Who Is The THIRD-BEST Spinner In The History of Cricket After Shane Warne & Murali?🤔|Bumble & Kimber
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- čas přidán 12. 09. 2024
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talkSPORT reporter and presenter Sam Ellard sits down with former England cricket player, umpire, coach and commentator David 'Bumble' Lloyd and cricket writer Jarrod Kimber to discuss all things cricket.
In today's episode, Bumble and Kimber discuss who is the third-best spinner in the history of cricket after Shane Warne and Murali and who is the most underrated spinner of all time.
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Kumble all the way !!!!! Not much turn . But enough both ways and that top spin of Kumble was just wow . Fantastic bowler. With DRS could have got a lot more .
It's absolutely Anil Kumble. There's no other option.
Kumble got a 10-fer, got wickets before VAR, hundreds of test wickets... no question!
David's two sixes off Murali were gorgeous shots, all technique and timing. Impressive.
Kumble would have had atleast 100 more wickets to his name if he played today with DRS. I lost count the number of times he hit the pad first and the bat in front of wicket and the batsman got benefit of doubt from the umpire.
That argument applies to Warne and Murali as well. So they would also have 100 more wickets I guess.
Would apply much less to a turning leg spinner. So far fewer to Warne
Specially Steve Buckner
Kumble performance in overseas is the best I have seen
@@pratikpande87The argument is for the 3rd best bowler and hence doesn't apply to Warnie or Murali.
Herath makes a compelling case, incredibly consistent and single-handedly won quite a number of matches for SL, adapted his game really well in foreign conditions where he played more of a holding role but could pounce any time turn was offered.
Loved Herath
@@scottiep74Anil Kumble was the third best. His record was phenomenal and unlike other Asian spinners he took wickets in Australia, SA etc.
If people knew how Herath was able to fill in for Murali and win matches single handedly for Sri Lanka, people might have different opinions of who the best is apart from the two goats. He was able to be the leading wicket taker from left arm spinners and to date his record stands tall.
Yes
Herath doesn't have the average nor the strike rate of Ashwin.
Also won the 2014 t20 wc...what a bowler.
Who is herath
Only in srilanka though
Has to be Ashwin. Dude is the only one in modern era who is taking similar wickets/matches like Murali and Warne. SENA record held against him but doesn't really get chances to adjust that record because of Jadeja and teams preparing pitches to negate his bowling.
Look at home vs away
He depends on rank turners and gets dropped outside Asia ( and west indies). Even Indian team doesn't rate him
@@russhouldin5774 Ashwin avg. 30.4 away from home. Kumble, Saqlain avg. 29.5, Herath 28, Lyon avg. 30.2, Bhajji avg. 32 all career avg. So at his worst his record is comparable
@@mayankdewli1010 He's the best bowler of the generation in terms of wickets and avg. He's won matches in every country except South Africa. Only issue is born in same era as Jadeja. He's better than Kumble and Bhajji were
Well in India they prepared pitches that make him great. Other than that period when Kohli was captain the pitches were horrible
Astonishing that Laker doesn't even get mentioned
Agree with this. Staggering.
@@ryuhayabaker I will always say that 19/90 is the single greatest achievement in the entire sport of cricket. It's on par with Usain Bolt's 9.58 in the 100m or Michael Phelps's 8 golds in Beijing or Messi's 91 goals in a calendar year.
Laker was the greatest spinner with the possible exception of O'Reilly. It's the recency effect that plagues all of these internet based channels. Us old fogies are swamped by people with no knowledge of history but more adept with software. What I find a bit distressing are Bumble's and Kimber's lack of perspective. Bumble played in the 60s and 70s and Kimber wrote a book on the history of test cricket. I love him as personality but Bumble wasnt that good as a bat (surprisiingly he was a better left arm spinner than, say, Hartley, but never bowled for England). He never faced Laker but would have faced Titmus and Allen, who could both flight the ball. I cant find his record against them but with a First Class average of 33 he probably didnt do too well. I saw a video in which he was discussing Laker's 19/90 and ,incredibly, said he thought modern bats would have fared better because they sweep more. Laker didnt bowl anything on leg so they would have to lap him. If they'd tried lapping on that pitch the scores would have been even lower. However, Lock would almost certainly have taken more than one wicket. Kimber has no excuse.
