How selling an $11,000 turntable turned into a nightmare
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- čas přidán 12. 07. 2024
- It was a Versa Dynamics turntable, here's a link to the 1987 Stereophile review of a similar model. www.stereophile.com/turntable...
My sale took place in the early 1990s.
Point of the Story, don’t deal with Versa Dynamics.
ahmen
That's what I've learned.
Good! Glad the company was named and shamed.
Versa Dynamics is irrelevant now and nobody buys their turntables if they’re still around? The rep Steve had to deal with was a pure douchbag. Including conveniently forgetting the platter was missing cause he heisted it 😑
I bought an old Technics record player at a flea market it was still in the box. When I got home I opened the box took it out and in the bottom of the box was the original sales receipt from a very high-end stereo store I remember as a kid. This was a $300 turntable in 1977. I paid $20 for it. It works perfectly to this day 20 years later it even came with two extra needles.
Damn thats some find
technics turntables are tanks
I got a gramophone older than that.
Funny. I have a Yamaha P520 direct drive automatic turntable with a Stanton 881S cartridge from 1985 that I paid $220 for the turntable itself and still works fine to this day. The black plastic hinges for the dust cover deteriorated and cracked themselves to death after 15-20 years, but kudos to Yamaha on the rest of it, although the viscosity of the cueing mech is kinda wonky. Also improved the S/N ratio further changing the turntable mat. Always make sure your table is level and the cartridge is best aligned and setup. Periodically inspect the stylus under magnification, and keep it and your vinyl clean👍.
Still listening/enjoying vinyl occasionally on it. 😉 👨🏻
I despise people like the one you have described.
The way he speaks and looks at the camera makes me feel like I'm in a sofa at his house.
My Genelec speakers (that i had bought second hand!) failed one day. The guys at Genelec checked the serial number and it appeared that it was almost a year over their 10-year (!!) warranty. They said: "Send it over anyways, we're going to repair it without charge anyways". THAT is what i call great company politics. Of course when i needed new (bigger) speakers, i bought Genelecs again.
Crazy !
That is a terrible manufacturer. Do not support companies like that!
To call it by the name: lucre, the root of all evil (1. Tim. 6,10)
The love of money...
And they found an easy prey in those wilt a love of conspicuous consumption. The whole high-end hifi schtick is all about conspicuous consumption. The higher the price tag the higher your social status within the high-end hifi hierarchy. The audiophile world is made of buffs who listen to the same few tracks on the same few records or CDs or SACDs over and over and over and over because "I can hear-see her chest heaving and the dimensionality of her ample b00bies shifting" with my new $25 000 pubes of vestal virgins Cables. I can also hear that she had had her tonsils removed a fortnight before the recording was made.
Remembers me another brand that acts even worse... Is called Apple lol
if you can't know for certain what a vocalist had for breakfast, the equipment sux
It was probably a distributor that he was talking to not the manufacturer directly.
There's an old saying in turntable manufacture and sales: "What goes around, comes around."
ilikethisnamebetter 🤣👌🏼you’re gonna get the needle if you’re not getting your moneys worth in the stylus world as well.
RATT said that best!
I heard that one... heard that one... heard that one... heard that one... heard that one...
Groovy...
ilikethisnamebetter love it!
This is when you never do business with a company again. Jansport offers a lifetime warranty on $50 backpacks for kids.
hiro111 not really the same thing but 👌
Can you put a different cartridge on?
$11 000.00 For a turntable and it has 1 year warranty only??? :-O
... And it breaks
rich dummies dont care wasnt thier labor . only thier money .
Alan ray Lol those "rich dummies" are probably many times smarter than you AKA someone who can barely string together a coherent sentence...
@@TheOfficialDaBoogaloo why would you buy an electronic item that is 11k that don't have even one year of warranty? seems like he has more money than brains.
At 11 grand lifetime service should be guaranty lol
How my nightmare started - I bought an $11,000 turntable. That’s enough right there. Good story.
Funny. 👌🏼
A $500 turntable (like Technics SL 1200 MKII or 1210 MKII were) can be considered expensive. A $11,000 turntable sounds ridiculous to buy - at least for me.
$11,000 is silly for a turntable, but if you can find a Technics SL-1200 for just $500, there's probably something wrong with it.
Baladár funny you should mention the SL1200 - I bought one of those with a Shure cartridge back in the 80’s for I’m thinking $525 total, when I was young, single and had (seemingly) more disposable income. All a matter of degrees, I suppose.
ekim andersom agreed, and I don’t begrudge those who can/will. I had mentioned in a previous post that I had spent about $525 (I think) back in the 80”s for a tt and cartridge, but I still have it today and have had absolutely no issues other than replacing the stylus . All a matter of your comfort and fund level, I guess.
