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Good video, but you failed to mention that refunds also played a role in the reversal. Would they have reversed the decision if there were no refunds? Maybe, but they probably wouldn't have reversed it as fast.
@@larock0wns I didn't have any data on the refunds. I mostly wanted to focus on how the devs and community worked together for a common goal here, which you don't see very often in today's industry unfortunately.
@@SecondWindGroup Well, I don't really agree with that. If they really cared about the community, they would have fought against Sony from day one and not sat quietly for 9 months and pretend nothing happening. They only went against Sony when the community spoke up. They sensed where the wind was blowing and turned their cloaks accordingly. They didn't work with the community, they used the community to pretend to be the good guys.
The delisting and it’s ongoing issue is the worst of the things Sony did. It feels like fraud to even offer the game in countries they knew they wouldn’t support.
Absolutely this, they sold the game in these countries *knowingly*, it's not like they decided to make it require a PSN account afterward, it was designed like that from day 1 according to Pilestedt. Like, when you do that voluntarily, it's called fraud.
It was only delisted on Steam, and the countries it could no be longer be purchased in included Japan, which I find strange since Sony is a Japanese company. To me, it seems more likely that Steam delisted Helldivers and Ghost because of the PSN requirement. If someone in a country that doesn't have PSN were to buy the game and then discover that they couldn't play some or all of it, that would likely cause Steam a lot of legal problems. As for why Japan was on the list of delisted countries I couldn't say since I know next to nothing about Japanese law.
@@jordonkautz1470 At least according to a Steam customer service rep, the huge wave of delisting HD2 was at the behest of Sony, though it seems Valve took the initiative in delisting the game from an additional three countries to correct an "administrative error". I do agree that Japan is a very strange country to be on the list, though
The current major order claims tons of new recruits are incoming. Could this be an in-universe explanation alluding to re-listing those countries? Fingers crossed for our missing Helldivers.
The biggest problem is that waiving the PSN requirement at the start and then several months of play showed that the game *did not strictly need it to work* thus making its later "mandatory requirement" look like another big fat corporate lie for another big fat corporate grab. Unfortunately for Sony, they decided to try this on a collection of extremely goal-minded players...
Remember when Sony came across as the good guys simply by saying “Our console isn’t always-online”, because they knew what consumers wanted and they understood what pushback was? Good times… from which they clearly learned zero lessons.
Those won't be reversed more than likely. Since this was supposed to be a requirement from the start, the game never should have been sold in those countries from the start. Them delisting it is covering their tracks legally. It's unfortunate, but is what they need to do to avoid any legal action.
Embargo? people were making shit up thinking they were going to be banned for playing in those countries, when Sony rarely enforced them in their other games. Like I have multiple country accounts in a country not supported, they never banned my other country accounts. And now they're crying because Sony actually listened.
@@Kaimax61 How did "Sony actually listend" exactly? They said it would not be a requirement going forward, but they also have added to the list of countries who cannot purchase the game from Steam since making that announcement. Last I checked, The requirement for a PSN account goes live on the 30th, so I wouldn't be surprised if your other accounts get locked out then. This is not them listening, this is corpo CYA at the expense of a good game.
It's funny how usually people cry about review bombing. The difference is Arrowhead was on the consumer side, but most studios and publishers create victim narratives whenever this happens to them. It's extremely apparent how disingenuous those efforts are now.
Makes Battlestate Games (Escape from Tarkov) or Arenanet (Guild Wars 2) all the more vile. Negative feedback? It's bullying, better delete it all! I'm sure there are more, but those are the first two coming to mind.
Review bombing is just a tool though, which sometimes can be wielded irresponsibly or idiotically, and should rightly be criticized as such. Like that time when Chinese players got a Taiwanese game removed from Steam for containing an anti-Xi Jinping poster, and again with Life Is Strange: True Colors for having the audacity to display a Tibetan flag in-game. Or when idiots review-bombed Fire Emblem: Three Houses for being... a Switch exclusive.
If they had just gone for something like "Connect your Sony account and get some in game currency/cosmetics" a chunk of people would have happily done it
"Link PSN to get a free cape + 1000 super credits" boom PSN linking skyrockets and people aren't pissed off because there's nothing mechanical they can't get just by playing
True, but that still doesn't help them in the countries where PSN doesn't / can't exist, so those players miss out on currency/cosmetics in that case. Given how Sony has blocked the countries in question now, it's clear there's something going on in those areas that they aren't willing to work with.
I mean it worked for Amazon. AMAZON, FFS. I still login to Twitch every now and then to grab my freebies, even though the only ones I ever use are Warframe skins...
I think Sony want this so they can add PS+ subscription requirements to future titles. They're seeing the PC market for what it is now and they want to pillage it like they did for their own console player-base.
Unfortunately those regions and countries have still not been relisted, though players that hadn't refunded can still play. the players need to mobilize to try and get those regions back but this may be to late. the active player base has halved since this whole Sony SNAFU
I still find this the stupidest thing Sony does. With the PSN restriction sure... they gotta, but now since it's gone.. why block those countries? INFACT.. Why were they even allowed to begin with!?
On the plus side, now the players have discovered that they do, in fact, have a say in these matters... and Sony have learned that people are finally annoyed enough with the corporate game industry's endless parade of burning dumpsters, to get engaged and hassle them until they stop shitting the damn beds.
@@kotlolish because they plan to reintroduce the requirement later on. It's the only explanation really. They know people won't stay angry forever and a 2nd backlash will be smaller.
The decision to rollback the PSN requirement doesn't mean the requrement is over, it's being postponed. Why else would Sony stop selling the game in the regions without PSN, even _adding new ones after_ the PSN requirement was rolled back? Clearly, they intend to reinstate it, and are just covering themselves legally so they can do it without breaking the law in those countries. That is, as far as I know the only reason why they'd add more countries to the blacklist.
Bc delisting it covers them legally. If this was going to be a requirement from the start, which it was, they never should have sold it in those countries to begin with. But since it was sold in them, there are legalities in place that protect consumers allowing those who already own it, to continue to have access. With them delisting it, and also not selling their future PC releases in those countries, it allows them to avoid this sort of legal issue.
Pilestedt did an awesome job on this. He not only threw his publisher under the bus when they did something to harm the developer, he practically grabbed the keys and offered to drive it.
'It was an unfortunate moment for a game that had really done everything right so far' That's the point. Sony wanted to siphon it for their own benefit, and didn't care how it impacted people. Standard company behavior.
1:32 Games purchased with Steam Keys, like those on Humble Store never show the requirement on the Steam page, because Valve is the distributor in those cases. Many users purchased the game without information that the game mandated a PSN account, hence why Valve can no longer supply the game in countries where PSN isn't available. If they did, they would be liable for purchases not made through the Steam store to be sued for supplying a defective product. Until Sony remove the requirement, no one in the 170+ territories can be supplied the game on PC. All they have done so far is kick the can down the road.
