How to Stay in Tune When Playing a Floyd Rose, Double Locking & Floating Bridge - Herman Li
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Shred Test! What's the best way to keep your guitar in tune? DragonForce guitarist @HermanLi discuss tuning, compare and examine different guitar bridges, such as the ones the Ibanez EGEN18, Music Man Majesty, PRS Custom 24 Floyd Rose Original, Kiesel headless with Hipshot, Jared Dines Signature, Dean Exile with Floyd Rose 1000. What other guitar tech topic would you like to see Herman discuss on Twitch and CZcams?
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I miss spoke during the livestream. The Floyd Rose 1000 is not licensed. It is made in Korean and only available to OEM guitar manufacturers. They are meant to be the same specs as the Original Floyd Rose but a lower cost. - Herman
yep but they perform worse. waaaay worse. At this point i just install the gotoh ge1996t in all my guitars
@@edgardomoragamellado6856 Gotoh is the best
@@higler. I see you're a man of culture as well
@@edgardomoragamellado6856 haha yep. Gotoh is so good and one of the cheapest. Only fools buy anything else due to brand or hype.
@@edgardomoragamellado6856 Schaller, Gotoh, Original Floyd Rose, is excellent Brands actually...
âThe better you do the faces, the more your guitar will be in tune...it will distract the audienceâ đ€Ł
I will print this on a T-shirt t and confuse the shit out of people
@@floppydisk1137 hell yeahđ
Steve vai moment
If you can't do the faces you are playing the wrong instrument
Damn...bad news for us fat guys and whammy bars. đ
wife: why are you going on a diet now?
me: so my Jackson stays in tune!
wife: đ€·đŒââïž
In that case you can tune the guitar parallel to ground
@@larskronke Ha! Good point.
tune the guitar the same way you play and you're good.
LOOOLL
Me too I need to stop eating alot
6:02 âdonât do this at homeâ
Donât worry Herman, I CANâT AFFORD to do that anywhere anyway
Same!!! I can't even buy a better or a decent strings either!
Well, I don't do that, but I stab my ceiling a lot! Maybe I should have bought a less pointy guitar, although it's holding up pretty well. At least better than my ceiling...
@@hotasianstepsister3039 I know buy my strings on Aliexpresse for 1âŹ50 a pack. Real ernie ballzzzzz
Thanks Herman, youâre right man, most people donât talk about or teach how to use the whammy bar.
No human can pull up on a whammy bar without making a face
Damn you and your accurate assessment
truth
Uh oh, what are you trying to tell me? Was I built in a lab?! Tell me damn you!
Not just any face... ORGASM FACE!!!
Dude I don't make any face while doing crazy whammy stuff WHICH LAB DID THIS TO ME!!!
I don't think the dog was in tune after that.
XD
I think he definitely needs a new setup
9:50 Gotta love that PRS build quality. This was the single most informative video I've ever watched on Floyds. You're absolutely right, noone teaches you this stuff.
PRS plus Floyd Rose, better stability than most hard tails
My PRS Left hand tremolo works great on my PRS SE Custom 24 but is not a FR replacement by any means. You have shown the hard cold true facts of what they are. And are not. God bless you.
I love how dragon force mainly hurman li makes videos not just to talk, react and more but to give tips love this band
LOL....You are the perfect guy to be addressing this question...
In my entire playing career, the last 12 with a Floyd bridge equipped guitar not a single person told me about these things. This was a very informative video. Thanks Herman! Floyd originals for life though, them is some great bridges.
Yeah we need more videos about floating bridges. Learned a ton here.
So much can be learned here... Herman, you are a great teacher as well as an incredible player.
I had to learn this stuff the hard way when I started playing again 4 years ago after a 15 year break from playing only acoustic guitars. I have to say, I was NOT aware of half of these. Thanks for all you do Herman.
This is exactly what us inspiring players need to hear! Thank you so much for passing down your wisdom!
No one talks about these things.
I hope he keeps sharing such information for us new generations.
The 1000 Series is really good, just imported, the ones that are made from cheaper pot metal and eventually wear down are the Floyd Rose Special bridges.
Yeah, I looked into it. The Floyd Rose 1000 is the same specs as the original Floyd. Its just made in Korea vs Germany (Schaller) They both use C45 steel as far as I can see.
