CRT VS LCD - Sony PVM Trinitron & LMD Face-off! | Retro Tech
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- čas přidán 7. 06. 2024
- This is the showdown between the restored Sony PVM LMD 1420 Professional LCD Monitor and the Sony PVM CRT format Monitors. We will be featuring a Sony PVM 1350, 14M4U and the 8041Q.
For more information on repairs, diagnostics and to connect with me, please visit: / retrotechusa
Sony PVM LMD 1420 Restoration Series
Part 1: • Sony's LCD PVM! | LMD ...
Part 2: • The Sony LCD PVM Lives...
Lag testing Stream: • Lag testing that LCD P...
240P Test Suite Website: junkerhq.net/xrgb/index.php?ti...
#retro #lcd #crt
0:00 - The Sony PVM Showdown: CRT versus the LCD
0:35 - The hardware used to setup the Test
3:40 - Hooking up the LCD and CRT into a video loop
6:02 - The showdown begins with Contra Hard Corps in 240p
7:45 - Comparing things in the 240p Test Suite
10:11 - Comparing the 480i image with the PS2 & Lord of the Rings - Věda a technologie
Hey everyone. Thanks for watching. The video is segmented in case you want to skip straight to the action.
In addition, I have some links in the description if you are looking for more information. For more information on repairs, diagnostics and to connect with me, please visit: www.patreon.com/retrotechUSA
CRTs reign Supreme!
Too bad you didn't use 14L5/20L5 which is latest generation crt, that would be more fair :). Also dim the lights next time, too much glare from the CRT to make a good comparison. Thanks for the cool video!
I challenge you to put it against a Viera or a Sony CCFL wide gamut Bravia. These early LCD screens were horrible.
I'm still using a CRT monitor. 👍 With GPU prices a 980ti at 1280x1024 means I can ride it out for a while longer 👍
I use a CRT monitor for modern games too and I’d say at least go with 1440x1080. Your card can do it and more detail is still more.
@@themmmeanone I'll see if my monitor can do it. 85fps locked all day long on 1280 X 1024. If only they made an OLED that did not suffer motion blur without needing 240htz 🥺
Nice comparison. One thing I like about early 640x480 LCDs is the ability to display pixel-perfect 480p VGA contents (maybe not this particular LMD but many others can), especially PC games and entertainment software from the late DOS and early Windows period. The sharpness and detail created by those giant pixels are just so pleasing.
It reminds me that plasma TV had many advantages over early LCDs in the making of 480p EDTV for gaming. I was wondering if you’ll be interested in reviewing a 480p plasma TV, especially the famous 4:3 pioneer pdp v402. It’ll be very interesting to see some comparison between a CRT and a plasma EDTV.
The lag on them is a non-issue for a lot of games too.
Obviously difficult platformers or fighting games are not a great idea to be played on them, but something like most JRPGs would not be a problem.
Are there so many 480x640 games? In my perception, PC games were either 320x200 for DOS, and thus with non-square pixels, or they were flex-resolution. So you can just set the system resolution to be half of the screen resolution. So with a 1600x1200 LCD, which have by far the best 4:3 panels, do great as 800x600 screens for early PC/Mac stuff. Even with black bars the 4:3 1600x1200 LCD's outperform all lower res panels, especially 1280x1024 were junk when it comes to IQ, and 640x480 never had proper IPS/VA panels either.
Would probably be a great monitor to watch VHS and old 4:3 movies on. That refresh blur might help the video in certain scenes.
Yeah and the lag won't matter. That's a great point.
I'm not sure if it's a good idea.
Because the vhs tapes are designed to be played on a CRT display.
Due to the imperfection of tape and the mechanism. The sync signal from vhs tape are not as stable as cable or game consoles. This has minor impact for CRT displays, but not as indistinguishable for LCD displays which basically requires a stable signal to work properly.
The "glow" effect is what I really miss from my old trinitron crt. Games looked super bright and vibrant on it.
I feel better with the CRT because it brings me be back to the good ol days. Plus we love our light gun games. Great video Steve 💯
That Thunderstrike BGM really throws me back...
Thank you for that!
This is what early LCD computer monitors looked like in the mid-late 2000's, I told people I preferred CRT's, they thought I was nuts.
Great content, as always!
Very interesting video, I liked it a lot, greetings from Mendoza, Argentina.
i use very similar monitors daily , PVM 14m4u and LMD 2110W. Have them chained up to share a component signal but i also use the hdmi on the lmd for a second pc monitor.
I always love the CRT to lcd compare videos
I'd really love to see this comparison again once the CRT's color is refreshed. Still a great comparison
Thanks for background music. One of the best videogame soundtrack ever.
I've been wanting to see a side by side for a while for a high quality LCD like that. A good plasma set really is closest to good old CRT as far as a panel with sharper pic.