To add, my experience is that I was gifted the game and never even saw a “skip” message on launch nor ever seen the steam store page. It wasn’t communicated to the actual players
This was the case for me. I purchased the game from the Humble Store for myself and my sister and redeemed the key through the Steam client, never visiting the game's Steam store page.
Until the game is re-listed in those countries, I fully expect Sony to try again in a few months. They tried to enforce the accounts a couple weeks before their May 2024 earning call, certainly to show growth of PSN users to their stake holders, so I would brace for the next one.
@@SecondWindGroup People have found archived versions of the games page and the requirement was originally "MAY be need", not a hard requirement. SNOY changed this
Don't forget that Valve enabled refunds for Helldivers 2 without restriction in all of the countries affected. Because of them, Sony started tangibly losing money. In a way, this is just further quiet benevolence from The Great Gaben.
It's the right step. I will note that Sony's move also smeared Valves' reputation. If Sony can region lock a game after months, what about every other game on Steam? Gabe has effectively covered his own backside on a wider issue by taking the consumers side. I assume because he well knows if one company sees profit from this activity, the others will follow. Likely with more egregious nonsense.
@@theghostoftom I think this is the correct answer, though Steam also played a part in this failure: given that the game had the PSN account link as a stated requirement from the outset, Steam's legal team should've advised to not list the game in countries that are not supported by PSN. Idk what Arrowhead's and Sony's role in this was - whether it was an oversight or a play at something (e.g. Arrowhead being a magnificent bastard and letting the chips fall where they may, or Sony simply not giving a shit and wanting to make an extra quick buck at the apparently laughable cost of their already poor reputation).
It is quite telling that these "warnings" on the Steam pages are *well* below the fold, on the side, and in a bland yellowish-brown color. They're there so the sellers can point to them *after* the sale.
Yeah, still learning how slowly they need to boil the frog to replicate their wild success with the embarrassing numbers of people who ran to KuSony's defense. The multi-billion valued corporation does not care about you, their executive board and shareholders would charge you for the privilege of getting pissed on while burning alive.
1:41 to add that noone ever looks there, the notification that the Japanese version is only available in Japan was put directly above the add to cart button. The psn thing should have been there, too
Anyone who doesn't look there after whining for a decade about multiple logins is a moron. (That doesn't change the fact that what Sony did was illegal of course) I haven't bought an EA, UbiSoft, or Sony game in over a decade for this exact reason.
On Steam, if you know where to look, it's pretty evident when some game has 3rd-party DRM chicanery (maybe that's just me, because that'll quickly kill any interest I have in purchasing a game.)
@@anna-flora999 Agreed. Just because I know where to look, doesn't mean a meaningful portion of people do; Steam store pages are long and cluttered with various interface elements of highly variable usefulness, which can make it hard to see these things. I mean, the system requirements of all things are in tiny faded text right at the bottom! (well, above the reviews, I guess, but still). At least they made the stuff orange so it stands out a bit, but still... lot of clutter.
@@hazukichanx408 I have a hard time feeling sympathy for people who don't make fully informed purchases, but I freely admit that it's my "old man bias" showing when I say that. I grew up in a time where you could read the box in the store and had to wait in line before pulling your money out to actually buy the game. It is REAL easy on Steam or other digital services to buy something without half a thought, but I still hold to the belief that if the information was presented to you before you bought, you don't have much of a leg to stand on when that information comes into play once you start the game.
EDIT: Forgive me father, for I have greatly sinned, in my thoughts and in my words, and in what I have failed to do, through my fault, through my fault, through my most grievous fault. Namely, I got zoomer brain and wrote the comment before I watched the video, then I didn't even listen when I watched the video and revise my comment. Also, I did a little more research later in the day and learned that the Arrowhead CEO said discussions with Sony about unblocking the countries are still ongoing. I deserve the L. I'm leaving the comment up though so that people can know what I said. Turns out it may not be over though. Even though Sony has said they'll strip away the PSN account requirement, the game is still unavailable on Steam in many countries where PSN wouldn't work, and that list actually kept slowly expanding even after Sony made the announcement. This concerns me because I was hoping to play this game with a couple of international friends online, and it's not a good sign if the list of blocked continues continues expanding even after the "controversy" is over. I hope they fix this, but I can't help but feel very cynical that Sony will take this deception and ignorance and continue running with it until it's way too late to reverse the damage done to the game.
The Baltics being added was done by Steam as an administrative correction to Sony's original list where Steam had miss the Baltic states. Several US territories were removed from the purchase restriction today. Sony in general has been completely quiet about what's happening. You can't take what's happening on SteamDB as definitive news one way or another. I believe the bit about the Baltics is from Twinbeard.
Sony could have tried the carrot (keep it optional but encourage signups with in game bonuses) or even the carrot and the stick (mandatory but still bonuses) but they instead went Full Stick (mandatory and you get nothing but the status quo). Never go Full Stick.
I really do not think those countries will be relisted seen as they've literally added countries to the list since the PSN "backtrack". Ghost of Tsushima is still going ahead with the PSN requirement and Sony will very likely to force the PSN requirement on PC in a few months again for helldivers. There is no reason not to continue leaving the countries delisted unless they still have plans to reintroduce the PSN requirement down the line. They gave the appearance of giving the community a victory and little else. They know the backlash will fade and when everyone stops paying attention, they'll do it again knowing the 2nd backlash won't be as large.
Still don't understand why the now delisted territories were even available to buy the game from the start if PSN was always going to be an intended requirement. Whether or not they ended up backtracking (currently all talk), they were guaranteed to lose money as they'd b legally required to refund copies in areas without the PSN access.
Nick, loving the perspective and the scripts are solid. ... maybe look into some media voice training resources? Delivery is still the weak link of otherwise top notch videos. Not everyone can be Frost or Yahtz. Marty. Aim for Marty level. I think he's starting with similar conditions and has honed it well.
A tip of the hat to the designer for showing how to handle publisher overreach while supporting their players. Thank you for highlighting this, Second Wind, and long may you continue to shine a spotlight on how this industry grows and matures.
Sony adding Baltic states to the banlist is just precious! Not only are they regular EU countries, but Estonia also sits just above Japan on the living standards index.
It's nice when Nick does a video. His situation was the core drive of the birth of Second Wind and the birth of second wind is an inspiring anomaly in this for-profit run world we live in. Truly spectacular. The video was entertaining too haha.😊
I think the lesson to be learned is that our personal data is valuable to a degree that we don't fully understand if they are committed to removing the title from sale entirely in those countries.
