Introduction into flail weapons (Warflail and Mangual)
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2022
- This video is about flails. However, this format is not a fundamental video, as I sometimes publish. Rather it's an overview of this weapon and can serve as an orientation to decide whether you want to have a closer look at this type of weapon. Therefore, we look primarily at 2 types of these flail weapons that also have a source base: Warflail and Mangual
Link to my battlesword article:
ddhf.de/forschung-und-wissen/... - Sport
The mangual is beautifully hypnotic in action. I never thought of it as a halfway point between greatsword and polearm - but seeing it in action with your commentary it makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the video!
04:17
I believe the _usual suspects_ (Matt Easton from schola gladiatoria and Tod from Tod's Workshop) may have demonstrated how this relatively cheap weapon swings around a shield and still do damage against someone trying to protect themselves.
I really hope to see more of these weapons. They are such an under explored weapon and your interpretations are always so clear and thorough.
Definitely would love to see more of those "overview" type videos. Especially about polearms. One about bardiche would be appreciated. The history of this polearm is pretty convoluted.
Edit: Oh, and of course, liked and subscribed.
3:58 In my humble opinion, the back point was used only when the flail top broke off. So it made sense to have a metal reinforced back point to then use it as a reinforced club or short staff.
Looking forward to see more on flails. Especially on the safety on using the mangual. It occurs to me that the long chain makes it possible to hit the wielder the forearms, head and other parts of the body.
Also downloaded your very interesting article on the battlesword.
I wish you went over the longsword in this manner vs just the text. I was trained using hectormairs treatise and kind of adopted my own understanding of it even though I'm pretty sure I'm now doing it wrong because all of the guards I was taught look nothing like anyone elses. Also really cool that we can see use of these tools from renown masters meaning they were not as obscure then as they are today.
Im glad your mangual is a proper one. Many so called "experts" believe the stick has to be longer than the chains, but that is a modern notion for safety. The mangual is like a very dangerous version of a montante (for its user, and taking in account just its function in the battlefield) and it actually uses the same concept and movements. Miguel Pérez de Mendoza, spanish master of arms, writes at the end of the century 17 about this.
The mangual is fantastic. I have been searching for different flail-type weapons on the internet and this is the first time I saw this weapon in action. Wonderful video with great historical context, instant sub
Thx mate
I love chain and flail weapons. That flow you speak of is really fun to experience. It's scary watching you flip the flail around, even as expertly as you do it. I hope anyone watching that wants to play with these realizes that the lever action creates exponential force - watch your skull and hands.
You gave me the nudge to finally finish the practice flail, we'll test your Video tomorrow
Everyday you learn something new just by watching videos on YT! Thanks!
The war flail is quite versatile, especially against opponents with shields. If the lower part of the flail is blocked, the smaller top half would curve over it and hit the opponent on the head, making shields impractical at defending against them. (Unless you have a good helmet.)
This together with its decently long range would, as described in the video, make it be a great weapon for defending on top crenelated walls or defending crowded gates/peacekeeping in public spaces due to how cheap it is to manufacture and by how difficult it is to defend against the unpredictable flailing end of the polearm.
Great video, this type of content deserves more attention.
Flails! I love them, thanks for making this and I'd love to see more.
The motion of the mangual is something that caught me off guard, the smooth swings so reminiscent of a greatsword as you mentioned was actually rather surprising, but nonetheless made a great deal of sense. _I'll have to look into that . . ._
Great video. Btw mangual is just the Spanish word for flail, so a one handed chained flail with a shorter chain is a mangual too
Oh interesting...Mangual has become a unique word in the hema world. But its makes totally sense. Thx for the insight!
@ it happens with a lot of Spanish words that they are kept the same despite having a translation a few are: espada ropera for rapier, siesta for nap, conquistador for conqueror.... Im not sure about montante for greatsword since we have another word for greatsword but it could be the case
great content, i like this format
This Video truly was an epic flail!
One of my fav channels
It'd be cool to see more unusual renaissance weapons. The period is criminally underrated.
Nice! Ist schön flüssig geworden, der Mangual move! Und kaum Winkel zwischen Kette und Schaft - Respekt! 😎👌
Deine Tipps haben nochmal richtig geholfen, danke :)
Another awesome video!
Mangual training reminds me of flexible swords; the way the blade bends in those teaches you to continue the momentum and how to not hit yourself.
That good weapon for range in middle combat for me🔥
This video has perfect timing as me and my friend were in the process of making a war flail like the polearm one right when we saw this video and I was wondering if you had advice for making one
What do you wanna know exactly. I used ash, some steel strips, two rings and a S hook to connect them together...but have decided against thorns...too dangerous to practice and would also damage the wood in the long run.
@ well it was mostly ways of connecting the two parts together that I wanted to know but I see what you mean with the bands and I didn’t want to use thorns for the end so we decided to use rebar for a blunt hard hitting surface for the swinging end
Great video thank you! Appreciate you putting in the effort to explore lesser-known parts of history. I've only seen the war flail (outside of medieval pictures on Todd Cutler's channel. It is really interesting.
