LEAN DOSING vs ESTIMATIVE INDEX DOSING! WHICH ONE IS BETTER?
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- čas přidán 19. 07. 2022
- Over the years I have used a lot of different fertilizers, with some I had good results, and with other not really. So I think it's time I start making my own fertilizer!
The Plantedbox Estimative Index kit: planted-box.com/product/estim...
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Just a thought for another experiment sometime: Plant growth between no fish, lightly stocked, and overstocked. Could be neat to measure how much the fish help the plantlife.
Finally…
I was always searching videos like this and now i found one!
Looking forward to the results and what a great introduction to fertilizers.
Cool video and experiment! Can’t wait for the results! Keep up the great content!
Content is fire! Excellent production and always educational
I really appreciate your scientific approach
thanks for doing these series. After 25 years, I'm starting to get the hang of this
Looking forwards to seeing the results of this.
I reallllly had a different idea when i saw the video title :) keep up the great videos.
Really interesting I'm looking into such a diy project!
Great subject matter. Looking forward to how this pans out
New upload, fertilizing has always stumped me.
Awesome! I’ve been learning about EI, look forward to results❤️🇦🇺
Bro your every video has something to learn from it! your Experiments are just epic!
I'm a fan of lean dosing after watching your videos. Zero problems to date for a whole year!
Will be interesting to see how your experiment turns out because I heard you can make your own ferts for cheap if you find them at the right place.
Salut mark, ahhh enfin une vraie vidéo sur l'histoire de la fertilisation et je t'en remercie énormément. J'ai hâte de voir l'évolution de cette expérience. Moi aussi je suis passé par plusieurs fertilisation et d'ailleurs ses toi qui m'a fait découvrir le planted box. Et je t'en remercie mais j'ai constaté plusieurs carences au bout de plusieurs mois. Et maintenant je fertilise que avec du micro et macro. Depuis mets bac se porte à merveille. Mais je voudrais revenir sur l'expérience des algues avec les températures chaudes et la négligence de l'entretien j'arrive à avoir des cornes de cerfs et la BBA. J'atends encore un peu pour trouver le remède pour les combattre. Mais avec ton expérience je vais commencer par la fertilisation. Donc un grand merci pour ton travail et le partage que tu donnes de notre passion. A bientôt mon ami ^^
This is a great idea for a series. When mixing your ferts, definitely RO or distilled water is necessary as to allow the fertilizer to mix correctly. Tap water can contain a lot of different things in it that may interact with the fertilizer and create compounds you don’t want. Distilled or RO reduces the chance that happens. Looking forward to seeing your results. Take care.
Great idea
All your experiments videos are so helpful for us to choose without us experimenting them.
Loving the channel. I really like how you actually do the experiments rather than just perpetuate other peoples opinions
Yes! This is what we need :)
Great plants fertilizer 👍🏻
MJ you are Dexter on this hobby. Love this test. 😉
Awesome tank ❤️😍😍
MJ, I am not sure if you're a super hero or just truly gifted. Your videos are not only informative, but soothing. Totally inspired to transform each of my tanks simply because of the wealth of concise and clear guidance and precautions you provide. Definitely curious as to how things turn out.
Thank you for the kind words 😊 not a super hero and not gifted either 😊 just a guy who’s very passionate about this!
@@MJAquascaping Even your feedback demonstrates your humble nature. Would love to learn how to truly determine the specific minerals my plants need. I use the master test kit and other additional chemicals to check water column, but I still struggle to find the right light/nutrient/CO2 balance. 10hr automated light with good CO2 production, but no pearling. The hard water we have in the US/my home state has good ph, but lots of chromium 6, chloramine, and moderately high levels of nitrates that constantly shoot my nitrate levels to 20 ppm. Uphill battle. Maybe I should move to the Netherlands.😀
Thank you for the video. I am however perplexed why MgSO4 is mixed with the micros. Its essentially epsom salt which I have always been told is either added to the macro solutuon or dry dosed at water change to remineralize. Have always had great success with EI.
Can't wait for the outcome after 30 days. I:m using the EI index for a couple of years now and had good results with it. I'm curious for the test by NOT using the iron-mix included in the package. See if the test will keep the reds in the leafs. 😉👍
Very informative.👍
I changed over to EI fertilizing using dry salts and it's been a game changer. No more Green Spot Algae. Less hair algae in the aquarium I'm treating for it and much faster and heather plant growth. My reds aren't as bright but it's a small price to pay for super healthy aglae free plants. My shrimp haven't been affected and my Otto's are still fat and happy. But I have to supliment their diet now that I'm getting less glass algae. They love pumpkin and zucchini and repashi
Its a very interesting video. Im waiting for results
One point to note, the micro mix with iron could precipitate out due to 2 things... light entering the bottle and the ph of the mix water. Depending on the chelate used for the micro mix will determine at what ph the iron will precipitate out of the solution so that is worth checking. I mix mine with a low ph mineral water to prevent this, and wrap my bottles in black tape to keep the solution in the dark.
I've made my own AiO fertilizer with phosphate and iron in one bottle. The trick is using preservative (sorbate), Ascorbic acid (vitamin c) to lower pH, as well as EDTA chelator. No precipitation after six months and very concentrated solution.