@@siamesevodka 19 wickets in the greatest single achievement but
Bradman's 99.96 average is a career GOAT achievement
I thought la lakers
We forget Lance Gibbs who was the first spinner to take 300 wickets.
Gibbs was a great bowler. Much better than all of the others mentioned here (except for Laker). None of the bowlers after Gibbs knew how to flight the ball (except for Bedi).
Daniel Vettori is the underrated spin bowler I guess had economical spells in new Zealand conditions and decent record in Asia and english and Australian conditions handy batter as well captained nz for a long time but I guess got overshadowed by Murali Warne and kumble in that era another new Zealand player who got under the radar quietly
What a lovely action he had...and a handy batsman too
Dude he was just a regular bowler. Good guy, a fighter but come on. He doesn’t even show up on the top 10 list.
Dan could give the ball a rip the ball early in his career and then after his back injuries he was a flight and arm ball spinner. Totally underrated. Always picked and played in NZ which isn’t always the case for spinners in NZ teams due to the conditions. The fact he was able to be picked even on green tops… seriously underrated.
All true, but he's not a top 20 all time spinner when Kumble, Qadir, Bedi, Valentine, Michael Vaughan, Gibbs, Swann exist
@@sportbilly2008 the reason Dan played as long as he did was because he was an all rounder. 6 test centuries and 20+ fifties. He was barely a top 4 bowler for NZ and would have never had the career he did without his batting. His blowing was accurate but no way a wicket taker
Kumble took 600+ in tests and 300+ in ODIs with very little turn.
I can’t believe there’s no mention of Saqlain Mushtaq! The funniest part is that when Saqlain was playing, he was more lethal than Warne and Murali. Just check the records for yourself. He was the fastest spinner to reach 50, 100, 150, and 200 wickets, and the only one bowling at the death in ODIs. It’s baffling that Jarrod Kimber hasn’t mentioned him even once. I’m sure Kimber completely forgot about Saqlain and would regret it once it’s brought to his attention.
Anil Kumble has to be the best spinner after Murali and Warne
Reasons
The batters during Kumble era were far more capable of handling the spin in subcontinent than today's batters.
Kumble after his 2001 injury started making impact outside Asia in a very significant way.
Kumble has a very good record the best team of his generation that is Australia
Ashwin has very good numbers, but his omission for a less skillful Jadeja outside Asia tells a lot about his all-round ability as a bowler
Ashwin has bowled well outside Asia in patches. But there is not a single test for him in Eng, Aus, South Africa and NZ where he can say that he has had a major role in the win. Kumble has Headingly 2002 and Sydney 2004 and many such matches
He got out Brian Lara at Antigua on a pitch where 5 or 6 players got 100s , if anyone knows Brian Lara loves Antigua .Kumble was also injured in that match , the press were calling him the mummy.
The idea of Herath at the bank throwing shade at the world's best spinners for a decade was hilarious. Mac'gill suffered from being an attacking leg spinner around the same time as the world's best in his own country, but their records in the same test show mac'gill often outbowled him so that's an interesting stat. it is only 8 wkts, but the average is striking 22 Vs 29. The strike rate is 41 vs 56 too which was huge.
Objectively, Murali is THE best spinner to have ever played the game, as proven not only by his superior average, strike rate, 5 wicket hauls and higher number of wickets taken despite playing fewer matches but also the fact that he was almost as lethal in ODIs as he was in tests. Warne's ODI career was just above average at best.
Number of overs is actually significantly higher for Murali than Warne. It's not really objectively.
@@zawadsadaf9194 Which only demonstrates how much more impactful Murali was for his team, and his superior strike rate, average and economy rate (in both tests and ODIs) demonstrate that he picked wickets more frequently while giving away fewer runs.
In just about every way, Muralitharan was simply the better bowler.
Murali got a lot of wickets against Zimbabwe and early years Bangladesh though. Sri Lankan wickets also favour spin more than any other country, certainly more than Australia
@@peterredding468 Even if you disregard all the matches played against Zimbabwe and Bangladesh, Murali still has a superior average (24.83) compared to Warne (25.40) and more 5 wicket and 10 wicket hauls (49 5WI and 16 10WI whereas Warne has 36 5WI and 10 10WI). Besides, Warne played a lot of matches against England, who traditionally have been weak against spin. In fact, Murali averages 15.5 against England and has picked up 8 5 wicket hauls against them in only 11 matches. On the other hand, Warne averages 22 against England and has picked up 11 5 wicket hauls against them but has played considerably more matches against them (36).