With the "restriction" of Ghost of Tsushima, Sony will not lift the restriction on Helldivers 2 for the 170 region. I got my game refunded thanks for that, and well, I am not going to buy it again, fuck it. I was also looking forward to playing Ghost of Tsushima this Friday, but I can't buy it, so I guess Piracy it is then to play the singleplayer game.
Arrowhead's CEO behaved better than their community manager who went from chastising the community for not creating a PSN account to leading the charge of leaving negative reviews. IMO, of course. Also, yeah, it says Sony Interactive in the announcement, Chief, might want to correct that.
Honestly the thing that hurts this vid in particular (and is also being pointed out here by others) is that this fight is FAR from over since those restrictions are still in place as of this comment. While it's still a W for both the community and for Arrowhead's rep, Sony is still fucking with this game's success unnecessarily
I feel like this was an oversimplification of events, as the community manager's initial reaction on discord was that the community was just whining and that anyone unhappy should get a refund. The twitter backlash made the community manager flip sides and instead told the discord to review bomb the game, which many were hesitant to do until Pilestedt chimed in on letting Sony know the community wasn't happy. This shows that the devs were hoping this would go under the radar or maybe Helldiver's good will would minimize the backlash. But we can see now that this is a big deal and that the devs should have given prior notice. I wouldn't say they had good communicate in this scenario.
I personally kept my helldivers review negative, with the specific note that basically amounted to "I don't trust Sony to not muck it up again" Only to then find out that yea, in spite of the PSN requirement being removed, the countries weren't re-instated, and I was totally right.
The sales ban in those (now) 175 countries still has not been reversed. I don't really understand why. But as long as those are in effect, it still looks like Sony is just waiting to put their PSN linking requirement in place.
I smell shenanigans. It sounds like Sony strong-armed Arrowhead into the dual sign in requirement, Arrowhead "forgot" to implement it at launch, "accidentally" allowed their game to be sold in a bunch of countries where Sony sign-ins wouldn't work, and then "failed" to communicate the requirement to their userbase. (Despite showcasing exemplary communication abilities when it all hit the fan.) And then when they successfully leveraged user rage against Sony, they _celebrated_ by handing out cosmetics. Yay for developers not allowing publishers to ruin their hard work, but still. That's cunning.
The PSN requirement will come back, they're already adding warnings on Ghost of Tsushima's page that it'll be required. It'll come back for Helldivers 2 too.
Please do not forget the HD2 community mod at first mocked people that "they don't have 120 seconds to create an account". After a huge backlash the CM said the quiet part out loud on Discord.
They also apologized for not knowing the requirement and that certain countries literally couldn't before saying that, said the quiet part out loud about leaving negative reviews to get Sony's attention, and then were fired for it, and some in the HD2 community have even created a petition to try and bring them back.
@@SecondWindGroupIt doesn’t matter if Sony wasn’t delisting in other countries anyway. That’s still an antagonistic response to your paying customers, for a job that’s supposed to keep the community positive. Either say nothing or acknowledge this update might be annoying for some people. Shouldn’t be barking back at your customers.
@@SecondWindGroup then again internet mocked "you guys don't have phone"... Sure I'm glad the CM had "redemption arc" but no CM should ever act like that. Am I glad CM lost job? No. But at the same time if I had CM like that I'd be very sad and angry that instead of calming things the CM threw a gallon of gas on a fire.
The Baltics being added was done by Steam as an administrative correction to Sony's original list where Steam had miss the baltic states. Several US territories were removed from the purchase restriction today. Sony in general has been completely quiet about what's happening. You can't take what's happening on SteamDB as definitive news one way or another.
I believe Helldivers 2 is still restricted in US territories, so the FTC probably has jurisdiction. Sending in a complaint would be worth 10 minutes. Not sure about other countries counterparts of FTC, but might be worth a shot sending a complaint as well.
That comment about multiple sign-ins hits home for me. I've been burned by UPlay and Origin in the past, so when Mass Effect Legendary released on Steam, I avoided it because it required Origin. As of right now, it's $6 on Steam and I still avoid it because that requirement became some buggy EA app that breaks achievements for a lot of people. I don't pretend to know the true reasons, but it seems like a backhanded way to try to squeeze in some new advertising streams to people who are already giving them money which is something I will not willingly pay for no matter how good the content attached.
Correction: Sony made the announcement that you reference at the start of the video--not Arrowhead; it is even signed off by them at the end of the messaged displayed in this video.
Aside from the fact that the countries still haven't been put off the restriction list yet, the only unfortunate part is that the Helldivers Discord Community Manager may have gotten fired or forced to be fired by Sony execs because of him publicly stating that those negative reviews and feedback gave them leverage. Bro legit basically put his career on the line all for the sake of making sure we're heard and that we're directed at the right target.
I just want to add another reminder that we cannot let up the pressure on Sony until the game is relisted in all the countries it was taken away from. I personally would recommend anyone that has linked a PSN account to get on A call or text chat with PlayStation support and unlink your account. Don’t let them tell you it cannot be done, it can. if you don’t have a PlayStation, close the PSN account. Everything that we can do that can calmly and ethically hurt Sony over this will help us.
Unless Sony makes a positive comfirmation of not requiring PSN accounts ENTIRELY, Valve will keep the sales in PSN-allowed locations only. It's the only safe move.
I really like your take on this, it's actually unbiased. Everyone and their mothers seem to be super negative and anti corporate on their takes. I get what Sony is doing is wrong, but it's kind of a double standard to put them and arrowhead on the chopping block when other companies in the same industry get away with doing the same thing.
Think one of the bigger reasons behind the roll back on the PSN requirement was that Steam offered full refunds on the game, no matter when or how long the game was played. This affect Sony directly in the pockets, the one spot that no publisher wants to be affected.
I think one of the most important things Steam could do going forward is move the "requires 3rd party sign in" dection to right under the buy button. I never realized it had the requirement because as you say Nick, no one looks, which is on us the buyer of course. I remember when i encountered the PSN linking popup message when i first launched the game, the first thing out my mouth was "Oh are you fucking kidding me?" And then when I saw I could click Skip and avoid it, i was very happy and never thought about it again.
Yea, 05:37 is my reaction today) It has gone from page without a buy button to "this game is not available in your region". Oh, well, I still have games to play)
"No one looks at those little details on the page" But nearly all of us hit the 'Skip' button on the PSN login when we booted it up. I legitimately feel this is an equal share of responsibility between dev/publisher. Arrowhead dropped the ball with their clarity, Sony is... well they're a Corp. Though huge shoutout to bullying Sony for backing down a bit, because PSN is just garbage.
