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Lessons Animation Taught Us || The Secret of NIMH
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- čas přidán 14. 07. 2018
- In response to Movies With Mikey - Lessons Animation Taught Us || The Secret of NIMH (1982)
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Full Shut Up and Talk interview with Don Bluth & Gary Goldman:
(Part 1) • Shut Up and Talk: Don ...
(Part 2) • Shut Up and Talk: Don ...
/ merkstreet
/ merkstreet
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Merkstreet is a channel with a particular focus on visual literacy and cultural analysis.
SOURCES
The Animators Survival Kit (2009) by Richard Williams
Tree and Leaf: Including Mythopoeia (1965) by J.R.R Tolkien
Don Bluth's Art of Storyboarding (2004) by Don Bluth
www.bbc.com/future/story/20150...
Written, directed & edited by:
Simon Parnham
So guys, what was your favourite scary animated film as a child?
I had seen all Don Bluth's early work, both Martin Rosen films, and the forgotten genius of Bebe's Kids by the time I turned seven. So...all of 'em, you could say. :)
Merkstreet The moving house part of NIMH stayed with me a long time. All the scenes really were a jumble in my memory but still vivid whenever I see them again.
@Jeffrey - that's a wonderfully traumatising childhood :-D
@audiblebeauty I can certainly relate to that. The reason why I wanted to look into the film further is because it's been with me, and I can't really shake it off. Not that I would want to.
The Secret of NIMH. It’s still my all time favorite animated film, followed by The Lion King.
"If you don't show the darkness, you don't appreciate the light. If it weren't for December, no one would appreciate May" This is exactly how I feel about these old movies compared to modern ones. People keep bashing how the older movies were "So dark" when compared to movies now, or how these shallow "dark" moments in movies are so shocking. I keep trying to tell people the dark half is what MAKES the film! Its why we remember them so vividly!
Compelling thoughts! What are some of the other films you had in mind?
@@MerkstreetUk The Nutcracker Prince cartoon movie of the 90s, The Last Unicorn, Watership Down, The Dark Crystal, All Dogs Go to Heaven, even cartoon series like Gargoyles and Batman the Animated Series. Mostly movies from my childhood in the 80's reruns and 90s, but on occasion something good would come in the later years like the original Teen Titans series.
Gargoyles! Someone needs to do a Lessons Animation Taught Us video on that! That series is so far in the recesses of my Saturday morning childhood I'd forgot it existed! Thanks for the reminder.
It's also very arrogant to assume children are going to be scarred for life just because of some dark themes. People treat kids like they're drooling morons that don't know anything. They know a lot more than adults like to believe.
The Secret of NIMH is the greatest animated film ever made. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.
It's a bold story. It's certainly up there for me. It's usually a toss up between The Lion King, Wall-e, and The Man Who Planted Trees, Byt (The Flat) by Jan Svankmajer and The Song of the Sea for me.
@@MerkstreetUk For me, NIMH hits all the perfect notes. Amazing animation, awesome story, brilliant music, good action that doesn't take over the film, morals that aren't shoved down your throat and just the right amount of tension and suspense.
This is the most enjoyable Lessons Animation Taught Us I've seen. I love how you're concentrating on the art and how it speaks to us and communicates with us subconsciously.
Thank you very much! High acclaim indeed. This is certainly the most emotive video I've done, and going about it that way does seem to strike a chord in people.
This was an excellent addition. One of the best ones in the collection hands down
Kind words indeed. Thank you very much :-)
I grew up in the Golden Age of animation I grew up with one of my favorite animations The Secret of NIMH. We need more animations like this. MORE NOT LESS MORE!!!!!!!. You cannot learn if reality is hidden from you.
The Secret of Nimh, The Dark Crystal, The Hobbit (70s version) and The Labyrinth are all movies that scared the bejeezus out of my brother and I as kids but we just couldn't help but keep coming back to them.
It's weird isn't it? Especially as a kid, there is this odd fascination of what terrifies.
The helplessness of being trapped in the birdcage always got to me as a child.