Companies and reps like this deserve to go out of business.
That's exactly what I was thinking as I was watching the video. What a ruthless SOB!
Scott Richards That's exactly what happened to John Bicht and Versa Dynamics.
@@magicmaestro08 Thanks for the info. Makes me feel good knowing he got what he deserved. I mean he could have tried to work something out if money was tight, or whatever. Especially after being such a complete Dbag, and putting the guy through all of that in the first place, and making such an ass of himself by "going to investigate". When it was all his fault, in the first place, anyway. Unbelievable!
Bill Gates paralyzed hundreds of thousands of children; What deserves to happen to him?
@@spahr001 Stop getting your news from memes you clown. That's a load of BS, and I believe you actually know this. You're just another lying right wing BS artist/nut job. Who likes to stir the pot. Nice try though. Loser!
www.snopes.com/fact-check/bill-gates-vaccinations-depopulation/
www.google.com/amp/s/www.truthorfiction.com/amp/bill-and-melinda-gates-polio-efforts-paralyzed-47500-kids/
www.google.com/url?sa=i&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjb6tKwqd3eAhWtIjQIHfXnDZcQzPwBegQIARAC&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pagalparrot.com%2Fbill-gates-polio-vaccine-program-caused-47500-cases-of-paralysis-in-india-here-is-the-truth-behind-it%2F&psig=AOvVaw20y82bUurq15MSvBV0rkAv&ust=1542609242438737&cshid=1542522841393
I don't know anything about turntables but this guy seems so nice and his storytelling skills are great.
*Versa Dynamics...* dully noted.
This is LITERALLY the reason why I never ever buy an $11,000 turntable. That... and the fact that I can't afford one.
Affordable or not no way to spend that much for a stupid record player!
But you are all over those $10,000 ones aren’t ya?
Just bought a turntable off eBay for $47.99. Built-in speakers, sub, etc...
LOL
@@drgwhatsthetruth3783 that will be underwhelming... I would spend no more than £200 for the player though, yet again I'm not an audiophile so I won't get one anyways.
Cool story....would love to hear more tales from your dealership days.
I agree. These videos are great. True stories are always the best ones.
Agreed, this was great.
I want to hear more about his Police Academy days. Mahoney needs a comeback/reboot!!!
Steve, interesting story. One thing that I appreciated about it, was that you stood in the middle and absorbed the cost on that motor. Great customer service like that is really hard to come by these days. I recall buying a set of B&W speakers back around 2004 for a sound system, along with TV, and a few other goodies. Well, move forward a few months, and the toddler of a friend of mine found the tweeter, and pushed it in. I felt awful. Took it back to Marco Electronics where I bought it, and just asked they repair it and I'll pay at pick up. Get there, and there's no bill. Made my day. Heck, it made my week!
I had a similar experience at SuperFi in Manchester, England. Bought some Mission speakers from them had a great experience, really good salesman named Chris. Or Tall Chris because there were two guys named Chris. Anyway then I moved away so I wasn't in Manchester and one day the phase-plug falls off one of the midrange drivers. So I pull out my receipts and wouldn't you know it, I'm a couple of months out of warranty. But I call the shop and ask for Tall Chris and he comes on. He doesn't remember the sale but is nice enough to pretend he does and I tell him the problem. He says ok I'll talk to the manufacturer and send you a new driver. Shall I send you a pair? (Mission back then was an Anglo-French affair the drivers came from France, everything else was done in England). I said well I don't need a pair, why? Do you think another one is going to fall off? Does this happen often? No he says, first time I've ever heard such a thing and I know Mission is going to say the same. So I say I can send you back the damaged one if you want and he says look, lets get you listening to music again first and then we'll figure out about the damaged one. True to his word a new driver arrives a few days later, straight from the manufacturer. I call Chris. Thanks man, I got it, I installed it, everything works great. How much do I owe you and now what about the old one? He says no no, it should never have happened. The replacement is free and you don't need to go through the hassle of sending back the old one.
Now that was incredible service. He took my word over the phone. He didn't even actually remember the sale. I don't know if he bothered to dig up the receipts from 14 or so months ago he just took my word and he acted. I don't know where you are now Tall Chris but I hope you're doing well. Superfi I know is sadly no longer around.
My Chipmunks' Christmas 78 would sound pretty sweet on that!
That's not a Chipmunks Christmas 78, it's a 33 1/3rpm Bing Crosby Christmas LP!