Unless you cherrypick their stats with the deliberate intent of making Warne look better, Murali simply was the best bowler and he was almost equally lethal with the red ball as well as white ball whereas Warne's white ball career was good but nothing special. Warne was the better batter, captain and all rounder but purely as a bowler, Murali was significantly better.
@@sundarsubramaniam7274murli played on srilankan rank turners while warne produced magical deliveries in eng and australia. Stats are not everything.
If you compare stats thilan samarveera is better than mark waugh laxman and Ganguly
Swann would’ve taken double the amount of Test wickets if Fletcher would’ve put personality to the side and picked him for England.
Swann is my one of the favourite bowlers to watch. Smooth and beautiful action , cool and calm and always threatening.
For the last question, the answer has to be Saqlain Mushtaq. I remember watching him in the late 90s, he was a genius bowler with excellent control over his off-spin and doosra. He massively underachieved in tests - should have done a lot lot better.
Harbhajan is underrated as well, he bowled in an era when the pitches in the sub-continent were notoriously flat.
@@karthikpatra Ajmal vs Mushtaq?
Saqlain probably GOAT in white ball. But didn't play enough tests if you ask me
@@siddharthreddiar3353 Saqlain bowled with a straight arm and Ajmal's 38-40 deg bend is almost 3 times the allowed limit. He shouldn't be considered alongside Saqlain or Harbhajan or anyone else for that matter.
@@karthikpatra I mean he ended up chucking but I'm not 100% sure he was doing it at the beginning, his action just got corrupted over time like Narine, Mendis.
@@siddharthreddiar3353 maybe, maybe not but his arm-bend angle was really really high.
I generally agreed with the comments, but Bishan Bedi, Prasanna (best off spinner according to Ian Chappell), and Subhash Gupte (best leg spinner according to Sir Garfield Sobers). You often can't just go by stats. You also have to look at quality of batting, especially against spin, during their time.
Sht up u idiot
Stats are the only objective measure we have (will stand up to a Gage R&R test). Any non-statistical assessment, will by definition, be subjective.
Ashwin for me. Amazing stats in tests. Kumble was great too, so was Herath. Ashwin and Herath were better at home but Kumble was better away from home.
Ashwin not even good at home unless its a rank turner
Saqlain by far. And im not even Pakistani. He literally invented a delivery. And made simple, casual off spin, lethal.
Another story of giberish of why Pakistanis are better than rest of the world.Bake me a Cake.
Good shout. Not that I agree with the answer but still, good shout.
He was excellent but it’s hard to compare him with modern offspinners when the doosra has essentially become illegal. Saqlain invented the doosra.
I think they r talking about test cricket here, Saqlain was as a far better odi spinner than a test spinner. His average in odi's is ridiculous.
Ramesh powar>>>Saqlain😂😂
Ashwin and Herath have a fair shout for #3, but to not even include Saqlain or Harbhajan in the conversation seems a bit myopic. 🤷🏽♂️
Kumble imo, he got more away scalps than any other Asian spinner.
Murali is not Asian?
@@srashtars away scalps is the keyword here
Ash, jaddu, lyon great spinners of this generation earlier warne, kumble & murali r great match winners
Ash jaddu only effective on rank turners
@@mayankdewli1010jaddu has a good bowling average in Australia and SA, even in england it's ok but the issue has always been that both have been underutilised in SENA countries.
@@sumbdithey have been underutilized because they don't have the skills. They depend on bad pitches. They are not proper classical spinners who can't turn the ball on any pitch.
@@sumbdiyou think you're smarter than kohli and Rohit ? They both don't rate Ashwin on sena pitches which is why he gets dropped often
@@mayankdewli1010 thats not the reason, don't just blindly go by stats,when it comes to playing in SENA countries indian team management goes with the thinking of playing with 4 fast bowlers and one spinner bcz of which prior to 2020 ashwin used to play and jadega used to sit out post 2020 its the other way around.
