Great Artists Steal - Oil Painting Advice
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- čas přidán 8. 04. 2024
- In this video I discuss taking ideas and insperation from other artists.
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I learned to paint in oil by doing endless mastercopies. It’s the only way to learn.
Great video🍻
Great method with real artist mastercopies. Gives a person a chance to really dig into an artist's thinking and processes.
Not sure a pre-processed AI 'guess' would have given you the same level of understanding. 🙂
Today my new art teacher liked my work in class but ask who was my favourite painter? I told him Francis Bacon. He then said "next week I want to see his influence reflected in your work". Kinda coincides with this video.
I'm glad you made this video. I copy artists whose work I admire. I sometimes felt guilty about this but it's a huge compliment to the artist and there's no way that I could ever reproduce another artist's work exactly. I would never pass it off as something other than my own.
yes, most people, with integrity, never sign them, but may note on the back it's "after so and so", to give credit!
Mark, thanks for knocking down those walls some people put up to limit other painter’s artistic inspiration. You are freeing a lot of artists from outdated and preconceived notions that crush creativity.
You are so helpful and inspirational. I just love your transparency and your honest, clear information. I can't say enough, thank you, Mark
I personally never understood why some people think copying other artists is a bad thing when the fact is, every great artist in history did it. They first learned from and were influenced by their teacher, then they copied from other painters in the museums. That was how students learned and grew as artists in the past. It doesn't ruin an artist, it improves the artist and helps them develop their own personal style.
Mr Carder, in my opinion, you are a fantastic artist! I love how you teach and how you are just straight up to the point of things! And your work is beautiful, always! So, if you don't mind, I'm going to steal.... Lol!!! 💕
I’m so happy to hear that you are still making paint. I also love the brush dip. I’ve learned so much from you. Thank you so much Mark!
This channel is pure gold
So happy to hear this from you Mark!
I never bought in to that cheap statement,
you start influenced and by the time your becoming a Great Artist you simple Create”
Honestly, it is really one of the best ways to learn. Just look at the best painters. There's no point plugging away in isolation.
My work reflects a bit of every artist I admire or have copied. Thank you.
Matisse was pretty clear about the importance of pastiche in order to learn to paint, or more accurately, to think like a painter. But he made a clear warning about it's dangers. That it quickly becomes a noose which strangles your own voice. It's like those art students you teach, who are always looking over their shoulder at the more interesting students work, and aping it without understanding the genesis of the work, or the personal creative experience of the artist which gives that work it's particular power. The thing is, those students never really stop looking for approval. If you're unsure about it, look at the Chinese art factories, and listen to the sad recounts of the workers who long to find their own song; and one day be able to use their own true voice to sing with. Or listen to the empty boasts of forgers, who have spent their whole lives copying other peoples styles without having made a single mark of their own. "At some point, you must stop looking at others works, and just paint" This is good advice from Constable
AMEN, thank you for the sanity and excellent advice
Thank you, Mark! These last few videos have been especially instructive. I like what you are up to these days.
yes, the philosophy of art, like so many other subjects, is the key to everything. The actual production of an art piece is just a tangible "document" of your particular philosophy, be it good bad or indifferent!
I think we’ve covered the subject pretty well and I’m on board with you Mark but I would sure love for you to start series on portraits ! The subjects of hands feet faces your color mixing for skin tones things like that be great love your videos
Bouguereau , Elizabeth Gardner-Bouguereau, Cave, LeFebvre, Doyen, Delobbe --they inspire me--they are the BEST! :) KImberly
Good advice. Thanks. It's like making a music cover of your favorite work--but making it your own.
I just can't tell you how excited I am to have this video and to have been influenced by you for many years👩🏼🎨
Good to see you are still in the game. Great video
A wonderful tutor many years ago, encouraged me to study the masters. I did just that through (Art) school, and beyond. I now encourage my students to study the masters to choose their favourite artist and explore how they arrived with the colour palette and composition. I just love this common sense approach to creative thinking and outcomes.
I agree with you entirely.
However, I do think that just using AI prompt to make an image and calling that art on its own is wrong (my opinion). I do agree that it can be used as a tool to bring inspiration to artists (and by artists I mean everyone who likes making art, professional or not. 😊One does not have to go to art college to be an artist).
I will be honest the initial thought I had for AI generative images as a professional artist was not fear at first but excitement since I would be able to have a lot of new inspiration for art. However, the fear only came when big businesses and individuals began selling the AI art as it is instead of using it as inspiration for a project or piece. Although I understand it’s very difficult to trace your own art on an AI generator database I still think it is important to note that AI is very helpful and good only when you consider how an individual uses it. If it is used to make images and sold as is, I disagree with its use.
