The Sans & Ice-E Conspiracy, and Deltarune Papyrus Mysteries | Theory Discussion
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- čas přidán 17. 06. 2024
- In this video I discuss how Ice-E connects Undertale Sans to Deltarune as well as dive deeper into the mysteries of Deltarune Papyrus and what this means for the Sans from Deltarune theory. It's a followup to my previous video: • Is Undertale Sans from...
You can check out my other Deltarune and Undertale theory content here: • Learning to Love Berdl... also post other analytical content, right here: • The Truth About Papyru...
Check out HalfBreadChaos' Ice-E video here: • What is the Nightmare ...
Timestamps:
0:00 - Introduction
0:13 - The Ice-E Connection
2:50 - Papyrus and the Sun
4:08 - Papyrus IS in Deltarune
6:00 - Mysterious Kickstarter Art, or Just a Joke Pic?
6:57 - New Inverted Fate Promo, Plus an Inquiry
New Inverted Fate video: • Inverted Fate: Victory...
Read the full story at: invertedfate.com/chaptersSupport me on Patreon: / dorkedmy Ko-Fi: ko-fi.com/invertedfate
Hurricane Heartbeat: archiveofourown.org/series/16...
Antipode: archiveofourown.org/series/18376
#Undertale #Deltarune #Sans #Papyrus #SansUndertale #PapyrusUndertale #SansDeltarune #PapyrusDeltarune #DeltaruneTheory #UndertaleSans #UndertalePapyrus #DeltaruneSans #DeltarunePapyrus #Ice-E #IceE #Dorked - Hry
Thanks SO much for 14k! This is a followup video to my previous theory discussion: czcams.com/video/uyWHp7pAbsw/video.html Check out the new Inverted Fate video here: czcams.com/video/Ctx1mYH1ix4/video.html Also, if you can, please check out my Patreon over at patreon.com/dorked. Every pledge helps me keep the creativity going and allows me to pursue my passions and spend more time making content for you. I also have a ko-fi at ko-fi.com/invertedfate. Check out my other Analysis vids here: czcams.com/video/4VfHhBh1c8c/video.html
Read Inverted Fate at: invertedfate.com/chapters
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Read my Kingdom Hearts fic, Antipode at: archiveofourown.org/series/18376
Hurricane Heartbeat: archiveofourown.org/series/1607731
I highly doubt it, but...If you read this I'd like to ask you to review Determination's actual effects. I believe a very very very severe fandela effect is spread on the entire community on HOW determination even works. People think for example that Determination KILLS monsters, when literally no case of determination has killed monsters directly, and some people think that it melts monsters, when every single case without exception is DYING monsters, and people say Undyne is arbitrarily an exception. I think there is a chance even you might've been hit by this misinterpretation. I want someone like you to actually cover this situation because it infuriates me how people insist on this when there is no actual concrete evidence. The MOST valid point I've seen regards alphys' theories on determination, but even then we have seen potential bias in her experiment, as she was testing without a variable for the way DT works, while we have a variable with undyne.
@@skullzans I think I MIGHT'VE touched on it a bit in the determination and red souls video, but that's a good point, and one I actually use in Inverted Fate as part of Undyne's whole thing. I think eventually it would melt healthy monsters, but I highly suspect that it takes significantly more, especially since Undyne is already predisposed to it. Like, the way I handled it in IF is eventually DT will make monsters melt, but it takes much more if the monster is healthy, power, and in Undyne's case, already predisposed. That she hit that point goes to show how excessively she relied on additional injections later, haha.
@@Dorked Personally, I think the idea that it eventually melts or kills them is dumb, because it is an arbitrary rule. We have no reason to assume it. However, I do think AUs using it that way is tolerable. Its like what you said in determination soul video, where the red soul isn't "Determination" but using it as such is actually fine, despite it being wrong or likely wrong.
**SIDE TANGENT BELOW:**
But, One thing I would like to say, since Determination can reform a monsters body, there is an arguement it could kill a monster if their identity isn't strong enough. IRL, spirits have to maintain a very consistent identity, or they begin to dissipate the parts they stop holding onto. With a body, thats anchored.
Why I bring this up is because with DT creating Undyne the Undying, it has been shown to be capable of changing monsters shape, even flowey shapeshifted despite being physical. This implies that if a monster has too much determination but no direction, they could theoretically fall apart if this was sutained, it wouldnt be lethal, but it would be an amalgamate situation, and they would become dependent on the DT if their magic lost its natural stability.
Then again, thats just a convoluted solution to how to "Retcon" IF's interpretation to mine, and I worry I sound like an arrogant ass for it.
@@Dorked Oh, also I do love the way you handled writing it, even if I disliked the fact of it, your storytelling made me see past it and even like that part of the story.
@@skullzans Here's the thing, tho: Alphys' observation is that the lack of physicality is what makes DT eventually melt monsters. I think given that this is stated in-game, it's reasonable enough to assume that eventually even a healthy monster will succumb and melt. Doesn't mean they will *die*, but when our only examples of DT in monsters eventually do lead to melting (Granted, with fatal wounds for Undyne), I do think it's reasonable to assume. My personal interpretation is that Undyne is able to handle it in her default state because he's strong, healthy, and more importantly- larger than, say, a Whimsun. I think smaller monsters probably have a lower tolerance even at greater health, and illness and injury decrease that tolerance because the monster's body is in a weakened state where DT is more likely to destabilize it.
Papyrus is a shockingly mysterious character tbh. The relevant detail here is that he seems to feign ignorance around Sans: if you call him in the room outside the lab, he's with Sans and doesn't seem to know what a laboratory is. When you call him when inside the lab, however, he's alone, and fully aware of what that "mysterious science house" is. So it's likely that he really does know what the sun looks like, but lied about it for one reason or another.
Yeah, that's why I think it's possible he was faking it to keep up appearances. The issue is we don't have enough tangible proof to stay one way or the other- but I could totally buy that Papyrus wanted to seem like a normal monster, since if he came from DR's world, that'd raise a lot of awkward questions from other monsters.
@@Dorked Came to mention this. Papyrus really is enigmatic & it's hard to tell when he really doesn't know better, is just being comedic, or playing dumb for what could be any number of reasons. He DEFINITELY acted more naïve & cheerful around Sans in the King Papyrus ending, but then dropped the act once his brother left. So there's canon precedent for him hiding things from Sans. & he also mentions in another conversation that Sans never tells him anything. & Sans does talk about him behind his back, sometimes in endearing ways, but in others teasing (depending on interpretation of his tone). So, Papyrus also knows that Sans hides things from him too. They're both so mysterious, perhaps even to each other about some things.
Despite him having the most dialogue in the game (though SO many people never experienced the majority of his phonecalls, both his solo versions & ones with Undyne along, EACH of which have two calls per room), he contradicts himself very often (example: he says he never sleeps, yet also says he cruises while he snoozes), changes his opinion of things depending on others' reactions (though of course, some of that may be his insecurities about being liked & wanting to fit in)... it's hard to really know who Papyrus is! Even HE asks, "DO *I* KNOW WHO PAPYRUS IS?"
So yeah... His stilted delivery & awkward wording about the sun almost, to me, seems like he's trying too hard to seem A Totally Normal Amount Of Surprised™️ about seeing the surface For The First Time, Audible Wink! But... Who knows!
