Quattro vs Quattro | Which has Real AWD?
Vložit
- čas přidán 17. 12. 2018
- We talk about the difference between Audi's famous Quattro All-Wheel Drive systems. Next, we go through a history lesson on the various versions of Quattro, starting with the Audi models from the early 1980s. Then we finish up with the pros and cons of comparing the Haldex and Torsen all-wheel drive systems.
Links Talked about in this video
Gen 2 Haldex Upgrade (MK5 R32, 8P Audi A3 06-08.5, MK2 TT 08-08.5)
www.shopdap.com/haldex02-1088...
Gen 4 Haldex Upgrade (Tiguan 1, Tiguan 2, CC 09-17, B6 Passat 08.5-2010)
www.shopdap.com/haldex04-1139...
Gen 4 Haldex Upgrade (Audi A3 09-13, MK2 Audi TT 08.5-14, MK2 Audi TTS, MK6 Golf R)
www.shopdap.com/haldex04-1139...
Shop for VW and Audi Parts Here
shopdap.com
----------------------------------------------------
VW AUDI Specialty Repair Cornelius NC
www.daprepair.com/vw-repair-c...
VW AUDI Specialty Repair Kent Ohio
www.daprepair.com/vw-repair-a...
----------------------------------------------------
More info on DAP Reward Credit
shopdap.com/store/rewardpoint...
Citations
www.awdwiki.com/en/quattro+evo...
www.audi-technology-portal.de... - Auta a dopravní prostředky
- We appreciate your Support and Purchases! -
Find all the parts for your VW or Audi! - Shopdap.com
Traction wise, Haldex is very good. Where you really feel it is in the dynamics of the car. Haldex cars tend to feel like front wheel drive with infinite traction.
Golf R owner here. A little hurt, but whatever... Faux Wheel Drive is better than Front Wheel Drive.
There’s nothing wrong with haldex cars. It’s all in good fun. There are a ton of RS3 and or TTRS running 10s with Haldex.
@@Deutscheautoparts I know, I was playing... Sort of, lol... You did sort go all out for like 10 minutes on my car, lol, but it's cool. I knew I wasn't buying an STI. I live in San Diego, so full time AWD isn't really my aim. I'm just a sucker for awesome VW's and this 2017 R is amazing. My next car is going to be an RS3 or S4... Shall I assume your preference is the S4? Looking for genuine advice from an expert.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haldex_Traction
@@nathanlangford3113 You living in land of muscle cars, and driving golf???? If you love german car buy porsche 911 993😉
@@generationx227 Porsche is my favorite brand. Can't stand shitty American cars.
The best explanation of the two systems that I’ve ever heard...perfectly explained and illustrated ..
I now know my mk1 tt has fraud wheel drive.....love it.
Totally agree! I haven't seen any videos like this on youtube. Thank you Paul!
The 1.8 mk1 TT is a very underrated car, the haldex system leaves it at no disadvantage against other Quattro systems, it has unbelievable grip as long as you don't lift your foot off the throttle the rear wheels won't disengage.
YES!
Great video on both systems!
As a TT Mk2 owner, the question of the "lifetime" haldex filter often comes up in our forum. The bottom line is all Mk2's Haldex have a filter that should be changed when the fluid is changed.
The confusion became apparent when I was discussing it with my Audi Service center. it turns out that from 2007-2009 the "3.2 quattro+" (JZX, JJN, JUY, KJU, KNS) parts diagram is shown WITH a filter while the "quattro" (KMC, IMD, MMO, MMK) is shown WITHOUT a filter.
From 2010-2015 only the "quattro" (MMK, MML, PYG, PYH) is shown WITHOUT a filter. There are no illustrations of the 3.2 quattro+ WITH a filter, or any parts lists for it during this period.
In addition, the pump should also be removed and the strainer on the end cleaned. It's actually one of two filters in the Haldex system.
I have no idea why Audi's parts list has an illustration with the filter and one without and then elected to keep publishing it without one from 2010 onwards. But hopefully this may help explain why dealerships and garages always argue "There's no filter for a Haldex". They're both right and wrong depending on where they're looking.
Bottom line, when you get your Haldex fluid changed, replace the filter and clean the pump strainer! If necessary, explain this in detail to your service guy or they will not do it as it's not part of Audi's Standard Operating Procedure for Haldex service.
www.ttforum.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=19&t=1850793
.
This was a great video! It can actually be hard to track down real information about these systems and you managed to condense everything and demystify it. Much appreciated. Subscribed.
