More steel cutting tests on the Benchtop Pro
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- čas přidán 12. 03. 2020
- More steel cutting tests on the Benchtop Pro
Y'all left a ton of great suggestions on the last steel cutting video, so we're trying a few of them out in this video! Testing better conventional recipes, giving conventional a shot, and seeing how High Feed end mills work on a lightweight gantry router. By the end I think I have a recipe that approximates "good enough".
📢 Twitter: / breakingtaps
If you're new here, the router is an AvidCNC Benchtop Pro 2x3, equipped with a CNCDepot S30C ATC spindle and Fogbuster.
0:24: Climb cutting test #1
3:24: Conventional cutting
5:02: High feed cutting
8:51: Climb cutting test #2
10:12: Climb cutting #3 - Věda a technologie
Love the commentary, really interesting to hear your reasoning for everything. You really cover all the bases with your testing and justifications. Love the imperial/metric feeds overlay as well- other channels could learn from that!
Thanks! Someone suggested adding metric in one of my prior videos, and in retrospect it just seems silly *not* to include it since most of the rest of the world uses metric :)
Thanks for the metric
Imo climb is the way to go on light machines, cutting forces are in geneal lighter, the tool does not get pulled into the material and its nicer to the endmill.
Your result with the highfeed endmill matches my results very exactly - I suspect the high axial forces the cutter geometry creates to be an issue for our light routers. Also, the geometry relys on a high feed to create some reasonable chip thickness.
What works well in my experience if you want to take a high feed approach: A regular endmill for steel, with a corner chamfer, say a 4mm endmill with a 0,2mm Chamfer, and then run it like a highfeed endmill, just with a bit more reasonable feeds ;)
With that tool/strategy combination i got hours of effective cutting time out of a 12eur endmill in 1.4305 (304) stainless.
By the way :) don't let you end mill hang out for nothing. Pull it back in to gain some rigidity, it will help to take out the vibrations a little bit. ✌️ I really enjoy seeing your development, nice vids
Great videos and love the metric specs, very beneficial! Keep on stepping.
Just a really enjoyable interesting video to watch! Very well done!
Can you please do a video on TAIG vs AVID vs Tormach? Pricing, performance, etc... why you chose what you did.
Thanks for posting this video and publishing the feeds and speeds. Was super useful on my CNC setup, I am certainly doing things now that I didn't know was possible with my 2.2kw high speed spindle. Look forward to more videos!
@@LegendLength yeah i managed to hold 50 micron tolerances. Check out some of my videos.
Use the smallest cutter you can and use adaptive tool paths. You might not have a stiff machine but it may be possible with deep depth of cuts and adaptive toolpaths
Great video, I'm enjoying the exploration with this machine. One important consideration with climb vs. conventional milling is the cutting force and subsequent bit/machine deflection. When addressing chatter/cutting issues, most people recommend conventional over climb because of backlash, something stemming from historically manual machining. But obviously most modern CNC machines have minimal or zero backlash, so the next consideration is how the chip is formed and the resulting forces. With climb cutting the bit (and machine) is deflecting away from the stock, whereas with conventional the bit (and machine) is deflecting into the stock. This is especially important with a light duty machine and long thin cutters (and especially with high axial engagement). Something else to think about with your machining strategies and what your seeing in the cut. Keep it up! Thanks for the videos.
EDIT: Just realized you addressed this a bit. Commenting before watching the whole thing: classic.
Good information nonetheless! :) I hadn't considered the direction of the forces, that's good to keep in mind, both from a deflection standpoint and probably from work holding too. Cheers!
Also with conventional the chip starts with "zero" width, which means there will always be a bit of rubbing which is bad for tool life and can lead to chip welding in aluminium.
I am impressed how well it cuts. Nice video.
I'm in the process of building my own machine and the information you are providing is worth its weight in gold.
the moment metric numbers popped up, i hit the sub button and liked the vid.. i was watching the previous video on this, and a cloud of storm and thunder builds on me when i saw everything on inches.. hahahahah! thank you for the priceless contents.. you never bore me.. keep it up!!
Great video. Keep up the good work.
This is great content, i usually use the yg1 5070 high feeds. I have really good success with ramping on these, we cut alot of slots and spiral water channels in hardened material, and those have become our go to.