@@Dorked Assuming that Papyrus is the knight also lets you put a few more things into context;
Papyrus would be trying to hide that he is from another world because he almost personally destroyed it and he's friends with Undyne of all people, who literally defied monster biology as soon as someone was threatening the fabric of their world.
It also shows that his "ANYONE CAN BE A GOOD PERSON IF THEY JUST TRY!" philosophy could be a result of experience, that he was the worst but became a good person because he tried. This idea also lines up with lines like Papyrus claiming he's a "tough kinda dude"
so I think we can safely assume sans told him about it afterward to which he was able to tell frisk when they entered the lab. I also skimmed through papyrus dialogues, notes, calls, and labels it seems that he only mentions the lab after that call, so I think that supports he wasn’t lying and his brother explained afterward.
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-her *I will say he says he never sleeps, but that he takes multiple naps? So that in itself doesn't contradict, but yeah
Something else I wanna mention about the "Papyrus IS In Deltarune" section is that Sans says its a shame that he can't go into his store to get milk because it's closed. In Undertale an npc at Grillbys says Papyrus always orders milk. Since Papyrus is a shut-in in Deltarune it's likely that Sans would've been buying that milk for him.
That's a good observation! xD And now I'm reminded of that weird milk cat in chapter 2.
@@Dorked do you mean the milk dish alphys keeps in the alley? because i’m pretty sure it’s Susie that’s the cat then
@@nraflower No, the one in the store.
He owns that store though so hmm
Also the random sun in shadow puzzle with Susie and Berdly in chapter 2?
It would be an interesting parallel if Papyrus ends up having meta-knowledge in Deltarune, like how Sans had meta-knowledge in Undertale. Sans' expressions and dialogue in Deltarune makes it hard to tell if he has that same knowledge, maybe leaving room for Papyrus to eventually fill that role? That's all just my brain pasta though
I think it'd be cool to show Papyrus being in the know about certain things, especially when the fandom tends to boil him down to being a dumb "cinnamon roll". x-x
@@Dorked Papyrus has meta knowledge too; he knows about the dating HUD (even remarking on it if you choose not to display it), & in several of the endings he specifically critiques the quality of said ending (often with comedic contrariness). Then there's him uh... seeing over the phone. Repeatedly. I think there are a few more cases, but those are the first that come to mind.
Oh! That's an interesting take! It'd be a really interesting character exploration if Papyrus was the one dealing the the existential crisis and depression instead of Sans!
Toby is one helluva mastermind
Created one of the most picked part lores/universes I’ve ever seen in an indie game. You love to see it. :)
There's so much wacky stuff to chew on and it can be so hard to tell when he's trolling and when he's serious. xD I respect that, though.
Okay, so, I fully believe Papyrus is the Knight, and I will die on this hill.
But more importantly, I think that there could be an explanation to Papyrus being from Deltarune and going to Undertale, yet not knowing what the sun looks like. And my idea is that Papyrus is intentionally acting ignorant to the sun. I mean, he's not stupid. He knows that he should hide that he's from another world. He's the same guy that uses reverse psychology to trick Undyne into befriending you, and the same guy who talks about Sans's time bending pranks.
Plus, when Sans replies, he's looking to the side. The same thing he does when he's not being serious, as if he knows that Papyrus already knows what the sun is, but is humoring him to keep the gig up. Especially because everyone else seems enamored by the sun. They need to blend in, right?
Just an idea, though.
Also, Sans's reply "We call that "the sun" my friend" is a bit weird for him to say to Papyrus because he wouldn't call him "my friend" but it makes perfect sense if he is playing it up for show instead of genuinely trying to tell his brother that information.
Personally, I think that Papyrus coming from DR is a safe bet. After all, he is said to have randomly shown up in Snowdin one day alongside Sans, and there is no evidence that indicates that Papyrus has ever lived without Sans elsewhere in the Underground.
As for him not knowing what a human or the sun looks like, I’m leaning towards the amnesiac theory. One piece of evidence that may point in this direction comes from the UT Winter Alarm Clock Dialogue. Near the end of his portion, Papyrus states that, although Sans never explicitly said so, he thinks he’s happy to have been able to celebrate the holidays with so many friends (which is likely connected to how much he misses his old friends pictured in his photo album). Papyrus then follows this up by stating that he “CAN’T REMEMBER THE LAST TIME HE WAS ABLE TO DO THAT.”
While some may argue that Papyrus is simply exaggerating, his choice of words still seems somewhat suspicious. After all, why not just say that “IT’S BEEN A LONG TIME SINCE HE’S BEEN ABLE TO DO THAT”? As such, this may serve as a subtle indication that Papyrus truly has little to no recollection of his home world and Sans’ past life. This might also tie into the “don’t forget” drawing Sans keeps tucked away inside of his photo album.
(And as for Papyrus’ presence in DR, one additional piece of evidence that points towards this is DR’s steam description, in which Toby states that Papyrus is “busy.” I honestly get the feeling that this version of Papyrus is going to end up being more similar to his original concept, which is why Sans asked Kris to come over-Papyrus needs to stop hiding in the darkness of escapism, and learn to embrace the light of reality. This would tie in perfectly with the central message that DR has been setting up.)
Huh, that's an interesting point regarding amnesia as a possibility. Hadn't considered that angle!
I don’t want papyrus to be a redditor or a discord mod
@@Dorked There's also the very odd description of Papyrus when you Check him in the G-route: "Forgettable." Like... How? He's very memorable, both to players & other characters. Then again, Papyrus seems to think nobody likes him, yet if he's killed in a Neutral Route, SOOOO many townsfolk speak fondly of him & wonder where he is. Maybe they just took him for granted, &/or never really told him they liked him (Though at least the hotel lady gives him candy).
It's one more piece of this puzzle, I think. A single word, but SO significant when "Don't Forget" is such a recurring theme in Deltarune, & is held in such a deeply secret place in Undertale.
I do think having a note to not forget (something) about those unknown people is a little suspicious, like, does Sans actively need a reminder...?
Cool ideas! I want to add another random peace of information and how I took it if that’s alright.
Papyrus mentions the “wind in his hair, sun on his skin” in a previous conversation in his room when you look at the racecar bed, suggesting that he does know what the sun is, but then asks what the “giant ball” is later at the end of the game.
I think it’s a similar situation to the laboratory conversation, he contradicts himself depending on who’s around to hear him. He seems to know what the sun is around you/Frisk, but once everyone is on the surface and Sans, Undyne, etc are next to him, he pretends he doesn’t.
It's worth noting that Sans' dialogue portrait from Undertale where his pupils disappear is still present in Deltarune's files, which implies that this dialogue portrait may pop up somewhere.
If this is true, than Sans might end up being a major character and if Sans is a major character than Papyrus kinda also has to be one
I'd like to think Ice-E is going to be some sort of amalgam-style boss fight to tie into Nightmare and Noelle's fear of him, where it's unnerving, but once you win it might calm down and become an ally, like most minibosses so far (Clover, Tasque manager, ect). Of course, this required us getting a Pezzarria dark fountain (which I'm hoping for anyways, more burgerpants is always a joy to see), but that seems quite likely considering the named buildings in town with the most notable, semi-repeat or original characters.
