HEATED Lauren Southern Debate Forces Moderator Into A Corner
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- čas přidán 29. 07. 2024
- Destiny reviews the Lauren Southern and Counterpoints vs SerfsTV and Tails debate that ends up with host and moderator DylanBurnsTV begging one side to talk more...
Date: 5 Aug, 2021
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0:00 - Teasers/Intro
0:55 - DylanBurns warns Destiny the debate gets spicy
3:54 - Counterpoints and Lauren's problematic opening
7:46 - SerfsTV and Tail's opening
14:45 - Open debate
32:15 - Problem w/ leading with misinformation
55:46 - How do you prove a negative claim?
1:10:19 - Why Destiny says he has no good debates...
1:13:22 - By their definition cementaries are mass graves
1:40:48 - Counterpoints finally loses it
2:33:35 - Who has been condescending in this debate?
2:48:39 - Closing statements, Serfs vs Lauren
2:59:00 - DylanBurns explains why he begged Serfs to talk
3:27:13 - Lauren Southern shows email
#Destiny
Destiny reviews the Lauren Southern/Counterpoints vs SerfsTV/Tails debate that put the moderator DylanBurnsTV into an awkward a corner where he begs the other side to talk more...
EDITOR'S NOTE - VOD froze a lot, dunno what was wrong, wasn't the video. Btw for those confused, Conorpoints is Counterpoints. They're the same person ►twitter.com/_counterpoints_
DEBATE RECAP AND LAUREN SOUTHERN 1V1 IRL DEBATE REMATCH CHALLENGE ►czcams.com/video/zSYf8pFeLCI/video.html
uploading right after live stream ended, excellent strategy. Pizza tactics back at it again.
Hey Bonnell, stop running from me.
Destiny vs Tariq. Sounds really boring honestly.
Tariq has only 13 subs? Interesting
9
I've said it before, while I understand Lance is a socialist, he needs to stop being collectively owned so much.
Inb4 Soycialist comments
You've won comment of the week, congrats!
Holy hell 😂
I always found that joke works better with "publicly owned". The double-entendre is more direct
NICE XD
I've lost many brain cells reading Lance's chat during this debate. How he has managed to cultivate this level of delusion and low IQ in his community is beyond me.
I just read "it can't be mass execution because it was peaceful?"
...yeah? What kind of a question is that? How far does your head have to be shoved up Lance's ass to not see that? I'm actually trying to be incredibly charitable but *damn* some of these people are actually beyond reason.
Maybe they were being sarcastic? That's all the charity I can spare.
@@albertjohnston1026 just your regular day to day peaceful MASS EXECUTION. mhmm mhmm yuppers
@@JackPorter Lol exactly (I can't see your comment in the thread, but it's in my notifications and I can reply through that so w/e)
Cult-think.
Serf followers aren’t bright
Lance vs Lauren makes Xander look like a debate god in comparison
And this Tail guy who embarrassed himself time and time again. Had made up his mind beforehand and had no clue what he was talking about. Maybe he's into verbal crucifixion.
@@SerenityM54L2SAM5L5N1 He’s not here to educate you. He’d rather be playing indigenous mario kart
Fuckin For Real
@@SerenityM54L2SAM5L5N1 It might have been some 8D chess.
Maybe he was showing off how badly the canadian education system had failed the indigenous people by parading his mental shortcomings for all the world to see?
Watching Xander fuck up is kinda cute because he want to be a bebate lord adult. It would be me at 21 if I had a camera on me and didn't have a real job. These dudes are pathetic
Okay, so I’ve been trying to give Lance the benefit of the doubt for a while. But at this point i completely understand why destiny calls him spineless.
TBH, I'm far from a lefty, but I never understood why Destiny went so hard on Lance. Never saw much from him, but he came across 'somewhat' reasonable. Always felt like Destiny had very little charitabillity with him, and disproportionately lambasted the guy.
After this video though, it completely makes sense now. Holy f+CK, it's all clicked into place. What a slippery weasely bad faith disingenuous POS. It's like everything he said was to score points with his audience.
@@jamesbarnett6772 After the Kormantine fiasco he went on his show and made a few spineless bad faith attempts to smear destiny. After that I never really had any respect for the dude
@@melonmazing515 ehh, tbh everyone involved in that whole debacle around destinys n word arc was on their bull shit lol
@@jamesbarnett6772 oh absolutely someone of his following has a responsibility to at the very least accurately and honestly represent his sources in his talking points this makes itnclear that hes nothing more than a dishonest idealogue and i just cant respect someone like that
@@avoryeda7606 cope
Oh my GOD. There are times when it’s okay to say “I’m not interested in educating you” and not spending emotional labor on someone. WHEN YOU VOLUNTEER FOR A DEBATE IS NOT ONE OF THOSE TIMES JESUS CHRIST.
My only criticism of Dylan is that he didnt kick him off when he said that. I would feel insulted if I had organised a debate and given my platform to someone (that could have been given to someone else) only for him to not engage with anything at all whilst keeping his face hidden.
@@phillipfragrance16 Especially when the FIRST thing he said about himself was how he knows SO MUCH about indigenous issues and whatnot.
@anon anon I think answering “You have the burden of proof since you made the claim” could have been fine. But what he said sounded like he just wasn’t interested in discussion. And also to people who are watching who maybe don’t know as much about this? They’re not going to be convinced of Lance and Rabbit’s side, and that was my side too. I wanted them to step up and speak, but ugh.
