Names in the Eastern Roman Empire - [Evolution of Roman Names, part 4]
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- čas přidán 16. 06. 2024
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Dumbarton Oaks Seals Collection: www.doaks.org/resources/seals/
Literary sources:
Martindale, J. R., The Prosopography of the Later Roman Empire, volumes IIIa and IIIb, Cambridge University Press, 1992
Nicol, Donald M. Studies in Late Byzantine History and Prosopography, London,Variorum Press, 1986
Polemis, Demitrios I. The Doukai: A Contribution to Byzantine Prosopography, London, Athlone Press, 1968
00:00 Intro
00:24 Disappearance of the Latin System
02:24 Personal Names in the Eastern Roman Empire
05:22 New Family Names
09:07 Outro
Footage:
Pompeii (2014)
Rome, TV series by HBO (2005-2007)
Rise of the Empire: Ottomans (2020)
Vikings (2016)
Music:
Imperator: Rome Soundtrack - We The People
Imperator: Rome Soundtrack - Mediterranean
Crusader Kings II Soundtrack - The Holy Sepulcher
![Names in the Roman Republic - [Evolution of Roman Names, part 1]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1X9LTHP70cM/mqdefault.jpg)
>substitute teacher
>work our actual teacher gave us isnt working
>free period before free period before school ends
>go to youtube
>see a video about the funny purple medieval greek rome dudes
>is good
>good channel
>me smile
perfectly timed as well
As an Orthodox Romaboo, I loved this. Pls more Byzantine content. *However*, I'd really love a video on the post-Roman West if possible. That is after 476 AD and the Gothic kingdoms, up to about Charlemagne or wherever you cut off. I want to see the Roman influence that remained, as many Germanics did assimilate, even the Lombards lost drinking horns in the 700s for example. Awesome work.
As always, you are the Basileus Autokrator. Thank you sincerely for your work with the names of the Roman empire, and everything else. Now please, start a Patreon so I can give you money.
Aye , hail to the Despotes of Roman naming convention.
Your series about naming conventions made me wonder.
How do citizens of the empire address their emperors? Do we call these individuals Princeps/Dominus or do we call them to the Latin version of their (mostly) Anglicized names?
It's something that I often take for granted since we always use the names that we give them.
I don't know about the ancient romans, but the later medieval eastern romans would call the emperor basileos, simply 'king' but in Greek
@@ZeRo-bx7lp the last part is not true. "Basileus" or "Vasileos" evolved to mean "Emperor" in the Roman (and Byzantine) period with the word Rēx/Rēgas- borrowed from Latin into the Greek vocabulary (along with many many Latin words due to the Greco-Roman nature of the ERE)- being used to refer to Kings and "Regnum" being used to refer to a Kingdom. In fact, the Byzantines reserved the use of Basileus to refer to the Roman Emperor and all other monarchs (with the exception of the Persian Shahnshah, which I will get to late) called "Rēgas" or Kings. This has been the case since the reign of Augustus himself who was called "Basileus" in the Greek east of the Empire although it was in an unofficial capacity in order to keep up the charade that the Empire was still a Republic during the Principate. It was during the reign of Heraclius that he officially changed the title of the Emperor from the traditional formula of Latin "Caesar Augustus Imperator Romanorum" to the Greek "Basileus" but these were equivalent terms (He also used "Autokrator Kaisar" but it was dropped in his edict and simply "Basileus" would be the new formula).
Note that it doesn't necessarily mean the old formula was completely dropped; Byzantine Emperors continued to keep both titles of "Augustus" (Augoustos/Sebastos) as well as "Autokrator" after the 9th century- which is the transliteration of the Latin word "Imperator" in addition to the official title of "Basileus". Augustus was used to refer to the senior Emperor while "Caesar" was used to refer to the Junior Emperor or the heir apparent.
Further proof that "Basileus" meant Emperor, not King lies in the diplomatic letters exchanged between the Persian Empire and the Byzantine Empire. We know that the Persian rulers' title was "King of Kings" (Shahnshah), we also know that the Persian King of Kings was the only other sovereign considered to be an equal to the Roman Emperor by the Romans (this, again, was so since Augustus himself) so this means that the Persian title King of Kings = Emperor. So if "Basileus" is true to its older meaning of "king" rather than emperor then the Persian King would refer to himself as "Basileus Basileon" however, in reality, he instead refers to himself as "Persōn Basileus" i.e Emperor of the Persians. This shows that the Persian Shahnshah indeed considers his title equal to that of the western title of Emperor meaning that the word Basileus has evolved to mean Emperor in the Roman/Byzantine period, not King.