To be completely honest, I don't think *any* sort of turntable is gonna help you out!
....lets hope that's a joke haha
London liberty? :) I have an old turntable console i inherited with that 78 still on the storage rack :)
so...you wanna tell me that a 11 grand...TURNTABLE...only has a 1 year warranty? who in their right mind would buy that with only a year warranty...if it were like a couple hundreds...maybe...but at 11 grand...i would expect at least 5 years...
For 11 grand you should get an eternity warranty.
If your buying a 11k turntable, warranty isn’t to much of a concern to you.
It’s because, as was demonstrated, this $11,000 turntable was not reliable enough for more than a one year warranty. Just because something is expensive doesn’t mean it’s any good.
@@axeledwards4162 .. Maybe not to you. Would you buy an 20k car and not be bothered about a warranty? There is no difference. Quality should always be expected and manufacturers should have faith enough in their products to offer a warranty and decent after sales service.
My SME turntable developed a motor/power supply problem after 2 years. SME were happy to replace the necessary parts free of charge although initially they stated there would be a labour charge. They did the whole job within a week at no cost to me and also provided a complete updated power supply as they had experienced reliability problems with other units. Their warranty is twelve months but is liberally
interpreted at their discretion. If only other manufacturers had such faith in their products and consideration for their customers.
TheOneAboveAll some jackass who lives in a frigging apartment in nyc...that's the type of tool that wastes 11 grand on a turntable.
But why fix the vacuum motor? For the first time, The customer could honestly say that his turntable didn't suck.
HAAAAA
hah
In fact it even sucked at sucking.
Heyyy...I see what you did there.
and demand a new one , i'd take this fucker to court and put him out of business
All audiophile nuances and arguments aside, your energy and presentation is very watchable. No ego and braggadocious vibes, just a good story and passion for the subject matter and product. As a Native New Yorka, I love to hear stories involving NYC.
If your management/store owner was aware of the horrible customer service that Versa Dynamics gave to their end users (your customers), refusing to make things right, having zero concern and care, and unwilling to stand by the quality of their products... hopefully you guys dropped them as a brand that you carry in the store. If a company can't stand by it's own products and if they don't give a damn about your customers (the user of their products), I just don't know how you guys could keep supporting them by carrying and selling their brand in your store. Would have just returned all unsold stock for a refund, or liquidate them at or slightly above cost if a refund to the mfg wasn't an option, and terminated any contract with them on the grounds of their horrible product and end user support, and delays.
@Tony Jaksn pre-1930's race and immigration was still an issue. gotta remember the roaring 1920s and early 1900s you had alot of irish, italian, and danish immigrants. Even though they are considered white races these days, back then, they were frowned upon and a lot of hate crimes and racism occurred back then.. then before that, in the 1800s, you had the chinese immigrants, alot of dutch and spanish immigrants, and same thing, alot of racism and hatecrimes.
So the moral of the story is, the pre-1930's weren't a great time, it was no different than today. only difference today is moronic white christians decided to hate on a new group of people. if american history teaches us anything, it's that white christian and English and central/western European white races are the problem... they can't live with anyone. They hate anyone and everyone. In the past it was Chinese immigrants, Then it was Irish immigrants, then it was Italian Immigrants, then Danish Immigrants, then Jewish, then Japanese citizens, then blacks, then hispanic, and so on.
A couple decades from now, they'll be hating on a new nationality, while these other races live fine together and have no issues with eachother or have any issues with new immigrants. This fact alone should tell you something.
There'a always one complete twat... :/
@@LycanWitcher "white christian and English and central/western European white races are the problem" because there is no racism or hatred in any other group. You are not taken seriously because you are ignorant to the point of idiocy.
@@SBCBears DIdnt say there was no racism or hatred in the other groups. However one thing that's for sure is that the minority groups of America aren't protesting, going in an uproar, or marching in washington or forming hate groups such as the neo-nazi, KKK, or other various supremacy groups. For the most part, the minority groups in America get along with eachother or aren't trying to kick eachother out of the country. Majority of Whites are the only ones who want to boot people out of the country en masse, build a borderwall, and isolate the country from the rest of the world.
@@LycanWitcherThe majority of whites? Let us see your data for that survey or are you just making things up? And what country are you from?
"John" should have been the recipient of a visit from " cousin Vinnie."
More like Luka Brazzi..
If the ICEMAN was still in business he would be the man for the job.
David Schomer didn't he just get knocked out by Tito Ortiz
Don’t know why this video was suggested to me, but I subscribed to your channel after hearing your story. You sir are a fantastic storyteller!
