Brexit has made Britain more multicultural, "less white" | Andrew Marr | The New Statesman
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- čas přidán 31. 05. 2024
- Tory divisions over Rwanda reflect the wider anti-migrant mood across Europe but a post-Brexit irony has been revealed.
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As far-right parties surge on the continent, Britain’s staunch multiculturalism is starting to look a little lonely.
Read Andrew Marr's article here: www.newstatesman.com/politics...
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Andrew Marr is Political Editor for the New Statesman, and is one of the UK's most senior political journalists. He spent over 20 years at the BBC where he was Political Editor and hosted the wildly successful Andrew Marr show. He is now based in Westminster where he brings his deep experience of political reporting to his analysis of the most important events in UK politics. He also hosts Tonight with Andrew Marr on LBC Radio.
Watch more videos from Andrew Marr in this playlist: • Andrew Marr
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Why didn't Boris write "Let's quadruple the number of African and Asian immigrants to the UK" on the side of the Brexit bus?
Because that would have meant telling the truth and if you hadn't realised yet thats a very rare thing for politicians to do. Instead they lied and then did what they always wanted to do, bring in more immigrants than even Tony Blair ever thought was possible.
You know why, he was not clever enough to think about it,,Sorry not clever enough to think, full stop
If Team Remain had pointed out this out the UK would have voted to Remain, mostly for racist reasons. However, Remain argued poorly overall which is a shame.
It's not racist to want to stop employers and rich people bringing in foreign workers to keep wages down and force property prices up, in fact it's just plain old common sense if you are a working class person.
@willyhill7509 Yes the bill cannot be racist since for every migrant sent to Rwanda, the deal is the UK gets a migrant from Rwanda.
Leaving the BBC truly was a second spring for Andrew Marr.
A big loss for the BBC unfortunately
The BBC has been a big loss
The BBC? Oh... I remember
Far from being, as Tories like to claim, the BBC being a hive of wokeists who want to foist politically correct and gender-fluid content on a long-suffering Britsh public, the reality is that the senior BBC suits are terrified of having the license fee frozen, reduced or even cancelled. This has brought about self-censorship galore and even words like Brexit being avoided to appease the government and show them that content is " balanced" and uncritical of the government unless the government itself gives the go-ahead, as with the Post Office scandal where it suits the government to be seen to be " acting for the people" by finally and hypocritically standing up for the postmasters and hanging unpopular wrongdoers like Paula Vennells, Fujitsu and certain expensive lawyers out to dry.
No wonder Andrew Marr has a spring in his step after leaving. He is no longer gagged or being quietly told to go easy on the Tories by the suits at the top.
He left before he was pushed, and you can see why.
I remember having an argument at work during the whole Brexit referendum buildup about this very issue. Many of my colleagues were incredulous that I believed that Brexit would mean we would end up having more immigrants from non EU countries! 😂😂
I remember thinking the same. But the reason you thought that is because you believe we need the immigration, I believed as much myself at least. My views have changed a bit, with over half a million net migrants coming over a year I think I can safely say they aren't all coming here to be nurses and pick strawberries despite what some people want us to believe.
Also remember, Boris flat out lied to voters and said the Tories would reduce immigration. They were expecting Brexit to be a serious shake up to how we run this country, instead Boris made it much easier for immigrants to get work visas (they could get jobs in pretty much every sector well below the national average salary) and the government essentially tried to run the country like nothing ever happened.
@@adam7802 Over a million immigrants incoming and half that amount leaving. We should be concerned about who is leaving.
@@adam7802 Immigration is required to have a larger tax-paying base of working age (18-65) to support a growing aging population expecting pensions (65+).
It's not about picking strawberries, and that's why any right wing party will always encourage immigration once they are in power. Sorry to break it to you.
@@nickhobbs6514 We don't need half a million people entering the country every year, that's ridiculous. We have nowhere for them to live and too many jobs with barely liveable salaries... If you think they are all high skilled labour you're a fool.
But even if I humour this idea, reality is it's been happening for years now and yet, as someone with alot of elderly family members, I can tell you they certainly aren't seeing any benefit. I have countless horror stories about the NHS... My own experience as someone who uses it regularly for a condition is dire too.
I would also like to remind you that labour started all of this, and I expect they will continue it and rollback any changes the Tories are starting to make.
@@adam7802 Why would I support Labour?
Do you perhaps remember Digby Jones of the Confederation of British Industry, saying that Britain needed to compete with China and India in terms of decreasing workforce living conditions. After forty years of spiteful deindustrialisation, Britain is nothing more than another a low wage economy for international investors, and they don't care who works in the factories, or the language of the adverts in the employment agency windows.
I work as a carpenter/builder and escaped to the Netherlands in 2007 because I saw it coming a mile off. The Netherlands and Germany are great places to have a small business in construction or manufacturing. So much high tech gear and products. NL is clean and society is peaceful and civilised. Everything works.
Britain has been run into the ground and they don't care who comprises the working class. This shouldn't surprise you. The British ruling class has been international in its investments since the days of Empire, flitting to their gated communities in Hong Kong and Singapore far more than the industrial towns in the North of England.
If the Tories had wanted to change this aspect of the British Isles, they could have done. Reform UK or Farage won't change it either. Doesn't the general apathy of our politicians to Britain's wellbeing strike you as strange? To them it's just another place though, and truth be told, not the nicest place that they own residences. Sunak is not an aberration, he is quintessentially of the British ruling class.
I see not a cig paper of difference between Labour and Tories, the tragedy is that most people in Britain think there's a choice to be made. Like I say, any right wing government will also increase immigration once in power, you can't buck the facts of Britain's economic landscape having been flogged to the lowest bidder, and the iron requirements of the CBI.
In many respects it's bittersweet living in a country like the Netherlands where Dutch working class jobs are valued and protected, while the rest of my family have to live in the UK. I continue to hope for things getting better, for all of you. But I fear the political culture of voters won't allow it.
All the best.
Yet again another masterful monologue on politics both British and European. Thanks Andrew.
grovel grovel... so wonderful... a shining star of wisdom in the firmament... so insightful, Andrew!