I think I'm going to name my son John Doukas Angelos Palaiologos Raoul Laskaris Tornikes Philanthropenos Asanes....
.... the Younger.
You pronounced the names surprisingly accurately; I've heard you say latin words well but I did not expect this to extend to greek as well.
Though you did pronounce the Κομνηνοί the archaic way, but I don't have a problem with that one since it sounds cooler.
That'a a nice surprisr, didn't expect to get it well. Thanks for the confirmation!
It of course is not perfect but it is still beyond passable and could very well be the way someone who has learnt greek as a second language pronounce it; which isn't even necessary as the subject itself is the name structure and trends but you still did some reading on that and it is a very nice detail.
My favorite Roman name is definitely Basil just caused they names a herb after him lol
The name Basileios has more to do with royalty then herbs.
@@Michael_the_Drunkard You are only saying that cuz u are a emperor yourself
My favorite greek nickname is actually from the late antiquity. Constantine the great was known as the bull necked.
Judging from his statue, it's well-earned
That name rivals the legendary Dungnamed.
@@spaceracer6861 Constantine V wasted such an awesome name and number on being a crappy Emperor... No pun intended.
Trachalas in greek
@@funnywarnerbox300 ConV was a good emperor overall, he simply ended getting slandered for his iconoclasm which although is viewed as heretical now, at the time it was actually quite popular among the people, the army and many bishops even...
Thank you! This will be very useful for my Eastern Roman Empire historical fiction about a child during the Islamic conquest of the Levant.
Bro really pointed out me pointing out the number of Tiberius in the Late Roman Empire lol.
I would have just brought up the Latin Regal names lasting until Theodosius III and ending with Leon the Syrian But Tiberius works too I guess lol, nice vid. Correlates with Haldon saying the Latin community in Thessaloniki disappeared during the same time, meanwhile late as Justinian II’s first reign Armenians could still go to Constantinople to learn Latin.
And smh no mention of the Taronites, the most long lived Byzantine Armenian origin family.
Right, Tornikii, how could I have forgot
*Why* did Tiberius survive as a name for so long though?
Something I've been quite surprised by, in all honesty.
@@jonathanwebster7091 There is actually a Saint Tiberius (martyr of Diocletian's persecution), which is probably the biggest contributing factor here
@@RomabooRamblings Ahh interesting, I didn't know that, thank you!
There are many Latin names that survive way past the 8th or even 11th century. Names like Adrianos, Maximos, Sergios, Markos and Antonios are still found 1400s and beyond Don't forget, that Constantine is also a Latin name.
Your video's are really helping me getting through most days mate, thanks.
Good Video!
Excellent research. Congrats!
Amazing video! I was waiting a long time for this one! Thank you! We need more great eastern Roman videos like yours.
A very interesting video, thank you!
Great and interesting video. Thank you from Nomadic Mongolia.
Dude, I am doing an investigative work about the rhomaioi culture. this is very valuable for my work, thank you!
This is my favorite channel about japanese history.
I really love when the Eastern Romans had Hellenised Latin names like Flavios, Tiberios and Ioustinianos.
Still common in Greece, Roman historian toldinstones had a podcast with Byzantinist Anthony Kaldellis, his birth name was Antonios, not a rare name today.
Today one can also find Marios, Iulia, Konstantinos, Iulianos, Valeria, Adrianos, Markos, Paulos, Iustinos and even Traianos.
@@Michael_the_Drunkard This shows that modern day Greeks are actually surviving Byzantines and a continuation of the Byzantines rather than ancient Greeks. The ancient Greek identity was imposed onto them during the Independence movement by the Western Europeans.
@@zippyparakeet1074 There were also public efforts by the government to get them to stop naming their kids Constantine, and offered classical Hellenic alternatives
Useful
Dude your time couldn't be better, you just released while I was playing CKII and yes another Eastern Roman run. This will be handy for all those bastards...
Are you a professional historian? This is some specialist stuff.
