Explained: How “Relative Risk Reduction” (Vs “Absolute Risk”) exaggerates Medical Study results…
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- čas přidán 4. 08. 2022
- Here is a basic explainer about to crucial concepts to know about when looking at any medical research study results: Relative Risk Reduction (RRR) versus Absolute Risk Reduction (ARR)
Other explainer video:
• How “Evidence-based Me...
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Great information. I've been trying to explain this very thing to people for years. The lack of mathematical and statistical education is staggering, as is the degree to which how easily people are suckered. *All* medical efficacy studies should include changes in *absolute* risk.
Me too. People are victims of creative math.
And it's not actually that complicated. But an educated society is not controllable. Even those I considered educated before, are no longer in that category.
@@jamesdefrancesco7765 the first thing I discovered in a statistics class was that every statistic can have outliers and can be skewed. Once I knew that everything changed.
We need more doctors like you ❤️
This is such an important point. When I had cancer, the adjuvantive treatment that was recommended had "30% risk reduction" according to the doctor. Now, I'm a physician myself. So I looked up the studies. 30% was the relative risk reduction.
Of 100 patients with my cancer stage and biology, 25 had suffered a relapse within 5 years. 8 of the relapses could have been prevented by the suggested therapy. That makes it 8% for relapse and it was 2% absolute percentage for death in 5 years. I didn't take the treatment and 7 years later, I'm still in full remission.
So glad you are doing well! Thank the Lord!
... and probably a lot healthier because you avoided the side-effects of the treatment.
I am very glad to hear that , lots of blessings ! 🙏
It's sad how people have been manipulated to take the juicy juice.
Statins are promoted this way. Big trail shows RRR of about 30%. ARR is 1%
Thank you. Statins are a perfect example. And isn’t it fascinating that once the patents expire, pharma’s push disappears? Of course they continue to be patient makers. Win-win for everyone but the patient who fails to do their homework.. I’m so happy Dr. Dhand is speaking out about this.
When I tried to explain the difference between relative and absolute risk reduction on a covid forum and it's significance in evaluating the effectiveness and more importantly the necessity of the vaccines I was vilified and called a conspiracy theorist. I despair at how utterly brainwashed most people. are and the futility of trying to enlighten them.
I agree with you Martin. It is a sad fact that people simply do not do any research and just believe whatever they are told. Unfortunately, they are simply sheep being led to slaughter.
I had the same experience as you. and I still run into the same today. Even when I put it in simple words: "Absolute risk reduction is simply subtracting the event RATES between the two groups" Then I give an example. 10.9% - 8.7% = 2.2%. They say "That's your analogy" or "you are a conspiracy theorist" These people are so dumb they can't do 3rd grade math.
I read about RRR and ARR last year. I can’t believe the ARR for the c shots are not being shared!
We thank you Suneel. Seriously. Don't stop.
“Statistics don’t lie, but liars use statistics.”
another example. covid vaccines are 95% effective according to relative risk reduction, absolute risk reduction is less than 1%
Yep! Dr. Richard Fleming did an excellent video analyzing all the original data submitted by the pharmaceutical companies showing this. It’s a shame that the general public isn’t aware of this, but if you try to explain it, most people won’t listen.
And if you didn’t die from covid the vaccine wasn’t even 1%.
Some of my 80 year old patients are getting it for second time after vaxx years ago. Second time is like a cold, a discomfort. Then back to their room they go. irony is , if they go out an exposed yet negative they have to quarantine for 14 days , if you ACTUALLY have it quarantine for 5
The absolute reduction is what affects you! The relative reduction is a statistics game. This is one of the biggest lies of the pandemic. The FDA recommends the absolute reduction. Why then use the relative risk reduction? Mistake or big lie you make the call.
@@scottpecorino6320 i cant think of any other industry that quotes the effectiveness of its products in rrr
J.R.R. Tolkien: "Evil cannot create anything new, They can only corrupt & ruin what good forces have invented or made."
