Aerith is Jenova by the end of the game - Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth Ending Crackpot Theory
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- čas přidán 23. 03. 2024
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This is the crackpot theory from Maximillian dood. It's actually very interesting. It does matches the overall theme of the game of loss and grief, and it is plausible since it's something that the game tells you can happen. And something Sephiroth has tried before.
#ff7rebirth #ff7r #finalfantasy7rebirth - Hry
All of Aerith's lines/actions in that final cutscene were things she's said or done already in both games. It's actually very creepy.
It definitely feels eerie, also some of her lines contradict what she says earlier. Which clues you in that it’s another manipulation scheme by Jenova
Are you sure? Don't recall her mentioning anything about a "second home" at any point in Remake or Rebirth.
I'm actually on board with this theory, but this being used as evidence isn't true; they certainly never spoke about stopping meteor or meteor even being cast prior to this. What this *does* demonstrate is that 'JenovAerith' can say wild shit and Cloud will 100% go with it.
@@airisoptional and praying and meteor
Not all of the lines were things she’s said before and the ones that were were meant to be cute callbacks to the first time that aerith and cloud met. The ending scene is just supposed to be a sweet and bitter end due to her fate. Are y’all blind?
In the original game sephiroth was in a materia. While Jenova was roleplaying as him.
"Those we fear, those we love...." This quote was repeated a few times. They wouldn't hammer it home so much if it wasn't important. I'm fully convinced by this theory.
jenova needs a body
Queen's Blood lore is rooted in a good princess vs a wicked queen - that could be a meta Aerith vs Jenova showdown.
Yup. The emerald witch and the shadow blood queen
Aerith is the emerald witch! Calling it.@@krystalstardust1457
And Aerith always in red.....
Um, no. She's obviously Chadley. 😏
Finally, the only correct take
Killed it with fire.😂
Sephiroth saying Tifa was Jenova could have been a Kansas City Shuffle. Make him suspect Tifa at the moment so that he doesn't see the real one later
Even if the theory is wrong, the ending mirroring the beginning where now Cloud thinks Aerith is the real one while she's the impostor would be sick.
Aerith in the end also walks different. They have made it very clear to show in both games how Aerith walks with her feet pointing inward. Even in the final battle they show Aerith walking in with her cutesy walk. In the ending scene they show her feet again but this time she walks like Sephiroth. Plus the red glints in her eyes as well.
I thought the same. I think it's an illusion to manipulate Cloud easier for part 3
I'M NOT CRAZY!!! SOMEONE ELSE HAS THIS THEORY AS WELL!!!
😂
Your still crazy just someone else is crazy with you
@@deantheyter9858 fair enough lol
I'm gonna say yes and no. On some scenes, yeah I get the feeling it is just Jenova or Cloud having serious denial illusions like when he is holding her "corpse" and she just smiles and wakes up or when she is just hanging around the party at the very end (she even smiles while staring at Tifa crying next to Red which is what I found to be the most strange behavior for someone like Aerith), but at the very end before Cloud gets on the plane I feel that might be actual Aerith saying her goodbye.
Gonna say no 100% because she’s only checking on them and the scene is sad on purpose
You may be right, if you want to go deeper check the ending credits when showing the entire frames of the journey.
Somehow some frames are missing, the ones were when Cloud says "Wake up", and later the full interaction of the party in the cinematic, skipping to the goodbye frame.
So yeah Aerith saying goodbye is most likely to be our Aerith.
You know, when you think about it, there would be no reason for Jenova to keep up the charade once the plane takes off.
At the slideshow credits, all of the Forgetten Capital to the very end of ending except Aerith saying Goodbye scene has been blocked out, implies that the real situation has not yet been revealed as most of them that showed in the gameplay were Cloud's POV., and we already know how messed up he is.
There actually might be our Aerith bidding farewell but chose to not interact with the crew for some reason. BUT the Dialogue-repeating, Meteor mentioning Aerith before that? Now that gets interesting.
I'd sure hope not, cause happily playing into Cloud's own messed up thinking during her farewell is kind of a shitty thing for "real" Aerith to do at this point.
I believe it. Why would "Aerith" randomly mention meteor? Not only that, her personality has been incredibly off.
because the cetra temple told them of meteor. why do y'all ignore that part?