I totally expect Ice-E to be some kinda nightmare hellscape. There's even precedent with Toby describing it as hell in the anniversary livestream. The main reason I omitted that here was because HBC already talked about it in their vid and I was more focused on how Ice-E could potentially prove that UT Sans is the same as DR Sans before blowing holes in that point with the sun. xD
@@Dorked Exactly where I got that theory from! HBC has some great videos, wish both you and him got the attention you guys deserve!
Also, I'm surprised no connection was made to Ice-E melting, and Papyrus's sun dialogue... More food for thought!
It’s pizza pants in deltarune
Remember when Jevil said that hell's bubbles roar from the deep? What if he wasn't referring to The Roaring and was actually referring to Ice-E?
Could tie into that song Onion-San heard too 🤔
@@Dorked I suggest you check out HalfBreadChaos's Theory on Ice-E.
Lemme check what it's called
Maybe we're being pranked across time and space
I really would not put that past Toby. xD
I hate when that happens!
Oh man, I love the idea of the Pizza Call Fun event being Deltarune!Alphys calling from across time and space so much, I think it's my headcanon now
IT'S A NEAT IDEA. It would tie into the other Deltarune connections with the Fun events for sure. xD
I think it's also possible that Papyrus hasn't seen the sunrise, which would explain his confusion (even if the comment about "meeting" the sun is still weird), or that both Sans and Papyrus forgot Deltarune but pieced enough things together to know they came from somewhere (with the "don't forget" picture being one of the things that made them realize)
THAT IS A GOOD POINT. Both having amnesia I could vibe with a LOT better than just Papyrus, tbh. At least then it'd be more balanced.
This is a good theory
assuming that sans and papyrus only got to the town around the day of chapter one, that they're darkners who found a way to move there from the dark world, and that the events of deltarune's final chapter will involve some sort of world ending event... it seems very likely that papyrus could've just gone the week that deltarune (probably) takes place over without seeing the sunrise. it's a lot of assumptions but it isn't impossible!
@@gretchling5012 Papyrus is a monster. There is no doubt about it.
Sans on the other hand... Who knows.
@@Dorked would make sense as well in that something would probably have to go SERIOUSLY wrong in deltarune for them to appear in Undertale
I can’t wait to meet sans’ brother, Prunsel!
Oh yeah I almost forgot about that word search.
I find the prospect of Deltarune Sans giving Undertale Sans a kids' crossword as a token from his world extremely goddamn funny.
xD Yeah, if it turns out they are separate Sanses, that would be an A+ prank across time and space.
@@Dorked ...Papyrus did say Sans tends to do those doesn't he?
HmmmMMmMmMMMMmmmMm
LOL
That's honestly pretty in-character ngl haha
If Ice-E smiles while sweating when he's in terrible pain, does that mean the Ice-E we see on the crossword puzzle is experiencing a 10/10 on the pain scale? Poor guy
if papyrus is actually the knight, i'll be super happy
YEAH, same! I love the idea, and I really do hope to talk about it more in-depth in a video on possible knight candidates. It just might be a lil' bit since there are other vids on the docket that my patrons seem interested in.
@@Dorked that would be cool
i hope it’s mad mew mew
@@DoodleZoo stop
@@thekingofdoges why
I haven't finished but I have to thank you for something unrelated. English isn't my first language and sometimes I accidentaly say "pizzeria" and I think to myself: "wait no! that's not the right word." but now I know that it is. Thank you for that.
UNDERSTANDABLE. English is a hard language even for native speakers. Happy to help!
pizzeria is the formal but usually people just say Pizza Lollapalootza
Heh, Jesse Hunter is joking, you're still correct. (Hopefully more people over time will get used to using tone tags to indicate sarcasm.)
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-her Yes I thought so. Thank you
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-herFrom what i’ve experienced and seen, tone indicators introduce more complexity and misunderstanding. It is usually better to let the weird statement be judged wrong by it’s weirdness. It was more useful for me when i got started with english to have people to ask if given confusing elements rather than have more precise and complex statements to determine.
I'm still amazed that so much lore is packed into what is essentialy Deltarunes demo.
Yeah, Toby's really good at leaving mysterious hints and buildup.
I really love this theory If only for how it expands papyrus’s character.If he really is from the dark world,and the theory’s about him being the knight are true then his”anyone can be a good person if they just try”belief during genocide isn’t just naive hope,It’s a philosophy created from personal experience.It makes his determination to help you even as you work to destroy the world mean so much more.
As someone who thinks Sans isn't from Undertale, I have an theory on Papyrus's location... UNIVERSITY.
Also, I'd love commentaries and dev stuff about Inverted Fate!
I could see him doing remote learning, if we're to assume he's still in town. :o Maybe he's such a shut-in because they moved from where they lived before and he's still a lil' blue about that.
I like the weird symmetry of sans being from deltarune and papyrus being from undertale. There’s no justification for it at all but i like it.
xD It would open some holes, but it is a funny and wacky idea for sure.
@@Dorkedboth of them being the older brother,,,, funky
2 points worth mentioning:
1. I-Cee's pain chart... Two taste choices for the Goner Maker are "pain" and "cold."
2. Papyrus hasn't seen the sun... The new skirt from Fangamer suggests that Papyrus is the Eggman. If this is the case (still a big "if," to be sure), then Papyrus Undertale could be from Deltarune- just not the Light World.
Many people think sans is a Darkner. Maybe Pap is, too?
Two things.
1. Papyrus is younger, so it’s possible he’s still a child in the Deltarune verse and his memories have faded over the years.
2. Both of them could have some degree of amnesia from the transport, and Sans just got off easier(perhaps spurred by the picture or his older age?)
Actually it seems that Deltarune is taken a few years after Undertale? After all, Monster Kid is older
Now that I think about it, this video is literally talking about how probably Sans and Papyrus moved from Deltarune to Undertale so... yeah.
But I think that Papyrus isn't that young. I mean, he seemed to be just a little younger than Undyne, considering that their usernames are "CoolSkeleton95" and "StrongFish91". But I don't know. Maybe I'm rambling nonsense
What interest me most is the tiles of Sans and Papyrus' house being removed in the public release. Toby has literally no reason to do that since we've already seen the inside of their house. I suspect the inside of their house is completely new
just like the inside of 'Sans is different from the inside of GRILLBY'S
When papyrus asks what the thing in the sky is, he could be asking if it's the sun or the moon as he does not remember exactly what they look like so he asks what it is.
Also true! It depends on how long he's been down there among other factors. xD We really don't know what his deal is yet with regards to DR.
@@Dorked
Yep, personally I find ice e decently compelling evidence as I cannot think of a single other place where ice e is mentioned in Undertale but we'll just have to wait and see.
I’d love to see more of Papyrus being the Knight.
I do wanna touch on it at some point, but I think if I do, I'll wanna do a couple of different knight theories as part of the discussion, e.g. the Alvin theory, Dess theory, etc.
If I may offer my personal reasons for believing it, in case you might not have heard of some of them, here are some of my personal reasons for believing that Papyrus is The Knight.