I have long argued that RR and AR should be required in the heading of a study. RR is very deceptive - that's why it is used so often.
NNT Number Needed to Treat and NNV Number Needed to Vaccinate are also important concepts.
They tell you how many people you need to treat to get one beneficial effect. 10k people treated to save 8 lives gives an NNT of 1,250 people treated per life saved. Costs? Side-effects? Risk benefit ratio.
Relative Risk Reduction vs Absolute Risk Reduction are concepts we need to keep in mind as we “follow the science” and “ follow the data” 🤔
And "follow the money".
There is bias in analyzing data just like there is bias in collecting data and just like there is bias in presenting data. It’s all human error or disingenuousness.
That is why people specialize in understanding data validity and statistics.
Really hope a LOT of people watch and understand this video. Thanks, Doc.
Thanks Doc. For some reason, grasping the precise difference between RRR and ARR can be a little slippery for some of us. A review and explanation like the one you here provide is always welcome.
Thank you Dr Dhand, extremely relevant topic as today's medical professionals seem to expect blind obeisance, when it has been proven many - if not most - of them have been thoroughly compromised in their seeking of mass profits vs mass health of patients.
I love the robotic repeating of a statistical reduction without swaying which is exactly what we are seeing in some these days. It shameful how so many ppl were duped....and harmed and then on top of that gaslighted to believe they weren't.
Yep the gaslighting is almost the worst part, bad enough to go thru something thinking its beneficial,but to find out you have been lied to or manipulated by the medical community just makes it more appauling. Just no end to the b.s..
Nice. It's good to see the difference. No other Doctor, except for Dr. Dhand, is making this clear to a wide audience.
Dr. Mobeen also. 😉🙂
No other doctor? What is your sample size?
Dr Richard Fleming
This has been out concerning statins and now the jabs for years. I knew this about statins 8 years ago. But the more that know as time goes on then more people can make a choice. Cheers.
@@junkgirltoo5005 I immediately thought of statins also. Tiny absolute risk reduction. Cheers to you as well.
Always enjoy your insight on medicine!!
RRR is always used for statins, showing a reducton of 50 to 80% for heart attacks, whereas the absolute risk reduction is miniscule, and there is a nett negative effect on all cause mortality. But hey, statins are given out free like smarties, we're not paying for them. The reality is that huge amounts of taxpayers' money is being wasted on statins.
In my experience as a practice nurse many patients have no idea they are on statins and what they are for! Lots also have side effects especially a cough but continue to take because the ‘dr told them to’ 🤦🏻♀️
Statins also affect your bowels and your brain.
@@dollydaydream246Do you "educate" them on the risks and benefits then?
I have a hard time understanding why doctors prescribe medications but never give you risk/benefit or warn of side effects so we can make smart decisions based on truth. For example, my doctor wants to put me on biologics for RA and tells me bad side affects are rare. However when I talk to 3 of my friends who have been on them all 3 have had infections, some serious and one gal almost died twice. Now how is 3 out of 3 RARE. AND THEN I LOOK AT WHAT DOCTORS GET FROM DRUG COMPANIES IT ANGERS ME. IF I WAS A DOCTOR I WOULD NOT ACCEPT ANY MONEY FROM DRUG COMPANIES. I HAVE NO FAITH IN THE SYSTEM. So I will probably suffer with RA because I don’t trust doctors to tell the truth
Pam V. Have you seen videos from physicians committee for responsible medicine about RA? They have a doctor on staff that overcame RA. I wish you the best to improve your health. I’m so sorry to hear about your friends.
I was able to get RA (as a symptom of chronic lyme) into remission by using herbal protocols, eliminating wheat and all processed sugar, and doing all I could to cool inflammation. After several months of trying to get referrals/approvals for chronic lyme treatment from conventional docs, I gave up and ultimately did it on my own. I have never been so glad for the fecklessness of our corrupt medical system. I still use most of the therapies to keep healthy and it has really improved my life and outlook. Good luck to you, I hope you heal.
