Why You Shouldn't Buy the Lionel Legacy SD45
Vložit
- čas přidán 4. 12. 2022
- Telling people not to buy a train!? What!? I wanted to make a video that covered the bad aspects of these particular locomotives as I think they're quite compelling. I really encourage you to watch the entire video so you can hear the reasoning for my criticisms of these engines and why I personally recommend staying away from them. My hope is that you take my opinions from this video and compare them to others to determine for yourself if you should purchase some of the new SD45s. Thank you for watching!
My new Instagram account: / kiskidivisionrailroad
Good observations and no need to apologize. We spend good money on these units and when they get to us we shouldn't have to touch them unless we want to make upgrades. Having to make any kind of modification for operational purposes is unexceptable. I also agree that bringing up these concerns makes future products better, especially if enough consumers are complaining about the same things. With that being said, I have wanted these units since they came out and knowing the problems you pointed out, I will be prepared for modifications when I get them. If you want to sell yours...lol.
I agree especially when it's something beyond a simple bent handrail or loose screw or something like that. Sadly with these units it really does seem like a design flaw. I wish I was able to find a better solution to the problem. I may be selling these in the somewhat near future haha
@@KiskiDivisionRailroad keep me posted.
This isn't the first time I've heard problems with these couplers especially on grades. Hopefully Lionel is listening. Great vid.👍
I hope so, Bob. The grades really seem to be the killer for these. They are somewhat reliable on a flat surface but as soon as you throw a grade at them everything goes wrong. Thanks for watching!
This is probably the best review I’ve seen of these, showing the issue front and center with blunt yet respectful honesty. For the already borderline unreasonable price Lionel charges for these, you should not have to modify and fix them right out of the box just so they can make a lap or two without derailing or uncoupling. It’s a shame that this design has been flawed with no improvements from Lionel, as the semi-fixed pilot is truly a good idea, and the rest of the locomotive is very nice. I have to put my GP30 behind the SD40 so the GP30 can pull the train itself while the SD40’s pilots have no actual strain put on them.
Thank you so much for the kind words! I'm not one to mind having to make small adjustments out of the box or taking a shell off to reconnect wires, but I shouldn't have to get a Dremel out and grind down the faulty design to make it work. I only have one car in my collection I can run behind these that mostly prevents the derailing issue from happening. That's just ridiculous
Its almost not even borderline unreasonable anymore for a Lionel locomotive. New mainline road diesels in the latest catalog MSRP at $749.99, and I HATE when these big CZcams channels defend it. I like my Lionel products but dang its just getting outrageous. I feel like more people need to talk about this.
Thank you for your honesty in this. Not only have you probably saved someone a headache in dealing with these Locos but maybe the problem will be addressed at the source. I enjoy your vids, keep em coming. You and yours have a Merry Christmas. Brett, Clayton, NC.
Thank you very much Brett! Just wanted to put my experience out there in hopes it's useful for someone 👍
For the price of a Legacy locomotive one should not have to fix anything. Good video. Factual opinion you are entitled to. Well done.
Thank you!
You did a good job.
There are good and bad in any product.
You were disappointed and expressed it in a polite manner.
Thank you for your observations.
Thank you for the kind words, that is exactly what I was going for
Very informative, you did a great job explaining. Thanks.
Thank you for the kind words!
Great video. Your criticism was presented respectfully and very clearly.
We should not be (as some would have us) on a guilt trip for expecting quality from products that are highly priced.
Thanks again look forward to more videos.
Everyone and everything needs held accountable! Thanks for your honesty! Like you style
Thank you I couldn't agree more!
Be honest. For what they cost Lionel should modify them until they are as trouble free as they can be. There are enough cheerleaders on CZcams. Keep up the great work.
Thank you! If I get more disappointing engines in the future I'll definitely be making a similar video to this
Excellent honest review. Much appreciated Buddy
Thank you! Glad to put my opinion out there
Do not be sorry for expressing your opinion. toxic positivity sounds like a coined term of those who fear cancellation 😂, you certainly earned my respect for being open and honest. Cheers
Admittedly it's something I came up with on the fly and I've unintentionally caused a little drama with it 😂 oops
This Is not a negative video. This Is an honest one. Thanks for the warning.
I appreciate that, thank you for watching!
A very well thought out run down of your experience with this Legacy model, Nick. It's always a problem to have to make a new model you've just received work properly because of poor manufacturing or design flaws. Very frustrating. It's always a service to other perspective buyers to know what they might have to deal with once they receive a new model.
Thank you for the kind words!