The UK Government issue visas for the vast bulk of UK immigrants. The numbers crossing the channel in small boats are miniscule, a statistical footnote at the end of immigration numbers. They make for angry press headlines, though and so a big distraction from the government-approved immigration.
What? 60k plus "dinghy loaders" is not insubstantial - it's a bloody invasion.
100%. They use illegal immigration, which whilst still a big problem, is used to distract everyone from the bigger issue which is the ever increasing amount of LEGAL immigration. I know a good amount on the left don't care about high immigration nor the plight of the native white British population (They should but they gave up on them A LONG time ago) but even putting that aside, they should care about the lack of housing, the longer and longer waiting times for GP appointments, the increasingly lower wages etc. The carnage and destruction just isn't worth it for a few new fancy restaurants and brands, it really isn't.
@@phoenixreborn6065who has money to spend in restaurants?
Sunak is working for India's Modi, not UK
This is one of the lamentable things about living in the UK: nothing to see here, you must be imagining it dear kind of attitude. A bad faith argument, motivated, I imagine, by class prejudice.
As of 2024, the UK 🇬🇧 is 82% White, while Argentina 🇦🇷 is 85% White 🤭
Least fascist Argentine revanchist ☝️
Adjusted for age demographics, I'd say there's even less...
Saw some videos of EU pre-schools and I don't see very many white children. I was shocked!
Net migration into the UK was a record 745,000 (maybe 1000,000) in 2022.
Net migration in the year to June 2023 was at 672,000, The top nationalities for immigration flows into the UK were: Indian (253,000), Nigerian (141,000).
Uk is an island country with small land area, How many houses are there in UK？ British will become ethnic minorities soon.
In 2023: report estimates estimates therre were 14,648 stowaways.
Other, 102,807 people granted Ukraine Visa and Extension Schemes visas. 43,368 people granted Hong Kong BN(O) visas. 4,671 people granted Family Reunion visas.
Britain’s legal migration numbers matter more than small boats, Rishi's distraction tactics!
Enjoy Brexit!
It does, and generally those immigrants from India and Nigeria need to have useful skills in order to be allowed in, unlike the immigrants from other European countries did when UK was in the EU. So the immigrants now are both darker-skinned and more skilled on average than those who were arriving in the UK before Brexit.
@@SandymoorFerrariClub How do you define 'useful skills'? We need plumbers, builders and car repair experts, not just IT consultants and doctors.
@@tancreddehauteville764
The UK already has plenty of builders and car repair experts. If I want to book my car into a garage there's about 10 different places in my town I can book in, most of which tend to have availability within the next few days. Most of the employees at most of those garages are British, so why would we need more people to repair cars?
In contrast, in the last 10 years I've booked appointments at my local medical centre maybe 12 times and of those 12 times I've been able to see a GP (rather than a trained-up nurse) twice. In the same period, I've booked my car in at the garage about 20 times (MOTs, tyres + other repairs), and guess what, every time I've been able to get a mechanic to do the work I need on my car within a few days of making the booking.
So to conclude, we don't need extra mechanics, and even if we do I'm fairly sure that Indian and Nigerian mechanics also exist.
Well, Mr Marr, reborn post-BBC! Really appreciated that piece & have subscribed as requested. The experience of living through Brexit with my Swedish wife, in the UK, was illustrative of the race question. We heard so many diatribes about immigrants. When she replied 'but I'm an immigrant' ....'oh, but we don't mean you"!
But that is such a strange thing given that most EU immigrants were white. I remember one guy saying "We voted to leave so that the Muslims don't come" despite the fact that the vast majority [excluding the few European Muslims] of EU immigrants were not Muslim
Really enjoy your unmuzzled views now that you have left the BBC. Always thought provoking, I shall continue to relish your content.
They're hardly a shock though - entirely consistent with the BBC homogenous view.
Post-BBC I have come to thoroughly respect and enjoy Andrew Marr's output, previously, I was raging at the screen.
Suella Braverman talking about thd failure of multiculturalism has to be one of the best "pot calling" examples in history!
Andrew Marr is an artist man. The way he can bring together abstract ideas and draw tangible links between things happening in the subconscious of our country is breathtaking. He’s like a psychotherapist analysing the British subconscious!
I didn't really understood the conclusion of his analysis, would you please explain? thanks
We need more of these Scots schooling our English citizens ❤
It was clear at the time that Brexit would lead to more non-European migration.
Close borders to European and keep open (and now greatly expanded) non European migration.
I feel more culturally connected to fellow Europeans than non Europeans,
I'm a white man, liberal minded labour voter and hater of the tories and brexit. I think Andrew is right to put the migration rhetoric in terms of skin colour because it certainly does seem that it was a driving force behind the Brexit architects. The thing I don't understand is why the Suella, Priti Patel, and even the PM himself persist with this obviously racist approach to politics. They themselves are not white and especially as politicians but probably in general, I expect they have all suffered racism and prejudice throughout their lives.
Because of their skin colour those home sec's think they need to up the rhetoric to get the xenophobes behind them.
Converts often become extremists in order to prove their allegiance to the group.
@@pastyman001 I suppose they must just be as fundamentally cruel and sadistic as we on the left fear they are. Not just the pantomime villains but they are actually so horrible that they would encourage and even build their careers around something they know to be so destructive and hurtful. I'm really struggling to come up with a better explanation.
With Rishi I don't think this is what he really wants to be doing.
I think the things he personally cares about are inflation, the economy, and maybe getting a trade deal done with India.
A lot of this posturing is about appeasing the right of the party and also trying to stop the flow of voters to reform.
@@HeirToTheScarletSky
He's PM, he could have put his foot down at the start of his premiership.
He didn't have to reinstate Braverman for starters.
I think he's elitist, which instinctively puts him on the right as he's never had to deal with 'working class people' before, merely look down on them as he shafted our economy in 2008.
Yes and no.
