Three Popular .32 ACP Handguns: Zastava M70, CZ70 and Colt 1903; Reloading for the M70
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- čas přidán 1. 01. 2019
- The purpose of this video is to showcase my three .32 ACP Handguns: Zastava M70, CZ70 and the venerable Colt 1903, and to share my experience with reloading .32 ACP (lead) for the M70.
,,,would like to see another video shooting the Zastava using different types of factory 32 ACP ammo...
Beautiful collection
Thanks a lot
Thank you for sharing this information 🙏
I too luv and collect 32acp i recently purchased the FEG AP MBP .
The FEG is on my short list. It looks very similar to the CZ70.
I picked up a M70 for playing with 32acp and loads. Your investigation on the M70 reloads and case bulging is intruiging. I'll be watching this as well and will slug my barrel. Planning on reloading powder coated 78g lead and will be watching OAL and case condition after shooting. Great info !!!
Very interesting. Love the Colt.
Thanks.
I have one of the Zastavas. I noted some bulging like you showed and traced it back to the bullet being seated out a bit long. This was with Armscor ammo. The bullet was seating right into the throat. OAL of these rounds is .969". I also have some PMC, same weight approx same bullet contour. These have an oal of .950". The parallel portion of the bullet is almost completely in the neck. They work better than the Armscor. Although the pistol has some exterior wear, it appears it has been fired very little and has a short throat and as you noted a tight bore. Just working the pistol with no ammo, I can see that the hammer will drop with the pistol slightly out of battery, which is likely behind your case failure. No rifling marks on the bullets, seat em deep enough to avoid that.
I edited the above, it was Armscorp ammunition to gave me a problem, Headstamp AP. Next time I'll get my magnifying glass out! I thought it was RP. The Armscorp is very inconsistent in OAL. Rnage fro .953 to .974 in just a small sampling.
As a newbie to both .32 Auto and Zastava M70's, I find this thread most interesting. I have already purchased Hornady brass and 60gr .311 XTP's. I hope this bullet proves safe to use in my gun's barrel. The 50th Lyman manual says its data can be used in .309 groove barrels. Their two test guns used that dimension. I will make sure the entire bullet shank sits at or
below the mouth to avoid the issue in your vid. Thanks!
This cartridge seats on the mouth of the case . When reloading, check case lengths against spec. Brass tends to stretch over time.
Colt 1903 my very very nice gun
Interesting gun
His my favorite gun
Thanks for your reply. The gunsmith measured the chamber and agreed with me. Apparently when a gun shop buys a quantity they also get parts. The gunsmith replaced the barrel and it chambers fine now. However, when bench testing the gun, without ammo around, and racking the slide, dropping the mag and inserting a different mag, the pistol would jam closed and I would have to field strip the thing to get it running. This happened more than not. Someone had also disabled the mag safety as well. After some ruminating, I noticed the last round hold opened finger thing was slipping under the empty mag feeder which prevented the mag from dropping and the slide locking. I repaired the mag safety and all my other problems were solved. I can’t figure if I was handling the gun right or what. Anyway it works and shoots great now. Sorry I got so long but yours was the only post that I could find. Thanks for listening. If you have an explanation please let me know.
Federal 32 ammo works the best. I recommend it if you own m 70 32acp. Never jams or fails. 1000 rounds no problem.
,,,good to hear you weren't injured.
Gratulation for zastava m70..zastava is top for me❤ i am from serbia we have good Quality of guns😊😊😊
Nice 👍
What a beautiful Colt 1903. True bluing.
It sure is!
Beauty!!
That Colt is beautiful
Thanks!
Interesting Video. Just a thought - seating the bullet deeper in the case will increase pressure. I had a problem with my 9mm CZ75 not functioning well @ a min OAL of 1.125" using Hornady XTP or HAP bullets (RN plated were no problem). An OAL of 1.085" was necessary to pass the "plunk test", but I was concerned about increasing pressures. I tried a load .5gr below the starting load given in the Lee manual and was happy with the results; they function perfectly and velocity averaged 1,100 fps (same as starting load velocity in the manual). I'm not familiar with .32 ACP, and I'm no expert, but try reducing grains by a couple of tenths below "starting grains" and see if function improves and signs of over-pressure stop.
