NEW SRAM Red AXS: ride review, details & pro mechanic insight
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- čas přidán 7. 06. 2024
- The new 12-speed SRAM Red AXS electronic-hydraulic road group features a completely overhauled lever design that is considerably more powerful and more comfortable than before, and SRAM also shaved weight throughout the group for a total claimed weight of 2,496g.
I have ridden a few hundred miles and 20,000 feet or so of elevation on the group, and I share what I like and what I don’t like here.
Also, I hire Jim Potter, owner of Vecchio’s bike shop, to build up the group and give me his take on the group in particular and SRAM in general.
More videos on SRAM Red AXS to come! But this is a good overview of what’s new on the new SRAM Red AXS.
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0:00 overview
4:00 pro mechanic
15:54 FasCat
17:26 new lever details
21:00 other part modifications
23:37 weight
24:16 ride impressions
30:02 what I don’t like
32:16 bottom line - Sport
Another through and fair review. The new hood design looks great and I'm anxious to see what the overall consensus is over time. You've once agin set the bar for review quality and depth. What drone are you using these days? The Colorado shots of you are really nice. Thanks so much for all you do.
Thank you. I have two drones: a DJI Mini 3 and then recently I've been toying around with a Hover: amzn.to/3V7MUn5
The Hover has been great for self-shooting. It certainly isn't foolproof - and it tops out at 15mph - but for getting a sense of place without a) a second person to fly a drone, and b) spending 15 minutes setting up a 'proper' drone and getting it to prepped and locked in, etc, this thing is the best thing I've found.
Resolution tops out at 2.7k, which is a bummer, but for social that's probably fine.
The main points are that it's crazy light, fits in a jersey pocket, and turns on and takes off in seconds and (mostly!) tracks you well on a bike.
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney Doesn't the DJI Mini 3 have a follow mode that you can set it up with similar to the hover? I've never owned a drone, but the dji would probably be my first pick for similar bike shots.
That ENVE road bike is absolutely stunning. Love the color!
Looks like an Enve…. but what Enve is it? It looks like an ISP. Look at the seatpost and clamp area.
@@scottsettle ENVE Custom Road
Agree. For the price Enve has some pretty bland colors. Bring some color and im sold
Shimano grx nailed this style of hood shaping few years back, good to see sram take this styling to road. Not the sharpest looking shifters but should be more functional and comfortable like grx.
Funny when I listen to bike mechanics removing simple parts or disassembly,I work on my cars,cycles & home & compare that to a bicycle which is a joke to work on,no crawling under tight spots or heavy lifting with a bike,working on a bike is relaxing
Excited to get “old heavy “axs sets on big sale
Hehe. No doubt.
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney I’ve seen the new red at my local bike shop love shape of the hoods. Thinking of swapping out force hoods. I have the force hoods previous to current and keep rest of the bike force. Like the fact there cross compatible
Such a pleasure to hear a summary from a mechanic on an actual customer install- great video👍🏽
Excellent as usual Ben. Thanks.
Excellent actual review with bonus content from Jim. Well done.Def going to swap my older red hood/levers for the new ones.
Hello again and thanks for your superb review of new Red, Ben!
Your videos are so straight forward and reply all our questions.
Nice touch to include the opinion of a pro builder.
Always useful/wonderful stuff, fun and informative the same time. 👍
P.S.: Your bike looks fantastic with the new Red!!👌
Love SRAM. I initially bought it for a custom bike with decouplers for travel (no cables or wires) makes the process easier.
The simplicity of right hand moves chain right and left hand moves chain left was good for my brain on the limit which is not infrequent.
I have the most current Force group on my newest bike and love it (actually 1x on a road bike…the horror😮).
Great review!
Thanks for a full, proper review instead of reading a stat list.
You're welcome. You can get a feature list anywhere, right?
Thanks for a comprehensive and common sense review. Your viewpoint matters and is helpful to all riders. This video should be required for everyone thinking about purchasing a new high end road bike!
Thanks Ben, great review!
First frame of the video is certainy a way to get someone's attention! Great video and commentary. I think the new lever layout is a big step forward and is something that I would love to see the other manufacturers jump on board with.
Great content creation - especially bringing a top notch mechanic into the review. Full real world picture on ownership. Do long-term follow-up and put Mr Potter in anytime it makes sense.
This is the place where i come for a real life review. Thanks for the testing. For me, this group is not a big step up but good changes nonetheless
Excellent video; very professional.