You bring up some good points. I usually try to inform people of the negatives in my videos also. Usually the positives outweigh the negatives. But I can see why those pilots and couplers are a dealbreaker for you. Thanks.
Thanks for watching!
Please make video on how to take spring out
Thanks for your honest review!
Thanks for watching!
The biggest gripe with mine- the Buffalo & Pittsburgh model- is that the rear pilot sits extremely low to the rails to where it contacts the rails in some circumstances like going over switches and slight grades. There's also minor details that are not present or different on the real locomotive like the horn being in the middle of the long hood versus on the cab in real life, and an emergency gyralite on the short hood that shouldn't be there.
The sag really is something. I really hope they address this somehow in future because even if it doesn't cause an operational problem, it just looks really bad and almost broken
Someone finally addressed the Pilots. I’ve put together a 13 unit 21” car passenger set with 4 lead locomotives and even with 96” curves, you can’t “push” a train through as the couplers will force wildly outside the curve and cause derailments. I was very disappointed.
Yeah I feel ya there. I'm not a fan of the whole kinematic idea.
As much as i love my set of them , I unfortunately have to agree with you on the pilot issue 😕
Seeing the headline of the video I was honestly offended bc I hate seeing negative statements , but I watched it in full just to see what someone else's opinion was and yeah I have to agree . I regularly use these at our club and pull 50 to 70 car trains with ease but it does look goofy with the pilot not centering on its own when it gets to straight track . My only derailment caused by these is coming out of switches on the yard or a crossover , it puts enough strain for the lead car to jump bc the pilot didn't center .
Good assessment , Now I'm going to watch more of your videos and subscribe . Thanks for being fair
Reading this comment made my day. Thank you for being honest and deciding to watch the video anyway. Thank you for watching!
Sounds like an unbiased review. I agree with you on the pilots. I wonder if a little lithium grease in the groove would help the pilot find it's center.
Thank you I tried to keep it as fair as possible. Honestly that's a good idea. I'm gonna try greasing it up some and see how it does. Thanks for watching!
It could be the luck (or bad luck) of the draw. I have had similar issues with my GP30 Soo Line #703 from Lionel Legacy. Other purchasers have reviewed this also as a "great" engine. The soundboard went out after only 15 minutes of run time. They repaired it, but now my smoke unit has stopped working. Frustrating when you spend so much money and have such bad experiences with the products.
Very much so. I'm sorry to hear of your QC issues with the boards and smoke unit. From my experience that was something Lionel has been steadily improving on. But as you said it's basically luck of the draw. Thanks for watching!
Your videos are great first time subscriber
I agree about the slop in the coupler I seen it in several of my engines
Yeah I've had quite a few with this problem. It's very annoying
So far I have been pretty happy with my Bradys Trains Lionel Conrail SD45 locomotives. They have performed well. I try to bring any problems that I have on video. I have done this with Lionel products in the past, especially issues with their scale rolling stock. So far I don't have the pilot issues with this one. However in your defense I did have issues with a Lionel SD38 with the same type pilots and getting stuck as you mentioned. I have since fixed that issue. There's nothing wrong with pointing out issues or what you don't like about a train purchase you made.
I'm glad those are working well for you; I would see those units in their store all the time and they're sharp and have a great color. Thanks for watching and the kind words!
The Conrail ones are excellent and they’re the correct color for once.
Yep, I have a Legacy Black N&W high hood SD45 from a couple years ago..Right out of the box it had the Pilot issues, some loose screws and that drooping coupler was a pain till I tweaked it out…I don’t have the multi horn option and the equipped horn sounds really thin and weak..Runs great after correcting the few problems.
Glad you were able to get yours working well. Unfortunately I still am fighting with mine
Hey, great video and good to offer different opinions, even if those opinions are not in the positive!
I have both of the Santa Fe SD45s from the 2018v1 catalog (same tooling). I couldn’t agree more on the pilots. They almost totally ruin an otherwise very nice model. I also hate the buckling they do when double-heading them. The only fix I’ve found is to open up the track for the swinging pilot and lubricate with plenty of grease. Not perfect, but it helps.
As for colors/road-specific details, I can say the ATSF is a home run. Colors are spot-on and there are loads of ATSF details such as blanked-out rear number boards and rooftop AC and radio trim pieces as well as a lit simulated beacon light.
Note on the tooling, FWIW, it actually was all new tooling for 2016. That was the first time they offered the SD45. IMO, it’s not the most detailed, but it’s spot-on proportionally. The MTH is older tooling and while I think it’s a little more detailed, it looks a little “fat” in certain spots compared to the prototype. Again, to my eye.