Papyrus in Deltarune would be MISERABLE given what we know about his personality from Undertale. He's eager to know people in Undertale, but in Deltarune he's a shut-in and has no known friends, or even anyone who's remarked on him outside of Sans.
There's a common misconception that I've seen used by some people in comments to try and disprove Papyrus as being even a contender to be The Knight, and that is an automatic assumption that The Knight is inherently evil and that Papyrus could never be truly evil, only misguided.
And to that, I personally agree with the latter. Papyrus (possibly quite literally) doesn't have a mean bone in his body. He's too nice, that's what makes Undyne hesitant to let him become a Royal Guard. He's the only monster in Undertale who seems to be capable of NOT killing the human outright, and a human's ability to deal damage is tied to how much negative emotion they put into their attack, how much hatred they let course through their strike.
If the same applies for monsters and their ability to damage humans, then it could be further proof of Papyrus being quite literally too innocent, too worried about others to fight or kill anyone, and there's good evidence to believe that a monster's power scales with their negative emotions towards their target, with Undyne the Undying and Sans becoming vastly more powerful than they normally would be based on their sheer hatred for you. Flowey MIGHT be a counterexample for this, given how they're... kinda the most outwardly negative being we could fight in The Underground, but they're also toying with us every time we fight them, which could explain why they leave us at 1 HP at the start of the game and why they deal constant damage during the Omega Flowey fight in the Neutral route, regardless of your Level of Violence.
Back on track, if Papyrus is too nice of a person to truly wish anyone any ill will, how could he be The Knight? I personally believe that his sheer loneliness drove him to create worlds where he could have power, where he could have friends, as an escape from a world where he didn't and couldn't. In the Dark World, Lightners are seen as incredibly powerful beings, and many Darkners are open to being spared and interacting with Lightners.
As queen posits, "is it not possible for anyone to make a dark world?" While it's possible that she is truly unsure of the answer, it's also possible that in the Deltarune timeline, monsters possess more physical bodies, and as such, can access the power of Determination. (An example of this is the fact that Kris, a human, is physically healthy in Deltarune despite being what seems to be the only human in Hometown, and would need physical food to be specially prepared for them if they had any special dietary needs compared to the local monsters, since a human needs physical food and not just energy to sustain their body, both in Undertale and the real world.)
It's entirely possible that monsters in Deltarune DO have access to determination, and if someone was lonely enough, they could channel their determination to make any friends into their blade, plunge it into the earth, and make a dark fountain.
As for WHY Papyrus would even make a dark fountain if he knew about The Roaring, it's possible that he just straight up doesn't know. He could have been manipulated by The Angel's Heaven into opening up Fountains, blind to the balance of light and dark he is tipping. It'd be a very Papyrus thing to do, given how he gathered everyone in The Underground to The Barrier during the True Pacifist Route at Flowey's urging.
As the final piece tying my belief down, Papyrus' main outfit he wears in Undertale has a knight motif, bearing an emblem on the lapel as the most obvious and most important detail.
As for where I this would take the story, I think it's possible that Susie isn't The monster mentioned in The Legend, but that Papyrus is. I'd imagine that if he got chased down and told of the magnitude of his actions, he'd be more than willing to try and stop what he's wrought with his new friends, restoring the balance and finding his own balance between reality and escapism, because that's just who Papyrus is. If Papyrus in Undertale is Papyrus from Deltarune, it's possible that this experience is what ingrained in him the idea that anyone can be a good person if they just try to be better. That line just feels like something Ralsei would say to cheer someone who has given up all hope at being able to fix something, in my personal opinion.
Sorry, I went into this wanting to only list my points but the storyteller in me decided to have a bit of fun with this.
Definitely looking forward to your video on the topic, and you make really insightful Undertale/Deltarune content.
I hope I was able to bring up something that you might not have considered, that you might be able to use in your video!
5:18 Lmao Toby is well aware of our datamining power and is now censoring spoilers.
We should maybe prepare for the possibility that Papyrus isn't as plot relevant as we would like him to be. Maybe Sans is the only mysterious one out of the two, and Papyrus is kind of an open book.
It wouldn't be IDEAL, but it's certainly possible.
I think the main reason I suspect Papyrus is gonna be somewhat important is because I feel like it'd be really mean spirited of Toby to tease Papyrus like this and then never have any payoff. Doesn't mean he'll be THE Knight, but I'm sure he'll have something going on.
Nope, UT Papyrus is plot relevant AND mysterious. The only thing is that it's more hidden. Basically just offhand comments that are pretty easy to miss. I don't think Toby would tease Papyrus for so long just to make him some comedic relief character.
Papyrus as the Knight would be hilarious, god I hope so
I appreciate the analysis of the actual info and facts that Toby has presented us. I feel like a huge fallacy theorists fall in is getting so mixed up in their speculation, they forget what the actual facts are they were trying to piece together in the first place.
Although to be honest, I likely will keep some of my headcanons (Like the Gaster-void thing/him being forgotten, as I personally believe in that.) I respect your take on it though 100%, and aknowledge that a lot of fandom concepts really don't have all that much evidence to support it. I will always state however that anything not explictly clarified or stated to in lore is a HEADCANON of mine, and not try to pass it off as canon. :)
We don't know that there's no pizza place in undertale, we just don't go to one. From the backgrounds of the ruins and home, you can tell that there are a ton of places underground that Frisk never goes to
Yeah, I mentioned that- like, Ice-E as far as we know isn't a thing in Undertale outside of one scene, but the existence of pizza is shown in other scenes. :p
I really really have a feeling that papyrus will be the knight he has his battle body which could turn into an armor in the dark world well he doesn't technically use knives berdly was almost gonna create a fountain with his halberd anyways so any weapon that can channel determination should be fine well I don't know how long the grand fountain has been there or how much time sans' dialogue of we just got here covers but there is a possibility that papyrus maybe can use sans' shortcuts himself
As for people who believe in the knight is "evil" theory and how could papyrus be the knight as he is the kindest monster underground think about it this isn't undertale it's a parallel world all of the original cast while not polar opposites are different in someway so I would expect Toby to bait us with everyone's personality being almost exactly same and then give us an "evil" Papyrus. Especially when he mentions that all the undertale cast will be there.Papyrus? oh he is "busy"
Honestly, Sans personality is WAY different from Undertale. Behind his inital layer, it feels like hes geuninely happy and is trying (Given he owns a bar), and seems just a lot more relaxed and chill. And Papyrus being the Knight wouldn't be too unlikely, espeically considering his whole goal in Undertale was to make other people happy and to gain admiration. What better way then that but to create massive worlds for people to adventure in, places where people never have to grow up or be seperated from eachother? Places of adventure and imagination... that defientely sounds like something Papyrus would want to do.
AU where ICE-E and Mew Mew Kissy Cutie swap when
You know, it's funny because Mew Mew exists in both games, but Ice-E is almost irrelevant in UT outside of that one puzzle. Very odd!
Papyrus is straight up a 6D chess genius using his bluster (and his brother's memetic value) to hide the depths to which his intellect goes. I at this rate believe that if he is not originally from Deltarune, then he is, at the very least, in fact, the Knight, if not straight up the main villain of Deltarune, Gaster be damned. Just watch Gaster (who was little more than an ARG leading into Deltarune) be tossed aside for Papyrus and Ice-E to take center stage.