I can’t believe you went thru this Steve! I would have returned it immediately! Your job as the salesman is simply one thing, SERVICE! If the company is this unconcerned with service to your customer the you should have stopped doing business with him! Yes, it is that simple!
You’re so patient. I work in customer service and would love it if more people were like you.
Wow. So much for money buying you a lovingly made piece of kit from quality components built to last. You were providing the customer service in this scenario. Imagine if the customer had dealt direct with the manufacturer. Thanks for sharing.
Unfortunately, we all have these stories. Fortunately, we all have our stories where the manufacturer went out of their way to make things right. I must say though, for 11K I would expect him to come over and flip the disc over for me-and get me a beer.
And give me a happy ending.
I didn't spend 11 grand on my last 3 cars... combined.
I spent that on my last 3 wives 😂
@ First 10 cars.
I haven't even spent 11 g on weed!
Smart man.
@Steve Tllsdaleys it's not about how much you make, it's about how much you keep.
Thank you for taking the time to tell this story, sir. :)
Of course he had no conscience... He was selling 11 grand record players.
SuperBoobaloo exactly, he already made his sale, he regrets even saying more than “that’s impossible.”
hahaha
$11k turntable with a one year warranty!
@@kielbeckham7189 I got the impression that it was a small company, and the salesperson was also either owner or CEO of the company.
Some record players are worth it. In 1976 an EMT 950 cost DM15000 ($5700), today that would amount to $25250 and in 1987 that was $11350. You would have got very good customer service though but they never broke down to start with, not even after a 3 decades of 24/7 use by butter-fingered DJs.
The BBC bought dozens of them as did many other radio stations and recording studios in Europe. Probably the finest turntable ever made. They still make the legendary TSD15 cartridge by hand in Switzerland but not the turntables.
You didn’t have an obligation to make “John” happy. You and John had an obligation to the customer to make him happy. Good story.
That definitely sounds like a really complex negotiation. it's hard to believe that the distributor the turntable was so obtuse. I understand that many high-end audio brands tend to be rather finicky about repair or replacement of their components. Personally I believe that's why people will cobble together their own systems. Great to hear a story from a dude that works in the trades! 🌝
Hey man!
Good to see you on CZcams after seeing you photos for years. I've bought most of my headphones based on your reviews.
Thanks for all your work.
"That's very interesting information"
You're a good man. And that was an episode of Seinfeld in my head. Poor George!
I don't know why, but I think I could listen to Steve tell any story about basically anything and I'd be fully entertained. This was the quickest 8min video I've ever watched.
Idk why this video was in my recommended tab. But I'm so happy it was. Ur a solid dude, keep it up 👆
Your second experience should have concluded, after receiving the motor, whereby you would dismiss the brand's representative.
I’d have informed Versa Dynamics that you’re no longer supplying their products, that’s really crap service. Rega will bend over backwards to resolve any issues for their customers and they will do it as fast as humanly possible, even on their entry level products and for long after 12 months is up... I find it outrageous that a company making an $11k turntable are so severely lacking in after sales care.
I’ve no doubt Singer did just that.
The Rega probably sounds just as good too.
What a disgusting prick!!!
James Collins I’ve two Regas, an RP1/Elys2 and a P5/Ania/Neo PSU, both punch above their weight!
Thank you for sharing this information with the public.
Enjoyed listening to this. You are a good story teller. Thank you for sharing
Great story Steve. Reminds of a certain audio company who charged me $253 for a battery replacement on their $500 dac.
So the rep came to the shop found a prob with the demos platter and removed it opened up a box for sale did not mark the box did not tell store owner etc replaced bad demo machines platter with the one from the box took the demos platter back to the company even before you found all this out why not just give the cust the platter from the demo and when you did find out what had happened you still did not give him his orig platter WTF
Patricia SMith ^^^^ This
Would you be OK with Toyota removing parts from their driven demo car's to fix your brand new undriven car?
If we could see (some) manufactures and dealer/ retailers through a peephole...
@@Dobermanator I used to be a mechanic, one shop I worked in was a Saab specialty shop, and the other a BMW dealership. In both shops we would borrow parts for testing in a pinch if the part was very expensive and difficult to obtain.
@@joshua43214 What stupid things a Company / Worker do is not relevant but thanks. Customers are what matters and Saab fooled people for years as a result you never see one but a few times a year.
You are a great example of customer service. Thank you for the story.
Truth..if a company won't stand behind their product it's because they know it's a piece of crap...they do know that product better then anyone else after all.
1 year warranty on a 11 grand turntable..shamefull
I usually depend on Gravity to keep my records on the turntable. It has been dependable for a long time and requires no heavy motor.