Bro he was the main reason why we did well in Australia in 2020-21 BGT series where he dismissed smith thrice with his skills and literally out smarted him in that series, post that he did well on a green top pitch in WTC finals where he picked 4 wickets and almost got rid of Williamson in 2nd innings as well, after that match he played one county match in england where he picked 6 wickets to get ready for India england test series.
Even after performing in those test matches he didn't get a opportunity to play a single test in england, and VK, shastri keep giving some odd reasons for not picking him
In WTC finals on that oval pitch which was tailor made for ashwin out of nowhere Umesh was picked,I can bet on it if ashwin would have played Travis head wouldn't have scored that 160 runs bcz of his superior record against LHB,
Now u say is it ashwin fault???? Or team management thinking???
Irrespective of the conditions lyon is always picked in the playing 11 and he bowls maximum overs as well that's not the way ashwin or jadeja is used.
In SENA countries asian bowlers have to bowl good amount of overs to settle in, and if ashwin gets dropped after playing one odd test matches how can he get into that rhythm????
Pretty good podcast love both jarrod and bumble,this one was so nerdy
When he retires, Kuldeep will likely be talked about as one of the best leg spinners ever. But I agree with Jarrod about Ashwon being the 3rd best spinner of all time. As a guy in his mid-30s who grew up watching Kumble, he has a special place in my heart but I still think Ashwin is a better bowler than Kumble and even Kumble says that so there's that.
@@Navin4061 he’s close to 30 and barely plays red ball. Phoonkna band kar aur jaake so jaa.
Kuldeep isn't even picked for the Test team regularly
Kuldeep is not a leg spinner, he is a wrist spinner, or some people say chinaman i dont know what that means tbh.
@legendkiller4481 chinaman means left handed offspinner. Also Kuldeep is a Leg spinner as well as a wrist spinner. Almost all leg spinner are wrist spinners. I feel Abrar Ul Haq from Pakistan might be an exception
@@Warlock786chinaman is left handed wrist spinner and it's an term that is based on an outdated racial stereotype that the Chinese are deceitful. We should stop using it like Wisden and Cricinfo have. Left arm wrist spin is a much better description of the bowling action.
Thank you Jarrod and Bumble, that someone mentioned Herath. My fav spinner all time. I know Warne and Murali are greats- respect to them as well, but they got good sides with support bowlers as well. Whereas Rangana in his latter part of his career had maybe 1 or none good supporting bowlers, and he had to take wicket after wicket anywhere he went, literally like a trustable bank.
The 3rd best spinner is Ashwin by a large margin. One of very few bowlers who average more than 5 wickets per match. Wickets per match, total wickets, match winning performances, intimidation, eye test - he has it all at all levels. Kumble next. One spinner who wasn't mentioned but needs to be is Lance Gibbs. Gibbs, at retirement, held the record for most test wickets taken. In the 1st half to 2/3 of his career - he was incredibly difficult to score off. Very tall, huge hands, incredibly accurate. Grimmett also fits this mold. Also held record for most wickets captured despite entering test Cricket very late.
ASHWIN doesn't come close
Ashwin is not even in top 10 for me.
Indian standards are very low
@KenwayHay Indians standards are low simply because of the rank turner's they make. Lose the rank turner's snd their current spin stock isn't that great
@@KenwayHayLOL THEN ANDER-BROAD PERFORMED ONN WNGLISH GREEN PITCH AND OVERCAST CONDITIONS.
@@Warlock786LOL THEN ANDER-BROAD PERFORMED ONN WNGLISH GREEN PITCH AND OVERCAST CONDITIONS.
Muttiah Muralitharan. He was a one man bowling attack. Warm had a superior pace attack to support him as well as possibly the best fielders around!!! Just coz he looked like Hollywood, but the stats show Murali up on everything!!!
murali bowled on ragging surfaces made specifically for him while warne thrived in all conditions and was immensely clutch ( motm in semi and final in 1999 wc)
I was really surprised that no one discussed Greame Swann! One of the best off spinners from England.
I saw Mushtaq Ahmed out bowl Shane Warne on the SCG in the mid 90s, winning the test for Pakistan. My goodness he was good.
Not one mention of Derek Underwood 😱
Some great shouts but surely Saqlain has to be mentioned as well? So much variation and such an innovative spinner
Clarrie Grimmet, born in NZ, test matches for Aus. Look at his record. Sydney Barnes, one of the best bowlers ever...