A6 Allroad BiTDi owner here. Love my car. A true tank in the snow
Wish I'll get one soon
The quality of the videos are fantastic. Always solid information when I watch. Please keep up the great information for us all.
What a GREAT video!! VERY informative, thanks for posting!
Excellent presentation sir. Everything I wanted to know but was afraid to ask.
Zen Den me too
this is the best, most comprehensive, amazing video on these systems on the internet. thank you so much for this video. great job
Coming from 3 Subaru STI's to my current Audi S3 I have to say I'm impressed with the Haldex, good snow tires and I would say it's every bit as capable on snow and icy roads, even deep snow is no problem as long as I'm not high centered. Just as fast, a hundred times more comfortable and fuel economy is about 5mpg better, and I don't look like a spoiled high school kid driving around anymore. Great video!
Don't lie to yourself. I can bet you miss the dynamics from the STI-s (if you really had one). You just can't compare that fake awd, with the subaru awd... especially if it's a STI.
He is right. I had an sti as well and now an RS3. The rs3 has less understeer than the RS3 and way more fun in the snow.
Octavian George I had 3 and haven’t looked back... 09, 14, 16. STI’s are fun cars but I like the Audi more in every way.
@@octaviangeorge5455 I would say he lucked out. There are a lot of STI's that can't be cured and you have to keep them forever.
@@djpat1200s sure, I can understand that. Everyone likes what they like. But you just can't say the audi haldex 4x4 is close to the STI awd. Because is not. That "4x4" acts like a fwd car, and just when the front wheels slips send power to the back (and just 50 %, as the videos says). Take your car at a track, or drive it close to it limits, and you will see the differences.
I own an Audi A3 with second-gen Haldex. In everyday driving, it's an awesome system. It's there when you need it. The fuel consumption is pretty good also at 6l/100km.
thats perfectly fine for a daily driver imo
Amazing video & thanks for the great explanations! I enjoyed the demo videos as well. Nice improvements to the video & keep it up!
this is awesome, ive learnt heaps about my 8p a3 20.t quattro and ive always wondered how the awd system really does work and this has taught me heaps, thank you lots.
The most informative video I've seen yet on this topic! Thank you. How did you get the bias numbers for each generation? Logging or just from documentation? I always thought it was 90/10 because of gen 1, but never heard about the changes in gen 2, 4, 5. Interesting stuff!
Thanks, a great video, I've been looking for something that compares these differences for a while. The strange thing is I had one of the first TT's a 220 Quattro and that didn't feel like a FWD in terms of handling and it wore the tyres like you would expect of a full time 4WD, i.e. pretty equal all round where you would expect to scrub the fronts out using a primarily FWD system
Thank you, at last I have been able to find someone who can do a great explanation of how the Haldex all wheel drive system works on my Audi TT Mk 1. Even better you have compared how the system compares to normal four wheel drive including pro's and con's of each. Thanks for doing a great informative and interesting video :)
I have been looking for this video for long time! Thanks !!!
This is surprisingly good
For once, CZcams recommended quality content !
Excellent comparison!!
Very nice video, glad Youtbe randomly recommended me this. Thanks! I've been considering buying an old Audi TT but I had no idea it's not Torsen-based Quattro AWD system.
Wow
Txn for these infos!
Clear!
Well made!
Kind of information I don't need but really interseted to learn precisely!
Subbed, because this video is fantastic!
Awesome Vid!, thanks for explaining a much heated debate on the audi world. :)
Great video! Loved the detailed breakdown of both systems!
I like watching your video keep it up.. love how in depth and how organized your videos are..
This is great. Gen 1 and 2 quattro enthusiast here. If you have not experienced one of these in the snow, do it! The gen 1 is a huge favorite, plus the lockable center and rear diff is a neat feature, albeit rarely needs used. I did find the humor in Haldex being "fake" awd. I use that a lot on newer Audi/VW friends, jokingly of course...sort of ;) Nice video!
own a S3 8L, have 350kw, have had the Haldex modded and once one understand how to properly drive it and use it, feels like going around a corner on rails.......
I would rather stick to my Lancer with AYC ;D
Very funny! :)
I have a Saab 9-3 Turbo X 6MT. This uses the Gen 4 Haldex, but has E-LSD in the rear. Absolutely fantastic AWD system put a lot of Subarus to shame this past storm here on hard, long life commuter tires.
In addition, I'm not sure about Audi, but the SAAB can put up to 85% to even a single rear tire if needed...
I, too, would prefer a torsen mechanical as far as simplicity, robustness and life expectancy of course, but as far as function goes the E-LSD in the rear of this Gen 4 is exceptional.