Oh nice, thanks for the tip! I've been trying to find other solid carbide high feed mills (it seems most high feed are insert-based? And usually too large for me to use), will check these out. I still really like the idea of high feed mills and want to play around more. Larger/longer parts seem to make more sense, to give it time to hit the commanded feedrate. Also contemplating some machine upgrades to deal with the accelerations required.
I have fitted a 3.5KW 18000 rpm spindle to my Syil X4. I use the carbide cutters from China and having pretty good success. I have up graded my steppers to closed loop and I would high recommend that. Reasonably cheap to do and they are bloody good! My machine is more ridged I guess but I'm finding I have plenty of torque around 6-8000rpm to cut steel. Good video and possibly the most relevant to my machine. I would never go back to to ordinal spindle for what I do this is awesome!
Not sure if you've updated it since, but when helical ramping I'd highly suggest setting ramping diameter to ~0.95*tool_diameter. That way you're not doing a full-slot ramp, and instead allowing the cutter to make its initial cut contact into the vertical surface from the previous helical pass.
the metric conversion have many faults, also MRR is a volume unit not area
nice machine though
Dude these videos are awesome, finally some good content for the AVID. If you can do more aluminum that would be awesome! I am looking to get one of these and do some aluminum milling!
Thanks, will do! Things got a little crazy around here lately, but I should have some more aluminum stuff in the near future (the main reason I got the machine was actually for aluminum, steel was just for fun :) )
@@BreakingTaps Looking forward to it, so pumped to finally see a quality video on this thing. I've got one ordered, coming soon!
When running step calibration , always remember to repeat the calibration over different distances several times. I usually set up a dial indicator and try it at .75in, then use mics. To set it over 4~6". Then usually try it with arbitrary numbers in between to make sure it's dead on in + and -. I've screwed up my screwmapping before too ;)
Ah yeah, that's almost certainly what I did wrong then :) I did repeat calibration several times, but only at one distances (0.5" iirc) and only in one location. How do you accurately measure over long distances with mics? Clamp in a vise and calibrate "inside" the mic jaws?
@@BreakingTaps I clamp a parallel to the table, tram it so its square with the world, touch the probe to the parallel, run calibration over whatever distance I'm wanting, and stack guage blocks from the parallel to the back of my probe . I've also used snap indicators(I think that's the correct name, the ones used to measure inside diameters). Also used a second parallel with a micrometer (kind of a pita) I'm sure there are better ways but that's what worked for me and the limited tools I have at the moment :)
And you got it with the mics. Clamp it perfectly straight in a vise and open the mic jaws wider than your moving. Then measure to your probe and subtract probe dia.
Awesome, thanks for the tips! I have enough of the same equipment (or similar) to give this a shot...will try this out soon!
Nice job! I was going to dry cutting some steel and this helps quite a bit.
Thanks! Looking forward to seeing your experience with it, and how it compares to the Tormach. Hard for me to know what's "normal" or good since this is my only machine, and not really designed for metal either :) You have the 12k spindle from CNCDepot, right?
@@BreakingTaps I have the 24K spindle from Avid.
Thanks for doing these tests. I'm seriously thinking about this same router with the 12,000 RPM CNC Depot spindle. I plan to do mostly aluminum, but it looks like steel is at least possible with this combo.
Nice! Yeah the 12k spindle wasn't available when I purchased mine... if I were to do it again I'd be quite tempted to get that instead of the 24k. The high speed is really nice for small tools in aluminum, but the 12k might end up being more flexible since it'd tackle steel better. My only big complaint are the steppers, I opted for the NEMA 23 and they just don't have the oomph to move quickly enough to take advantage of the spindle. Should have gotten the 34s, or just jumped straight to Clearpaths.
That, and the machine can really start to get thrown around when moving at high feeds! Next project is beefing up the table and bolting it down :) Goodluck!
@@BreakingTaps Yeah, Clearpath is on my wish list as well. I emailed AvidCNC about it to see what they can offer, or if I'm going to need to build out the electronics from scratch. The Clearpath motors need different cabling and power supplies, and I've already got the spindle and Hitachi SLV VFD, so I suspect I'll be on my own, but I'd really rather work from a configuration they've tested and can help support--especially when it comes time to start messing around with probing and toolchangers.