The scene where Mrs Brisby has to squeeze through the water feeder has never escaped me. Based on the comments, this film seems to have a similar effect on a lot of children, i.e the images stick around into later years.
@@MerkstreetUk Yeah, a lot of this movie stuck with me.
Also all of American Tail triggered my childhood fears of being lost at the time.
Don Bluth movies a fantastic but I might wait till the tweens to show them.
"Who are you going to trust if you're unsure about the safety and sanity of a mentor, a guide, or a friend?" (4:58) Indeed. These films are in important ways about human reality. They contain questions and exemplars that are relevant to the lives of people, no matter of what age.
Indeed. To get kids to watch this at an early age does set them up well - if they can handle it ;-)
The Last Unicorn was pretty dark too.
Yeah, that's another one of those that randomly popped up in my life every so often. It operates in the same headspace as the animated The Hobbit from 1977.
I honestly do think we will not see anything akin to or similar to Don bluth's work again for quite some time and as a result of that it's latest films not only stand-out as Classics but also stand for all time as pure works of art
I saw this in the theater when it released. I was mesmerized by the golden light that pours out of Nicodemus's book when Ms. Brisby reads it. The little random sparkles made my eyes widen. I attest that it was the viewing of this film, that inspired me to become an artist. To pursue art. It remains one of my favorite animated films. It's only a shame that no reasonable master has been made onto home video. I have had the VHS, several DVDs and at least two different Blurays. It is in desperate need of remastering and repair. The first few feet of the first reel, for example, is riddled with damage. I have seen what other studios have done with remastering in 4K and I hope I live to see the day it happens to this film.
The Secret of NIMH was pretty up there for me, especially during the house moving scene. And it's not animation, but The Neverending Story had the same energy. I'll never _not_ be able to visual Atreyu's desperation as he lost Artax to the Swamp of Sadness. Kids movies should have darkness, I've always believed that.
I actually only watched The Never-ending Story for the first time recently. Part of it's disconcerting quality I think is the fact that it's hard to tie it down. But I can imagine that as a child the Swamp of Sadness scene would linger. There is something in particular about the death of animals on film that does something to us. Mhmm...maybe a topic for another video at some point! Great thoughts! Thanks for sharing.
I want to feel like a mouse in this film. I want to find any work in any medium that makes me feel the dread, caution and triumph that this film makes me feel.
The secret of nimh is one of my all time favorite movies. I got it from my birth dad as a 5th birthday gift and I loved it so much! It was the type of movie I would watch over and over. And it's what sparked my interest in animation!
I love the debt that we owe to our favourite stories. Their value is nigh-on impossible to quantify. Thanks for sharing your thoughts :-)
That ending left me sobbing, filled with mourning for what has been lost, and yet hope for the future. Well done!
Aw, lovely. Thanks for sharing.
well said.
A excellent reviewing.
An animated film scored by Academy Award winner Jerry Goldsmith, you know it's something very special.
The music seeps into the malleable minds of children. At least that was my experience!
Very well said. I was 11 when this film came out & it blew me away, remaining an important touchstone of a courageous heart in the face of despair & darkness. The sad fact is, that the consequenceless violence of so much Children's animation, actually does more harm than good. Not that there can't be children's films (animated or not) that don't have violence! But taking away the real effect of that violence for fear of 'damaging' kids, does them a disservice. A small trauma experienced as a child, can prepare you for major trauma as an adult.
Nicely put. It's one of my main gripes with Marvel films. Tons of physical violence with very little focus on bodily trauma caused by it.
A smart, refreshing chat. "The Secret of NIMH" impacted Mr. Parnham as a child, through use of elements such as contrasting colors, character (eyes), aligned music and so on. Indeed, "The Secret of NIMH" made huge waves despite its initial modest box office ticket sales. Stephen Spielberg like it so much that he contacted Don. This later resulted in collaborative filmmaking of the original features, "An American Tail" and "The Land Before Time" .... Despite these two and subsequent features by Don Bluth's team, "The Secret of NIMH" remains arguably at the top.