Other than that I really enjoyed listening to your opinion on this topic. I agree with the sentiment that AI can be used as a tool to bring inspiration to artists or for projects 👍👍
agreed; i think there's a clear difference between using gai as a tool and using it for exploitation
You're the best! I just received my Geneva paints...can't wait to get into them! ❤
A few years ago, an artist took exception to me because she thought I was promoting copyright infringement when discussing copying ideas by other artists. That accusation sent me down a rabbit hole of copyright law study. Last fall, I was at a popular, scenic location near the San Juan mountains in Colorado, and at least twenty photographers were lined up for the same shot. It got me thinking... Just who of the twenty photographers owns that copyright? Stuff like this gets messy fast, doesn't it? Anyhow, I like your approach to the topic.
Thanks man! You’re a great teacher! 💪🏻✌🏻👀
I'm so glad to hear that your view of AI is simply viewing it as tool to inspire and create. Your paintings will always be valuable regardless of the future of AI graphics.
I discovered AI last year and now explore ideas using this new image source. Thank you for coming out an saying it isn't cheating, only a new tool in our kit. I started my painting journey about twelve years ago from your videos. I have gone on to develop my own style and techniques. Thank you. You continue to be an insertion.
I really enjpyed todays video. Informative and interesting as always Mark. Thank you.
Another great video thank you!
Rembrandt, Van Gogh, Velazquez, Rubens, Vermeer, etc etc all those guys copied it´s essential to learn. And I agree AI can be used as a tool, but take it easy and don´t be over dependant, no old master had that stuff and their work will be better than yours with every ai or modern tool available.
Thank you for all your insights.❤
Thoughtful as usual. 👍
Thank you for this very helpful video 😊
Another great art talk 👍
Agreed! Copying is great.
I have the book, The Academy and French Painting in the 19th Century by Albert Boime. Chapter 6 is called The Copy. “Making a good copy - a work of art in its own right, worthy of the original chosen as model - requires skill in analysing the design, colouring and general technique of the old master’s work” Dictionnaire de l'Académie des Beaux Arts. Great post!
i love ur videos !!
Thank you
Thank you for great videos
Thanks. I feel better about my last two paintings that I copied, with some variation. My question, though is: do you sign your name on the front of the painting?
Salamat po
Everyone copies, at least a little. Impossible not to.
hear what you are saying but i enjoy it a lot more if i dont copy
Great chat ❤
I once had an idea of doing a painting of God bringing Adam to life by touching his hand, and put it in a place that I was going to call the place where I showed it "The 16th Chapel;" because there were also going to be 15 other chapels.
Masterstudies are like song covers. After picking up an instrument, it would be a really strange attitude to start writing songs without learning any already existing piece. Nobody does that. Also, masters did masterstudies all the time, so if Rubens thought that this is a good idea I wouldnt argue against that.
Good advice I subscribe to and share.
well said...
Thanks for the video. Do you have an image generator that you prefer?
Can you please suggest which AI program to work on apple phones? Love your videos
What kind of medium does your paint have and how long does it take to dry so it can be varnished? I was told oil paint takes 6 months to dry before it can be varnished.
As a professional digital artist for over 20 years I totally agree with you. When I first realized the power of AI art I was shocked and dismayed at the possibility of losing my income. While that still scares me I've come to accept and even enjoy the process of art exploration with MIdjourney. It's such an amazing tool for inspiration and reference. I really do see it helping artists grow and improve when used properly and ethically.
I would refer to Nick Caves letter, read by Stephen Fry, on CZcams
Thank you Mark great advice as ever. People are too stuck on the words cheating and rules ....i would call rules guidelines..cheating that only applies to exams. as you rightly say we have an abundance of TOOLS out there we can use how ever we wish ,every piece of art can only ever be unique to us the same as handwriting. how we reach our personal goals is only ever our own business at the end of the day whatever we are doing not just making art. thanks again Mark for helping to wipe out all this stuffy old fashioned way of thinking 👌👍
Great video. Which AI apps are you using to generate images?
Hey mark, what AI did you use to generate these images? Thanks
If I remember from a previous video, he used Midjourney.
Exactly what I was going to ask..
04:38 I am interested to hear what you think your opinion might've been if you were a purely digital painter and your entire business/earnings came from only from those commissions. No traditional art, no teaching, no books, no classes, etc etc.
@Draw Mix Paint Will you ever sell your paint in the UK? Would love to try it.
Yes, stand by, should be available within the month.
Hello Mark, could I ask what is the AI are you using to generate these photos and paintings?
I think there is a vast difference between AI-influenced art and AI-generated art. You can use a program to generate a certain theme, genre, motif that you then translate into a painting that your hands produced. If, however, a computer actually painted the imagine by a "paint machine", it should be identified as such and not a work under your own signature.
If you enter a contest, it's my understanding one will likely have to provide a photo of your subject matter can you confirm this is correct?