Awesome videos! Your best bet is a spray of light oil if you're not prepared for a flood. For lighter metals or softer metals, WD-40 is the way to go. Also it's better than nothing for steel. The key is to not cause any thermal shock to the tool. You get micro fractures from the AlTiN and tungsten carbide expanding and contracting at different rates. So if you had cold water an soluble oil, you better be cooling it all the way or you'll get a hot tool with cold coolant, then crack-boom! Steel might be better dry with an air blast, but when you work with mushy stuff like aluminum you absolutely need a light oil to keep it all from sticking to everything like hot laffy taffy. Niagara makes some amazing cobalt HSS mills that don't last as long as AlTiN but they don't mind deflection or chattering. Plus the flat ground roughing endmills leave a mirror finish on surfaces. So that's a plus. If you want to reduce harmonics and also improve the life of coated cutters, go with odd numbered flutes. The best ones in my opinion for rigidity and high speed 2D profiling are 3 flute 5/16." They got enough meat to take a beating, great for high rpms, and one less flute gives you all sorts of clearance for chip evacuation. Also try a Ranque-Hilsch vortex tube for localized cooling. Look them up. Compressed are refrigeration for machining. FYI I taught CNC and manual machining at a community college, so I picked up a lot of tricks. Feel free to ask me questions. Addendum, I looked at some other videos and saw you're already using 3 flute mills. Very good!
I know this video was posted years ago but it was very enlightening for these benchtop pro machines.
My observation: by using steppers rather than servos you have somewhat competing interests between the motors and your high feed spindle / endmill. Steppers lose power on their torque curve the faster you run them. So they become increasingly likely to skip steps at higher feedrates. So both your frame and motors are working against you.
Also, those chips aren't turning gold or blue which means they aren't getting too hot and you aren't pushing anything too hard. A generic rule of thumb is that once the chips are a straw gold color that is where you want to be and if they are turning blue you are putting too much heat into the material/cutter.
Really interesting.
I have the same machine on the way but I decided to go with a 12,000 rpm spindle. Also I went with clearpaths for all axis. I plan to bolt the machine solidly to a metal frame base bolted to the ground. I want to cut mostly aluminium but would like to cut 4140 ocasionally. Hopefully the lower rpm spindle speed and the added rigidity will allow me to cut pretty much anything. Will let you know when I have everything assembled and running.
Awesome, goodluck! I think I might have gone with the 12k if it was available at the time. ++ to clearpaths, I recently acquired some servos and plan to swap them in the future as well.
I used to routinely cut mild steels at 1000SFM. AlTiN/TiAlN is perfectly happy in an HSM toolpath around there dry, and frankly should only be dry starting at 600SFM.
I think conventional would be beneficial for finishing passes, or chamfering, but it isn't my favorite machining style for CNC. I sometimes will use a table router to machine aluminum plates by hand, and whenever I tried conventional, the stock would want to roll along the endmill/bit and fly out of my hands. Terrifying. But I found that doing light conventional passes at the very end would always leave a mirror like finish. So I started applying this same mindset to CNC as well. Climb 99% of the time, and then conventional for small WOC finishing passes or chamfering.
Summary: I hate conventional.
Ah interesting, I hadn't thought about conventional for finish (or chamfer)... will give that a shot! I've really been struggling with finish passes. On several of the test pieces, the surface from roughing was pretty decent (not great, but not terrible either). But the slower finish pass started chattering really badly and ruined it. I guess the small amount of leftover stock isn't enough for climb to "bite" into and bounces instead? Not sure, but trying conventional there makes a lot of sense to me. Thanks!
You should try 304 SS. It’d be cool to see if this machine is capable of machining something as mean as that stuff.
Impressed how well it cuts and the very high speed... i wonder how many hours of machining the endmill last before wearing out... on my desktop cnc machine the last one lasted 45 minutes cutting steel
Keep up the good work, couple of things:
As far as steppers go, the problem with them is that their torque falls of a cliff the faster you run them. Very high holding torque, but as your RPMs increase the torque decreases, has to do with their inductance.