@@arceptor I'd be honest, I probably didn't hear it.
@@inunarugo understandable. A lot was thrown at us in the last hours
Ohhh, didn't realize Max already finished the story! I was thinking about this exact thing the other day, and I think it's promising!! ... But, just like all the rest, too bad we don't know enough to say for sure one way or another ｡ﾟ( ﾟ^∀^ﾟ)ﾟ｡
It's great that all these wild theories kind of mimic the discourse surrounding Aerith and finding a way to revive her in the OG game
I think another huge hint is the music. In several scene, the dev could straight up use Aerith's theme, and it would be quite emotional. But instead, they altered Aerith's theme or use some eerie version of the lifestream theme in those scene. The dev team are pros, they won't use such music unintentionally. They want us to feel uneasy for a reason.
It’s so eerie to think that so many of us aren’t going to consider this theory purely because we want her to be alive so badly. We’re seeing The Thing play out in front of us and we don’t even see it, just like Cloud.
Yah for sure jenova is doing that but Aerith also is in another timeline. Both happening
This was one of my first thoughts too after just seeing the ending of the game. It would make for a much more interesting story
Watch the original Sleeping forest dream then the new one, you'll see differences, all in all it looks like Jenova, and Sephiroth are really messing with Clouds head in both games, but he might actually be able to save Aerith in a timeline.
Max was pretty dead on with most theories from remake. We can wait and see. I like the different theories. No one is right or wrong yet.
Not crackpot, it’s what it seemed like to me when I beat it
He was getting a lot of flack online for this but I think it's a GREAT theory! Even if he's 100% wrong which is likely, it still provokes thought, and discussion and adds a new lens through which to view events and sequences which is all we have between releases and it's super fun!
my theory is that the aerith he starts seeing AFTER her death is absolutely jenova. The hints are as soon as sephiroth kills her, he starts having the usual jenova flashes wehre he's picturing her talking to him.
But it was still aerith in temple and right up to alter
To say that’s Jenova is contradicting Nanaki sensing Aerith, is contradicting the actual meaning of cutscene where she checks on everyone. It’s contradicting her being sad after they left. It’s contradicting the scene where she is left with a field full of flowers. And there’s more.
We don't necessarily know when its jenova-aerith or the lifestream aerith, but when she looks like she's comforting, its actually aerith. but I think the devs did some tricky camera shots beause aerith only appears when cloud is looking towards a certain direction (manifests her being there in his mind); Cloud promises -> shot of the bronco's propeller -> shows cloud entering the bronco -> he's not looking there but there she is and this is when its actually omni aerith who is saying the goodbye, not Jenova-aerith who he has been talking to.
😂
@@tdspkhype3042 all of those things are something Jenova would have done if mimicking Aerith. Jenova would behave just as Aerith would behave.
@@Poppe7 Ah yes Jenova would spiritually take the appearance of someone. Sure /s
Dude if you are ignoring everything I said just to agree with a bad theory, cool
I just finished Rebirth a few days ago. The ending is really sticking with me. The more i think about it, it just seems like a really dark ending. I decided to replay remake and pay rework close attention to Aerith throughout. She really seems off during the ending.
I love Max theories.
This one? Nah
@@gamerforlife3946 YES, this one...
@@DWN-024ShadowMan Cmon let’s discuss it then. Tell me how but don’t ignore any scenes please
@@gamerforlife3946 have you seen max theory? Have you heard what he says?
@@DWN-024ShadowMan Yes and he ignores multiple scenes and connects far a part scenes to eachother when most are foreshadowing for next part. He also says Jenova theme covering the Aerith theme in boss fight is an indication when that was in OG. He also ignores Aerith's theme in the background of this scene. I could go on but I do want to hear your opinion
I would be on board with this twist and I think it would drive people insane. The foreboding Jenova/Aerith spot in the theme sells it. Welp 3/4 years we'll get our answer.
I don't know about that cause they still said that this is an alternate timeline journey now and she could still be alive there. Also I already know that who they're dealing with right now is Jenova/Sephiroth and that Cloud is being manipulated by it too from his mako fractured mind and Jenova cells inside him.
I know this is just a theory. But if true, it's super creepy. And I would kind of like it because I wanted Jenova to play a bigger role and this would give it to her.