1000 series are the most bang for the buck. The Specials can be good too if you upgrade the springs and dial it in correctly. I run the 1000âs on most of my guitars and never had a problem with them. Iâve got one special on an LTD 401 that I was going to throw a 1000 on. But I just upgraded my springs and claw, and works as well as my 1000 series. But I do put tw25b grease on the posts to keep the knife edges from getting chewed up. The Specials do have softer metal. But if taken care of, they can perform well. Typically I wonât buy a guitar unless it has at least a 1000 series or better. But someone sold me that 401 for 200$. Couldnât pass it up. Does it play as good as my ESP or Gibsonâs? No. But itâs a damn fine playing guitar and comes surprisingly close to guitars I have worth 10 times the amount. đ€đ»
@@Wargasm644 Hey. I'm looking at a Schecter Hell Raiser, but don't have a lot of experience with Floyd Roses. Does the 1000 really hold up? I'm meticulous about tuning so I'm a bit concerned. Especially after finding out it's a cheaper model than the original. Can you suggest anywhere to learn everything there is to know about them?
@@ciaranw520 the Floyd 1000 is similar to the original German version. Except made in korea. They are really good units and will never go out of tune if dialed in correctly. Itâs about the most expensive version top builders currently use. Even the Floyd special can be a good unit with upgraded springs and a proper set up. Floydâs are not easy to master (setting up). It takes time and patience. But once you know how to do it, itâs hands down the best tuning stability available. If youâre looking at schecter, they are pretty good at sending their units out set up and ready to play. But just remember, if you change string gauges or tunings, it will throw the Floyd out of whack and youâll need to dial it back in. Floyd setups is spring tension vs string tension. A delicate balancing act. If you understand that concept, youâll be able to dial them in. There are two different types of mounts too. You have the flush mount (only dives down) and full floating (can be pulled either direction). Full floating is the best for me personally. Most people have a hard time figuring out how to set up Floydâs. But with enough reading and watching videos, you can become a pro. It took me a few months to get good at it. But Iâve been playing Floydâs for 30 yrs. so itâs second nature too me at this point. Good luck
@@ciaranw520 Tuning and stability are not 100% related to the floating bridge alone. As you heard Herman Li said his favorite tremolo is the Edge Zero. Any Floyd Rose will behave respectfully if set up correctly and doesn't have issues with wear or design flaws. I personally have 2016 Ibanez Jem 77BFP with Edge Zero2 and 1998 LTD which was the first year of their manufacturing and has a cheap licensed Floyd. The Jem has much thinner neck and headstock, and even with 0.9 strings there is a lot of movement in the whole instrument. The LTD is rock solid, the damn thing weights 10kg and nothing is moving, the cheap tremolo is nearly 25 years and with minor maintainance it does actually stay perfectly in tune no matter how much of abuse it takes....
The Floyd Rose 1000 sets itself apart from other lower quality Licensed Floyd bridges by using the higher quality metals that are used in the Original and Pro Floyd Rose models. I have a FR 1000 on my Solar V and it's the most stable trem I own, pretty much exactly the same as your results here, Herman. I put a stabilizer on it and increased the spring tension so I'm able to drop tune it using the fine tuners, EVH style, but even before I did that it was rock solid in terms of tuning stability.
I have one on my harley benton fusion and once you tune it you will never tune it again
Wow. Next bridge Will be 1000 FR. Actually I have Ibanez lo pro edge but I can't see how much is stable because I haven't a precise tuner like Herman :(
@@gorftz2863 i only tuned it when o changed the string and itbwas a like a month ago that sucker is still in tune but it's hard to fing guitars with floyd 1000 under a 1k the best bets are schecters and harley bentons
Harley benton fusion 2 fr and sc custom fr comes with floyd 1000 and that's the lowest you can find and schecter sun vally supershreder with burst finish also comes with floyd 1500 which is the same
I was gonna comment the same
Which stabilizer are you using ? Looking at the tremmory right now but not sure if its worth the 100 bucks.
This video was incredible. Thank you Herman!
These are some real valuable tips and tricks here. Thanks Herman đ€
Proper spring tension, string angle at the nut, and well lubed and maintained trem posts are the key. if youre having issues with tuning after you tighten the nut or use the whammy those 3 things are the first things you need to check. Sometimes its as simple as replacing the springs in back or installing a string tree or retainer bar on the head stock. Hope this helps someone!
