Battery Deathmatch: Lithium versus AGM

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  • čas přidán 29. 08. 2024
  • In this video, we pit a lithium (LiFePO4) battery against an AGM (absorbed glass matte) battery head-to-head and compare their specs during capacity tests on the test bench before taking both out onto Lake Havasu to measure speed, range and price.
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    Lachy LiFePO4 Battery: amzn.to/3GBWpTW
    UPLUS AGM Battery: amzn.to/3mYJ1CU
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    AJ's personal battery recommendations:
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    $117 per kWh - incredible!
    Current Sponsorships as of the publish date of this video:
    None
    Milwaukee Angle Grinder Giveaway Rules: bit.ly/anglegrindergiveaway (Google Doc)

Komentáře • 28

  • @hanginwithj
    @hanginwithj Před rokem +1

    Your production quality is 🔥 Keep up the good work man! Subbed

  • @aznative_
    @aznative_ Před rokem +6

    It's a very good video but the background music is a bit much. It's really loud compared to your voice.

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před rokem +1

      Yeah, sorry about that. I was in a bit of a hurry to get that video out. I will absolutely fix that for the next one. Thanks for the feedback!

  • @NiteWolfeFishing
    @NiteWolfeFishing Před rokem +2

    Great vid!
    I find amp hour ratings on lead batteries to be very misleading. leads all rate the ah from full charge to flat out dead, while knowing using it that way permanently greatly damages the battery.
    Where lifepo4 batteries give you the full use of the rated ah, since they determine the ah from full charge to bms cutout.
    And yes you shouldnt take a lifepo4 all the way down to bms cut out since that does somewhat cut down on the life.
    The general consistence is to stop at 20% of rated ah for the better live cycles. But the simple fact is you CAN drain all the way to bms cutout because it doesnt volt sag and a lead flat out become unsuable past 60% or so discharge due to volt sag.
    On a troller this isnt as noticable as say using lead on high end fish finders. Since the troller doesnt have a built in cut off it will just keep draining the battery til lits dead.
    Most fish finders have a built in low volt cut off, so once the volts drop they stop working. This is normally around 11 volts (or 10.8 for most).
    On my metered lead (i have since changed to lifepo4 even for my fish finder) this cut off always happened at around 55% of what the label on the battery said i should get out of the battery.
    So for those thinking of which battery to buy....
    Realize you NEED to double the your ah for lead.
    meaning if you need 80ah for a day of motorized kayaking then you would need to buy a 160 ah lead battery for your needs.
    But 1 100ah lifepo4 will get your day done and leave you with a safe long life for your battery or in my case 20% fudge room if you were a little aggressive with your speed ( i had 9ah left last night when i got home lol).

  • @InformationEngineer59
    @InformationEngineer59 Před 11 měsíci +1

    Thanks for the head to head test. My lead acid is dying, I think I'm heading towards lithium.

  • @ieism1
    @ieism1 Před 9 měsíci +1

    I went back from lifepo4 to AGM last week. Lithium is better in most cases, but for me it wasnt reliable. I had bms shutdowns often, and im running a system that needs to stay online. I ended up buying 4x the capacity in AGM to make up for the losses, and somehow still ended up same price as lithium. 400ah of AGM is heavy and not efficient, but its reliable and proven. Losses due to Peukert or temperature are well documented, as is shelf life and cycles. Lithium, not so much. To be fair, the chinese brand lithium was really not difficult in admitting their unit was faulty and returned my money.

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před 9 měsíci +3

      Sad to hear. It does happen. Sometimes you get a dud, or even an unreliable brand in general. Some of the cheaper no-name brands will regularly pack their cases with old refurbished cells that don't have the kind of draw left in them that you might need if you're drawing large enough loads. That said, while I can't cite a source for extensive scientific testing of the conensus that the Peukert is near non-existent for LiFePO4 cells, I have experienced that to be the case in every test I've run at or below 1C on all my LiFePO4s. The only way I could see Peukert contributing significantly is if the cells have aged dramatically. If it were simple to confirm the cells are definitely new, and the BMS were confirmed to handle the draw, then the LiFePO4 pack should be just as reliable as any lead type. But there's the rub. The packs are usually sealed. The only way to truly confirm quality is to order and test raw cells and assemble your own packs from scratch, which is too much hassle for most people. Aside from that, we roll the dice, especially when paying bargain prices.

  • @WavePuntFrl
    @WavePuntFrl Před rokem +2

    little edditing tip... turn down volume of the background-music (a lot). I like the content of your channel. E-motor-outboard, boats, welding, electronics.... yep, i just subscribed.

  • @imxploring
    @imxploring Před rokem +1

    Perhaps the (5s) stands for 5 seconds?

  • @kyleigh2643
    @kyleigh2643 Před rokem

    Nice video. Just wondering if the on water test for the agm was stopped when the motor actually died or whether you stopped it at some low voltage point?