What does a publisher provide a developer by restricting the sale of their game? Are the devs still on to hook for "poor" performance if the publisher is the one fucking things up?
Thing is it's only a very tiny win. HD 2 is atill deslisted in non-psn countries and GoT still requires PSN and is deslisted in non-psn countries. This isn't over, they will push until the executives get their bonus.
Early in the video "nobody really looks at those little details on the page." 5min in "due to the sign-in requirement being removed." It has not been removed. I'm going to keep pointing this out until people stop saying it has been, or until it actually is. As of the time this video was posted, we're 10 days since they *said* the requirement would be removed, but the Steam page still says a PSN account is required.
That's never going to be removed from the page because it's required for crossplay with PS5 which is an advertised feature and they'd end up in a false advertising state.
@@sleeplesson Pretty sure this is not true. Destiny 2 has crossplay with both xbox and ps, and you're not required to have an account from either MS or Sony for it to work. No such requirements are listed on the Steam page either, of course.
Kind of amazing how the developers were so polite and proper with the community while also making it very clear that Sony were the bad guys in this fiasco.
honeslty, i was somewhat aware of this when i got the game, as i did see it in the store and was told about it. So i was surprised that i was able to cancel the sign-in and that it still let me through. edit: i got the game near release date, or a week or two after.
This only adds to the ongoing abuse of nefarious EULA agreements that are quickly becoming out of control displays of gross anti consumerism. Granted, the requirement was on full display but they knew what they were doing from enabling play initially and *THEN* pulling the rug. This action was calculated from the start otherwise it would have been mandatory to have a PSN from the outset.
@@Akabans999 Yes, you are correct ("A-head knew 6 months before launch that it would be mandatory" but chose to disable acc linking initially so people could play), but it all feels rather sketchy to me. Maybe they are only guilty of not properly communicating the later need to link an account. You could also argue that it's the responsibility of the end user to read the agreement requirements and there really isn't an issue here at all, but it's just comes at a time when there are countless cases like this happening right now where contracts are changing after the fact.
1:39 You can absolutely blame the end user for not reading the terms of service. Maybe it's because I work in law, but any time you see an EULA pop up on your video game, you need to brace yourself for the idea that you don't own the game or that conditions to play the game can and probably will change in a way you may not like. Gamers need to get a lot more savvy about what an EULA even is instead of just seeing it as a one-time barrier to play. The devs were responsible for obscuring the sign-in requirements, and they were the ones to list the game in countries in which it couldn't be played. Sony obviously needs to expand its service, but Arrowhead had months of lead-in time and communicated none of this until it came to head. The end result is that they can present this news like Sony just asked them to implement it on a whim, which is bullshit, the login requirement was literally always there. The lion's share of the blame falls on Arrowhead.
For simple plebs like me it'd make sense to not have the PSN limitation, there are so many countries that don't have it If Ghost of Tsushima isn't released on those countries... well then... the sailors of the binary seas will make themselves the heroes of this story yet again
Attention game devs and publishers I should be able to press start on a game, go take a piss and get some water and come back to a game ready to play. Sign in and log in bs f with this.
Except the community backlash had absolutely nothing to do with Sony reversing their decision. Sure, it’s convenient excuse they can point to, but the actual reason is to avoid lawsuits. Because the ‘needs PSN to function’ was there from day 1, the game was sold in several nations it would have been impossible to play in. That’s knowingly selling a defective product. Considering plenty of those countries and regions are in places that have actual consumer protection laws (some in Europe, for example), Sony had opened themselves up to a legal fight they’d have 100% lost. I’m sure gAmErZ would like to claim they beat the company, but you didn’t. The grand machine of corporation and the suits in charge of it don’t care about you or your opinions or where you yell at them, and never have.
![Gungrave G.O.R.E, No Man's Gate [PS5]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/1qVidIYmWNI/mqdefault.jpg)
Thanks for watching! Wanted to shoutout and credit the fanart used in the thumbnail as well! twitter.com/LionelSchramm/status/1759973926707319234
Good video, but you failed to mention that refunds also played a role in the reversal. Would they have reversed the decision if there were no refunds? Maybe, but they probably wouldn't have reversed it as fast.
@@larock0wns I didn't have any data on the refunds. I mostly wanted to focus on how the devs and community worked together for a common goal here, which you don't see very often in today's industry unfortunately.
@@SecondWindGroup Well, I don't really agree with that. If they really cared about the community, they would have fought against Sony from day one and not sat quietly for 9 months and pretend nothing happening. They only went against Sony when the community spoke up.
They sensed where the wind was blowing and turned their cloaks accordingly.
They didn't work with the community, they used the community to pretend to be the good guys.
The delisting and it’s ongoing issue is the worst of the things Sony did. It feels like fraud to even offer the game in countries they knew they wouldn’t support.
Absolutely this, they sold the game in these countries *knowingly*, it's not like they decided to make it require a PSN account afterward, it was designed like that from day 1 according to Pilestedt. Like, when you do that voluntarily, it's called fraud.
It was only delisted on Steam, and the countries it could no be longer be purchased in included Japan, which I find strange since Sony is a Japanese company. To me, it seems more likely that Steam delisted Helldivers and Ghost because of the PSN requirement. If someone in a country that doesn't have PSN were to buy the game and then discover that they couldn't play some or all of it, that would likely cause Steam a lot of legal problems.
As for why Japan was on the list of delisted countries I couldn't say since I know next to nothing about Japanese law.
@@jordonkautz1470 At least according to a Steam customer service rep, the huge wave of delisting HD2 was at the behest of Sony, though it seems Valve took the initiative in delisting the game from an additional three countries to correct an "administrative error". I do agree that Japan is a very strange country to be on the list, though
@@jordonkautz1470 There is a separate Japan copy now that is locked to japan.
@@jordonkautz1470Sony Interactive Entertainment, the responsible company, is based in California, USA. Not Japan.
The fight isnt over helldivers! we need the recruits in those 170 countries!
"Over 100 countries", much closer to 200. Cheebus.
Theres 195 countries and I highly doubt they would lock out over 90% of the world
The current major order claims tons of new recruits are incoming. Could this be an in-universe explanation alluding to re-listing those countries?
Fingers crossed for our missing Helldivers.
@@penguindrummaster it’s SEAF recruits
165, five more just got unblocked- Guam, American Samoa, Puerto Rico and a couple other US territories
The biggest problem is that waiving the PSN requirement at the start and then several months of play showed that the game *did not strictly need it to work* thus making its later "mandatory requirement" look like another big fat corporate lie for another big fat corporate grab. Unfortunately for Sony, they decided to try this on a collection of extremely goal-minded players...
What do you mean, "look like"? It demonstrates that *it was*.
