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CB500 Restoration: Discovering engine damage
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- čas přidán 28. 11. 2019
- Hope you guys like this project. In the next episode, we will pull the motor and find a suitable replacement.
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Absolute shame that you wasted that cylinder. It was absolutely usable with patience. There was no need to destroy it like that.
That was a good salvageable engine. New pistons and rings, cylinders re-bored, crank an conrod bearings, timing chain and gasket set. And the engine was like new. The parts that he destroys are very hard to find and very expensive here in Europe. I wonder what his customers have to say after seeing this video
I'd have cleaned the piston crowns and poured in light oil dilluted with celullose thinners which seeps in and penetrates like nothing comercially avalable but keep it away from paintwork and plastics. Repeat this for days if necessary. Sledge hammers are for demolition Not motorcycle restoration!.
Doctor Well said.
I'm an old Honda mechanic. I have done almost the same for a customer of mine. He left the spark plugs out all winter in Oregon. I had to chisel out all of the pistons and bore the cylinders. Complete rebuild.
I have been looking for cb500/550 bike for couple years, but even bad ones cost here thousands.. I wish I could have that bike. You thrashed that engine.. makes me feel cry.
Next time open bottom end, open rods and penetrating oil for pistons and try to get them out.. probably need to go 0.5-1mm over drill, but still you'd working engine.
You thrashed that engine, man..
That motor was rebuildable, I've never seen a motorcycle shop use a club hammer like that. Obviously not a lot of knowledge with engine builds such a shame to destroy that engine. Should have kept a matching numbers bike. Just my opinion.
Holy shit !!! The way you treat that bike is infamous. I am currently rebuilding a cb500 and tried desperatly to find a skilled mechanics. Only find one but is too far from my home (garage70 france). I am doing it on my own and love every minute. It takes some time but i know now how to deassemble a cam without cutting a 100$ chain ^^. The amount you must charged for that bike if you replace every piece will be insane.
pretty sure someone poured oil in those cylinders in order to protect them from rusting. It was totally salvegeable. obviously after many years without care and due to the opening of cylinder 2 (valve not locked) oil turned to mud with humidity. Sad to see that
Should have been a butcher. The majority of these YT "builders" only know how to assemble and not build bikes. I certainly wouldn't pay too much attention to what they do. They have no patience and lack the engineering skills to work on engines. This was a perfectly salvageable engine but needed some time and money spent on it. Unfortunately in today's society, everyone wants instant gratification, pretty sad really.
Hey man, totally unsarcastic question here, how could you free those pistons up without beating them with a hammer?
@@samvalencia6653 You have a smart phone. Look it up.
Seeing that poor, salvageable engine being repeatedly clubbed with that sledge hammer was like watching the torture scene in Reservoir Dogs for the first time. But without the fun music.
So, how would you have taken it off? And how the hell would you salvage a cylinder block with total rusted and scratched cylinder walls?
@@WeItenspinner Easy. Remove entire engine, Cover pistons with a super light oil like MMO, let sit a couple weeks. Apply heat to the cylinder head to encourage the oil to creep and repeat. Use non metallic dowels and rap the pistons every so often. until free. re-hone the cylinders. It has worked for me many times. He ruined a vintage cylinder head because of his impatience, shame.
@@stevenewsam1993 Thank you very much!
@@WeItenspinner There are other ways. But they require Patiance.
@@stevenewsam1993 Your correct, and he was very impatient. What a waste.
Doesn’t want to break the rotor bolt, takes a hammer to the engine?
There is no time that a motorcycle engine is beyond repair.
Well that was heart stopping!! for such a clean original bike to have a 2lb mash hammer taken to it, may as well used a stick of dynamite. beats me how people with no skill nor care get the gems and the people who would love these things till death get all the butchered crap and do they're best to caress life back into them. so sad.
I had a similar situation with a 550 im restoring,i was able to remove the jugs after several months and one of them the bore is destroyed by rust and i ended up buying some new used jugs on eBay that except for one tiny brake on a fin they are beautiful, difference is that i saved the old jugs because someone out there might be able to use them,definitely didn't take a hammer to it,what might be trash to some of us could be a treasure to others
you need to heat up the cylinders and pour it oil to try to ease the jammed. not a hammer. silly.
Interesting video content on your channel. I got a 74 550 four with a side car from my Dad with 372 original miles on it. I've enjoyed watching your videos to learn more about these older bikes. Thanks for all your hard work making these videos.