Thanks for sharing that cycling route. We have traveled thru Grand Junction and always spent just a night.
My age and cycling experience this just may be a great Ride for me.
As usual your video is a class above the rest!
You gotta ride that! Here is a loop from the downtown hotels - with a dogleg out to Palisade through the vineyards: www.strava.com/routes/18499212
You could break that into two rides.
And/or, you could do the Tour of the Moon with my friends at The Ride Collective: www.theridecollective.com/tourofthemoon
Using the code theride2024 saves you 20% on entry.
Top Tier Ben! thanks a bunch!
Nice deep dive, great description.
The new lever shape is almost identical to the TRP hylex, which is a great thing, ive been running those for a few years and theyre the best of anyone for hood shape ane braking ergonomics
Thanks. I need to get some time on TRP. It has been years, I’m afraid to say.
Fantastic. I've always been a Sram fan. The ergonomics of the lever is the best on the market IMO (never owned a Di2 group tho).
I have always wanted a closer look at that frame and wondered what it was seeing a blue bike hanging on the wall. It looks amazing and I love the blue paint job!
the reason you did not have issues after hard breaking is SRAM increased the gap of the pads in the calipers. Warped rotors no longer rub.
I keep trying to get both SRAM and Shimano to quantify pad clearance, but have thus far been unsuccessful.
This reminds me of how much I want to have my Melee painted. First world problems…😅 Thanks for the fantastic review, as always, Ben.
Cheers, Brian. Where are you thinking of getting your Melee painted?
Great Review, I appreciate covering the hood shape in great detail. I have 2 bikes with Force AXS, Im going to replace my road bike later this year and have been interested in maybe going with the new RED. I'm an old man hack of a cyclist my only reason to go Red over Force is ergonomics. My son is sponsored by Sram for DH racing so i get a decent discount and the cost difference isn't absurd.
Thank you. Liked the part with the mechanic a lot. 🥞
Thanks very much!
New room, drywall? Thank you for all you do for us out here!
I'm getting very, very fancy. One day I might even put covers on the outlets on the wall. 😀
Garmin climb function works without a route now as well
Good one!
Thanks!
Love the zia on your bars. My kid just wrapped up his freshman year at UNM. See you at Unbound?
Go, Lobos! And yes, I will be at Unbound and was just talking to my friends at Feedback about doing a gravel Q&A in their booth.
Great stuff Ben, thx! Curious to get your pov on hot waxing that new RED chain, as these holes will most likely be stuffed with (a bit of) wax. Competing marginal gains 😅
Thanks. And you know, that was one of my thoughts looking at that chain…
It's great that Sram released the new Force before Red, so we can wait another iteration before the better braking trickles down.
Awesome review! Your work is always excellent! How does the new Red hoods compare to the new Force and Rival hoods? I have the new Force on my gravel bike and the new rival on my road bike and it seems like the feel and design are identical. The new Red hoods looks a bit different then the rival and force. I have small hands and I love the Force/Rival hoods. I'm not sure I would like the additional reach of the new Red on the hoods. Eventually, I would like to upgrade to full Red on my road bike, but I'm not sure I would like the new Red shifter/hoods.
Thanks. The new Red hood is a bit longer and roomier. SRAM contends that the reach adjust works for a wide range of hand sizes, but it certainly wouldn't hurt to put your hands on the things physically before buying, if you're considering going that route.
Great and thorough vid Ben, thanks!
but maybe comparing the ergonomics of new force to new red would be good (potentially more useful a comparison, or relevant and closer) rather than old red to new red ...
Good idea. Thanks. Maybe my next video on Red will be new Red vs DA Di2 and Force.
Great review Ben. It would be really interesting to hear your comparison with SRAM Force / Apex, as well as with all tiers of electronic Shimano groupsets. Do the functional differences between electronic groupset levels justify the large price differences between them? Also, it’s intriguing that Campagnolo is being virtually ignored across the industry, despite arguably (at least by price) now producing the best top level electronic groupset. ...If SRAM Red is worth the high price, why not Campy? And arguably now the Shimano wired electronic groups are the least advanced of the three, yet still gets most plaudits, why is this?
Considering the swapping out the chain when ready. Will this new red chain work with the current Sram Force chain set.
very high quality production, some cycling journalism outfits should take some tips from you. kudos.
Great review. Question: do you know if the new levers are compatible with the old (last Gen) brake calipers?
They are, yes.
It looks like new lever shape makes the level longer, therefore one might need to get a shorter stem to match the hand position setup with an older generation lever? I recall Shimano Di2 levers also reached out further from the 11 speed to 12 speed generations. Thanks for the comprehensive review.
