The Best Characters Cut From Game of Thrones
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- čas přidán 15. 05. 2024
- Hello everyone! Today I'm going over my picks as to the best characters from #asongoficeandfire cut from Game of Thrones.
Be sure to subscribe if you enjoyed this video! What do you think? Is there anything I missed? What do you think of #houseofthedragon so far? More #asoiaf content is on the way!
(also I'm sorry for not including you, JonCon)
Thank you all for watching! I'll be back with more theories next week, in a collab video! Character art in this video is by TheMico! Art in the thumbnail is by Shebsart, Aaron Miller, tsundere-power, and David Sondred.
My Twitter: / quinnthegm
00:00 My Favorite Part of Game of Thrones
00:55 Cut Characters
01:47 The Brothers Tyrell
04:20 Strong Belwas
06:25 Rodrik the Reader
08:25 Barbrey Dustin
10:54 Patchface
12:35 My Favorite Omitted Character
15:28 Conclusion - Zábava
Man it’s too bad they forgot to include Euron, he would’ve been a great addition to the show
love your vids man
It’s also weird how they cut Jon out of season 8 until the last episode
I didnt give permission to include me in this trash show
But we got Jack Sparrow instead, which imo, was super epic
Book Euron: "I will marry the Dragon Queen and drown the world in blood." *Eldritch implications*
Show Euron: "Oy I fucked the queen I did, eat me asshole Jaime ya cunt." *Inbred implications*
Aegon, Val and Stoneheart are the three most important omissions in the show. To the point where it's impossible to tell the same story without them.
Aegon as in ”young griff”?
@@ollepetersson-id923yep
Aegon is obvious, but from a show perspective why do we need Val?
How is Val remotely that important
Val is important as she takes care of Crasters son also I think she has a part to play in Jon's resurrection
Garlan Tyrell comes across as one of the few really truly good people in the nobility. I love that he sees the worth in Tyrion and tells him so, and how much that single of voice of support means to Tyrion; that he tells Sansa that Tyrion would make a far better husband than Loras; and that he stands up to Joffrey.
Love Garlan.
Garlan and Willa’s are truly GOATS
He sounds like the antithesis of the hound and what he believes
Garlan is such a badass, dude trains in an actual practical way, can see Tyrion beyond his disability and is an honorable man.
Getting rid of Vargo Hoat only to create a whole new character (Lock) in order to fill in the blanks was a huge red flag for me....like why?
Yeah that was a weird one. Change aside, I honestly didn’t mind Locke, he was a good presence.
Probably for efficiency. D&D probably thought they didn’t need two groups of psychotic brigands running around. They skimmed the Mummers down to their two essential story beats
1) Vargo/Locke cuts off Jaime’s hand
2) Qyburn find his way to King’s Landing
Fair points and I didn't mind Locke as a character but the irony of one of Tywin's mad dogs cutting off his son's hand was lost. Just seemed like an unnecessary change.
Yeah, I missed Vargo Hoat and his Bloody Mummers too. They really showed what kind of psychotic scum Tywin Lannister was willing to employ in order to win at all costs, and they were just so much more interesting than what we got in their place.
@@thing_under_the_stairs agreed!
An underrated character is Cortnay Penrose, he only appears in a single chapter, but that dude DEFIANTLY defended Storm's End to keep Edric safe. We got little-to-no time with him, but the stubbornness with which he protected Edric is extremely loveable and probably one of the most noble acts in the series. Storm's End wasn't even HIS castle!
He reminded me of Argilac Durrandon (aka The Arrogant) - in his stubbornness, at least.
He was a great character and I saw the situation in a similar manner. On the other hand he was being more stubborn than Stannis. The elder was clearly Stannis and Storms End his by all rights. But now with Renly dead he was endangering hundreds of defenders and thousands of possible attackers who hours ago were on the same side.
He had no cause or proof to believe Stannis wanted to hurt the boy and every assurance Stannis meant to keep him safe.
To any normal person at that time Edric seemed to be necessary to Stannis' plan only as a visible proof of Cerseis infidelity and the basterdy of the three Baratheon heirs.
It was obvious Penrose had his own problems with Stannis and allowed those to influence his actions. He even threw his glove in Stannis' face attempting to provoke him. I call him arrogant and stubborn after considering the actual position without knowing everything.
@@borisdorofeev5602even with the assurances form Stanis, it still looked like a man wanting to kill his nephew to secure his claim
I love him, how he defended Brienne 😢
@@notyourproblemnope8582 Edric Storm is a bastard, he has no claim to anything.
I also love how Garlan gives Tyrion loads of credit for the victory at the Battle of the blackwater. Its only a line or 2 but seems very much deserved and genuine . As no one else is willing to give him praise..
BEST BOY STRONG BELWAS. The decision to remove him was the direct cause of how bad the later seasons were, empirically
LIVER AND ONIONS
Let's not forget that majestic dump outside the gates of Meereen! What a class act!