It's very possible, but then what isn't possible anymore after that ending? I mean, the writers just up and turned reality into gibberish in the last 5% of the story. If it turns out that Cloud is Sephiroth, Tifa is Yuffie and Barret's your uncle, would that be a thing that stretches believability anymore? Toriyama will just snap his fing-- masterfully write another Multiverse Ex Mach-- totally make everything connect flawlessly.
Interesting theory, however I don't know if that is true. Jenova was already weakened after the ending of remake. Sephiroth is the new Jenova as he took over the whispers. And the ending could not be interpreted as Jenova since we saw the rainbow when Cloud hit the sword of Sephiroth. Also Aerith showed up to fight against Sephiroth isn't just a memory as Aerith can actually move and fight. Also if Jenova Aerith is there, shouldn't there be more Jenova glitches? Usually Jenova theme always follow with glitches. Also as Sephiroth already got black materia and thus able to summon meteor in other worlds. I thought Jenova would have bigger things to worry about. If you say he predicted everything about rebirth, where is the video? I would like to see it.
In the temple of the ancients Sephiroth says to Aerith „my fragmented mother” as we know Jenova cells are fragments of her within others.
Max missed a lot and definitely didnt predict everything in rebirth lol he literally stated the obvious and a lot of his viewers apparently needed remakes ending broken down, i think some of the smaller channels were actually more correct in analyising/theorizing rebirth before the release. He missed a lot of context in this, I like Max but he missed a lot of dialog clues in his analysis. The fact that the black materia is fake, Aerith says this when she takes the materia. Aerith says "I saw what you did back there, thank you" in the last fight with sephiroth, also no one has said anything about the differences in her hair surprisingly, or that Tifa sees the timeline where Aerith lives and the timeline where Aerith dies. Without reading the story about the white and black lifestream I could see where someone could think she's possibly jenova at the end, though this story is about Aerith vs Sephiroth. I don't believe they would do all the twists they have just to have everything play out exactly to a T the way they happened in the OG or they would just make a remaster instead, just my thoughts
I love Max but let's be real here, imagine all the pissed off people who buy Aerith merch (figures, art, clothing etc) and telling them the only true version is the one from the og 1997 game and the one brought to life for the last 100+ is a lie. We can go back to the very beggining of Remake and Aeriths reaction to the flower being stomped doesn't seem very Jenova-like. Why would she pretend to care when no one is looking?
Anyways, Max looked kinda blazed playing the game. A lot of people have been wondering what Aerith whispered to Tifa after the Gongaga reactor and Max had absolutely no reaction to that part. Just one of many where he just didnt seem to be paying attention or something.
Why did aerith say I saw what you did back there thank you? Is that because cloud tried to save her?
The Jenova theory passes the initial smell test. More-so than the Cloud seeing dual worlds and Aerith living in one.
@@ImaFknLegend It doesn’t even pass any test lol
My theory is that when Cloud saved Aerith, she swapped timelines to make Sephiroth think that he killed her, so she can continue praying, thats why when lying in Clouds arms she says "I got this"
She didn’t say that, cloud did
Watch as he lays Aerith down when he tells her I got this, he lays her on her back look at the others they aren’t moving like they are frozen in time. After the fight Tifa runs to Aerith she is laying on her side, the Aerith that died, as soon as you see one of Cloud boot pause, zoom in and you see Tifa kneeling beside Aerith still laying on her side the Aerith that died. Cloud approaches Aerith is laying on her back the Aerith Cloud saved. Zack healed Cloud we are going to see that in part 3 which will explain how Cloud was able to save her and defy fate and create a new world. Remember Zack having Aerith hair bow and didn’t with Biggs but yet at the Shinra building.
@@OtenP_you’re just in denial that she could have been saved
@vaasmontenegro3728 crazy theories aside tho, Cloud is the one that says that though, not Aerith.
@@vaasmontenegro3728 She will 100% be saved. They are both killing everyone, and saving everyone. The main gang all dies in one world, Aerith/Zack alive in the next. Then both worlds will collide and everyone stays alive. Im guessing cloud #2 will be used as Sephiorths "perfect vessel" to re-incarnate and come back as his final form. That second cloud wouldnt have the character development the first cloud has had, and will be weak enough for sephiroth to take over, especially with Tifa being dead in that universe.
