lines of the original, but let’s see, maybe the 700 design would work on a bigger bike.
Love your channel, keep up the good work.
At half the price, I went with the 22’ CB500X. I absolutely love it. Plenty of power for me, great for trails and awesome on the highway. I ended up buying the Trail 125 and Grom too. Amazing lineup.
Having 3 bikes for the price of one? Sounds like a reasonable deal if you've got space for them all.
I have just ordered an Africa Twin, won't get it until December! I also looked seriously at the 1250 gs. But after test riding both I came down heavily on the AT. Both handled OK dirt for big bikes but the gs was definitely quite a bit more squirrelly, it certainly felt less planted. I agree with you about the instrument cluster the BMW is far superior no comparison really, the proximity of the horn, indicators and manual shifter on the Honda gave me the shits as well. One of the things that made me choose the AT however was its Japanese reliability. I don't want to be half way between Melbourne and Broome and find I have problems, an adventure bike needs to be robust and reliable. In my experience Japanese bikes are simply much more reliable, in my experience BMW's break (sometimes often). Japanese bikes don't. I ordered my Africa twin with DCT but I am still in two minds about it. I suppose that I will find out if I have made the correct decision when I have owned the bike for a while.
I am in the same situation. Still confused between both. My requirement is 60% Highways and 40% City. I'm yet to test ride both.
@@mostwantedadrian yeah you are about to have some serious fun. Both are great bikes in my opinion. The BMW is probably the better road bike while off road the Honda is loads better. But the big beemer is just not as reliable. I intend doing some serious long trips into remote parts of the country, I don't want to be having to find a BMW dealer in Kununurra.
Thanks a lot for sharing your purchase journey. I also do believe in Japanese vehicles' reliability much more than in German ones. Statistically this has to be right. With an individual unit - I guess that it may always go either way. I hope that after your Africa is delivered (5-6 months of waiting time?! Damn!), it will work like a charm. I think that if I were you and were to travel a lot on perhaps mostly empty roads of Australia, I'd choose DCT myself without hesitating much. If there was a lot of city riding, I probably wouldn't choose the non-DCT one but a completely different bike. All the best with your Africa!
@@VToldsMotoShow thanks. Yeah I don't intend doing a lot of lane splitting, but I do intend plenty of long days in the saddle on dirt and tarmac touring. Just found out it doesn't come with a centre stand as standard! A bit annoying.
@@mostwantedadrian I commute 55 miles a day on the highway. The standard bike is perfectly adequate for this.
There is nothing better than DCT with good rear brake control in heavy city traffic.
I still love my 2016 Super Tenere… and I can’t find a replacement for it… I had a FGS800 2008 used it for 120.000km and it was nothing special, also had a 1999 AF 750 and loved it… waiting for the new Super Tenere 1200 to drop in 2 years?
I'm also very curious about what Yamaha comes up with in terms of new Super Tenere. I find it weird for them to discontinue it just like that with the base that it has given them. Let's see what happens!
Hi V-Told, do you plan to make a video about new X-ADV? Just got one and very curious about your opinion. I am Warsaw based as well. Greetings!
Hi, I don't think I'd go for it but I bet that this is exactly the machine that I noticed on the streets of Warsaw a few weeks ago and wondered what in the world that was. It sounded wild but I couldn't recognise the shape. I guess that I know now. All the best!
If you are coming from a road only background, the front brakes might not feel substantial enough. For offroad that is perfect because you don't want sensitive brakes. I feel Honda had to find a compromise
If that's true - and I don't know that - then I'd probably get it. I feel that after electronically adjustable suspensions, then riding modes, now it may be time for the category to develop adjustable brakes reaction. Not sure how safe that would be but even if they had two modes, so a road one and an offroad mode, this would make some sense to avoid too large compromises here.
@@VToldsMotoShow maybe automatically adjustable according to speed.
i have the standard AT with DCT and I couldnt disagree with you more re the riding in traffic. The DCT makes it so easy and I find the weight on the bike is very low, so you can come to a virtual standstill without needing to put a foot down. I am so surprised you found that not to be the case.