“IT IS KNOWN!”
the later seasons were bad because Martin couldn't finish 2 books in a decade. asking Dean and Dan to finish GRRM's work when no one in the world can write GRRM was just a lost cause.
@@penoyer79 no it was the decision to remove strong belwas
Asha's favorite nuncle Rodrik Harlaw. Rodrik offered Asha to be his heir to Ten Towers just to keep her safe
Rodrik: _You have three uncles_
Asha: _Four_
Rodrik: _You have three Kracken uncles. I do not count_
Asha: *_You do with me_*_ . So long as I have my nuncle of Ten Towers, I have Harlaw_
He's probably the most intelligent Lord on the Iron Islands. He sees that reaving and raiding isn't at all sustainable. They'd do far better with some coastal lands and forests just like he wants.
The Iron Islands were in the best positions to trade Winterfell/its heirs, Deep Wood Moat/its heirs and Moat Cailyn and the heirs to the Neck for the Northern Coast.
They would have had land for farming and hunting and wood for ships. Them electing Euron was so dumb.
@@borisdorofeev5602There’s only on issue: “We do not sow.” To take reaving and salt wives away from the Iron Born is a very fundamental part of their identity.
@@diegonoriega3507 Look I get the Ironborn are based on Vikings and those guys did a lot of raiding, but they understood what a lot of Ironborn somehow don't, that if you kill everyone who makes the things you want to have so you can take the stuff from them, there's just not gonna be anyone around to make things anymore. Vikings still farmed and even with the Ironborn they have some infrastructure outside of reaving. Aeron's very first chapter mentions captives from the mainland being put to work to farm on the islands, infertile as they may be.
The idea that the majority of the Ironborn population to prefer to go to war every time they need groceries than to just grow food themselves is really dumb worldbuilding, and it stands as a sharp contrast from the other nuanced, diverse societies in ASOIAF that, while perverse in some aspects, at least have some internal logic. The Ironborn are founded on stupidity, and it makes them as a society appear cartoonish outside of a handful that appear to act and think like actual rational people.
@@SoCalSon395 There's also probably some cultural shock lingering on from the rule of House Hoare and how poorly all the Greyjoy rebellions went. Much more fun to be pirating along with big daddy Euron and not give a damn than have to be administering a realm.
@@SoCalSon395 Is it a problem with the GRRM's worldbuilding or a problem with the Ironborn as a civilization that will lead to their end?
Aside from omitted characters, something that stood out to me especially after watching HOTD was how muted the colors were in GOT along with the "flair and excentricity" of some of the characters.
By this I mean how like the colors of clothes, armor, and house symbols that some characters have aren't nearly as vibrant as they're described in the books. If the character Tytos Blackwood for instance did appear in GOT, he wouldn't have worn his colorful and elaborate Blackwood outfit with the raven feathered cloak. Instead he would've worn a plain black or brown tunic with a vague tree emblem. This goes for just about every character design in the show
This is one of my biggest gripes with the show. Especially in the later seasons everyone wears black and brown and grey furs. Dany is the only one with an interesting wardrobe. I get they were trying to be a bit more realistic, I think, but they should have gone all in on the vibrant colors and designs that are in the books.
Agreed. One of the worst offenses they made in this department was Daario Naharis. Both of them. When I saw this guy with brown hair, dressed all in brown and chatting up Dany, I was wondering, who is this supposed to be? Where's the blue hair and gold lace? I was so disappointed that they didn't let the costume department go completely bonkers with him.
i agree: if grrm writes someone as wearing plain clothing (with say one ornate item or their house sigil embroidered on a jerkin) you know that’s short hand for this guy is means business. that also adds to their character, like how the black fish only has his cool cape or stannis keeps things practical as opposed to renly. it meant something if someone wasn’t draped in cool clothes as much as those who were
@@kennethp7411middle age wasn't grey, it was pretty colorfoul
It's this annoying faux-realism that ruins the aesthetic of (pseudo-)historical and fantasy productions as of late, where they don't use any colours and most costumes look like potatoe-sacks with extra steps. Even then new Napoleon movie eleminates almost all the colour in a period renowned for colourful uniforms and dresses. Historical fashion was wild, especially during the late medieval era and early rennaissance (the era aSoIaF adapts into fantasy).
I wish they had included Mya Stone and Edric Storm in the show. Mya is important as the eldest of Robert's bastards and the guide to the Eyrie and Edric is important because he is the only bastard Robert acknowledged in public (didn't have much choice considering Robert fathered the boy on Stannis' wedding day with Selyse's cousin Delena Florent).
On Stannis's wedding bed, no less. Was insulting as hell.
Edric would also be a better candidate for legitimization and being given lordship over Storm's End than Gendry.
They kind of forgot about bastards after season 1
Speaking of Noye's influence on Jon:
Noye also has that awesome little speech to Jon, that was given to Tyrion in the show, about Pyp and Grenn and the way that Jon's been treating them in the practice yard.
What speech that was given to tyrion? Who's Noye
In the show, Tyrion interrupts Grenn, Pyp, and Rast ganging up on Jon, and then he tells Jon what each of them is at the Wall for, and that none of them ever trained with a master at arms. In the books, that dialogue is between Jon and Donal Noye instead.