Pam V. I hope you can find some naturopathic doctors or doctors who have researched RA and think outside the box who can help you. That is so sad about your friends, but you are wise not to go on these medications your doctor recommends.
Same with my best friend and self. I always read side effects before taking anything. If I am comfortable with the possibility of any of this happening to me I will give it a try. But some have several pages of side effects and some very bad ones. I urge everyone to do the same before trying anything.
They dont tell you the side effects because they know you wont take it when you hear them. Same with the VA××
Another excellent presentation of critical information! 👍
My pleasure James- thanks for watching!
Here's a real study involving Atorvastatin, the component of the study unaffected went from 99% to 98.64% in the control study. This was reported as a reduction in CHD death by 36% in the statin group. In reality, it was barely perceptible and almost a rounding error.
Thanks, doc. I appreciate your content. A good example of this is the statin meta analysis in JAMA recently.
I saw a video by a guy named Dr Ron Brown on this very topic about 6 months into the 'demic, & haven't heard much about it from anyone since. I'm happy to see it being talked about more, not many 'laymen' are familiar with the term at least in my experience, & msm certainly won't be enlightening people to the concept.
Look up Dr. Richard Fleming
We need integrative (metaphysical) medicine!
If you have only 167 infections in the placebo group of 20.000 within two months then there is only a very low risk of infection anyway and it is impossible to judge the efficacy of a vaccine in such a setting...
Thank you doc. RRR really only matters to scientists comparing studies. But what matters to people is the ARR and total number to treat. RRR is aka "efficacy" this buzzword gets thrown around to coerce people. It's very deceptive imo. The public really should know all of the facts
Having followed Prof. Norman Fenton, i have known this for a year now. 😄
Thank you Dr. Nice to see you again.
Thanks for watching Sandra!
Dr I know after watching many of your videos what your opinion is on the vax. I am not I one of the 20 yr old and I decided not to vax. Never regretted it. I am currently recovering from covid and it reminded me of influenza I had some years ago. Still have no intention of getting a jab! Don't like the data & side affects that keep showing up or big pharama relationships with Gov CDC WHO etc.
We're 65 and 70, both unjabbed, both high BP and a bit overweight. Got covid, felt tired, achy for a few days, back to normal after 2 weeks - we take various supplements which I believe helped. Both of us agreed that we've had worse colds and flu!! Like you, we've never regretted not getting these jabs, even though it's cost me $$ as I had to quit my job, and the more info that keeps coming out, the happier I am about our decision! Stay healthy - at 20 your whole life is ahead of you - best wishes!!
@@andersonomo597 So sorry that this cost you your job, but you did the right thing! I also did not get vaxxed, but had already lost my job shortly after Covid hit and before the so called ‘vaccines’ became available.
Well, now you have proper immunity which so faux vaccines do not give. I'm 69 and un-jabbed and a very pro-jab friend, whose had 4, recently got Covid and was quite ill.
@@shirleyswaine4701 So many jabbed & boosted have gotten covid...pretty sure I probably recovering from BA5 which is highly contagious and is everywhere. Letting g my natural immune system do its thing supporting it by mindful care while recovering. No jabs for me!
@@shirleyswaine4701 And I'll bet they said 'but it would have been far worse if I wasn't vaccinated!' NEGATIVE efficacy of these jabs is rapidly becoming apparent - and it's being covered up, unsurprisingly!
Very interesting and informative!
Fraud runs rampant in science these days. There is enormous pressure for researchers to publish papers in peer reviewed journals. The peer reviewed journals get paid big bucks to publish submitted papers, thereby setting up a direct conflict of interest. When I was at university I assisted my professors in a study they were conducting and witnessed them first hand committing fraud with their methodology. They were looking for a certain outcome before they even began the study and made sure they got the outcome they wanted. In science these days there are very few replication studies ever done to confirm the results of prior studies. Everyone just wants to publish the studies with the new latest and greatest attention grabbing title. Of the few replication studies that have been done there has been an upwards of 40% rate of not being able to replicate the results of prior studies.