Anyone who voices disagreement is obliged to explain it, or it can be dismissed on its face. Nobody owes faith that anyone actually has a good argument. If it's not worth the emotions to explain, then don't voice your disagreement in the first place
@anon anon bang on dude, nobody owes anyone faith in their conclusions. Anyone stating disagreement is obliged to explain it fully or they can be dismissed
Destiny your new editor is based as fuck. Keep him. The receipts he plays during all ur videos are bad ass
i dont think its a new guy i think its the same dude just improving his skill which is cool to see tbh.
August has been editing for a couple of months, he is getting better and continues to be based
@@MildChunkySalsa good for him he’s killin it
agreed editor is doing a great fucking job
@@MildChunkySalsa i know time flies but I think its approaching a year if it hasn't been already.
Might as well have played League with Lauren, if Serfs wanted to wanna platform her like this.
@@maddyleaf Pretty sure 100% of lance's audience already knew who lauren southern was.
@@maddyleaf Lance does irresponsible platforming when goes on a debate. Guy does not know how to debate, comes across like a halfwit. He should stick to reacting conservative videos and spouting rehearsed talking points.
@@Jack91790 I looked up her channel, she still has a ton of subs but hardly gets any views
Honestly, Lauren isn't even that bad anymore. Like we all disagree with her heavily obviously, but she's highly good faith and pretty knowledgeable.
@@maddyleaf So you don't want people to make up their mind on who they want to follow based on who they think makes a better argument?
Oh God I'm unsubscribing from The Serfs. This debate crossed the line and I can't take his cringe anymore
@Anita Blackhawk to be fair, I never really watched his videos or debates. I only subscribed to him because I wanted a Canadian leftist's perspective on certain issues. But just his overall personality and aura is just something that I cannot look past
@Anita Blackhawk Autism isn't an insult.
@Anita Blackhawk It isn't, actually. It's not overthinking it to be consistent on not using disorders as an insult.
@Anita
How about you just for a moment learn some modesty then, for the sake of your child and other autistic family members. Not for you, not for your ego…..but to make life for those like them a little easier and less stigmatized. Just stop using their natural state as an insult. It’s grim.
@@SomersBugtopia but it's not autism that is used as an insult, it's the screeching. Which means it's perfectly fine for someone with autism to manifest, but not for someone not on the spectrum.
This feels like a poor joke, "A Leftist, a Rightist, a Centrist, and then a Nobody walk into a bar and start talking genocide..."
LeechTV over here really making Lauren fucking Southern look like a intellectual powerhouse
Lance should really stop debating people. Maybe he can focus his energy on reacting to clips instead.
His turn is now to do a mike from pa
He's an absolute cringelord when he does that as well
@@awaister Ugh, he's so smug there
he should pull a hasan. Act as if debatelords are cringe and stick to his echo chamber.
This is so true. He hurts the side of whichever team he's on
"I'm pretty sure your brain is running on 1995". Savage LMAO
I think it was irresponsible of Dylan/TheSerfs to platform Twin Rabbit like this.
Sunlight is the best disinfectant. Now that we've had the opportunity to observe Twin Rabbit, other people can be made aware of Rabbit's toxicity.
@@user-gh1vc9kb4e Godlike comparison.
@@Slyfa187 This is why the right of free expression is so important. Bad ideas can't be criticized if they are never revealed.
I just feel bad because I know Serfs community is probably not looking at Twin Rabbit negatively but are looking at Dylan like, "Dylan had the gall to have SerfsTV fight two people in a debate at once!"
@@silenceyouidiot I did have a look at that community. It is a radical cesspool.
This debate turned people into right-wingers. Lance is a very poor debater and kinda bad communicator.
I wouldn’t go that far. I think people are more entrenched than that.
That's the scary part of this shit, the left is better at pushing fence sitters towards the right than vice versa.
Eh they only really argued over the most fringe lefty narrative possible though. Most people probably didn't go into this debate thinking residential schools amounted to Canadian Treblinka.
@@DannyT-ln5ex
unironically true, leftist streamers tend to be super cringe, like l'm a fan of her but look at demonmama, she's smart but insufferable to listen to, like from "im the demon of internet debates" or calling her fans 'imps'.
all the right need to do is to peddle conspiracy theories but do it seriously and not waste the viewers time.
If you support someone who inspired mass shootings based on a pointless debate then you're you were already right wing.
The rabbit guy talked like 7 times. Across hours. Did a smug victory lap, despite contributing 0, and saying nothing of value.
Had a real Vaush-esque cadence. 😖
Actually he was a pidgeon in a chess game. Knock everything over, shits somewhere and then struts about like they’ve won.
@@mickeyboy90 at is such an amazing mental image lmao
Comparing this to Vaush is insane. Holy shit. This rabbits guy is just useless
@@thefirebreathingleftist8648 I’m talking about his posturing, and snide attitude. Real know-it-all.
I don't see the comparison to Vaush in Rabbit, if anything his attitude is on the same level of smug as Sargon, Vaush's posturing always comes off as loud and confident which Rabbit wasn't at all.
I can't believe Lance is asking to prove a negative, this is like the first thing you learn when you get into debates
Fulkerson. Be fair if this debate is anything to go by his braincell count is in the negative.
i had fucking lefties saying "prove that the CIA didn't do x". That's not how it works.
@@lubu2960 granted the cia did do allot of fucked up shit during the cold war, but that doesn't excuse the modern lefts intellectual laziness.
I was expecting Lauren to say something like “Well prove to me that you didn’t kill and ate a baby Lance”
@@prophetofindridcold4119 why I do agree it happened in terms of a debate you still would have to prove it
Hate defending Lauren, but I get why she got pissed at the end. Lance didn't even address the debate topic in his closing statement, he just used it as a chance to attack Lauren. Which yeah, was a totally bitch move to wait until the very end.