Brexit was filled with contradictions. When Farage talked about the "decent people" who had "concerns" about immigration, what he meant was fewer brown people. His breaking point poster wasn't of white europeans working in Britain in Costa. It was, as Suella Braverman might say, to invoke a swarm or invasion of people of a different skin colour. Capturing the far right racist vote. Brexit wasn't all about racism but racists saw it as their opportunity to make Britain white again.
Most things Brexit were contradictions. Global Britain, which was going to replace the EU, meant more people with brown skin would be coming to Britain and fewer white Europeans.
If you go through every Brexit promise to do one thing you find equivalent promises to do exactly the opposite. Often in the same sentence.
The word immigration in Britain is imprecise. It includes so called "migrants", "illegal migrants", and those who arrive through "freedom of movement". Conflation of terms leading to the illegal migrant who comes to steal a job and claim benefit. Schrödinger's migrant. Illegal and legal, stealing jobs where we have shortages and claiming benefits when they can't, getting a free house while sharing with 10 other people. The bizarre world of how immigration is debated. Illegal being used to describe those who lawfully claim asylum. Migrant being used as a pejorative to people working in the fields to pick veg or fruit.
The private sector, as you rightly point out, has no shyness in representing all its customers in adverts, promotions or delivering services. However, the state should not be dismissed. The problem with the state is that it has been hollowed out over forty years. The NHS is now just a brand. A multitude of contractors. Sliced and diced into competitive trusts and money following into shareholders and Conservative donors. Councils can barely collect the bins. Education is a mosaic of multi-academy trusts. Public services provided by a patchwork of agencies. Gone are the days when a Secretary of State can demand the state deals with ethnic diversity. The levers of power are not moved like that anymore. A state with agency and mission would be required. A one that we had decades ago before the need to privatise everything.
Proportional voting systems would allow the racists to have their own party. They would not have to take over the Conservative Party. That would be a good thing. An openly racist political party of white supremacy. The Conservative right could stop pretending. The BBC might then get around to holding them to account and stop treating them like Conservatives on flagship political programming.
Good post.
Brexit was not a campaign to make the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Northern Ireland white. Which Leaver campaigned to deport non-white people? However, the whole referendum debate was about the proper relationship between people and institutions of which the Nation-State is one. Both Leavers and Remainers used facts and feelings. Also, the referendum was for some people a discussion like that of the Reformation and not Nazism - does a country set its own laws (have legal sovereignty - a sovereign being the ultimate legitimate authority, so legal sovereignty is ultimate legal authority) etc? The Brexit vote was not exclusively white. Nor was the remain vote exclusively non-white.
Also, immigration has a precise meaning: the act of coming to live permanently in a different country. People who do not come to live permanently are sojourners not immigrants. An illegal immigrant would be someone who immigrated illegally and a legal immigrant would be someone who immigrated legally. Immigration is a concept recognised in Liberalism (coming out of the Enlightenment) because Liberalism creates the contemporary nation-state as the primary polity of understanding. '"The land shall not be sold in perpetuity, for the land is Mine. For you are strangers and sojourners with Me"' (Leviticus 25:23) is a more Biblical view. Stranger, in Biblical Hebrew, can mean resident non-Jew (not all Hebrews are Jews and not all Jews are Hebrews - read the biography of Abram/Abraham and Moses). Sojourner means traveller. Borders, limits of jurisdiction, have always existed. A border, abstract and physical, is human recognition of difference: self and other or that is not this.
The nation, a polity (political community) summarised as: the inhabitants of a defined geographical area with shared language, norms and standards, traditions etc. That a centre exists and the fringes are not to be centred. The United States does this at the Presidential level. Nation comes from the Latin natio which means: gave birth to. Think about the Confucian value of filial piety or, as expressed in Christianity/Islam/Judaism as: '"Honour your father and your mother, that your days may be long in the land that the LORD your God is giving you"' (Exodus 20:12, ESV). However, Exodus 20:12 is also the underpinning of Exodus 20:2-11 and hierarchy (Holy Order - Holy meaning conformed to G-D) more generally because G-D is the spiritual Father. Identity is formed from lowest to highest being in alignment. For most of human history we have understood nation as being synonymous with shared ancestry (more or less). Human solidarity, above the nation, can exist if you believe in monogenesis: having a universal common ancestor be that L.U.C.A. (Last Universal Common Ancestor) or Adam/Noah and/or someone/something else such as St Paul's: 'There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slave nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise' (Galatians 3:28-29). The latter of those being spiritual rather than people becoming an amorphous blob.
All nations have an economy, but I do not understand how the disordered view of economies having nations attached has come to be. I believe that the best relationships are a reciprocal relationship to someone even if arranged in a hierarchy, not submission to something (say, the economy). Man is a social being not an atomised individual. Identity is also being able to conform the whole of the self in relation to the other. Too many separate identities and people become atomistic. How do you expect people to cohere if we have multiple understandings of goodness, truth and beauty? Perhaps you do the thought exercise of playing a game with no rules. Nor are people are not fungible widgets with their purpose in life defined as an economic unit to produce what you want at the lowest possible cost. Stability is a good thing because people do better when not in a society of constant change. Change is the norm, but in order to survive and flourish consistency is required. Value is somewhat related because in order for people to even function people also need a hierarchy of value. How else are people to know what they need to do first and, once the first is completed, what to do next? Again, this is part of identity and living the best life possible.
The Conservatives came out of the Parliamentary grouping called the Tories who believed in God, King, Family. I do not have a world view which demands the nation should submit herself to the market. Also, on a practical level, you will not be able to have re-nationalisation in the European Union. However, that is a debate about the proper role of Government not about whether charity is good (because charity, Biblically referred to as mercy, is good). Libertarians came into the Conservative Party because Libertarians also wanted to conserve that which is great and good because of the threat of false doctrines like that of Socialism/Marxism. Sir Winston Churchill is the exemplar of this. Conservatism has always had a streak of Liberalism because Whigs like Edmund Burke were sickened by the French Revolution.
I thought that Farage said that he'd prefer more qualified Indian doctors coming in than unskilled Eastern Europeans and that this would be more possible with Brexit.
@@ianboakes8670He never said that. He doesn’t care about having doctors in the NHS. He uses private healthcare.