True, however one has no bragging rights with simply gravity alone ..
I find gravity also tends to work just about everywhere too, and silently
A relatively inexpensive alternative to a vacuum is a weighted hold-down that covers the label area. Since not all LP's are flat this may be useful in some instances.
I've always found gravity to reliably stop the LP from floating away, but if you've got more money than sense then you clearly need a backup in case gravity stops working.
Maybe it vacuums the dust from side B while you play side A
A vacuum motor to fix the record to the platter... so, this turntable sucks? Seriously, though, I have a Mission 774 arm, designed by the same idiot who designed this turntable. As undoubtedly good as it is, the arm is way over-complicated. Over-engineering is poor engineering.
Mmm although i agree there is a but. The reason why this is done, is because of retarded audiophiles (as seen in the video)
These builders laugh their asses to the bank so not so weird. That they provide what's been demanded.
John Elrick a Rube Goldberg designed arm ?
@@ROTAXD No. it's rather good, you can find plenty of information on the interwebs. It is, perhaps needlessly, over-complicated in terms of the adjustments available and how tricky it is to adjust. It's one of those arms which will track a Decca cartridge, being quite well damped and the cartridge fixing being coupled with the main pivot. I'm just griping because I'm one of those minimalist kind of guys who values simplicity.
Didn’t Bruce Thigpen design it? A couple of years ago he was a real mensch about helping me get one of his ET arms that I bought on eBay going and ended up charging me less than his regular price for replacing the wiring, or giving me a free cueing lever or something like that. He is still in business though he has licensed his his ideas to people who aren’t like Monsoon Audio.
Yes I remember the Versa. The arm blew and the platter sucked.
@@ziqfriq You could be right, I was following the info in a review of the turntable. I like the 774 but it's a bit of a bugger to set up if you're changing to a new cartridge with a different form factor to the old one.
Oh man Steve, I just now found this video as I was searching your old posts but I can confirm every word you stated was true, I do remember hearing the story at the time. The owner John Bicht was a brilliant designer but a absolute ball buster. He charged you for everything & incredibly intolerant which was one of the reasons I ended up selling mine to a gentleman in Italy. He made 2 models the 1st was the top of the line 2.0/2.3 & then later released the 1.0/1.2 which was a simpler less complex model. As you know it was a complete system that couldn't be separated. Without doubt it was the finest linear tracking arm ever created as there was literally no arm wand & essentially a head shell on the air bearing it would only track with the edition of the platter vacuum. I owned the 2.3 I can honestly say even by todays standards its still one of the finest tables ever created & the arm has never been equaled by anyone, not the Airtagent, Bergman, Rockport or even the Kuzms Air line, it was truly in a league of its own. The platter air bearing was so special it was assembled in a clean room & couldn't be taking apart. Versa Dynamics ceased production I believe in 1994 but John put together a protoiype that he showed at CES not too long ago as he was thinking about restarting the company but it never came to fruition. Tue air bearings were produced by what is considered the finest air bearing manufacture in the world & to put things in perspective John's cost of the platter bearing today if John ordered 50 of them was 5,000 per bearingmg, necessary? Who knows but it was truly something special none the less It's so cool after all these tears learning that you were the salesman behind that infamous deal & in the words of Psul Harvey "Now you know the rest of the story" Thanks for the trip down memory lane.
I absolutely love this story! I was on the edge of my chair until the very end, waiting to find out how the story concluded. And I can easily identify as well.
I'd love to hear more stories like this!
A turntable for 11k should have a life term warranty... lol..
yes it fucking should!! well said
WORD
For 11K I can buy a technics SL1200 and lots of prostitues with the remaining 10.8K
@@EnglishLaw
Nothing beats a Technics SL1200MK2
@@mackjeez wrong. The Technics SP10 does. As do the Denon DP100, Nakamichi Dragon CT and the EMT 950. These 4 make the SL1200 look and feel like a cheap toy.
Great tale, and it's like an extra scene from "My Dinner With Andre"; loved it !
Yup thats why customer service always comes first when looking to buy high end audio equipment or any high end/expensive gear. I’ve been through situations like this one too many times until I finally learned my lesson. The worst is telling the truth to a customer service representative and them not believing you! Indeed a nightmare. Thanks for sharing your story.
11K for a freaking turntable?!? Is it made out of Panda fur?!?
No, the the bearings wear formed from unicorn balls and the needles were made from ground unicorn horns
Bob you´re spot on when it comes to that type of drones, I´m more into racing/freestyle drones and parts and pieces are cheaper but we crash a lot so we need replacement parts all the time...