I will get the measuring tape out for the next review looking at lever length for SRAM and Shimano, 11 and 12 speed, electric and mechanical. Good shout.
Ben, how tall are you and what crank length do you ride. There's a lot of talk of going to smaller crank length than what comes stock on most bikes lately. Have you done a video on this yet?
Thoroughly enjoy your unbiased reviews!
I'm 6' and ride 172.5. I used 175s for the first 10 years or so, and slightly shorter ones for the last however many eons. I'm a tweener on bike size between 56 and 58s, but I always go for 56s in part because of the 172.5s that often come on 56s. Tadej is on 170s now, as you probably know. The tri crowd will give you an earful about hip angle and a lower torso and better aerodynamics and on and on if you give them an opening, and they're not necessarily wrong. Sam Boardman who is a tall drink of water runs 165s now. 172.5 works for me, though.
When can I rip off my front derrailluer and not tell the difference? 1x12? 1x13?
Came here for Potter wasn’t disappointed…
Ben, what handlebar is this in your blue bike?
With those bigger chainring options I would have liked to see cassettes that start at 11. I still dislike the 10t for efficiency and it seems like a waste of a cog when you have a 52+ on the front. Rare is the group ride that wouldn't get grumpy if you put the 52/10 to use by attacking down the hill
Thank you Ben, if I just upgrade shifters with my existing red GS, will the bonus button functionality work and can I switch gears (easy /hard and front chainrings) .
Yes. That's a cool thing about AXS is that they are all on speaking terms.
For someone with a custom enve bike, does the extra reach of the hoods impact the bikefit? Does it feel something like "oh... this is stretchy"
Great question! It is a tiny bit longer. Not as much as the jump from cable to hydro levers - that through me for a loop a few years ago with test bikes where I would measure to the center of the bar and be stumped as to why a precise fit felt so different.
I'd add some data on this into the next video.
What is that Michigan Route 22, a garbage bag? Surprised to see that. Cheers.
The one piece crenk and chain ring sound like corp parasite. I like most of the changes and hope the button's etc make it to the Explr groups soon. Maybe aftermarket crank with removable chain rings.. What if you want to change your crank length also. $$$$'s Sram . Maybe Sram will try to corner the power meter market by dropping cost of their power meters way down and they are expecting consumers to have the laying around like spare tires. Thanks Ben!
LOL. Thank you, gave me a good laugh with my morning coffee. It's completely absurd for consumers, yes, but Red level isn't designed for consumers. It's designed for top end marginal gains. If this design pops up in an updated Force groupset, then yeah, completely agree, but those aren't considerations for for "top end performance". (Also, agree that the buttons on Explr or other groupsets would be fantastic.)
@@jester6578 are you aware that the latest Force groupset has the same design? (integrated powermeter in the chainrings)
wear the chainrings and you have to replace the whole powermeter. it's probably up there in the most stupid designs ever made
@@ynslife I actually mis-understood what OP said, I thought it was a statement that the chainrings were integrated WITH the cranks. But as far as I can tell from the SRAM website that's not the case. Powermeter integrated into chainrings will be the most accurate representation of power going into the drivetrain - but also has the drawback of cost if you want to change chainring size. As for chainring wear: as long as you are doing basic cleaning/maintenance and replacing the chain when needed, I would be VERY impressed if a non-pro wore out their chainrings. (Which is what Ben says in that part of the video.)
Thanks! Couple questions if you don't mind: 1) is SRAM still using DOT for the hydraulic fluid (sorry if I missed that)? 2) The ENVE bike looks to be using a rear brake caliper on the front. Not the first bike to do that, but do you know the reasoning behind that choice? 👍
SRAM is still using DOT, yes. On the calipers, they are the same front and rear. Can you explain what you mean by a rear caliper?
@TheRidewithBenDelaney Thanks. Too bad about the DOT. I had hoped that they would change that when I heard about the new Red.
It looks like the caliper on the fork uses the same mounting design as the rear caliper; where the retaining bolts go through the stay instead of going through the caliper into the stay (how they usually attach). I didn't look at the part numbers for the new Red, but for Shimano groups the front (IBRR9270F6RF) and rear (IBRR9270RDRF) calipers are different parts, and not interchangeable. There are other bikes (e.g. some 3T) that use this design. It's something you need be aware of when ordering a retail groupset as a groupset when building the bike up. Just wondering if you knew of a reason (marketing or otherwise :)) for that decision.
