Hybrid Mode vs eSave+Battery Save efficiency test. Wow, what a difference.
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
- During a long road trip, I decided to do some experiments with different modes and driving in different ways. Here are the results of my first experiment of comparing the efficiency of Hybrid Mode with eSave+Battery Charge. The difference is pretty amazing.
The only issue with this test - the entire reason regular hybrids (plug in hybrids allow an external form of energy so a little different) exist is so they can regain energy from inertia. You use energy to accelerate and maintain speed. Well regen allows you to mitigate some of that energy you used to accelerate. It does nothing when you are at a steady state on the highway.
So a highway test, while the easiest way to obtain results, is not the best way to test the efficiency.
This is why nearly all hybrids do so well in the “city” mpg. Their highway mpg is only a factor of the efficiency gains made on the vehicle and it would achieve that with or without the hybrid system.
They perfect test would be a series of starts and stops for like 50 miles. That is a logistical nightmare and time consuming too. But you get the idea.
I’ll try to post some data since I live in a dense area of NJ, and I am constantly starting and stopping. i ordered my 4xe in mid January. It’s literally why I’m switching to a hybrid.
We just finished our first tank of gas on our used 4xe. 1000 miles. For $67 in gas and maybe $20 electricity. This of course was mostly short trips that were fully or nearly covered by the battery. Given we forgot to plug it in a few times and had a couple longer trips, I'm guessing the next tank will last us 1200 miles. This has been really fun and interesting, our first hybrid vehicle.
My PR so far is 1365 miles on a single tank. It gets to where you try to not use the gas engine. I have enough random, unplanned drives that I can’t do much better than 1000 on a tank right now.
Loved the video. Our 4xE is on it’s way to Birmingham - cannot wait for it’s arrival.
Thanks for all the information on the 4xe. It's helping me with my decision on pulling the trigger. I've driven jeeps 30+ years and this technology is interesting. FYI...... I've found that in both my JKs and my 2018 v6 jlur, if you cruise below 70 mph (I set cruise @ 67 mph), you'll obtain much better mileage in general. I have 37s with a 2" lift and I get @ 17-19 mpg. My odometer is adjusted with a programmer btw. Thanks again for all the great info
If you can, I’d try to account for elevation change and wind direction. Did a long drive yesterday and those were big factors as well. Hard to hold all factors equal, but appreciate your efforts to try to figure out the black magic!
Wind??? How would that make a difference on the wind streamed designed Wrangler. NO better designed brick on the planet LOL ( FYI all joking folks I love my 4xe )
Thanks for another informative video! Not sure, but if we were to plot gas usage vs time, there are likely brief periods where the mileage drops significantly (accelerating, going up hill, ...). In e-save the ICE is running most of the time to prioritize maintaining the battery charge, but in hybrid mode, it can use and optimize both ICE and Electric thus, reducing the impact of these high gasoline usage periods.
thank you for this experiment. I have a 22 4xe
American Flag grill inserts look great w/the granite crystal paint
I can concur that the hybrid mode is much more efficient. I have had similar results while pulling a small trailer.
Charging everyday is a P.I.A. so I usually drive in E-Save mode and I get approx 22.5 MPG ...My travel is about 50%/50% - City/highway miles and I use E-Charge
@@DR-dx5zc If you calculate your gas milage when you fill up, you likely are not getting 22.5 MPG in eSave. The dash calculator cannot adjust for the added resistance of the motor/generators when they are generating. It can be off by up to 4 MPG compared to hand calculating. It’s a thermodynamics issue.
I’ve had mine for about a month and am about a quarter tank into my second tank. When I’m doing random driving of 50 to 100 miles or so, I’ve been switching to e-save (charge) once up to highway speed, based on the theory that highway speeds are when gas engines are most efficient. When I hit traffic lights, etc, I switch back to hybrid mode. Not sure if I’m doing myself any favors but it seems sound in theory.