PPS.- Not made of Panda fur, eh eh
No, its Pandas make it.
nobody tell him about the Clearaudio Statement. . .
I'm not a music enthusiast but I do enjoy old audio equipment.
What a nice customer and you helped out in a difficult situation
First of all, CONGRATS, to YOU, for going beyond for your customer... wow.. the John-guy of very little concern, sounds like someone I hope I don't have to meet, lol God bless you and your customer, sir... and Happy New Year!!
You get better service buying a $90 turntable, $90 sound but $11000 service meaning if it's missing a part they give you a whole new one
Good answer!
Have you noticed some hifi amplifiers models looks very alike, but one is worth $10000 and the other is worth $700? Well, the only difference between those are usually the quality of components inside the amplifier, so if your familiar with electronics you can buy the cheap one, and then replace parts with quality parts used in the $10000 version and get the same audio quality as the $10000 version. You probably wont be able to sell it for that, but if you want really good sound that is an option. There will be some costs for the parts, but no where near $10000. Some models are just overpriced. It has always been like that, its a shame.
Just the thought of spending $11,000 for a turntable is enough of a nightmare for me.
Thanks to the Internet, we can quickly find out the manufacturer's service record.
That’s cheap! Linn LP12s are like £18,000!
@@SvenTviking You mean Kronor?
@@SvenTviking...Over-rated
Manufactures can over produce anything and charge a premium. The same sonic results could happen for a fraction of the price even for a linear tracking table like this one. When I was in audio sales I could never BS about what the client needed and never over hyped so called esoteric equipment.
The wonders of retail and dealing with suppliers! You did well for your customer...
Great story - well told. Thanks - and greetings from Channel Islands
love the t.shirt
He was a wealthy guy, he wasn’t always around.
He just bought a 11k turn table xD
Anyway, good job providing the service, the customer was rather patient too.
This is gold. We need to hear more stories. Maybe a series?
Its always nice to see a good salesman that shows interest in customer satisfaction. And if i was the middleman i would certainly have told the manufacturer that this was the last time i sold any of his products, due to the nightmare of BAD customer support.
I have a fire to put out almost daily at the store. Not all like this but, constant for sure. Most of the time I'm like "I thought I got into this because I loved audio? I didn't expect it to be constant disaster control!". Some issues are real from the manufacturer's product, some are in the customer's head. I've got one guy right now (Mentally handicapped) who bought a turntable from me a couple months ago, and has called literally hundreds of times about it since then, lol. Probably 15 times just yesterday. Always the same question about the cartridge. He keeps messing with it after I professionally set it up in his apartment, SMH. There's nothing wrong with it, but he just doesn't stop asking questions about it.
Oh, and I want that T-shirt...now!
I love this type of video. Thanks for the story!
I have a Denon DP-45F from 1985 I bought used in 2005 for 180 bucks that has never given me any trouble. I feel blessed!
Moral of the story....Never spend $11,000 on a friggin turntable.
Sure, but then you can't tell your friends you just spent 11k on a turntable
It is a little hard to work up any emotion for the people involved. Considering the 50%+ profit on this sale between maker and vendor, arguing over who is going to pick up the cost of a $300 motor is a priceless insight into the insane world these guys inhabit.
@@randallstewart175 - What I got from the story was that some manufacturer reps are clueless assholes, and you shouldn't do business with people like that. If I was the store owner, I would have dropped the line and written a letter to the president of the company to inform him why.
@@OMGWTFLOLSMH the company is a one man operation by john
Randall Stewart it’s clear the manufacturer should peek the bill, they are nasty. Including taking the plater of a new item out it on a demo and selling it to a costumer as new
Also, what was your commission on the turntable?
Well told, very relatable and funny. I think everyone’s had that one consumer nightmare story, so this was interesting to listen to!!👍
A great story. You did everything you could for the customer.
For $11,000, it should not have these kind of issues. A vacuum motor should not fail after a year. That being said, I would just go with a 40 year old Technics. They rarely fail. I realize that some of these exotic turntables have very precise parts and probably have plinths of steel and a shock proof platter. You're playing a $30 tops album on an $11,000 turntable. Does the stylus last any longer? I guess it depends on the stylus. I'm not ripping on you, I just find it astounding that there are turntables even 10 times that price out there. Yes, they sound unbelievable, but I couldn't justify it for myself. If it makes them happy, though, I guess it's ok. Thank you for sharing and I'm truly sorry that you and your customer went through this craziness. Have a happy new year.