Cool video i love .32! I also had some problems with my cz70 but if you polish the feed ramp and get some new magazine springs for it from Wolff springs it should run a lot more reliably. Mine also really likes fiocchi 73 grain round nose fmj, but i want to get into reloading .32 so i really appreciate your video
I also have three 32's but all different from yours. I have bought the Hornady die set and some plated and jacketed FMJ bullets but have not actually loaded any yet. I have never seen a Lee mold for the 32 ACP but was considering a Lyman or RCBS but decided to try the commercial bullets first.
Your problems will give me more to think about on this project. Since my post war Walther PP has much better case support I will probably focus on it for handloads.
I recently bought an m70. At the range I noticed the slide was not going completely into battery. However the pistol seemed to shoot without incident. I also reload this round. I have a kel Tec p32 that the slide does close and it feeds factory and hand loaded ammo fine. When I reload, I check the ammo size by inserting a round into the chamber (plunk test) to be sure it fits flush with the chamber breach face. So when you look at a chambered round it is flush and does not stick out. I do this with all pistol rounds I load: 32acp, 40 S&w, 9mm, and 45acp. I also occasionally check fired brass after depriming and resizing and they all sit flush in the chamber. Back to the m70, none of the rounds or cases tried completely entered the chamber. So, I mic’d everything and my though right now is that the m70 barrel has too short of a chamber. .07 inches to be exact. All bullets and cases met Sami spec’s. They all stuck out so it can’t be the ammo as it all sat flush in the kelTec. Since I had bought the pistol, I returned it to the gun shop and they agreed and took it in for their gunsmith to evaluate. By this time I was a little po’d and a lot confused. They offered to get a replacement barrel or ultimately return the gun. It might be awhile til I hear back as the gunsmith is way busy.
I have searched the internet and the only video that actually addresses this same issue is your post. Thank you. I thought I was going nuts. I’m interested the status or you gun right now. Have you done the ‘plunk test’ of the same ammo on the different barrels in your video?
It's been a while since I've toyed with the M70. With the current shut down of our local range due to Covid-19, it will be a while longer before I will pick that piece up again. If the chamber is indeed short, I would consider having a gunsmith rework the chamber assuming there is sufficient material to do that safely.
Thanks for the heads up on checking bore size on my M70. What bullet resize die do you setup for your M70 being the bore ID =.3085. Mine is the same as yours. I was going to test out some softer 12 Brinell slugs swaged to .311 and some 18 Brinell swaged to .309 using Lee sizing dies. Sounds like Zastava M70's have Glock like unsupported chambers for better feed reliability.
That Colt looks brand new.
Not bad for a 74 year-old girl, huh?
I just purchased a M70. ‘Thanks for the tip. Is the same length no matter what you shoot?
Also,... Nice job with the info and testing results. I will test the chambering with my ammo before.thr range.... What i kept thinking about was powder charges available in 32acp ammo at the time of gun production. Not sure how to confirm this, but what if 2.2 grains was the max charge in the ammo at that time @ 1970???... Could that be possible.? Thanks for the video...
Thanks for the video. Did you ever get it completely figured out? (Is your range open again, I hope?) I also reload 32ACP. I currently use Berrys 71 grain plated bullets. For powder I use Hodgdon Universal. The range between start and max loads is minuscule: 2.2 to 2.4 grains if memory serves me.
I have not yet shot my reloads through an M70 because I am waiting for my RGUNS order to reach my local FFL. One of the first things I check before starting an actual run of reloading is the plunk test. Someone above mentioned that 32ACP headspaces on the case mouth, I believe. I will also check that by inserting a resized case with no bullet in it. What is interesting is that of the two brands of 32ACP brass that I have from shooting factory ammo, they have different case lengths, around 0.100” difference if I remember correctly. One is Aguila and the other is Fiocchi. When I was first reloading 32ACP, I would only use one brand of case per run because of that.
