Yes. But it’s so difficult that if I’m right it has only been recorded once (it’s in the Warner/Teldec box along with a lot of things that aren’t in the DG set). Dave is absolutely right, this music is exceptionally difficult to play, especially where there are larger forces, so it’s unlikely we’ll get a proliferation of the non concertante orchestral works on disc anytime soon.
OMG I’m so impressed you did this. It’s a really excellent set. The comparison with Schoenberg might be a little “off” as I think Ligeti shows you what you can do if you do avant garde music that doesn’t start with the second Viennese school. It’s what you can do with extended Bartok, including the micro polyphony things. Clear or cloudy? Well he wrote cloudy music that has caught on with so many young people but also very clear things earlier and later. Just listen to the Violin concerto, the solo viola sonata (not in this set admittedly) or the piano concerto with the African things and the Steve Reich things going on. Goodness me. Do you like the ocarinas? I certainly do and nobody else has done quite such a daring yet simple sound, the deliberate highlighting of differential tunings etc. He makes me laugh too so it’s in that long line of humour since Haydn.
one would never know it from the text of the Oxford history but apparently Ligeti was the late Richard Taruskin's favorite recent composer. He definitely is one of a handful of composers that people from far outside of the world of classical music really connect with (my heavy metal bandmember/noise artist friends love his work). Can I put in a strong recommendation here for his piece "Clocks and Clouds" which shimmers like a Klimt painting and is hardly ever performed because of its weird orchestration. It's on the Warners box (with Apparitions someone mentions below) in an utterly perfect performance. Also the biography of his life is fascinating and once you realise what he went through as a youngster his music makes new sense.
I've bought numerous Ligeti sets and this one you're talking of today is truly one of the best. And you touched on the thing that turned me on to Ligeti (2001: A Space Odyssey) and all the reasons that led to me continuing to investigate his oeuvre. Thank you, Dave, as always.
I think Kubrick also uses Ligeti pieces in at least two other films, The Shining and Eyes Wide shut. The story of how Ligeti sued Kubrick over 2001 is a fun one, but they obviously made up.
I absolutely love Ligeti’s last work for large orchestra “San Francisco Polyphony” where the micropolyphony of the earlier works becomes swirling and activated to a point of fabulous hyper-excitement. Curiously this score has still not been published; Schott has listed it as “in preparation” for more than ten years.
As I recall there was no overlap between the Sony and Teldec boxes. The project was dropped by the former and picked up by the latter (or vice versa). The DG is more of a greatest hits collection, and the recordings are reference recordings.
Chris. That is correct. Sony is called the ligeti edition. And teldec continued the project and their portion is called the ligeti project. Sony also has an 8CD masterworks box which is still available on Amazon as a cd set and also a digital download for 10 bucks! I have the Sony stuff. The music is tough listening at times. Certainly not everyday stuff. Dave. The Etudes are in the masterworks box.
@@alanmcginn4796 I collected all of these as they came out, as I am a Ligeti fan of long standing. (My personal favorite is a very early work, the Concert romanesc, which was in the Teldec sequence.). I had simply forgotten which label had started the project (though dropping it is something typical of Sony, as I am sure Michael Haas would attest). My one disappointment is that Le grand macabre is done in English, even though that was the language of the Salzburg Festival premiere. I prefer the German-language premiere recording on Wergo, because Herbert Prikopa's very Viennese First Minister is hilarious (he was Balloon in the ORF's old serialization of Schweik and a long-time comic children's television host). In most cases, though, I do prefer the recordings on DG, and am glad to see them collected in this small, inexpensive box, even though they have been widely available in other formats.
Thanks, Dave! What a joy! I've been waiting for this for quite some time. BTW: The "clear and cloudy" might refer to Ligeti's opus "Clocks and Clouds" which alludes to a treatise by philosopher Karl Popper of the same title. NB: I once asked Ligeti about his "ramifications" pronouncing it English, and he immediately corrected me: Ramifications is meant to be a French word.
@@DavesClassicalGuide I didn't. I knew Ligeti considered himself an "elitist" composer (quote: "I will always prefer a natural violin to any electronic sound simply for its noblesse") - so French was to him much less vulgar than plain English (just read the titles of his Etudes!) - Well, I loved him for that.
@@ippolit23 he stated that often he chose french titles because they "sound good". No joke :D I think it's written in "Träumen sie in Farbe" ("do you dream in colours? [or in b/w]), an interview with a german music critc. He probably got upset by your question also because he considered Ramifications his worst piece ever.
Ligeti-split! I've known the pieces on the 2001 soundtrack since I was 5 and loved them forevah (relatively). also I know excerpts from Le Grande Macabre (also delightful). so now I'm looking for a fuller overview of his works. sounds like the set Dave reviews here is that . . . any other recommendations for a solid intro to G L?
This is the only Ligeti I own, and some of the larger works make me think they were influenced by Language's 'Music of the Spheres'. IMHO, his violin concerto is one of the best post-war concertos.
"Ligeti lives in a box now" is only a half-correct statement.
It’s a shame they don’t have “Apparitions” for Large Orchestra on there. That is my favorite piece by Ligeti and it’s also his scariest
Yes. But it’s so difficult that if I’m right it has only been recorded once (it’s in the Warner/Teldec box along with a lot of things that aren’t in the DG set). Dave is absolutely right, this music is exceptionally difficult to play, especially where there are larger forces, so it’s unlikely we’ll get a proliferation of the non concertante orchestral works on disc anytime soon.
