Speeds and Feeds for Wood on the Shapeoko -
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- čas přidán 30. 06. 2019
- The material properties of different species of wood can vary significantly, but if you have some reliable recipes for a hard wood and a soft wood, you should be able to figure out some speeds and feeds for everything in between.
If for some reason you want to print out that spreadsheet or write in your own speeds and feeds as you discover them: docs.google.com/spreadsheets/...
Learn more about our line of Desktop CNC machines at carbide3d.com
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For a Beginner just starting cnc, these videos helps a lot. Thank you very much.
Great little video. As a beginner these videos are invaluable!
Great video and thanks for the metric measurements, Winston!
THIS VIDEO SAFES MY LIFE
Thanks, for most of us this is a journey with a few crashes! I use mostly hardwood and even within a species ie maple there can be a range of values. Cheers
You can definitely go deeper and faster. Also, you'll benefit from using chipload calculations to maximize your efficiency and prevent tool wear
What feeds and speeds would you typically run in MDF with a 1/4“ end mill?
I’m thinking about getting a similar router and looking to get realistic numbers for feeds and speeds
Saw your contribution to Alex's dough sheeter, installed and running.
I tried the recommended feed rate for medium hard wood (2x4). I think you mentioned you were running at 18,000 RPM. Worked fine. I used a feed rate of 50 in/min and plunge rate of 1/2 feed rate. RPM=Feed Rate/(0.02 x Diam x #Flutes) where chip load was 2% of the diameter of the end mill. I notice I need to run a finish pass at 0.025 in to save sanding milling text. Thank you for taking the time to help. Good information! Smoking plywood a single piece with same setting that worked on other plywood; which exploits your comment that not all wood with the same name mills the same. Thank you for your help!
You are the best! Thanks!l
You might provide a reference for pine as well since that is the cheapest soft wood people typically start with. I usually use that when I'm trying something the first time. It makes a lot less mess than MDF.
thanks for all the video's you made, they are very helpfull!
Can you maybe do a material feed&speed&endmill testing on HPL? (high pressure laminate), also known as Trespa.
A Down cut or as you say compression cut end mill will always give a better surface finish on wood and prevents the grain from splintering. Even in plywood. I almost always use only down cut end mills on my projects.
This is tremendously helpful. Is there a plan to make a work holding guide? A comprehensive guide to work holding of flat to irregular stock would be nice for the S3XL. Dos and Donts for doublesided tape, edge clamps, mighty bites, super glue, vacuum tables, etc.... as always, great content.
Thanks for the info. Does Carbide have a spreadsheet with recommended feeds & speeds for a more encompassing list of materials.
In troubleshooting, it is often preferred to change only 1 parameter at a time, and then test that. With that being said, I wonder which parameters are best or easiest to maintain. Such as using a consistent router rpm setting for all of one type of material (i.e. wood)--say, 18000 rpm--and then adjust either feed rate or doc. With my time making chips still measured in hours, and not wanting to damage my limited number of bits, I have had a hard time finding the best balance between rpm, feed rate, doc, plunge rate, stepover, and stepdown. Extrapolate that to all the different types of woods and wood products alone, and it is overwhelming.
Maximizing production rate and minimizing cleanup on the backend is always the goal. And newbies rely on the tribal knowledge from veterans, so I appreciate these recommendations to use as a starting point, even if there is some dissension from others based on their experience.
Miss the old project posts and design to finish parts with explanation on why you did things in the specific way.
What speed would I use for cutting out plywood panels for a boat? 1/2 and 3/4 inch marine plywood with a 1/4 inch bit?
How does moisture content affect feeds and speeds?
Thank you for your input. I have been burning milling hard plywood so I need to increase feed rate. according to your table. So RPM would be 10,000 RPM for a 60 ipm, Chip load=0.002, and # of flutes=3. RPM=Feed Rate/(CL x # of Flutes). Is this right? Please advise. Thanks.
These recommendations are EXTREMELY conservative. I have milled 50+ hours of Walnut with a 1/4” endmill and Feedrate - 75ipm, DOC - 0.5”, Stepover - 0.2” (80%), RPM - 22,000 ish. that’s 10x the material removal rate of what’s presented in this video. Don’t limit your milling based on this video. Keep pushing the boundaries until you find what you are comfortable with.
Most of the time when I see recommendations from the manufacture, it's usually one times diameter. (1xD) So a quarter-inch bit cuts a quarter inch deep. And last chart I checked out was something like 180 IPM for a 2 flute end mill--that's nuts. You'll snap your bit in about 3 inches of travel. Based on my own trial and error and snapping three or four $40.00 bits, I learned the hard way. I'm running about 75 IPM, and right in the .06 to .11 depth of cut. So, I think Winston's recommendations are a very good place to start. I'd rather be a little conservative and work up in speed as opposed to snapping a $40 bit, twice or 3 times, until I figure out I'm going way too fast. $120 will buy a lot of nice hardwood! I applaud Winston for his conservative recommendations!!