It's complicated. Optically, it was bad. It allows Lauren to frame it that way. On the other hand, there's no denying that Lance's points were factual and salient to understanding Lauren's world-view.
Lauren Southern is someone who has lied throughout her CZcams career to frame issues such as migration, refugee crises and South Africa into far-right talking points. She pioneered the Great Replacement Theory which was cited in the Christchurch shooter's manifesto. She's shot flares at refugees in the ocean to stop them from entering Greece. She's toured with Stefan Molyneux. She's handed out Islamophobic pamphlets in Luton.
I understand the desire to remind the audience who Lauren is and how she rose to prominence. Because effectively, she's trying to rebrand herself as a moderate off the back of an audience she cultivated as a spokesperson for the alt-right.
Substantively, everything he said was true. It was a really bad moment to bring that up however, in terms of optics.
@@peter9162 agreed. It just really made him look desperate going after her past, when he should have been closing his points.
@@peter9162 The great replacement theory was around way before Lauren Southern. I find it incredibly dishonest to blame that shooting on her personally when that theory has been around way before she even mentioned it.
There’s plenty of criticisms of her but that isn’t one, it’s falls apart when you look into it further.
All the Africa shit was happening, not everything is somehow far right because she says it. All these talking points can be discussed. You shouldn’t be blaming a single person based on what some crazy person does.
@@George-bb9kr She massively popularised the theory. She operated as a thought leader in an alt-right ecosystem that led to the shooting. He supported Generation Identity (a far right activism group that Southern participated in).
Look, you're right. I can't actually accuse her of causing the shooting. Because even with a manifesto, it's impossible to know what actually goes on in someone's head.
All I'll say is that, whether it is her intention or not, the ideas and method of communication that Southern (and other prominent people like her) participate in increases the likelihood of lone actors committing atrocious acts of violence. It's stochastic violence.
In the case of Southern she was particularly active offline as well, participating in far right activism in Europe (trying to physically repel refugees from entering Greece), handing out Islamophobic pamphlets in Luton (UK) and attending rallies in New Zealand.
Now my advice is that if somebody doesn't want to be accused of encouraging violence, maybe they shouldn't participate in activism specifically designing to stir up racial/ religious tensions in countries they don't even live in. Maybe they also shouldn't use their platform to amplify racist conspiracy theories as well. But yeah, you're right. I can't say with a 100% certainty that she inspired the shooting. But I still think she's a despicable, hateful person who has put forward ideas and actions designed to stoke hate and hasn't shown an ounce of remorse.
@@peter9162 The theory was popular way before Southern came along. I’m not going to accept that point when majority of news sources were also talking about it in detail. New York Times specifically.
Now I can’t really defend her other actions but that wasn’t really my main point anyway. I focused heavily on her causing a terrorist attack. I didn’t know about her throwing shit at refugees boats, that’s fucked on every aspect.
Do you believe a person can change? From what I’ve seen from her she seems far more moderate on most things now. I don’t understand how someone can be in the libertarian party but also be far right. That doesn’t really add up to me.
Only if Lance had spoken a bit more to Jesse Lee Peterson about LUHVIN black folks, he would have won this debate.
Lance was not missing intelligence or rhetoric but rather love for black people. It's a tragedy.
Do you luh indigenous people
Amazin!
I think it's mainly that he was arguing things that he knows are wrong.
Du yu luuuh blah peepoh?
@@stephentyree9296 don't make fun about how black people speak racist
Look, I'm only halfway through this and I just have to say now that that chat is ruining humanity for me. Idk how so many people can see and hear the same things as me and still not see and hear the same things as me wtf
Edit: I just realized it was Lance's chat. Nvmd. Makes perfect sense now.
Lances chat is a scary place
The guys on the Sitch & Adam Show brought forward the hypothesis that this was all an elaborate smear job on Lauren. The way the "debate" ended, with Lance giving his closing speech right at the end, is certainly dubious.
It makes the most sense. The mod sided against Lauren repeatedly, refused to help push the debate foreword along with him interupting Lauren and Points several times without good reason. Add to him having Lance not give his closing comments until after he did his channel shoutouts is hella fucking sus.
I also think Mauler did a great job describing why Dylan's style of moderation was absolutely horrible during this debate. He actively inhibited the flow of discussion, and stopped everyone from making arguments just to give people equal time to talk. That's such a horrible way to moderate, certain points take longer to make than others, and it really felt like Dylan was trying to stop Lauren from making any slam dunk arguments.
I would seriously love Mauler and Destiny to have a conversation sometime.
@@Terrbearr428 yea I agree Dylan is extremely big headed in all aspects physically and mentally and he’s also so all in on his side. It’s cringe.
@@Terrbearr428 isnt mauler just some dude making bad movie reviews? dont tell me that clown has political opinions xDD
Destiny's hatred for The Serfs is so entertaining
It's kinda like watching a BabyFace just beat up a Heel. It's really satisfying
Imagine listening to a debate on historical crimes against ethnic minorities with Lauren being closer to reality then the opposition.
Sad to admit but the leftist here were pretty embarassing
Tales is just stupid
And Lance did it just for the end part but for some reason he thought getting utterly embarrassed is the best way to get there.
@@orkinho1 not anything unusual
The only positive I can see from this situation is Lauren's fans maybe checking out Conor, the dude genuinely seems like good representation for the right and is seems fairly reasonable on most issues, at least that I've seen.
I’m not in Lauren’s camp, but I’m going to be checking him out. For sure.
That’s true. I’m far left but I find Connor very reasonable and good faith most of the time.
I've been in his discord since the early days and had several conversations with him, he's a good guy, even if me and him have loads of disagreements. He's definitely just trying to arrive at the best position.