@@Mamilian the calipers themselves have the part# BR-R9270 and are exactly identical front and rear. The part numbers that you've quoted are for assemblies, that include the caliper and various other parts. It is these other parts such as the hoses (SM-BH90-JK-SSR and SM-BH90-JK-SS) and mounting hardware, that make the assembly front or rear.
As for your question of why they use the thru-bolt mounting style, it's lighter and easier to manufacture, and doesn't require threads in the fork. Not having to put threaded inserts into the fork means you can't ruin the fork simply by crossthreading the bolt.
Ben needs a white saddle to match the bar tape.
And white helmets, shoes and socks... :-)
@@TheRidewithBenDelaneyAnd G Thomas glasses!
If the new lever hoods are longer and most of us spend most of our time riding on the hoods, do we need to adjust our bike fit when moving to new Red? 10mm shorter stem to compensate?
PS: really enjoyed the zero bullsh1t evaluation from the mechanic 👍
I have grx di2 shifters on my road bike and tbh the answer is yes it affects fit. But whether that causes you to change the stem length is up to you. I did not shorten the stem because I don't want the tops any closer to my knees when out of saddle. 1cm turns out to not be that big of a deal for me.
@@proffate Thanks for the quick reply. My lack of flexibility is shocking!
damn, Ben can corner!
Can the new Red levers be used with the previous Force groupsset?
Yes.
Question, Ben...What is the largest cassette that Red will accommodate? I'm planning on building up a gravel bike and looking to build a 10-50 or 10-51t cassette with a 40t chainring.Thoughts?
I've read it can fit a max of a 10-36t cassette. Would have to use an XPLR RD to go above the 36t limit.
Yup, what @thenordic24 said - 36t is the max. On the plus side, there is just a single derailleur in this group instead of short- and long-cage options. On the minus side, you gotta run another derailleur if you want a bigger cassette. That said, with the range of chainring options, I feel like 36t is a pretty darn low gear.
Fooking POTTER! 🤟
Why doesn't SRAM make clipless pedals to go with their drivetrains? Great review.
They do have Time pedals as part of their family of brands.
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney Thanks Ben!
Is the weight you stated with the power meter or without it
With a power meter! 172.5 cranks, 48/35 rings, 10-28 cassette, and then all the other parts including hoses, fluid, bolts, batteries, etc.
Vs Force?
Ben who would you say this groupset is ideally for (racers or weekend warriors)?
It's really more of just a financial thing than a racer vs recreational rider. I know plenty of pro riders who never had the top-end group in their careers, and they did just fine. Conversely, there's nothing wrong with a weekend warrior buying the latest and greatest (provided it doesn't start fights with their significant other at home...).
@TheRidewithBenDelaney thank you
New Madone coming!?
😶
I'll keep my Cane Creek EE brakes. They work great and easy to work on.
I'd really like to have a comparison between this, Shimano *AND* Campy...
My ordered list of preferred gruppos is still Campy > Shimano > SRAM for the last time I bought a road bike.
Change my mind.
Well, I couldn’t tell you the last time I rode a Campy road bike…. Maybe the NY Gran Fondo ~10 years ago? 🤷♂️ Sorry!
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney You said you'd be doing a head to head video comparing SRAM and Shimano - maybe ask Jim to lend you a Campy bike to do the comparison thoroughly :)
Do you and other youtubers get the groupo for free?
SRAM sends out test groups, yes. The same goes for all the bikes I test - the company sends it to me, I ride it for a while, do a review, and then send it back. An increasing number of e bike companies have been emailing me about "collabs" or paid reviews, which I of course turn down or just ignore.
Sram have come a long way since their GripShift days. I don’t think this group will be rivaled by shimano or campy any time soon
Who’s Ben Delaney?
idk how people like these huge bike computers. I absolutely love my bolt v1. Also, I don't think the new Red is very aesthetically pleasing. DuraAce and SuperRecord look like another class comparatively imo.
I dig the Bolt and Edge 830 for 95% of my rides. It's nice to have a big screen sometimes for following routes. Hammerhead definitely has an uphill battle against Garmin and Wahoo, and I expect SRAM to leverage its reach with groups (and wheels, and meters, and pedals) to get a toehold for its computers.
What does the groupset cost?
Varies by market: www.sram.com/en/sram/models/gs-red-e-e1
$2850-$3000 is what they have listed for the US.
It definitely seems like groupset ergonomics are converging. Shimano getting chunkier and SRAM getting smaller.