And I couldn't disagree with you more. The center of gravity is very high, not low, which is not even the key point. It's all together making it not precise when riding very slowly. KTM 1290 Super Adventure R is also very tall and with a pretty high center of gravity and it does it perfectly, including coming to a standstill slowing down gradually with no struggling to keep the bike riding perfectly straight. Unfortunately Africa Twin is not as compliant here. It does turn better if that helps the image.
was wondering when you will be testing ktm 1290s against ducati multistrada v4 and bmw 1250 gs and triumph 1200
I'm wondering as well. I'm getting the Triumph in a few days but KTM has no motorcycles available since the beginning of the year, which makes it quite a challenge. The funny part is that I'm actually very interested in the 1290 as a customer but KTM makes it impossible to proceed with on any level. I'd never buy anything this serious that I cannot try first.
Would you go with the Africa twin or a T7 world raid for a global tour?
I think we should direct this to more offroad-oriented riders. I actually haven't ridden the Tenere, so cannot answer anyway. I'd take a GS as I suspect it would be the most comfortable and versatile.
I have ridden a few DCT equipped bikes, I think it works good in any speed other than very low speed riding; u-turns, figure 8's, etc. You need to fake out the computer by pressing the rear brake so the transmission doesn't go into neutral. For me, I don't really like it. I have a R1250GS with a quick shifter, so you can in essence is like a DCT.
Until you're in a 2 hour traffic jam in Bangkok and your left arm gets fatigued from feathering the clutch so much. Then you need to stop for a massage. But,,,, I don't think your left forearm gets much attention. 🙄
A quick shifter is not “like” a DCT. 😂 Are you sure you have driven one?
@@CanonMatters2Me of course. My BMW F900XR has a quick shifter. Sucks. Below 3k it's clunky. If accelerating like a quarter mile sprint or track day it's fairly smooth. But in nearly all cases the pressure required on my big toe is simply odd. If I slightly clutch I get a much better shift. Why do I need "quick" just for daily riding? No benefit. It's a gimmick. You still need to kick the lever with your tie Ala Fred Flintstone. Archaic. DCT provides near perfect shifts either on its own determination or with the paddled which are light years better than poking a levrr with your foot. With a quick shifter the benefit is not using your clutch hand from gears 2-6. In reality the gear still needs to be physically moved by a shift dog to engage the next gear regardless whether the clutch is used or not. In DCT the gears are already engaged and the clutches simply engage and disengage which is miles smoother and faster than the foot kicking thing that mechanically moves the gear on the transmission shaft. No real benefit. Unless you're on track day. My Audi TTRS with its DCT is phenomenal too. Best technology in the car in spite of its superb turbo 5 cylinder. My Honda XADV with DCT is infinitely better at changing gears than my BMW F900XR. Like modern vs old fashioned. I don't feel the macho need to feel I have to manually shift. These two bikes are my 17th and 18th, in the last 20 years which includes mostly BMWs (10 I think) with a few Ducatis and various Japanese bikes etc. The Ducati quick shifters admittedly performed better but still kept my toe busy even when not going balls out. What's the point? I'm thinking about the Honda NT1100 with DCT to replace my BMW but supply chain woes at Honda has deliveries pushed way out. The Africa Twin is just too tall and the Goldwing too big for me. I live in Thailand (American) I was the founding director of the BMW club here 25 yrs ago. I know we disagree. 🙂 But I'm just as happy you're a passionate motorcyclist too. The drawbacks of DCT are weight penalty, and cost. Plus low speed U-turns need a change of technique. Other than that my experience is overwhelmingly positive toward the technology that also dominates the sports car world. (during the same period I've also had 16 cars.) The last manual was a Mini Cooper S from 2003 or thereabouts. Glad that's in the rear view mirror too. My wife's MB C43 doesn't actually have a DCT but it performs like one. Every time I ride my XADV and look down and see the gear position in 4,5, or 6 and laugh and say to myself who shifted? That was so crazy smooth it was imperceptible. When I slow for a corner it downshifts nicely. If I need to grab a good handful to pass, a few light taps with my thumb gets me in the right gear seamlessly. Far more advanced and competent than moving the lever up and down with your toe. Just like the paddles in my Audi or MB. Anyway, this is just a conversation. I wish to be respectful and I'm happy we can lightly debate. Motorcycling is my life. I'm 67 and have been riding for over 50 years. I also admit that the comfort of no clutch lever is a consideration with my not as strong as they used to be thumbs! 😁 Thanks for listening and enjoy your two wheels whatever they may be. Cheers,