Plasma's suck though.
Thanks for the video! I watch all your stuff ! Quick question just picked up a Sony KV-27FS100 model also but I noticed the Initial Setup screen keeps popping up even after I do the Auto Program. Sometimes it'll go away for a while but then will return. Any idea how to fix this? Thank you!
I'm still keeping mine, the blur is my only problem that bothers me. I tested using my MiSTer. thanks for the video Steve.
Awesome Video Thanks
I didn't even know that an LCD PVM existed !!!
excellent technical report I wanted to know if there is lag on the lcd even using the component in 480i/p i play Ps2 at 480p/576p on a 30" Samsung
PS i like your modded Genesis ☺️
That is a fine looking thumbnail!
Haha, Thanks Mate!
Can't you use a modern ips LCD and try again with the rejuvenated PVM ?
And of course, thanks for your testings so far.
what do you call that adapter you have on your rgb wires to connect to the tv? I have the same inputs on my CRT but my wires wont plug? Pleas help!
Very cool
I bought 3 PVM’s today! 2x 20M2MDE for 200 and 330 euro, and a 2053MD for 390 euro. Comes with 40% tax and auction fees on top, i didn’t realize that. I bid the 2053MD accidently, so a bit cause i think i overbid that one. Still very happy, thanks for all the great videos!👍👍👍
“a bit bummed” i meant
@@jengelenm comments can be edited.
for sure 40€ would have been a great price but the site is well know and not like ebay who bid at last second win the auction. there is auction fee, tax on object and tax on fee, its clairy say in auction condition.
i didnt know they where so valuable..i have 2 in the shed and a sony triniton dual input crt monitor.. the 3 of them are all 20 inch...
Does it have a lot of ghosting? I so lots of video tape to USB transfers and was thinking about one of the monitors.
Use Retroarch with crt scanline shader. Then use run ahead to get rid of input lag, that might make the lcd useful for retro gaming.
How can i center the image on my sony lmd 9030? can't find any settings for this. Thanks!
Nice comparison Steve. I've recently jumped down the rabbit hole of professional CRT's, picked up a JVC BM-H1400PNKA and a Panasonic BT-S1015DA. Do they need to be powered off when connecting/disconnecting BNC cables or doesn't it matter?
Thanks. That should have no effect on the monitor so you can do it while on or off.
Make sure you have proper 75 ohm termination.
I always liked crt because of the nice glow.
Muito bom o vídeo
Is the screen really that grey on the CRT PVMs? Does that mean that they can't display any darker images than the base grey?
I don't know if the world will ever see a display technology that offers no lag. Anything that's a panel has to be loaded into a buffer first so it can all be drawn in an instant. With a CRT, as soon as the source outputs, the electrons hit the phosphor (but really, it doesn't, it just goes nearly the speed of light, which is imperceptible).
u should get one of those bvm e250's(oled), they look pretty pimpin
I would always prefer the LCD, no Overscan, no Stripes and geomitie errors.Right Colors, No Highvoltage Failure. Sharp Pictures.
Can you make a video of Sony Pvm 8040 vs 8045..?
What cords would I need to play ps2 on the 8inch one?
Nice comparison. But I would have liked to see a comparison with a CRT with better color.
Does anyone know the music, that is playing at the beginning?
It's pretty cool. Not for gaming but I would put it in the kitchen, have a raspberry pi hooked up and make it seem like a Retro futuristic smart home piece from the 80s/90s
I've been doing my own comparisons lately , both Dell
A Dell M993s 19" 1600x1200 CRT vs a Dell 2007FP 20" 1600x1200 using Retropie, both are great monitors but the Dell CRT looks 100xs better no contest
Very cool. Dell did and still does make some good monitors.
CRT is my favorite even if LCD will have perfect geometry
Does this bad PVM still look better than your best consumer CRTs?
Great comparison Steve. To me, it will be always CRT units for me.....And Brutus watching the gamplay's bro. 8^)
Anthony..
Thanks Anthony! CRTs are still the best!
I gotta say just from the first frame I already prefer the CRT. Coating on Trinitrons makes them look pretty bad with the lights on though, but with a bit more contrast I'd always take the CRT.
Steve: "Next time I will lag test a Pioneer Plasma display!"
Close, it's going to be a Hitachi Plasma!
@@RetroTechUSA Nice!
Pioneer Kuro KRP 500 is the High end , plasma still today , i prefer to play modern system with this Pioneer in 1080P than other screen 4K HDR dolby atmos and other things ,
Kuro has the real picture natural color , real black , color are not artificial !
@@CryptoRetroTech Just found a 42 inch FullHD Panasonic Viera, the other great plasma brand, and I can confirm it looks stellar.