I can't thank you enough. This was incredibly informative.
Thank you, Herman Li, for letting us know about how the position of the guitar affects the tuning. I tried that with my Dean CFR350 the other night and was surprised how off the tuning was.
Thank you for showing the actual tuning stability of those bridges. Very informative video
Holy smokes, you just filled a huge knowledge gap in my head! Thanks for sharing all of this, finally an insightful not-click-bait lesson (presented so chill it doesn't feel like one, but teaches you more than one). Props!!
Mind Blown over the tuning change on guitar angle.
5:45 haha this is why I love Herman! I was so scared of the headstock snapping
very informative demos ! thanks herman
Herman speaking about the position of the guitar when you tune is something that a lot of people really miss out, that affect a lot the tuning when you are playing live, I have an Ibanez RG270DX with a Gotoh GE1996T tremolo in it, that guitar stays incredibly in tune even abusing the whammy bar, what's the secret about the zero return point?, as Herman mention, the quality of steel is so important, The GE1996T and the LoEdge have a cool sharp blade that is touching the guitar studs so precise and helps with the return, but with the pass of time they get loose and impact to your tuning, so it is important to have a good edge touching between your trem and studs, another important thing is the lifetime of the springs, springs should be replaced each 2 or 3 years, depending the use of them, and one of the most important things (at least for me) is the lubrication between each metal component that is working in all the setup, from the screws that touch the claw of springs, the contact between claw and the spring, the spring and the trem block, the trem edge and the studs, the tremolo and the string, the string and the double locking nut. I use Big Bends Nut Sauce, this is the holy grial to fix or improve significantly the tuning stability.
That was far and away the best and most useful demonstration of tuning stability and instability, and what to realistically expect from a variety of Tremolo Bridge types and designs, and how to accommodate the performance of one's own bridge. I've considered getting various locking systems for my guitar, but having seen the demo, I don't think that would substantially improve the performance I'm already getting out of my Bladerunner Super-V Trem bridge. Thanks, Subscribed. đđ
I am LOVING this video. You are one of my fave guitarists and play the way I want to learn. I used to own a Fender in my late teens, now I know why I hated mine. I am learning a lot!! I am getting an Ibanez soon so I know Iâm in the right place lol. Love you Mr. Liđđ
High quality information on a niche part. Thank you, Herman Li. Ordered a guitar with original floyd on it, was told it was important:)
Loved it, great info!
this is therapy for me, just watching someone go through all the same pain I feel on a regular basis with the mechanics/intonation maintaining of guitars. The solutions are awesome, but my head and emotions feel not alone, haha!
Herman is so entertaining and the video is incredibly informative
Awesome video - answered a lot of questions and some cool tips and tricks and valid points
Very good information. Some of the most useful that I hadnât seen
Wow.... đđđ This is something new for my knowledge. Thank you for sharing the knowledge. Loving it
Wow. So much information. Thank you for sharing.
Dude thanks , we as guitar nerds love these kind of videos â„ïžâ„ïžâ„ïžâ„ïž
I never considered the angle of holding the guitar can change the tuning that much. Thank you for the video.
REALLY IMPORTANT WHEN SETTING INTONATION
Great information and wisdom.
It took me a long time to get my old Strat to go up and down well and return to tune. The fellow who bought my old guitar did not appreciate the subtle modifications I did to accomplish that. He was grateful I had not modified the guitar so that it could not be restored to original. After 40 years I have a Strat coming with a FR original and I am told that's so 80's. Well we shall see and hear how dated I am and sound. I appreciate the efforts and demonstration here. Our first piece is a serious piece never done before on an electric guitar. I don't have the chops but it is a 10 minute piece. Damn, did I bite
It off! Trying to impress and challenge the kid. He says he's willing to carry my amp. đ â€
Ive sat down to tune only needing to tune again when standing. Thought it was just more of my own crazy. Out of all the wierd guitar myths and truths I had never ever heard of this before! Thanks dude!
especially for old guitars changing the floyd springs is a life saver had an old universe i fought that guitar so much setting it up i finally i asked a tech said to change the springs and she play perfect now!