Perfectly put
German national here.
Andrew delivers in my opinion, an impressive view on the “current” British social state, as well as the conservative, liberal and left and progressive values and tolerances.
Interesting indeed!
Danke
This is an excellent monologue Andrew. The big cooperations and universities are interested in multiculturalism as you rightly stated and have become more influential in this than the governments. You forgot to mention the role of football. When Manchester City is winning every trophy on this planet its supporters don’t care where the manager comes from, or what the races of the players are. They just love the trophies.
I am centre left and its obvious we have let in far too many migrants. We haven't built enough housing, hospitals, schools and public services to keep up. In fact we've even cut some public services even though demand is increasing. Illegal migration should lead to automatic deportation. As we should set up centres in France where claims can be assessed. If people decide to ignore that then forgo the right to apply. Being tough is the only way to deal with this.
But do you really want this migration of people with very different views who do not accept western values.
Get rejected in France, then jump on a dinghy to the UK.
I knew this all along, that’s why I voted remain!
A really brave essay on an extremely sensitive issue. Well done Andrew
watching this from New York - NY turns 400 in 2025. For these 400 years, NY has always been a question: "Can the peoples of the world live together on these small islands and live in peace and prosperity?" and the answer has always been a qualified yes. But if and only if the basis is not race or religion or ethnicity or language but a culture that simply demands the NY attitude - Show me what you got - what can you do? And when NY has lived by that, NY has succeeded. When NY has become embroiled in race and ethnic strife, it has failed. I think that is a bit what Andrew Marr is getting at. A civil society succeeds not because of a left "woke" political agenda but when we welcome each other's talents because a thriving economy depends on the talents of all.
You mean New Amsterdam.
Anyhow, aren't you overwhelmed by migrants in NY.
It's not all about the economy.
New York can be multicultural if it wants to be, however other countries and regions receive the right to believe and want their country and region to have the native culture as the dominant culture. This shouldn't be controversial.
@@celtspeaksgoth7251 No, we are not being overwhelmed. The founding document of NY is the Flushing Remonstrance of 1657. "Therefore if any of these said persons come in love unto us, we cannot in conscience lay violent hands upon them, but give them free egresse and regresse unto our Town, and houses, as God shall persuade our consciences, for we are bounde by the law of God and man to doe good unto all men and evil to noe man. And this is according to the patent and charter of our Towne" and that has defined our city for these 400 years. And aside from our mayor, the people of new york have continued to welcome those who come - and do so in the spirit of the poem inscribed on the Statue of Liberty; "Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!" Has it been a challenge to welcome over 100,000 migrants, definitely, but great cities meet great challenges. And overtime, the migrants arriving today will be the city of tomorrow as has been the case for 400 years. They will be the energy and vitality that allows ny to thrive
@@ecnalms851 Societies that spend energy on keeping the world out to preserve homogeneity over time wither. Young people leave. The population gets old. So yes, it is a decision, but there are consequences. The UK will thrive if it welcomes the world, and the UK will decline if it tries to become a bunker afraid of the world.
@@1Grussus I disagree, you don’t need extremes and most people are fine with some immigration if it is not too much and integration occurs. Also, New York doesn’t really have a culture, it is just a mix of diversity. Countries outside USA like India, Germany, Italy, Ireland, Egypt etc have more set cultures and traditions folklore, and history that are hundreds to thousand of years long. USA culture just seems centred around the economic idea of the American dream and capitalism whereas other cultures it is more social not economic
Too optimistic. Underates the extent of racial prejudice.
So no problem with people coming from Poland, and other parts of Europe, but BIG problem if people are coming from Africa or Asia.
Well said. Brilliantly articulated. I'm in total agreement on all counts. Keep the (non) faith.
I think the colour of a person's skin is irrelevant, but immigrants from Asia,Africa have totally different outlooks on life, especially religious views. The surge in influx of Islamic folk as Europeans have been made unwelcome is going to change the way of life forever in the UK. The more Islamic politicians that are voted into parliament from places with high populations of Asian immigrants and their children coming to voting age will obviously change the demographic. We seem to be going the way of the red squirrel. I actually live in a muslim country, retired, and it is so different to the UK. The people have a totally different mindset. They certainly wouldn't want us coming to alter their way of life. I'm an aetheist by the way.
Islamic culture is the issue not race.
@@colincampbell4261 You are deluding yourself.
The vast majority of the 5-6 percent of Muslims in the UK assimilate. They fall in line with our birth rates and pay lip service to religion to keep their grandparents happy. There's as much chance they would vote for a non Muslim as a muslim. Particularly when so few muslims are on the ballot. Jess Phillips would have loads of muslims in her constituency - and they clearly must vote for her since she's an MP
Exactly. I'm Indian. I queried Brexit voters, they wanted more Asians in UK? Remain to me felt keep it Christian, keep it white caucasian, same culture. Basically Brexiteers utopia? But they voted against it??
It's not about skin colour. It's about too much immigration. The strain on jobs, housing and public services is the main driver. Next too much money is being wasted on asylum seekers and illegal immigrants. We have many problems in the UK and that's where the money should be spent.
Brexit just changed Britain's migration back pre EU. When people from the colonies did the administration of the "empire". Worked for Britain.
In India nurses doctors are still educated trained like during the Raj days English is a first language used.
You have expressed well what I believe but have never been able to formulate in my own mind or express to others. Well done and thank you.
Wonderful, Andrew. You're a very articulate and eloquent speaker.
I never used to watch you on TV... but now, I watch all your latest videos. Thank you for (now being able to) speaking your mind.
If it was about skin colour why isn't there such thing as Hindu phobia ? What is it about the Muslims that frightens people ?
Shh. Not here. Andrew's talking, although his mouth's all gummed up. He needs a drink of Coke.
Negative media of Muslim is projected 200% times more in Western media.That's why
I don’t think it’s quite right to assume all anti immigration sentiment is fueled by racism. There is also an issue in respect to perceived unfairness. People think it unfair that people can break the rules by getting in a boat. They also think it’s unfair immigrants can access public services and welfare without having paid in. I am not saying these perceptions are accurate- simply that they are widely believed.