Jon Con, Aegon, Arianne, Quentyn, Alleras, Marwyn, Brown Ben, Belwas, Penny, the Widow of the Waterfront, Maqorro, Victarion and Stoneheart. There was so much story and characters left out, so many characters invented for no story reasons. If they had followed the source material they would have had enough for another 3 seasons even if George didn't finish the books. They also could have covered the characters on the Cinnamon Wind. The Summer Islanders are fascinating, I wish we got some of those characters in the show. Some of the best storylines are the ones left out of the show. All of Tyrion's adventures in Essos are so good, can't believe they left all of that out and made Tyrion into a lovesick puppy with bad judgement and bad jokes. The Essos and real Dorne storylines are going to be very important to the end game, stupid to leave all of that out. If DnD wanted out they should have left and allowed someone with knowledge and passion to take over. I blame them for ruining the series beyond redemption.
Yes I agree with all you said I've listened to all Danny's chapters on U Tube by David Reads asoiaf an couldn't believe how much was left out an Danny's house of the undying chapter I was stunned as I thought she went looking for her dragons the show did Danny dirty, strong belwas is a good character thanks for your comment
Yeah I never understood why they were rushing to catch up to GRRM; he gave them PLENTY of interesting material to stall on, and it wouldn’t of just been filler. Instead they cut it for the sake of “time”, and ran into a dead end.
Very minor character but a character I think of often is Dick Crabb. I don't know why but his tike with Brienne was enjoyable and his death was sad but then the after thoughts of Brienne as she wish she just trusted him and pays him respect all ways gets me a little teary-eyed.
Ya my first read thru I was annoyed by those chapters but during other readings I found myself looking forward to those chapters. And like you I too shed a tear for crackclaw point knight.
They're all good Dragon men up Crackclaw way
My dick has crabbs
"I'm sorry I didn't trust you, I don't know how to do that anymore"
@@danieloptun6698 :(
Tormund: Some great lord was he, this Donal Noye? One of your shiny knights in their steel smallclothes?
Jon: A blacksmith. He only had one arm.
Tormund: A one-armed smith slew Mag the Mighty? Har! That must o' been a fight to see. Mance will make a song of it, see if he don't ...
if the show had kept these characters and others for later seasons and portrayed them more faithfully they probably wouldn't have had to worry about catching up to george so fast
Would’ve made it so much harder to wrap up the series though seeing as no one knows when the winds of winter or the Dream of springs will come out. They would’ve just fucked up the ending even more cause they’d have no idea what to do with all these characters, look how they ended Littlefinger and Varys
Agreed. We also could have had an extra season or two.
I too am quite sad about Donal's lack of inclusion, his quote about the Baratheon brothers and what kind of metal they are is my favorite encapsulation of that trio
It really is perfect. "Stannis is like Iron, hard. He'll break before he bends"
Nimble Dick deserves his time on the silver screen!
We all want a bit of Nimble Dick 😊
One book-only character I’d love to see you talk about is Edric ‘Ned’ Dayne. I think he’s pretty fascinating, despite his limited appearances, and a video about his potential role in Winds would be cool to see.
Is this the one where Arya talked to when she was with Dondarrion's men?
@@dan_ta_lionI just know he's the heir of house Dayne and he's named after Ned, which is fascinating on its own
Patchface
Stoneheart was a really crucial part of the Red Wedding story that they just cut because they're doofuses that don't like magic. Having Arya just show up and murder everyone isn't how that story should end.
I feel like the show made big, strong characters always slow as hell, to the point that I have heard people say that Daario, Arya or Syrio could beat the mountain. Belwas is a good example of a big guy who still has to have great timing and reaction speed otherwise his stick of deliberately getting one shallow cut before winning would be impossible. In the book the champion of Mereen is mounted, armored and wielding a lance that gives him a great reach advantage but Belwas sidesteps at the last moment to just be graced.
Great point! As a pit fighter, size alone wouldn't have kept our boy Belwas alive very long. Just look at how Oberyn skewered the Mountain. To survive, Strong Belwas had to be not just strong, but also fast and agile. Now get him his liver and onions!
No way could book arya kill the mountain in a straight fight. She's trained as an assassin, not a fighter. An eleven year old can't wear enough armor to protect themselves, and while Oberyn wears little armor, he at least fought with a spear to negate Clegane's reach. Book Gregor was also stated to not be that slow.
Didn't the Queen of Thorns refuse the Cersei / Willas proposal because of age and supposed used-ness on Cersei's part, which Tywin tells to Tyrion?
I believe so, though it pops up again in feast/dance if I recall.
Yep! It’s in dance I believe.