@@blitz8425 I think if every centrist (even if they lean one way or another) was like Conor, I wouldn’t be sad about people being centrist. He’s a good dude.
@@nightlydrugs6927 Conor is the only centrist I've seen who genuinely does the 'take good ideas from both side' thing in good faith
I absolutely love it when destiny talks to Dylan. He goes from 100mph dunking on serfs shitty arguments and then slams on the brakes and is super chill.
Kinda gave me whiplash.
Yeah it sucks that the sexpest turned out to be dogshit, I'll miss those moments lol
@@EE-jp5ev a simpler time...
Lance shits the bed, don't tell me.
And rabbit dude is the poster boy for the Dunning Kruger effect. He thinks he's the smartest guy in the room, while simultaneously being the most ignorant guy in the room.
@@jeffwells641 rabbit dude?
@@Naalders Big Chungus
Big Ol' stain
He reached organ trail levels of diarieha.
Dylan pretending like he didn't set up Lance's 'gotcha' rant at the end is pathetic. He had the 3 other people give their closings, made his own final statements then handed it over to Lance. When Lance launched into a series of blatant personal attacks against Lauren, Dylan said nothing. He didn't say a damned thing until Lauren reacted, and then he was outraged about the personal conflict? No, that's just crap. He just finished setting up so that Lance would have the final word. He should have stopped Lance once it became clear that his closing statement was not about the topic but simply a personal attack on one of the other participants. I would expect exactly the same if it had been Lauren personally attacking Lance.
Dylan should be ashamed.
@@bbmm3811 Hope his channel ended up hurt after his non-moderating in this dumbster fire of a debate.
I find it hard to be charitable to Dylan after this, the debate where he dropped CTV in to what was already a shit show, and the Prime/Katarana stuff.
Right on the money. He's a manipulative piece of trash
He did a terrible job moderating the whole debate, and that set up at the end was the icing on the cake.
I hate how Lance unironically does the Trump "wrong" thing, like he says Lauren is misrepresenting the facts and cherry picking the article but then pivots and doesn't talk about the article at all and what's being misrepresented
While it is true that Lauren misrepresents everything she touches. I don't understand how you could fail against someone like her. It's bizarre.
I actually really respected Counterpoints debate style here. He came off as well informed, compassionate but also not afraid to turn up the heat when the convo stagnated or got lost in the weeds.
P.S. that TaleOfRabits guy needs to never debate again. He might have been unintentionally or not the most bad faith debater I've seen this year with a repulsive flare of condescension
I don’t think counterpoints was that eloquent but it was a slam dunk argument and it wasn’t difficult to argue.
@@thecooletompie I don't know, there is a point to Counter wanting to push onto a new topic. Sort of like how Destiny and Seder spoke about college debt for an hour and a half with nobody really pulling on ropes.
The argument was simple, "It could be a mass grave, we need to wait years until it's dug up and fully uncovered, then we can pay attention to what reparation's need to be done to those involved."
@@thecooletompie Kind of feels like he did so because he knew Lauren would fight tooth and nail over what is a mass grave and what ground sonar can reveal about them.
I don't know anything about the guy, from what I'm watching he's trying to play the balance while TheSerfs and Lauren could talk about 'what ifs and abouts' for literal hours.
The rabbit guy made Conor, one of the nicest person on YT politic, lose his fucking mind. That's something.
Center- Right might as well be a nazi to someone as dull as Tails
@@christianvalarus5950 all I've seen of Connor has been some Hippy Dippy debates, and while I disagree with him, he is the only conservative I actually like, as he is not stupid or "evil" like most conservative figures sound.
@@hugosilva400 Agree. Connor is a good guy
@@CynicalBastard center right people aren't usually very nationalist.
@@CynicalBastard shit guess literally nothing can exist I guess
Lance just needs to leave Debates to the big guys
You mean to the adults?
@@animatorbroman3710 at least people with a minimal microscopic amount of spine
Windows 95 won this debate
Honestly a soggy jam sandwich would be harder to debate than lance.
What do you mean by peanut butter, what are you talking about when you say that
@@DannyT-ln5ex ?
Seems like it'd be really hard to nail the soggy jam sandwich to a position though, it'd be slipping and sliding all over the place.
@@Rallylabs lmao it's the debate bro jam sandwich
Sam.. you need to get on that ASAP.. that is one of the best CZcams chanel names I ever heard.
Conservative Lance in 2001:
Dont talk about islamophobia it takes away from 9/11
Go ahead, tell me lance doesn’t sound like he’s studied every single one of vaush’s mannerisms
I think you mean his debate partner, who sounds almost exactly like Vaush.
Just wanted to point out it's been a year and no mass Graves found
I came from Counterpoint's channel because the comments said your reaction was A tier...
Gotta be honest, seeing you go "Connor, STFU!!!" to "Connor you are cleared for takeoff" was hilarious.
The word "aryan" is a sanskrit word that was meant to refer to the peoples who migrated to India from Iran (who originally had come to Iran from central Asia) during the 1000s bc. The word was picked up during the time when we were finding out about how most European, Iranian and Indian languages were all connected. As a result, some people believed this word referred to more than just Indians and Iranians, but instead Europeans aswell... and soon, it became much much worse.
The term was picked up by Theosophy to refer to the Atalantians in the root civilization theory and then was adopted by occultism that inspired Nazi ideology
@Jordan May yeah there were a lot of interesting things going on in German thought. Much was surpressed or destroyed and somethings were implemented in the nazi ideology.