Just found your channel and would love a video on growing red plants. Thanks
Interesting experiment.
Interesting topic. I’m curious to see how rhizome plants get along with the lean dosing method since they need to get their nutrients from the water column.
6 years ago I started with liquid ferts (seachem) then graduated to thrive liquid now I'm using thrive dry ferts. . Such a money saver and I can adjust the amount of what nutrient I need less,or more. Im still working on dialing in the amount,at first I got GSA (never personally experienced that form of algae before) I'm actually doing both EI and lean dosing..if that makes sense, I fertilize every day,but do small water changes of 20%-25% (I use a 32 ounce cup to remove and replace water) every couple of days and 50%-60% water change with full maintenance once a week. removing excess nutrients,
So I'm feeding the plants.. not the algae. This has always worked for me. I only keep nanos,so it isnt hard to do so many water changes,I'm sure would be a pain with larger tanks.
Interesting! But I think you should divide the EI dose in six days, this is how it was developed; dosing only monday and tuesdat will créate a peak por nutrients at the start of the week.
Agree divide it up!
I think lean dosing seems cheaper at first, but then you rely a lot on root tabs to give your plants N and P, and those cost money too. So honestly I dont know 😅.
Plus, lean dosing requires aqua soil, whereas some EI people dont use aqua soil.
MJ aquascaping the king of suspense
This is a reply to someone else's comment but I'll post it again so that more people can see it and learn from it:
I've made my own AiO fertilizer with phosphate and iron in one bottle. The trick is using preservative (sorbate), Ascorbic acid (vitamin c) to lower pH, as well as EDTA chelator. No precipitation after six months and very concentrated solution.
hello if possible can you make a video on perpetual preservation system(or pps) dosing as shown on rotalabutterly nutrient calculator..
I’m interested to see the results, I currently use more of a lean dosing method but I used to use more of an ei dosing method, both worked super well but the ei method gave me faster growth. Also what’s that grass like plant in the tank with the little things on the tips?
Please make a video on EI vs PPS system :)
Have you ever heard of Easy Green all in one? They also carry iron and carbon. Im from the USA so very limited on brands of ferts. What do you think about the brand if you have time to check them out. Made by Aquarium co-op. Trying to find something to use on a few tanks. Thanks and Great video
Yep good stuff! I would probably use that as well if i were in the US
Ik heb me hier ook al een tijdje in verdiept erg leuk dat je dit topic aansnijdt !!! Erg benieuwd hoe dit gaat.... Heb je een schatting hoeveel je uit het totale pakket kan halen gezien de 30 euro die het kost??
Daar ga ik nog even voor zitten 😁 Het is natuurlijk afhankelijk van hoe groot je bak is, maar volgens mij gaat dit behoorlijk lang mee, en is het in verhouding erg goedkoop.
I hated making these stock solutions and the alternating dosing. I felt like a drugsdealer with a tiny scale mixing all kind of powders. I prefer ready-made bottles/cans now.
This is an exciting experiment. Anyone know of a source for EI ingredients that ships to Ireland?
Ótimo
Hello 👋 bro 😎
Can you give me please 🙏 your program fertilising?
Master line
Which with the light on
And which when the light off
They prefer using RO water, because it can dissolve more salts.. I think that's the reason.
Hi Mark do you never have a problem with the shrimps? Because in for example Tropica nutrition is Fe and Cu.
And this can even kill them.
Never had issues!
@MJ Aquascaping I used the Dark Start method and cycled my tank for almost 2months, does this mean the aquasoil nutrients in it will be dissolved? I'm planning to use either EI or Leaned which do you will prefer knowing my tank is running the cycle for 2 months now?
The update video link pls.
Could I check how much do you dose your potassium? In therms of ppm?
I have same EI KIT, my red plants lost colour. What do you think if i will mix macro to two bottles a one with phosphate an another with nitrates and then doung smaller dosing of nitrates?
what light stand are you using?
I have never seen a good argument for doing macros and micros on different days. The only thing i can think is it minimize any potential adverse effects. Otherwise, why not just dose on the same day.
Instead of potassium sorbate ...
Can i use only vinegar for preservation..?? Can any one answer that..😀
Hello, is this EI kit cheaper?
I would rather to this experiment last more days I think 3 months because of the estimated index at long term could be harder to keep and in some cases the tank crashes at 3 month
Off subject here but wanted to ask you about a small pump I use to circulate water in a med planted tank with hob filter and co2 .I am currently using it on back of tank aimed at front of tank what are your thoughts thannk you
From the years of watching Green Aqua setup a few times... the plants definitely do best if everything flows in a circulation so a HOB which they seldom use is placed on the side or in a corner and try to make whatever else work with the flow 😉
@@stoneysscapes7544 thank you for replying I bought a tiny pump with flow adjustment . Did not want it to be overkill running it at med,and putting it on back of tank 3/4 down length of tank seems to continue the flow pattern of hob thanks again
Hi MJ, are you dosing potassium sulfate (masterline potssium) in lean dosing?