What's one of the amazing things about this movie besides almost all of it is that despite how COMPLETELY different from the book it is I loved them both. That doesn't happen often. I have to say I was disappointed in the ending because it left out the possibility of a sequel (like in the book series not the piece of junk they created as a sequel). The sequel they did was worthy of a Disney sequel (note that I hate almost all of their sequels unless it is part of a series) in that it was extremely juvenile and not well thought through.
This was beautiful. I've always loved Bluth's work as a kid, and you really brought it all together with the light/dark themes. And I won't lie, Samwise's speech brought me to tears at the end. Great analysis!!
It was a bit of a cheap shot ending with that, but couldn't resist :-) Thanks for the friendly feedback
This truly was a warm hug of nostalgia and a delicious meal to the intellectual mind. I wept.
Lovely. Just a gosh darn lovely thing to say. Cheers pal!
This is a really insightful and well-crafted video. I do have one English professor's son's note: at 9:55 or so you use the word "palatable" when I believe you meant "palpable." Palatable means something is good to eat, or tastes good, while palpable means "(of a feeling or atmosphere) so intense as to seem almost tangible." Great work, though. Kudos. I am planning to do one of these myself, but it's such a huge category I'm having trouble focusing in on essential points. I'll get there.
Hi Chris. Thanks for the feedback - c'est tres helpful! Please make a point of posting on this thread once you've got a wee video up, would be great to see it.
My favorite scary animated move as a child probably is Coraline
Strong choice! First time I saw that was as an adult and it scared me silly then. Can't imagine what it would do to a child? I mean, what a notion! Don't run away from your parents, because another set might want to kill you...!
@@MerkstreetUk I was a tween when I watched that one. I remember thinking it was fun. I liked the colors. I liked the dark themes.
I was 12 I think when I started contemplating what death meant. By 16 I was dangerously suicidal. The fact that Coraline featured characters that were dead appealed to me. The fact that true death was portrayed as a happy, natural thing appealed to me. The fact that Coraline was fighting for her life appealed to me, because I was fighting for my life too.
When you're a kid, your life is tightly controlled, so the idea of the other mother intimidating the puppets into subservience is not as horrifying as it would be for an adult, because it is a fact of life for children. My mom is abusive, so I was never really considered my own person... I was a vehicle for her desires, tightly controlled by her through fear and intimidation. It was nice to see other creatures like me.
To me, it wasn't really a message of "don't run away or else" but more of a message of "this happens sometimes, and sometimes it looks innocent, and sometimes it's your parents doing this to you, and sometimes you have to survive it."
I think little kids are more worldly than you think they are.
I was 10 when Coraline came out. So maybe you were referring to younger kids, but I'm pretty sure Coraline was meant for an 8+ audience.
The speech at the end of the video was so thoughtful. And all the quotes from animators and authors was great fir your presentation of the fundamental importance of animation and well... story telling as a whole
Amazing. Thank you for that reflection.
Thanks for taking the time to say so ;-)
I really enjoyed this. I love the pacing that went so well with the subject matter.
This channel is super underrated! Keep up the amazing quality videos!
Very kind! I've been taking a break from the channel, but am looking to take it up again. Encouragement like this is a good kick up the backside ;-)
that was nuts. nice ending. almost call it a twist.
Very kind of you to say, thanks for taking the time.
Truly remarkable. Just a beautiful video.
Well, that's just lovely. Thank you very much for taking the time to say so :-)
Dude I need to see the secret of nimh again. I always love that movie, I grew up watching it.
Let me know what you think when you get around to it !
You definitely know how to share a concept. Subbed.
Very kind. Thanks for taking the time to say so. :-D
Exactly, Merkstreet did SUCH AN AMAZING JOB on this one! Deserves a million+ views.
@@cougarfanforever That's a jolly nice thing to say :-)
This is a lovely piece - you made me cry at the end! I was 8 when Nimh came out and I remember loving it hugely, it didn't frighten me at all. Looking back at other stuff like Sleeping Beauty (esp. Maleficent), The Dark Crystal, Night on Bald Mountain; they were all my favourites with the dark jewel colours and characters with real depth and genuine emotion. Watership Down though... I don't even know how old I was, but that gave me nightmares.