I'm really happy you made this video. I nearly lost my mind the last few months that so many artists were just in kind of a denial phase instead of seeing the huge potential ai image generation has for an artist in the sketching, composition and inspiration phase. The way you're using these tools is also my approach that I took when the first tools became available. Especially with stable Diffusion there are now so many tools and plug ins available that let you take so much control during the generation process its just an awesome tool for an artist in the process of developing a new painting.
This is the best mindset to have towards AI art.
Excellent advice and completely honest and real as always, sir. All the cry babies in the comments need to look inside themselves at their own insecurities to figure out why they’re so threatened.
❤
What AI program do you recommend?
My opinion, its metter to know about all great masters they're style of painting and why not be under influence of Caravaggio and Tishler, al try something new and somebody says yes this is like Monet paint.... Paint what you want how you want, there's some rules and work it... Knowledge about past masters is crucial for developing our skills,im not just oil painter, akrilik is also good for hipperalistic animals, impression and expression.About Ai i dont know nothing so i can talk nothing about it.
When a student painter copies other artwork they are only learning the craft not the art. There is a difference…..
Theft is "intuitional" in human society, always has been. We even "stole" fire from nature, to begin with. Now we call it redistribution of wealth, taxation, and other euphemisms to justify it, but in art yes, it is a way to learn, to copy the work of another. All artists begin their practice with a favorite artist or two, mine was Robert Bateman for wildlife pictures and Edgar Payne for landscapes, they still are. I suppose that Richard Schmid is a favorite of many for portraits, but I don't do those other than as an exercise to train the eye to draw well, since I never would use a projector for anything, having learned to draw when I did mostly wildlife, which are just portraits of non-primates, aka us!!LOL. Great artists sometime write books too. In fact, the book by Schmid, Alla Prima, says it's "all he knows about painting", so, if you read it, he helps you to "steal" his methods and philosophy, most importantly, I think. Anyway, good vid, Mark, as per usual.
I think what most artists believe is that the BEST, most REVOLUTIONARY artists create unique and fresh content that goes against prior conventions. This implies they didn't take inspiration from anyone else to do this. That somehow, their way of thinking, their creative "genius" is a phenomenon that is separate from what everyone else is doing.
This is an incomplete argument.
Personally, I believe that "revolutionary" artists still copy, but they implement their ideas and techniques differently. Banksy didn't invent street art. Hell, he didn't even invent political street art or street art activism...but he did combine multiple different aspects and techniques to make his own name.
The truth is: Everyone steals. Everyone copies. Everyone grows. Banksy copied street artists, who copied Picasso, who copied Leonardo Da Vinci, who copied ancient religious portrayals of divinity and rulers, who copied from cave paintings, who copied from nature while using limited supplies.
Everything is based on everything. It's the story we tell with it that matters.
Please teach us on how to use AI 🙏🙏🙏
Can you (or anyone) recommend a good Ai app?
Midjourney is very good. Search either CZcams or the Internet for tutorials on how to use it.
you're not wrong, but generative ai ALSO creates unfair competition by crowding out our sales venues and turning media sites into to mush.
Which AI was Mark using in this video? The aspect of AI in painting that I don't like is that artists who are naturally gifted in terms of composition are hurt by the fact that artists who are terrible at composition are now going to be able to create perfectly composed paintings. I would rather see the natural gift from talented human minds. I believe it is inevitable that artists will be coexisting with AI so we might as well learn how to benefit from it. It's not going away.
I think it is FANTASTIC that people who used to be terrible at composition can now create great compositions!!!!! What is the downside?
@@DrawMixPaint I see your point in a non-competitive sense it is wonderful. Paint by numbers also helps a lot of people and they get real joy from it. There's nothing wrong with that. But much of the art world is competitive. Mark, you made a great point in a video about the inevitability of robotic paintings. We are getting close in some respect. You can now have AI generate an incredible composition worthy of a master. You can then project this composition onto your canvas and trace it out perfectly. Now you still need to mix and apply the paint but it has almost become a paint by numbers at this point. i just feel we should be able to somehow retain some respect and recognition for those artists that are truly talented and gifted at painting from scratch.
@@DrawMixPaintThe downside is that corporations then use whatever you post, including your copyrighted work without your consent for their “research” yet for profit tools to accumulate billions with the promise of removing the artist and directly effecting the ability of the artist to live and eat meanwhile their tool is entirely depend on us to produce anything.
You gotta be kidding me how people are so ignorant about this, not everyone want to obey to the “GenAi lords” and fall into the fever dreams of some software developers who can’t respect common core and steal our stuff just to sell “creativity” back to us for 20$ a month.
Read about the lawsuit of MidJourney vs Anderson, it’s 450 pages that show how horrible these companies are and how it is stealing.