Sydney Barnes was more of a medium pacer who bowled massive cutters. Not really a spinner
In my view Chandra Prasanna n Bedi were the first three best spinners followed by Warne, Muralidharan Kumble .....
Warne all the way long greatest ever .. Born on fast bouncy wickets and still went on to have a great career...
Am surprised i didn't hear them mentioning saqlain mushtaq .. What a bowler he was...i think he held the record of fastest 100 fastest 200 wickets or something in odi or multiple formats
7:15:
Jarrod: I became leg spinner because my dad pulled me over to the side and he said, "look Jarrod, you are really slow, this isn't going to work out for you".
Me: Are you sure your dad was talking about your bowling speed?
What
Ashwin hasnt taken a 5wkt haul in SENA countries.
Anil kumble has 5 wkt hauls outside Asia and West Indies.
Ashwin has far better average and strike rate than Kumble...
That too in a generation where nostalgia merchants claim is easier for batting...
So Ashwin and Jadeja for that matter even Axar is better than Kumble...
If else to have an opposing opinion,I think 1st we have to establish the current gernation is more easier to ball and batting is more difficult in test now...If so then we could have a claim for Kumble being on par with Ashwin
@@AlenBenny-q8tAshwin takes wickets in rank turners while kumble took wickets in batting pitches
@@swarnavabanerjee4112 If that is the case,then what Im saying is that when we compare batsmen in Test we have to counter the fact that 2000s batsmen like Sachin Dravid Inzamam Younis Ponting Sangakkara lara had a huge advantage to boost their stats by stats padding...
Modern test average of 40 should be considered on equal with 50 in past...
For eg.Root and Kohl who averages 49 should be considered on par with a batsman averaging 59 in past era...
Or Dravids average of 52 must be considered on par with Pujaras average of 42...
But I don't see that happening...
(btw I agree the fact that Ashwin bowled in rank turners and Kumble in flat tracks...Still Ashwin is better)
It's the obsession of 5 fer and Hundred 😂😂bro he got soo many 4fer in aus, SA, Eng but surely u will not count that
@@snehalkhatri9357
kukdeep Yadav has 5wkt haul in Sydney .
Jadeja has 5wkt haul in Durban.
Ashwin doesnt have one outside Asia and westIndies.
As an Indian I feel it should be Saqlain, he had a very clean action with humongous variety with the batters of the time having no clue.
Oldies will say Bishen Singh too.
Kumble is the 3rd best spinner of all time. Period.
I don't feel Anil Kumble gets his due as how great a bowler he was.
Incredibly underrated. Yes Murali and Warne were better but Kumble was excellent.
I remember when he hurt himself in the West Indies and still bowled with a bandage on his head.
Despite being of Pakistani ethnicity he often bowled well against Pakistan. I remember when Saeed Anwar scored 194 and punished him with 3 sixes I was shocked as it rarely happened to Anil.
He was a great bowler who I feel doesn't get his due.
Abdul Qadir, Saqlain, Ajmal, Yasir Shah - What awesome spinners Pakistan has produced.
Shahid Afridi as a leg spinner is quite underrated.
@muhammadasad729 agreed. But unfortunately he never really focused on anything and hence remained an underachiever.
qadir and saqlain were excellent. So was mushtaq ahmed. But yasir shah has been below average for most of his career. And ajmal was ineffective once his bent arm was proved.
@anon3444 Ajmal didn't play much h after he came back from the ban. Fact is Murli did the exact same thing but things were stricter at Ajmals time. Yasir Shah below average for most of his career ? Fastest to 150 and 200 test wickets bro. What you on about ? Lol
@@Warlock786 Yea but that's because in Murali's case, his action was called by the umpires and then cleared by the ICC. In the case of ajmal, the action was not cleared by the ICC, hence he didn't play. He did make correction and came back, but then ICC discovered he used his old action in crunch situations. So he was banned again.
Perhaps you're right about yasir shah, he was good for a long time. He just had a bad phase at the end, after which he was dropped.
Rangana Herath is the third-best Spinner In The History of Cricket period. there is a small possibility that we can have someone like Shane Warne in the feature (he is a classic right-arm leg spin bowler after all who has the natural big turn due to the action ) but we will never have another murali. his arm is a genetic marvel. Man Calling ashivin the 3rd best spiner is an insult to cricket itself haha.