Nah, I just love reading stuff
As long as surnames go as you've mentioned Greeks in general used to give people of profane standing and power a surname since the Trojan years...for example Ajax the Tellamon(Άιας ο Τελλαμωνιος) mostly by profession or topography tho....after the frank occupation of 1204 even the last Greek used to have a surname either by profession,topography,Father's name or etc..anyway nice topic and information on your video congratz
Impressive
More video about the Eastern Roman Empire please
3:24 male mames in spanish
Jorge, Demetrio, Nicolás, Mauricio, Constantino, Basilio, Niceto (Aniceto)
3:46 Female:
Zoe, Helena (Elena), Sofía, Irene, Ágata, Pelagia y Natalia
Long-name guy isn't censored! \o/
Okay; so I've been doing some research into exactly *when* the nomen gentilicum 'Flavius' was dropped as a formal part of the names/titles of the Emperors.
We can say with absolute certainty, from several sources, that *all* of the Emperors of the Heraclian dynasty used it, and junior members of the dynasty (for example, David Tiberius) appear to have used it as well.
And I've found one reference (Franz Dölger, 'Byzantinische Diplomatik') to its usage by the Emperors as late as the reign of Leo VI, though I've not found any other references to that, so I'm not 100% sure.
I'd love to hear from anyone else more knowledgeable on the subject than myself.
Personally, the Heraclian dynasty being the last to use it kind of makes sense, as it's the dynasty where the Empire is largely reduced to Anatolia as a result of the Arab invasions; and as the Empire transforms from the legions to the theme system, we lose the old Roman-derived aristocracy and names, and the Empire becomes merit- rather than hereditary based, at least for a couple of hundred years.
And of course, the very last usages of 'Flavius' and 'Aurelius' as 'status' nomina is in the 600s in Egypt, around the time of the Arab invasions. Indeed, the very, very last example of any 'regular' Roman possessing a nomen at all is also in Africa; namely Julia Rogatiana, who died in 655AD in Volubis in Mauretania.
Even outside the formal boundaries of the Empire, we still see a lingering association of the name Flavius with imperial legitimacy, or at least, Catholicism, as the Lombard and Visigothic Kings both adopted it when they repudiated Arianism.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Byzantine_bureaucracy_and_aristocracy
Isaac Komnenos Angelos and his brother, Alexios Komnenos Angelos both using "Komnenos" reminded me of the earlier use of "Caesar"
Sad that the series end, happy it happened. Maybe as a spinoff you could look at onomastics of early Christianity in the Roman Empire
This is a really interesting part of Roman history that I was never aware of, thank you.
I do have a question, do you know if these roman naming practices influenced other naming conventions like the Iberian/Hispanic costume of multiple second names and surenames?
I only know that the Iberians used to have direct patronymics in place of family names (kind of like the Icelanders still have nowadays).
Modern Hispanic surnames come from the same idea of Greek surnames. They were either from a place, from a specific Lord or religious. Over time they morphed into the surname we have today with the interesting quirk of adding the maternal line to a newborn last name which is as you know EXTREMELY rare because most languages only keep the Paterlineal line. Also the "second" names of Hispanic origin were named either by Saints for protection or of relatives of the parents. You can get hilariously long names that could put Romans to shame if you start adding tons of grandparents, saints and what not.
I can't speak as much of iberia but I do know that Eastern Europe is heavily influenced by the Byzantine culture and that shows in the names with many names having Greco-Roman origins being incredibly common such as, Konstantin (Greek- Konstantinos, Latin- Constantine), Vasily (originated from Basil), Anastasia, Vitaly (Greek- Vitalios, Latin- Vitalis), Artyom (Artemios), Alexy (Alexios), Yevsey (Eusebios), Fyodor (Theodoros), Fyodora (Theodora), Irin (Irene), Evgeny (Eugenios), Dmitry (Demetrios) etc.
yo Portuguese dude here, great video, friend. By the way in portugal large names are not unheard of. my mother has 6 names for example. this happens at times, but not very frequently. the reasoning is that we portuguese use both the maternal name and the paternal name. in my case I have four names. 2 of my own and my mothers surname together with my fathers surname.
Dias is a very Romano-goth name it literally means day in portuguese and was the surname of a great Hispanic hero of Spain El-Cid, El campeador.
many people dont know but portuguese and spanish are the only Hispanic people. that means hispanic is a european term and the USA are mislabeling the Mexicans as hispanic. They had there chance, but they asked for independence, so they aren't hispanic anymore.
I literally have no fucking idea what you’re talking about but I’ve watched this whole series anyway
So; correct me if I'm wrong, but as regards the original tria nomina, first the praenomen fall out of use (due to the Constitutio Antonina, most people are just 'Marcus Aurelius _', so the praenomen becomes superfluous), then, a couple of hundred years later, the nomen falls out of use, so it's just the cognomen that's left from the 'classic' Tria nomina.
