I have a lot of experience with Skaven and have exclusively only played them so far in the Old World. After watching the video, I had many thoughts, so I watched it again and wrote them down in roughly chronological order for simplicity's sake. I like Skitterleap because it allows you to control magic range and keep characters out of trouble. Cloud of Corruption is excellent as well. At this point, I've defaulted to using battle magic on my Grey Seer to keep him safe, as all the spells have long ranges. You can't give Stormvermin drilled except by wasting points on a specific banner. There is some debate about how the Furnace and Bell charge. Do they use their own movement or the unit's movement? I also like the Cautious Shield as a way to blunt Dragon charges, but you really have to build a unit to win combat around it, which can end up wasting valuable points. I really like Death Globes on the Assassin; you can take two of them. I'm sad to see the removal of Giant Rats. Games Workshop actually nerfed them, but I still run three units of approximately 30 with immortal master moulders. They cost 100 points each and are fantastic for clearing flanks. I wouldn't equip spears or shields on the Clanrats. You don't want them in combat, and it's a waste of around 80 points. Warpfire Throwers have less range than a Ratling Gun and can't move and shoot, making them fairly difficult to use. I'd take the Hell Pit over two Lightning Cannons. The random movement is challenging, but it's been greatly improved by the FAQ. You need something that can tarpit a major threat for a few turns. Cannons with random elements and without multiple wounds aren't worth taking. Gutter Runners are extremely good. Throwing weapons and poison is how I run them. They start shooting on the first turn and don't stop. With each iteration of my list, I keep adding more and more. I'm up to three units of 10 now. It's unwieldy on the table, but they chew through everything. You're hitting the Terrorgheist on 4s since it's a large target and you don't have the -1 penalty for long range. Unfortunately, you've built an illegal list. You are only allowed one unit of Jezzails per Engineer. You also can't put Skavenbrew on a unit champion; it's for Chieftains and Warlords only.
Cool, excellent feedback. Like i said at the end, it needs some tweaking and I was finding it hard to work out what's good. I did drop the cannons in the end and ended up with a single hellpit to act as a bit of a distraction. I was really trying to maximise the number of ratling guns and would probably have ended up removing all upgrades from the clanrats (apart from the champ to limit the effectiveness of a single large monster charging them). I reckon where I might have ended up is dropping the bell as I'm not sure it's much use really, taking another engineer, removing all the upgrades on the clanrats and then buying some giant rats, which I think are great, they just don't come with weapons teams. On the rules query, I think RAW means you'd use the unit's move for charges, but I'd rather dragged along was an exception to heavy chariots joining units than what it currently is... It's probably also worthwhile mentioning that Skaven were my main army in 6th, and I even won a tournament with them - they have been de-powered quite massively, as I remember my warp lightning cannons killing tonnes of stuff, but now I can't see them doing much and I'm not sure what the difference is?
*Random Movement is broken this edition.* A unit of fast cavalry could be 18" away, you roll the 1 in 216 triple 6s and they end up having to hold as a charge reaction. Also it not random movement it is *random movement characteristics* you could roll an 11 and decide I don't want to move anymore.
I don't think so as it isn't reliable, it's massively swingy, you could roll an 18, or you could have a 4" charge you need to make and roll that 3. On the deciding not to move, you could just wheel on the spot until your move has been eaten up, so the roll being the maximum distance makes sense.
6:50 Pillar of Fire is amazing because you control the direction, especially on a highly mobile unit in combination with arcane urgency you can cast it at one end of an army and walk the vortex across half the enemy army if they are tightly packed since it jumps over units when it moves. d3 + 3 hits and S3 is ok, but its AP -2 as well.
Good foray into trying to make Slaven work. One thing to watch is that jezzails can't be split as you may only have 1 per engineer! Old world builder is user friendly but new recruit seems to be quicker at bug fixing!
At about 14 minutes in, when talking about the bell being a large target, you said it can see over other units. Has this been confirmed somewhere? The way I understood it, everyone can see a large target, but the large target doesn’t have a rule that lets it see over smaller units.
I have a lot of experience with Skaven and have exclusively only played them so far in the Old World. After watching the video, I had many thoughts, so I watched it again and wrote them down in roughly chronological order for simplicity's sake.
I like Skitterleap because it allows you to control magic range and keep characters out of trouble. Cloud of Corruption is excellent as well. At this point, I've defaulted to using battle magic on my Grey Seer to keep him safe, as all the spells have long ranges.
You can't give Stormvermin drilled except by wasting points on a specific banner.
There is some debate about how the Furnace and Bell charge. Do they use their own movement or the unit's movement?