Dont forgot Best test left arm bowler of all time = Rangana Herath
Lmao he was trash outside sri lanka
Total trash.
@@saurabhb1041 I dont know but Kumar Sangakkara has said that He was lucky to play with Herath
@@GK-nq3co I dont know but Kumar Sangakkara has said that He was lucky to play with Herath
@@user-ut8mp8ex7x he’s a colleague what do you think he’s suppose to say. Herath was an average cricketer.
New age kuldeep is good. But its a shame ge gets so less chances
Has to be the King of Spain Ashley Giles 😂
Who spun two balls in his entire life!
King of pain 😂
With DRS -- Shane - 1250; Murali - 1350; Kumble - 1450 (and I may be conservative here)!!
Dont the same people claim that with DRS Sachin would have 200 centuries,Ponting would have 150 centuries???
Going by your logic that DRS would help bowlers get 2X more wicets,Can we assume that batsmen who played in DRS generation like Kohli would have had 30,000 ODI runs and 20,000 Test runs?
Dont the same people claim that with DRS Sachin would have 200 centuries,Ponting would have 150 centuries???
Going by your logic that DRS would help bowlers get 2X more wicets,Can we assume that batsmen who played in non DRS generation would have had half the runs which they scored in last gernation...
For eg Sachin would have had 9000 ODI runs and 24 ODI Centuries.7000 Test runs nad 25 Test centuries
2000s batsmen were so lucky that they could skip DRS
@@AlenBenny-q8t Yeah, as far as the batsman are concerned, I would agree!! Maybe not half, but definitely way low.
Got to be Kumble - not a huge turner of the ball and a master of his art. 600+ test wickets
Anything other than Kumble is absolutely delirious ngl
I don't think Hedley Verity was mentioned.
I think the argument is somewhere between O’Reilly, Grimmet, Kumble and Ashwin. Those are probably the next four in the pantheon for me.
Kumble is third best
I think Yasir Shah deserves a mention. I mean fastest to 150, 200, 250 wickets. Cant beat that.
Ashwin is given turning wickets in India and his overseas record is not good. Kumble always steps in difficult situations and have produced brilliant spells. It could be either Kumble or Herath or Vettori
Not even a contest, Herath is the 3rd GOAT of Spin 💥
Ravi Ashwin - no one come close
No way. Doesn’t even get in the India team the majority of the time overseas
@@peterredding468 That tells you the depth Indian cricket has at the moment. If skill sets, mindset, and aggression are the parameters, then Ravi Ashwin is the unmatched contender. He has match-winning spells across the globe. If he doesn't get into the playing XI, that's largely because of the combination and not because he is not worthy of it. Ravindra Jadeja edges past him because of his batting, or else he would have played 150 Tests by now and shattered 700 Test wickets record for sure. A spinner's ability is counted when he stands up for his team and helps them win Test matches - 5 wicket hauls and 10 wicket hauls are just distractions. Has he contributed to India becoming unbeatable in Asia, West Indies, and Australia? The answer is yes. The closest to Ashwin are Nathan Lyon and Graeme Swann, largely because of their mindset to win, and never play for a draw. They play poker on a cricket field, ready to take risks and reap rewards. I don't know what your criterion is, because if you ignore an average of over 5 wickets per Test for 13 years, despite being left out on many occasions, that's mental fortitude for me, and that's exactly where Ashwin edges over the rest of his contemporaries.
That’s a laughable answer
@@an7440 Oh really! Why don't you give me a logical answer? I am patiently waiting. And then will decide whether to laugh at yours or not.
You’re having a laugh.
Good for a debate...impossible to arrive on a single name without difference of opinion. Kumble, Harbhajan, Ashwin, Swan n Saqlain all come in to the pic. Kumble had the greatest resolve...Saqlain had great mysteries. Ashwin n Swan had bit of both... Harbhajan troubled the greatest of batters 😅
Danish Kaneria hardly played any games for pakistan, in their worst era, with a wk who couldn't catch. He is still the spinner with the highest test wickets for Pakistan (3rd highest overall). He bowled on batting paradise as a stock bowler with mediocre bowlers ruining his average. Exceptional legspinners and googly and his county average and Sr in pak and England was incredible.