And it's only about 200 years after that, that surnames start coming into the picture?
At 3:51 you put Eireen for the English version of the name, but the English version is Irene. I'm sure you know this though because of the prominence of figures like Irene of Athens. Is there any specific reason why you chose to write it that way?
Anyone know where he's getting these background clips from? It all looks like really cool Eastern Roman movie footage which I can never find on CZcams
Fun fact: during the brief co-reign of Michael III and Basil I (before Basil I had Michael ahem...disposed of), as Mike Braudlin notes: "Michael had criticized the Latin language as a "barbarous and Scythian tongue" in a letter to Pope Nicholas I. The Pope's reply was that it was "ridiculous for the Emperors to call themselves Roman if they were ignorant of Latin" (quia ridiculum est vos apellare Romanorum imperatores et tamen linguam non nosse Romanam).
So, in their coin issues of 867, the co-Emperors issued coins with the legends in Latin, saying "Michael Imperator" and "Basilius Rex", as a kind of middle finger to the Pope.
This is the last, to my knowledge, use of the *Praenomen Imperatoris* of Imperator by any Eastern Roman Emperor.
As far as I know, anyway.
They kept on, of course, using 'Augustus' right up until 1453, although it was nearly always transliterated as 'Augoustos' or flat-out translated into 'Sebastos'.
Hasn't the validity of that letter been questioned though? I find it hard to believe he'd actually say that.
@@monetizedyay6827 Yes; I have my doubts as well.
Nonetheless, the coins certainly are genuine.
Which I find interesting for its use of Latin.
Meanwhile in mudhut village:
Siegfried son of Siegfried, Karl son of Siegfried, Ingrid daughter of Siegfried.
Best part is that to this day "son of x guy" remains as a last name for many with their parents actually having different names to it.
01:10 f: The vanishing of the senatorial class wasn't only due to the pestilence but due to the long term Gothic wars as well. Or as badly, I'd say.
Hello.I am enjoying your videos.Can you tell me is the Name Mariyan a Roman name?thank you for understanding.
Yes, it originates from Marianus.
@@theicepickthatkilledtrotsk658 OK but can you confirm this?Whit historical facts I mean.For example old or ancient texts,old or ancient documents,exetera.
One other thing I've noticed: when an Emperor accedes to the throne or to high office with a name that is considered unsuitable, they tend to adopt a new one that is more suitable.
So, we have Tarasis, son of Kodisa, becoming Flavius Zeno, we have Apsimar, who became instead Tiberius (III), Bardanes became instead Philippicus, Artemius added the name Anastasius to his birth name, becoming technically 'Artemius Anastasius', though he is known to history as Anastasius II, and Konon becomes instead Leo (III).
I've noticed this is particularly true for the twenty years anarchy, the period between the end of the Heraclian dynasty and the beginning of the Isaurian dynasty.
I've no idea why this seems to be so common, nor why the 'original' names would be unacceptable: none of the 'original' names seem to refer to pagan gods or anything else that might make them seem unacceptable, so I'm at a bit of a loss, although I've noticed a lot of them seem to be names of Isaurian, Armenian or Germanic origin, and thus (I guess?) might be considered 'barbarian', and hence unacceptable?
Also there's a heck of a lot of emperors and family members that add names after their name like Constantinus or Tiberius. Tiberius II and Maurice spring to mind off the top of my head.
Constantinus I can understand, as it's to honour Constantine the Great, but Tiberius? Apart from its association with the eponymous river I can't think of a reason, there's only the successor of Augustus that bore that name, and that was as a Praenomen, not a cognomen (although Claudius bore it as well). It just seems really odd that of all Roman names, it's *that* one that seems to last as long as, (or is revived) than any other.
One reason is that the Emperors you mentioned were not native Greek so changing their names to reflect the majority culture they rule would have been important. The name Tiberius was popular with the ruling Heraclian Dynasty. Heraclius' 3rd co-Emperor son David was renamed Tiberius before he was deposed and mutilated, Constans II youngest son (and co-Emperor) was Tiberius, and also Justinian II's boy Tiberius who was also associated with the throne.
So the Roman’s of the republic and early empire had their first name then their family name and then their honorary family name?
U know that cgp grey actually has a video on the name 'tiffany' and its not quite from theophoni
Roman Republic: Eoxinius Ien
Roman Empire: Eoxinium Ien
Byzantine Empire: Ien Eonsileus
My mother's family surname is Kyritses which is a Byzantine title of some sort of lower rank of something that I never really understood what...🤷♂️
Anyway, amazing video!