I bought a guitar with a fully floating Floyd back in 2013 and it took YEARS to figure most of this out and even today I still get frustrated with some tuning struggles! This video is great and honestly should be required viewing before you purchase a floating bridge guitar so you know what you're getting into. đ
Thank you for this video! Would love to hear you go into more depth on this subject. Tuning is the most important aspect of the guitar!
Primer video que veo en el que hablan con bases y fundamento acerca de la estabilidad de los diferentes tipos de puentes flotantes.buen trabajo herman li
Thank you for this!! I've started working on my "belly tuning compensation tone tuning" technique now! I luv the gravity demonstration too!!!
That was so much wisdom thanks!!
VERY VERY VERY INFORMATIVE VIDEO!
Amazing work
Thank you so much for free knowledge.đ€
thank you bro . Its realy intersting !
Absolutely good demonstration you are right brother nobody teachers these things or explains it properly yes very interesting thank you so much for that
Herman, I don't think I can live without a Floyd Rose anymore. lol. I love them! It DOES take a little time to set them up, but it's worth it in the end. I have become very fast at fixing these bridges nowadays. Great video, and I love some Dragonforce! Keep rocking, brother.
Very interesting and unexpected! I found your video while looking for tips on tuning and balancing Floyd Rose bridges. It`s a time-consuming task. I have an ESP Arrow 7. Just gotta say: thanks for Road of Resistance! Also very much enjoyed the Extreme Power Metal CD and hope to see you play live sometime soon. Keep up the good work.
Cool insight of the floating trem.
such a great video!!!!
thank you, I learned a lot
Very interesting, I had no idea the tunning changed like that just moving the Guitar around. Great info. Thanks. đđđŻ
Really good video. Thank you.
Thank you for this!)) I observed that tuning changes in dependence to position, but haven't thought it changes that much!
Thank you very much!!!... hugs from Lisbon, Portugal.
I bought an Ibanez RG as my first guitar with a floating trem and it's nice to know that it's normal for them to settle a little flat when you go down or a little sharp when you pull up.
I learnt to counter it the same way you said but it's not something I have ever heard people mention and being my first floating bridge I figured it must be a flaw with the Edge Zero.
Definitely gonna test this on my guitarsđ . Also was not aware tilting the guitar had that much effect on tuning. I also had a case of a neck not fastened tight enough to the body, which had a big impact as well. Thanks for discussing this important matterđđ€đŒđž
I've been battling this for years. The thing that seems to usually improve it for me, is making sure the locknut is tight. Not the clamps, I mean the mounting screws. Also the neck bolts. Just did that to my Ibanez RG and it definitely helped.
I hate having to train myself to dump the trem or bend a string after each pull-up. I've had Strats before where that was mandatory. For them, I use Nut Sauce everywhere, even the bridge saddles. I've had pretty good luck with that so far.
Really interesting and informative video Mr Herman, I'm a bassist but I play guitar as well, i was thinking about buying a guitar with a Floyd to try and this video helps a lot
Thanks very informative!!
Great info dude đ€đ€đ€
Very cool info from a touring guitarist! Usually guitarists don't bother that much, but you do!
I have 5 guitars with whammy bars (2 lo-pro edge, 1 edge pro, 1 ofr, 1 schaller) and you say all my thoughts in your video!
That was really cool!! I never tried the "hold the guitar face up / down and check the tuning" thing... fascinating. Just to add more info to your tests though, I've got a very old Jackson that I had an original Floyd Rose installed in as the Schaller it came with wouldn't stay in tune at all. And Just like you saw with your Floyd Roses here, whether I go down / up with the bar it comes back in tune every time just fine without having do a jolt or purr on the bar. The Ibanez's I have do not do that and have the exact same problems you show here in that if you pull up on the bar, you have to jolt the bar down some how to get it back in tune.
Interesting story though from back in 2009ish when this was driving me crazy. A guitar tech I talked to in Los Angeles that happened to be working at a Sam Ash music before they closed their stores mentioned how, and this is his opinion, that it has to do with the knife edges of the tremolo unit and how it sits on the posts. By knifes edge, I mean when you take the tremolo unit off the guitar, the two points of contact where the unit touches the posts. Sometimes the knifes edge on the Ibanez tremolo units don't quite form a fine enough point, so he recommended to file these two points down to make sure the edge is as fine as you can make it. I tried this with one of my Ibanez's that has an original Edge Tremolo (not the Lo Pro or II or variants), and sure enough, while it didn't fix the issue completely, it did make it noticeably better.