My technics from the 1960's sounds good enough for me. I think calibration makes more of a difference than the turntable itself. But hey what do I know
Paul Callas AGREED 100%
The folks at Technics, and parent companies, weren't solely obsessed with audio in the design and manufacture of the iconic SL-1200. I think that's clear. They were hyper-focused on a quality product that can reach a broader market. We all know it wasn't intended for club djs, but *shocker alert* an excellent product tends to be appreciated by most. Technics would give a nod and wink to several comments seen on this vid, for sure. They understood that it needs to be resilient, sound better than most (boutique decks excluded), and have components that they can turnaround fast if the need arises.
These uber-expensive decks I'm sure are wonderful, but all the "engineering brilliance" and aesthetic devotion to gimmicky shapes, materials and *OMLORD* isolation techniques do not net enough improvement in sound to justify the purchase.
It's as someone else pointed out, by and large, it's simply one of a hundred ways that immature wealthy folks, with no meaningful direction, signal higher social status. We all do it to some extent, but jeez man, spend most of that cash on something worthwhile. It's everyone's life to live so it's whatever, but insane decision making.
@@freshpow21 I do appreciate good quality. I would bet if you put one of these really high end cartridges on a Technics 1200 and another one of these super tables that the sonic difference wouldn't be that significant. The recording consoles and decks are less expensive than some of this stuff. Like I said before though, if it makes them happy and they can hear the difference, then let them enjoy it. If I told my wife that I bought an $11,000 turntable with a $10,000 cartridge, I think she'd divorce me, lol. Most of the items that I bought are second hand and they're fantastic quality, but most of it needed repaired, which I'm able to do. I lucked out in finding a Nakamichi TA-4A and a Pioneer PL-L-800 linear tracking turntable that needed repaired, but ended up putting an Ortofon 2M Black cartridge on the turntable and fixing a cold solder joint on a 5 volt regulator in the Nakamichi receiver, and it just sounds better than anything I've ever owned before. I ended up getting a Sony TC-355 reel to reel deck that I ended up paying $25 for and it just needed a couple of hinges freed up because the grease was nearly 50 years old and basically turned to glue. That is such a good sounding deck, but the thing that I find to be the weakest part of that deck is it's not 100% speed accurate because it has a rim driven flywheel for the capstan. I only discovered it when trying to sync up video from a camera and audio from the deck. It's not off much, and my ears can't tell the difference, but it's not right. The drift is noticable about 30 seconds into it. My TEAC A3440, which I got for free, and it just needed a belt, can be synced up with a video camera. I don't think it sounds quite as good as the Sony, believe it or not, but it does sound great.
Paul Callas again I agree.
Bought a used but very wall maintained SL-1200 MK 2. I made some modest upgrades and made sure I had proper cartridge and stylus alignment. Next, ensure my media was clean.
Just from that alone...WOW...near silent playback and gorgeous sound. It's fun as a hobby and the music is amazing, but it's not $11K fun. Haha
Gréât story. I have a similar story but with a huge 60 + channel mixing console. It revolved around failing individual channels and the fact that the down time was costing a lot of money. When they wouldn't send an engineer to fix it,, I simply said that I was sending the whole console back and would charge for every extra cost as the console was clearly not fit for purpose when purchased(part of UK consumer protection law)
Trust me they were Johnny on the money and they fixed it and fully tested the console overnight. It took 8 hours AND they compensated me for my losses. Amazing what can happen when you mention that the client is Siouxsie Sioux (of the Banshees fame).
Trust
I see that I made a similar comment 2 years ago, but this just rolled up again so I rewatched, and I gotta say, having now safely retired, I LOVE nightmare at work stories. Very purging and therapeutic, for some reason.
I appreciate your process, asking the manufacturer to do the right thing. This matters.
I can understand that electronics fail but lack of accountability from the manufacturer, manufacturing what is still a niche product in a niche and small market is not what you want. I can’t seem to find this company online so I do hope they are rotting in hell. I must appreciate Rega that way. My out of warranty RP1 motor failed and they provided me a new motor for free though I had to see to logistics as it had to be shipped from UK to India. Eventually when I attempted to replace the motor, it turned out it was the pulley that had lost its glue and ended up slipping on the motor shaft causing platter speed issues. I communicated to Rega but they were happy for me to keep the motor as spare. Now that’s a company that truly supports its customer.
www.versalab.com/VERSA%20DYNAMICS.html They seem to scam upgrades as well not just turntables :D
What a nasty shark... the manufacturer.
Good stuff, man ---you kept your cool and did the right thing
the shot looks great. you should always do your show this way.
A turntable is not worth $11,000. That's the nightmare.
