PREMIUM Aluminum Gravel??
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- čas přidán 14. 10. 2023
- A first look at my new Blackheart Bike Aluminum Allroad frame built up around Shimano GRX and Logos Epoché carbon wheels. What is high-end aluminum? Why is 7005 alloy superior to 6061? Why are aluminum bike frames becoming more popular (again)?
Blackheart Bike Co.
blackheartbikeco.com/
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The color is AWESOME!!! Too bad it doesn’t fit 700/45 c tires at least.
Keep an eye out for bigger tire versions in the future 🖤
Really nice bike! I am also of the opinion that the frame material is not as important as most people think it is. Rather have nice components and light wheels! Thanks Nolan!
A road oriented gravel bike, awesome.
You hitting it with your analysis of the frame material!
There are a lot people out there with outdated strong opinions about frames , hopefully you made some of them reconsider their (sometimes) fanatic praising of others frame materials.
Overanalyze everything!
Dude that burnt bronze is sick looking 🔥 I agree ride what you like and not what the trend follows, a skilled rider can make it fun on any different material bike.
Thank Goodness for threaded BBs!!!😀👍🏽
Have you tried threaded BB’s for pressfit? They solve this perceived problem. See Token Ninja and Wheels MFG.
I second that you can "engineer" the ride feel more by the choice of wheels (rim, spokes, tire, tire pressure, and even seatpost and handlebar) - for an everyday cyclist like me, I can't really tell the difference between my carbon frame and titanium and steel frame. 😎 They have different ride qualities, yes - but it's more the wheels that give that "ride feel" 👽
The color looks amazing! Beautiful Build!
I ordered an AllRoad Ti a few weeks ago, and I can't wait to get back on two wheels!
A lot of people really seem to believe that steel as a material inherently has a compliant feel 😂😂
In fact, steel IS stiffer than aluminum. The compliance comes from the fact that steel could get away with narrow, thin tubing due to its strength and fatigue resistance. Aluminum frames are lesser in those aspects back then so manufacturers resorted to utilizing hydroforming and large diameter tubes so that the frame barely bends at all, increasing the frame's fatigue life.
Nowadays aluminum alloy production and processing has advanced so much that frames can get away with tubing similar to steel, making modern aluminum frames significantly more compliant than older frames without much drawbacks in fatigue failures.
Right on. I mean, there are differences in frame material, but these days I think tires and component spec make a bigger difference in feel
How does compliance mesh with fatigue life? Aluminum unlike steel or titanium has a much lower fatigue life; isn't a compliant AL frame inviting flex, and therefore fatigue? If the argument is that it'll be 10 years or something before that becomes an issue, that's a pretty valid viewpoint. But if it's less than that...
Plus, I'm a big rider; there will be more flexing regardless of material. :)
@@matt.3.14 Previously yes, now to a lesser extent. Advancements in all aspects of aluminum alloy processing, stock forming, part manufacturing, welding, and frame fabrication adds up to the significant increase in load cycles before failure.
When it comes to fatigue failure in bike frames, the point of failure isn't commonly on the median sections of the tubes, especially with modern 7000 series aluminum alloys withstanding more load cycles than ever, but rather on the weld areas, where despite the annealing process those areas have deteriorated strength (too brittle). With progress in alloying (e.g. addition of scandium), aluminum alloys retain elasticity by reducing unwanted recrystallizations during forming or welding (better weldability when the weld filler has scandium too), therefore not eliminating but significantly reducing the adverse effects of welding on yield strength and fatigue resistance.
I did the similar thing earlier this year... Bought an allroad/gravel aluminum frame with 40 mm tire clearance (very affordable frame) and built a bike. It is amazing. I do have it currently in a road configuration.
I agree re: design is more important than material, but the material does have a general characteristic. In my experience, aluminum can ride quite well with careful design (Orbea Avant in my case), but steel is still the ultimate for me re: ride quality and liveliness. Good luck with the new bike!
Love the video as usual. All my bikes are aluminium and I literally put on a Ritchey Butano 42" on my gravel bike today :)
Unfortunate about the rear tire clearance... how about running a 40mm in front and a 38mm of the same brand/model tire in the rear, if available? I had to do that with my Cannondale Slate which can fit probably 50+mm in the front but only 40mm in the rear (so I have 45mm front and 40mm rear of different brands and models... horrors ;)
Yea I’ve since installed 40mm raffles. Fit is great. I suspect that blackheart is working on something more like a gravel bike with more clearance - the market clearly demands it
“I got another bike so I can have fewer bikes in the garage” - delusions of a cycling addict. I’ve said the same thing and I have more bikes than ever.