Having watched both these videos concerning Sans . . . an idea is slowly forming in my mind. What if, somehow, the Deltarune Sans and the Undertale Sans somehow accidentally swapped places? One Sans was desperate to get back to the surface where monsters lived in peace, and his shut-in brother needed him. The Undertale Papyrus may have even started the same, a shut-in as well. Undertale is set a few years behind Deltarune, so Sans may have decided to work earlier on with this younger otherworld version of his brother, building up his confidence and trying to help him get out and make friends. Sans seems to go overboard constantly talking about his brother and singing his praises, and even helped design the costume (Papyrus' battle body) to get Papyrus to socialize at a costume party in Snowden that happened some time prior to when the human falls down. Sans may have been desperately juggling this with figuring out how to swap back to his world and his own brother, his familiar place. Perhaps he hung out in Grillby's an inordinate amount of time not just for the food, but because it was the one familiar place he could find, as there was no diner, or ICE-E's pizza in the Underground. Eventually, he got depressed at not being able to go back, and gave up. However, his giving up may have been what spurned Papyrus to suddenly become more outgoing. In Grillby's Sans mentions in one of the dialogue options that Papyrus' pestering and efforts got him to finally get a job as a sentry. Ironically, it may have been Sans giving up that spurred Papyrus into become more outgoing and putting in more effort to socialize and make friends.
On the flipside, Undertale Sans suddenly finds himself on the surface where everyone lives in peace. His brother is (still) a shut-in, but other than that, everything seems so nice he becomes complacent in trying to push Papyrus to make more friends or be more outgoing. This Sans is not depressed, and has not given up, as he got his own store and is running the business fine on his own. Because he's doing great and paying the bills, he's more complacent with Papyrus shutting himself off from the world. Not to mention Papyrus would be a bit older than he was expecting, and has perhaps already solidified into his own routine and is more resistant to Sans' efforts and pushings. Not knowing how to deal with an older Papyrus who's more set in his ways, Sans puts that on the backshelf while he works his business and enjoys the tranquility and sunlight. Kinda makes you wonder if he ever worried about the little (younger) brother he left behind.
So, this at least makes slightly more sense than if JUST Sans or Sans and Papyrus warped worlds. One decides to accept his lot and even finds it as an upgrade. The other suddenly finds himself locked underground, in the middle of a declared war, with the destruction of humans imminent, not to mention his discoveries of the timeline possibly ending, leaving him with no hope. Neither Sans may have met Toriel until later.
Well, that's my idea. I'm curious to see what holes or evidences can be found for this take. I don't think I've seen this exact take in the comments, yet.
Did you see Jaru’s video on this subject?
Great analysis video! I love theories that go deep into pondering & considering stuff! Thanks for uploading!
Great video as always!
Eyyy, thank ye. c:
Hmm... Papyrus battle body inspired by dark world costume change? Maybe...
The ice-e inclusion in Undertale is particularly noteworthy because, as far as I know, it's the only mention of him (it?) in Undertale, and the fact that it's sans who had the word search and prepared it as a "puzzle" makes it particularly suspect.
Papyrus not recognizing the sun is a strange detail, and the fact that sans says "we call that the sun, my friend" is really odd. It really sets it up as sans being part of one group while sans being part of the other (though that could just mean that sans being the older brother was born before monsters were sealed underground and Papyrus was born after, hence the "we" in that statement referring to older monsters who lived on the surface previously, and calling him "my friend" could just be a strange form of endearment [I know I say strange things like that to *my* brother]). However, that still causes issues with the fact that Papyrus doesn't recognize the sun. Amnesia seems a bit cheap imo, and papyrus being a shut-in seems a bit of a stretch. The way that I see it, it's possible *only* sans traveled between worlds and the Papyrus from Undertale was, in fact, from the Undertale world. This could mean that the future of Deltarune has some grim connotations for what happens to Papyrus, and explains why sans is so defensive of his brother in Undertale. It's certainly a lot of food for thought
Another commenter did point out that Papyrus is known to feign ignorance at points. e.g. "science house" vs laboratory depending on when Sans is around, so it's possible that it's that, but I think the biggest question if we assume only Sans came from DR is what that means for a potential UT Sans and what it means for UT's Papyrus, too.
About the Purple Guy... I think he's actually a parody of Barney the Dinosaur (from Barney & Friends, which ran on PBS in the 1990s). It all checks out: a person in a dinosaur costume with a purple main body & green belly. The cloth patches sewn on are obviously to emphasize that it is indeed a costume, & that he's likely NOT a purple dinosaur monster.
Lots of edgy kids always made fun of that show when I was a kid (myself included; peer pressure is quite a thing when you're a social reject who wants to fit in), because it was "for babies," & he had that kind of Goofy-like voice that for some reason adults think kids enjoy (when in fact, most of us just think it's dumb & makes the character seem dumb).
But, for those who remember those days in certain regions, there was plenty of dark creepy mascot controversy that could certainly rival the kind of stuff that inspired FNAF in the first place... (Intentional misspellings ahead to evade YT's silent comment deletion.)
First, simply his empty looking stare & minimalistic, mostly immobile face was legit creepy to some. Then, there were lots of urban myths about Barney, mixed in with real situations that kids misunderstood.
Several arrests were made where ko cane was stashed inside Barney dolls, which morphed into rumors that the real Barney suit had the dust stored in its tail. Also, rumors about the actors who wore the costume over the years (that, as far as I know, are untrue). That one of them cussed out a kid on the show for stepping on his tail. Or that one was a pedal file. Or that one of them h4ng3d himself while wearing the suit.
Also in those days, there were occasionally people dressed up in Barney costumes at stores & parks at various times, giving kids candy or hugs. Sometimes they were obviously unlicensed knockoff costumes that looked ugly or even super creepy. & I heard adults saying that at least one of those costumed people got arrested for Moe less station charges... 😶 Not sure if true or not, but who knows, but it sure got me to not even be tempted by the candy (even before I had joined the edgy crowd, plus after I grew out of it).
Even when the Internet was still very new, like when message boards were posted to via email, there were groups who hated on Barney. There were websites like "Barney is E vil" & "Is Barney Sat an?"
And it doesn't help that one of the most well-known, usually completely serious major news site, CBS News, randomly has a poorly-written, dark & obviously fictitious article (not even on April Fool's Day) from 1999 titled "The Big Purple Dino Is Dead!" (Google it if you want, including"CBS News" it's short & shocking! Contains gory phrasing & mention of Grape without the G. 😵) Like, what even IS that?!
I think he was mostly hated for his omnipresence, just EVERYWHERE with no escape, especially if you had younger siblings or babysat kids who watched it. But even then, merch & music was all over the place in public. It just drove lots of us both kinds of mad sometimes. Heck, reading up to see what I've missed, his theme song was one of many used by the U.S. military to torch ur POWs (WTF, the world should've disowned us for that... 😣).
Poor character, heh... We vented our frustration with playground songs modeled after his "I love you, you love me" closing theme, with the next line being "Let's h4ng Barney from a tree"... Yikes. 😶
So yeah... I'm not sure if any of that might eventually apply to this Purple Guy... Though we ARE seeing echoes of it with Ice-E himself. Kris scaring Noelle saying he's real & eats kids, the cryptid figure, the fact that Ice-E is creepy to some but (maybe) fun or neutral to others & is super popular, despite being super weird & disturbing...