I have many times read the abstract of a study and it's conclusions, and then read the full text of the study only to discover it was full of methodological errors or the raw data didn't support the conclusions, or both. I believe science as a method of inquiry is wonderful but these days all too often that's not how it's being used. It's not science that is the problem, but scientists.
I agree as a psych major and having published my own study, I am appauled at how some studies are manipulated for results and a study is only valid when can be replicated. So thanks.
Exactly, you are speaking exactly what i have been thinking.
You’re a hero. A truly honest man . ThankYou.
You're a good bloke Suneel, I like you.
The most egregious use of statistics is using RRR for the benefit of drug, but using absolute statistics for the side effects.
This is a great video. This is still being we all needed to know these past two years.
There are "lies, damned lies and statistics". Since the beginning of the current enforced treatment protocols the daya shared have always indicated, to those with training in statistical analysis, that the claims made were done in a manner to manipulate people to a certain behavioural outcome. This has all been a dumpster fire at all levels.
When I mentioned relative risk reduction compared to absolute risk reduction to my local pharmacist, his eyes glazed over… 🙄
People used the numbers/data in such a way to cause fear.
Just makes me hope I never get sick and need medical intervention!
RRR is more relevant when the ARR is high but not so much when ARR is low.
Wow, that was really interesting, a revelation. I understand better the old quote that "There are lies, there are damned lies - and then there are statistics". In particular, this made me think of when, at the age of 50, with raised but not excessively raise cholesterol, I was put on statins, despite there being no instance of heart disease below the age of 60 in my family and all the women living to at least their mid-80's. My then GP kept upping the dose until I began getting numb arms in the evening - I stopped them immediately and altogether and never got numb arms again.
Yes same with me. they were also promoted to me as means in my 30s to stop migraines. I never did take them after reading about them and asked for another migraine med. Seems after a certain age they really push the statins. So who is really profiting from so many taking them?
Ref. The Lancet (medical journal) article entitled The Elephant (not) in the Room
Critical thinking and statistics should be compulsory subjects for all schoolchildren. We would then be able to see through the lies of government and the authorities. But they won't be made compulsory, because we would then be able to see through the lies of government and the authorities.
I agree with you. Of course some “authorities” do not want us to think or to have any understanding of statistics and absolute risk.
So true Dr. Dhand!
Thank you, Dr. Dhand! An important concept!
Keep on keepin' on!
I heard that the Pfizer reduction was 94% (which was all over the news). This was a RRR with a real or ARR figure of 0.8% . I have posted this important information many, many times.
The absolute reduction is what affects you! The relative reduction is a statistics game. This is one of the biggest lies of the pandemic. The FDA recommends the absolute reduction. Why then use the relative risk reduction? Mistake or big lie you make the call.
@@scottpecorino6320 In my mind it's all been one GIGANTIC lie from the very start.
I am sick of seein drug pushing on TV Commercials...not health psa just pharma....enough! Drugs creates people thinking drugs are the answer to everything.
I wish they’d outlaw those pharma ads like they outlawed cigarette ads on TV. It’s sickening.
@@vivaciousom5347 agree
Thank you Dr. Suneel 👍
How about adding # Needed to Treat!
MD's are not scientifically trained. Memorization is required, and that is about it. When MD's become research professors in the US they typically also study for a Masters degree in science to educate them in science (not even a PhD, but at least a masters in something)
YES!!!!! This was exactly my basis for not getting vaccinated 'Against' covid infection. I advised nurses of these facts and they had never heard of the relation between the two. There's a reason it wasn't reported in the media. Nobody would be queuing for a clot shot. Zero units shifted.
“You want to live in reality” 😂🙌👏💛
Lipitor is a great example of this that you are speaking of.
Sartre quote, “The worst part about being lied to is knowing you weren’t worth the truth.” ...
Thank you so much for this!
If the Clinical Trial is reported by a media service owned by a convicted felon, do you think it's BS or safe?
BS
Thinking especially of statins...