The Queen of Thorns didn't want Cerise as daughter- law and keep putting off and Cerise didn't want to be a wife again she was done. They both keep putting off. There a theory that Queen of Thorns wanted kill Tyrion not Joffecy in the books version to free up Sansa for her Grandson. Littlefinger wanted Tyrion dead cause he getting close about him
Rodrik the reader, Barbrey Dustin, Willas and Garlan were really nice characters, they added a truckload of depht to their factions, not all Tyrells were scheeming showoffs, not all ironborn were idiotic tools, and not all Northmen were stalwart Stark supporters, but damn stubborn in their grudges.
I was really disappointed they removed Taena Merryweather. Aside from her making for an interesting back and forth as someone in the middle of Cersei and Margaery’s rivalry while playing her own game, but made for a really vivid highlight into, despite claiming she was a mirror of Tywin, how much like Robert Cersei was becoming.
For the future “majorly changed” or “on the show but no impact” like Wyman Manderly, a few names that immediately spring to mind:
- Xaro Xhoan Daxos
- Doran Martell
- Kevan Lannister
- Blackfish
- Euron And Victarian Greyjoy
Victarion isn’t even in the show
What about Aetho(I think)? Dorne badass, one of the best fighters in the seven kingdoms, stabbed in the back after like 3 lines and never even got to use his weapon. That was pure laziness on the choreography/stunt side of things. There's absolutely zero reason why he couldn't have had a 3v1 with the sand snakes other than "I couldn't be bothered". It would have made Euron appear as a bigger threat too, since he'd have killed the three of them after they killed Aetho. That and not having grey worm v Jon is something that will always baffle me. And I loved grey worm, but by the time the series wrapped he hadn't done shit.
@@stephengrigg5988 Areo Hotah? Yeah, pretty much everything about Dorne was awfully done. No Arianne, no Quentyn, the sand snakes were awful, Ellaria is almost the complete opposite of her character in the books
@@colinfuller They appeared to do this weird mix of Euron and Victarion-- I speculate that because Euron wielded a battle axe during the naval battle where he killed the "sand snakes"
@@TheAnimalstrength I don't remember a ton about her in the books. From what I remember she attempts still attempts an assassination(albeit different and involving a shit ton of people), and Doran has a great scene with her about his plans later. I really have to read the books again haha
Satin stans we ride together we die together. The Mary Magdalene allegory to Jon's Jesus allegory makes me feral.
The Shavepate just adds another dynamic to the politics in Mereen which makes it more interesting. Similarly, King Cleon in Astapor has a similar affect on Dany's plotline.
The two characters that were the closest to making this list were the Shavepate and Satin, both of whom I hope to cover in a sequel.
Taena Merryweather was a great fem-fattale who shouldnt have been left out
Taking out Patchface annoyed me so much. I hate they took out so much of the magic. Those are some of the book community favorite talking points. It's fun and the show watchers only didn't get to experience that
I think removing the dreams was a huge misstep too. That was their chance to do really surreal David lynch style filming. Like Theon’s dream of the hall of the dead or the actual house of undying visions like the dwarves ravaging Westeros as a woman while graphic would have been interesting
Garlan was a better swordman than Loras but humbler.
I think Garland was the better sword and Loras was the better rider/jouster IIRC
Garlan is just superior to Loras on every level
I think an interesting follow up video would be on which character changes or omissions impacted the show endgame the most. Like, we know they will play a role in the book plots but showrunners didn't substitute them adequately and thus ruining other characters' stories? For example, it is speculated that Lady Stoneheart will impact Arya's story by showcasing the dark side of revenge. The show did do anything meaningful with Arya's character after her return from Bravos. The lesson we are sure she will have to learn, was not thought. Or the omission of the entire (f)Aegon plot. On one hand, understandable, cutting off yet another claimant to the Iron Throne, but his absence means that nothing we saw in the last few seasons will happen remotely similar. So the whole Cersei-Dany-Jon power struggle will not happen. But the writers failed to substitute his impact with Cersei's stange hold on Kings Landing and probably pushed some of the conflict onto Jon and Dany which was poorly handled. Like Jon is pushed both as a love interest and the greatest rival, so we get both situations underdeveloped and practically doing 180 in a short span of time. Like part of most of the Dany/f(Aegon) dealings was pushed onto Jon, without consideration of his character or goals.
Val, Darkstar, Marwyn & Co., Taena Merryweather, Tyrek, Ser Courtney Penrose, Brown Ben Plumm
Moqorro and Septon Meribald
I mostly agree with all your points, but I think cutting the entire fAegon faction really made the show’s ending suffer. Aegon as a character is ok (he’s definitely outshined by the power players around him like JonCon, Illyrio, and Varys, etc.) but I’m a firm believer that he and Arianne will join forces and take KL, kicking Cersei out of power, so instead of Daenerys coming to Westeros to fight an unpopular tyrant she’ll show up looking like a foreign invader trying to usurp a popular young king. Aegon is definitely a larger threat to Dany than Cersei, especially since I think he’ll steal one of her dragons (I think it’ll be Rhaegal to parallel the Blacks and The Greens in The Dance by having them ride dragons that are literally those colors) and he has really powerful and skilled people on his side. I really think that’s where the show ending suffered. That and whitewashing Tyrion to be a good guy. I think he’ll be the devil (or imp lol) on Dany’s shoulder pushing her to be more destructive.