So, he still COULD be a purple guy associated with scary mascots, ironically first seen working with/as one, either way.
But anyway! It's just funny to me here because he's a mascot dressed as a mascot. Then with Chapter 2 having him at the Mayor's office, still wearing the Ice-E mascot head & now also a business suit, it seems like he's going around to different businesses, acting like he works at each place, & thus acquiring more layers of costumes & uniforms as time goes on! 😆 I wonder how many layers deep he'll bury himself in suits!
When I saw you wrote "Barney is E vil" it felt like my heart skipped at least 15 beats before it clicked that you were simply censoring that word. Thought the universe was going to implode for a second.
@@petruciosxd1374 Huh? What's so scary about the phrase "E vil"?
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-her Made me think for a moment that people were seriously using the phrase like that with E separated from vil, as if Toby could have possibly known about that too and made a seemingly random off the walls reference to it in Undertale before expanding on it in Deltarune with the pizzeria and the purple guy.
@@petruciosxd1374 Hehehe, well, kind of cool that telling this tale ended up creating a kind of meta tension, even if unintended. It kind of makes those old legends feel like they're coming back to haunt us again. 😈
@@ZaCloud-Animations___she-her People kept making Barney jokes about Susie, and she was considered a menace even though she isn't _really..._ This. This is the true one. The true Nightmare.
Fantastic analysis as always, you make some of my favorite Undertale/Deltarune content!! As I said in the previous video, I'm almost completely sure about Sans belonging to Deltarune, and Ice E being so weirdly important just makes me believe it even more, so thanks again for more videos to send to people.
As for your other content, I'm not really into KH but I really like your analysis work, so I definitely would still be interested in checking it out, I think posting what one wants can also be crucial to keep a healthy relationship as a creator, and with IF, I'm been very interested in it for a while, but I don't know where to start or what's it about, just that it looks like a lovely piece of work, with a lot of effort, so if you could point me in the right direction, I would be absolutely delighted to check it out!!
Oh, certainly! IF is a long running AU webcomic/multimedia project, and the chronological reading order can be found here: invertedfate.com/chapters Thanks for the kind words, btw. c:
@@Dorked I'll check it out!!
Unfortunately, Toby did confirm that Purple guy is not, in fact, a reference to purple guy, or to anything at all, in the 6th anniversary livestream. Naturally, he could be trolling, but the fact that Pizzapants' suspicions that Purple guy didn't work there were confirmed in chapter 2 when he instead showed up in the town hall means that Purple guy is probably just a completely original meme.
Ice-E being in Noelle's room is also referencing a prank Kris pulled on Noelle in the past, so it's hard to say whether or not it's a coincidence that there's also an Ice-E related puzzle in cyber fields.
Honestly, that comment during the stream came across as pretty sarcastic. I do think it's more than just a fnaf reference, but at the very least Toby seemed pretty aware of the fact that people would draw attention to it.
neat video! def food for thought- there's so much about deltarune we still don't know or only have the crumbs for :p
i gotta say though, i was really caught off to find that you wrote antipode and hurricane heartbeat! im subscribed to those fics on ao3 so it really surprised me that this random video i clicked on was made by an author i follow!
I think Ice-E does have some greater plot relevance, but I'm not sure what.
Imagine if The Warrior turns out to be the Roaring Knight or something wild. xD I don't expect it, but it'd be funny.
Honestly, it's actually pretty likely. (Both the warrior and Ice-E cryptid are in my top 10 canadites for the being the roaring knight)
the Ice-E Warrior is the only monster who considers himself having blood, and also compare it to Pizza sauce,, (tomato sauce) and yearning for battle, which could be a connection/reference to Sans being the only "bleeding" one, and may even suggest/confirm ketchup as it is also a form of tomato sauce, of which he put for battle.
something i still find interesting is how sans bleeds and papyrus doesn't. sans bleeding feels like some pretty solid evidence for him being from the deltarune world. in deltarune, we know that magic doesn't exist in the light world at all, which to me implies that monsters aren't made of magic, and are instead flesh and blood just like humans. susie says that everybody bleeds, and there's an unused sprite of her bleeding
When Papyrus appears in Deltarune I think there will be a lot less Pruncel in Deltarune art.
*Then it must not be finished.*
The theme is just gonna change to DT Papyrus going “who the hell is that?” in response to Prunsel
Thank you for putting the "Papyrus is in Deltarune" section, I always hear people say that papyrus is not the brother sans refers to because he doesn't say his name despite all the evidence of that not being the case.
It's very silly when Papyrus is outright mentioned on the game's steam page. :P I think it's a lot of shitposting but some people legit do think he doesn't exist, and I don't get it.
ok uh heres my theory:
this theory takes place where sans is from deltarune and his door is a portal to undertale so he moves to and fro. since ice-e is a big thing in deltarune, its no doubt that sans has got atleast something as small as an ice-e crossword (especially since he works in a local store hes probably the most updated) so what if he just brought it to undertale and set it as a small 'trap' for the human.
this could be very well wrong but hey, thats just a theory-
I would love to see "pretentious neckbeard" papyrus in deltarune just to upset people who think papyrus was just a naive baby
I think as long as Toby refines the concept so he's not as mean-spirited as the original beta concept, or at least he develops from it. Toby did say he changed it out of concerns for it being too mean spirited, after all.
@@Dorked fair, i just think seeing a version of papyrus who is completely different from expectations would be funny
Amazing video as always!
I'm so curious about Deltarune Sans and Papyrus, but guess we'll just have to wait for a little while until we get some answers. I know it'll be worth it tho. Toby is a genius when it comes to these games.
Keep up the great work and as always stay determined!
Yeah, I think it's good to trust in Toby. He knows what he's doing and he's always had a pretty strong persistence of vision in his work.
@@Dorked Yeah, especially with deltarune since I think he confirmed he saw the ending in a dream. Very interesting indeed. Can't wait to see how he'll surprise us with this.
I know this is unrelated to the video but I’ve really been thinking about kris and how they’re technically soulless. Does kris go along with everything because they don’t really care. Is that also maybe why they were considered weird by the other kids. Soulless beings are proven to feel emotions like fear, anger, enjoyment (flowey), and kris has only been shown to remove the soul when they wanna do something they themselves want to do, such as eat pie. So could it be they’re going along with it because they find it interesting? Possibly also why they made another dark world, they want it to continue.
Just something that was on my mind.
I doubt it. Kris shows a lot of caring for the situation. If you interact with the cages in chapter 1, they worry about the end of the world. If you talk to Undyne about dark worlds, they worry about those, too. I don't think Kris is actually soulless. I think we are just forced to control their soul and thus have uprooted their agency, for better or worse. They seem to be in pain when the soul is removed, but it's the easiest way to resist us short term.