2nd, the NES series VFD that comes with that spindle kit is good but there is better. Look into the WJ-200 also by Hitachi. You can over drive the torque at lower RPMs to get more grunt down low, but be mindful of the spindle temps as you are pushing it.
Makes sense re: steppers. The Avid folks recommended NEMA23 since they said I wouldn't need the higher torque offered by NEMA34 at high speeds... but I guess they weren't thinking about HSM and really pushing the machine. My fault for not researching enough! I suspect I'll move to servos sooner than later though, so I'll just live with it for now :)
Interesting, what's better about the WJ-200? I admit, I don't know much about VFDs :) Is it one of the sensorless vector drive types? I did see the NES has a "torque boost" mode for lower speed, I guess it just increases voltage? Will have to play around with it. The S30C does have a temp cutoff probe inside the spindle so at least theoretically it shouldn't go into full melt down
@@BreakingTaps Actually Nema 34 aren't really much better. If you look at the torque curves they have higher holding torque but they too fall off a cliff as RPMs climb, in some cases they are worse. Avid has picked a good blend of torque and speed for their Nema 23 motors, but when it comes down to HSM; servos are king.
Both VFD can do sensorless vector feedback, but the WJ200 is optimised for high torque applications.
By chance do you have an instagram account?
Interesting, will do some more reading on VFDs (and re-reading my NES manual)! Might have to add the WJ200 to the upgrade list in the future. Related to low-end torque, CNCDepot recently came out with their 12k model. Makes me wonder if I would have chosen the lower speed version if I were to do it again. Would definitely make working with steel easier, but otoh limits smaller end mills in aluminum. Always a trade off i guess :)
I may have secured a set of servos for a very reasonable price, albeit with a slightly unorthodox control method. More to come in the future as I get them integrated :)
My instagram is @polyfractal. Mostly a hodge-podge of machining, astrophotography, dogs and baking haha :)
Great video, just set up a BTPro 2x2, i am not planning on cutting steel however. only complaint, is your last few metric conversions, are completely off
Oh, whoops! Sorry, must have been a copy/pasta mistake... or just totally messed up when punching in the numbers. Do you remember which sets are wrong, so I can add a note to the description?
high feed tools's feed are related to their low lead angles, i wonder if having a higher lead angles would just be better for your router
i think incrasing your lead angle would half your feedrate while allowing an higher dept of cut, while still keeping part of the benefit of high feed rate
and yes i know its an old video
Some metals self harden as they change temp. It's one of the reasons why steel is cut at low RPM. It's also why coolant isn't always used. Heating and cooling is how swords and knife edges are hardened...
Do you use Mach3? Step calibration is easy to set, use an indicator and a know sized block like a 123 block. In settings you can set MDI to go 1" and you set the actual distance travel from your indicator and insets steps per.
I do! So this was after step calibration as it turns out. I suspect I either did it incorrectly, or need to repeat calibration at multiple locations around the machine to average out any non-linearities. There are also two Y motors which I just blindly calibrated as the same, which I think is technically incorrect...but couldn't think of a better way to do it.
At the end there, your metric DOC and WOC numbers look swapped over to me, FWIW. I thought the 10% WOC sounded fine and I'd have been tempted to go for 15-20% next. The spindle speed will reduce under load but that's normal. No point having a decent spindle motor if you never push it.
Conventional causes the tool to rub at the start of the cut and may actually increase the cutting forces and spindle power. It's only necessary if you have a problem with backlash, which your machine clearly doesn't.
The only reason I've broken tools in the last 18 months or so is due to chip recutting, so I sympathise with your nervousness when chips don't clear! Those silly fog lube things look about as ineffectual as brushing oil on the stock before you start machining. To me it's either full flooding or air blast if you plan to use your machine to its full potential.
Whoops, swapped indeed! Thanks for the opinion on 10% WOC! Still training my ear for what's "good" and "bad" :) Interesting re: conventional, I guess it makes sense that it'd increase cutting force at the start since it doesn't have a chance to really take a bite.