You’re absolutely right, the main reason I didn’t discuss that here is the fact that I dedicated an entire video to this idea back in May.
Much respect for the Donal Noye selection. I too just did a ASOS re-read and its beautiful how a tertiary character at best can have such an impact on plot relevance and character development. Small things like that make me so obsessed with this series!
You're one of the few I've seen willing to entertain the notion that Noye's lost arm is a bit of a suspicious situation; after all, the Tyrells famously just feasted outside, knowing they didn't have to risk a thing in this war if they kept up the siege. Why waste a single man when you can just sit around and wait out the war? I have a pet theory that he lost his arm because of some dishonor there - trying to escape, starting fights, inciting mutiny, something like that. He tells Jon he came to the wall because a one-armed blacksmith won't do anybody good before immediately becoming the blacksmith for the watch and clearly has no trouble working. I think whatever he did ended with him minus an arm and Stannis telling him it's the noose or the wall. That'd account for why he has such a dim view of Stannis as obstinate and brittle - Stannis's refusal to surrender and refusal to understand or pardon him for what he did during the siege.
It's a constant theme with Stannis being misconceived and presented to the reader in a poor light by a biased character. His actions and nature are ever misunderstood and the reader comes to see what sort of man he really is only thanks to Davos and Jon's POVs. Noye's 'brittle iron' is a byline by a lot of fans when describing stannis still even as his flexibility and resilience are shown over and over. Cressen portrays him as a man twisted to cruelty to even those close to him, when clearly Melisandre had told Stannis what she saw in her fire and the naturally skeptical Stannis tries to subvert her prophesy by ensuring Cressen isn't invited, isn't helped, and is trying to convince him to leave with his humiliation of Cressen, mixed with his own anger and sense of betrayal at seeing this prophecy come true, that this surrogate father was here to betray him and he has no agency against the prophesy of what he came up to do.
I've tried putting these points up before but always a lot of pushback that 'there were probably just skirmishes at the siege' and 'his arc is he starts off an asshole because of melisandre' respectively, but ultimate Stannerman I am, I can only see a man characterized by mischaracterization from all other characters being purposefully introduced to the reader with biased views
I think Brandon Stark did not burn but strangled himself trying to save his father who burned in front of him
Never been this early to anything in my whole life!
🎉🎉This should definitely become a series. With separate episodes for Arianne and Victarion. Beside them, interesting characters that have been omitted are Teana Merrywheather (and her husband), the Stokeworth family and Val. There are also some amazing prologue pov characters but they usually do not have much direct impact to the story.
Great selection of characters, and I especially liked your segment on Rodrik the reader as I just read The Kraken's Daughter today and it was nice to see that Asha also has a parent figure she can turn to when she needs to get away from Balon the same way Theon has Dagmer Cleftjaw. That makes for a good segway, I think I mentioned original Reek when you asked for suggestions for this video on your twitter and really that's more about how different Theon's ACOK arc is in GoT. I think having Dagmer around as someone who genuinely cares about and supports Theon is cool, plus having him instead of whoever that creepy ironborn guy they put in the show lets Theon guide his own journey and ultimately makes it his own decision to attack Winterfell. Add to that the Ramsay-Reek conspiracy and how Ramsay in disguise later serves as that devil on Theon's shoulder works really well because you can believe Theon would betray Robb, but it's harder to see him committing real violent atrocities without someone pushing him like that, which makes it weird when the Ironborn guy they have filling both Dagmer and Ramsay's roles in Season 2 doesn't come up with the idea to burn the kids but in fact it's Theon doing it of his own accord. Having watched Season 2 and read ACOK recently it's very strange how they just rushed through certain plotlines and randomly started ASOS for some characters, and I think the Winterfell one suffers a lot from that. Not having either of the two characters I mentioned, or the Reeds around since they don't show up until Season 3, really makes the plotline feel empty and they also lessened its impact on other characters as the news of Bran and Rickon's supposed deaths is barely impactful at all in the show where in the book it causes Robb, Catelyn, and even Tyrion, with the kidnapping of Tommen, to make rash decisions in response that end up biting them in the butt later on.
All of this to say, I feel like the omission of original Reek had a domino effect in oversimplifying the North plotline to the point where it really doesn't feel like that region exists outside of what Theon is doing for Seasons 3 and 4, and by the time they decide they want things to be happening up there again in Season 5, the damage is done and they've decided it's better to butcher Sansa Theon and Stannis's character arcs in a single stroke than have the slow, bubbling tension that is the North in A Dance With Dragons. It really sucks that the show is not only bad after it passes the books, but also just didn't really care to properly adapt the last 2 books out of 5.