What about... WE, the player, are souless? In undertale you frisk has 2 bands for having chara's and their soul, and kris has one for theirs, too (This is an old theory but it could help). So I think we are the souless puppeteers
@@anothername2557 That would be kind of funny, considering we control people with their soul
Hm, how very interesting and intriguing, i really hope that the next Update isn’t too far off now,
anyway, i watched a particular video recently, about the "Victory" Lap, truly makes me very interested to see how it all ends with Inverted Fate, anyway I couldn’t help but to noticed that you had add Deltarune Characters in your AU, a truly interesting addition i gotta say, it makes sort of sense too, you certainly does come up some very interesting ideas, certainly makes me look forward to whatever else you might come up with in the future.
The end is not as near as people think... but I don't wanna say too much more than that. ;) Thanks for the kind words, btw!
@@Dorked hm, i see, regardless i will still be looking forward to it, ‘cause you’re quite talented, at least in my opinion.
another great dorked video, can't wait for more inverted fate content on the channel also
Eyy, thanks! I was thinking I'd do a leitmotif vid on Victory Lap like I did for Defiance For Your Friends to promote the recent chapter. xD Might do that on, like, Tuesday or something.
@@Dorked looking forward to it!
Since Papyrus is Sans's younger brother, in Deltarune he could theoretically be younger, perhaps even too young to have coherent memories.
The problem with that is that Sans leaves Papyrus alone in their house which I don't think he would do if he was that young lmao
If anything, I suspect DR Papyrus is closer to Kris' age, haha.
great video, your theory discussions and analysis are always really well done!! if you don't mind me asking, would you have any tips on how you organize your ideas to make videos like these?
One thing that helps me a lot is writing it all down in a script. Figuring out the topics and breaking it into chunks and sometimes prewriting also helps!
I feel like a huge part of Papyrus's shut-in nature in Deltarune is due to the fact he has very little to project on in Deltarune to hide some of his more deeply-rooted insecurities. As we know, Papyrus is both a far more intelligent person then he lets off, and has some pretty deep insecurities. Hes constantly seeking for the acceptance and approval of others around him (Hence why hes always attempting to join the royal guard), and generally making people happy in every way he possibly can. However, if you cut out most of Papyrus's outlits for the issues he hides behind his extroverted personality, I could really see him sort of closing in on himself and spending his days in his home, just working on puzzles in hopes he'll one day make something that'll get people to admire him.
Honestly, would be a REALLY interesting parallel to Sans's seemingly better off life in Deltarune. Where he owns a bar and seems to be relatively well off with no signs of Nilhism or self-loathing. Thinking about it, the phrase 'Your choices don't matter' really does sum up sans's entire philosophy in Undertale pretty well... Eh, starting to ramble a bit.
What do you think, Dorked?
new video! hyped to watch!
Hope you enjoy!
I am kinda hoping that Papyrus turns out to be the Roaring Knight, coz that would be really cool, and he's also a large person, and my favorite character, and AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!
I don't know what else to say, I just felt like screaming. XD
Excited to watch
Awesome! Hope you enjoy.
ICE-E will be Noelles Secret Boss Fight
I love your Undertale videos 💖💖💖
The VAST majority of monsters live and work in New Home. So there's definitely a pizza shop up there.
Remember the long walk through the King's castle shows you houses and buildings stretching as far as the eyes can see.
I think Snowdin, Waterfall, and Hotland are mostly there accommodating the monsters who suit the climate there. I feel like they probably work in the appropriate industries for the location. E.g. CORE coolant, Royal Guard, snail farming, etc. But most of the monster population are best suited to the Capital
Ice-E could always just exist in Undertale yet be incredibly beaten down due to Mettaton being the M E G A - S T A R, kinda place Sans would love tbh. Yet in the Deltarune universe, without Mettaton being the uncontested MEGA-star he is, they would actually be able to compete, possibly with them even becoming the MEGA-star.
Why do I say MEGA-star instead of superstar? Or just megastar. Megastars are basically just superstars, but there's little to no competition to them at all. So, for example, Mettaton only has to contend with the Spider Bakesale (since he likely sells stuff to the shop keepers and Grillby), since they produce their own stuff.
And I just wanted to highly the M E G A because I felt like it
Also in chapter one Toriel references Asriel will be visiting at the end of the week in chapter two sans references his brother will show up when Asriel does and each chapter is one day there’s seven chapters
Kinda unrelated to papyrus but about the knight, could it be that the knight isn’t just one person?
It's definitely possible! I definitely don't think it should be ruled out.
The song "sans." Is the only Deltarune song lifted directly from Undertale with not alterations too.
6:00 lol 😆 why is torial so buff
Buff Toriel is a gift and a treasure. I respect her workout routine.
Flowey's buff too. They're ALL buff, except Sans. XD
Random: Can't wait for Mysteryman to not be Gaster and Mysteryman is Onionsans dad
I think Mysteryman definitely is connected, given the fun value 66 and the gaster follower noise, but I also don't think Mysteryman is Gaster Himself so much as a fragment.
Aha! But Onionsan's SON is Gaster! Now it's all coming together... Damn, Toby really is a genius.
Onionsan is also Onionsans dad
Another Onionsan is Onionsans dad
Then we have Onionsam, the one diferrent guy
Why not being up the the fact that sans talks about other sans existing. What if the two sans are in contact somehow but not the same person?
That's a good point! I think the main reason I hadn't considered that is that the line is said specifically in the context of resetting (e.g. if you come back to fight him after he dunks on you). It didn't quite occur to me to look at it in that context, but it's a fair point!
It would be fun if Undertale sans comes from deltarune. But deltarune papyrus comes from Undertale
I want inverted fate and also the anylitical vids sound cool
great content as always. You could consider getting a better mic it would probably make your voice clearer
One thing people are forgetting with this, is that the guy that goes tra la la, I'm forgetting his name at the moment, says "beware the man from another world." Not men, man. If sans is from deltarune, it means he didn't come over with Paps, which means two things. A, paps died in the last world, or B, Sans was forcefully ejected from his original reality.
i will send all of my energy for the algorithm o7
Eyy, thanks a bunch, Shayy! :)
If papyrus isn’t in deltarune i hope it’s a crossover with omori for kel
The theory Papy is The Knight does make sense, due to his concept art. He might be traveling around with Kris in a way that they can’t see him.
The Knight could also be Gaster trying to free himself from the void, using the vessel you made at the beginning as his dark world/light world form. Unfortunately, I do not have the game on PC, nor do I plan on it at the moment, so i wouldn’t be able to check future code for refrences to my theory. However, I do have some things that might back up my theory.
The phrase: “I’m with you in the dark” could be a reference to the void, not Ralsei in the Dark World. Also, in the song, the part where it says that line, the piano version can be switch backwards and it sounds like Gaster’s Theme but in a different key. And we all know about the “Dont Forget” part. But we don’t know it all. That part in the song can be a major reference to Gaster. Wait I’m getting off-topic- hold on-
Papyrus has been fooled by Flowey before. He could also be fooled by Gaster in a way. He probably told him that he is a shining knight, even if he doesn’t have armor. But he could have Undyne’s armor. Gaster could also just plain ask Papy to free him from the void, as he wants to see his family again but- (insert dramatic tone) doesn’t know where or how to find them if he’s trapped in the void. So Papy feels bad for him, and decides to help him using Sans’ old magic doors.