Kumble, Ashwin, Lyon, Herath or MacGill (would have been one of the best leg spinners in the world if he hadn't spent his entire career in Warnes shadow)
Honorable mentions, Jadeja, Swann, Mushtaq Ahmed, Harbhajan Singh.
Subash gupte could have been one of the greatest spinner of all time but a betray by his teammate didn't let him. ( sir gary sobers consider him the best spinner of all time even better than shane warne)
Sachin was the most under-rated spinner. He could have double the wickets in case he worked hard on his bowling.
Common man! He is not even in top 50, although a decent part time bower
he was trash, a pie-chucker in the true sense. I remember how often he would be bowling short filth and would get smacked. Sehwag was probably a better spinner than him.
@@20shourya As per Sehwag himself, offspinners are not bowlers at all!!
He was trash
Murali is the greatest spinner of all time
Saqlain, Swann and Dan Vettori are honourable mentions
Well I agree with you all most of the times but my 3 best spinners are, s warne,mutiah mulithian and Lance Gibbs or sonny Ramadin ,that's just my view, viewer from trinidad
I Remember Mason Crane troubling Mighty ABD in a blast game. Eng didn't really invest in Crane though, he is good.
Graeme Swann is probably the best conventional off spinner. The guy gave it a good rip. And his record speaks for itself
Tim May. Just because he was my favorite bowler and why I wanted to bowl spin.
In the 60's and 70's India had BS Chandrashekhar. Took 242 wickets. Perhaps, you might like to listen in on what Viv had to say about Chandra. Leg spin in India wasn't dead contrary to what Jarrodbhai believes.
Can't believe Lyon isn't in this conversation, I know he leaks runs but he attacks opposition, takes risks normally others wouldn't. Brilliant record in Australia
My argument against lyon or ashwin is this is weak era of test batting for eg when harbhajan had to bowl he had to bowl to 2 other sub continent great teams sril lanka and pak. They had inzi younus yousuf srilanka had jaywardena sanga samraweera . Australia had ponting martyn or clark waughs hussy sa had kallis amla prince . Hell even west indies had lara chandrapaul and sharwan. England had bell pieterson collingwood. Look at their averages and the current lot. The former most of them had averages over 45 close to 50. These days i dont even remember any player from sl pak west indies or even south africa middle order properly. Only nz had better test players now than in early 2000.
murli had an unfair advantage..shane warned was the greatest spinner
Warne was a cheat. He was actually caught using drugs and banned from the World Cup tournament. If he had been Asian he would have been banned for life
It’s not unfair to naturally have a body that suits a certain skill
Shane had an unfair advantage with dope.
Stuart McGill
i second McGill, If there was no Warne he would have 500+ test wickets
Gary sobers ,once said that
Subash Gupte(played in 1960s) was better than Warne.
E Prasamna also praised Gupte.,who could turn the ball big
No mention of Stuart MacGill. Australia rarely missed Warne when he was out of the side because MacGill was such a good substitute.
I was Shocked to see has close to 200 Test wickets mate 😅
@@drprathamprakash1408 Even Kaneria has hundreds of test wickets...it's not the only judge of quality.
@@KaiXx751 Well it would be about the time he played, it directly coincided by the prime of Warne!! For Warnie not to be banned after doing stupid things, we wouldn't have seen McGill
Totally agree about Ashwin. Ashwin is the greatest spinner India has ever produced. The numbers speak for themselves. He would be picked ahead of any other spinner because of his bowling varieties; his cricket brain and also remarkably his abilities as a batsman. Ashwin helped India win down under and has bagged a huge haul of wickets at home. Kumble was also a magnificent bowler for India but I would expect Ashwin to surpass his 619 wickets provided he doesn't lose love for the test game.
Saqlain or kumble. One invented a delivery and other one wasn't a traditional spinner with much lesser turn than any other and to have such high wickets
All three of them agreeing on Murali being the second best was surprising too me.
Has to be Saqlain. Check Murali's interview on Saqlain where he says Saqlain is one of the main reasons for murali getting from 100 to 700 wickets.