One final criticism for the model, maybe this is just the 2018 run, but there’s a lot of side-to-side slop on the gears on the trucks.
Very nice to hear your experiences with the model. I'm definitely going to try greasing up the pilot groove and see if that helps at all. I'm going to be honest i'm shocked that this is a modern tooling; never would have guessed that. I'm surprised Lionel skimped on so many details for being so new, they're usually very good with detailing new tooling. I've really enjoyed reading everyone's comments on the loco and the general consensus seems to be that these are just perfectly average models - which is totally fine. Thank you for watching!
Thanks for your frank comments. You are hired and I look forward to watching more from you. Arlin
I appreciate your honest assessment on these engines. Much better information provided by you verses someone who constantly pushes fanboy reviews.
Thank you! I was striving to just be honest. No point in telling only half the story
Do you own any of their F40PHs or ES44ACs? They also have semi-fixed pilots, but they only rotate on a single axis and do not have the issue that the new ones do. I don’t understand why they dropped that design, it worked flawlessly. I run 25-30 car trains myself and while I haven’t had issues with derailing, I can’t stand the look of these 45s going around the layout with their pilots swung out to the side. It also makes the train lurch when they do finally switch sides in reverse curves. Same issue happens on longer passenger trains.
I really enjoyed your review. The sweet talking needs to end. If nobody speaks up, things will never change. Ever since they switched to Pantone colors their paint has been an absolute roll of the dice. The X31A head out in your train is practically orange. I bought a trio of these 45s and I honestly think they look disgusting. The cab number fonts are wrong too. And it’s so sad because the old MTH ones are so sharp.
Hopefully somebody from the big orange borg sees this video and passes it along. I’m getting to the point where I’ve had enough and I’m ready to stop buying their products.
Years ago I owned one of their ES44s and it was great. Never had any problems. The engineering coming out of Lionel these days is honestly pathetic. A few years ago it seemed Lionel was finally turning things around but lately things have been nosediving off the deep end. It's really a shame.
I just got my SD45 and the couplers are so messed up. The couplers somehow get stuck on curves. Also I paid cash for it and Lionel probably won’t give me a free repair since it was released in 2018 770 bucks down the drain
Aw man I'm really sorry to hear that. This problem is extremely frustrating.
Good video... need the truth for better or for worse. Subscribed.
Thank you!
It would be nice if you worked for Classic Toy Trains magazine. They used to critically analyze engines but not now. At present, they are merely water carrying cheerleaders for Lionel. In the realm of S gauge, I have found Chianel to be shoddy with chronic problems such as bad sound boards or side bolsters falling off, just out of the box, with wheels falling all over the floor! It's been that way since 2016.
Most important question to ask is what kind of replacement part support there will be especially for BTO's. Lionel no longer carries oritginal or retro compatible sound boards for bershires made in 2014. It's only a matter of time before a high priced "Visonline" becomes an eyesore and door stop.
Yeah many of the bigger names in the social media sphere of 3 rail seem to think pushing a 100% positive narrative and just ignoring any faults in a product is the best way to grow the hobby. I completely disagree with that stance - at least with the high end products. With starter sets yeah sure, there's really no reason to dog on those too much. But what so many of these influencers don't understand is that a $1.5k steam locomotive and $650 diesel are not targeted towards beginners, they're targeted towards experienced users. Because of that there's no reason to hide and cover up any flaws. You aren't protecting newcomers; you're just withholding information from people who already know their way around the block with this hobby.
I’m happy being cheap getting the Lion Chief 2.0 locomotives. 1/2 the price and no issues.
Can't blame you at all. When the going is bad with the scale stuff I miss the days where I bought o27 equipment. Thanks for watching!
We need honest appraisal and opinions
Notice John cortapassi.he is brutally honest
Thank you for watching! I agree covering the good and bad is only beneficial
Well done. Nice to see someone not treat the kinematic pilots like they’re the best thing since sliced bread. They’re not. Lionel needs to cut the bling and start making trains along the lines of true modelers and not the “scale” guys with their 4 elevated loops and giant fishing ponds in between the main tracks.
Yeah it would certainly be nice for them to start leaning back towards that. I feel like not even 5 years ago they were more balanced with making good models as well as fun features. Nowadays it's all play value.
This is why I only use MTH 😅
Their diesels are generally much more consistent
Brunswick green is like 99 drops of black paint with one drop of green paint 🎨. I never saw a Pennsylvania railroad engine with a green like that. And yes I am that old.
