In Depth look at the Lab-Box Developing Tank
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- Glenn takes an in depth look at the innovative Lab-Box by ars-imago, the first multi-format daylight-loading film developing tank.
This amazing new developing tank lets you load 35mm or 120 film without using a changing bag or going into a darkroom. The video runs about 20 minutes, but shows you how to load film via the 35mm module as well as the 120 module.
Come visit Pitman Photo Supply and have look in person or you
can order yours at bit.ly/labboxkit
This was the best and concise demo I’ve seen. The key to spooling the film onto the spool is making sure that the spool is locked into position. If it’s not locked, the spooling fails and your processed film is ruined.
I've been having troubles with my 120 film being ruined (13 rolls were fine, 6 were not), and I'm interested in what you're saying here. What do you mean "locked?"
@@NickorusCarrin Watch the video from the 4:00 mark - you need to twist and lock the two halves of the spool.
@@NickorusCarrin He means "assemble the reel properly", which may not be that easy to do, since many of these parts failed to get most or all of the index marks to "line up" and the reel assembly process is poorly documented. If you actually use the LB a lot and shift back and forth between 35mm and 120 reel assembly, the smarter move is to buy a second reel, i.e., one for each format. My concern is that the reel has to be really tight to work properly, and constant disassembly and reassembly shifting between formats will cause wear which will loosen up the mechanism. On my unit, I found the film guide very difficult to adjust between the two sizes. Rather than going to work on it with a rat-tail file (like so may others have done), I tracked down a second guide as well, now one for each size with no resizing struggle.
This is probably the best and thorough video about Lab Box operational I've been searching for. Good work Glen 👍
Me again. Glenn, you do a great job of explaining the use of Lab-Box. It took me several tries to get it right. I want to emphasize two things - I suggest using continual agitation for approximately 8 minutes as well as ensuring that the spool is set up correctly. You will notice how smooth the turn of the knob is when done correctly.
I had used a full tank and the assembly was off. The result was a film that was sticky and useless. I spoke with the manufacturer and Alex at Cinestill that helped guide me. I have only developed black and white thus far, but will eventually go to C41.
This presentation is simply the best. I have destroyed two rolls of film due to forgetting a step here and another one there. If purchasing allow three rolls of film in order to get it rigth.
🙂 I think I´ll choose the bag the old fashioned way. You can also develop several rolls in one go that way. Anyway - looked smart in the beginning.
This gentleman was awesome. Everything effortlessly explained. Thanks a million!!!
Good to see the demo, I am familiar with Nikor reels (1960`s stuff !!) so I stick with them, the lab box looks sooo complicated...
It reminds me the very old similar Agfa Rondinax which had internal thermometer too.
Thanks Glenn! Looks like a pretty cool contraption
Very well explained, thank you very much! The Lab-Box seems to be good thing - and film is still alive!!!
Wow
That’s the definition of a solution looking for a problem
looks interesting but i think i stay with my good old Paterson tank. Can develop more films at once and not so many parts that could make trouble…
Great domo thanks for sharing.
You’re very welcome! We’re glad you liked it.
Hey Glenn! I’m Glenn
Thank you Glenn for a GREAT consice video, you tubers should be required to pass your course on Consice Videos before uploading, your the best 👍
Looks like an interesting system. Thanks for a great demonstration.
Nice work Glen
Thank you!
Omg, the 120 process. I think with some Jobo reels and a tank, I would have already started the developing by the time this conraction got the paper off
This was designed by an engineer being clever -someone who does not shoot and process multiple rolls of film at a time.
Very nice demo and the orange is pretty. I'll stick with stainless. Three 120 rolls per tank . I always designate a closet or ¼ bathroom for loading film on to the reels- simply adapt the room to be light tight. The stainless has lasted decades and there is no staining that is common with plastic reels.
I know right?
Fantastic and concise review that was extremely informative.
Thank you!!
Thank you. The explanation was very simple and understandable.
thank you. great demo.
Huge help, thanks for sharing!
Glad it helped!
Just curious who doesn’t completely roll their 35mm into the roll? Is this only able to be used if you do not completely roll your 35mm.
I wondered the same thing, but then I found this video with what appears to be an easy method to retrieve the end of the film (and has a tool option): czcams.com/video/fJfahouv_D8/video.html
b-Box Update: It's August 2010. ARS has just declared its Kickstarter for Lab-Box successfully completed, although they burned though 7 times the KS money sought and still could not deliver as promised with significant additional charges. While ARS ended up redesigning the product several times and taking more than 2 years to get the basic product out the door, the finished product is well designed and functions reliably. The two knocks on LB are: (1) it is overpriced - and it is, grossly so; and (2) on the 35mm option, the little knife which cuts the film from the cartridge after loading the film reel gets rusty. All I can say about that is the knife is located such that you'd have to be one careless idiot to get liquid from the processing tank back into the compartment where the knife is recessed. That aid, the knife could have been made of stainless steel to avoid the issue. Will ARS do a running upgrade to the knife? Doubt it - At the current prices, it is unlikely there will be another (Version 2.0) run of the LB. They will have a tough time selling off the inventory on hand.
great vid
They are wickedly expensive, but I'd rather have those Hewes steel reels and tank sitting on the end of the counter. Expensive, but still much cheaper than a LB.