Hahahah this was actually my First thought when beating the game. It would be a nasty twist if it happened. lets find out in 3 years 😢
I thought it as soon as I saw the ending, so that Max and me.
My theory is that Elena's sea salt ice cream is a hint that part 3 will be called FF 7/2 days. I'm sure that game will sell a lot just like Rebirth.
I think I got spoiled
I like to think Cloud also,"Gi'd" aerith. Cloud made it so she cant die and return to the life stream. She needs cloud to accept her death or else she'll never return.
It would be super sad
THIS. Makes LOTS of sense.
@@Justajawnie yeah, but its just something cool I would do for drama. They said they havent written anything yet. They have the scenario but theyre waiting for everyone's reactions before they start writing part 3.
@@kennethforman5265 I like the idea. I am onboard.
Personally...i feel like youre overthinking this and it was just her spirit at the end...even red felt her...buuuuut the last game is supposed to be where it gets dark
I am still a strong believer that there are two sephiroths in the game. The one we see talking to cloud in the flow of timelines, and the one we see throughout the game. The sephiroth throughout the game we see, is jenova, even in the original game it was always jenova until sephiroths new body was created in the north crater. I think the sephiroth we keep seeing in the edge of creation is the sephiroth that is trying to save the planet from jenova. Jenova has almost always been the true baddy
3:20 the theme is actually showing the conflict between Jenova and Aerith. During the fight with Jenova, it was an indication that Aerith actually lives or fighting for Aerith.
I don’t think Aerith will allow Jenova to take her form.
but what about her sitting nd smiling at cloud
@@nicholasbloom1 According to developers in FFVII Rebirth Ultimania, it's confirmed that the Aerith we see at the end is indeed the same Aerith who was with the team, which dismisses the Jenova theory.
Additionally, Aerith, being a Cetra, possesses significant abilities. I anticipate that we'll uncover more about her capabilities in part 3.
I think Max is mostly right about what the ending is. But I don't think that Aerith is Jenova specifically. I just think Cloud is delusionally seeing her because he can't accept her death, another thing Max did say. He is basically seeing her in place of particles of the Lifestream in the air like you will see in the overworld.
I think the biggest hint that it's not the actual Aerith is the tear in the sky. Like people have pointed out, that tear is directly from the Lifestream sequence in OG. I believe the "multiverse" takes place entirely in the Lifestream, which is why Aerith feels Zack grab her hand when she puts her hand in the Lifestream in the Cave of the Gi. This is why the tear in the sky is in every "multiverse" world. It's all in the Lifestream.
The reason Cloud sees the tear in the sky in the ending is because his mind is already in the Lifestream, where Tifa needs to go to save him.
You missed a lot of evidence: 1- The first time Aerith appears to Cloud ( when he is sitting next to tifa ) the shot of Aerith is ominous + bad music.
If she was "alive" or whatever, they woul've shot the way scene differently.
2- When Cloud says at the end " Aerith i'm gonna stop Sephiroth/Jenova i promise ". At the exact moment clouds says " stop spehiroth", we see a shot of her feet ,she stops walking abruptly, and the next pannel doesn't show us her face. + the dialogue during this scene is not natural unlike the rest of the game. If it was really Aerith, again, it woul've been shot way differently
3- During the fight aertih+ cloud vs sephiroth, Sephiroths says" Blalbla CLoud is it a illusion ?? " and cloud Answers " dont bother, this shit won't work on me anymore" then we hear Sephiroth laughing like crazy " lol this fool he doesn't know yet ".
4- There is more but they might not be as strong arguments as the
THE ONLY COUNTER ARGUMENT IS RED SOMEHOW sniffing Jerith ( Jenova being Aerith ) at the end somehow even though only cloud is supposed to see her. ( Hojo injected red with Mako/Jenova during experiment ???? )
1- the music is ominous because he thinks she’s alive but she is not.
2- That’s called hesitation and doubt… And in JP he doesn’t even say promise lol
3- That’s because Cloud still believes Aerith is alive but he is literally fighting with lifestream Aerith because even Sephiroth talks to her.
4- nothing
So they made a farewell sad scene and you think that. Also Nanaki sensing Aerith scene wouldn’t have been made if they wanted to hammer Jenova theory.