Thank you for educating us. The beauty of the web. You don’t have to spend so much money to learn something anymore.
Very entertaining video, answered all the questions I had when researching this topic
Nice video man and nice breakdown of the Gen one Haldex! As an avid Mk1 TT enthusiast and aspiring Motorsports driver, there are solid solutions to turn the sluggish reactive Haldex into a reactive weapon!
For example, HPA and UM both provide solutions to manipulate clamping conditions including those based off of throttle positions and engagement under heavy breaking as well. Biggest advantage is that in the 8.5 years of heavy exposure with the car and it's community, I have yet to see any documentation of a failed or failing Haldex system due to over stressing (this is of course assuming proper maintenance due to increased abuse). The thing is nearly bullet proof and takes the abuse like a champ!
I think this shit is great. Thanks so much for doing videos like this. Makes you appreciate all the systems so much more. Cool.
Really great video, needed something to better help me understand what lies underneath my 2018 S5. Very glad I went for the optional sports diff on the rear now!
this was very educational, good vid.I have that mk1 TT model
Love it how the TT mk1 still looks a modern car!!
No, it doesn't at all. It looks like it was designed with Y2K in mind. Which, might I add, happened to be almost 20 years ago. When did this car debut? Oh yeah. 20 years ago.
@@nickbrownfield3694 Thats your opinion i have mine!!! Name me a car from the 2000 era that still looks good like the tt mk1 interior and exterior
@@quattrorsq8558 tt and s2k still look good today :)
@@quattrorsq8558 Honda 2000
Fester Bestertester Honda 2000 reminds me a bigger version of the mx5 plus the interior of the Honda 2000 looks out of date compare with the interior of TT mk1,nice car tho don't get me wrong but i think Audi did an amazing job designing the TTmk1 and it will be a future classic for sure!!!
I have had a 2001 MK 1 225 Quattro TT coupe for 17 years. And regardless of the Haldex's supposed shortcomings, it has been great in the snow with all season tires and awesome with winter tires. It works so well in both snow and other slippery conditions that I am thinking that maybe those Audi engineers knew something.
Great in depth video. Thx for the effort you put in this video ❤️
I never new this. Keep teaching me new things. I live in Gastonia NC, I need to swing thru your shop for my b5.5.
According to wikipedia the 2.7 million USD Bugatti Chiron uses Haldex Four Wheel drive system.
military vehicles too
Bugatti is owned by VW.
Makes sense because the engine is in the back. The majority of the power should remain in the back
In front engined cars haldex is worst
Yup..! It's coming from the V.A.G. concern too. Finally, a Bugatti that can actually drive without constantly being in the garage for service.
Was getting ready to fire up my flamethrower after the first half of the video - good thing I kept watching. My RS3 might be faux wheel drive but you wouldn't know it from just driving it. I was able to get some fun rear-end-slide outs in the snow last week without even turning traction control off.
In any scenario where i want 100% power going to my rear wheels, I'd be in an M3, not an Audi anyway. But there are other reasons I preferred the RS3 (and have been very much enjoying it).
Great video. I absolutely love my 98 B5 A4 1.8t Quattro. That little thing is a beast in terms of walking through snow, wet roads, even mud to a certain extent. Mine has the 5spd manual and a decent k04 turbo upgrade...so I definitely get slightly less gas mileage - lol.
I had to search for a while to find one that had that setup...without being ragged out by someone running 25+ psi! It's a fun little car...it actually came with the AEB head and all.
For an all around fun little project - it checked every box that I wanted it to come with. By the time I'm done...it'll be my little toy from here on out. I actually had a daily driver already when I bought this...so the limited space wasn't a big problem.
I have been absolutely amazed at the handling and the ability of this little sleeper! It's just a little 1.8l with a big turbo...so it's not smoking Mustangs and other sports cars - but for a little 4 banger with awd...it'll blows people's minds routinely, lol. Like I mentioned earlier - I bought it for a project - I had always liked the Audi sedans of that era...before they came with a massive amount of fluff that nobody really needs...and I was originally looking for the s4 with the 2.8 or possibly even the 4.2l v8...but as I searched...I came to appreciate the 1.8 turbo and decided that I would go with it and just upgrade to a big turbo setup. I like the versatility - and with the exception of finding upgrade parts for the AEB - it's not real difficult to find whatever I want pretty reasonably priced.