My default answer is Belwas because I love him (who doesn't?), but as you make me think about it... Yes, it's Belwas 😂
Not one specific character, but the people Arya met while traveling with the Brotherhood; Harwin, Ghost of High Hart, Lady Smallwood, etc. These chapters, more than any other, show the impact the wars have had on the smallfolk and how meaningless the conflicts between the different houses can be.
barring the ones in the video, my top omitted characters would have to be:
1. Big Walder & Little Walder (they’re annoying and I loved them so much - would have been hilarious)
2. Satin (obviously)
3. Anguy (him & Arya break my heart, can’t remember if he’s in the show but I don’t think so)
4. Genna Lannister. At least throw her in at riverrun with Jaime, but iirc they never mention her at all in the show.
5. Hoster Tully (he technically appears in the show, but the chapters of Cat and him before he dies are so tragic and good)
I would've liked more of Quarth as we just got her talking to Jorah an no talking to Danny with all her messages for Danny
If the overarching theme of ASOIF is "if you don't learn from history, you're doomed to repeat it," Rodrick is the character that shows you what can happen if you _do_ learn.
Excellent picks, your videos have been amazing lately
12:43 MA BOI true respect, one-armed blacksmith gigachad of book-only characters... Donal Noye really serves the role of "father figure"/mentor to Jon and is one of the few characters to consistently voice *good ideas* ... he really kind of is the existential hero for GRRM: rational, pragmatic in his outlook on life but always respectful in his interactions with people, honorable yet humble, and willing to sacrifice everything he has for what he believes in
Yes!! George does like that type. Yoren (who sneaks Ayra out of kingslanding) is another example. He puts his vow to bring men to the nights watch over everthing, and doesn’t seem to care about the politics of the kingdom)
He literally spanks a lady of winterfell while on his way to go deliver her to Winterfell (something i dont think many commoners could even fathom doing in the books)
You should definitely do that video on characters most changed from the show! loved this one :)
Season 7 & 8 really suffered with the exclusion of Young Griff and Arianne.
Man i’m just waiting on my Uber Eats to arrive so I can watch this drunk and then happily fall asleep. It will be a sublime experience.
Sublime as always Quinn.
Where the fck is Marwin? Val? Alleras? Leo Tyrell? Darkstar? Aurane Waters? Where the fck is my boy Moqorro? man you should really do another video. Great job tho as always
They included Marwyn. (Jim Broadbent)
A bastardised version but still.
Domeric was also barbrey nephew i believe
Satin. My personal favorite minor character. I say minor, but Satin spends the most time with Jon out of every other character besides Ghost. From Jon returning to the wall, to Jon dying, Satin is with or near him.
Jon in book 5 is harsh and blunt with people. Except Satin. The few lines of dialog they share lack the edge Jon normally had.
Jon takes Satin and the recruits north for their Vows. Satin is there when Wun Wun joins. Jon makes Satin Steward of the Lord Commander. A boy barely older than Jon himself, at the wall for less than a year, named as one of the most important positions.
Jon thinks about Satin a handful of times, and he reminds the reader Satin is pretty each time.
And this is what really confuses me, Jon's crush on Satin is removed, Satin is gone from the show entirely. Why? Satin does 3 things, fight with Jon on the wall, make a joke about Mel, and helps Jon as his ward. It's not exactly a role that demanded a ton of screen time.
I know why. it's because D&D wanted Jon to be a traditional hero. They wanted him to love and kill Dany. Jon being bisexual and into a femboy named Satin would ruin their version of Jon.
I only bring this up because Jon exploring his sexuality and being softer with someone is very important for his character. Jon is a very conflicted person, and his hard decisions are paired with cold eyes. The more stoic he gets, the more the smaller moments of him finding a boy pretty mean so much. It also makes Jon a much deeper character overall.
Again, I love Satin. I write fan fics about him. I think he has such an interesting point of view. A whore from Oldtown who somehow got arrested in Gulltown and got to the wall, fought the battle on the wall, met a giant beyond the wall, and is the ward of Ned Stark's bastard and Lord Commander of the Night's Watch.
This is a minor character with 2-3 lines of dialog. It's why I love George as a writer.
It also shows how Jon thinks of people based on merit and not judging by status, everyone else is calling Satin a whore and Jon calls them out for being criminals too, and that Satin can read and write so he's a good steward.
I think he just thinks he's a pretty man, like it's a girly thing. Jon judges everyones appearance constantly. It's been a while since I read it, but I didn't interpret it as Jon literally being sexully attracted to him. Sam is fat, gilly is plain, ygritte has crooked teeth, and satin is a pretty boy. I could take it as him hating on someone's looks again just as easy.
I don’t see him as attracted to satin just can note he’s man pretty in a somewhat feminine way. Cause he notes his prettiness somewhat similar to sansa in book 1. Jon is way more attracted to Val cause not only is she physically attractive but she also is a capable warrior
Justice for steel shanks
You should definitely do a video on Wyman Manderly! He is such a great character who deserves some discussion. I was glad that he did have a cameo in the finale of season six. But he is such a great character with his The North Remembers speech and his wonderful plotting against House Bolton and House Frey. It is a real shame that we missed out on seeing some of that dramatized. Even though the Frey Pies were given to Arya in the television show, and it did feel like a bad ass moment for her character, I think it was a bit of a disservice to Arya in the end. GRRM makes it clear that revenge becomes a cyclical problem that harms those that enact it in the end. I think the television show did too much to glorify revenge because it felt satisfying to the audience in the moment. And their version of the Frey Pies perpetuated that aspect of revenge, regardless of the momentary scene in the finale, where the Hound tells Arya that she should turn away from revenge before embarking on the inevitable fan service event of Clegane Bowl.