Literally no evidence supports Jenova theory as even Aerith’s theme is there when she talks. Also the look of her being sad when they leave. Camera keeps looking at her saying farewell and in a field of flowers. And alot more is against this theory.
@@gamerforlife3946 devs could have done some tricky camera shots beause aerith only appears when cloud is looking towards a certain direction (manifests her being there); Cloud promises -> shot of the bronco's propeller -> shows cloud entering the bronco -> he's not looking there but there she is and this is when its actually omni aerith who is saying the goodbye, not Jenova-aerith.
@@Mehrk At the beginning of scene she’s not there but then she is always there. Plus like you said, it’s lifestream Aerith because she is leaving them
@@hgdfhgfdhjfg Dude Nanaki is from a place that connects to lifestream more than anyone… It’s like you just contradicted the actual story and character
@@hgdfhgfdhjfg Jenova can mess with anybody, Rufus have no Jenova cells in him but still can see Jenovas illusions. The Cetra had no Jenova cells, Jenova could mess with them by mimicking their dead brothers and sisters and so on. I think it’s actually Jenova Red is sensing, Jenova is mimicking Aerith.
I think he has a point though in the fact that the game insists on this lore that Jenova can take the form of your loved ones and bring dead people to life to mess with you. It's his theory, he has the right to have one.
Since Aerith presence is in Cloud's broken mind, it's possible he actually sees two forms of her: the one in the lake was indeed creepy so it can be Jenova trying to mess with him but I do think the one in the field was Aerith spirit. We will have to wait for the last game but his theory is interesting.
Dude lore wise that was done to finish the rufus scene. He has zero points because his own basis has holes in it
Very interesting theory, it’s gon suck waiting 3-4 yrs
The Jenova theory is the theory that is made with zero sense if we are being honest
How is it interesting though? It doesn’t make sense
@@hgdfhgfdhjfg So Cloud loves Aerith?
There is merit to this. Also, keep in mind that during OG7's development, Aerith and Sephiroth had a much closer bond. Without spoiling too much, let's just say their faces and hairstyles are similar for a reason.
What merit? She was designed to be his sister at one point. The Jenova theory contradicts actual scenes in the final scene itself.
Max gets way more credit than he actually deserves about his theorizing. The dude spat out hundreds of ideas and theories after Remake, and most of them were just flat out wrong and kinda cringe. If you throw out that many ideas, a few of them are bound to be right. But Max's batting average on FF7 theories is less than .100 so just be aware of that. Anyway the Jenova/Aerith idea just makes the story waaaay too complicated. It's already complicated enough as is. The events at the altar already need to be cleared up and adding a Jenova/Aerith manipulation makes things too hard to follow. It's an interesting idea don't get me wrong, but it just makes a messy situation even worse.
This theory has no sense. If she would be jenova at the end she would go with the rest of the group on the bronco but doesn't happen
hello,
No,
Have a nice day
Who's to say he isn't doing that with Aerith? Me, I'm the one to say that. It's not misdirection to have Nanaki mistake Sephiroth for Aerith, it's just lying to the audience at that point. Cloud sees Aerith and Nanaki sense her. She's actually there communicating from the Lifestream.
Sephiroth is trying to gaslight Cloud with Tifa because it's an expanded plot point from the original. He literally transforms into Tifa later to get a party member to give up the Black Materia. One of the biggest criticisms of the OG is why Tifa waited so long to say anything. We see that criticism tackled head on in Rebirth.
Max Dood's thoughts didn't line up with the devs. Jessie wasn't alive at the Gold Saucer with no memory of Cloud or the party. There is no Back to the Future style time travel shenanigans at work. We didn't go to the Northern Crater in the second game and the game didn't end there. We didn't get visions of chibi OG characters from the OG timeline interacting with the Remake timeline. Genesis didn't show up in Rebirth. Bugenhagen wasn't the wise sage who explained all this multiverse stuff, Gi Nattak did.
Did you watch the recent interview Max did? First he claims Aerith is Jenova, tricking Cloud, but isn’t it Sephiroth intentions to break Cloud mind? Now Max is claiming Aerith is Sephiroth because you can see a glint of red in her eyes at the end, so which is it? Is she Jenova or is she Sephiroth? Then he claims she uses wall hacks and cheats to travel when he should keep in mind Sephiroth is doing the same thing, how does he travel? Did you see Sephiroth kill Aerith in the church? Did he have his sword?