Very nicely put. Tolerance has to run both ways. The problem, as someone who is myself a member of a gender and sexuality based minority, is that many of the other minorities that do have a racial or cultural basis, don't particularly like my group. In fact some of them regard us in old fashioned language as "perverts and sinners," and so whilst I value the idea of live and let live, that can't work at all if people start coming in and then retrospectively seeking to impose their own narrow minded religious and cultural prejudices against other types of existing accepted minority.
As you say we can only be truly multi-cultural if I accept their right to PRIVATELY regard me as someone they disapprove of - and at the SAME TIME they reciprocally publically accept that their disapproval of me ABSOLUTELY does NOT and will NEVER give them the right to start legislating or indeed campaigning to restrict my personal freedoms, in so far as my private excercise of them does not injure others around me.
In other words they can freely state their opinions in private, as can I, but neither of us can publically act against the other group within the civic sphere of society. Live and let live on BOTH sides.
All very difficult to practice and/or police of course... partly because some of these groups percieve any restriction of their freedom to try and aggressively eliminate other minorities, of which they disapprove, as an unfair persecution of their whole belief system - and thus the only way for the other groups, who are willing to adopt a live and let live pluralistic approach, to preserve their mutual tolerance, is to outright ban any holding intolerance as a fundamental tennet! So ironically we find ourselves having to be pretty intolerant of intolerance... what a fine paradox.
Christianity !
@@StratsRUs ...has thankfully started to slowly learn to tolerate things they don't agree with. Agreed some more extreme forms of it still don't, and indeed conversely there are other religions who similarly are learning how to be pluralistic, but we aren't really talking about those who are prepared to adapt - rather about those who won't - and in that case there is a problem whether they be christian or something else.
I think if any country can make it work, the UK can. If we broadly have a free and tolerant society then we do have to accept that there will be friction between some beliefs and values, dare I say considerable friction. The neverending task is that sufficient numbers of citizens need to remain vigilant to ensure that no extreme view imbeds itself into elected law makers such that any minority group has their rights infringed or, god forbid, put them in danger of life and limb.
@@jennyd255 Christianity has reformed especially in Europe, NA, and SA. Islam hasn't however. Main reason for the rise of the far-right in Europe is because of the immigration coming from almost entirely Muslim countries. Meloni said it herself that "Islamic culture is not compatible with European values". There is only the rise of 'far-right' in Sweden, Afd in Germany, Geert Wilders in Netherlands, rise of Marine le pen in France, Switzerland, Hungary, Pis in Poland, right-wing sentiment in Denmark, and the Tory party in UK (people vote for them because Labour is softer on immigration and doesn't take it as seriously, particularly Muslim immigration). I recommend watching the documentary by Journeyman pictures which is free on CZcams about what happened in Cologne, Germany 2015 New Years Eve where 1200 women were sexually assaulted. Insightful documentary. There is also what happened to Samuel Paty, a french teacher who was beheaded by an 18 year old Muslim Chechen refugee after he showed cartoons of Prophet Muhammad in a freedom of expression class.
@@StratsRUs Most of the churches near me are full of LBTQ rainbows!! There is no equivalence with my local mosque, where women are not allowed to use the front entrace, and have to use a side door.
The brilliant Andrew Marr. Such a pleasure to listen to you break down the current circumstances.
One of your best ever commentaries and I have watched you for decades!!!!
Mass migration of people who have completely different worldviews to the host society will inevitably lead to conflict. This is especially true of people with the belief that their religion is "the word of god" and it is their duty to that god to convert the host population. In the recent past, mass migration into the Americas from Europe was a disaster for the Native Americans. Likewise Australia. Further back in time the mass migration of the Indo-Europeans from the Pontic steppe into western Europe was disaster for the Neolithic farmers who had settled there.
Meanwhile, in 2016, we told white atheists and Catholic, Orthodox and Protestants of all denominations to eff off out of spite ( even though we shared the same DNA with them) because a few billionaires wanted to avoid paying a bit of tax.
Calling Brexit a ‘political philosophy’ is really stretching it
Well, it was and is "free" markwet ideology, cloaked in xenophobia.
Brilliantly open, challenging, matter-of-fact and looking for balance. Best watch and listen of my week so far.
Glad you enjoyed it!
But, Andrew, we are living in a Post-Capitalist world now, are we not? And, one more question, why are current conditions creating so manyt millions of desperately poor people who cannot even afford food?
The state isn't influential, it's the media. Particularly the right-wing tabloids on the older generations. That's why there is such a big divide between the young and old.
The government is influential, more than both they and the media realise. What neither of them realise however is that no amount of propaganda bs can get around people's real lived experience.
If you're homeless you're homeless, if you have no job you know you have no job, and no amount of crap from the press will make you believe differently.
They also assume that the electorate vote for a candidate or in a referendum for the reason that candidate wants them to vote for him. Nothing could be further from the truth.
You are entirely wrong. Young people are consuming new media and so are Gen X / boomers and the youngsters are starting to get redpilled after years of Marxist brainwashing in our schools and universities - or did you think left wing indoctrination was not a thing??
Under 70s get their Media from non-regulated sources Inc tik tok, Facebook, X, YT etc and those sources are generally funded by special interest groups, funded by corps and billionaires and as you said 'the state isn't influential'. Eg I wonder who is funding Andrew Marr today.
Many young people are right wing, don't kid yourself
I believe the left-wing BBC has a massive influence on most people. It pushes diversity and this is not based on economics, but principles.
Thank you Andrew for a great piece of journalism! You hit the nail on the head!!
One of the main reason I voted Remain. We need migrants because of falling birthrate. Its a simple question who would culturally assimilate the easiest, a Polish person or someone from Pakistan.
Well said Andrew Marr. I would say that although we've had large non-white immigration since Brexit, Britain has long been a diverse country. That diversity goes back far longer than we realise. We should embrace it😀
Diversity is what makes ME free, thought I would rather be inside the EU than out of it!