Anyways, this was a great video!! Thanks for the info and great playing!! :)
you just solved all my problems with my sterling majesty guitar, thank you herman!
You give me hope. Just got one of those.
Playing for 8 years never knew about any of these!!! This definitely helps
Very useful video! đ€đ»
Hell yeah McRocklin!
Actually, my guitar teacher back in the day indeed mentioned the "pulling back in the opposite direction" when I was still playing a regular strat-type guitar without a locking whammy bar system. So I kept doing that trick once I was playing guitars with Floyd Roses. Because I did have the impression that it slightly improved the pitch accuracy after returning from a dive / whammy-bar pull. But I never examined it as systematically as you did here. Seeing that even your high-end guitars with Floyd Roses don't completely return to original tune, that kind of makes me question whether Floyd Roses are as much needed as I've been thinking for all those years.
Given that even with non-locking whammy bars, if you pull back up so that the strings fully slide back through the nut, that can still also work. Not too surprising if you think about it, though - people have been playing strats and using their whammy bars for decades, after all. I still feel "safer" with my guitars having Floyd Rose systems (I guess they're also licensed on the Schecter Hellraiser series), but anyone who plays a more standard strat-type guitar with a regular whammy bar might get by just fine if they keep doing that "push / pull in the opposite direction trick". It's just less reliable without the added stability of the locking nut, I'd assume.
Main benefit of the floyd rose is range. Strat trems do the job, but they don't do the same job. Locking nut is simply a necessity at this point, not just for tuning stability but preserving your tuners and nut.
Your tone is wicked man!
Such a great demonstration. Iâm gonna try stabilizers. Floating tremolos are the bane of my existence.
this is so great and entertaining content!!
Thank you for the push-pull trick to get it back to perfect tune, my 7 string Floyd Rose 1000 occasionally does that and it makes things so much easier!
Now if I could only get my Jackson Floyd Rose on my King V to stay in tune for more than three songs lol.
Nice! Thx for info!
Great video man!
Thanks a lot Herman, i thought i was the only one who faced this problem. Nobody really talks about this.
I like that he talked about what us common folk use, I do have a dean with a Floyd ross special that actually stays in tune better than my Ibanez RG (that I no longer own), the Ibanez was the cheapest RG I could find so it is understandable.
i learn this from experience, i thought thats my guitar defect, but now i know this happen to all floating bridge. thank for the information herman
Extremely difficult not to like this guy. Thanks for the demonstrations and your time Herman
Great research
Amazing, been playing for 20 years and I didn't ever notice this.
Excellent details. We are trying with stabiliser. Thanks
Thank you very much! No one really talks about these things
Iâm kinda shocked by how well the Floydâs did, and never knew flipping the guitar around would change it that much. I suspect the mass of the bridge is effecting that. Cool vidya boss.
This was a great video in terms of the info shared and the comparisons, but the only bridges missing were the original Ibanez Edge, and the Gotoh shown at the end.
Great video!
Thank you for the comparisons. I not seen your site before.
I am very much a Gibson LP player but have a couple of strats which keep there tuning reasonably well with use of moderate tremolo/vibrato use as long as you don't do massive dives.
I have a old US Peavey Tracer with a Licenced Floyd rose by Kahler - spider trem it is a night mare keep in tune it was bought 2nd hand in 2002 maybe it worn not sure.
I also have a Ibanez Jem 77p with a Zero edge II which is sort of OK.
But with today's technology surely some one must eventually come up with a more reliable trem/Vibr system.
Love it Brother Li..
i actually never knew this, thanks
This was very helpful Herman. I just got my first floyd rose guitar and was getting confused as to why it was going way out of tune.
Awesome video! I always thought my Flodyded guitars were defecto when they wouldnt return to pitch after pulling up. I would always have to bend the G, or, hit the bar to re-zero the tuning. Now I know that's pretty much the way it is.
ty for the details :)
Tune it as you would be holding it to play. Such a great tip Herman.