Such a shame to see someone with so little patience set to on a seized engine. It was salvageable but it's now ruined.
so right a bit of wd40 a clean up more oil in the cylinders leave 24 hours and tap down with a piece of wood more oil and there you go I have freed off a lot worse than that I cleaned out the rust then I honed the ones which were down-filled with good old wd40 and hay presto they freed off cleaned the pistons honed the bores and she runs like a kitten five years and twenty-five thousand miles since its as you say experience and patience that's all it takes.
@@kinkong1961 its not always working had oil in an 1980 mzts for 2 month didnt even turn 1 bit
@@horstbratpfanne4706 I had the same situation,i was gifted a 550 that had been sitting outside/inside for 30 something years,that engine was seized tight,one piston specially,after 3 months with oil in it i was able to free it but i had my doubts sometimes.
Little patience, I don't think so. I've watched this man spend many hours fixing old bikes and turn out real nice. he decided not to use this engine, has a spare, his shop his choice.
Seeing how he takes off yhe cylinderblock makes me shiver and cosy me five years of my live. I have no words for this lack of respect and skills.
So, how would you have taken it off? And how the hell would you salvage a cylinder block with total rusted and scratched cylinder walls?
@@WeItenspinner You have a smart phone. Look it up. Won't waste my time with details on you.
Mate do me a favor DO NOT TRASH THE MOTOR , sell it to some one who will Fix it please .
Why trash the cylinder block? It's obviously still on factory bore. Surely a rebore and piston kit would have been a better way to go?
Absolutly!. Or a hone and new rings as I did with mine.
Yep. This guy is an amateur. Turning the crank on the rotor side? Clueless
NO....NO.... NO!! He did the right thing. Cost and time wasted on an engine in this disrepair. You are pissing in the wind to think you are going to rebuild
the top end and NOT rebuild the bottom end. Just the fact that the valve keeper is still missing makes using the bottom end a very poor crap shoot.
Don't call him names until you've tried to put a wrench on a bike and tried to make a living at it. It's obvious you've never had to weigh time vs dollars spent.
I can't tell you how many times I've seen bikes in this same shape and had to call the customer to tell them the bad news. Course they blame me for being the bearer of bad news that their poor baby that they left outside for 2 or 3 years, uncovered, with the spark plugs out and now I can't fix it for $50.... and it's MY FAULT! Your are the one that is clueless.
Doesn't anyone rebuild engines anymore, these old honda's are fairly simple to do. if you really want to you can double the hp & maintain reliability
Is that statement true for a CB350F?
For the most part just the problem of getting PARTS is only one of the insurmountable aspects of rebuilding a Honda engine. The other side is that
the amount of time and money invested doesn't make it profitable..... period. He's right..... he's got another engine.... use it!!!
Looking forward to this one!
Guys!. Never ever strike alloy castings with a steel hammer!. Cut a short length of broom stave, put one end of it in an exhaust port ( usually the thickest part of the casting) and strike upward in alternate ports. With barrels, cut the stave into a chissel shape and strike upwards in an area without fins. It works on singles, triples and four's. I had a 500/4 back in the eighties, took me from Birmingham (UK) to the south of france and back without missing a beat. This bike has stood complete and restorable since the late seventies. A couple of hours with this guy and major engine parts are total scrap!!.This vid makes me cringe!!.
It hurt to watch! If anything, a good hone, and at it's worst, it could have been re-sleeved. :-(
@@AdamMcNutt
If it was a stock barrel he'd have three or four stages of reboring and oversize pistons to eliminate any scoring. I would have cleaned the piston crowns and poured in light oil diluted with cellulose thinners which seeps and penetrates like nothing else I've seen comercialy available.
Thanks, as always, for taking us along.
Lot work good luck I think some pb blast and use a wood block is better to hit metal parts with since you went that far I would have split the cases and bored clylenders. That me
My wife and I drove a Honda 500 4 cylinder and Honda 350 4 cylinder from 1976 to 1983 changing over to the 650 and 750 4 cylinder customs. We both enjoyed seeing these old bikes and the video. Looking forward to the next video.
Awesome videos dude! Very informative and educational. Keep it up!
you need to rebuild that motor! Then you get to keep a nice stock bike and that'll be a great experience for you and a great playlist for the channel.
Probably a salvageable block until he took a hammer to it?
Very good video, thanks. I just picked up a complete 74 CB550 that was stored for a long time in a garage. The engine was also locked up. The number 4 cylinder turned out to be the culprit. It was stuck in the bore due from moisture and rust. I also ended up punching a hole in the #4 piston trying to get it out. Once out, the cylinders were inspected and looked relatively good. I may be able to just hone the cylinders....we will see. The mains bearings looked good and appeared to have low miles on them. The rod bearings also looked like they had low miles, but had some scoring through the top coating and will be replaced.