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před rokem +2

      Great question! AGM batteries don't have a cut-off circuit, and since they're made of lead, you can damage them if you discharge them too low. Pros say 11.5V is a super-safe cut-off, 11.3V is recommended for long life, and below 11.3V is kinda danger-zone territory. If you discharge to 11V each time, you'll kill the battery permanently in just a handful of discharges. So on the lake, I discharged a LITTLE bit longer than I was aiming for, since it dropped a bit faster than I was expecting right at the end. I think it dropped to 11.2V before I cut it off manually, but all the numbers I put on screen at the end were the results once it hit the 11.25V mark since that's the mark that matches the bench test cut-off. I didn't want to cheat by posting any extra discharge on the lake.

  • @InformationEngineer59
    @InformationEngineer59 Před 11 měsíci

    Um, I think the 270A 5S, the 5S means 5 seconds.

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před 11 měsíci

      Good catch! Very few people have caught that. I realized that’s probably right shortly after I published the video. I was thrown off by the fact that they never called it a CCA number, since AGM is usually not used as a starter. I was only concerned with deep cycle tests for the video, but I have doubts that this battery could pull 270A even for 5 seconds. I may test that in a future video.

  • @slc12312
    @slc12312 Před rokem

    Great comparison! I don't have a trolling motor yet, but some say to not use a lithium battery, so that makes me a little worried about voiding a warranty or burning out the motor. Is this something I really need to worry about?

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před rokem +5

      I believe warnings about lithium batteries from trolling motor companies (especially Minn Kota, who has blogged about it in the fairly recent past) generally warn against "lithium ion" which is the colloquial term for non-LiFePO4 lithium batteries like NMC, NCA, etc. The older-style lithium batteries that are common in electronics nominally rest 1.2 volts above LiFePO4, so they were historically a bit too much voltage for trolling motors. With LiFePO4, you are still about 0.75 volts above equivalent lead acid most of the time, but in my opinion it's perfectly within safe range, since LiFePO4 never exceeds 14.4V which is the fully charged voltage of lead acid. So long story short, modern LiFePO4 batteries are as safe for trolling motors as lead acid batteries are. As for whether you'd void a warranty, I haven't seen any documentation that says you will, but I haven't really looked for that. I'd read the warranty of your motor in full if you're concerned, but I suspect it's not likely to be a problem anymore.

  • @HeyStripes
    @HeyStripes Před rokem +1

    still waiting for that apples to apples vid .....

  • @The_ZenTex
    @The_ZenTex Před 8 měsíci

    What battery charger would you recommend?

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před 8 měsíci +1

      Thanks for watching! I recommend the Noco Genius 10-amp (amzn.to/4a6rzQx). It would charge a 20AH AGM pack like the UPLUS in this video in about 1hr, and it would charge a LiFePO4 pack like the Lachy in this video in about 2 hours. You can pay less if you get the 5A version, but it'll take 2X as long to charge.

  • @ut4964
    @ut4964 Před 11 měsíci

    well done

  • @J5swagg
    @J5swagg Před rokem

    What’s the smallest battery I can run on a 30 thrust trolling motor? Just need to get from A to B

    • @john0270
      @john0270 Před rokem

      your doing your battery a huge damage by not sizing it to run atleast an hour under whatever condition your going to encounter

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před rokem +1

      I personally wouldn’t go smaller than about 20 amp hours. It yields about 1.4C as we saw in this video, and the temperatures were very telling. You can certainly go smaller, but it would raise the ratio to 2C or above, and the temperature would rise. For LiFePO4, I’m not sure what size will cause temperatures to scrape the limit of safe levels (120F-130F), but I will find out in future tests. However, batteries that small will be impractical IMO, since they’ll give you minuscule runtimes.

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před rokem

      @@john0270 I agree a battery’s total number of life cycles will diminish if you always overdraw it, but as long as you keep temperatures at safe levels (below 130F), you will still get impressive cycle life out of lithium compared to lead acid. On the other hand, lead acid batteries have poor cycle life to start with, but they are more resilient against running hot under high load. So I just wouldn’t buy a lead acid battery to begin with, but IMO either chemistry will be fine at well under one-hour runtimes. This video is a perfect example of it. The 1-hour mark is arbitrary. The runtime depends completely on the size of the battery.

  • @curtcampbell8284
    @curtcampbell8284 Před rokem

    You've got adds on the video!
    I wonder if that means you're getting paid soon🤔🤔

    • @eagleray1
      @eagleray1  Před rokem

      Nope, they put ‘‘em on every video now, even if they’re not paying the creator yet.

  • @Mikoleungcy
    @Mikoleungcy Před rokem

    Hi AJ, I can't find your email address, how can I contact you?😂

  • @markfromwestcoastwoodcraft7633

    Loose the horrible 80's video game music