@@travispluid3603 Oh no doubt it absolutely was, but I'm just saying what it was going to look like regardless of whatever intent they claim.
Remember when Sony came across as the good guys simply by saying “Our console isn’t always-online”, because they knew what consumers wanted and they understood what pushback was?
Good times… from which they clearly learned zero lessons.
Fight isn't over. As Thor from Pirate Software said, until they reverse the embargo on the other countries, Sony's words are just words.
Those won't be reversed more than likely. Since this was supposed to be a requirement from the start, the game never should have been sold in those countries from the start. Them delisting it is covering their tracks legally. It's unfortunate, but is what they need to do to avoid any legal action.
Embargo? people were making shit up thinking they were going to be banned for playing in those countries, when Sony rarely enforced them in their other games. Like I have multiple country accounts in a country not supported, they never banned my other country accounts.
And now they're crying because Sony actually listened.
@@Kaimax61 How did "Sony actually listend" exactly? They said it would not be a requirement going forward, but they also have added to the list of countries who cannot purchase the game from Steam since making that announcement. Last I checked, The requirement for a PSN account goes live on the 30th, so I wouldn't be surprised if your other accounts get locked out then.
This is not them listening, this is corpo CYA at the expense of a good game.
... why do you have multiple country accounts in an unsupported country?
It's funny how usually people cry about review bombing. The difference is Arrowhead was on the consumer side, but most studios and publishers create victim narratives whenever this happens to them. It's extremely apparent how disingenuous those efforts are now.
Makes Battlestate Games (Escape from Tarkov) or Arenanet (Guild Wars 2) all the more vile.
Negative feedback? It's bullying, better delete it all!
I'm sure there are more, but those are the first two coming to mind.
Gaijin did that when War Thunder got review bombed. Q fucking Q.
But...but...you can fly! You can shoot! You can mine! You can loot!
@@SimuLord But the consumers said, "We don't care: silence your doots! Take back your chests, and here's our boots!"
Review bombing is just a tool though, which sometimes can be wielded irresponsibly or idiotically, and should rightly be criticized as such. Like that time when Chinese players got a Taiwanese game removed from Steam for containing an anti-Xi Jinping poster, and again with Life Is Strange: True Colors for having the audacity to display a Tibetan flag in-game. Or when idiots review-bombed Fire Emblem: Three Houses for being... a Switch exclusive.
If they had just gone for something like "Connect your Sony account and get some in game currency/cosmetics" a chunk of people would have happily done it
Right? The way they went about this was incredibly stupid, I feel like thousands of people would have happily done it for premium currency
Because the playerbase is easily outraged, but not hard to pacify.
"Link PSN to get a free cape + 1000 super credits" boom PSN linking skyrockets and people aren't pissed off because there's nothing mechanical they can't get just by playing
True, but that still doesn't help them in the countries where PSN doesn't / can't exist, so those players miss out on currency/cosmetics in that case. Given how Sony has blocked the countries in question now, it's clear there's something going on in those areas that they aren't willing to work with.
I mean it worked for Amazon. AMAZON, FFS. I still login to Twitch every now and then to grab my freebies, even though the only ones I ever use are Warframe skins...
I think Sony want this so they can add PS+ subscription requirements to future titles. They're seeing the PC market for what it is now and they want to pillage it like they did for their own console player-base.
More likely they wanted to increase the number of active PSN accounts for the next earnings call.
that and they just wanna collect data.
Pretty much what all three of you have said is accurate.
There's a reason we're ditching the NOW LOADING FOREVER CLUB
Not quite, PSN accounts are a Key Performance Indicator for Sony. This is all about shareholder nonsense.
Unfortunately those regions and countries have still not been relisted, though players that hadn't refunded can still play. the players need to mobilize to try and get those regions back but this may be to late. the active player base has halved since this whole Sony SNAFU
I still find this the stupidest thing Sony does. With the PSN restriction sure... they gotta, but now since it's gone.. why block those countries? INFACT.. Why were they even allowed to begin with!?
On the plus side, now the players have discovered that they do, in fact, have a say in these matters... and Sony have learned that people are finally annoyed enough with the corporate game industry's endless parade of burning dumpsters, to get engaged and hassle them until they stop shitting the damn beds.
@@kotlolish because they plan to reintroduce the requirement later on. It's the only explanation really. They know people won't stay angry forever and a 2nd backlash will be smaller.
The decision to rollback the PSN requirement doesn't mean the requrement is over, it's being postponed. Why else would Sony stop selling the game in the regions without PSN, even _adding new ones after_ the PSN requirement was rolled back? Clearly, they intend to reinstate it, and are just covering themselves legally so they can do it without breaking the law in those countries.
That is, as far as I know the only reason why they'd add more countries to the blacklist.
Bc delisting it covers them legally. If this was going to be a requirement from the start, which it was, they never should have sold it in those countries to begin with. But since it was sold in them, there are legalities in place that protect consumers allowing those who already own it, to continue to have access. With them delisting it, and also not selling their future PC releases in those countries, it allows them to avoid this sort of legal issue.
This is why Arrowhead needs to terminate Sony as a publisher of their game. Clearly Sony is not the correct choice...
@@Xyler94 That's the problem, they can't. Helldivers is a Sony IP not Arrowhead IP.
Pilestedt did an awesome job on this. He not only threw his publisher under the bus when they did something to harm the developer, he practically grabbed the keys and offered to drive it.
As he should. Look at how many publishers have thrown their studios under the bus in the past month alone...
#PublishersRuinEverything
'It was an unfortunate moment for a game that had really done everything right so far'
That's the point. Sony wanted to siphon it for their own benefit, and didn't care how it impacted people. Standard company behavior.
1:32 Games purchased with Steam Keys, like those on Humble Store never show the requirement on the Steam page, because Valve is the distributor in those cases. Many users purchased the game without information that the game mandated a PSN account, hence why Valve can no longer supply the game in countries where PSN isn't available. If they did, they would be liable for purchases not made through the Steam store to be sued for supplying a defective product.
Until Sony remove the requirement, no one in the 170+ territories can be supplied the game on PC. All they have done so far is kick the can down the road.
To add, my experience is that I was gifted the game and never even saw a “skip” message on launch nor ever seen the steam store page. It wasn’t communicated to the actual players
This was the case for me. I purchased the game from the Humble Store for myself and my sister and redeemed the key through the Steam client, never visiting the game's Steam store page.
Until the game is re-listed in those countries, I fully expect Sony to try again in a few months. They tried to enforce the accounts a couple weeks before their May 2024 earning call, certainly to show growth of PSN users to their stake holders, so I would brace for the next one.
If the PSN sign-in was always required then why was the game sold in countries without PSN support?