And yeah, I'm really unimpressed with the fogbuster, almost moreso on aluminum since you _can't_ run dry. Who knows, maybe I'll waterproof the enclosure and just switch to flood some day :)
going to watch this also to see if any of my question gets answered
aghh one question i have about the rigidity of the frame of the machine. I have access to fabricate custom metal tables is there room on the frame that I could fabricate pieces to kinda give it a more ridgidity if I clamp or bolt it to for example a heavy steel table?
Yeah, I think there are a few locations that could benefit from additional reinforcement. The gantry "arms" are big chunks of aluminum, but could easily be reinforced (or replaced) with steel. You might lose some speed/dynamic response since they are on the moving section, but it would also stiffen up the gantry a bit.
Other easy fixes could be adding a steel fixture plate to the table, or replacing the aluminum table with steel completely. Filling some of the base extrusions with sand/lead/epoxy/etc. They are all large hollow extrusions and it'd be trivial to add another hundred pounds just with sand. Table has rubber feet, but could also bolt it directly to a table for extra rigidity.
I should have splashed out for bigger steppers, or just servos. The steppers I have at the moment are definitely underpowered imo.
The place that needs it the most, but would be hard, is the Z-axis. The spindle acts as a long lever which can torque around the head and gantry, which I'm not sure is fixable without replacing the whole gantry.
Here's a sorta-3D view of the router I made a while back, if it helps: czcams.com/users/postUgzwFk9u-RWRTuii1jR4AaABCQ, and an image from the manufacturer: www.avidcnc.com/images/BTPRO2436-Base-16.1_800.jpg
I think the only time when the majority of the force is up and down in a high feed endmill is when you are plunging. Think about it, where would vertical force be coming from in a cut like you were doing
I highly appreciate showing metric values (so I don't need a calculator😉) But @9:34 12.7mm as 10% WOC would translate to a 12.7 cm end mill, that's 5 inches 😆.. 0.025 inch = 0.635 mm 👍
Great series!
1) Your saying it comes out 0.016" too large consistently. I notice Fusion360 adds a 0.5mm "Stock to leave" on it's adaptive and pocket jobs by default. Is it possible that that is where you are gaining what would be from that?
2) Regarding lost steps: Do you feel the belts are skipping on the reduction drive, or the motors are losing a step?, just curious
3) In 9:58 you speak of it shrieking a bit. Your concusions are fair on that one, as a tangent, would it help cancel harmonics to fill the upper lateral rail's hollow area with rubber pipe insulation, packing it tight? This would weigh a couple ounces, and the damping coefficient should cancel some of the amplification of resonance.
Thanks!
1) theoretically shouldn't be the issue, since I ran 2D contour and horizontal finishing passes after the adaptives (I just didn't show it on camera much since they were boring). Which is too bad, since that would have been an easy fix! :)
2) The BenchtopPro has ballscrews, and the steppers are direct-drive on the ballscrews. So I think it's the motors themselves losing steps :(
3) I think that would work yeah! pretty much anything in there would help absorb some energy and reduce resonances. I've considered doing the same to the lower rails too, but with something heavier like sand or lead shot. It's on the summer todo list :)
Thanks for watching and commenting!
Calculate step per revolution and ballscrew pitch. Plug into software. Done.
Anything else you see is a mistake in your calculations or backlash. Use backlash compensation in software and make sure everything is tight.
Thanks for the video. I own the same machine but with the Avid spindle kit. I'm not sure I'm ready to feed it steel.
Good luck if you do! Just start slow. I think the Avid spindle is roughly comparable to the S30C so it should be relatively similar experience. I think. :)
@@BreakingTaps How do you think the Benchtop PRO compares to the regular Avid PRO (eg, PRO4896) in terms of rigidity? The frame of the Benchtop PRO uses several 8080 extrusions for its base cross-braces whereas the regular PRO uses fewer and smaller 4080 (the PRO4824 only has a single 4080 cross-brace). I can't tell which gantry is more rigid - the regular PRO uses bit more parts but I think they both use an 8016 (eg, 80 x 160mm). The Benchtop PRO also comes standard with the aluminum table, which you could certainly add to a regular PRO.
I've started receiving the parts for my PRO4824 and definitely plan on adding an aluminum table similar to what the Benchtop PRO has and also wondering if it might benefit from additional cross-braces. I was initially going to get the Benchtop PRO but experience with a similar-sized CNC in the past had me looking for a slightly larger footprint, something where I could keep a vise permanently mounted and still remain a decent working area for small sheet.