It's actually better. Read my post as to what dct I have ridden
@@robb8773 Yes, thanks for putting my responses in order. I tend to get carried away with my over zealous appreciation for DCT and my sarcasm for quick shifters. 🙄 It's 3am here and not sleepy so entertaining myself on various CZcams channels. Maybe I should lighten up on the red bull caffeine in the evening! 🙂
Hey V-Told, do you have in plans to review a Honda NT1100? I’d very much like to watch it 🙏
I'm hearing more and more about it so naturally my curiosity is building up despite it looking like a very traditional touring motorcycle. Slightly larger suspension travel just like in a Kawasaki Versys 1000 and BMW S 1000 XR I believe, suggests that it could find its spot among these adventure/crossover motorcycles. I've got a feeling that it may be too far from the style that I like and it could impact my perception. Thanks for mentioning it and let's see.
I have ATAS 1100 DCT ES (had two V-Stroms 650 and two Africas 1000) and there is no problem with maneuvering in the city it terms of balance. The bike is so balanced that I can drive steadily at a very slow speed. The problem, however, lies in the width of the steering bar. It is not always possible to drive between cars with such a wide steering bar.
I'd recommend trying a KTM 1290 SA R, BMW R1250GS or a Triumph Tiger 1200. V-Strom also isn't very good at it so having a perspective on what it achievable and how compliant these bikes can be at very low speeds, changes the judgement.
@@VToldsMotoShow I tried all of them.
Must really be an illusion due to the camera angle , but is your bike handle a little right biased ?
I haven't noticed it being out of place, so likely you the the camera's wide-angle lens.
Vito, I sold my 21 GSA because is was wayyy too big and bulk, then I was going to buy the AFT DCT but none of the dealer around me had 22 in stock (also my gut said it was way too under-power for my style of riding), instead I bought a 22 KTM 1290 Super Adv R and OMG, I never looked back to the honda or nor I have missed the BMW, if there is a unicorn in this big bike market I have found.
You should try as well!
Huge thanks for sharing it. I am personally very interested in this KTM but for months now dealers countywide do not have any demo unit. I feel that it can be my top bike too but of course can’t say a thing without riding it. I’m happy that you managed to find one to buy for yourself. All the best with it and I’m also screening the market.
I'm waiting for spring to pick up my new 2022 Africa Twin Adventure Sports, manual transmission. I think the most difficult thing about off-road on the Africa Twin you had is going to be the DCT, which is why I took manual transmission. I'm coming from an F800GS and R1250GS, and while I will miss the power and comfort of the 1250 on the highway, but I'm excited to just try a different bike for (hopefully) some long adventure tours around Europe. Comparing prices, the manual ATAS is almost 10k EUR cheaper than the R1250GS here, and only slightly more than the F850GSA, and for service pricing BMW is 30-40% more expensive than Honda.
Thanks for sharing and I wonder about that price difference - perhaps it's about some highly specced GS since it's a staggering 10k euros. That's close to a price of a fairly decent motorcycle on its own which makes it sound ridiculous to me. And scary at the same time.
@@VToldsMotoShow I was looking at full spec on the 1250 GSA. It's also not a completely fair comparison because here we don't get the 2023 ATAS in manual transmission, so I bought one of the last manual 2022 models available, which also lacks the electronic suspension.
as far as precision goes I saw a video saying you can ride the brake while applying throttle for a more precise response
Right, I've heard about that too, yet I wonder how precise that would be in the end. Then there's one more thing to incorporate into the whole process.
cool! please test honfa NT 1100)
Can I switch it to NC750X? ;)
I've been considering one of these. If I did end up getting one, I would definitely install the left foot shift lever and also add a modded rear brake lever for the left hand like on stunt bikes, for finer low speed control. I think these two changes would make the bike a more viable option.