Aerith who’s exceptionally close to the memories of the future, and who appears there after some sort of consciousness acts upon the lifestream. Answered by Motomu Toriyama.
In Costa Del Sol on the twilight beach. Aerith tells Cloud she can't wait for him to meet Future Aerith, and he's going to love her. Future Aerith has been in contact with normal Aerith somehow, possibly the same way Cloud now sees Aerith at the end. They even "Merge" for a moment in Temple of the Ancients when talking to Sephiroth, Aeriths Voice is doubled.
Cloud and Aerith fight Sephiroth. Sephiroth tells Aerith, “I must admit, I underestimated you” he asks Cloud, “What do you make of this? Is any of it real? Or is just all a fever dream?” Cloud tells Sephiroth, “Don’t even bother. That shit won’t work on me--not anymore”
Max didn’t even paid attention to the death scene. He is basis his theories on watching others ending explained videos and yes I did watch him watch a lot of theories.
I also bet you didn’t paid attention to the death scene as well.
Let’s see if you did and see what I did with the sword landing position and how Aerith lays.
Just because Max claims Aerith is either Jenova or now he claims Sephiroth doesn’t mean he is right and I disagree with his theory because first it was Jenova and now it’s Sephiroth hmm 🤔doesn’t seem like Cloud isn’t the one who is confused here.
I was watching too, for the most part Max came up with this theory on his own. Sephiroth and Jenova has always been kind of the same thing
Spoilers to the original (in the slim chance you don't know):
Sephiroth's body has always been stuck in the Northern Crater, and should be in the Remake series (but we don't know). Sephiroth appears everywhere using the Jenova cells inside of people (and anyone alike) like the robed men, including in Cloud's mind. That's what Max meant, he's the first to admit it's a crackpot theory but he's been cooking nonetheless
@@IdenNonya I agree! I also saw Max cook his theories. One thing I think a lot of people misunderstand is how Jenova works. Jenova can mimic anyone, and make that illusion show to anyone. Everyone in the party have seen Jenova mimic Sephiroth. You don’t need Jenova cells in you to be fooled by Jenova.
That streamer and his takes are a plague because his fans 99% of the time will take them as canon and spread them as if it’s a fact despite the story saying a completely different thing
Some of the older players seems to have forgot details from FF7
In the original game Jenova also managed to fool whoever Could give the Black Matera to. Red XIII and Barrett are the options given to the player. So Red sensing "Aerith" doesn't hint she was the real deal or from an alternate timeline/universe. He is one of the characters tricked by her depending on the player's choice.
Insofar as Aerith being dead across all the timelines, there's a Twitter post in which someone has translated FF7 Ultimania. In one of those posts, Nomura has confirmed Cloud successfully blocked Sephiroth's blade. So, for the time being, Aerith seems to be alive in another timeline.
My problem with this theory is that in og Aerith had to die in order to stop jenova from within the life stream. The only way sephiroth can truly win is to either eradicate all white materia, or save Aerith.
Lmao this is such a wrong take.
@@hgdfhgfdhjfg that is aerith. Shes alive in the timeline cloud created via the parry. They couldnt have made it more obvious. Her consciousness survived because of Cloud. Shes playing chess with Sephiroth and she trusted cloud to make the move for her.
@@hgdfhgfdhjfg 0:30 of the video... and 1:36 of the video... Jenova is an alien lifeform and has the ability to take the form of loved ones since the OG game back in 1997 lol Rebirth just added the tidbit that Jenova can also take the form of the dead. This is why ppl came up with this theory lol
@@hgdfhgfdhjfgdid you even play the game? They explained multiple times that Jenova can take the form of anyone
@@Jenova867 so long as she has a body to manipulate. which she doesnt have one of aeriths
This might be true but im not gona believe this theory only because one person had it and people look up to that person. I think we saved Aerith. It is more likely based on what we have seen so far and we cant make up ideas about how other games has been since this is a new game
Debunked because the white fates are Aeriths fate and she’s taken control of her fate just as Sephiroth has taken control of his fate :p
Drop the timeline thing too lol ~ and no the aerith that was with cloud in the church was advent children aerith
The aerith that came to fight with cloud is advent children aerith.
The card game utter gibberish.
Lmao nope 😂
Yes she is.