Indian friends talk about Kumble and Harbhajan and Ashwin, but I personally feel Kuldeep Yadav if given proper chances/grooming will emerge as the best spinner to emerge out of India. Haven't seen a better Indian spinner and IMHO currently by far the best spinner in the world
How come they forget about Saqlain Mushtaq ,who completely change the art of off spin bowling
3:03 Nostalgia bias? Ashwin is taller than Kumble
Yes Ashwin is an inch taller than Kumble
@@dinkin_flicka14 yeah.. but Kumble certainly ain’t 6’6😂
BS
The tall wasn't the main emphasis, the tall wrist spinner was more so the emphasis.
I think it was mainly about how high his bowling action was..Despite being an Inch shorter to Ash, his deliveries certainly came around 5-6 inches higher to Ashwin 😂
No mention of Stuart MacGill or Daniel Vettori even in the shortlist?...
😂😂😂
Daniel Vettori is another one who always played on green tops
Subash Gupte, Saqlain Mushtaq, Bedi, Prasanna, Yasir Shah, Ashwin, Jadeja
Tells a lot about your weird cricketing knowledge.
Yashir shah? 😂.
Just listing old names like Gupte and Prasanna doesn't mean you know what you're talking about.
Qadir and Underwood were both better than those two.
Ashwin depends on rank turners
@@JackBarrBaxterjust talking shit about names you dont know also doesnt mean you know what you are talking about. Derek Underwoood was a fast spinner. Real art of spin is in putting body behind the ball and deceiving batters in the area. Not extracting support from the surface.
Little Tubby Chap...the most bumble quote ever maybe
Aesthetics are for those who watch the game from the sidelines. It's always the numbers that must decide the greatness of any player, a spinner in this context. Sure, I would pay to watch Abdul Qadir bowl, but I would put my money on Anil Kumble to win matches for me. I bet Bumble would pick Anil Kumble ahead of Qadir if he was a captain.
I am surprised Lyon and Swann weren't discussed!
Lyon is by far the best off spinner of current era, no one evens come close
Saqlain didn't even get a mention! Saeed Ajmal and Chandrashekar were also right up there!!
……..saeed ajmal hardly took another wicket after they stopped him chucking.
Saqlain was phenomenal. Great bowler
Rahul Dravid would milk Riyan Ahmed for 150 runs every innings
No mention of Vettori, Prasanna or Gibbs as even underatted is a tad baffling
@@subhasisbharali303 Prasanna not as rated as Bedi or Chandresheka in his era. Gibbs could have had a shout as he was the main spinner in his era but his record isn't inspiring. Vettori if Left handers only
What a comedy Abdul Kadhir Above Anil Kumble.. you can be partial but it's so much...
Saqlain by a country mile. He was genius of the rarest kind.
Guys, get focus right on bumble's camera. It's focusing on the book shelf
Has to be Ashwin. His away record since 2018 has been pretty solid
Nope. Not really. That's why he gets dropped
@@mayankdewli1010dropped???bro he hardly gets opportunities to play in SENA countries even after 2018 drop hona toh door ki baat hai
@@mayankdewli1010 Lol watch his performances in Centurion 2018, Edgbaston 2018, Adelaide 2018, Melbourne & Adelaide 2020, Southampton 2021.
He’s just been unlucky with injuries and the balance of the team overseas requires a 4th seamer, so Jadeja gets picked ahead of him for his batting.
@@farmansiddiqui9279yeah you're going to have a few good games if you play for over 15 years. Even kuldeep has a 6fer in Sydney and he hardly ever gets a chance. Rohit kohli don't rate him in sena countries...they pick guys like thakur Umesh over Ashwin 😂
Don't underestimate Kumble anyone... Fighter
Kumble never had issues with chucking(murali) or doping(warne). He is the actual goat spinner.
The question should be reframed as follows: Who is the third best spinner capable of taking wickets of Sachin, Lara or VVS Laxman in a single match?
Can't believe they just skipped SAQLAIN . He was a nightmare for so many teams.
No.1 murlidharan no. 2 tied with atleast 4 spinners
Deadly in the conversation
Bill O'Reilly is #1. He played longer than Warne and had a better record overall. Only debate is whether the Australian wickets were more spin friendly at that time.
Third and fourth best spinners are Anil Kumble and Saqline Mushtaq
How come you didn’t mention Saqlain ? He was an amazing bowler
Murali was the best. Shane Warne was an ordinary bowler in India
Shane Warne was like Bumrah, change the game
Yes but murli was ordinary in Australia 😊