Sounds like you were a stronger child than me. But even the strongest will struggle with the harrowing experience that is Watership Down...!
@@MerkstreetUk seriously I'm 45 now and I still can't watch it! 😅
It definitely leaves an indelible mark!
Anyone who enjoyed this video should attempt to read J. R. R. Tolkien's essay "On Fairy Stories" (the definition of myth was different back then). Really good video.
Oh, definitely!! I go back to it regularly! Great suggestions.
A word to the wise for those who only watched the movie or never read more than the first book: Jenner wasn't the complete villain he's made out to be. If you want more info I suggest you read "Racso.and the Rats of NIMH" by Jane Lesley Conley. It's the sequel to the book this movie is based off "Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH" even though it wasn't written by the same person. I believe it was written by his daughter.
It's certainly an interesting trope you get in sequels, and makes for a fascinating discussion - i.e the reframing of the original stories villain. Never read the books myself. Thanks for the suggestion :-) Oh, and happy new year to you!
Great stuff. Really enjoyed it.
Things do seem dark now, but a new day will dawn.
Kyle Foutz :-)
1. It's not scary, per se, but the animation I loved as a kid that taught me about Light defeating true Darkness was the 1977 _The Hobbit._ Smaug, the goblins, and even Gollum were pretty terrifying.
2. This was a great addition to the LATU series! I really enjoyed your insights about the use of form to create an atmosphere that reinforces the theme. Animation is undoubtedly more free to do this than live action.
Very kind of you to take the time to say so. I remember reading The Hobbit graphic novel, which I believe is very similar character drawings as the animated film. The graphic novel did a great job at building atmosphere. Tolkien's work and adaptations are amongst the powerful stories in that regard. Great shout!
Spot on, sir. A fine analysis.
Thank you kindly.
welp, i wasn’t expecting this video to make me cry! good job, man. the editing is particularly powerful towards the end.
Thank you very much for taking the time to say so. I'm glad it connected with you!
_Expression_ is everything in this movie, even head-and-shoulders over Bluth’s other works. Even as a small child, I was subconsciously _drawn_ by the fact that they really don’t turn away from showing very strong negative emotion on the character’s faces.
Even when bad things happen in most Disney movies, the characters expressions don’t actually get that sad or angry or frightened. Not in a way that would deeply impact a child.
But in this one, what riveted and frightened me most was the _absolute terror_ on Mrs. Brisby’s face, and the livid, ugly, frightening insanity in Jenner’s.
Oh and let’s not forget the expressions of the rats in the scene where they get injected.
It was also of course the music and the deeply saturated coloring, but the expressions of abject terror on the rats’ and mice’s faces really got to me as a kid.
And even then, I appreciated how deep that was.
Great points!
I love this movie
It's definitely a good'n!
Fantastic video. But I believe that the Watership Down film came out in 1978 lol
Thanks for the clarification. Was trying to find the bit where I got the date wrong, but struggled. Now, I'm either just being a wee dafty and don't know my own videos well enough, or I'm missing the point you are trying to make ;-) Thanks for leaving a mesage :-)
Thank you, this was very good.
And thank you for taking the time to tell me so - always helps :-)
Beautiful video! Your ideas flow together perfectly.
I'm still making my way through the LATU playlist but I think this is going to be one of my favourites. :D
A splendidly kind thing to say. Thank you!
HOLY CRAP how does this video only have 14,000 views?!
That is a very kind expletive. Thanks :-)
This was Great! A wonderful essay on a wonderful film!!! I look forward to more...!
Thanks for taking the time to say so. Not far off from the next one being finished.
Beautifully written and edited piece.
Very kind of you to say. Thanks :-)
Ah, splendid. I'm quite glad I found this channel.
Thank you kindly :-) Currently taking some time off, but hoping to get something out later on.
So am i.