I don’t remember hearing what your OAL was, by the way. I could see instantly that it was too long for the chamber, as you stated. When necessary, I will also insert a given bullet further into the case, but with caution, of course. I do the math and measure the powder charge height (on a case standing up on the bench) against the depth of the bullet into the case. I do this because I want to make sure that the powder is not compressed, as that, beyond just inserting a bullet deeper, is what really increases case pressure, and could be quite dangerous. For that reason, you may want to consider a denser powder: a couple people recommended Red Dot above. As I said, I use Hodgdon Universal.
So if you see this comment and have a moment, I would definitely be interested in hearing where you are at with reloading for the M70. And beyond the nuances of reloading 32ACP, someone above mentioned replacing that recoil spring, which certainly affects feeding issues.
Thanks again for the detailed video!
Hi,.. I had the same type of casing failure with a 9mm beretta 92fs. I was.sure it was the gun.at.first.also.... But came to realize the ammo was inferior.
having trouble with my CZ70 jamming so I cant empty the clip. the bullet gets jammed all fucked up inside the chamber. I just ordered some triple K mags that are supposed to be factory new for it perhaps that will solve the problem. any tips or ideas?
Sounds like rimlock? Try using fmj only.
Dan Welch the mag solved the problem
I do very minimal loading of .32acp but you are working this up in a dangerous fashion. Just seating the bullet deeper in the case dramatically increases pressure. First, buy a case gauge and there is only one seller with one, Google it or reply and I will look it up. Your finished case must meet the case gauge to be standard. Lots of people do the barrel thing but all barrels are different. If it passes the case gauge it meets sammi specs for size and you use whatever the powder called for. Pushing the bullet deeper into the case though is a dangerous procedure. Be careful. You have already had one kaboom.
hi try 2.1 grains of RED DOT! also use FMJ bullets the Euro .32acp/7.65 Browning more often than not is sized .308/.309. Hope that helps.
Thanks for the tip!
That 1903 is worth $1000's. I'd say $4000+ if you can find the box for it. It's pristine.
I had the box. It was pretty beat up. I'm not sure where it is at the moment. I hope I didn't chuck it.
Yea, anytime you start seeing Guppy Bellies on your cases your getting about as hot as you want to. Glocks have a lot of unsupported chamber and they will tell you right away when your up as hot as you can go. I didn't know it was a problem in the .32 being a rather low powered round anyway. And yes, shoving the bullet to far into the case will raise the heck out of pressure. You have to back way off on the powder when you do that. My question would be Does that model 70 guppy belly factory load too? If someone did monkey with that chamber your next plan is to find a new barrel. Written before you got around to mentioning Factory Ammo. I believe it would be prudent to try that First.
Don’t know what it is about the 32 pistols, I love these guns and the caliber is very fun to plink around, but the 32 ammo cost is making me consider buying dies as I have the other supplies already, thanks for the video
That was part of the reasons I started reloading 32 ACP.
What's the biggest giveaway between the US Armament Corps 1903 reproductions and the real colts?
I don't have any personal experiences in handling the reproduction to be able to determine what the differences are with certainty but from what I can see in the videos, the finish in the repros appears to be a step below the original.
Ok. Idk about chamber designs, but EU guns have small land and grove diameter more like a 7.62. PPU ammo has a bullet diameter of .308-.309. Your bullet mold is .314 which is perfect for 32 short long H&R and 327fm. U didn't say what the diameter was after you size. Could try Hodgen HP38.
I hear a pressure spike problems.
I'm going to size my cast bullets for the two Beretta 81's I just got to .310 and drive them through the barrel with the old plastic mallet. Ever shoot black powder?
I have a BP rifle but have only been able to use Triple 7 with it because BP is not readily available to me given current shipping restrictions and the fact that I live on an Island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean. :)
easydoz1 You do know that w231 and hp38 are the same.