OMG I’m so impressed you did this. It’s a really excellent set. The comparison with Schoenberg might be a little “off” as I think Ligeti shows you what you can do if you do avant garde music that doesn’t start with the second Viennese school. It’s what you can do with extended Bartok, including the micro polyphony things. Clear or cloudy? Well he wrote cloudy music that has caught on with so many young people but also very clear things earlier and later. Just listen to the Violin concerto, the solo viola sonata (not in this set admittedly) or the piano concerto with the African things and the Steve Reich things going on. Goodness me. Do you like the ocarinas? I certainly do and nobody else has done quite such a daring yet simple sound, the deliberate highlighting of differential tunings etc. He makes me laugh too so it’s in that long line of humour since Haydn.
one would never know it from the text of the Oxford history but apparently Ligeti was the late Richard Taruskin's favorite recent composer. He definitely is one of a handful of composers that people from far outside of the world of classical music really connect with (my heavy metal bandmember/noise artist friends love his work). Can I put in a strong recommendation here for his piece "Clocks and Clouds" which shimmers like a Klimt painting and is hardly ever performed because of its weird orchestration. It's on the Warners box (with Apparitions someone mentions below) in an utterly perfect performance. Also the biography of his life is fascinating and once you realise what he went through as a youngster his music makes new sense.
I've bought numerous Ligeti sets and this one you're talking of today is truly one of the best. And you touched on the thing that turned me on to Ligeti (2001: A Space Odyssey) and all the reasons that led to me continuing to investigate his oeuvre. Thank you, Dave, as always.
I think Kubrick also uses Ligeti pieces in at least two other films, The Shining and Eyes Wide shut. The story of how Ligeti sued Kubrick over 2001 is a fun one, but they obviously made up.
I absolutely love Ligeti’s last work for large orchestra “San Francisco Polyphony” where the micropolyphony of the earlier works becomes swirling and activated to a point of fabulous hyper-excitement.
Curiously this score has still not been published; Schott has listed it as “in preparation” for more than ten years.
I believe I have a recording of Bernard Haitink (!) doing this, so have to assume there are the parts travelling around….
As I recall there was no overlap between the Sony and Teldec boxes. The project was dropped by the former and picked up by the latter (or vice versa). The DG is more of a greatest hits collection, and the recordings are reference recordings.
Chris. That is correct. Sony is called the ligeti edition. And teldec continued the project and their portion is called the ligeti project. Sony also has an 8CD masterworks box which is still available on Amazon as a cd set and also a digital download for 10 bucks! I have the Sony stuff. The music is tough listening at times. Certainly not everyday stuff. Dave. The Etudes are in the masterworks box.
@@alanmcginn4796 I collected all of these as they came out, as I am a Ligeti fan of long standing. (My personal favorite is a very early work, the Concert romanesc, which was in the Teldec sequence.). I had simply forgotten which label had started the project (though dropping it is something typical of Sony, as I am sure Michael Haas would attest). My one disappointment is that Le grand macabre is done in English, even though that was the language of the Salzburg Festival premiere. I prefer the German-language premiere recording on Wergo, because Herbert Prikopa's very Viennese First Minister is hilarious (he was Balloon in the ORF's old serialization of Schweik and a long-time comic children's television host). In most cases, though, I do prefer the recordings on DG, and am glad to see them collected in this small, inexpensive box, even though they have been widely available in other formats.
Thanks, Dave! What a joy! I've been waiting for this for quite some time. BTW: The "clear and cloudy" might refer to Ligeti's opus "Clocks and Clouds" which alludes to a treatise by philosopher Karl Popper of the same title. NB: I once asked Ligeti about his "ramifications" pronouncing it English, and he immediately corrected me: Ramifications is meant to be a French word.
I hope you said to him, "Who cares?"
I hoped Ligeti wasn't a pseudy tosspot but that story could be substituted with any composition PhD and I'd believe it
@@DavesClassicalGuide I didn't. I knew Ligeti considered himself an "elitist" composer (quote: "I will always prefer a natural violin to any electronic sound simply for its noblesse") - so French was to him much less vulgar than plain English (just read the titles of his Etudes!) - Well, I loved him for that.
@@ippolit23 he stated that often he chose french titles because they "sound good". No joke :D I think it's written in "Träumen sie in Farbe" ("do you dream in colours? [or in b/w]), an interview with a german music critc. He probably got upset by your question also because he considered Ramifications his worst piece ever.
@@FCarraro1 I believe you. I even heard him say something like that myself.
He was surprisingly easy to listen to.
Ligeti-split! I've known the pieces on the 2001 soundtrack since I was 5 and loved them forevah (relatively). also I know excerpts from Le Grande Macabre (also delightful). so now I'm looking for a fuller overview of his works. sounds like the set Dave reviews here is that . . . any other recommendations for a solid intro to G L?
If the music is divided into several CDs, does that mean it is Ligeti-split?
Oy!
just saw this, after posting my comment. what's the statute of limitations for calling "jinx!" ?
This is the only Ligeti I own, and some of the larger works make me think they were influenced by Language's 'Music of the Spheres'. IMHO, his violin concerto is one of the best post-war concertos.
Who?
@@DavesClassicalGuide I think he is referring to Rued Langgaard's Music of the spheres. PS: Also love the Ligeti violin concerto, one of my favourite