Damn. Reminds me of when I had a spark plug get stuck in my head of my CB750. I took the head off and gently chipped away at the existing plug that corrosion-welded itself to my threads. It wasn’t perfect, but I did everything I can to save the head and it payed off. I would have taken a heat gun to the stuck jugs on your build and honed ‘em out for more giddy-up, but it’s your build! Ride safe and wrench on!
Are you being ironic?. This bike has stood complete and restorable since the late seventies. A couple of hours with this guy and major engine parts are total scrap!!.
So, how would you have taken it off? And how the hell would you salvage a cylinder block with total rusted and scratched cylinder walls?
@@WeItenspinner Have it machined. duh
Keep it as original as possible!!!!!!👍💪🙏
You can unstick a motor with a hydraulic coupler made out of a spark Plug and a Porta Power
Looked really clean otherwise! So cool you found that old registration card. Love those history tidbits! Look forward to seeing this progress.
That history mates me wish you'd put some time into the original motor, even if you replace barrels and head with parts from your spare engine.
Why you did that to the cylinder block???? 😳
OMG Your a HAMMER MECHANIC
Undo 2 bolts on the camshaft sprocket and slide the cam out . Why split the chain ?
The engine is locked up so you cannot rotate it to get to both bolts.
This is the same sort of chap that takes a rare bike and turns it into a bobber or cafe racer. You should have just sold it to someone who actually wants a project. You obviously have no experience of old Hondas. The camchain comes out without splitting it, just take the sprocket off and the tensioner should be removed before you take the head off. As for walloping the barrels or anything with a lump hammer! !!!
How would you take the sprocket off a locked engine?
OH YES! Great channel to stumble across!
This thing was only scrap the moment you used incorrect tools in removing the head or cylinders. This is like cutting off a starter motor because it's bad - only to replace the engine because it is scrap as well.
With new crank shell bearings and a rebore, all of that engine was rebiuldable. That was before you got you're sledge hammer out!!.
I agree, all that was needed was some patience and careful easing of the parts. The pistons were beyond help, but the cylinder head could have been salvaged and rebored before it was clubbed to death with a club hammer. I think that time is the issue here, this would have been a great resto series as it only had one previous owner. In the essence of time and getting videos out we trashed the engine. The bottom end is probably usable if it was de-rusted properly and the gearbox and other engine components are probably in good working order. It’s a real shame.....patience my friend, patience is a virtue.
@@dan40754
That bike has been complete and restorable since the late seventies. It falls into this guys hands and in a couple of hours major engine parts are total scrap!!. If time is an issue he should find another hobby.
I agree, if this had been a really rare Vincent Black Shadow I am sure no club hammers would have been used !! I think that some time using releasing oil and some wooden wedges and drifts that the head would have come apart intact but with the bores damaged. A rebore and new pistons later plus a bottom end refurbishment and all would have been good, I am convinced of that. Very little engineering content, if it don’t work smack it with a hammer and then use a donor part. This could have been a good resto project all original, not now!!
@@dan40754
More like f&%king butchery.
Yeah, I think I'm done watching this guy. As Dr. Dirk said, some patience and "softer" tools like wooden wedges and solvents, and this would have been different. If you really want to honor the original owner, don't beat his bike into scrap so you can get a video out by the end of the day. Beware to his customers.
Hey Taylor, you mentioned it towards the end of this video but that engine stand minimal wire start up would be an awesome video. I hope the new shop is treating you well, it’s pretty cool to see how far you’ve come since I started watching this channel.
rebuild the existing engine if the frame and engine numbers match. its not often you get a bike with the original bits
Sad to see the head ruined now. There are only so many of them left. Put a 550 engine in it. I suspect you will cut and weld on the frame to put the 500 in there, ugh. Please don't.
I would love to find one of those old 750`s, I had the pleasure of having to ride one for a few years. Such a dependable ride and reminds me of my dad.
I have a 77 with a fairing that's in fair shape that needs carb work or a tune up. sgtcrow56@gmail.com
I'm interested. I'm in central Joklahoma.
Really like to see you do something with that motor and keep that bike stuck condition
So even keeled during the surprise. Enjoying all of your videos.
He was "even keeled" because the surprise of a seized top end was insignificant when compared to the extreme violence and damage he inflicted on an otherwise good engine.