My three favourite monologues: Bloodraven's 'Ghosts' speech - Doran's revelation - Manderly's speech to Davos -- all kinds of chills & perfection!
13:00 just re-read that chapter yesterday where Donal Noye tells his backstory. It wasn't the siege of Storm's End where he lost his arm, but the storming of Pyke in the Greyjoy rebellion.
I fucking love Garlan, and the way he treats Sansa and Tyrion in Storm. I didn’t know that his nickname came from his elder brother and that really makes me like Willa’s too, I cannot believe the show excluded these two, especially Garlan
Awesome video dude!
JON POV in GOT
"Wow there's the guy who forged Robert's war hammer that he used to smash Rhaegar, what a cool guy!! I hope he mentors me!"
Awesome video! I would love to see a follow-up with missing POV characters, cause there are definitely a couple whos absence brought down the quality of the show. with t
Wex is one of my favorite characters period
I like Donal Noye too. I'm personally not that bothered by patch face, though. He's intriguing and I find his relationship with Shireen interesting but aside from that, he's mostly just an instrument for vague foreshadowing
I don’t know why but I’ve always found him and his backstory fascinating!
@@QuinnTheGM oh yeah, he's definitely really interesting to wonder about, and I'm really intrigued to see where his character goes and what some of the mystery builds to. You can't not be intrigued by him
I genuinely think Barbrey Dustin wanted the Boltons to get rid of the Starks purely due to being slighted by Brandon Stark. But when the Red Wedding happened she wasn't prepared for how brutally barbaric it was, and it made her sorta realize that her hatred of Brandon had poisoned her feelings towards the innocent Starks. This is why I think she joined Wyman Manderly's plot, she feels slighted by the Boltons now for what happened, and as they say: The North remembers.
I’m just starting to read the books and haven’t yet come across any that weren’t included in the show except the one-armed blacksmith at castle black. Looking forward to getting to them!
Saving the best for last, Donal "the goat" Noye
I would love to see this video done again with a casting list of who should have portrayed them in the show.
The best omitted character is stannis baratheon. I can't believe the show named his replacement the same name as him, SMH
I might be a bit late but Ser Cortnay Penrose is my favorite character in the entire series and his omission from season 2 still stings.
Garlan is one of my favorite characters in the entire series. Just a genuinely nice guy first, but lowkey one of the greatest warriors in the realm.
His defending of Tyrion really shows the type of guy he is. Tyrion’s always looked down upon by knights and other nobility, but Garlan is the complete opposite. Dude even spoke out to the king in his defense, which is insane when you remember he barely knows the man.
Guy really lives up to that billing as “the Gallant” shame he was cut, here’s to hoping he can make it through the series.
Great list! I haven't read through the full series in a while, so I'd forgotten how much I'd loved Bitter Barb Dustin, Rodrik the Reader, and Donal Noye, the most badass and wise blacksmith in all of Planetos. I think Patchface and Strong Belwas are pretty unforgettable. Good call on the missing Tyrell brothers, too. They seem like decent, solid guys that would both be good heirs to their house, and would also be interesting to hang out with. And Willas is definitely Westeros's most eligible bachelor - is a limp really that bad in the eyes of the ladies?
I'm going to have to do a reread now, just to find more amazing characters that Dumb and Dumber neglected.
Good list!
My favorite character that was changed was Yoren from the nights watch because of how he was used in the book. He was mentioned so much in the background of most chapters. Justthis dirty, grubby guy, begging for scraps all over westeros. Until he saves Arya at Neds execution and we realise that not only does he realise that Ned is innocent, he probably sees most of whats going on the the country but mostly only cares about his mission. He also gives Ayra a whopping when she beats up another recruit dispite knowing shes a noble, and tells Gold clokes to FOH when the come for Gendry. Just seems like a bad ass (who we never actually see die)
Oh and bonus cool fact: he was only in the nightswatch for killing his brothers killer. Definitely a guy with his own sense of right and wrong.
I miss Victarion but I'm also happy he wasn't ruined in the show.
He was sort of rolled into their "Euron".
Hey, great video. I noticed one small error: You said Brandon Stark was burned to death by Areys' command, but he actually strangled himself (by use of a Tyroshi device) in his attempts to save his father from burning to death. :)
Choosing not to have stoneheart was a HUGE blunder. I haven’t read the books, but damn would that have been a heart wrenching plot line to witness. Her rising from the dead a twisted vengeful version of what stark once loved so fondly. Coming to tear down everyone who had a hand in there houses downfall.
great picks, one character i wish we had seen in the series was Young Griff aka the Aegon pretender (or he could possibly be the real deal)
Great vid Quinn :) Could you please do a video on some of the more interesting wildlings, particularly Osha. I always find her to be a very unique situation, she seems unusually loyal to House Stark given her wildling background and I wonder if she can really be trusted with Rickon long-term - how will she interact with Davos when he arrives? Would love your thoughts on her!