I haven't handled either weapon but the mangual appears more dangerous to yourself. How did it feel handling it?
Comparing both weapons to a great sword for crowd control do you feel it would tangle on one opponent and lose effectiveness?
Awesome video! Even just looking at the movements already makes me afraid of hitting myself in the head with it.
Great video!
We need an instructional DVD/video on the flail! 100% serious!
Interesting.
Cool to see the blunt parallel to the greatsword
Dealing with my GF has never been easier, I'd like to thank you for this.
I think sparring with the mangual could be interesting, because this weapon lives from the moment. But when your opponent blocks the chain with the shaft of this polearm this momentum is taken.
It would go around the polearm though?
Blocking those chains is dangerous. There is a lot of momentum in the weights, that would be transerred to the opponents polearm. Yes, you might stop the chains - but you risk to break the shaft of your own weapon, get hit on the hands or your polearm might get ripped out of your hands.
great video
thanks alot! so much information!
I like how you put those fancy upholstery nails on your flail ;D
way better than usual nails right? :D
I tell you what, flails are VERY deceiving weapons. You wouldn't think they are THAT effective but with the right strategy and combination they are terrifying.
The mangual is as scary for the opponent as the wielder. Definitely have to learn how to "rob energy" at the end of the swings to allow you to then safely accelerate the weapon once more. Have you struck any targets with the mangual? If you have, how did you find that the chain heads reacted to impacts? Reminds me in small part of how you use nunchaku or some of the chain weapons in chinese martial arts. Has elements of the rope dart as well with subtle differences.
The flail would make sense for guards. Team them up with a guard with a shield and a sword or a shield and a club and alternate the fighting to wear down the criminal. Move in with the flail first and if you don't subdue them in the first few blows, switch off with the shield armed guard. When the shield armed guard has the opponent's attention move to a position with the flail where you can harry the head at longer measure.
I love how one of the deadliest flail weapons in history was originally designed by farmers to beat away weeds and brambles.
Nice one.
I normally favor ranged weapons, however flails are my absolute favorite of the melee category, owing to their unpredictability to opponents and their striking power.
Gotta say, the flail actually looks reasonable in the proper context, particularly this longer one. But that other thing looks like it is way more dangerous for the user lol. It seems like it would be really easy to slip up and crack your own head with one of those metal balls. (Though you looked very graceful in the using of it.)
Thank you for a very well done and informative video! 👏👏As a sidenote, may I point out that the 'u' in 'Miguel' is silent, so it's not really supposed to be pronounced "Migwél" like you did in the video, but rather "Migél", like in German 'geld' or 'nagel'.
Have you encountered the flail (2 section staff) ideas and forms in eastern traditional martial arts? If so, do they bring something interesting to the table in your opinion?
As impractical in battle most flails are, theyre really fun to use.
Looks great, but what happens when you actually hit a target? How much control will you have over the mangual?
Flails can be practiced by hitting a target or an apple out of a tree just like a whip. Chains or ropes with balls were common anti horse devices dating back to Zerxes to trip the horse.
Cheers!
😃Love it
Thanks!
I can really see the flail used by the town watch to disperse the oh so common riots or give a good thrashing (pun intended) to some unruly youths. And the Mangual seems like a nice stand in for the Montante for low-key outings where you can't carry along a huge ass sword to fulfill your body guard duties.
Great video as always. Björn, any plans for one hand flail (řemdih in Czech) video?
Maybe... :)
@ Don't be so shy with small weapons, Björn. :D
Can a flail weapon be underslunged attachment of a sxs flintlock blunderbuss ust like doom slayer's super shotgun meathook to be conjunction with a round shield back in medieval times such as dark ages?
2:11 Warflails also saw use in Thirteen Years' War ( Dreizehnjähriger Krieg).
Thank you so much for this. I’ve found accounts of 19th Irish farmers using flails in fights. Could you give the dimensions of your flail and what kind of wood it is made of?
can a side by side blunderbuss/flail combo be used as a grappling hook gun?
" I would highly recommend fencing against a flail to anyone that wants to learn more about it" 😆
Never thought I'd ever haveto say this, but one of the few things I remember from the Norwegian royal armoury archives (large lack of flails, explanation follows) is that it's a KNIGTS dueling weapon... Tight locked shields.. Littlte stricking range above it?... Scholars are beyond me.. Shame you cant read..
If I was on this guys side in warfare, I wouldn't want to be anywhere near him when he's swinging those chains around. Looks as dangerous to your side as well as the enemies!
There are people who say that fails, especially the ball and chain flail were not really used in battle. Apparently there is no historical record of them being used.
Who said that and what means "not really"? :)
I have troubles picturing the Mangual as a weapon of war. I looks nice swinging around, but what happens if it actually hits something?
I have had discussions with my fellow HEMA practicioners if the mangual was an actual weapon and was used during the middle ages, even if it can be seen in one or two manuals.
Does anyone know of reliable sources and armouries around the world that have them dated to the earlier periods? (1500s)
Will you also do the overview of the scythe fighting? Seems like another tool-made-weapon that could be used (and indeed was) by peasants levvied into military.