Alright, my brain’s starting to hurt from the information I’m writing down here, so I’ll explain the holes in this theory another day. Lol,
A big thing is that "the void" as a concept is purely a fandom construct- Gaster was shattered across time and space, and what that really means for him has never been fully articulated on. I talk about this more in this video here: czcams.com/video/Phd0cjrc1F8/video.html
@@Dorked thanks! But the void is still a possibility! :)
i think papyrus is gonna be playable in future chapters, that’s why he’s hiding
I'm really curious about Ch3 with the end of Ch2 implying Toriel may be in the next dark world. I was very much expecting Toby to keep the Undertale characters in the light world, expecting him to want to focus on his new characters and stories and have them as fun references for the fans in the light world. Hinted at this by the fact that at school, Monster Teen, Temmie and Snowy don't have portraits but the other kids do-assuming the other kids will have appearances in the dark worlds while the carryovers from Undertale will not. I figured Papyrus will remain a fun little side character only in the light world just for the fans, but with the hints of Toriel and maybe Undyne in the house dark world maybe we will see Sans or others have more going on. five more chapters to find out !
now we are going to Ice-E with Sans on Theory... soon we will have Theory about that tiny Brown pixel, Theory about Color choise for literally everything, and maybe even is Concept of UT/Deltarune a clue for future of these two. (if it wasn't obivous, i meant we are going deeper with Theoires)
To be fair, it is odd how Ice-E only appears in UT for one scene involving Sans yet is omnipresent in DR. :p
@@Dorked yeah but still, we are diving deeper then ever probably.
3:43 yeah
Idk if they mention this in the video, but on the pain scale, it says at ten (being most pain I’m assuming) he’s happy and sweating, just like in the undertale crossword puzzle, I don’t know how to make a theory on it, it’s just something I noticed
Edit: this is another thing I noticed, in the pin up magazines, it says “H0t and fresh chease, pepperonie, just like in your dream’s” could it be related to Kris’s nightmare in the ending scene of chapter 1?
Interesting Mention: there's MAJOR. proof that papyrus and sans could be from DR's world, the shopkeeper says that both of them just "appeard one day" this could mean 2 things: either papyrus and sans are gaster but splitted in half, OR, they came for DR!
Knight Papyrus truther gang 🔥🔥🔥🔥Shit would explain everything
6000 BC years ago there was the first evolution of Ice-E and the appearance are a man with an Ice-E mask while doing an monkey pose.
So are we gonna ignore the fact that papyrus has an egg in the date and the whole ``man behind the tree`` thing. Also very suspicious that papyrus is busy. I think papyrus is holding some kind of act infront everyone but when we are left alone with him he sort of drops the act. That would explain the sun and moon stuff. Also when papyrus talks about sans` room he calls it a different world and as we know sans` door has the same light the warping doors have. I could be wrong and just talking nonsense but I just wanted to meantion these things. (also the more detailed armor papyrus makes me think toby took advantage of it and will draw some sort of connection to papyrus and the knight)
Whoohoo! I made it into the video!
I have a tin foil hat theory
What if after the full deltarune comes out papyrus will be aviable in chap 1 and 2 and many others?
Huh, interesting! We'll just have to wait and see. I have nooo idea what Toby is doing with Papyrus, but I just want to see best boi.
@@Dorked me too, but I think the wait will be Worth it ;3
Ok but what if there are two separate sans existing at the same time in undertale at some point?
Wait is the papyrus being a shut in the reason for the comic where papyrus is a neckbeard ?
maybe sans and papyrus traveled through multiple universes (including deltarune's) without spending too much time in any of them (explaining why papyrus doesn't remember what the sun looks like) until finally settling in undertale's. But it wouldn't make much sense either, because then why did he open sans his shop if he wasn't planning on staying long? Tbh, that the brothers are directly from deltarune is what makes most sense, but I have a problem with this theory: how does it relate to their relationship with gaster? I mean, that they are from the same universe as gaster is already enough of a relation between them , but after years of feeding ideas of they being his sons / creations / co-workers it seems a somewhat vague and disappointing answer...
Anyways, sorry if im misspelled something, english is not my native language
I definitely think they've been there longer than a day because Sans already knows Asgore's routine. It's too early to say for sure what their deal is, though. The bros are very mysterious!
y’know I can de buff papyrus and the sun Okay here we go so papyrus might have been not created at the time so Gaster and sans could have been on the surface but.when papyrus asks what’s this bright thing in the sky and sans replies the sun so maybe??? At the time he was not even at the point maybe Also I have a rebuff for your theory you can find the g followers in the game Deltarune without the gray everywhere Maybe check their first letter of the names by digging in the files? Hmm? So here guys I might be wrong on a few things but hey Dorked. Hopefully this helps you.?
I already am aware of the non-goner versions of the followers and even showed an example in the video. Not sure how that has to do with the theory, though. xD
I have no clue
ice-e is an amalgamate.
first of all, he melts, snow doesn’t melt in hotland(and everyone thinks it’s normal that it doesn’t melt), and ice doesn’t melt in any point, whether we’re talking about the weakest enemy in terms of stats(sans’ check dialogue is “the weakest enemy”, which is ice, that’s a connection), or the ice thrown by the ice wolf. the only thing that melts is the amalgamates
second of all(the weakest evidence), ice-e says GIASFELFEBREHBER, turns his head up, and froths his mouth, which is amalgamate behaviour
third of all, the bubblegum machine is the only thing in the spamton sweepstakes that doesn’t seem to be related to deltarune, but it’s an amalgamate of several stock images, and a bubblegum machine would fit well in a store such as ice-e’s restaurant
finally, we haven’t been able to beat either final boss through violence and change the ending, why would that change now? in chapter 6, when i have a feeling we will take catti to ice-e’s diner(catti’s snowgrave will give the twisted sword the ability to cast spells, we get an upgrade to damage in snowgrave every two chapters), the final boss will be ice-e, who cannot take damage
one more that i realized on the spot, kris says ice-e is real and eats kids, and in undertale there’s a scene where memoryheads surround you, and they seem to be hungry because they stop when they get food
YOO NEW VIDEO
YOO EGG
INDEED. I felt obligated to follow up on the last one because I missed some pretty crucial stuff.
Fun fact: the ch 2 “catch phrase” isn’t actually the same as it was in the word search
Ice-e
Nightmare
The brother in Deltarune isn't Papyrus, but Prunsel.
Oh are you into Homestuck? I noticed the Light Symbol from Homestuck used to represent the Sun
I used to be into homestuck. xD I just wanted an easy sun graphic and my mind went to the homestuck sun.
Okay but here is threepieces of evidence that Delta room comes after undertale first of all Sans shop has grillby's scratched off second the combination of Cara and frisk to make kris and this one's a bit of a stretch but onionsan muttering they can't remember.
Papyrus being a shut-in doesn't fit with what we know of Papyrus in Undertale, tho. The Grillby's building could've gone out of business and been repurposed in DR's world. I talk about this more in the video related to this one, riiiight here: czcams.com/video/uyWHp7pAbsw/video.html
@@Dorked thanks
how do you know "paptalk" and "paphouse" dont just stand for paprika talk, and paprika house? and the voice at the beginning just really likes the papyrus font.
ICCE E IS FREDDY REAL