Either way, I think it's pretty impressive what's shown here.
GordonGEICO : I haven't seen the PRO4896 personally, so hard for me to give much of an opinion. But I asked the Avid folks exactly that before I bought, and they recommended the Benchtop for metal cutting. Here's what they said:
>>>>> Start email
With milling aluminum being your primary use, I would recommend the Benchtop PRO over the larger PRO platforms. There are a few key areas where stiffness is significantly improved:
- Gantry: The shorter gantry travel is obviously stiffer, but beyond that there is simply much more material on the BT PRO gantry. It uses the same 80x160mm extrusion as the larger machines but then has a ballscrew actuator bolted on the front which boosts the stiffness further.
- Y (table) axis: the BT PRO has two linear rails supporting each side, vs one on the larger machines
- Ballscrews: While these don't affect the stiffness they do provide smoother, quieter, and more maintenance free motion than the rack and pinions.
- Table: Under the extruded T-slot table shown on the website there are three stout 80x80mm extrusions connecting the left and right Y axes. This is a much stiffer standalone structure than the larger machines.
- Depending on the shape of your parts you may want to attach a vise to the substructure, or create your own fixture plate.
All that said, I know other folks (youtuber Robert Cowan comes to mind) who have successfully cut aluminum on their fullsized Avid machine
@@BreakingTaps Thanks for the info. It's pretty much what I expected. The Benchtop PRO looks like a real good machine.
I have to ask. This is all done on the Avid Bench top Pro series? I just came across this video as I am trying to figure out if I should just use their electronics package or the Benchtop Pro itself.
Hi freind..thank you for vidio..can you give us some information about power of spindle and what kind of motor you use for axises in machine??
Spindle is a 2.2kW, 24000 RPM from CNCDepot. Same power as the one that Avid sells, but I wanted ATC on mine. Stepper motors are NEMA 23 420 oz-in, although in retrospect I would have opted to get the NEMA 34 960 oz-in (or servos like Clearpath)
Have you experimented with tool-stickout? Maybe a tip for next video. With the high feed endmill you used, I noticed you had the tool very far out of the holder, and that is not something you want ever, no matter how rigid machine you got.
Yeah that's a good point, not quite a fair comparison. I generally try to keep stick out to a minimum... not sure why I had it so far out for the high feed. Having a long stick out has caused me grief several times so it's something I've learned to be wary of since then :)
Climb milling...because who doesn’t love seeing chips fly?!
Haha yeah, I mean let's be honest, that's the only reason any of us do this anyway! Gotta see those chips flying!
@@BreakingTaps Climb milling will eject the chips with more authority. But, if the machine isn't rigid enough, it will tend to snag the work piece a bit. "A bit" might mean reduced tool life and inconsistent finish, or it might mean breaking tools and scrapping parts.
Conventional milling isn't as awesome at throwing the chips out of the way, but the load on the cutter is more consistent. How about more air to clear chips out? Two or three outlets rather than one.
Hi,
Legitimate note about HSMAdvisor in your video: This happens because at some point the default depth of cut becomes too large for the tiny 0.24" end mill.
Here is the full write-up and a screenshot with explanations: zero-divide.net/?&article_id=5266_avid-cnc-benchtop-pro-hsm-and-high-feed-milling
This issue will be fixed in the next update.
Great video as always!
Awesome, thanks @HSMAdvisor! On that note, is there a bugtracker/github/jira/etc somewhere to file bug reports? Happy to pass them along if I run into them :)
There is never an "always" in machining. Most of the time, coolant is beneficial. Some of the time it really doesn't make much difference, and the remainder of the time it is detrimental.
I don't know anything about your machine, but if you are going to adopt HSM practices, you need to calculate feed rates accordingly. If you run a cutter at a given rpm, it needs to be cutting material at the appropriate IPR value for that rpm as well. Doing otherwise reduces tool life.
Yep, the struggle is real :) The poor power at low RPM makes hitting lower SFM targets difficult, and the (currently)-limited top end feedrate makes hitting IPT at higher RPM difficult. Can't easily fix the RPM issue, but I'm working on some modifications to enable higher feeds and acceleration without missing steps, or shaking the machine to pieces.