That's interesting. I wonder if there are any kits for a left hand brake like in a moped. It would certainly open a whole new set of possibilities. I like your idea.
@@VToldsMotoShow I haven't been able to find any actual kits unfortunately. However, I did find videos from a couple different guys that used oem parts from a honda scooter (can't remember which one) to set it up quite elegantly and without losing stock functionality. Didn't look too difficult once you have the right parts.
Why not just use the rear brake? It’s already there and it’s free. 😁
A foot shifter is a great addition.
@@VToldsMotoShow Can use the master cylinder off an X-adv, but honestly I think it’s pointless and expensive when you can just use the rear brake.
@@eMotion_Video_UK Of course you can, and that's certainly fine if you don't want to spend any money on it. I think a hand lever will give the finer and more tactile feedback that ones fingers can provide over a foot with a heavy boot on it though, so it's an option. Also gives you more options as far as access if you're forced into any odd positions.
So... DCT or manual is better?
I personally prefer motorcycles with manual transmissions but if I were forced to buy Honda Africa Twin or just wanted it, I'd definitely take it with DCT even not having ridden the regular one with manual.
i agree. get rid of most buttons. i mean it has a touch screen to change settings lol.
Or maybe a joystick to replace a few of them and move away from each other.
super top heavy, high center of gravity, balanced hard and dificult to manage in low speeds, transmission bloody complicated, crappie performance, 173 buttons to set Sport Modes, if the surface is not super even the bike shakes a lot, front suspension dives like crazy, bad brakes, the hardest seat ever, difficult to ride in city....did i miss something? Congrats...what a great , precise, professional and unbiased review!
It is sad but I agree ,I sold my new ATAS DCT 2022 with 1700 km on it and buy back BMW R1200GS 2012
You've successfully summarized the negatives, yes. No go and check the definition of what "bias" means.
Mate, are you from Poland?
Yes!
When using dct at slow speed, you can’t pair it with clutch, but you can pair it with rear brake. This is the problem with any first look in combination with a deep review. You simply don’t have enough experience with this whole new technology. BTW, the video confirms you aren’t familiar with the system. To get D to down shift, you just have to give more fuel, like any automatic. You can see in your demo video, that as soon as you twist the throttle with authority, it down shifts immediately. The idea that you don’t have enough power for traffic maneuvers is just wrong.
Not sure if an automatic transmission is that whole of a new technology. I believe that in D it wasn't downshifting quickly enough while in other modes - yes. That makes me state that D is not working in line with my personal expectations. In a car, at the end of a gas pedal motion there's a "button" that allows you to force the car to downshift instead of allowing the car to stick to the current gear. Here it should react to a wide open throttle quicker in D. But it's not an issue as there are different mores, so no need to get upset. As for power - not enough for me to enjoy as much as I'd like. Doesn't mean that it's a weak engine or a slow vehicle.
I know a guy who has a DCT Goldwing that was riding it during a MSF riding course and he dropped the bike because of the low speed problem of the DCT equipped bike going into neutral during the low speed maneuver............he had $3000 of damage due to the low speed crash!
All he needed to do was modulate the rear brake while giving enough throttle you need. The bike will NOT stall. So gas and brake. It's very easy once acclimated. I don't care where the gear is! I don't care what the RPMs are. Gas to go. Brake to stop. The technology is amazing. I've got an F900XR which I like. But my XADV with DCT makes me wish all my bikes had DCT! Except for my Suzuki RGV 250 2 stroke which needs to be constantly in the powerband. 🙂 DCT where have you been all my life?! 🤣 (50 years and over 35 motorcycles of all types) I saw a second hand Honda V1200X with DCT its fast, but it's really heavy. Africa Twin? Too tall for me. Cheers,,,
$3K in damage from a low speed drop? gotta be more to the story.
