They're a bit niche, but fantastic none-the-less! London's small tram network!
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- čas přidán 15. 07. 2024
- Up this week, we take a look at the Croydon Trams, which serve a very niche little network south of the Thames.
Date of Travel: May 2023
Rolling Stock: Bombardier CR4000
Operator: Transport for London
Origin: East Croydon Tram Stop, Greater London, United Kingdom (England)
Destination: Wimbledon Tram Stop, Greater London, United Kingdom (England)
Cost of ticket: £1.75 ($2.20, €2.05)
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#london #tramlink #trams
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Credits
[1] Tramlink map 2017.png by Metrophil
Link:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Tr...
used under Creative Commons Attribution-Share Alike 4.0 International license.
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[2] www.openstreetmap.org under Open Data Commons Open Database License (ODbL) opendatacommons.org/licenses/... opendatacommons.org/licenses/... opendatacommons.org/licenses/...
It's worth noting that although there is quite a bit of on-street running, particularly in the centre of Croydon, those streets are mostly restricted and only open to public transport and cyclists, not general traffic.
Church Road is shared with traffic. And so is Lebanon road afaik
@@_CaptainCookie I did say "mostly" and not "wholly"! Church Street is effectively local access only, and not used by through traffic. The on-street section of Addiscombe Road past Lebanon Road is restricted to access only at busy times of day.
Almost like streets being for humans living there and not cars is a good thing
I like how the tram has the same logo as the underground and the overground.
That's the generic TFL roundel. You can see the same design on the bus branding, River buses and even taxi stands I've seen with that roundel
@@_CaptainCookieAlso the bike share program
@@erik_griswold sure but boris bikes are basically obsolete now with lime, human forest, and whatever other ones there are that offer electric bikes
@@_CaptainCookie cool :D
Both of these brands can also be found in my city, Kraków. And ones of them were produced in the same time as CR4000s, when German branch of Bombardier built original Bombardier Flexities (known locally as NGT6/1) in a form of 24 there section sets (of which half of them have 4 doors and another ones have 5 doors (additional added single wing door in the rear)) and this company was successful here as it also won two additional tenders: one for the trams of the size and look, but the new livery and front and rear, called NGT6/2, in a form of 36 sets produced around 2007 and another one for much longer ones with completely new design, called NGT8 and produced in 2012. Stadler is still producing the 110 trams and it's also caused by the organisation of the major sports event: The Variobahns were produced for 2012 Olympic Games, while Tangoes are still in production for (outside of extention of 50 to Borek Fałęcki (it's completed) and Górka Narodowa (in construction)) 3rd European Games in Kraków.
you forgot to mention they also go to New Addington
I enjoyed seeing everyday London and Croydon passing by. When you see London online it's usually famous places and Croydon you don't see at all. This week's tram and next week's Alpine journey illustrate perfectly, the wide range of the channel.
I went on the trams in January with my dad, we got a thameslink from London bridge to East Croydon to get one. Didn't know about heading to the southern end of the platforms, would've saved lots of time.
The trams are pretty good. Towards Wimbledon at least they replaced a crappy old train service that was being run down and little-used. Now it's very well-used. Not a massive fan of Ken Livingstone, but it was one of his initiatives.
Good ol' Ken had plans for more trams throughout London. What could've been!
@@lordgemini2376 The coss London one was a good idea. The firts thing Boris cancelled IIRC.
IIRC, the train ran something daft like every 45 minutes, because that's what they could manage with one train in service and an end-to-end journey time of about 20 minutes. So the tram now is slightly slower than the train was, but so much more frequent that the door-to-door journey time for anyone using it is likely to be less.
@@stevieinselby And IIRC an elderly 2 EPB wasn't exactly welcoming for passengers.
@@brianfretwell3886 the southern terminus was ill thought through - creating a one way system around Brixton would of caused so much havoc with buses let alone other road users. Croydon was ideal because the main roads the trams ran along were all very wide like George Street & Wellesley Road whilst Station Road & Tamworth Road wern't as heavily used. The Croydon tram also worked because it took over several low frequency old railways which the southern tram wouldn't of done
Interesting report. First time I seen your blog.
The Wimbledon branch to Croydon was originally a rail line.
I love trams.
Originally from Scotland, I remember the original Edinburgh trams and travelled on one of the last Glasgow ones.
The driver let me drive a fee yards.
A great thrilled at age 14!
I'm headed to London and and the UK in general next summer (first time!). I'm a bit of transit nerd too so seeing all of your transit stuff makes me more excited!
Extending these beyond Beckenham to Bromley would have made a lot of sense although probably too expensive - I know you can change for Bromley South but having trams run through the centre of Bromley would have taken a lot of strain off the crowded bus network.
Bromley Council would've said no, just as they voiced their opposition to a tube extension to Hayes.
Fun fact: The Croydon Tramlink was opened in 2000 and has never expanded since, and, now, all tram lines in Croydon aren't numbered (althrough unofficially these still have numbers from 1 to 4), but these have assigned routes:
West Croydon - Elmers End (only in case of running to depot, in this case, early mornings and late evenings),
Wimbledon - Beckenham Junction
West Croydon - New Addington (via full unidirectional loop),
Wimbledon - Elmers End.
Just sad they don't go as far as Lewisham, as doing so would link back to the DLR and thus the Underground.