I'd love to know the noise level of the machine while cutting. Have you measured those? Mine gets up to 130dB which is crazy loud.
I haven't measured, but it is very loud! When the spindle is at max 24k RPM you basically have to shout to be heard, and I wear hearing protection when working around it.
Do you have a video where you talk about your spindle? Was thinking about the same s30 you have, any information would be great. Would this be the one you go with again?
Afraid not, never got around to doing one on just the spindle / spindle setup. I'm pretty happy with the S30C though! CNCDepot has a lower RPM model now that might tempt me (12k instead of 24k, would make steel work easier)... but I'd probably go for the higher speed again because most of my work is in aluminum and that suits a higher speed. The toolchanging aspect has been flawless, no complaints there. Only recent irritation was from Fusion 360, which has disallowed tool changes in the free version. If there was anything I'd change, I'd probably get a better VFD for the spindle. I went with a Hitatchi NES-1 which doesn't have vector control, and I've noticed it lose steam on lower speeds faster than it probably should. A vector VFD would probably perform better at lower speeds, from what I've read.
Thanks for your videos and insight.
You think using avids larger nema 34 steppers could help prevent he machine from losing steps? Maybe help it do better running at high feeds?
Yeah, I think so. If I were to do it again I would have bought the NEMA 34s, or just grabbed some Clearpath servos. Upgrading to servo is on my "someday" todo list. I like to run it high feed and low WOC, and these smaller steppers just don't seem quite up to the task.
@@BreakingTaps yea, servos sound pretty nice, but I feel a bit intimidated by all the wiring and servo tuning I’d have to do.
How do you like that shars vice? do you find it accurate enough for the machine?
It's acceptable, for the kinds of non-precision work that I mostly do :) I haven't checked for parallelism and such but it gets the job done. When I need a really tight tolerance on something, I tend to leave the part slightly oversized and finish it off the critical dimensions on my manual mill since it's easier to sneak up on features that way. This Old Tony somewhat recently did a video tearing down an import vise (czcams.com/video/Zl6wpdtBZhk/video.html) and the results were... not great :) I suspect my Shars vise came from the same factory as that one, looks basically identical, so his results probably apply to my vise.
OMG! I wat the same machine. Does you recommend it to me?
I've been pretty happy with it so far. :) A few small issues but nothing major, and it's put up with plenty of abuse that I've thrown at it :)
You didn’t talk about the helical speed and step down
Any ideas for making small holes like 2mm in diameter in steel on your machine?
At a depth of 10 mm?
Hmm, not sure to be honest. If you went with a carbide drill, you'd max out the RPM at 24k so that's ok... but I'd be worried about such a small piece of carbide (really needs good rigidity which the machine might not provide). For a HSS drill, you're around 8000 RPM which is on the lower end of usable torque. But OTOH, it's such a small drill it's not removing a ton of material. It'd probably be fine as long as you were pretty conservative.
That's in A36 though, not sure it'd do well in something evil like stainless :)
@@BreakingTaps 4140? maybe
for making only a few parts you know the ipm can be very small
What CAM system are you using?
Fusion360 for CAD and toolpath generation, Mach4 for motion control
You might find this video that discusses the pros and cons on both climb and conventional milling useful. czcams.com/video/bq83ZLIZmaA/video.html
I'm realy want to buy a cnc exactly like that one.. can some one help me ?
It's an Avid CNC Benchtop Pro 2x3 (www.cncrouterparts.com/benchtop-cnc-machine-kits-c-59_60.html) with a CNCDepot S30C spindle (www.cncdepot.net/) :)
what is an honest cost for a running machine? it looks like around $5g for the machine and you end up around $10k to have it actually able to cut anything. am I accurate or no where near?
Yeah that's probably fair. I think I ended around 7-8k plus some for tooling (tool holders, endmills, vises, etc). If you went with a non-ATC spindle it'd be a bit cheaper.
What machine is this?
Its funny how it actually hurts when I see the cutter break at 4:45.
Poor little guy didn't stand a chance :(
Good Job. Your need ours tools.
Look the web store.
first
@muslim.exe