You know, you ask what our favourite scary animated films were growing up, but I wasn't allowed to watch much scary stuff. I'd honestly say that two of the most influential films of my childhood (one being the darker one and the other being the animated one) were the extended edition LOTR films (I know it's not one per se, but it's a set) and Beauty and the Beast. In the latter, I was always drawn to the grim idea of being transformed into something that looked so unlike oneself, and with the grim idea of being locked away for somebody else's transgressions. And of course, Gaston is terrifying. As for LOTR...well, I could probably write a solid thesis on how that series (films and books, and the books beyond that Tolkien wrote) shaped me and my worldviews. I'll summarise by saying I would likely be a completely different person who wrote much poorer. But ever since I was little, I was very drawn to the harder questions LOTR asks, which is part of why I find the Silmarillion so very intriguing. It takes a lot of what I love about LOTR and plops it in one spot (albeit a spot that's a tad bit less accessible). Now as I grow a bit older, there are some stories (Secret of Nihm, Princess Mononoke, and The Last Unicorn come to mind) that I wish I had heard about before I entered high school, because I think a smaller me could've been greatly shaped by those stories, moreso than I can now.
My parents were pretty strict about what I couldn't and could watch growing up as well. We are kindred spirits because Lord of the Rings is a book I re-read once every two years or so, and watch the films at least once a year. Have you ever come across the BBC Radio 13-hour dramatised version from the 1980s? It was the first version that I came across, and to this day it's one of my favourite adaptations of the book. It's fun - Ian Holmes who is obviously Bilbo in the films, plays as Frodo in the radio play. The Beauty and the Beast is a great example of a film I could only watch under a cover growing up. Watching it as an adult it blows my mind that from the scene of Belle walking around the palace, finding the rose, running out, getting chased by wolves and then taking Beast back there is like 20 minutes of bleak and dark tension without a break, in a 90 minute kids film! Another great example! Thanks for your sharing your thoughts :-D
Beautiful video
Kind words. Thanks for taking the time to say so.
Bravo. So impassioned, insightful, and honest. Best review i have ever seen. Thanks
Woah. Very extensive accolade. Thank you for very much for taking the time to say so.
This was amazing. Thank you.
Thanks for taking the time to say so :-)
The use of voice over and music in your video is suppurb. Really flows. One of the few who do it as well is Breadsword
Uh! Thank you for both the compliment and a new CZcams channel to check out. :-)
Amazing insight! Not gonna lie the end brought a tear to my eye. Wonderful analysis, hit that subscribe button faster than I’m used to.
Thank you kindly! Glad you enjoyed it :-)
Dude at the age of 8 I was watching horror movies like Freddy Krueger and things like that
You had a stronger disposition at 8 than I had, and probably still do. Impressive!
@@MerkstreetUk my family is really into horror movie and toughening you up pretty young
I like the secret of nimh I watch it a lot when I was a kid and I still like it a lot. 😀👍🐭
It's one of those that sticks around even into adulthood, hey?
@@MerkstreetUk that's right. 😀👍🐭
This is something that I might like to watch one day. Maybe.
So good 💙
Thanks you kindly Josh :)
i don't get it, everyone seems to get what makes a good movie like the secret of nimh, yet there's no other animated movie like this one. great video btw!
It would seem it's easier to theorise that to make. It's a good point!
1:23 BICH THAT FILM IS A MASTERPIECE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
The book is even better!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I've heard amazing things about the book - an ambitious tome as I understand it. The film is without a doubt an impressive, memorable and somewhat disturbing piece. Did you go grow up with it or watch it later in life?
@@MerkstreetUk Well...when I was little I first watched the Christmas special from the old TV show. Then many many years later when I got into CZcams, I was watching WatchMojo do top 10 disturbing children's films, and I recognized the art style of the rabbits. so I went to the movie shelf and found the old Christmas special. I was like "this cute thing was based off something gory and mature.....well I got to check that out ASAP!!!!!!". So I watched the film and fell in love with it, then later I found the book just lying around the house and read it, now on my book shelf permanently.
So that's the story. :) (sorry it's long I know)
@@teddybearkiller5271 Good story ;-)
@@MerkstreetUk :P :D Glad you liked it.