Some would argue the same about the cost of an original Stradivarius or modern equivalent, but you'd actually be wrong. There's a huge difference between say a cheap guitar and a high-end model. And it has mostly to do with sound quality.
@@PHeMoX - Not $10,000 worth of sound quality...FOH
James Richard Wiley if a man has 11,000 dollars to spend on a turntable and he enjoys spinning records, who are we to say it isn’t worth it?
Are we really going to start this debate? Value is relative. Anything is worth whatever someone is willing to pay for it. People want to spend their money. There was actually a really interesting article I read about this software company that built an antivirus that was better than Norton and sold for the half the price but people wouldn't buy it because they perceived it as cheap. The company didn't start turning a profit until they doubled the price of their software. They didn't change anything but people saw it as more valuable because of the higher price. Point is people want to pay more money. They actually like the product more when it costs more. That's why apple is still in business even though their products are less powerful and more restrictive. People like paying more money
@@TehQSAclan - Because I think most people would agree if you spend $11,000 on anything, it should probably work properly and the company should stand behind their product. But maybe that's just me...
I actually met the designer of Versa Dynamics turntable in a Chicago audio salon just after C.E.S. in 1987. It had just been introduced, possibly at that show. I just happened to wander in as he was there trying to get the store owner to carry his turntable. I did get to hear it and thought it was quite good. What shocked me about it however was the price, $7500, almost twice the price of a Goldmund Studio, and about 1/3 of my annual income at the time. You could still buy a new car for that money in 1987. I mentioned this and he pretty much dismissed me at that point. I've learned two things since then: Buying high end, expensive equipment from a new and unknown designer is crapshoot, although that should be obvious, and, having owned a vacuum turntable with an air bearing straight line tracking tonearm, the complexity is not worth any theoretical superiority in sound. I have damaged two stylii in my life, both of them on that tonearm.
I closed my eyes and envisioned what a audiophile looked like and there was this person
Terrific story about real life issues. Please share more. Hope the customer felt like he got his monies worth. By the way, "blessed are the peace makers". You kind sir, certainly filled that "middle man/peace maker" position.
The moral of the story is don't waste $11,000 on a turntable because ultimately the company making it cares more about making money than providing customers with the best product and experience possible.
Steve with Manufacture / Vendor support like that. I know you seem easy going, but I hope you told that this was the last sale of their product you made for them. Due to the piss poor customer service/support they have.
I've had my share of 'snake bitten' deals. Once they start going south it is almost impossible to stop it until it hits bottom. Nobody wins, everybody loses. Every once in a while, even the best deals wind up this way. You were the class guy who represented your company and your customer. Pays dividends in the long run!!
What a Great Story . . . Thank you for sharing. Just goes to show you that even when you buy high end doesn't mean that comes with high end Customer Service.
Not the first time I've heard bad things about John Bicht. It's just one example of why he went out of business. Contrast this with guys like Andy Payor of Rockport.
Precisely why I went with gravity over vacuum... no failures so far, fingers crossed..
I was wondering why someone might want to play records on their ceiling.
@@EnglishLaw LMAO..
WOW, What a story! BTW, the pump & compressor was to be placed 50 feet away. Give me Technics SL-M3 any day! No one can tell a story like Steve. What talent! What goodness!
Thanks so much!
Great story, great video. Thank you for sharing
Honestly this happens all the time .. customer service has gone the way of
The steam engine ...
Anything ultra-ultra high end like a Lamborghini or some other rare or exotic "thing", there is always going to be headaches. It's overly complex. The parts are rare and with only 1 supplier. And to make it all worse, it all has to work perfectly together or else it may not work at all. Unless he's archiving the last and only records available from some long-dead valued artist, no reason why a $2,000 record player wouldn't serve his purpose as the $11,000 one. Rich people waste money on lavish, self-indulgent bullshit. Like Panoramic wrap-around sea aquariums installed in their living room at a country club (one of my former employers company owners). The maintenance alone on such an aquarium setup, I could not afford.
Thanks. I was about to buy one of those $11,000 turntables. But you changed my mind.
Great customer service on ur behalf thanks fir the story
Are they still in business?
Nope, Versa Dynamics didn't exist for long. A few years.
There is a John who works for versalab maybe he's the same person
Wow, he's really let himself go since Police Academy.
Haha. I knew that name sounded familiar!
Didn't get the joke until I saw his name. Good one!
Came here to make this joke. Fine work. 💪
Thanks
I did about 32 police academy jokes about a month ago.....nothing absolute silence...and you get all the recognition!!?
This makes me feel so good about my cheap pro-ject debut 3.
Somehow this story caught my attention. Look forward to hear more.