Well done
Great demo thanks for sharing. I often take pictures at 120 and 35. It's laborious to change from 35 to 120 and back to 35 every time. why doesn't the company do two roles that are fixed? the idea is very good but needs an update, also think of color film and how you can keep the whole thing constant with temperatures.
We’ll have to look into the availability of additional reels. As to maintaining temperatures, generally water baths are the way to go and immersion circulators for Sous-vide cooking are quite affordable now.
My question is: how do I have the tip of exposed film out of cartridge in order to clip it into the roller ?
that was really helpful, thanks!
Great vid
Interested in this kit! Great demo
can you develop color film with this? I know nothing about film development.
The price on these things are outlandish.
I saw it well. thank you.
you can develop in the field if you have all your chemicals mixed and ready
I got another idea. Use the Lab-Box for loading your film unto the reels easily in daylight. Now take them out, and transfer to a Patterson tank, which if you have several of these reels, makes life a lot easier, and you can put the tanks in a water bath for better consistancy. At the same time, the Lab-Box is ready for the next film to load. Better to use the best of both...one for loading, and traditional Paterson or Kinderman tanks for the wet side of it. You also won't have to waste your entire time turning the stupid knob for the entire processing cycle, and use traditional intermittant processing every 30 secs. If you buy a bunch of reels, your processing will be much faster.....from a holiday you can easily have 40-50 rolls of film. Doing it this way, you can drop the reels into rubber 8x10 film tanks, and do it fast.
Hi, thank you so much for sharing this video! Is it possible to develop in color with the product?(I’m new to this🤔)
Yes, you can process color film in the Lab-Box. Color processing is sensitive to temperature and is generally done with the developing tank (in this case the Lab-Box) sitting in a temperature controlled water bath (an inexpensive immersion circulator for Sous-Vide cooking can be used for temperature control. We generally stock the C-41 and E-6 chemistry kits along with the Lab-Box. pitmanphotosupply.com/shop/categories/chemistry/712572fa-830d-401e-a59b-4d50b6162c1b
Great demo. Reinforced my decision to pass on this product while in development on Kickstarter.
Man, you saved me from spending $170 (USD or Mex$5300) in one of these contraptions. I've been loading steel tanks in the darkroom since 1968 and Jobo tanks since the 1990's. No strange to film processing, B&W or Color. However, since I dismantled my darkroom a few years ago in consideration for the planet --enlarging B&W fiber paper and then washing and toning to archival standards is a real kick in the 🥚🥚 to the environment so I just process film and go hybrid on prints. I don't have a problem with loading my Jobo or Hansa (steel) tanks inside a changing bag but the climate change keeps my old darkroom at a cozy 35ºC so I thought getting one of these and working in an air conditioned environment. No way! I'll lightproof my darkroom again and load in the dark without using the bag.
There's no reason for someone that can load roll film (even 4x5" which I don't shoot anymore) in a holder to get one of these crazy gadgets. Bye Amazon, hello again changing bag. I'll buy a cooler tomorrow.
Thanks a bunch!
I have a kodak color 35mm film. What film chemicals best for it?
If it is modern Kodak color negative film, you should use C-41 compatible chemicals such as this C-41 Press Kit pitmanphotosupply.com/shop/omega-brandess-c-41-press-kit/849e93a0-4aa5-0138-8ec8-00163ecd2826?variation=2151719 The other possibility for modern Kodak film would be color transparency film like Ektachrome 100 which uses the E-6 process. Here are the chemicals for that pitmanphotosupply.com/shop/edwal-ez-e6-kit-quart-kit/3b02bf40-4aa8-0138-8ecc-00163ecd2826?variation=2151721
The film cartridge should indicate what process to use. For the chemicals I mentioned the cartridge will say either C-41 or E-6. If it is Kodak color film and it says something other than that it might be a defunct process.
@@pitmanphotosupply2171 I'm using the CineStill two bath Cs41 process with good results; getting 18~20 rolls out of one liter. Fast and temperature flexible.
Too bad nobody has made new designs for 16mm film.
Good demonstration video.
For the 35mm module= Shouldnt you put the film somehow inbetween those 2 thin metal rods? Or film should be below it like in the video?
The film needs to be beneath both. The two rods support the film as the cutter passes between them.
Great video, can you develop color film in that ?
Processing color film should be fine, you would just probably want to keep the level of any water bath you use to maintain temperature, below the level of the middle of the agitation knob. The knob is sealed with a gasket, you probably could go above it, but probably better to be safe.
This looks to be more of a hassle than it's worth. In a changing bag, my roll is spooled up in less than 30 seconds.
How am I supposed to load this if my exposed roll of film is fully wound back into the cartridge?