The quattro like my B5 - especially with the 1.8t and 5spd manual setup - is a great little car for a custom build project. IMHO anyway. There aren't too many extras to worry with...and you don't have to be a top notch import mechanic to end up with a pretty nice, decent priced, easily maintained, custom project that turns heads and inspires smiles pretty much everywhere I take it - yet at the end of the day - it wouldn't completely crush me if I had to start all over again.
A good friend of mine told me not long ago that "Although he's not at all surprised that I am so hopelessly in love with a sexy German beauty - practically HALF my age....she's not quite how he pictured her!"
Good detailed info, thanks. I have an A6 (C7) 3.0 with non-faux all wheel drive and I love it. I've gotten use to the front-heavy feeling of the car, and really appreciate its performance here in 🇨🇦.
So as the owner of a B7 Auto and Manual and a 2017 GTI, I have to say that while I LOVE Quattro and will always own a Quattro vehicle, there is something to be said for dailying a car with just front wheel drive for fuel economy. Also, if you haven't test driven the Mark 7/7.5 please do yourself a favor and check it out. It's absolutely uncanny how much performance is packed into this Golf.
His previous shop car was a mk7 GTI
Nobody cares about Golf man,it's VW. Dull and cheap. Even if it has space shuttle engine and can go around the Earth in a minute. You park it. It's still a Golf. And a disgusting VW.
@@eleonik76 lol, which is exactly why people care about it. It doesn't stick out, it looks just like any other golf. Not everyone is 2fast2furious racer boy
@@eleonik76 U do realize VW owns audi right? Lol noob
@@betterwithrum Do I look like a F&F rice boy? With 2 kids,at my 43,working at BOSCH,would be laughable to be. Every car brings association with something. Volvo with safety, Mercedes and Lexus for luxury,BMW and Porsche for both,sport and fun,Honda reliability and sport..etc. The only association you can make about the VW brand is dull,bland, usually broken boxes which most car reviewers, sponsored by VW claim to be overall fun and practical car to drive. Give me a brake and go blend with..what was it again?
Haldex Gen 1 was not only found in the Audi TT! At the same time they were also found in the MK4 GTI’s and Golfs in Europe.
You can also get a performance parts for the first gen Haldex system.
Well thats because the TT is basically a Golf 4 R32 or 1.8t 4Motion. Most parts are interchangeable.
@@Flowxing It was also found on various Volvos and Fords....
But its called 4Motion, and this video is about quattro
@@Veiee Shame shit.
@@danielg2923 True
Great explanation! I've actually driven the mk1 tt and currently own a a4 b8!! obviously the Torsen is the way to go just because you get that throw into the seats but in my driving experience I think Acuras Sh awd is probably one of the best awd systems using torque vectoring. Quattro engages the brakes a lot in the snow which is safer I guess but Sh awd makes me feel like I'm in Tokyo drift and powers out of any corner. For the simplistically of Quattro torsen being almost fully mechanical other than sensor monitoring it for brake application I prefer it.
Good point on the handling advantages of transverse engines with the Haldex set up. I remember jumping out of my 8N TT into a B6 A4 (a loan car) when the TT went in for a service. The TT was always front heavy, but it was nothing compared to the big lump hanging out the front of the A4. Compared to the TT, the A4 turned into corners grudgingly, even at moderate speeds.
Hilarious! How did you keep a straight face? My guess is you don't like the faux wheel drive system. Forgery wheel drive! Dude, this is your best video! Love it and I learned a lot.
@Scott Youngblood In a straight line
@@37rmstrong Hmm... Have you seen them on the track? They do a lot more than just straight lines. The RS3 has no problem matching the lap times of an M2. Granted, if we were talking Torsen, it would rule the roost - but Haldex is what we have, and it does a pretty great job in this generation, with the more aggressive engagement that the Audi Sport models have.
@@08DarkSi ... but an M2 with 40 less hp. Also, with expert racers.
I don't think too many people think Audi's and the Golf R are better track cars than their rwd competition.
I don't have a problem with it. I'm ok with my Golf R being the GT car compared to it's direct competition.
Either way, it's not that big a deal, their is very little between these cars.
its 8o@@37rmstronglook ooouup9ljp7kikii6n
@Scott Youngblood The Lamborghini's and R8 use a reverse haldex system, as the engine is on the rear wheels, so it acts like a 4wd, where it is 100rear 0front, but can be 50/50
I'm still happy with the AWD system in my 2018 S3. With winter tires, it's just as good as by 2015 Subaru Forester XT was.
It was all in good fun. Haldex is a great system!
Do you really just compared that fake awd system with the symethrical awd? :D
Bullshit
That's not really saying much.
A fantastic explanation ! Keep up the great work!!