I have been watching this channel for the last month and I am very surprised there aren't more subscribers! I'll be very surprised if this doesn't blow up. This is definitely my favorite motorcycle channel on CZcams now. I didn't think I would find something I liked better than FortNine.
The Horror, The Horror!.
RHS passed away on March 22, 2013.
Bike last registered when he was 40 years old.
Most likely are the 2nd owner of the bike.
As for the bike, maybe a vinyl stripe over the letters on the tank to just cover it up? A repaint would be hard to match the original, especilly with the patina it has.
Also the white panniers look horrible, but either color match or black would look better, keeping them if they are easy to take off and on so you can use it to carry little bits of stuff if needed.
Nice shop buddy. I may have used a little more finesse in my approach and tried to save the motor for a rebuild... but to each his own. I have a CL200 that the motor is locked up on. It was my late father in laws and the motor has been seized for 30 years. It's not going to be easy, but I want to restore it to original in his memory.
You got your work cut out for you with this one, looking forward to seeing it come on.
Good luck man
I'm not overly versed in single cam hondas, but is it commonplace to have to brake the cam chain to get the camshaft out? I would have thought you'd back the tensioner off and have it slip out.
Some chains require you to put a pin in. But 9/10, you would release the tensioner. Then slip the chain off the cam gear.
Please run the engine on the stand!!! That would be awesome to learn about
I love the faded gas tank! I'd say try to lightly sand those letters out before you re paint it or something. Even if you can't get them out then I think it adds character lol
I right now have a nerve in my lower back causing pain and discomfort at times. But seeing you take that hammer to the cylinders was the absolute most painful thing I experienced today.
Running the motor with minimum wiring would be wonderful. Be great to see what is needed to get a motor running on the bench. Thank you so much for your videos. I am enjoying them as much as I enjoy Mustie1's videos.
Engine stand video should be out in the next few days. Thanks for watching!
I sewed my '71 seat and all I can add is that you should use some clear flexible adhesive on top of that that, like shoe goo.
That valve dropped after the keeper spit out. Is there makes on the top of that piston where the valve hit it?
At 19.05 is that damage from a flat head pounded between the head where the gasket is all damaged.
Looks like fresh damage. This guy is a brute. Hopefully he'll eventually learn and this video will always be there to shame him.
@@johncrowley5612 A bit HAM FISTED.
Cowboy, absolute cowboy
Try rocking the bike on its wheels, in gear to loosen a frozen motor next time. Doesnt always work of course, but it give you alot mechanical advantage.
Gold!
Im in San Antonio TX. I have a 75 CB550F and oil is leaking slowly from the gasket below the cam chain and valve springs. Never done it before. Im going to try it in a few months when i have time and money. Would rather pay to have it done honestly. Good video.
You should try evaporust/vapor blasting the seized engine parts.
As much as we enjoy doing this work ourselves, I would have been tempted to send the engine out to one of the CB engine shops and let them have a look at it. A second opinion on the crank, cylinders and head would be nice. I would bet they could have saved much of it. Wouldn’t have been cheap, but, like someone said, these parts are getting more rare by the year.
Thanks, and I hope you will video the finished bike,
This could be great candidate for stock showroom resto, all your chrome looks in great condition and apart form the paint damage on the top of the tank it looks great too, i know you can save this thing , the 500 is my favorite bike i did one but it was far to used to do make it show room condition so i went matt black everything. i rebuilt my engine completely, Im in Australia so parts were a lot harder to come by, but i love my CB500. It could actually make good video on the engine rebuild process . If i wasn't on the other side of the world id be volunteering to come help you.
Great video
I would love a project like that but I would have spent a lot longer on disassembly and saving every part possible, the hammer is a tool of last resort for me.
Awesome video dude! Hey, does removing the resonators from a Honda exhaust do any harm to the engine? A 2014 Honda shadow spirit fuel injected. Thanks
Hey man I live in ceader Park Texas, I have a 1972 cb500f engine. Currently with the top end removed, the bottom end spins and has no transmission damage. If your interested cool if not cool 👍
Good luck believe it would be an awesome bike for you to have in your collection it could get well used
I love that paint combo on the 500… there’s an exact 72 500 green and black version looks beautiful. In fb marketplace in Louisville ky for about 3900 …
Génial, une version sous-titrée! Depuis que je suis ta chaîne, c'est la 1ère fois que je peux avoir une traduction!!!