@@billycoo7916 the term was just used in a lot of different contexts in the earliest days to appeal to some ancestral group. Proto-Indo-European before it was given that name was often called Proto-Aryan, as Aryan was believed to be the name of the ancestors of the people who spoke Sanskrit which was believed at that time to be the oldest European language, and it was around this time that they realized the languages of Iran and India shared a common ancestor with European languages. Even today there are still some wack groups out there that use a corruption of PIE theory to talk about the ancient Indo-Europeans as the ancestors of the white race and shit, though they've updated their terminology and no longer use Aryan. Should of course point out that linguistics rejected the racial notion of the word Aryan from the very beginning.
But anyway, tldr: the term became co-opted early on to appeal vaguely to an "ancestral" race.
There's also some interesting history of the term used positively as well. Max Müller, famous in Sanskrit studies, tried to popularize the term because he believed that if Europeans realized their languages were related to Indian languages and that they all share common ancestors, that they would come to see the light and abandon racial prejudice and see Indians and Iranians as distant brothers and sisters. He expressed a lot of concern that it was being used instead to foment racial divisions, as a lot of Germans were uncomfortable with believing that they could share ancestry with "swarthy races". The Hitlerian view of the Aryan kind of embraces that though by saying that the "swarthy races" were corrupted and that the European races were closer to the original aryans and they used the theory as justification for their own racial supremacy.
@@sameash3153 Didin't know about Max Müller, nice fun fact.
Destiny is so hungry for a real debate he's started debating himself.
Is there anybody in the world that can challenge him? Is he God of debates?
Perhaps he can intentionally develop multiple personality disorder and debate himself.
@@lucasevergarden6601 Try Ask Yourself and Avi.
Destiny literally refuses to debate them because they're too good.
@@lucasevergarden6601 Sargon spanked him. Metokur did... but Metokur doesn't stand for anything.
Lucas Evergarden sargon slapped him. Sargon on sitch and adam had a moment when sitch recalled that sargon BTFO’d destiny when they were arguing about white people and minorites and sargon after letting him go on his rant about how it sucks to be minorities sargon simply asked “okay so then why would whites want to be the minority” and destinys brain gridlocked
Lance pulling that lame shit at the end should have told his audience exactly the type person he is. But they cheered it on. I honestly don't believe the overwhelming majority of these people give two shits about any of the communities they speak on. It's so disgusting. It's a childish game for these people. Real life trauma is whittled down to memes and owns. I don't need that in my *F E E D*
who is traumatized by it? lauren or the people she shot flares at or the families of the 50 people that are now dead because of her ideology?
He doesn't the serfs coverage of aboriginal issues is so terrible it physically hurts me as an actual advocate IRL
@@butternutsauce but she gets called out for that already. Was it really necessary to read off a prepared speech about someone's past at the end of a debate about indigenous children dying? Lance shat the bed throughout the whole debate and read off a closing statement attacking her past. What was the point of the debate then? It makes it look like Lance is here using the deaths of indigenous children as a tool to call out Lauren's past. He does an injustice to them on his objective to attack her. Just another Whiteman using minorities to get clout.
@@bruce9313
those children are dead because of the same politics that lauren perpetuates, if people like her never existed then there would not have been any mass graves.
@@billieeisenhower406 What ideology? I didn't follow her for a long time.
21:50 My God, can the rabbit guy follow a conversation?
I don't even like Lauren but even I could hear her say it was someone who worked on the ground penetrating scans before and that she was an instructor at the university Lauren went to not her "friend".
It's not even a good gotcha since it just makes you look anti-intellectual since she actually does seem educated on this unlike any of the four people discussing it here.
Also bonus meme 2:28:30
The rabbit guy looked into the last 2 years of church burnings and his takeaway was one church burned down 3 times because of an open flame while ignoring that anyone can look up church burnings in Canada in that last few years and see the actual numbers being reported at around 50 churches.
Again it's not even a good talking point since the leaders of these indigenous communities even condemn the burning of churches since its often in their communities.
If they are easily condemning it which makes sense since these people probably actually care about their communities and know it makes more sense to condemn but make sure the focus of institutional wrongs that were committed by tne Canadian government are addressed. Why can't he just say "oh yeah that's bad but lets not forget about the issues that leads people to rioting"
Especially since Counterpoints and even Lauren is willing to concede that institutional racist policies existed and fucked over these indigenous communities for a long time and should be addressed.
What an absolute fucking disaster for Lance's side. Just annihilated at every turn. RIP.
Yeah i guess they underestimated Lauren on this topic.
Man all these dumb debates from lefties on Lauren almost gaslight me into thinking she's much smarter than she is. But she really isn't. A lil. But Xander and Serfs...swings and misses. Nonstop
The critical difference is that Lauren reads a little bit of the literature, whilst people like Xander and Serfs don't
@@salokin3087 Xander is still wet behind the ears but there was no excuse for Lance.
Xan and serfs are probably the weakest internet leftist when it comes to debate. She’s going for softballs to pad her stats
At least Xan's debate was on her stupid children's book and was fairly inconsequential, Lance and his dipshit partner were debating a real consequential issue; were super smug and arrogant the entire time and ended up getting completely blown out.
yea whatever happened, doesnt change the fact that lauren is a horrible human being
hosting a debate for Lance is actually irresponsible platforming
man if destiny moderates the second debate, i will literally lose my mind from the GOD TIER content that would be.
dest as a mod would do more debating than everyone else LULW
Unfortunately lance is a chicken and won't debate Lauren. Even in person they were both in Vancouver coincidentally and he won't say it to her face, mod or not.
Lance doesn't have the spine. He has been called out several times and refuses to. Because he knows he already is in the wrong, already looks bad and a second debate can only do more harm.