Best classic tech video on YT, but in the future I expect 4-electric-engine drives with fully electronic control.
I would like to watch a video with the same quality as this one about the AWD system that is on current TTRS and RS3.
Thank you
They have the newest gen haldex.
Controller upgrades to the GEN 1 Haldex systems were also available: Blue and Orange controllers.
I had a couple MK1 TTs with the upgraded Blue controller. They worked great in Minnesota snow.
awesome video! I am new to this platform. I moved on from an old school gc8 subar to a 2004 Audi S3. I am happy with the car :)
Great video...WOW! Even after all these years the Mk 1 TT is still a lovely looking car.
You can set up more traction to the rear in Gen V in VagCom.... That said, I think my old "real" quattro is still better than my decades newer Haldex system. Also, when I do launch control, those rear clutch packs "Grunt" on take off (Stage II with TCU tune also). I think the biggest difference for me is on-limit handing which is much worse in my Haldex hot-rodded S3 than my old Big-Turbo Torsen A4. The A4 you could tail out like an M3, but the S3 even after thousands in suspension and chassis mods, still won't rotate and ends in understeer.
That's exactly where the Haldex fails the most. People compare snow performance, but it's on a track where you're seeing the biggest drawbacks of the system.
It creates this weird feedback where if you're on low acceleration mid-corner you've got very little grip and you're understeering, yet when you accelerate the balance shifts backwards really fast which suddenly gives you grip, making the whole behaviour inconsistent and unpredictable.
Basically you need to be well on the throttle during the entirety of the corner. If you've let your foot off the gas you're going straight. Not realistic at all, and quite inconsistent on top of it.
I've got both a B5 quattro and a Skoda 4x4 with gen4 Haldex. Having no ESP at all, the quattro is more willing to send the power to the rear axle on throttle while removing much of the power from the front. This makes it predicatable for me on snow as it will act like an RWD, sending the car into fishtailing and still remain in the curve while also responding to countersteering. From that point, it can be held on track with throttle. The Skoda on the other hand, will not go into a spin with ESP. With ESP off, the turn has to be entered with no throttle (since revving would make the front axle spin and understeer) and even then it needs a lot of work to keep the drift, because the front wheels lose the ability to steer once the start to slip.
Exactly i have a b5 and feel the same. Almost rwdish
Very informative! Thank you for sharing
Awesome video, very informative. Thanks! 👍🏻
Haldex is from Sweden. Before haldex vw 4 wheel drive was called synchro.
Volvo and saab use also haldex.
ilir swe🇸🇪 syncro*
I used to have an S60R and it had haldex, upgraded to my 13' S5 and got it tuned and now I'm spinning all 4 on launches
synchro is true all time awd. haldex is used in more brands. saab was getting latest haldex gen, since it's their domestic brand
Nice video, however max 50/50 torque split for haldex is not exactly correct, that is just in static terms. But the actual, dynamic torque split may go much beyond that value, in theory almost to 0/100, in reality rather up to 10/90. This system cannot spin rear wheels faster than front ones, but it can send much more than 50% of torque to the rear.
Is this due to the energy lost through the prop and rear diff .
@@jemdoratl5139 That's a function of grip and weight transfer.
i have a 2002 audi tt quat and a lot of thanks to the guy who made this video very informative to the point's thank you very much really enjoyed it.
I have a 2015 Golf 7 with the Haldex 5. It works way better than I thought, great system for everyday driving. And the reaction to the rears when losing grip with the front wheels is just ridiculous. It’s as if the car is a full time awd. I’m impressed!
There are upgrade modules for Gen1 Haldex also, highly recommended (I got the blue unit). They engage based on throttle pedal position. 40/60 torsen feels much more RWD like and TT requires very different driving style and is harder to drift. This is also due short wheel base and very nose heavy design vs A4.
Could you give info,where did you get the blue one?
I also wanna know
I think the company was HPA that made these, likely obsolete product now. There are other standalone units for mk1 Haldex, google helps. Also inserts that lock the haldex ratio, but those likely shorten the drivetrain lifetime.
I don't know man, I have haldex in my MK1 TT 3.2 VR6 and she rips in the snow and wet weather. Never have grip issues, it hauls ass. Deep snow or anything, I've never had issues. I understand he calls it's fraud wheel drive but god damn does it work well all wheel drive wise.