Well, you guys, you had a hint of what was to come when you heard, "I think I'll put a quick top end on it." Given the dearth of good parts available for these, and the usual condition of the cylinders and valves, and the ignorance with which most folks approach machining on these machines...no such thing as "a quick top end".
Odd question, what material are you using on the top of your work bench?
About the gas tank, I restored (preserved) my Z1b tank that had similar damage by carefully masking at the original pin stripes and repainting tat section. The rest of the tank and stripes are original. Finish with 2k clear.
This is the kind of videos I really enjoy to see ! Good work!
If that was your bike and you found someone beating on it with a hammer would you still say "good work" or would you turn the hammer on him?
I'm torn about this. It's an old bike that needs some love and someone will be ready to give it. Deciding to scrap the engine is not consistent with restoration. If it was a regular commercial garage, or would be different. But here, on CZcams land, viewers want to share in a journey and learn. Scrapping achieves nothing.
15:26 i think if you just pulled the chain tensioner you might have been able to jump teeth on the sprocket until you could get the other cam sprocket bolt. Or just reached in with an open end wrench possibly bent custom with a torch... I think every can chain I've replaced was endless and required crank removal to install.
Great vid.
Any chance you could explain how you would attach the motor to that engine stand?
Wouldn't mind trying that for the xs400 I'm rebuilding currently.
Would really love to see your videos show a rebuild thru to riding!
Its been under water, in a flood zone or some such
I thought the same thing, a flood. All that silt on the bike under the seat, in the bags, and likely in the pipes/engine too. Pretty trashed out now. Love all the other mayhem comments. I dont think I will have him touch my bikes any time soon.
Hi,if you heat the cylinder block ,the liners will push out
Gonna be a fun build to see what is up with the motor. Auction bike is like a box of chocolates, never know what you get. Nothing sweet about that motor.
you can rebuild that engine replace all berings and seals i have not seen a video of that
Hey, I'm a fan of you vlogs so much so I have been looking at CB's. I like the way you go through with detail and ask for suggestions. I do not know much about motorcycles and that being said I found a 73 cb750 so the seller says. I am going to look at it this fri. The tank doesn't look like the 73 tanks I've seen, no air box, crazy seat. So nothing seems original, could I send you a picture, maybe you can tell me something about it ?? Maybe email a pic of the bike. Look forward to hearing from you
the hammer scene was awful ......
Like watching someone torture kittens assuming it's the only thing to do.
What a shame the original engine was toast. It looked so clean . . . I guess there might be some parts that could be salvaged for later use. I can't imagine how someone managed to get all that dirt, dust and goop into the engine. Glad you decided to keep it stock and more correct.
Well, that motor is stuffed!! What about a performance modified motor from a 1982 CB650, would it fit? CR carbs and a neat Yoshi 4/1 pipe.
20:00 I don't know what kind of "ground beef" you're eating, but it looks more like ground beef after being processed through the digestive system.
Plus are there kits available to upgrade to disc brakes???
Keeping one original bike would be fun. I'm not a purist but not every bike has to be a cafe racer?
It takes longer than an hour to free off seized pistons !! That is why u screwed it up !!
I would give that tank a laser Cut sign in a matching colour in a vintage style,with my own initials and saying when it was rebuild, to cover the Old initials or Else there are the good Old flames offcourse 😁👍🏻🔥🔥
After you go through all these bikesFrom head to toe do you ever sell them. I haven’t rode a bike in 50 years but seeing your videos gets me to thinking thanks
instead of destroying the chain all you had to do is take the timing chain adjuster and loosen it up and you two had all the slack in that chain that you ever need to get it off of that cam. Cam gear
You are better off splitting the cases and going through it, doing the a minimal clean up.
Just an off topic question. I have a cb550 that I’m restoring. I need a new gas tank as the old one is rusted right through. Problem is I live in Hong Kong. Anybody have any tips on the best place to find one?
Thanks
Jon
jonathan ash webike.com in Japan a bit north of you 😎. japan.webike.net/HONDA/CB550/251/mtop/
Can you put a 750 engine in the 500?
Not sure if you did such a good thing hitting the motor...I've rebuilt many and never destroyed one.
You had a good original bike with a siezed motor. A bit of time and effort would have seen it repaired. You took a sledge hammer to it instead. I know America has more of these than Europe and so they are worth less but that was what I expect from a teenager with no skills. You could have removed the cam chain tensioner and drilled out the centre of the stuck piston. Butcher not mechanic. Tempted to unsubscribe.
stevegrim. I agree. This has me Pissed. I AM UNSUBSCRIBING.
Yet another hacker.