Great question. With most 35mm film cameras that allow or require manual rewinding of the film, it is pretty easy to leave the tail/leader of the film out by only doing about half a crank/turn after you feel the film release from the take up spool. Some of the more advanced motorized cameras have custom functions you can set to have it leave the tail out for you. Many cameras like motorized point and shoots, AF SLRs, and single use cameras don’t have that option or they pre-wind the film and wind it back into the cartridge as it is shot, resulting in, as you mentioned, a cartridge with no tail/leader. With traditional darkroom load only tanks you can just open the can in the dark, cut the tail and spool it onto the reel. This takes a bit of practice, but is not too difficult to do. With the Lab-Box you will need to use a film leader retriever (which we sell rather inexpensively, $6.95 I believe) or if you live nearby our store, time and staff permitting, we’d be happy to do it for you or teach you how to use the leader retriever. Coincidentally, most of the staff was practicing using the manual film leader retriever today.
@@pitmanphotosupply2171 That makes sense, thanks.
Idiot proof thank you very much for a great vlog
It's a damn shame that replacement parts for this are not being sold in the US. I guess they thought it would last forever. They were wrong
Which parts broke on you? Have you had any luck finding replacements yet?
@@pitmanphotosupply2171 I've been playing email tag and am still no closer to ordering a new (complete) 120 reel. I don't know if it's the language barrier or the fact they still don't supply parts in the USA. FRUSTRATING
EFD620G I just spoke with our distributor and he said that complete 120 reels with hub and clip will be on the next P/O. So there is hope. MSRP for Hub, Clip, & Reels is $19.00. They were not on my previous price list, but they are now. They have also added the 135, Hub, Clip, & Reels ($19.00) and the Film Guide ($14.90).
ahm... it's hard to follow due to many "ahm"s and the other vioces... but thx for your effort, it's a good video and a great description.
Compared to a cheap developing tank with a self loading spiral, like a paterson, I can't see a single benefit this has. Small parts, looks easy to break, complicated, fiddly, the list of downsides to this system just don't end. A self loading spiral in a paterson tank can be fiddly at first, but if you have a sacrificial roll and practise in daylight, and then in a darkbag, they'll get there in no time.
Dark bags are a bit annoying though when you've had the luxury of a dark room, to make life easier throw all your stuff in a cardboard box with no lid/flaps, then zip that up in your darkbag, now have a dark tent.
That is quite expensive for a box of darkness.
Patterson tanks have done and will continue to do the same job for way less. Change bag takes like 30 seconds to load and put into Paterson tank. Looks too complicated and a pain in the ass to clean. A solution for something that does not need fixing!
You are right, the Patterson tanks and reels continue to be a great value (especially in light of the price increases in the stainless steel alternatives, we sell both by they way), and are very easy to use. Cleaning the Lab-Box isn’t really any more difficult than the Patterson. There is one use case where the Lab-Box is probably a better alternative, and that is if you only have use of one hand. In testing, I have managed to load the Lab-Box using only one hand without much difficulty, this isn’t the case with the alternatives.
Erm Erm Erm Erm
so many UMS ! umm !
don't use ite fot 120 film. this shit burn your first frame.
Umm
So don’t spool your film into the film canister while in camera. Got it. Otherwise, you will not be able to use this box.
This thing is ridiculous. This is a rube goldberg machine. I'm not sure what the point it is. To keep people from spending 10 minutes to figure our how to load metal reels? Who would spend time coming up with this?
Too complicated and expensive and can only do a roll at a time. Don’t see the point with this product when you can have a simpler Paterson for a fraction of the price.
Reasonable points, but the main point of it is that the entire process can be done in daylight. If you have a place to load the tanks and reels in the dark or a changing bag, traditional reels and tanks are a great option.
I've watched many videos of people using various containers/boxes and methods and this, by far, seems the fastest and easiest.
@@pitmanphotosupply2171 In all honesty this is just a trap for a beginner/amateur who is too intimidated by loading film in the dark. The loading procedures for this product are complex enough that if you can perform those, you can load film in the dark no problem after a try or two using conventional supplies. And at 10 bucks for a paterson tank off of ebay, and a 5 buck brand new dark changing bag, 200 bucks for this system that is only really useful to the extremely uninitiated for their first couple of rolls is an utter joke. Solution looking for a problem if I ever saw one.
@@imvisier9925 all valid points really, and similar arguments can be made for stainless steel reels over the plastic Paterson reels, (for instance no moving parts on the Hewes reels, pretty much last forever, and much easier to clean and dry when processing a lot of film rapidly. There is one big advantage to the Labbox over the others and that is that with a little practice and no other special preparation it can be used even if you only have the use of one hand (I’ve actually tested it that way).
@@imvisier9925 In my first photography class, many moons ago, we had a practice roll we could load in the light. The metal reels were a bit tricky, but the plastic reels are extremely easy to load.
These days, I use a changing bag, and load two paterson tanks at a time.
super duper inefficient device
I wish I had a dollar for every time he said “um” 😬
That was an awful display.Do it right or not at all. Really, why bother?
NEVER! Never, buy this thing i can't count 120 rolls i destroyed using this .