Yeah I have the 1.8t it’s amazing in the corners it doesn’t snow much in the winter where I’m from but it’s fun it grass after rain
I never really understood the haldex system until I watched this video, assumed quattro was 4wd. I too have a mk1 tt 3.2 v6 and have similar experiences to you when driving. I can't fault the system.
should i buy a mk1/mk2 a3 with this quattro. I'm especially intrested in 1.8T and 2.0 fsi
corners at 250 km/h in a tt 3.2 mk1 are priceless. competitors must slowdown, audi tt keeps rolling on.
I also don't know driving a gt3071r tt and gt3071r s3 8l... And also a c5 quatrro so I can compare... Wtf
Thanks for the in depth info! 1966 beetle, 2016 gti, 2016 audi tts. My first quattro! Kinda wish it was full time awd! Still love the car!
upgraded from 4motion to Quattro.. Very insightful video
What should have been the number one Pro for for Haldex is packaging. The Haldex system can easily be packaged for a transverse engine unlike a Torsen or Crown gear setup. Also, in the current longitudinal AWD a Torsen center differential isn't used anymore but a Crown gear center differential. Also, recently the Longitudinal cars are getting the alleged Quattro with Ultra systems which acts pretty much like the Haldex does. It can completely disengage AWD too. In Haldex, the driveshaft to the rear always spins and a clutch pack engages the rear diff. Quattro Ultra can even stop the driveshaft. The longitudinal cars such as the Allroad and Q5 lost that permanent connection to the rear wheels and can send 100% torque to the front axle just like Haldex. The longitudinal S and RS cars will maintain the Crown gear for now but Quattro with ultra is finding it's way into the longitudinal line up. The explanation in this video is dated (Crown gear replacing Torsen, Quattro with Ultra) and the landscape has changed recently. There isn't just two systems.
One of the advantages you list for the so called torsen system (crown gear actually on your car) is the possibility of adding a rear sport differential. That is not a system capability per say but a audi choice. Volvo had some Haldex cars with a torque vectoring rear. It can be done with both Crown gear and Haldex systems but Audi only does it for some longitudinal cars.
Matthew Gaines It dated possibly ‘cos they’re marketing Haldex upgrades?
You rock MG! I did not see ur comment before posting mine, watching on my silly little phone. Tks for the add info. One thing I was wondering is it 100% or 85% for the crown? Tks again!
@@changounchained2648
Crown works similarly to Torsen where there is always torque going to both axles. The amount can vary but it never sends power to just one axle. It is truly full-time. Quattro Ultra can send 100% to the front axle unlike Torsen and Crown gear.
QUATTRO !!!!
the world's best permanent all-wheel drive.
Rolls eyes
The Subaru system is better
AikarambaNorway no
Sean Durham It’s a lot better. I have years of experience with both. Search up some real tests on CZcams.
Suryateja GT lol, so definetly not. Not by a mile. You should really look at some tests. I used to think Quattro was the best too
Yes. Keep doing videos like this. This was great.
Oh and do a mk7 is38 install video while you're at it.
Superb video about the quattro system. Thank you!
I have the Sport Diff in my S4. Everyone says you NEED it, but I beg to differ. Im not racing my car everyday...
What about the HPA gen 1 Haldex controller? This makes the car either front wheel drive for fuel economy or full time yes full time 50/50 split!
I got one for Christmas if you guys wanted to do a video on it?
@@sonarbug Yes please!
Tank you . Now I finally understand how it works the Torsen and Haledex sistem . I have an A 3 with Haldex sistem , obviously ,but I’ve never had any problems in the winter season ...and the winter season ,where I work ,there’s a lot of snow ( Dolomites ,Italy )
Excellent video and illustration. Perhaps an updated video on the latest tech would be useful.
The TT is a Haldex (Not actually Quattro but a Volkswagen 4Motion because it has no space to fit a Torsen) and the S4 has Torsen which is "Actual Quattro" because it can fit one, this has always been the case with smaller vs. bigger Audis, old S3s for example were as small as the TT and Golf so they had Haldex instead of Torsen.
The main difference is that Torsen is always on and Haldex isn't.
переведите на русский
ok but the most important part of any drive system is the tyres ie i have a landrover 1990 defender with BF goodridge MS and have fitted air locking diffs (never got it stuck) also i have a 1982 Audi quattro turbo flying fin replica which summer time Michelin 225/15 winter time proper soft compound snow tyres best of both worlds only downside is exhaust on Audi which rots quickly
Thank you for it! Waiting for Sport diff narrative!!
Huge fan of my Torsen-based B6 A4 Avant! But I also adore the Mk4 R32 as well as the new Mk3 TTRS/RS3. Love AWD no matter how it's delivered!