I also like the Cautious Shield as a way to blunt Dragon charges, but you really have to build a unit to win combat around it, which can end up wasting valuable points.
I really like Death Globes on the Assassin; you can take two of them. I'm sad to see the removal of Giant Rats. Games Workshop actually nerfed them, but I still run three units of approximately 30 with immortal master moulders. They cost 100 points each and are fantastic for clearing flanks.
I wouldn't equip spears or shields on the Clanrats. You don't want them in combat, and it's a waste of around 80 points.
Warpfire Throwers have less range than a Ratling Gun and can't move and shoot, making them fairly difficult to use.
I'd take the Hell Pit over two Lightning Cannons. The random movement is challenging, but it's been greatly improved by the FAQ. You need something that can tarpit a major threat for a few turns. Cannons with random elements and without multiple wounds aren't worth taking.
Gutter Runners are extremely good. Throwing weapons and poison is how I run them. They start shooting on the first turn and don't stop. With each iteration of my list, I keep adding more and more. I'm up to three units of 10 now. It's unwieldy on the table, but they chew through everything.
You're hitting the Terrorgheist on 4s since it's a large target and you don't have the -1 penalty for long range.
Unfortunately, you've built an illegal list. You are only allowed one unit of Jezzails per Engineer. You also can't put Skavenbrew on a unit champion; it's for Chieftains and Warlords only.
Cool, excellent feedback. Like i said at the end, it needs some tweaking and I was finding it hard to work out what's good. I did drop the cannons in the end and ended up with a single hellpit to act as a bit of a distraction. I was really trying to maximise the number of ratling guns and would probably have ended up removing all upgrades from the clanrats (apart from the champ to limit the effectiveness of a single large monster charging them).
I reckon where I might have ended up is dropping the bell as I'm not sure it's much use really, taking another engineer, removing all the upgrades on the clanrats and then buying some giant rats, which I think are great, they just don't come with weapons teams.
On the rules query, I think RAW means you'd use the unit's move for charges, but I'd rather dragged along was an exception to heavy chariots joining units than what it currently is...
It's probably also worthwhile mentioning that Skaven were my main army in 6th, and I even won a tournament with them - they have been de-powered quite massively, as I remember my warp lightning cannons killing tonnes of stuff, but now I can't see them doing much and I'm not sure what the difference is?
*Random Movement is broken this edition.*
A unit of fast cavalry could be 18" away, you roll the 1 in 216 triple 6s and they end up having to hold as a charge reaction.
Also it not random movement it is *random movement characteristics* you could roll an 11 and decide I don't want to move anymore.
I don't think so as it isn't reliable, it's massively swingy, you could roll an 18, or you could have a 4" charge you need to make and roll that 3. On the deciding not to move, you could just wheel on the spot until your move has been eaten up, so the roll being the maximum distance makes sense.
@@MalignMusings You don't need to wheel on the spot, you just choose any distance from 0 to what ever you rolled.
Can you point me to the rule that says you don’t suffer the -1 to hit for long range in Large Targets?
6:50 Pillar of Fire is amazing because you control the direction, especially on a highly mobile unit in combination with arcane urgency you can cast it at one end of an army and walk the vortex across half the enemy army if they are tightly packed since it jumps over units when it moves. d3 + 3 hits and S3 is ok, but its AP -2 as well.
Agreed, it really is quite good, no idea wht I haven't seen this before.
very informative video! I'm trying to make a skaven list to play at my lgs and this was helpful
Glad it was helpful!
Good foray into trying to make Slaven work. One thing to watch is that jezzails can't be split as you may only have 1 per engineer! Old world builder is user friendly but new recruit seems to be quicker at bug fixing!
An interesting list went 3rd on 2k points this week-end. Doom flayer was on the menu
Good video again! I have a mate that I'll send this video to
At about 14 minutes in, when talking about the bell being a large target, you said it can see over other units. Has this been confirmed somewhere? The way I understood it, everyone can see a large target, but the large target doesn’t have a rule that lets it see over smaller units.
Yeah it's in the normal rules for large targets, they can see and be seen, units don't block LOS to or from them.
@@MalignMusings Found it, thx!
Commenting for the great god Algorithm.
All hail Al Gor Ythmus
Skavenbrew doesnt need additional wording.
Only to make it super tight, I'm nitpicking...
I do not believe you can have a grey seer with a fellblade be on a bell as the weapon has been faq to be infantry only.
Yep, you're absolutely right, nerfing factions at the bottom of the meta, well done GW!
@@MalignMusings classic GW
????
I am also in the fillar of fire family