Specifically with MidJourney, they made a spread sheet of 20,000 living breathing artists who did not consent, to a mere of a prompt knowing these people do not want this. Search for Kelly Mckernan, Karla Ortiz etc.
This is exploitative tech who cut the artist out, it’s not some leap of progress as it entirely depends on us too and once you remove the dataset (in MidJourney it’s LAION 5B) the quality falls dramatically to producing horrible outputs again.
Why can’t we advocate for good tools??? You can have your Ai but do it on a public domain
People can do what they like obviously ......yet a Sargent's (or ??artist's) mastercopy is an intense engagement in that artist's thinking and processes....an AI 'mastercopy' is an overprocessed digital 'guess'. Quality over quantity issue. Kinda like engaging in a home cooked meal vs McDonalds. Just my 2c.
There are so many AI companies out there. Is there one or two you have found work best for you?
Midjourney is very good. Search either CZcams or the Internet for tutorials on how to use it.
It’s ok to steal ideas for something inspiration, we humans gets inspired but Ai corporations using datasets for their own profit to compete with you by algorithm and calculations without your consent isn’t the same.
To play devil's advocate, I might suggest that you are reducing the role of the artist to a pure technician, and removing the role of the artist as creator. Personally, I take technique for granted, and am far more interested in the unique "world" that an artist expresses through their work.
I can agree that if one is already relying completely on photo references, then the move to AI references is completely practical and that it makes sense. However, it must be shouted from the hilltops that art is not only rendering and technical power, it is world building. When an artist creates a unique aesthetic, the world gets bigger for everyone.....including AI. This phenomenon does not work in reverse, as personal vision is a form of biological mutation, not an algorithmic average.
Sooo.. a great modern artist steals from AI who stole from everyone?
Look at Dan Marshal and Joseph Zbukvic, Dan just copied his style completely, and gets away with it. makes me sick. You cant just jack someone elses already successful style and just pretend its yours. I wouldn't able to look myself in the mirror. And regarding using AI to "explore" don't you understand that your creative process and muscles are stunted by this? Just the same as photography stunted artists when that came. You no longer get well thought out compositions and choices, you get what he camera captured, and boring "snapshot" paintings. It will become even worse with AI. Sure, youll get to painting faster, but he result will be worse than if you sat down and did thumbnails, out of your head, and you yourself arrived at the best composition and you yourself rejected 10 of your ideas to get to the really good one. its decay and rot in the art world.
This is such a disappointment, I've always enjoyed and learned with your videos, but encouraging the use of AI as it is today is just something I can't support, I think it is totally ok for an artists to not mind, our even approve of their work being used to train an AI, but the generative AI's of today were trained on the works of thousands of artists that did not consent on having their work use in this exploitative manner, it would be fine if it was a choice, but it isn't, and using AI is supporting theft, and undermining artists rights and agency over their own art. Giant companies like OpenAI, microsoft and google are, and will, profit millions on the backs of artists without offering any form of compensation for said artists, thousands of small artists are losing commission income due to the exploitative, unlawful and reckless creation of these AI's, I wish you the best in all your endeavors, but I leave your channel today with a bitter taste in my mouth.
What ever floats your boat!
This is just silly. AI copies a style. Everybody copy styles. Everybody copies compositions. We got to get over ourselves we're not so unique.
@@glenngalen9853 Gen-AI is not "everybody", it is not an artists copying the composition of their favorite artists, Gen-AI is a machine trained on copyrighted material taken from thousands of artists, it was made for profit by corporations, and it is already impacting the live hood of thousands of artists, industry concept artists, small commission artists, and it's only getting worse, people need to stop thinking about it as "person just doing the same thing we do", and see it by the product it is, made on the back of artists work without their permission, as I said, the tool is not a problem, you should be able to train an AI with YOUR works if your want, or to sell the rights of your work to be used as training data, but this should not be imposed on artists without their consent. People are free to not care about this fact just so they can play with a shiny new toy, but pretending things aren't what they are, and ignore the damage it is doing on artists live hood all over the world is just disingenuous.
au revoir
How exactly are “thousands of small artists losing commission income” due to ai? I’m not saying you’re wrong, but I just don’t see how this is really doing any harm to individual artists, unless one of the ai platforms is blatantly copying other artists work and generating collages from them, which I know is not the case. Is it not hypocritical of you to make this argument? Google steals our data for profit and you’re using CZcams, no? It would be hypocritical of me to call you a thief. Most of the platforms we use steal other people’s data for profit, yet we all use them. In some situations maybe using ai is supporting theft, but just saying “using ai is supporting theft” seems like a blanket statement based on what you said.
this channel now is Prompt Mix Paint, it's a shame
Mimimimimimimi
Artist without imagination, using photos, AI, isn't artist for me, unsubscribe 👎👎👎
Another fantastic video that blew me away!