I just did a service on my haldex system on my mk7 4motion wagon and it cost me $25 for the fluid and took 10 minutes, so the service cost is minimal
Are u a mechanic or did you watch how to do it on youtube?
@@vroomgc sort of both... one bigger bolt at the bottom of the system to drain and the bottle of fluid with some 1/4" hose taped to the bottle, into a smaller bolt hole at top of the system to fill. Fill until fluid comes out of the fill hole
@@vroomgc I took a course in automotive service technology in 2012, but all my experience is DIY. I'm a Software Developer
What about the Haldex filter? Did you replace that?
Rob Gray should be replaced on each 60k km
Haldex is actually what we all want in every car. FWD for the day to day, because lets be honest, when on earth do we actually need 4WD? (Apart from the one and only time you do a hard launch in your new car), and 4WD when the a few bad winter days arrive. Perfect.
water, bad conditions like sand on the road.... Many reasons why to use a torsen system. The difference in mpg is not that great.
Thank you! Finally someone did a comprehensive comparison between real Quattro and a new Quattro-Ultra (Haldex)!
Quattro Ultra is not haldex, that's entirely different system.
the vid i ve been looking for thanks !
He pokes fun at Haldex BUT Haldex is used in the Bugati Chiron and Lamborghini's. Neither of which have cost or fuel consumption as a design requirement.
Bruh you're silly. The R8 and huracan (haldex isnt used in the aventador) are different conversations because they are the opposite of the TT line. The engine is in the back so it's full time RWD and part time AWD. That's a totally different conversation than debating performance for fwd/awd vs true awd. Learn before you post. -2017 TTS owner.
@@xynurse6095 You are an imbecile and you should learn something about the subject before you comment.
R8 is not Haldex, Lambo Aventador is Haldex
XY Nurse R8 uses a system called Viscous Coupling
@@An.Individual lol you kidding! You can't argue the actual point and should have just shut up. That makes you look so young.
Well, my fraud 2001 TT quattro behaved excellently in the snow compared to the drivers stuck on the side of the road trying to put snow chains on their cars.
winter tire is all you need when the roads are properly maintained and salted
Big fan of the torsen setup in my b8.5. would have been great to go over the interaction with esp. as esp is key for haldex performance. S4 torsen esp also impacts dry driving as well as snow/ off road completely differently. Usually stops wheel spin on torsen, for haldex mainly switches power between wheels. Only limit for torsen is when two wheels off the ground on opposite sides it gets confused, once esp switched off torsen performance better off-road. With torsen you also don't have 20-25% drivetrain loss between bhp and awhp (engine to wheel) like transverse haldex setup.
Looking forward to your video about the quattro system in the audi e-tron! :-)
Ferrite wheel drive!
@15:50 TT with Haldex still gets away quicker though, doesn’t it? 😉
Stuart McConnachie judging by the tire profile it seems tt has winter tyres. Four wheel system cant fix that
It just gets out of a frame. Look, camera is following S4, but doesn't follow TT, so it's hard to say which one got away quicker.
Also TT is probably less powerful, so it may spin less because of that
@@ramziakas151 And probably the TT is lighter so more agile than the heavier and more inertial S4.
@@Gazseee you are probably right as well
Gen 1 Haldex also have an upgrade and makes a huge difference.
stergiostn6S3 how to get this upgrade? By soft?
Siggy I think from HPA
Siggy i have this one www.jbsautodesigns.co.uk/review/3760/1/
it`s the controller of the haldex unit. Two bolt and a connector. Easiest mond.
stergiostn6S3 price?
@@Haldexify 650 before 4-5 years
Amazing! Great explanation!!
Very informative, thanks a lot!
Torsen reacts without any delay, constantly switching power, without usage of computer and sensors it is purely mechanical. Haldex have delay, sensors have to detect slip, then computer acitvate valve then it will put power on rear axle.
Haldex is better lol. You wont notice the haldex delay. It's about .01 seconds. I have a 16 s3
@@The32694 2016 s3 have active haldex which is controlled by controller in such manner to prevent slip (for example, each time You are taking off your S3 is locked in 50:50 split).
Torsen is superior, because it reacts faster, it can switch in wider bias, and is maintenace free. Haldex major pro is fuel consumption- when You are driving 90kph your S3 is just FWD car.
Haldex is used only in transvelsal engine cars, because implementation of torsen would be too expensive.
Haldex could be mounted in longitudal engine configurations, but Audi keeps mounting Torsen in A4, S4, RS4, A5, S5, RS5, A6, S6, RS6, A7, S7, RS7, A8, S8, R8, Q7. Why? Because torsen is better drivetrain than haldex.