9:50 ''the founder did something so everything they did is tainted''
Humanity: finds out Thomas Edison was diddling children
Also humanity: starts breaking all light bulbs.
the romans crucified jesus? fuck, we better start writing in the cyrillic alphabet instead
It gets worse: The oldest civilization in history were xenophobic patriarchs that regularly engaged in mass slaughter, theft and destruction of cultural artifacts, and slavery.
Time to return to monke I suppose.
Yep,it was such a dumb thing to say, everything is tainted if you look back enough.
The Serfs and his partner must be the most annoying and disingenuous people i have ever heard debate. My God !
Lance should be forced to debate forever.
The more he opens his mouth the more he de-radicalized people on the far left because of his own stupidity.
The man is single handedly bringing both sides together to dunk on him. A hero we didn’t want but a hero we deserve.
I listened to Mike from PA once and now I'm in a country club and I bought War Bonds.
I think it's great that a kid w/ special needs gets to participate in debate...
"The definition of Mass is Big"- Brilliant.
Oh yeah, it's mass brain time.
(opposition brings up point in debate)
"Well, actually i'm not here to educate you"
*WORLD CLASS DEBATE*
I'd love to see this in politics. Have the white house press conference and have the PR person come out and on every question about policy be like "I'm not here to educate you, if you don't just understand this, then maybe you should do something else."
@@Winasaurus that's kinda what's happening now with the new press secretary....she's self owned many many times now it's sad
@@lillagahnavich7700 I think basically every single press secretary ever has done that. They have the worst job in the White House because they have to tip toe around so many lines.
How have we made the words racist Nazi and genocide absolutely hollow.
Whole debate was cluster fuck though IMO Connor/Counterpoints was the real MVP. I hope he gets more attention and recognition cause i believe he represent a lot of the center right mindset.
Connor is pog in general
@@Jacob-nz8ok dude is pretty conservative but actually has a brain and uses it, it's great. Connor is always refreshing to listen to
@@MrRazmut he is a centrist.
@Jax Teller
Literally said he was center center-right
@@arturzinurov4781 leans centre right but yeah
this guy rabbit pretty much sums up the rest of the far left to me. You can't go much further left without having a few extra chromosomes
Tails’ argument was like a Holocaust denier saying that Hitler didn’t want to starve people, the allied bombing cut off supplies, and that’s it.
@@Romper_Stomper_ usually you don't declare war against the world
@@Romper_Stomper_ It is usually beneficial to not spend a ton of resources running an industrialized mass murder complex.
mass graves? mass Ls for those two guys.
I’m Canadian and we’ve been learning about this for YEARS in public schools, these burials and graves are nothing surprising, and this has never been some big secret that no one knew about. The fact that there’s this massive public outcry is nothing more than political relevancy and pseudo moralistic outrage to publicly look good from Canadians who have known about this their entire lives and didn’t say anything until it was in the news. This isn’t a massive revelation or discovery. It had its two weeks of fame once it was relevant in the news and then disappeared just as fast.
@@tomwensrich9602 couldn’t agree more. Our country is in a terrible place, especially in the east, because of how terrible our education system has been in letting children be exposed to insane ideology unchallenged and with no other viewpoint being offered.
@@puffdaddy69thanks for your 11 IQ assessment. Truly , nobody would have ever realized that things will always be criticized. Next time someone says something negative about Hitler I'll just say "well people always get criticism no matter what they do". Thank you so much. This is revolutionary.
I hate when lefties like Lance call people out for thier past, or calling then grifters. Like dood people make mistakes, and people change their minds over time.
Bingo
Haven't watched this yet, but it feels hard for me to imagine TheSerfs winning this debate... I expect it to be fairly one sided for Lauren... Lauren strikes me as the person who studies a lot in preparation for an exam while TheSerfs is like the person who just says "I'll wing it and probably get a passing grade... Just gotta moral grandstand enough..."
Edit: Wow, I feel prophetic watching this debate...
Edit: I don't think I've seen such a trouncing in a debate... Like, it doesn't even feel like TheSerfs and the other guy are making bad arguments... It feels like they're not even making arguments... Like, you know when in philosophy (also science I guess) something can be considered so bad that it's "not even wrong"? This feels like one of those times... I've only watched 2 hours in so far, but wow... At this point I think the best TheSerfs can hope for is damage control... Like, even when Destiny debates literal Nazis, at least the Nazis can argue positions... They may be garbage, but they make arguments... TheSerfs' side though here is just taking hit after hit and responding by being snide which is a bad look when you have no substance... It makes me really not believe that TheSerfs takes debating seriously... I'm not too much of a studying person myself, but even I would've studied more on something this big than TheSerfs seems to have...
I think you are saying Lance and the other guy basically showed fractal wrongness with the information they provide and their arguments?
I once made a fool out of myself in front of my English class with a totally unprepared book report. That was over 10 years ago and it still irks me to think about.. and that was in front of only about 20 people. The shame of this shitshow must be unbearable.
Would you be able to tell more about that story?
@@guybien4621 I was pot headed at the time so very very lazy and absent minded. I put it all together a day before, walked into class that day fairly confident. As soon as I got in front of everybody and started talking that confidence left me. I looked and sounded nervous. It was supposed to be a 45 minute presentation, I think I went about 20. One of those things you look back to and cringe audibly. It really wounded me, ever since I avoid public speaking like the plague.
@@austinlittle1638 Thank you for sharing this and for your time! I've had a similar experience and was curious. Same on the public speaking avoidance.
@@guybien4621 you bet. It's like anything else. You just have to dive in again, face the fear to get over it. Safe travels
@@austinlittle1638 what book was it thoe
There should be a CZcams guideline that if you’re on a debate panel, you must be hooked up to a 1996 Indian child electric chair, where chat can donate and zap you if you’re being too dense.
😂
That would just lead to all Internet debaters getting grilled lol.