That's a good question, and one I didn't have the answer to for the video... and one that Sony should have an answer for but don't yet.
@@SecondWindGroup People have found archived versions of the games page and the requirement was originally "MAY be need", not a hard requirement. SNOY changed this
Don't forget that Valve enabled refunds for Helldivers 2 without restriction in all of the countries affected. Because of them, Sony started tangibly losing money. In a way, this is just further quiet benevolence from The Great Gaben.
It's the right step. I will note that Sony's move also smeared Valves' reputation.
If Sony can region lock a game after months, what about every other game on Steam?
Gabe has effectively covered his own backside on a wider issue by taking the consumers side. I assume because he well knows if one company sees profit from this activity, the others will follow. Likely with more egregious nonsense.
@@theghostoftom I think this is the correct answer, though Steam also played a part in this failure: given that the game had the PSN account link as a stated requirement from the outset, Steam's legal team should've advised to not list the game in countries that are not supported by PSN. Idk what Arrowhead's and Sony's role in this was - whether it was an oversight or a play at something (e.g. Arrowhead being a magnificent bastard and letting the chips fall where they may, or Sony simply not giving a shit and wanting to make an extra quick buck at the apparently laughable cost of their already poor reputation).
Valve is great, but they had to fight the EU and Australia in legal battles. EU and Australia forced Valve to adopt a refund policy
Haha - i didnt know about the cape resembling the negative score bars! That's neat!
Nice video Nick
It is quite telling that these "warnings" on the Steam pages are *well* below the fold, on the side, and in a bland yellowish-brown color. They're there so the sellers can point to them *after* the sale.
It would appear that Sony is very much indeed "still learning".
Yeah, still learning how slowly they need to boil the frog to replicate their wild success with the embarrassing numbers of people who ran to KuSony's defense. The multi-billion valued corporation does not care about you, their executive board and shareholders would charge you for the privilege of getting pissed on while burning alive.
1:41 to add that noone ever looks there, the notification that the Japanese version is only available in Japan was put directly above the add to cart button. The psn thing should have been there, too
Anyone who doesn't look there after whining for a decade about multiple logins is a moron.
(That doesn't change the fact that what Sony did was illegal of course)
I haven't bought an EA, UbiSoft, or Sony game in over a decade for this exact reason.
On Steam, if you know where to look, it's pretty evident when some game has 3rd-party DRM chicanery (maybe that's just me, because that'll quickly kill any interest I have in purchasing a game.)
@@SimuLord true, but that "if you know where to look" part is the issue
@@anna-flora999 Agreed. Just because I know where to look, doesn't mean a meaningful portion of people do; Steam store pages are long and cluttered with various interface elements of highly variable usefulness, which can make it hard to see these things. I mean, the system requirements of all things are in tiny faded text right at the bottom! (well, above the reviews, I guess, but still). At least they made the stuff orange so it stands out a bit, but still... lot of clutter.
@@hazukichanx408 I have a hard time feeling sympathy for people who don't make fully informed purchases, but I freely admit that it's my "old man bias" showing when I say that. I grew up in a time where you could read the box in the store and had to wait in line before pulling your money out to actually buy the game. It is REAL easy on Steam or other digital services to buy something without half a thought, but I still hold to the belief that if the information was presented to you before you bought, you don't have much of a leg to stand on when that information comes into play once you start the game.
EDIT: Forgive me father, for I have greatly sinned, in my thoughts and in my words, and in what I have failed to do, through my fault, through my fault, through my most grievous fault. Namely, I got zoomer brain and wrote the comment before I watched the video, then I didn't even listen when I watched the video and revise my comment. Also, I did a little more research later in the day and learned that the Arrowhead CEO said discussions with Sony about unblocking the countries are still ongoing. I deserve the L. I'm leaving the comment up though so that people can know what I said.
Turns out it may not be over though. Even though Sony has said they'll strip away the PSN account requirement, the game is still unavailable on Steam in many countries where PSN wouldn't work, and that list actually kept slowly expanding even after Sony made the announcement. This concerns me because I was hoping to play this game with a couple of international friends online, and it's not a good sign if the list of blocked continues continues expanding even after the "controversy" is over.
I hope they fix this, but I can't help but feel very cynical that Sony will take this deception and ignorance and continue running with it until it's way too late to reverse the damage done to the game.
Video discusses this, and points it out at the very end.
4:50
how about watching the video first?
The Baltics being added was done by Steam as an administrative correction to Sony's original list where Steam had miss the Baltic states. Several US territories were removed from the purchase restriction today. Sony in general has been completely quiet about what's happening. You can't take what's happening on SteamDB as definitive news one way or another.
I believe the bit about the Baltics is from Twinbeard.
@@Kaimax61 That's far too much to ask.
Sony could have tried the carrot (keep it optional but encourage signups with in game bonuses) or even the carrot and the stick (mandatory but still bonuses) but they instead went Full Stick (mandatory and you get nothing but the status quo).
Never go Full Stick.
I really do not think those countries will be relisted seen as they've literally added countries to the list since the PSN "backtrack". Ghost of Tsushima is still going ahead with the PSN requirement and Sony will very likely to force the PSN requirement on PC in a few months again for helldivers. There is no reason not to continue leaving the countries delisted unless they still have plans to reintroduce the PSN requirement down the line. They gave the appearance of giving the community a victory and little else. They know the backlash will fade and when everyone stops paying attention, they'll do it again knowing the 2nd backlash won't be as large.
they've maintained the restriction so they can quietly reinstate the psn requirement. Don't let them play you for fools
Still don't understand why the now delisted territories were even available to buy the game from the start if PSN was always going to be an intended requirement. Whether or not they ended up backtracking (currently all talk), they were guaranteed to lose money as they'd b legally required to refund copies in areas without the PSN access.
Until the game is actually relisted in those countries, assume it won't be, and assume sony intends to push for account linking again.
Ironically, since this nonsense started, I believe we've failed every major order since.
To be fair, pretty much every order was deliberately over the top.
@@NeddyhkTo be fair they fixed a bug that had kills count multiple times per kill.
Nick, loving the perspective and the scripts are solid.
... maybe look into some media voice training resources? Delivery is still the weak link of otherwise top notch videos.
Not everyone can be Frost or Yahtz. Marty. Aim for Marty level. I think he's starting with similar conditions and has honed it well.
A tip of the hat to the designer for showing how to handle publisher overreach while supporting their players. Thank you for highlighting this, Second Wind, and long may you continue to shine a spotlight on how this industry grows and matures.
Sony adding Baltic states to the banlist is just precious! Not only are they regular EU countries, but Estonia also sits just above Japan on the living standards index.
this was a golden example of collective action, good stuff.