Good question! I don't know 😂 It just says potassium on the bottle
@@MJAquascaping right, i think should be sulfate because nitrates and phosphates add macros other than potassium
Hi MJ, is it possible if you can provide the actual weight instead of scoop?
Just convert it to grams or ml
@@gabrielalexander3069 that doesnt make sense
A bit difficult because some salts are heavier than others. I would say 1 scoop is roughly 25-30 grams
have a look at rotala butterfly nutrient dosing calculator, it makes light work of this subject
Hey man.. quick question. Would it be ok to use dechloronated tap water for diy co2?
Think so!
Yes, it will be okay
Waiting for results
I think the old title was a lot better
Isn't it one of the benefits of the lean dosing method that you don't have to do a 50% waterchange every week?
You could say that
Any reason why you dose macro on Monday and micro on Tuesday why can't you do it at the same time?
I believe that it is because of how the form of iron used in the two bottle method gets affected negatively if both are mixed together
Brother make a Fertilizer vs No Fertilizer Experiment!! it will be great to watch how much difference it makes. and there is no such experiment video on CZcams.
Curious how this experiment is going. I noticed you're not dosing daily but twice per week as per the plantedbox instructions. I personally think this is a flaw and if you read up on what Tom Barr recommends (on of the brains behind the EI method) it is best to dose daily. You're also using aquasoil on the EI tank so you're basically doubling down on overdosing ;). But...who knows what will happen because it is very tank specific. For me the EI method (also using the Plantedbox kit) seems to be solving all the issues I had with deficiencies, stunted growth and ALGAE. better planty health = less chance of algae take over. whatever the outcome... you have to take in consideration that that result is only for your setup(water, bioload, light, plants etc.)
ben benieuwd mark!
I have not found any notable difference over the years using tap or RO.
Are those 10 Gallon aquariums?
On the shelf are all 5 gallons 😊
It's also far cheaper to make your own Fertiliser
Hello MJ.YOU CAN WRITE WHAT YOU HAVE LAMP CHIHIROS WRGB COLOR SETTINGS.GRETTINGS.
Slim or pro?
SLIM
SLIM
@@iwonawojtas9169 I always have all channels on the same level same percentage
What level percentage every channel
@@iwonawojtas9169 in a new setup I will start with all channels on 50% and every week I add 10 %
I have a question about NPK: If I dose Seachem Nitrogen does it provide Potassium for the plants? It sais is derived from potassium nitrate, urea 1-0-2, thanks.
It’ll provide potassium, but might not be an adequate amount.
I think you should run this experiment @ 60 days - much better long term results to end up at a more accurate conclusion no?
root tabs vs liquid fertilizer on inert substrate
both
Root tabs alone will not help any water column feeding plants while using inert substrates, you need both to do that job
I don't think that this comparison between these two fertalizing concepts in equally planted, and equal lighted and CO2 intensity is meaningful to be honest. EI, as far as I know, is meant for heavily planted (with many fast growing plants, i.e. Dutch style aquariums) tanks, high light and CO2 intensity, because these conditions increase the risk of a shortage of one of the nutrients. With low light or low CO2 or not enough fast growing plants you are basically waisting ferts and increasing the risk of algae development. Many of the aquascapes look heavily planted but are not because the hardscape uses a significant amount of the aquarium volume. Many of the carpeting plants do not need allot of nutrients from the water column. EI was developed for Dutch style tanks where the majority of the aquarium volume is accupied by plant mass.
predictions; 4. Lean's cheaper than EI. man EI seems like SUCH a waste... first you dump in too many chemicals and then every weerk you gotta do a drastic water change to get rid of the excess, so as not to pollute the water... xD like.. whut... that's like those old romans (or those city dwellers in the hunger games really) gorging on food till they're full and then throwing up to make room for more food... >.
Granted I have been aquascaping for only about 6 months, but fertilization so far seems to me to be the most overrated aspect of the hobby. Perhaps if you are really going for a "green aqua" level, with tons of light and CO2, tons of maintenance and almost no fish, then I can understand it. But it has been my experience, even with CO2, as long as you are using aquasoil and tank is well stocked with fish (and you are feeding them), you pretty much dont need to fertilize anything. I add little bit here and there, only when I remember, afraid of getting low on micros and K, but clearly the fish will enable enough N and P. There has been a couple of times I tried to get into a fert routine with an "All-in-One" and each time it brought algae... so I stopped it.
and what after the soil is depleted?
@@skeletoncreek6446 I never got tanks that old... but here is my hypothesis, specially seeing tanks from MD Fish for example, who uses over and over again the same media: First more nutrients will always come from the fish food/waste and that will reach the soil and plants. For example, I've experimented with growing stem plants glued to wood (totally out of the ground with roots flying around)... and they've grown amazingly. I've also heard someone saying Aquasoil is not about bringing a nutrient stock from the store, that is a side benefit... the main benefit to Aquasoil is that it has the ability to absorb/store nutrients FROM the water... Hence, as long as you have nutrients in the water, it should be good.
I have same EI KIT, my red plants lost colour. What do you think if i will mix macro to two bottles a one with phosphate an another with nitrates and then doung smaller dosing of nitrates?