I haven’t been able to find any scenarios where eSave ever comes out ahead but it’s worth experimenting. Try different methodologies and track your gas milage when you fill up instead of using the MPG indicator on the dash. The calculator in the dash can be deceiving.
Chris, how did you get the “e” on the charge door blue? Was there a certain paint you used? Would love to match that on mine!
Second this - did you use a vinyl decal, automotive paint, or ???
@@joshuakrause7191 3rd on this.
@@joshuakrause7191 A friend in the Wrangler 4XE Facebook group makes these.
@@ghzhammer A friend in the Wrangler 4XE group on Facebook makes these.
A friend in the Wrangler 4XE group on Facebook makes these.
Thanks for your informative videos. Where did you purchase your Electric Door Decal? Thanks.
Several people in the Jeep 4XE Fans group on Facebook have made those.
Get a grand Cherokee 4xe! Getting in mine, 40.0 mpg on first tank, then 47.0 mpg on the next tank of gas. I charge on level 2 charger, costs me $1.20 each time I charge from empty!
Great information! At the end of the e-save experiment, what was the displayed state of charge on your battery? Did that MPG efficiency loss translate into stored battery energy?
I kept putting it in to electric mode when it said I had a couple miles of range to use. I’m not sure what the total percentage of SOC it was because I kept looking for opportunities to spin off the power before I stopped to fill up again to make it as fair to the experiment as I could. I don’t think it really translated well in to a good amount of energy. It just seems like a really bad way to operate.
question??? if there battery is dead should it just be left in hybrid mode and how long can you drive with it
At the
Great information! How was the charging speed when you use eSave+Battery Charge? How much re-charged the HVBattery?
Not much. I only ended up gaining about 7 miles of electric range over 150 miles.
First of all, thank you so much for all your video contributions.
I just got the Rubicon version of the Wrangler 4xe. I swapped it for my Wrangler Sharara 2-door 2020.
I'm a bit disappointed withe the battery range so far, as well as with the real MPG (in my case KM per liter).
As I understood from your experiment, in hybrid mode, driving at 74-75 MPH (120 KPH) you got 7.8 electric miles from a full battery. So the 26-27 miles range on electric guaranteed by Jeep, could only be achieved with a speed of 50-56 MPH (80-90 KPH). Does this makes sense? Thank you.
Jeep only states 21 miles of electric range. But at higher speeds, that goes down a little. The Rubicon is a little less efficient than the Sahara.
I’ve been able to go over 70mph in electric mode but I’ve heard people in Rubicons can’t go as fast as the Saharas and HAs. I think it has to do with gearing because even when I throw my KO2s on, I can still do 70.
@@Wrangler4XEFans As I understood watching your video, the 21 miles of electric range stated by Jeep, went down, on your experiment, to 7.8 miles of electric range when driving on hybrid mode at 74-75 mph, is this correct? Because this is what's happening to me. I can only get 10 miles of electric range when driving in Hybrid mode at 80 mph on highways here in Europe. I understand that the faster you drive the more Kwh are burnt, but only 10 miles of range?!! This is my concern.
Besides, out of the 17.3 Kw of total battery I believe 15 Kw are usable. Thank you for your response.
@@gonzacls No, I actually managed to get 7.8 electric miles without any charging. There are those times when you will get some electric miles without plugging in due to the hybrid system always being part of the equation.
Very informative, thanks. Btw, how did you get the flag placed on the grill. Amazing
Under The Sun Inserts.
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Where did you get gas at $2.699 per gallon in your experiment, or was that referring to some other "unit cost?"
This was from over a year ago.
@@Wrangler4XEFans yes but even 2021 prices were crazy at that time. Just a curiosity... nice video
@@Bobbo30 That was somewhere out West too. Not sure if prices are generally lower in that part of the country?
Hey there aside from what jeep thinks is the most fuel efficient mode, how would you use your e select modes to save as much gas as possible?
Electric mode when fully charged and the trip can be covered in all electric. Then hybrid mode. The eSave mode is the least efficient mode because it adds additional work load to the gas engine.