@@Deltro61 180 definitely is a lot for a quarter inch 2 flute, though I have also seen manufacturers recommend somewhere in the area of 100 to 115 ipm based on chipload at 24k rpm, and I don’t think that’s too crazy. Always depending on the machine though, a tool breaking may also just be caused by a lack of rigidity or too much runout of your collet
How do Fusion-360 style 3D-adaptive cuts play into this? In the deep square pockets shown in this video, is there any (dis)advantage to doing a fast spiral plunge in the center to nearly the full flute depth, then spiraling out, as I often see people doing with aluminum? Or does wood need to be treated differently?
You can, but there's no practical advantage. With aluminum, your margin for error is much smaller so you want to control cutting forces. If the endmill chirps a little in the corners cutting wood, it's no big deal. The plain 2D pocket tool path will usually be faster. That being said, if you're using a compression endmill, that's where the deeper adaptive cut would be great.
I don't what is so hard on the feed/speeds thing. Just listen to the machine and see how the chips look like.
It also depends on the machine speed and all I ran on 12000RPM most of the time. I can go double but I hate the noise plus I like to keep a room for some tweaking. I definitely do not run on the maximum it can get, but rather have some room there for cases when the machine decides to go thru the stock fully buried in it.. like when it goes from part to part and I forget... In that case the setup I run with should handle that situation on its limits. That is how I set it up. When the machine can go thru the stock fully loaded that is how i keep it and machine in a normal pace and load with chips flying off not a dust.
What’s difficult is the amount of internet chatter filled with exacting numbers for feeds and speeds. Plus the talk of danger and broken endmills.
We are in favor of just getting cutting.
Do you think the craftsmen running routers, by hand, for the last 70 years were calculating feeds and speeds????
They were listening to their routers and the bit, looking at the chips and the resulting cuts to be able to predict and create quality cuts.
There is no substitute for experience.
“Get busy cuttin’ or get busy dyin’….that’s damn right”
@@carbide3dexactly, when they taught me to CNC 20 years ago we did no calculation whatsoever, we just knew by experience and adjusted by the chips and sound, always started with smaller load and add more if it was possible, same like on any other machine. Sure not the utmost way how to get the production pace but was good for us building prototypes.
I'm going to go out on a limb and toss in my 2 cents. i would recommend .125" DOC and a radial engagement of about 30% and a feed per tooth of .002" (assuming 10000rpm, router speed will drop to about this under a healthy load). If you cut deeper reduce radial engagement and not feed rate, your tool life will be better and your material removal rate will be much higher.
Inches? Whats that? ;)
hi, can you help me with some advise to set my parameters? i'll cut hard wood "Mezquite", and i will use a surfacing bit 1 1/4" diameter 2 flutes. i think it would be a good idea to start with DOC 0.5mm, RPM something about 13k to 20k, and feed rate 500mm/seg.
BTW. im new in this
i just realice, there are another key parameter "chip load" and it should be in the datasheet of my bit
Ever tried carving 5 inches deep on cnc
For wood, what conversion is necessary when using 2 flute endmills, vs the 3 flute 201? Is it a chip load deal as with aluminum, or can you go the same rate or even faster since you have more room for chips in the flutes? I use the Whiteside RU2100 & RD2100. I've been playing it pretty safe with the RD2100 in plywood & MDF with .08" DOC and 60 IPM feed. Yet to use hardwoods on my 3XXL.
Chipload isn't really a big deal, so I wouldn't worry too much about it. The reason it matters in other materials is heat. And here if you rub more than cut, you'll just see a little burnishing/blackening of the cut edges. That you can recover from because wood is forgiving, in aluminum you'd break a tool. If it works, just go with it. Woodworkers have been pushing router bits through wood by hand for decades, and i guarantee you they haven't measured their feedrates!
You could get into the nitty gritty of chipload calcs, but I find it easier to balance feedrate and RPM based on the behavior of the cut. Fine sawdust means rpm is too high or feedrate is too slow. Broken bit means rpm too slow or feedrate too high. Small but intact wood chips (approx. size of a half grain of rice) is ideal IMO. I too use the RU2100 but run it much more aggressively IE: roughing walnut at Feedrate - 75ipm, DOC - 0.5”, Stepover - 0.2”, RPM - 22,000 ish.
@@WinstonMakes Assuming you’re producing decent size chips and the machine is capable of running quicker, what would you consider downsides of going up proportionally in feed and rpm and therefore increasing surface speed (Vc)? Is tool life influenced in a big way in wood, or is that negligible? Haven’t had the chance to really test that yet
crazy slow! 12 passes to go through a piece of 3/4" plywood? Why dont' you do a video showing how fast the machine can actually be pushed. anyone can recommend going a snails pace a real engineer knows the true limits the machine can be pushed to. sorry I will die of old age at your recommendations.
Bro this is a hobby machine..... not a real legit factory cnc. This is a good company they tested all this shit with math. They ain’t tryna destroy there product after a few uses
I made a cnc machine but my cnc machine can go up to only 175mm/min 😁😁😁