A+ subscribed
Thank you!
for me i like my milwaukee road sd-45 one problem i have horn set they didn’t even try all 5 horns same one in each different pinch to high and super high then low
Thanks for the great review
You are correct,
most of the other channels have a positive bias which is not productive to the hobby. One of the bigger channels goes as far as to gas light people for complaining about Lionel's poor QC...I will not mention him
I had very similar issues with the last Lionel SD38 I purchased
Goofy, almost neon bright colors
Detailing underwhelming for a relatively new tooling
I like the kinematic pilot, but I see your point.
I have not noticed the centering issue yet, but the factory used the wrong screws on the plate holding the assembly together, resulting large misaligned gap between pilot
Given the exorbitant price of these models, I question if I will be purchasing another Lionel diesel in the foreseeable future
Thank you! It's unfortunate because up until a year or two ago I was a huge fan of Lionel and thoroughly enjoyed their products. But lately i'm just not enjoying the stuff they're putting out; they don't satisfy what i'm looking for. I've been turning towards MTH and TMCC locos to fill the gap modern Lionel had disappointingly created.
Thanks for the response, just be aware that Lionel is phasing out support and availability of older TMCC and Legacy DCDS control boards
Yeah a few months ago just about all TMCC boards of any kind were removed from their parts sight. Truly unfortunate.
Vertical curves at the beginning and end of grades cause lots of derailing problems in every scale, but that kind of vertical play in any coupler system is going to be trouble. Not good design…
Hello if you decide to sell them how much do you want for them 😊 lam always looking to buy Locomotives
Will do 👍
@@KiskiDivisionRailroad thank you 😊
I have Williams sg45 in my railroad and they perform perfectly right out of the box and they only cost me $100 each.
Do Lionel engines have kadee mounts?
Over the past 5 or so years Lionel has been making a strong effort to equip as many locos as possible with a built in Kadee mount. Unfortunately I don't recall if these have them or not.
I fix the pilots on my locos and was thinking maybe the kinematic pilots would make it easy to fix them and add kadees. I’ll have to think about that
I had a Williams locomotive take a dive off the train table to the concrete floor and all it did was break the horn off the top of the cab
Question: Isn't the rail line The Pennsylvania Railroad ? If so, then why does their insignia have TWO 'R's ? Shouldn't be just a 'P and an R ?
The "RR" stands for words "Rail" and "Road" that make up the word Railroad
Why you shouldn't buy any Legacy loco. If it breaks, like mine did twice in less than a year and a half, Lionel won't take care of the issue. They had it once and fixed it 'under warranty'. Then in a few months it took a crap again and this time they won't do anything except to send me to an outsourced mechanic. It's back to Post War or anything pre 2001. I have over a thousand dollars in POS's that are supposed to be top of the line. Don't work anymore and I take great care of my trains. Sucks. Don't buy them if you want to run them.
I try to only buy MTH Premier Deisels. MTH is a Far better Product than Lionel. I do buy some of the Lionel Steam Engines.
For diesels I generally agree. However Railsounds 4 and 5 era TMCC diesels are honestly incredible and i've been buying a lot of that lately. But for modern times MTH generally makes a better diesel product. Thanks for watching!
The KDR✋👍
Both the design and quality of Lionel products have been on a steady decline over the last few years. It's unacceptable considering how much they cost.
So tired of Lionel screwing up colors. Honestly unless it’s black I’m assuming it’s gonna be wrong.
About 3 years ago I was in the same boat as you. However over the past two catalogs they truly have gotten much better with color accuracy; to the point now it's an exception rather than the rule. Thanks for watching!
@@KiskiDivisionRailroad Lionel can’t get any greens or reds right to save their life. Check out the latest Southern Atlantics, just awful. Legacy J’s had bright orange stripes instead of Red. I bought the Erie Lackawanna PA Alcoa last year and they’re literally white instead of grey. It’s embarrassing. Check out any Great Northern steam engine In the last 3 years. All different schemes and all are wrong. They’re awful and there’s no improvement in sight. Honestly it’s embarrassing and they are doing nothing about it to fix it. So unless it’s black I’m not preordering anything until I see it.
Fair enough. Can't argue there. The items from the 2021 v2 and 2022 catalog seem to be more consistent at least.
Same here.
Scale 2 rail locomotives have fixed pilots and don't have the problems that Lionel has
Hybrid 2010 Vision Line has the same coupler issues. ok running Premier Tropicana refers but a postwar sized Lionel car derails on 054. The hobby needs more honesty.
Iam old school I buy legacy I buy the old engine. Lionel
Nice!
I guess no one cares what you think. The engine is almost sold out.
Hopefully it works better for them