Britain had a 99.9% White poulation in 1951 and an overwhelming amount of that was White British indigenous, this is not exactly what you'd call diverse is it.
@alunevans380 No, it wasn't quite that high(1948 is often seen as the time of change) although near that officially. But that's because alot of people passed as white who we now know were of other backgrounds. There are plenty of examples like the Black Tudors, Anglo-Indians etc. Funnily enough, in the 1880s, the upper classes did not see working class people as white( this started to change when empire was promoted)😀
@brettlangridge9449 the black tudors is literally just one guy blowing a trumpet in a Henry VIIIth painting. Anglo indians maybe made up 20,000 people in total, the vast majority of them living in India. Britain was definitely nearly uniformly white before 1948.
@mappingshaman5280 It was mostly white, but not in the way the previous person said. And the 2 examples I gave are just 2 of many. The point I was making is alot of people who passed as white actually had other backgrounds too. Far more common than previously acknowledged. Still a minority, but 99.9 or anywhere near that. Also of the white population, many had other backgrounds (huge % Irish, also Jewish, Hugenot, Italian etc). But the point is our diversity is part of our history 😀
Yes Vox are still a political party in Spain . They expected to go into coalition with the centre right PP but in last July"s GE they didn't get as many votes as expected. Spain didn't like their far right policies.
Excellent as always, Andrew. Ever thought provoking and challenging.
Think the corporations point is a very interesting one! I also get a huge amount of training where I work (fortunate 100 corporation) related to inclusion, discrimination, unconscious bias, and the benefits of views from a range of background rather than just those like us. It’s a great point I hadn’t really considered in terms of how much those organisations do regarding integration.
Why does this only apply to Europe and the US?
Ask Soros
How can anyone claim to be pro-working class and support mass immigration? It’s a contradiction.
“Contradictions do not exist” Ayn Rand
The birthrate in the country is not keeping up with the demand. The population is aging and there is a gap in healthcare workers.
We knew this in the 1980's but we still kept telling young people not to have children in universities and colleges. Now that we don't have enough people we need to import millions from other countries. This has the effect of keeping peoples wages down and at the same time increasing the cost of housing, Wind on another 30 years and there won't be anymore people to come from abroad as every nations population is in free fall
@@Thebusinessprodco
Well done Andrew.
Brexit backfired!
The same doesn't seem to apply in Germany or Austria or Spain or France, where advertising and other media generally reflect the local ethnic breakdown, yet surely it's the same global companies purchasing the advertising etc?
I think this is due to the UK’s cultural ties to the US which has seen a massive diversity push since George Floyd. UK has followed the US for a long time and is also more capitalist like the US than Europe.
Wow, I was not expecting that. A good watch, thumbs up from me.
I thought the whole point of UK Brexit immigration policy is that people from outside Europe are here on a short visa so they can be ejected easily and work without the normal employment rights to which EU workers were entitled. So it is racism - giving workers of a different colour fewer rights - and presumably lower pay. Like apartheid or pre-civil rights USA.
@chrimbus71 Fair point but Germany did take in 100,000s of Syrians.
the main problem is that in England there are far too many people, regardless of where they are from, and most are concentrated in London and the South East. Jobs and resources are not evenly distributed across the country and it's a desperate situation.
Neither is transport infrastructure so its impossible to plan sensible train journeys or commute easily. No levelling up in sight then...
You seem to skim over all the problems with immigration that are real and not just simple racism . Jobs, housing, education, healthcare etc. I would like to hear you give solutions to how Britain can cope with 750,000 extra people per year coming to make it their home. It wouldn’t matter what race they are, the problems are surely also about how to cope with these huge numbers.
It was never about race, it’s about the British way of treating each other, keep the our environment safe and clean, being respectful to each other. It’s all gone.
It was bigotry, end of.
Who would have thought if you get rid of European migrants with Brexit and you have a demographic problem, that they would be replaced by people from outside Europe ?
This is how you present facts. Bravo!
The irony of Braverman is striking. 😂
Not at all. Only if you see things in simplistic terms of race. I think this is primarily about ethnicity, class, and religion. Rishi Sunak, Suella Braverman, and Priti Patel all have parents who are Indian, Hindu, and middle or upper-class. So it's not unlikely that they might share common ground with British nationalists who oppose immigration from poorer Muslim countries.
It's not uncommon for immigrants to oppose immigration from other regions.
@@andybrice2711-
But it is Rishi Sunak, Priti Patel, and Suella Braverman’s government that has allowed mass migration in the numbers never seen before into the uk under their government, much of those migrants came from India so yes it is ironic.
If they’re against multiculturalism and mass migration why did they allow so many Indian migrants (especially Indian international students) to move to the U.K.?
I prefer real cosmopolitan diversity where there is a good balance and mixture of people from different ethnic, cultural, religious backgrounds, instead of simply flooding the uk with masses (in the hundreds and thousands) of Indians, when we already have millions of Indian-descent people in the uk already and a strong presence of Indian culture here.
It would be boring if the uk became another india and pakistan, true cosmopolitanism with a good mixture of people from all around the world is more vibrant and interesting to live in providing the people are respectful, well educated, well integrated, lawful, and economic contributors.
@@abcxyz-cx4mr Well, I'm not convinced any of those people are really very anti-immigration. I expect they're just trying to win back votes from the nationalist right.
I'm just saying it is entirely possible for immigrants to be against mass immigration. And not necessarily hypocritical.
@@abcxyz-cx4mr And yes. I'm generally in favour of cosmopolitanism as well. Though I also think it's reasonable to acknowledge that certain countries have more in common, and migrants between them are more likely to integrate well.
For example: Indians, Nigerians, Ukrainians, Poles, and Hong Kongers all seem to get along well in Britain. Whereas Somalis, Albanians, and Syrians often struggle. Probably because of the relative stability of their countries of origin. And how much shared history and cultural overlap they have with Britain.
Though I think wherever possible those judgments should be made on an individual basis, and not based on generalizations about groups.