That is strange zastava m70 eats all ammo i am shooting m70 winchester white box ,pmc ,remington, ppu buffalo bore , s&b etc. And all funktion good holowpoints no problem never had problem and never had problem whith +p ammo wery strange first time i see m70 not fuktion and i am from former yugoslavia vi all got the m70 and m57
as I watched what I suspected might be true was. your seating depth was wrong and this is one reason I,m VERY careful with cast bullets they can get "shaved" by the chamber mouth or "caught" on it of course in your case (no pun intended) they can engage the rifling therefore driving pressures WAY UP. you might want to get a loaded cartridge gauge (I use them on ALL my reloads) to be sure chambering is not an issue. Thank God you were not hurt or your firearm damaged!!!
His seating depth is way too deep is one reason thats why he is getting failure to feed because there is too much space between the tip of the bullet and magazine he is getting rim lock. The other reason is because he is is not crimping his bullets with lead it would have to be a light crimp but why screw with lead when he could get a copper jacket FMJ with a cannelure seat to the highest depth to prevent rim lock then crimp problem solved. It has nothing to due with polishing the barrel or feed ramps the deeper seating depths causes higher then normal pressure inside the case which caused the failure.
unsupported chamber... Glock 40's have a similar problem with hot loads
Finally a .32acp lover like myself! ok since you slugger the bore (euro bore diameters run .309 whereas American .32 calibers bullets can run .3125 for revolvers) I would NOT recommend Win 231 I use RED DOT.. Chamber Dimensions vary GREATLY for .32 acp pistols especially those manufactured in former eastern bloc nations. I STRONGLY suggest using either FULL METAL JACKET BULLETS or Cast with LINOTYPE.
Thanks for the tips!
Replace the recoil spring
Thanks. I'll consider that.
I personally wouldn't shoot the colt much at all. Put it away and only take it out for monthly inspection and oil massages.
That seems to be the general concensus and I get that. Unfortunately, i'm not the kind of guy who buys a Ferrari and parks it in my living room to show my friends everytime they visit. LOL
To me it appears that having the feed ramp as part of the chamber instead of outside the chamber is what caused the problem. That is quite a bit of unsupported chamber. Watching this saved me from buying a zastava m70 today while they are on sale for $149. I'll keep looking for a .32, back to considering the keltec.
You need gloves when handling that 1903
That's actually a good idea. Which ones should I wear? The Oakley SI Assaults or the TG Hellfox? jk.
Glocks have the same thing because they are not a fully supported chamber
The only unsupported chambers in Glocks was the .40 Gen 2 and the weak case Speer brass . In both cases the unsupported chamber and weak case have been rectified.
Someone destrojed feed ramp i have zastava m70 and i shot all kinda ammo whith no problems holowpints , pmc. Winchester 71 gr. Fioochi 7.65mm europe 73gr you name it i shot it tru the zastava whith no problem at al . I shot even overloads that i make my self and i mean wery hot hot🔥 to hot for 32 acp but that all metal m70 take it like boss and i f.....g cary it loaded whit owerloads holowpoints for more power ... i think this m70 from original had feading problem and the idiot that owned the gun polished and grinded down feed ramp and fucked it upp
Thanks.
Ohh my god man just hapened same thing to me of tousends of rounds no problem first time it hapened to me and got 1 round of pmc bronze old one i got the only one round from my friend and i shot it and it felt wrong but when i take out the magazine i saw the black burn on rest of the rounds in the mag and it make me wonder and i find the case and it was blown up same style like you and when i presed the casing it was to soft cheap material casing whith 2 fingers i make it flat i shoot 200 more rounds cbc HP S&b winchester white box no problem so no newer i shoot pmc ammo again in zastava
@@Kaneguy its all about quality of the round
@@Kaneguy and american 32 acp and EU 7.65mm europeian guns like european ammo for the most 32 acp works good but pmc newer i put that in my mag... i was happy for not destroing magazine... but i stil belive sume guy filed down feding ramp for beter feading
Nice colt but could not watch the whole video tooooo sssllllllloooooowww