These super how quality LCD ones don't get nearly the same love however may arguably be better
No valid comparison can be done until both units have been properly calibrated and any issues in drive circuits fixed. For one, the CRT can do true black and blacker than black, the LCD cannot, yet it shows as having deeper blacks than the CRT. The CRT isn't calibrated properly. I have a '74 Zenith Avante TV that has better black level than what is shown on the CRT in the video. Also, the scan lines on the CRT seem to be exaggerated (sharpness up too high?).
Exactly put...my Wells Gardner K7000 is so black that you can't tell if the CRT is off or on. This video as much as I appreciate the guys dedication and efforts it doesn't deliver...my K7000 kills this...you should see Windows on it.
The LCD seems to suffer from pretty bad CCFL backlight yellowing. Contrast looks better than CRT here because of the chosen exposure settings of the camera. If you had increased aperture or lowered ISO, the contrast on the trinitrons would have looked much better. Now they are overexposed.
Oh and set the white balance of the camera to 6500K to accurately capture the white point. Now it is probaly on auto white balance, making the CRT look rather bluish.
I can SEE the input lag
The perceived contrast on the LCD in your lighting conditions also looked higher than the tubes, though its probably the anti reflective coating.
I feel like If we could get full field HDR 2000 on an LCD, you could strobe it, and get damn near the motion clarity of a good tube maintaining about 450 nits while strobed.
Still the lag on the LMD makes it a giant turd for gaming purposes
is variable lag the same as input lag? 60ms is too much for retro games imo. its a shame.
Watching the intro and the lcd shows that sonic game better on film
Why left side is so blueish
Brighter color on the lcd but looks like crap in movement
CRT continues dominate at low Hz. Few LCD strobe (flicker) can get down to 50Hz but ULMB only, the (very) high price and no true 10-bit color support, unfortunately. I use CRT monitor for zero motion blur and for true 10-bit color because I want 50Hz for TV + multimedia and for few retrogames and 60Hz for multimedia, retrogames and modern games. :)
Ah... LCD has very low persistence time (ultra low motion blur) at 50/60Hz strobing 🙂 but the picture is little dark, unfortunately.
the lcd just looks better!
It's 2022. Is anyone still asking this question? LCD tech peaked a decade ago and no matter how they try and rebrand it or what letters they add, it will never surpass likes of CRT, OLED, or even Plasma displays for picture quality.
I can appreciate peak LCD for what it is. Go get a Sony Bravia 46W5500. It is magical. Not the OLED or Plasma contrast, but there are areas where it excells. First of all, CCFL LCD is king of computer interface kind of stuff. Uniformity is unmatched. White point is unmatched. Brightness is unmatched. long time reliability is unmatched! You can run such a Bravia full white at 500cd/m2 and it has a nice eye-comfy white point with that. No dirty screen effect, no image burn. And I also like its wide-gamut characteristics. My 2008 26 inch CCFL LG monitor is still by far the most astonishing display I've ever come accross. It is lag free, stunning viewing angles, and the gamut is crazy. 100% AdobeRGB. It is in my best looking arcade cab.
the crt looks way smoother
Anyone in Los Angeles interested in buying from my CRT collection? I have PVM 8041q, pvm 1354q, pvm 1412. Local pickup only, to avoid packaging issues as is the talk of the town.
6:15 Look at the wrong colors and the crazy Panel smearing with motion on the LCD..
The CRT's color, brightness and contrast was not properly tuned. If so, theres no way lcd can beat it.
6:57 The ghosting on the LCD is unbearable, CRT has God tier motion, look that, even my 210Hz OLED feels terrible when compared to a 85Hz CRT.
Can I Have a sony crt
Did you grow up living with CRTs? That’s how it was intended to be back then.
Retro systems needs lots of cables lol
dat motion blur lol... yea definitely crt all the way
Modern display = motion blur
LCD loses all it's resolution as soon as anything moves !
Why not CERT race you know where the chicken
First?
Yes, you are. :)
So to be honest this is not the best example if the CRT was not reflective which I know every CRT is it looks better to the eye then an LCD in a dark room dark spots on the CRT are just like a black hole since the laser is not projecting anything to it unlike the LCD cuz the LCD looks like dog crap at night
why test an excellent PVM against a piss poor LCD? test vs a QLED or OLED- you wont see the lag and with modern shaders you can recreate every CRT effect on them if you want a certain look.
LCD wins!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
damn the lcd one is so bad....colours are completely off
once you powered those tvs on the video became unbearable to continue watching maybe consider doing it all for the camera then record yourself talking in a separate room or something i can still hear the ringing and i paused the video for more that 5 mins.
LCD wins. Just accept everyone praising the CRT for nostalgic reasons only because it sucked here in comparison.
those old lcds had tons of lag. Damn.