😆 Promise I'll sell 2 after building this one
Nice build! I'm kind of regretting going 1x. I like what you say at 6:30 about frame material making smaller and smaller contributions to ride feel. In my opinion, carbon frames are highly overrated. However, weight bearing carbon components are where the elusive "butter" resides. I often wanted to throw my carbon bike in the ditch, after 25 or 30 miles, when I first got it. However, after changing to carbon wheels, wider and lower psi tires, carbon seat post, and carbon bars... it was Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde. 😊 On the other materials, high-end steel (Reynolds, True Temper, Columbus, Tange) is real. Run of the mill steel is... run of the mill. And Ti is overpriced, even for globally sourced tubing, basic designs, and tube structures. Ti bikes like Moots or Seven, etc. demand that money trees bloom year round. However, there are a lot of braggers who say these brands ride like magic carpets. Not sure if they are just psyching themselves so not to have buyer's remorse, or the frame geo and tube structures are that good. I probably will never know... my money tree never blooms. 😁
I really appreciate your channel. Keep up the "no BS" theme... It's much needed!
Thanks for sharing! I bought the Ti version after your initial review a while back... Loving it.
Ya Zack! Glad you're digging the bike.
Acompanhando aqui do Brasil. Canal sempre com ótimos vídeos e excelente qualidade de conteúdo. parabéns
I never lost my faith in aluminum thankfully this versatile material is a “mainstay”, Although It is my hope that when you install the new treads, that you will shoot a video field test on this next level balls to the wall bike! 🚴
Very, very cool bike.
Love the shapes, love the welds, love the round tubes and the proportions of the bike. No stupidly dropped seatstays to be seen. The ceracote finish is really classy and lifts the aesthetics of the bike.
Good that you mention the fact that carbon fibre bike put a strain on the environment. Carbon fibre is wastefull already during manufacturing and can not be recycled. Sooner or later all carbon bikes will end up in landfills. Aluminium, steel and titanium can be recycled 100%.
Agree with everything, but I do fancy a little seat stay drop 😀
@@TheBikeSauce yup, dropped seat stays make all kinds of design sense.
Sick bike !
Really intelligent look on this build. I agree, frame material is becoming less important. I have modern steel, magnesium, and carbon builds. Not blown away or disappointed by any of the materials. My Vaast A/1 is set up similar to your 2 bikes-in-1 Blackheart and I’m completely happy. Enjoy your rides!
Nice looking build Nolan 🖤
Very excited about this one 🙏🙏🙏
I took a long look at this bike but I thought the chainstays were too short and the 225 max weight limit was a bit off-putting for me. I'm 6'4" 195lbs, but I did ballon up during the covid lockdown. I'm going with the Mason Bokeh instead. I've been riding their Definition aluminum road bike for 8 years now and have developed a deep love for that bike. This Blackheart is a beautiful looking bike though. Just not what I'm looking for.
Hey you should look into the new drop bar gravel bike from the mountain bike company Commencal- it’s called the 365, 6069 aluminum, nice geometry and component choices. It came out quietly 4 months ago, love to see a review, Commencal makes good stuff.
Saw that one. Not convinced they’d send a demo, but I’ll try
Hi Nolan, What makes this different (other than you’re doing frame-up) from a Niner RLT9 aluminum (take your pick of build) or Trek Checkpoint ALR? (if they still sell the aluminum version).
good objective video. and you're spot on about frame material in that it's how a material is applied is far, far more important than just the material itself.
I'm surprised at the the level of delusion that's still out there regarding that scenario.
I've got a Blackheart Allroad Ti that does pretty much only specific road duty with light wheels and fast 30mm tires. it's a versatile and quick bike that's just fun to ride a lot. win/win.
I like the build. 20.5 lbs for a do-it-all must be exquisite.
i really like how they didn't go crazy hydroforming the tubing. it's like the gravel version of the BC original podsol. i'm all for that classic look. hope people catch on to how good 7005 is. Perhaps companies will go the banshee paradox route and engineer compliance into the yokes and drop outs to make them even better. wishful thinking
Love all my 7005 up till they reach 15 years old and they corrode under the paint
@@janeblogs324You still can't beat good old 6061 T6,excellent corrosion and strength almost the same as 7005 T6.
Awesome bike,I love the oversize tubing and chunky welds,aluminium for me is still the best frame material,super strong,lightweight and no rust.💯👌🏻🚴♀️P.S,how much was the complete build?
Right on! Price will vary, but frame is Blackheart AL allroad, GRX 600 group, Logos Epoche wheels.
@@TheBikeSauceSo I'm guessing approx $4500 for complete build.
How does it compare with your winspace g2 ?
Would you consider this bike for some mellow ish bikepacking? Maybe like a night or two out into the woods and back? At most maybe some mellow single track…otherwise some fire roads or old railroad trails.
Bike is totally capable. It lacks mounting points (racks will be a challenge) but you can certainly strap some bags on and go.
@@TheBikeSauce perhaps a tailfin set up would do the trick.
What’s your opinion on the geometry for bikepacking? Any issues or concerns there?
Hi. Can i ask what your seat height is on the 52cm pls
Lot of companies returning to Aluminium - Example?
Carbon is a placebo, especially for thicker tires??