Imagine if Sony tries to force PC players to pay a PSN+ sub for online features. 💀
Pretty sure Sony are real busy imagining that already.
We dive together, or not at all!
It's nice when Nick does a video. His situation was the core drive of the birth of Second Wind and the birth of second wind is an inspiring anomaly in this for-profit run world we live in. Truly spectacular. The video was entertaining too haha.😊
I think the lesson to be learned is that our personal data is valuable to a degree that we don't fully understand if they are committed to removing the title from sale entirely in those countries.
The negative review cape is the epitome of Helldivers style, I love how they have handled this.
The situation was *exacerbated* not "exasperated" :P
Now all we gotta do is get the balance right and Helldivers 2 will thrive. Well that and getting all those countries back.
With the "restriction" of Ghost of Tsushima, Sony will not lift the restriction on Helldivers 2 for the 170 region. I got my game refunded thanks for that, and well, I am not going to buy it again, fuck it. I was also looking forward to playing Ghost of Tsushima this Friday, but I can't buy it, so I guess Piracy it is then to play the singleplayer game.
Arrowhead's CEO behaved better than their community manager who went from chastising the community for not creating a PSN account to leading the charge of leaving negative reviews. IMO, of course. Also, yeah, it says Sony Interactive in the announcement, Chief, might want to correct that.
A temporary moment of collective catharsis
Really the only thing that mattered was that people could get refunds. Without that and if everything else was the same nothing would have changed.
Exacerbated, not exasperated.
People get exasperated.
Situations get exacerbated.
Honestly the thing that hurts this vid in particular (and is also being pointed out here by others) is that this fight is FAR from over since those restrictions are still in place as of this comment.
While it's still a W for both the community and for Arrowhead's rep, Sony is still fucking with this game's success unnecessarily
I feel like this was an oversimplification of events, as the community manager's initial reaction on discord was that the community was just whining and that anyone unhappy should get a refund. The twitter backlash made the community manager flip sides and instead told the discord to review bomb the game, which many were hesitant to do until Pilestedt chimed in on letting Sony know the community wasn't happy.
This shows that the devs were hoping this would go under the radar or maybe Helldiver's good will would minimize the backlash. But we can see now that this is a big deal and that the devs should have given prior notice. I wouldn't say they had good communicate in this scenario.
Sony still holding strong on not re-listing those countries.
Love these, Nick, keep up the great work!
People better be ready for when Sony swings back though, they didn't say it would never be required, it could come again.
I personally kept my helldivers review negative, with the specific note that basically amounted to "I don't trust Sony to not muck it up again"
Only to then find out that yea, in spite of the PSN requirement being removed, the countries weren't re-instated, and I was totally right.
This is very important information, also sad though. Thanks for putting it all in one place.
The sales ban in those (now) 175 countries still has not been reversed. I don't really understand why. But as long as those are in effect, it still looks like Sony is just waiting to put their PSN linking requirement in place.
I smell shenanigans. It sounds like Sony strong-armed Arrowhead into the dual sign in requirement, Arrowhead "forgot" to implement it at launch, "accidentally" allowed their game to be sold in a bunch of countries where Sony sign-ins wouldn't work, and then "failed" to communicate the requirement to their userbase. (Despite showcasing exemplary communication abilities when it all hit the fan.) And then when they successfully leveraged user rage against Sony, they _celebrated_ by handing out cosmetics.
Yay for developers not allowing publishers to ruin their hard work, but still. That's cunning.
The PSN requirement will come back, they're already adding warnings on Ghost of Tsushima's page that it'll be required. It'll come back for Helldivers 2 too.
180 countries still cant play, the war rages on.
That credits music was just what I needed today. I just wish there was more of it =P
Please do not forget the HD2 community mod at first mocked people that "they don't have 120 seconds to create an account". After a huge backlash the CM said the quiet part out loud on Discord.
They also apologized for not knowing the requirement and that certain countries literally couldn't before saying that, said the quiet part out loud about leaving negative reviews to get Sony's attention, and then were fired for it, and some in the HD2 community have even created a petition to try and bring them back.
@@SecondWindGroupIt doesn’t matter if Sony wasn’t delisting in other countries anyway. That’s still an antagonistic response to your paying customers, for a job that’s supposed to keep the community positive. Either say nothing or acknowledge this update might be annoying for some people. Shouldn’t be barking back at your customers.
@@SecondWindGroup then again internet mocked "you guys don't have phone"... Sure I'm glad the CM had "redemption arc" but no CM should ever act like that. Am I glad CM lost job? No. But at the same time if I had CM like that I'd be very sad and angry that instead of calming things the CM threw a gallon of gas on a fire.
This series has the best intro song
Helps when a company is run by a person who sees consumers as people rather than a resource to be harvested.
so good to hear from nick on this issue!
Props to Arrowhead handling the situation well
The Baltics being added was done by Steam as an administrative correction to Sony's original list where Steam had miss the baltic states. Several US territories were removed from the purchase restriction today. Sony in general has been completely quiet about what's happening. You can't take what's happening on SteamDB as definitive news one way or another.
It's already over play count is below 100k( at peak) and its only been like 4 motnhs
I believe Helldivers 2 is still restricted in US territories, so the FTC probably has jurisdiction. Sending in a complaint would be worth 10 minutes.
Not sure about other countries counterparts of FTC, but might be worth a shot sending a complaint as well.
Wait, the issue isn't resolved. Dig deep into it
That comment about multiple sign-ins hits home for me. I've been burned by UPlay and Origin in the past, so when Mass Effect Legendary released on Steam, I avoided it because it required Origin. As of right now, it's $6 on Steam and I still avoid it because that requirement became some buggy EA app that breaks achievements for a lot of people. I don't pretend to know the true reasons, but it seems like a backhanded way to try to squeeze in some new advertising streams to people who are already giving them money which is something I will not willingly pay for no matter how good the content attached.
Until the game is relisted in the 180 countries they delisted, I wouldn't trust that they "fixed" it
Given how they're dealing with Ghost of Tsushima, they didnt learn the lesson.
Sure they did. The lesson learned was "Don't give any exemption at any point, for any reason"
"exacerbated", not "exasperated"
Correction: Sony made the announcement that you reference at the start of the video--not Arrowhead; it is even signed off by them at the end of the messaged displayed in this video.
Aside from the fact that the countries still haven't been put off the restriction list yet, the only unfortunate part is that the Helldivers Discord Community Manager may have gotten fired or forced to be fired by Sony execs because of him publicly stating that those negative reviews and feedback gave them leverage.
Bro legit basically put his career on the line all for the sake of making sure we're heard and that we're directed at the right target.
I just want to add another reminder that we cannot let up the pressure on Sony until the game is relisted in all the countries it was taken away from.