The first past the post system might have stopped the far right getting seats and MPs, but it has in the process reduced greens getting MPs and holding the UK to account with regards to its climate pledges. I don't agree with the far right but maybe the current electoral system does no represent the electorate well leading to the huge disenfranchisement we see in the young, so now someone can porogue parliament or borrow huge amounts for tax cuts and there are no cries of dissent, we look at Trump and laugh whilst we undermine the foundation of democracy in the UK .. I hope for change.
Oh dear, pardon me laughing 😂😂😂😂😂
I have incredible respect for this man! The width and breadth of his knowledge and the insights he’s able to generate blows my mind every time. It’s true, since Brexit, there were less immigrants like me from Eastern Europe and more from the rest of the world. But I don’t think the anti-immigration sentiments has mainly to do with the skin colour as much as it does with the culture of where these people are coming from and how willing they are to integrate and respect the basic values of British society. I don’t say there’s no racists, but not enough to create a political blow back. I think there is though a push back against uncontrolled immigration and immigration from countries with cultures that keep creating extremist views religious or not. For example almost all British people are happy to welcome the typical Indian immigrant, with peaceful religious views, hard working, willing to educate and better themselves and contribute to society and culture. There are extremists coming from India as well (human nature, many cultures there) but the proportion is tiny to those that have a positive impact. The same cannot be said of other places from where immigrants are coming from. Also, though hard to quantify, apart from extremist views, there are other qualities, or lack of, that immigrants can bring and have an impact in society. Why would we believe that they only bring good qualities when we do not make any effort to select for them? We should not discriminate by colour of skin, but we should have an ethical way of controlling what sort of immigrant we accept in this country based on British values, if we still believe in them! 🇬🇧
So you believe in discrimination, including but not limited to racial discrimination? I notice a plethora of "we" towards the end, where you perhaps aim to suggest that your own personal views represent the majority of others' views, yet are solely your own. Also, such comments typically suggest the commenter believes they have some ownership of the country (rather than simply holding nationality and thus no better than any other national whatever your family history), and preference for those undefined, but exceptional, "British values". There are so many words and phrases there (hot buttons) which demonstrate that you are carefully, but unsuccessfully, trying hard to project reasonableness, yet are actually a typical far-right Ukipper.
Great video, Andrew, like always
Andrew spot on😊
Wasn't sure I initially wanted to click on this.
Really glad I did. It invites a lots introspection around our society and the political forces trying to shape it.
It's not about race its about ethnicity. It's about preserving British values, our culture, our traditions our heritage and history.
Hear, hear. Soooo glad you parted from Auntie Beeb.
Thanks for posting.
Thank you for the probing explanations. They were helpful.
It’s gotten out of hand……
Politicians in the Western world refused to listen to their own people….
What a mess.
Lol its mostly a global thing
Kalergi plan, the elites are delighted, the birth rate has been falling for decades. No integration. Total cultural and societal collapse. As mentioned, all part of a plan. Capitalist cyborgs, that's the aim.
As a Jamaican from Windrush who was a British subject at the time. I’ve always questioned the ‘Multicultural’ tag. We are Christians. Eat pork. Drink pints. Watch football. Go to seaside towns in winter. Loved the Royal family. Yet we were called another culture. I can see it with Muslims. But not us. Yet here we are.
I love seaside towns in winter. You have it all to yourself!
Except we are NOT Christians. We are mostly children of the enlightenment and are a progressive, secular society mostly indifferent to the religions of minorities - Christian, Muslim or football fanatics .!
But why do you assume that absorbing British culture is enough to make you 'belong' to Britain? Ultimately you are Africans, and your native culture is west African, as that is where you originate. By the way, I have never objected to multi-culturalism, but please don't demand to be called British because you originate from a former colony.
jamaican culture isnt the same thing at all.
@@megasizer5119 same as what?
It is hilarious that Brexit voters got exactly the opposite of what they thought (against all evidence and advice) they were voting for. I love it.
Excellent perceptive informative journalism and ..... optimism!!!
Great video - As always.
Superb points and well structured thesis. Thank you.
I couldn't help noticing that the sign on the New Statesman Building at 6:15 is missing an apostrophe! Shock Horror
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Thank you for Crystallising what is already happening - top marks!
Brilliant description of exactly whats happening around us. Really insightful.
I agree with the move to the far right in Europe! Indigenous folk all over Europe have had enough of migration!
This massed migration experiment started by Germany has seriously, seriously failed!
Immigration is/has ruined Europe! So many facts show this as true!
Agreed with every word Andrew! Rough seas ahead and its up to us!
Nothing to do with the un refugee convention. And the un global migration pact then. Labor signed one Tory signed the other nothing to do with Brexit. They do as told.
Stop the Goats!
Those goddamn goats, taking control of our cliffs...
Those damned Goats are widdling all over OUR White Cliffs! @@theconversationalelitist6423
Goats just want a Nanny state.