Armored soldiers weren't just put on the outside for psychological or propaganda reasons. It helps with attrition from ranged weapons like bows and javelins.
I don't know what time you mean when you talk about bows and javelins. I am talking about contemporary military theory of the 16th and 17th centuries. You can believe me that I am not making things up, but drawing my conclusions from quotes and sources. I have also published an article on the subject where I reference the sources. There you will also find the reason/explanation for the good armor in the outer ranks. ddhf.de/forschung-und-wissen/die-verwendung-des-deutschen-schlachtschwertes-des-spaeten-16-und-fruehen-17-jahrhunderts/
@ I understand what time you mean. But from the medieval period on it was common to have the armored men upfront to counter bows. And during the medieval and Renaissance eras skirmishers like the Italians and Irish would use fletched javelins sometimes called war darts. The sources for that are endless. And the English were still using bows well into the 1600s.
flails are badass but they look hard to wield properly
Armas con evolución convergente, en Corea, China, Japón y Okinawa habían esas mismas armas.
Интересно увидеть реальное действие этого оружия на предметы (манекены щиты и прочее). Крутить их в руках конечно красиво но что будет если цепь обернется вокруг ноги или ударная часть отрекошетит от щита или доспеха.
Скоро сниму видео на эту тему :)
@ had no idea you knew russian that's pretty cool
Я надеюсь, что смог ответить на его вопросы с последним видео.
I feel like the only way I'd want to fight someone with either of these weapons is while wearing full plate armor.
Where can I check out Perez de Mendoza's book?
Curious. What are the benefits of having multiple smaller heads and chains on the mangual, as opposed to one larger head and chain?
I assume the advantage is in making sure it doesn't halt when parried, and maybe to make it less dangerous outside of full acceleration, (ergo less dangerous to you). So it can act more like a montante.
5:03 Bro knows the third form of stone breathing
I find it interesting how originally weapons and tools were close together in form and function (blades were used for harvest and war, so were polearms), and over time those uses diverged to the point that modern weapons can serve no other purpose. I wonder if that contributes to gun aversion by those who would ban firearms. They might feel differently if guns served any other role than violence, but since they are ignorant of the need for justified violence in self defense, they assume there are only malevolent reasons to carry a gun.
I love the mangual, though I keep feeling my shins shattering from a badly-timed step. With greaves I'd be happy on that all day.
i have made some relativly sparring save versions with a leather bag filled with wool, it is alot of fun to fight with them, but parriing with them is basicly impossible.
THE TEICK IS TO SEE EVERYT PALEY AS A SEXY DOG
Would you be so kind to weigh the head of the warflay for me? I am trying to build a head that be used for sparring and a datapoint how heavy a real one is would be nice, thx
The weights differ massively in the original...nails, reinforcements, metal rings, sometimes the rod is even made entirely of metal. I would suggest you equip your head as you prefer and then take the weight as given.
@ That makes sense, I was more asking in the direction of "what weighs a real head? XXX Gram! So the sparring head needs to be much lighter". But I have a first datapoint from training today: 400g is ... devastating. So next try with 100g
But thx for reacting anyway 🤘
😂 “no army wanted to create a peasants impression”
Flail is unpredictable for its user too. It pulls your arms unpredictably each time you attack, and you lose some time and energy to correct the weapon. It is good enough for peasant militia but not good enough for proper soldiers. On the other hand, mangual is too predictable while attacking but very chaotic during contact. I rather have a mace or a staff than these two.
Maybe its just me or my device, but you talking was really quiet. I had really trouble to understand what you said, even with max volume.
But the rest was great.
Has the Mangual been used in StarWars?
pretty neat but not really the weapon I would choose
What about the single-handed flail?
I wish Medieval themed movies actually used realistic flails instead of the gigantic monstrosities they usually use
why does the Mangual has multiple heads considering that they move in the same way and hit in the same places.
They do scatter a little...this makes the error rate redundant
How many times did you hurt yourself during filming?
"peesants" kek
cooles Video, gebe es historische Einhändige Flegel?
🤠👍🏿
🖤🍻🍺
Guandao please..
Peasents wird wie päsents ausgesprochen.
Amazing weapons but very likely induce a literal headacke were I to try them out. xD
Great for a more open order battle (eg. a skirmish), and for threatening a large area and multiple opponents at the same time.
Mangual with the rapier would be a terrifying combination if it works (a big if).
🙂
MAN GUAL IS AN ISLAND OF DUDES
You've gotta use this against a dummy with a shield
You're from Germany? I just asking because of your accent
Dane axe next?
possible, but honestly...that looks not so different from the other polearms...ok the axe himself looks different..mh^^
@ You're right...maybe axe and shield?
@@IlFantePesante I guess without contemporary sources its always difficult...but never say never ;)
@ yey!
Better master the spoon, before learning the flail.
:-)
Flails can't be used when in formation
My guy, why are you not wearing a helmet with this stuff? 😅
the ea is peasant is misleading. it sounds more like pasant, like "pleasant"