@@motoNudziarz the Audi r8 uses haldex
@@The32694 I am wrong, as much as You are...
It is visco clutch as in panda 4x4, but controlled by computer.
Chiron and Aventador use Haldex, but they are RWD with front engaged by computer controlled clutch
@@motoNudziarz right. I think the haldex is superior for launching
A friend of mine went on the track with a 8l S3, summer tires, the way the Haldex was reacting was awful and can be dangerous if you are not aware of how it works. If the car was understeering a bit on throttle, it kicked the torque to the rear really fast and suddenly oversteer like a pig, about as violent as if you would have pulled the ebrake. To heavy, too slow, didn't know what to do with the torque, garbage to me. On the other hand, I have a 01" A6 c5 quattro, torsen, on dry or rain, really safe, on snow, that's cheating, stable like a freight train, even on worn snow tires. I know that newer gen Haldex work well, faster, better in every way. Still not the real Quattro
Yea you really need to retune the system for track use. It's designed for street out of the box
Funny you should say that. Found that with my 8P 3.2.
brah ... this cars are made for daily usage not track, and believe me there is nothing safer out there for a daily usage car.
Of course they are not made for track use, like 99.5% of car production, but if you find this behaviour on the track, there is a small chance (or possibility) to find on the street aswell, the S3 was a fast car (often in straight lines), but I find it way too heavy for what it is, and you can drive way too fast without enough feedback. Yeah as a daily why not, comfy and all, but saying there is nothing safer with a Haldex that don't what to do ? Come on, I'd rather have a true awd, fwd or rwd instead, nothing to interfere with my inputs. Haldex is just a bandaid for the 2 days of snow where almost all the cars were sold. It's like the "electronic limited slip diff", pretty words to say that you burn your brake pads in straight line trying to put on the ground the 450hp after remap and then at the first corner you have brake fade but you never touched the brake pedal. Garbage because cheaper, and manufacturers like that shit
Yeah sounds like your friend just doesn’t know how to drive his car. My old S3 was amazing
Actually feel good. Bought a FWD TT and always thought I was missing out until I saw this, fake all wheel drive means all those 225 quattros are basically front wheel drive cars pulling around a 300lb wagon until it actually kicks in. Plus, you have to buy (if you can find) a blue haldex to actually get full quattro. I'll stick to my WRX for snow driving, they got it right the first time.
thanks man, good job, clear and neat.
So Quattro vs 4motion...
@Jason R
No, just Quattro because it never referred to a particular technology. The video is cute but dated. Quattro with Ultra works exactly like Haldex but for longitudinal cars. If Haldex is faux, so is Quattro with Ultra because they both can disengage an axle.
4motion systems on cars like the Passat 3bg were also torsen based, so no.
@@AndrewLeet92 Passat 3bg 4motion is technically A6 C5 Quatro.
@BassVentura A6 C5 Quattro. I know what i'm saying.
@BassVentura Mate. Passat B5 4Motion have A6 C5 Quattro parts. Not A4 B5. A4 B5 Quattro rear suspension is different than Passat B5/A6 C5. Passat B5 4motion share parts with A6/S6/RS6 C5 not with A4 B5. Electric is also from A6 C5. Passat B5 had 8 cylinder engine too.
A4 B5 and A6 C5 are overall quite similar.
I give this video an F....for Fantastic :)
I would give it a C- because it ignores all the changes made to MY 2010 and later cars. Crown gear differential and Quattro with Ultra are the two big ommisions.
Very informative video, thank you.
Excellent. Easy to understand (I'm not a mechanic, I just drive my TT man!), Not overburdened with data-facts and entertaining to watch. I have the the Audi TT 3.2 V6 DSG Quattro (8J, 2007) for nearly 10 years now. No more guessing and reading forum topics. I finally understand in lay-mans speak as to how my TT traction works. Also didn't know about the 'Haldex Upgrade Module' which I'll be looking in to.
It's a shame you didn't cover off what happens with the Haldex when the "Launch Control" is engaged. Not sure if any of the the Mk1 TT's has LC, but I know the Mk2 TTRS has LC (and the TTS, I think?) and for sure my Mk2 3.2 V6 has LC. The car really feels like it "hunkers down at the back" when we take off. Never seen what it looks like outside the car other than some clips of the same model posted on CZcams by others demonstrating how to activate LC in the same 3.2 V6. Anyway... I can only assume that my LC is automatically setting 50/50 distribution for a period of time before and after the car is moving, but would have been nice to know for sure.
Thanks.