That is very helpful to know
That, yes, but also your comedic relief =)
Good work and thank you sir
Thanks for all your vlogs Dr Dhand! I wish you’d get a microphone that doesn’t echo your voice. This would be easier and more pleasant to listen to.
Sign up for weekly webinar with FLCCC ALLIANCE, lots of great information
Project mockingbird
Hubby was put on statins and did some research - and stumbled across the RRR vs ARR. He's stopped taking them. The side effects are not worth the *TINY* ARR!!
Exactually amd so many ways and things to do to help other then take statins.
If I were to tell you that the moon was made out of cheese, would you believe that? Of course not. But now, if I tell you it's made out of sand....
You: Maybe.
Me: If I tell you I know for sure?
You: Then I would believe you.
Me: So you now know that the moon is made out of sand?
You: Yes.
Me: But it isn't.
You: I only said I knew because you said you knew.
Me: I lied.
Me: Knowledge isn't truth. It's just mindless agreement. You agree with me. I agree with someone else. We all have knowledge. We haven't come any closer to the truth of the moon.
You can never understand anything by agreeing... by making definitions. Only by turning over the possibilities. That's called thinking. If I say I know, I stop thinking. As long as I keep thinking, I come to understand. That way, I might approach some truth.
Me: That's the best conversation you ever had.
You: Is it over?
Me: You think it had better be.
Agree
I'm a c O v I D Nurse. I've had it twice. Last positive was nearly 2 years ago. Still NO smell or taste. Also have a very very Swollen Abdomen. They stated c O v I d intestines. Well WTF. They have NO clue what to do. My abdomen looks 9 months preggo at times then goes down a bit. Still to this day NO answers. No Dr I've seen knows what do to or say. I can even take a big bite of Wasabe an only makes my eyes water just No taste. My smell comes an goes about 10% So safe to say I have permanent nerve damage.
Have you looked up Dr Shankera Chetty, South African doctor who has a lot of information on this.
@@helenryan2848 Thank you. Here in the States they are not allowed to speak Science or Truth. This Dr gave more info in 5 min than allowed here. I don't know is the new response. And they really don't know. Thank you
Look up professor Norman Fenton who does lots of great analysis of this type of statistical presentations on data.
T h a n k y o u s i r ! ! !
What can be done to bring about positive changes in what is taught in medical schools?
So obvious but we can't see the forest because of the trees?
The absolute reduction is what affects you! The relative reduction is a statistics game. This is one of the biggest lies of the pandemic. The FDA recommends the absolute reduction. Why then use the relative risk reduction? Mistake or big lie you make the call.
👍💝
Safe and effective?
No, no, no, trust hig pharma and the feds to have your best interests in mInd.
This is sarcasm.
Thank you Dr. Dhand. It's good to have you back.
How do we get rid of clots in our body?
Can anyone please help me with something? I recently visited an elderly aunt who had a sore throat and a cold she caught through air conditioning. Because she tested negative for cov and she is fuly vexed she felt it was ok not to tell me she was unwell and not only that she coughed all over me without covering her mouth. I came down with covid. Is it possible for sb to pass cov on if they have tested negative for it? How do I explain it to her? Or would I have caught it anyway because my immune sustem is low?
The tests aren't reliable!!
I tested negative for Covid but my daughter got it from me. She had a headache for a day. I had mild cold symptoms. The only reason we knew had it for sure is because we had antibody testing done months later. The tests are unreliable and very often inaccurate.
The short answer is yes! The tests are not always accurate.
👍🏻
💟☮️☯️
❤ actually I just want to go with my gut feelings on life, whether it is political ot medical ! And your CZcams Settle my gut, like dark horse, like Jordan Peterson
Classic massaging of how statistical figures are delivered, in order to confuse mathematically illiterate minds.
Works a treat.
$$$ B I G
PHARMA $$$
I heard when he plays red alert he picks the Russians ....
Wow! You need to understand the jargon.
Open slather for con-men.
See, its better not to see doctors.
Very bad examples.