Chat would electricute a thousand puppies if you give them the ability too lol
Lance is a copy paste of every single internet socialist on the internet. I don’t think there’s 1 single original thought in that brain.
Edit: this tails dude’s stupidity is triggering me into oblivion. And Connor’s pop off just saved my god forsaken soul. Destiny I stg if you mod the 1v1 between lance and Lauren I will get a DGG tattoo
Regardless what you think of the people outside this conversation, Lauren and Connor comes off as saints who deal with delusional people with respect and patience for most of the debate. Sad state of affairs.
Lance and his buddy are dishonest, morons
"You're not presenting any facts." Well fuck me, I'm really curious what his definition of "fact" is. They probably should have led with establishing that definition to avoid all the confusion later since Lance seems to think "fact" means "anything that helps my argument".
Beginning see why people enjoy destiny's content. this commentary is a-fucking-plus lmfao
Absolutely stellar commentary.
Destiny has been in top form for a while now! I originally didn't like Destiny but over the past 2 years he's been getting more and more entertaining. I've done a complete 180 and have been enjoying his past debates too.
What's even more mind blowing is the fact that there are people in Lance's audience that thought this looked good for him.
I briefly checked his chat during his debate and I don't know what to call it but misogynistic towards Lauren.
I personally love lance, he's so fun to watch crash and burn, but he isn't so agressive like Mike or demonmamma. He's like the Erobb of debates.
that is a little unfair to erobert
Erobb is likeable tho
@@hoopmooy3543 I'm not on 4 chan I don't watch Erob.
@@Bububixby that's really your opinion isn't it?
I take it back I was cranky.
Between Mike and Serfs, who has the worse track record regarding getting owned in debates/convos?
Mike has a higher overall physical cringe factor.
Oh definitely Mike, DEFINITELY. The cringe factor is infinite.
wwwwhhhAAAAAATTTT!?!?!
Still Mike. Call me when there's a stream where Lance dropkicks an ottoman.
(the furniture, not someone born in Anatolia and aged at least 102)
@@sirgodricenwardsaier9074 You don't KNOW anything! What's a TIF
Dude even the serfs chat was getting sick of the partners BS by about midway and Destiny is absolutely right both of them should have backed out cuz it would not have looked even half as bad as the actual debate did.
Watching lances chat during that debate hurt so much…. But seeing the comments at the end kinda made up for it. I guess his twitch chat is a full blown ecochamber while his CZcams audience seemed to notice the failure from lance.
Leave it to Lance and this tailed dude to act disingenuous….these two only came on here to try and dunk on Lauren. They didn’t even listen to the arguments.
If Lance wanted to “own” Lauren Southern for her past shitty political activism, he should have just made a video response to her. Trying to craft a debate around Indigenous restorative justice was the weirdest way to go about confronting her
That's not bad faith enough for Lance. He has to go the extra mile to be as slimy as possible.
This has to be the best react content destiny has ever produced. Also: August = Godstiny
Destiny’s editor, ilysm thank u for your quick editing
I thought that mass graves were like huge holes in the ground where you just dump people into
I mean sometimes they can be but usually there just a ditch filled with bodies.
1:01:50 You, me, Adam, Sitch, Mauler and Rags felt that too, and said it out loud.
I think everybody is privileged who hasn't had the horror of talking to Lance.
My wife is literally looking at me like I’m crazy, because when he said, “ No one is f*cking talking, so you have plenty of time to read…” I friggin lost it… I’m still laughing as I write this…
Lancelot more like Lancelost.
Tail of rabbits, not foot (unlucky)
rabbit sounds like a massive neckbeard. i hope he talks like that all the time. imagine that guy ordering a sandwich or something
“It is not my job to educate you on what I want on my Subway sandwich.”
Damn I remember the old meme of people on the left years ago saying
"It's not my job to educate you" or "educate yourself I'm not here to educate you"
I thought we learned years ago that if you're not willing to give people the information they will go to the people who are willing. This is what led to the anti-sjw/skeptic/classical liberal(tm) crowd gaining a lot of followers since these guys loved talking about the issues even if they were completely wrong.
You're in a debate talking about the issues you supposedly care about, this is the one time when you should be trying to educate people. Now I don't think Lauren is going to change but the counterpoints guy seems willing to engage with what you're saying and even is willing to give concessions to try and bridge the gap, Dylan is trying so hard to give the serfs and rabbitthoughts time to inform people.
This is just lazy if not just outright irresponsible since it makes people on the left like myself look unwilling or unable to give answers to basic questions. At the very least consider the audience of people who know very little, this is a time you can inform people on indigenous history/issues since it's not usually a topic that is well known or mainstream.
i'm not a leftist(or a rightist or a centrist, all 3 are tarded)....but i do take it upon myself to educate them. specially when they dont even understand the most basic facts about a topic. which is quite often, specially if they are from usa(and lately canadians seem to have been infected as well).
@@sabin97 not left, right, or center. Then what are you, Enlightened One?
@@electron6825 fourth positionist
@@sabin97 are you just completely apolitical?
@@electron6825
i'm me.
i take my own positions on every issue, independent of what the left/right/center try to push.
it's called thinking for yourself instead of following ideology.
you should try it.
my brain is no better than yours.
if i could do it, so can you.
instead of being a sheep and following the ideologues, learn to think for yourself.
again. my brain is no better than yours. so you really have no excuse to be a sheep.
Alberta is divided into: Southern, Northern, and Central Alberta! We commonly use these delineations, and recognize regional differences, so in this case, saying: “Southern Alberta” is meaningful!