I personally would recommend anyone that has linked a PSN account to get on A call or text chat with PlayStation support and unlink your account. Don’t let them tell you it cannot be done, it can. if you don’t have a PlayStation, close the PSN account.
Everything that we can do that can calmly and ethically hurt Sony over this will help us.
Unless Sony makes a positive comfirmation of not requiring PSN accounts ENTIRELY, Valve will keep the sales in PSN-allowed locations only. It's the only safe move.
calm story bro
I really like your take on this, it's actually unbiased. Everyone and their mothers seem to be super negative and anti corporate on their takes. I get what Sony is doing is wrong, but it's kind of a double standard to put them and arrowhead on the chopping block when other companies in the same industry get away with doing the same thing.
just reminded everyone that your average corporate executive is one of the dumbest people on earth who only got their job through nepotism.
To think Sony would learn their lesson was the only mistake, but a victory for the customer is a victory nonetheless.
Think one of the bigger reasons behind the roll back on the PSN requirement was that Steam offered full refunds on the game, no matter when or how long the game was played. This affect Sony directly in the pockets, the one spot that no publisher wants to be affected.
Arrowhead Studios as a whole was an still is trying to do good in this entire situation. It is unfortunate that the CMs are not part of the solution.
Such a community W
I think one of the most important things Steam could do going forward is move the "requires 3rd party sign in" dection to right under the buy button.
I never realized it had the requirement because as you say Nick, no one looks, which is on us the buyer of course.
I remember when i encountered the PSN linking popup message when i first launched the game, the first thing out my mouth was "Oh are you fucking kidding me?" And then when I saw I could click Skip and avoid it, i was very happy and never thought about it again.
"WE DIVE TOGETHER OR NOT AT ALL!"
srsly loving the new channel guys, it's way better than escapist. enjoy my patronage and keep up the good work.
Thank you!
Thanks again
That intro song always reminds me of the Brooklyn Nine-Nine intro. 🤔
Yea, 05:37 is my reaction today) It has gone from page without a buy button to "this game is not available in your region".
Oh, well, I still have games to play)
People really like to leave comments without actually watching the video huh?
Oddly, yes.
Haha, now just imagine moderating the comments every day!
It’s free engagement lmao
"No one looks at those little details on the page" But nearly all of us hit the 'Skip' button on the PSN login when we booted it up. I legitimately feel this is an equal share of responsibility between dev/publisher. Arrowhead dropped the ball with their clarity, Sony is... well they're a Corp. Though huge shoutout to bullying Sony for backing down a bit, because PSN is just garbage.
What does a publisher provide a developer by restricting the sale of their game? Are the devs still on to hook for "poor" performance if the publisher is the one fucking things up?
Good question.
Thing is it's only a very tiny win. HD 2 is atill deslisted in non-psn countries and GoT still requires PSN and is deslisted in non-psn countries.
This isn't over, they will push until the executives get their bonus.
Early in the video "nobody really looks at those little details on the page." 5min in "due to the sign-in requirement being removed."
It has not been removed. I'm going to keep pointing this out until people stop saying it has been, or until it actually is. As of the time this video was posted, we're 10 days since they *said* the requirement would be removed, but the Steam page still says a PSN account is required.
That's never going to be removed from the page because it's required for crossplay with PS5 which is an advertised feature and they'd end up in a false advertising state.
@@sleeplesson Pretty sure this is not true. Destiny 2 has crossplay with both xbox and ps, and you're not required to have an account from either MS or Sony for it to work. No such requirements are listed on the Steam page either, of course.
To correct, Arrowhead didn't announce it. Sony did through them.
Kind of amazing how the developers were so polite and proper with the community while also making it very clear that Sony were the bad guys in this fiasco.
honeslty, i was somewhat aware of this when i got the game, as i did see it in the store and was told about it. So i was surprised that i was able to cancel the sign-in and that it still let me through.
edit: i got the game near release date, or a week or two after.
This only adds to the ongoing abuse of nefarious EULA agreements that are quickly becoming out of control displays of gross anti consumerism. Granted, the requirement was on full display but they knew what they were doing from enabling play initially and *THEN* pulling the rug. This action was calculated from the start otherwise it would have been mandatory to have a PSN from the outset.
I mean at the very least it wasn’t enabled from the outset because it BROKE
Iirc it was from the number of players but it was disabled very fast
Did you even listen to video?
IT WAS MANDATORY but Arrowhead CEO puled pulg on it within few hours due their technical problems.
@@Akabans999 Yes, you are correct ("A-head knew 6 months before launch that it would be mandatory" but chose to disable acc linking initially so people could play), but it all feels rather sketchy to me. Maybe they are only guilty of not properly communicating the later need to link an account. You could also argue that it's the responsibility of the end user to read the agreement requirements and there really isn't an issue here at all, but it's just comes at a time when there are countless cases like this happening right now where contracts are changing after the fact.
Now if everyone can do the same for Ghost of Tsushima on PC - otherwise SONY won't learn their lesson
1:39 You can absolutely blame the end user for not reading the terms of service. Maybe it's because I work in law, but any time you see an EULA pop up on your video game, you need to brace yourself for the idea that you don't own the game or that conditions to play the game can and probably will change in a way you may not like. Gamers need to get a lot more savvy about what an EULA even is instead of just seeing it as a one-time barrier to play.
The devs were responsible for obscuring the sign-in requirements, and they were the ones to list the game in countries in which it couldn't be played. Sony obviously needs to expand its service, but Arrowhead had months of lead-in time and communicated none of this until it came to head. The end result is that they can present this news like Sony just asked them to implement it on a whim, which is bullshit, the login requirement was literally always there. The lion's share of the blame falls on Arrowhead.
For simple plebs like me it'd make sense to not have the PSN limitation, there are so many countries that don't have it
If Ghost of Tsushima isn't released on those countries... well then... the sailors of the binary seas will make themselves the heroes of this story yet again
Attention game devs and publishers I should be able to press start on a game, go take a piss and get some water and come back to a game ready to play. Sign in and log in bs f with this.
Except the community backlash had absolutely nothing to do with Sony reversing their decision.
Sure, it’s convenient excuse they can point to, but the actual reason is to avoid lawsuits. Because the ‘needs PSN to function’ was there from day 1, the game was sold in several nations it would have been impossible to play in. That’s knowingly selling a defective product. Considering plenty of those countries and regions are in places that have actual consumer protection laws (some in Europe, for example), Sony had opened themselves up to a legal fight they’d have 100% lost.
I’m sure gAmErZ would like to claim they beat the company, but you didn’t. The grand machine of corporation and the suits in charge of it don’t care about you or your opinions or where you yell at them, and never have.
Fuck the whole gaming industry right now