@@Wrangler4XEFans thanks so much I’m rly looking into getting this car
So, if you stop and let the battery charge at idle, say from 50% to 80%, how long does it take and how does it affect overall gas mileage?
I've never sat and let it charge up by idling. I did it once just to see if it would work and took quite a while just to gain a percent of charge. It would take a long time and would be the worst way to charge it. It would kill the gas mileage.
What regen mode were you using for this? I commute close to 50 miles one way to work in a hilly region. It is mostly back roads with a few miles of highways mixed in. I haven't done an MPG estimate yet but I keep it in max regen with ACC on and this usually gets me 5-7 miles on the battery for the return trip.
esave + battery charge.
It would be interesting to see the difference between just running it in hybrid mode vs using esave. My guess would be that you’d come out ahead just using hybrid mode all the time. By the way, I no longer trust the on board MPG calculator for these kinds of experiments.
Its because you may have the REGEN Engaged? If so?.this is why your only getting 17 mpg. It uses some gas too
Max Regen only kicks on when decelerating. It reverses two of the phases on the 3 phase AC motor/generator in the transmission referred to as P2. It only does this when you lift your foot from the accelerator. It really doesn't impact highway MPG since you aren't decelerating much. I don't use it on the highway anyway since it slows it down more than I like.
The reason it uses more gas is because eSave asks the engine to work harder to either charge or save the battery level. In charge mode, the extra gas use is self-explanatory since the laws of thermodynamics tells us that we don't create energy, we just transfer energy from one form to another. So if we're charing a battery, that energy has to come from somewhere. In addition to driving the vehicle down the road, we're adding the demand to charge the battery. In the battery hold mode, we're dealing with charge curve issues at higher percentages of SOC that change when the battery is at a lower state.
I have a question. Once you filled up on battery and gas what was the total range that you got on a single tank? How many total miles can you drive.
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Going 74mph in a fully loaded brick and getting 15.2MPG, isn't too bad. Nice to know how good it is in Hybrid mode though.
How many miles does the Hybrid mode last tho? Cause once the battery runs out you are basically forced to be on eSave
No, you’re never forced to be on eSave. The Wrangler 4XE is always a hybrid. Just like regular hybrids, plug-in hybrids operate much the same after the electric-only range is depleted. The 4XE has two electric motor/generators. One is the propulsion motor in the transmission and the other is on the front of the gas engine. Once the gas engine is running, the one on the front of the engine provides charge for the battery. The one in the transmission can do the same when conditions are right. So the battery is maintained around the 15% total state of charge so it can always assist with propulsion.
@@Wrangler4XEFans Oh I see now. I didn't know this. Just ordered my 4xe rubi yesterday and its my first hybrid car. Thanks for the detailed answer. So going off of your video the 4xe has a rating of 22 MPG on hybrid mode. How would this number differ if the car is in hybrid mode with a fully charged batter vs empty battery? I am thinking of taking my car on a long road trip and ik that the battery will run out on this trip
@@RedFaceeee There are people that utilize what many call M8 mode. You can pull the shifter to the left and manually shift. That forces the gas engine to run and makes it run in like a forced hybrid mode. Most people can go about 70 miles from the 100% charged to the
@@Wrangler4XEFans Can you expand a bit on this M8 mode or link to a video that explains this?
@@Machine1775 The idea is to pull the shifter to the left to the manual shift mode. Then try to keep the RPMs low by keeping the speed in the sweet spot to keep it in 8th gear. It forces the Jeep in to a more blended hybrid mode where both the gas engine and the electric motors are all working. It slows the discharge of the hybrid battery because it’s sharing the load with the gas engine.
For me, the jury is still out as to if it’s more or less efficient than just letting the vehicle make its own decisions. I have an experiment planned but it’s going to take the better part of a day to do. So I haven’t done it yet.
Worst hybrid car ever, shamed
Can I ask what leads you to that conclusion?