Why is it divided like so? Is it really that large of an area? Or is it like a widely different culture or both maybe? Would appreciate any answers
I think destiny argument was that saying "in southern Alberta, there was very bad something" sounds a lot like cherry-picking an area where some statistic looks very extreme.
@@thekycklingwizard78 alberta is a very large province, and had several residential schools, some of the most abusive were in southern alberta, but northern alberta also had some like st henri in fort vermillion that were infamous. what the whites often did was send kids from the far north to schools in the south and students from the south to the far north. Alberta’s area is approximately 660,000 square kilometres (250,000 sq mi). also the far north has only2 small cities, FT mac and Grande prairie, central alberta has edmonton and Red deer and southern alberta has calgary. we do actually say southern alberta, and northern alberta a lot
@@kingryan69 do you guys drink a lot of Tim Hortons coffee?
@@jamiec5594 Tim Hortons isn't owned by the same entity any longer, I think burger king bought them some years ago.
RE: comments about Southern Alberta. I live in Alberta and using "Southern Alberta" and "Northern Alberta" is common in our local culture. Nothern Alberta is the area north of Red Deer with the main city being Edmonton; Southern Alberta is the area south of Red Deer with the main city being Calgary. Enjoy your context and have a great weekend.
right, so, I don't think the issue is whether or not that's terminology that people would use, but rather, why would you use that instead of just saying in all of Canada? Why would you cherry pick one region and say "in this region alone, 28% indigenous children died".
It makes it seem as if, if you said "In Canada, X% of indigenous died", that that would result in a statement that wouldn't be as surprising.
@@jordanknight336 He asked "Why southern Alberta as opposed to Alberta" I was answering that question. It was about a specific area, not the whole of Canada
@@kittyjerkface To be fair the overly specific nature if saying southern Alberta was definitely to cherry pick data and make it seem like as large an area as possible was responsible for that shit
@@josiahclarke3535 I wasn't debating that. Destiny asked a specific question and I gave a specific answer. I'm not debating how relevant the data is. He asked "why Southern Alberta as opposed to just Alberta?" and I was just answering that.
Thank god I know I'm not smart enough to debate people on the internet. This was so fucking embarrassing.
I'm like 30 minutes in, and I can't stand the rabbits guy. He's disingenuous AF. He forgets the arguments/points he says, sea-lions, and diverts the discussion the moment he realizes he didn't do his home work.
2:59:00 Dylan’s call-in with Destiny about mass graves is a much better debate than the actual Serfs debate lmaooo
While researching the Tulsa Race Riots earlier this year something came up that reminds me of the grave talk. There were supposedly "mass graves" of black people killed during the riots, and to be fair there probably are some graves somewhere that could be considered communal mass graves because of a lack of identification and because there were so many people that died all at once. With no one being able to ID some of them, and the inability to pay for the burials, this will lead to people putting them in communal graves just by necessity. You aren't going to leave them out in the open for animals to eat for god's sake.
Anyway, during the research there were reports over the last 10 or so years of ground penetrating radar finding "mass graves." Several different ones, in fact. Problem is that then they dug up one of the supposed mass graves it turned out to be an old basement to a building that no one knew of and that there were no bodies found. Other "mass grave" sites that people only ID because of ground penetrating radar haven't been excavated because of political reasons. Things like "we don't want to disturb the graves" despite the fact that they don't even know if they actually are graves. So it seems to mirror this same sort of argument that ground penetrating radar doesn't actually mean anything without the proper follow up. It's a clue to what MIGHT be there, not what IS there.
Bad job on the editor's part highlighting Lance's chat. You didn't have to subject us to that.
Lauren got Destiny'd debate in this
Dude the amount of times I've argued with people and I'm trying my best to squeeze every second of talk time I can get, it's crazy to hear them not take like 5 separate chances to talk uncontested.
Because they've got nothing
"Lance would be two youtubers away from being a nazi". You're probably right, but Lauren would absolutely have been one of those two youtubers.
In fairness she would have been the first not the second.
She was playing battleship IRL with immigrant/refugee boats but she just a regular republican bro I swear
@@smiff513 Not anyone’s take.
@@rosebudtv4660 That’s unhinged and trivializes the Holocaust .
@@rosebudtv4660 Sounds like the Democrats as much as the Republicans, maybe even more so.
Guess that means we’re stuck between a Swastika and a Aryan Skull Shape.
The Serfs was running out the clock so he could pull his little soliloquy at the end. I think Dylan helped him arrange the whole sign off at the end so he could try to dunk on Lauren. Dylan let's everyone speak, then suspiciously plugs his stuff and gives the floor to the serfs...
Dylan is so defeated towards the end of this lmao
He was focused on making sure Lance got his gotcha moment while still doing his shout outs. Dude was hella shitty as a moderator and clearly working with Lance at times over staying neutral and keeping the conversation going constructively.
BuT sHe'S nOt tHe DiReCtOr oF tHe CoMpAnY.
I'm in love with Destiny's editor.
Also, keep up the great work, Destiny. I'm a new fan and I've been loving your content so far
does destiny ever post the homework he does to study for these debates? it wouldnt hurt to have those sources…
He does sometimes, he did for the Fuentes debate. I don't know about others though.
Lauren did a good job, Conor did a great job, Lance was gawd awful, Tail should avoid debates for the rest of his life and Dylan should never moderate again.
I don't like Lauren Southern's politics, but god damn if I ever *would*
Down so bad I found this comment with a GPR
@@raz1572 would use my GPR on Lauren Southern
At the drop of a hat my dude.
@@raz1572 good one
@@raz1572 …. OH… That’s what he meant…
….
Jesus.
Did lance delete this video from his channel i couldnt find it?
I know next to nothing about Destiny. I'm just here because apparently someone can't stand Spineless Lance as much as me.