Purdy schlick 👍
Gold jockey wheels please sir 👍
Problem is when aluminum bike, as premium as it may be, costs as much as a carbon or a high kevel steel equivalent... how does it compaee woth your Ritchey Outback?
I can see alu frames starting to creep up with greater popularity. It’s bound to happen. The outback is a completely different bike, so it’s tough to compare. Even ride quality, the outback has RH 48mm tires, and the blackheart now has 40mm raddlers. I hope alu frames don’t explode in price tho..
@TheBikeSauce you're right. In fact, it has been going on for some time with components, where the common 6061 handlebars have been more and more flanked by lighter 7075 versions (Ritchey does that). Now it's happening with bikes as well.
"I no longer believe that the frame material itself is as critical in determining how a bike rides"... Finally, truth.
I agree that aluminum has come a long way and can be more refined towards ride quality. Although so has carbon and Ti in addition to stainless steel is also more curated towards ride quality but usually at a much higher price. Then when you factor the variables of tire size and rim width and material of the wheel set that also makes the difference. I’ve recently purchased a Berd spoke custom wheel set for my hardtail and it was incredibly nicer than my steel spoke wheels. Probably going to eventually get a custom gravel wheel set for my next build.
Funny thing is that designing that compliance in accelerates the fatigue of a very fatigue prone material. Designing compliance into a metal bike is only a good idea for titanium and stainless
@@veganpotterthevegan I have heard that aluminum can corrode badly and we all know that steel can rust but personally I’ve owned a steel or aluminum frame that rusted or that the corrosion ruined it, but I have seen it happen.
@hardmtnbiker working as a mechanic, I've seen plenty of corrosion on steel and aluminum. It really is location and maintenance dependent though. A fair weather rider in the dessert will never really have to worry about corrosion. The only way to avoid fatigue for aluminum(and less so for steel) is keeping it on a storage hook😅
need more purple
I got a fever.. 😆
Gold jockey wheels please sir 👍
That would be a nice touch on this one 😀
Share the color code!!!
Burnt bronze H-148, graphite grey H-146
This is where the Vitus Venon EVO could make better sense at this price point.
Where's the build video my friend?
Lol I need time to edit. A week I’d say
@@TheBikeSauce nice! You really threw that build together in a jiffy!
I am no liking those short chainstays and cramped rear triangle - Blackheart makes some nice bikes -
but the geometry here is super lacking if you can't get tires in without rubbing the back of the seattube no matter what material goes into the frame.
To be fair, its the tire that's overstated here. A 40mm tire fits just fine.
Lovely bike but that rear triangle is just too small. I don’t understand why people design gravel frames with such limited rear tyre clearance. It’s a fundamental design flaw. As soon as they get caked up in mud and grit they become a sanding wheel which is inevitably going to damage the rear of the seat tube. It’s also not going to hugely adversely affect geometry having slightly longer chain stays. There’s a happy medium to be had. These bike companies are making gravel frames with road rear triangles! Ok on 650b wheel set but fit a 700c and you’re done. The Brother Mehteh is the same with 700c fitted and 40mm tyres. It’s practically touching. It also looks ridiculous too from an aesthetic point.
I suppose on the spectrum, this bike leans more toward road (it’s an Allroad bike). Whereas a ‘traditional’ gravel frame will prioritize clearance, a road frame would prioritize compact geo.
Thanks for the feedback. Nolan is spot on that this is an Allroad design. Going larger on rear tire clearance means longer chainstays, dropped chainstays, or a cutout seat tube. All of these would compromise on road handing and road aesthetic, which we prioritized on this model. Keep an eye out for a gravel-specific design with 50mm tire clearance in the future.
Plenty of reasons not to buy this bike. But if you give a bike more clearance, most of us will exploit that and will throw a bigger tire on that will be just as likely to sand a frame away
Great bike and frame, but that crooked Blackheart logo is hideous, like a 12 yo used Windows Paint the first time. And website doesn't offer "no logo" option
So you’re saying you picked aluminum cause everyone else is picking aluminum again?
He’s ahead of the curve. Most big manufacturers had moved away from aluminum, except for their low-end bikes but now we might start seeing higher end builds in custom aluminum manufacturing making a come back. Problem for me is frameset is $1500, that was custom steel few years ago. Diverge E5 elite $2k with grx 400, bike in video likely well over $3k with carbon wheels and grx600. Though you can hit that with Trek Checkpoint or Niner RLT 9 alloy and their tubing profiles are pretty good too. 🤷🏻♂️
💯
1:36 size 52 doesn't mean anything these days
It's a pointer to the geo chart
Why do I keep coming across videos claiming that aluminum bikes are coming back? As far I can tell every big bike manufacturer has been making alloy frames uninterrupted for the last 30 years.
No doubt. I think the focus is shifting back toward aluminum for higher-end bikes, which had previously been dominated by carbon and boutique steel.
Premium price...average bike with cool wrapping
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