Great stuff, about a great movie.
Hayao Miyazaki is the Don Bluth of Japan.
Excelent explanation (plaudit
) :D
Very kind of you to take the time and say so. Thank you. :-)
You had to go and put the Samwise quote in didn't you..... I'm not crying..... You are
It was a cruel move I know.
I still have never seen animated films that affected me like Don Bluth's did, except for earlier Disney films. Everything today is so bright and funny and whacky and I hate it so much.
nice!
Chris Völkle thanks pal 😁
An important difference is, Watership Down was never meant to be a children's story. It's a novel for adults and young adults at least. NIMH was meant to be a children's story.
This film caused me so much fear as a child that when I remember it, I only see the beginning
i have to ask is this even your video. because it is far better then anything else in your video collection. if it's yours than grate i'll keep myself subscribe. but if its not can you tell me who did this video so i can show him my appreciation.
I appreciate you checking. Online content can easily be spread around without due credit. It is my video, and was my first attempt at a video essay. This does make me think about how I approach the next videos though. Thanks for your feedback.
My favorite is Jeremy the crow
Yas! Love the profile pic! 😀
@@MerkstreetUk Jeremy The Crow is funny and cute
After I read the book, I just couldn't watch this movie anymore. There's taking creative liberties and then there's pulling crap completely out of your ass.
I can thoroughly understand that a book that you build a meaningful relationship with would make a person a purist when it comes to adaptations. I certainly have a number of books I feel that deeply about. I'm afraid that Mrs. Frisby and the Rats of NIMH isn't one of those, but the film is. So I'm therefore very forgiving of the changes they've made and enjoy the film as it is. But again, I can fully appreciate why it feels like 'pulling crap' out of ones ass. A beautifully eloquent description ;-)
Thanks for sharing your thoughts.
@@MerkstreetUk I'm usually much more forgiving when it comes to adaptations but in this case, it's like they weren't even trying to be faithful to the source material. The entire second half is a complete re-write that kills off one character who doesn't die in the book and demonizes one character who doesn't even appear in the book aside from flashbacks and being mentioned by a few characters.
Very interesting. Will need to have a look!
So many of these that I've seen have been along the lines of "Cinderella isn't feminist enough so Frozen is good because it's femininist" and I just wish people could let go of politics for a second and look at how beautiful animated films can and have been. Looking at the nuance and the visual aspect. To use the 2 films in the example I gave, I actually don't like Frozen because I find it a bit patronising to watch tbh. The themes of the film are outright stated in the dialogue and it didn't feel like an artistic experience, just a kids' film. But Cinderella has always been one of my favourites. I don't care about the politics and never have. It's beautifully animated. It doesn't need a lot of dialogue or subversion of themes to communicate the narrative and be a good film. It's a symphony of moving art and music.
I do think the beauty of these things - especially Mikey's brief - is that it's so inclusive because the topic is so broad. What lessons did animation teach us? The answer to that probably says more about the person, than the animated film being evaluated. Maybe with this new found freedom of expression through CZcams videos, et al, we do veer towards the political at the moment. In my first draft of this it was a lot more political - I was watching this film as a kid while the Balkan war atrocities were being screened on news channels. Stories like Secret of NIMH allowed me to frame such awful events in a meta-narrative that could involve a happy ending. So, I can very much understand why people are veering towards the political. However, in terms of Cinderella I'm afraid I must confess ignorance as I've never seen it. *Bracing myself for the telling off* Thanks for your thoughts though - they've got my thinking juices flowing!
Also Cinderella is an abuse victim. And "feminists" expect her to just run away. First of all where would she go. At with her step family she has a roof over her head and food to eat. Not to mention all the emotional reasons why. Talk about victim blaming. She wasn't after the prince. She just wanted a night out. She wanted for once to have fun and be a free woman. Meeting and layyer marrying the the prince was just a concoquince of that
Love their animation, do not love the anti-union sentiments.
I hear ya. There's definitely a pretty classic corporate attitude that runs through their approach.