You know, i find it funny that names that came from Greek are more common than names that came from Latin.
That's because how involved with early Christianity Greek (and so Greek speaking people) was. Most early saints even in West Europe were Greek.
@@thibautnarme6402 Yeah, you're right. And all of this happend as a result of Alexander the Great's conquests across Asia
I can't wait for you to get to 100k and I can say I've been following you forever
Greek names now: peepeepoopoopapalogos 😂😂😂
weren't most senators powerful holders of bishoprics throughout western Europe?
Plus, weren't the majority of Occitani feudal lords majority Roman senators?
Explore Golgumbaz with Guide Jahangir, South India 🇮🇳
Damn, if Russia would have been recognized as the new Rome after the Fall of Constantinople, sure we would have had even a roman Emperor called Takahashi 🤣🤣🤣
Interesting
8:48 Tornikes ? So he must be Georgian ?
@Romaboo Ramblings Your approach to dismiss the Roman Tria Nomina and most of all the Nomen (the family name) is extremely simplistic and do not take into account many important factors:
1. Barbarization of the imperial power - from 717 AD the Roman state is in the hands of the barbarian Isaurian dynasty. The Isaurians were barely Romanized and it's a miracle that they even used Greco-Roman names at all. They unleashed their simplification and tried to even simplified the Nicean Orthodox Christianity - a compromise with the Roman - Greek and Latin religious practices and Romanitas/Ρωμηοσύνη concept in a time when the paganism was still alive in both Greece and Italy and hold away many Greeks and Latins/Romance people there who prefer the protection of immigrant northern warlords instead of the Roman authority, even if they could make a compromise and accept the Orthodoxy (eventually happened). The barbarian emperors from this dynasty and the following Amorian dynasty (of gypsy origin and culture) used only one name because this was their custom. This changed the fashion of the imperial administration, but this does not mean that the old Nomina (family names) were forgotten. That's why when the rule of the barbarian emperors "magically" the concepts for the Nomen (family name) returns with the speed of light and again the Tria Nomina system is restored with few modifications. But why modifications?
2. Christian influence - in the Christian tradition the father's name is even more important than the family name. Under this influence the Tria Nomina start to include the name of the father (or the nickname of the person) as Cognomen. This means that the Tria Nomina consisted of: Prenomen (personal name) Nomen (family name) Cognomen (father's name or nickname or both) Adnomen (second family name)
So, the only difference from the Republican Roman name after the Macedonian Restoration was that the name of the father became more important because of the Christian influence. Apart from them the concept remain the same which tells you that it was not "reinvented", but restored. True, the old Latin Nomina were gone, but even in the Dominate many family names from the Principate were gone, because these families simply died out. After so many plagues and historical time it's not wonder that even in the old Rome, where the people continued to speak Romanesco Romance Language the old Patricii families and their names were no more.
What was the footage from
check the description
@@RomabooRamblings thanks
What was the byzantine version of Victor
Nikephoras
@@RomabooRamblings thank you
Nikephoros (Victory-Bringer)
Dorothea the traveller
Muy name in greek is Ansgarios Ioannes
So is this the reason Latinos have many names as well?
🏹🏛🦅⚔️🛡👍
Byzantium will rise again, jesus will return to the east in triumph,marana tha!
You don't need to try that hard to pronounce greek stuff you are just making it harder to understand
Fascinating exploration. You almost certainly know this already but for those who don't; names that contain the root "theos" (e.g. Theophrastos, Theodoros, Theopompos, Timotheos, Dorothea, etc) or that refer to a specific deity (e.g. Apollonios, Dionysios, Demetrios, Diogenes, Diocles, Zenon, Heron, Athenagoras, Apollodoros, Isidoros, Heliodoros, Christophoros etc) are known as "theophoric" and some were popular even before the rise of Christianity (obviously I don't mean explicitly Christian ones like Christopher or Christodoulos). Some of the biblical Hebrew names, including John(Yonahan), were also theophoric originally by referencing either the word "El" (Micha-el, Emmanuel, etc) or Yahweh (e.g. Mati-yahu AKA Matthew , Joseph , John etc...)
Edit: I forgot to mention the most theophoric name of all, Herakleios(or -ius in Latin) refering to Herakles, which is itself a reference to Hera, making it something of a theo-cluster-name I guess.
Cool, thanks.
What about Indus, Hindus?
They have come and gone... Hindu`s still live.