@@sunrisejak2709 I have about the same years experience and number of bikes under my belt too, scrape the DCT, give me a manual with quick shifter any day. Good luck
@@robb8773 I've got a quick shifter on my BMW F900XR and it's so disappointing I don't use it. The pressure required on both up and down shifts us so heavy and notchy that I just shift the old fashioned way and it goes in and out of gear like butter. Maybe mine needs adjustment or something. But where are the downsides with DCT? In every case the shifts are faster smoother and imperceptible. Put it in manual and shift when you like and the shifts are still significantly better than a "normal gearbox." most sports cars have gone the same way. The gears are already engaged with the next gear and all that happens is the clutches swap in the blink of an eye. In a regular traditional gear box a shift dig has to physically move the gear on the shaft to engage the next gear. So ancient! I see no downsides only enhanced pleasure letting the bike do something better than a human ever could. I did a 2000 mile trip on the XADV with DCT and it was a different relaxing experience. I followed that a month later with another 2000 mile trip on my F900XR. The only upside was the better twisty road stuff on the F900 but the shifting part was better on the DCT. The App on my BMW through the Nav 6 GPS logs how many shifts. It's insane the number of times I shift on a spirited mountain road. Admittedly my grip strength is not what it used to be and slipping the clutch constantly in an hour and half traffic jams in Bangkok is no fun! Good excuse to get a massage though! However my left forearm rarely gets the bulk of the attention somehow. 😁 But I get what people take enjoyment from. Motorcycling is everything from scooters to Harleys and new and old and big and small etc. As long as we're all passionate about two wheel travel it's cool. By the way I hate CVT transmissions so go figure! 😊
@@sunrisejak2709 I have it on my R1250GS and its smooth as butter, I use it all the time...no problems. I still hate Honda's DCT. Good luck
Why can't Honda make the valve check every 40-50000km ? Why only after 25000 ???
This job COSTS. Thw whole bike needs to ba taken appart.... They neglected their BEST concept - the NC750X, and push everybody to buy THIS engine in all the crazy versions.... And the price 😱😱 😖😖
There is asolution to that. Get a valve check on a VFR then go back to any other bike - enjoy the cheap service.
To each their own, but I love manual transmissions. There are far too many road situations (not to mention off-road situations) and different rider expectations to leave that individual "ideal" to some engineer to figure out.
Solution? Manual transmission.
Right, however, the manual mode in an automatic transmission would sound like a sweet spot in an otherwise fully automatic transmission. There are situations when slipping the clutch helps but on the other hand we've got to remember that eliminating stalling of the bike completely also brings a lot of potential benefits.
This bike will be overkill if you only plan on tooling around in European city-centers. The ATAS is a serious continental-crosser that can chew up miles on the expressway, off-road trails and nearly everything in between. You will never gain the full appreciation for this bike putting around on cobblestones.
That's possible. Still, this type of motorcycles suit me the most personally and I ride mostly in the cities. I believe that most riders spend most of their time on the road rather than off, so percentage-wise, it still may be the most important part. Anyway, I get it that when it comes to that 5 or 10% of offroading, then how Africa handles that can make a huge difference in overall perception. So yeah, I get what you mean and it may be the case in some of those instances.
I own a AT DCT 2021, electronic suspension and big tank, the only thing I don't like is that in the Ohh Shi# moments there is no clutch to press to neutralize the engine, the 1st reaction in these moments is press clutch and front break, but in the DCT case, if you do this you keeo the throttle on while trying to break, and the bike will try to keep going forward because still in throttle power, this is not safe at all, so it takes some learning and be specially more cautios than normal.
All in all I love the bike, and the DCT makes this bike bikr slowdown and shift down as you break at high speeds in a controller manner, and it acelerates as a bullet by shifting down with the tumb bottom
Oh yes, I also believe that this requires some getting used to. I haven't had much issues from the beginning except for the misaligned buttons on the left side of the handlebar. Perhaps the biggest struggle was not to rev the bike while in traffic since the gear is engaged unless you're specifically switching to neutral. So yeah, this may end badly for some of us at some point. But then it's not the bike's fault in such a scenario.
Finaly someone who adress real problem of dct...how to slow down in trouble if your hand is on throttle and you need to engage brakes...and no clutch leaver to disengage the engine! How about an answer Vtold...? Didnt hear any of "test" youtubers explain it...