Ohhh very good. Well done sir
Stop the boats
We are more than 65 million people for a start! We were in the EU for over 40 years, and our young were not trained because it was all about import import imports, that by the way replaced our work force, and lacked the opportunity to build our social system because we had to take care of the European LAW! Not only we were not training ourselves and our children, we had to provide everything else for the EU, Spain and Greece did the same for example, hence Spain and Greece went bankrupted! That’s reality before we left the EU, if we see the facts we’ll see our young were losing training and jobs, and it was compulsory to take in workers from the EU under the EU law… hence Cameron negotiated a deal with them to have a 4-5 years stay in Britain before anyone can claim benefits for new comers, if we stayed with the EU… It’s a delusional power, we had no power, not to mention hundreds of other problems they brought into Britain, for example students from universities were kidnapped to use for prostitution for the EU rich underground, not to mention the easy access to and from the EU that criminals used as a way to hide in Britain so they are not caught, many house holds were living with or beside murderers and they didn’t even know! Because it was easy to escape their country and hide in the UK established network from the EU criminals, and our police force couldn’t do anything about it because we were under the EU law, the police forces and intelligence, and investigator departments had no power because we were under EU law! Etc etc etc! The list is a mile long, if your child is kidnapped for sex trafficking, then you would not say what you are saying above! It’s ignorance that we’re fighting against, against ignorance is the problem and the problem was going on in plain site! I remember a building site that was being built and there were not one British worker there because the company was under EU law, so they did whatever they wanted! It was not only human rights but it was EU rights… I could go on and on… hence Brexit happened, plus if Cameron didn’t want us to leave the EU he should not have entered us into a Referendum, period! So see the facts! We should all stick together now and stop yo-yo yoing about and get on with Brexit… to create a better Britain, the benefits can be huge, if we had the right mindset like Switzerland or Singapore that are not in the EU, it’s early days still with people ignoring the facts and benefits! We copied Singapore in the past with the housing system where everyone should be allowed to own their own homes in the 80s! Hence many bought their council houses and were happy with their homes, of course everything needs updating, hence Brexit for all, transition is never easy so we are going through crisis not because of Brexit but because of the wars around us, Putin, COVID, etc, we would be in the same situation if we stayed in the EU, France is going through hell right now, so is Germany and the rest of Europe, don’t tell me we prefer the political system of France and social chaos in Germany right now, the EU is a mess right now?! It’s stupid to go backwards is what I’m saying, whether you voted Brexit or not … to rejoin would be a disaster, it will bankrupt Britain like Spain and Greece, they were in a recession because of the EU not because of leaving, they didn’t leave, they couldn’t, yet they still suffered hell because of the EU system that got them there in the first place ! Many country will be leaving in the future because of this! I couldn’t believe some people were wanting to stay in the EU because it was easy to travel, they didn’t cared about people who had no jobs because of the EU system! It does not work because everything has to go through 28 languages before any bill is passed! This lacked human rights as far I’m concerned because you need to get permission from the EU for anything you need to get done, it takes years before anything gets done! Imagine if you had 20 people living in your home and you have to ask before you go for a pee?! Imagine that for Christ sake! America can do 50 states because everyone speaks the same language! Wake up everyone! Ask before anything gets passed is what the EU represents….soon we’ll be living exactly like Germany and France where years of PAPERWORK needs to be done before they can build a bathroom! What kind of mindset would you want for the future of your kids if you have any?!We should be helping the UK succeed as a country and build it up again not blind sided by the EU! We can still be part of the whole world not just the EU…
Excellent commentary, thank you!
A very precise analisys of the situation, thank you. ^^
Its not the colour of the skin that right leaning voters struggle with, its cultures which are fundamentally un British in their values. The ability to have good government for future generations will be undermined by these imported cultures. It is hard to blame 'old fashioned' Brits from trying to protect their own culture and history.
There's a hell of a lot more cultural similarities between Britain and white Christian Europeans than there is Chinese, Indian and Nigerian communities (who make up the majority of the 1.4m legal migrants into the UK since 2021). It is specifically the migrant policy unlocked by Brexit that has allowed this to happen, truly a shocking twist of irony for 2016's Leave voters.
Rubbish. It has always about how the TORIES want to keep power and not share their wealth. Nothing more or less.
Clever remarks and line of thoughts : Andrew Marr ! From me, seasoned & retired human mammal😅 son of a diplomat, (Swiss & Italian, w French, British, Australian and US relatives), my first 8 years in Israel, then all my education in Switzerland (Scools, Uni, Post-Grad, Conservatoire, Scouts, etc, Science cursus). Basically like Colin Firth's parents who made him experience diversity in his early childhood years. That said, I find our Swiss history, society, policies, way of life, political system, diversity , governance, army, education and integration of other cultures, civic education / awareness and social care , quite unique in the world ! And am proud of it, in these times so well brushed in 12 minutes by Andrew Marr. Remarquable journalist and thinker here ! Congratulations !
Andrew Marr offers only a partial explanation for why the private sector promotes a multicultural vision of Britain in the media. Of course private companies want loyal workers and consumers from the ascendant non-white population, but they are only 20 percent of citizens. The other reasons are fear and ideology. Fears of activists denouncing a company's leaders as racist for not being 'inclusive', which can lead to boycotts, suggests self interest motivates execitives too. Then there's the propensity of the media to jump on bandwagons and copy each other. We see this in the over representation of black people in nearly every TV show or ad. Perhaps this leads to yet further alienation among the native whites and the consequent destabilising effects that result (Brexit etc).
Spot on.
Brexit has made britain poorer, shrunk its economy and made it superflous in europe .
Thats the tragedy .
Immigrants or some boat people are NOT the problem.
Vote Reform…to save Britain
After watching the short form social media videos, your calm and wise analysis is a tonic.
I like how you mix personal instincts with learned views.
One of the best presentations I've seen. Well done for having the guts to talk about it.
Andrew addressing each elephant in turn.. I agree whole-heartedly. On the first point about the irony of Brexit, I began thinking that perhaps I had it all wrong and should have voted for Brexit. Perhaps underneath that "angry old man in the pub" facade, Nigel had a soft under-belly and he just wanted a level playing field for immigration. Perhaps that's just fanciful! And on the last point, I think it's become evident that politics has become weak and far less significant, leaving business and the media to drive attitudes. Finally, I too hate the common use of words like "mixed-race" or "bi-racial" which is only used for African- European or Asian-African mixed ethnicities but not used for European mixes or even European-Asian mixes. I also hate the "black" and "white" identities which are such lazy and inaccurate ways of describing origin.
Andrew, I find your voice hypnotic. If you asked me to buy a used car, I would immediately seek out a loan. Thank you for your excellent commentary. DA ( Vancouver, WA - USA)
Very good exposition Andrew. It has given me a more complete understanding of the social and political dynamics existing in this country.
What a wonderfully thought-provoking piece !
People are not furious about migration. Politicians are blaming immigrants for their failures to meet the expectations of people..
The effects of Brexit don't matter.
If the ending argument about capitalism (customers/employees) was right, how do you explain the racist practices of businesses both small and big the past in the USA and even today in some places?
Does democracy not exist? Are people not allowed to oppose immigration, or is that not allowed?
Great monologue and summing up of where we are on this.
I liked the way you were able to show why capitalism in these European countries thrive on immigration and that's partly why we see so many blacks and indians in commercials.