The strange thing is, the spearwives with Theon also were unusually sympathetic to the starks, could there be a connection?
Oh my god the Snowpiercer reference and then the reference that Wonkapeircer is real ahaha. I too went down that rabbit hole and watched that CZcams video right after watching Snowpiercer ahaha.
Donel Noy is a cool character and probably is more than a bit of a nod to Azor Ahai forging Lightbringer. In Jon's fight with "Rattleshirt" he even laments how Noy didn't live long enough to put an edge on the sword he uses, directly referencing sword-smiting. And so many references to the "aspect" of this or that facet of the god head. Azor Ahai was the Warrior, the Smith, the Father, perhaps. The Stranger.....
Great video idea Quinn. I have a crim law midterm tomorrow wish me luck (imma need it if I keep procrastinating with asoiaf vids)
Good luck! My crim midterm is due Tuesday, it’s a take-home essay thing.
Good luck to you guys who are still in school! Sometimes I wish I was, and then I remember things like midterms, and Hell Week, and student housing... Anyway, slay those midterms like Balerion at Harrenhall!
Likewise 🤝
Great video. Love these characters too. But I don’t think Brandon Stark was burned to death. I think he set up so that he strangled himself trying to save his father. As I recall, his sword was placed just out of reach and witnessed his father being roasted alive in his own armor.
I really like Jaime’s extended family. Him having a bro moment with daven was cool and i liked Genna Lannister a lot, she was like a smart Cersei.
I like what you said about Patchface but in my opinion it was the right decision to cut him from the show. like you said there's a lot of prophecy and mysticism around patchface that works really well in the books that i think you can do in more interesting ways with a visual medium.
Think of a character like Ros who isn't in the books, but serves a purpose in the show where you can get more background information and thoughts and motivations from the characters who talk to her. You don't really need that sort of thing in a book because we're in most of the characters heads anyways so we know what they're plotting.
TL:DR patchface is really more of a plot device to keep readers thinking and guessing rather than a character in the normal sense
you should put the rodrik quote up in your classroom or something. it'd be fiting.
Just imagine Dwayne The Rock Johnson as Strong Belwas in the show
Renly’s peach is my favorite character from the book, I will never forgive D&D for leaving it out.
Mormont's talking raven deserved at least an honorable mention.
Great video. I never watched the show at all. At this point, i am done waiting for the books to be finished, but cool nonetheless.
Liked the video because of "fun fact : this fire is green because tyrell blood" that got a good chuckle from me
If you do make a video about characters that did appear but were drastically different: bloodraven/three eyed raven, it makes me so sad every time I think about what could have been
Please do the “changed in the show” characters video!
The lack of the northern politics and characters like those in Robb's Kingsguard was a major mistake for the show.
there's no way the show can keep all those characters
Mances reaction to hearing about the giant and who killed him was one of my favorite things to read.
Donal Noye is a great character. Love him. Show actually gives him a slight nod in the battle at castle black in the show. There is a scene where they have a character pick up a cleaving knife which he used in the book to fight with. Not a ‘named character’ in the show but definitely give him a nod in the show cuz he was super badass
Some other good characters missing...
The rainbow guard. Renly's own version of the kingsguard. All interesting characters in their own right, and i loved discovering what happened to them all after Renly's death.
Harwin. Provides good exposition when Arya meets the brotherhood without banners, and may have been a contributing factor in the revival of Catelyn as Lady Stoneheart.
Some of the less important knights, such as Balon Swann, Lyn Corbray and Lothor Brune.
The Kettleblacks. Stupid name aside, I loved how they were able to lie and cheat their way up the social ladder and get into Cersei's inner circle.
Some of Robbs inner circle, such as Raynald Westerling, Dacy Mormont, Smalljon Umber.
Would absolutely love to get pov chapter with lady Dustin. She seems to know all kinds of northern secrets
I may do a video about Garlan myself. For such a small character, he's one of the best people in the books. If you listed positive attributes found among the male characters, and made a top 10 list of characters with those traits, Garlan probably wouldn't be #1 on any list, but he'd be on all of them. I think he's the best all-around knight/lord/human being in the stories.
I would've liked to see The Green Grace in the TV show too
I enjoyed this video
I’m actually upset you left out my guy Nimble Dick. His journey with Brienne and Pod during A Feast for Crows was so great
It was appropriate to leave him out. However, it would've been cool to have met Small Paul. He wanted that bird!
Don't forget about our dear friend "Nimble" Dick, honorable mention the adventurous Cleos Frey.
The Rodrik quote... I'm just re-reading the series and had to scribble that down in a notebook last week as I thought it was so good. Very topical, sadly.