Song ID at the end pls ?
Hey. I use a music subscription service called Epidemic that makes tunes that don’t exist elsewhere in the world so CZcamsrs like me don’t get hung up with copyright violations. So…. it doesn’t exist. 😃
Enve ISP…haven’t seen that before I don’t think
It's a Custom Road bike from when ENVE was first dipping its toes into bikes. I was editorial director at VeloNews/Outside at the time and they built that for me as a demo. When Outside laid me and others off, I asked ENVE if they'd sell it to be at a pity-the-laid-off-guy pro deal price.
@@TheRidewithBenDelaney that’s a super cool bike! I’m glad they gave the right number, it’s neat to see things like this. In the video you made a comment about trying the group on a bike that you could show soon and I was like “but what about the blue one, that seems like a unicorn, wonder if it’s that one”. On a side note I got an AXS Red bike in the last month at one of the stores that was going out of business for such a low amount I don’t have regrets about how amazing this new group looks, but I still want it.
With a non-replaceable chainring riders will have to start using wax on their chains to prevent/minimize drivetrain wear.
Holly crap! This means more bike-related unnecessary purchase arguments with my wife.
I wear out chain rings. LOL
I know right? Ben is a great guy, but since he's only riding new bikes for a few thousand km at most before sending them back, seriously out of touch 😂
the new app doesn't work with the older Karoo 2. kinda lame.
Those chainrings with built in powermeter is a total deal breaker for me. What are they thinking?? I change between 3 different chainrings depending on the race course - I really don’t want to own x3 powermeter!! So sorry SRAM you won’t be getting any of my hard earned money.
The problem with DOT fluid is that it expands in hot days, causing brakes to lock. Also having DOT prevents from swapping parts, eg with Shimano you can use Magura brakes, or any other brand using mineral oil ; ) Electronic groupsets will use up the battery in cold winter days withn 2 hours.
B) Red grouset is definately for sponsored professionals or crazy cyclists. I see no benefits of having Red for $4K! How it would improve your fitness, or quality of ride? A groupset for 1K will exactly do the same. Forget about Karoo, different pistons, or integration, these are tertiary features. But the technological process is like a game, if you keep playing, you become better, if you stop you're out of the game.
Do not agree on sram customer service. I have a pair of zipp 303s, on which i have to change the bearings every 4 months from the beginning, what i never had on any other wheelset before. Don't know what is wrong with those hubs, also the axis is broken. They only tell me that it is wear and tear. That is what you get for a budget wheelset and furthermore it is pretty expensive to change bearings every 4 months
zipp hubs where always trash... who the hell buys those craps wheels? First random chinese wheelset is better then this crap and cheaper. Zipp is for influencers lol
unfortunately bought them before i had 9velo on my radar and thought they are solid wheels and espacially for the guarantee...
Been on Zipp 303S wheelset for over 12,000 miles with zero issues. Hammered them
On many a pothole in fast group rides and a couple bridge seems severe enough to burb the tires. Still no issues.
And that is why i think that something is wrong with my hubs, but unfortunately no guarantee at all from sram
@@bewe9473, rider weight, ride style, weather conditions in use, constant hard cornering in Crits? All could be a factor. But then you may just have a faulty hub (quite rare but not out of the realm of possibility). Many sets are in use with my riding groups and no one complains of issues. Sell them and move on.
the new Red AXS looks nice, but kind of redundant after last year's new Force, to the same extent that Ultegra/ Dura Ace does.
the only way you can tell one from the other these days is its lighter on the scales and your wallet is lighter after paying for it.
I get that people wan the super premo top end stuff - but with prices nowadays - yikes.
Why is it pronounced “schram”?
Double barrel middle fingers is 😂😂
Just wanted to set the tone right from the start of the video. 😜
OMG, headsets last forever. If you are worried about your headset when it comes to internal hydraulic hose routing, maybe learn just beginner level bike maintenance.
lookit Ben scramble to shill for SRAM
Even in this market..... shut up and take my money!
No no no Ben, hydraulic disc brakes are trash. Rim brakes are way better. Not according to me, I love my hydraulic disc brakes on my road bike, mountain bike, motorcycle, cars, truck. I have not had rotor rub, but with every rim brake I have ever had it is hard to get them not to rub and not to wail like an air horn. Granted these are older bikes.
So you're saying the Rival set I just pieced together from various sales at different sites for the past month for under $1k (with cranks and tax!) is now totally outdated? 🫠