If only trams went as far as oxford street or Westminster
always enjoy using the Croydon Tram. The traffic in that part of London can be bad at times, and it is easy to to go IKEA or the retail park on it from Croydon.
Thanks for this one Dylan. In all these years, I've still not managed to have a ride on the the Croydon trams so your bitesize review's worked wonders 👍🏿
Ahh, the nostalgia! Didn't go on them much whilst there, but I remember being on them!
Strictly speaking, they are London trams though. All routes run through London boroughs, regardless of not going into Central London.
Those trams seem like a good idea for areas where, as you say, there is little to no Underground or other rail network connectivity.
Also, I'm really looking forward to your next video, you've got me intrigued!
Awesome work sir.
I visited the Croydon Tram for the first time in January. I managed to do the loop, though it took some working out to achieve this and what I found is a particularly tram unit does not ping pong the same route all day the loop sets it off on other legs of the network. Something which would be fun to do; just get on a tram and sit their and see how much of the network it covers in a day.
Interesting. I suspect you would need at least 3 teams to cover the whole network though who knows?
Seems like quite a good system to me. Every city in the USA should have one in order to facilitate local transportation esp in areas where there are no subways and too few buses. For example, in NYC, a line that runs from Jamaica, NY to East New York/New Lots, down to Flatlands, Marine Park, Sheepshead Bay, and onto Gravesend. There is a need for more public transportation and such a system would fit in quite well.
That's one hell of a project, if it's going from Jamaica to Gravesend. From the Caribbean to the North sea 😨
@@_CaptainCookie
Such a line would service an area encompassing 900K people. Therefore, a good investment in my view.
Dylan, can I suggest you do an Irish rail journey; Arrive in Cork, and get the Iarnród Éireann Intercity from Cork-Kent to Dublin-Heuston, then have a go on the Dublin's DART rail from Greystones to Howth, and then the Luas tram from Tallaght to Dublin-Connelly. After that go on the Enterprise from Dublin Connelly to Belfast Lanyon Place, and finally get the Translink-NI Railways rail service from Belfast Lanyon to Derry~Londonderry.
Thanks for sharing
A neat little video on Croydon's tram system. Unfortunately, I didn't get to experience it myself when visiting Britain five years ago so thanks for the experience. You and others may have already viewed videos on Melbourne's tram network thanks to CZcams sharing relevant links in their sidebar.
For comprehensive CZcams coverage of transport topics in my part of the world, may I recommend;
ThebusofdoomFSX, Pannier Productions, Comeng998
as three channels worth viewing/subscribing to. Cheers from downunder.🙂😉🙂
I just started watching your channel , it's pretty great and your knowledge on the trains and the system is amazing, your descriptions make it very Interesting to watch. I was also wondering what do you do for a living that allows you to travel so much? I'm just jealous.
Thank you so much 😁 I make money off running ads on these videos.
Short and sweet, thankfully the sun was shining the whole time.
amazing review dylan mate them trams do looks amazing
Only a few days ago I saw a tram exiting Beckenham Junction bound for Wimbledon (just for a few seconds since I was on a fast Southeastern train)
Last time I used them was going from New Addington to Croydon; much preferable to the buses
Edit 2:32 You only need to *touch in* to get on a tram using one of the readers; at Wimbledon though, the process is more complicated
I always have to double check the signs at wimbledon, to make sure I don't mess up
Ikr, talk about making a mountain out of a mole hill!
Lovely little system. We need as many trams as we did in the 1930s
Keep up the good work
Nice!
Great trip
Oof!
Felt sorry for you on that Southern service at the beginning there,
3 + 2 Seating is Never good!
Trams are cool 👍
You need to touch in before boarding. No need to touch out at the end unless your journey ends at Wimbledon.
I have been on the Tramlink many times and it’s such a good tram network in South London that serves Croydon and Wimbledon. And the trams are very good.
Living in Croydon the tam is great for some people but in reality it doesn't serve anyone living on the north south axis of the borough. Seems the routes were really to draw folk in from rival retail cores and make travel from New Addington easier.
I would love it if there was a new route connecting Croydon to Brixton. Yh there's the 109 and 250 but these are the only direct connections and a tram could be faster with less frequent stops and all the advantages it gets at traffic lights whilst offering a cheaper alternative mode of transport towards central London.
The main reason that the tram doesn't run on the north-south axis is because there were already good rail services on that corridor - whereas there was no rail service _at all_ to New Addington (population over 10k), no direct service from Croydon to Elmers End or Beckenham, and only a very poor service to Wimbledon that could easily be taken over by the trams.
Hey Dylan, just a little side note but being early in the video you said about tapping in and out on the readers, unlike trains this is not true, it runs on a bus system where you only tap on entry, you aren't required to tap upon exit
South London needs an extensive tram network, especially as the underground is quite limited south of the river.
just a small correction: you don't need to tap out in any station apart from Wimbledon, and the reason is otherwise you might be charged the nation rail fare. Moreover, if you come in from the main barriers at wimbledon you have to tap twice, once at the entrance and once before boarding the tram. I guess you have just been "unlucky" to get off to the only station which requires tapping in and out and it made you think you have to do it at every station :)
How do they know where you got off then and you could be still charged the national fare
@@gillianderoiste2097 it works the following: if you get in or out any station in the network, apart from wimbledon station, you don't need to touch out as there is a flat fare of £1.75. At Wimbledon, as the entrance/exit is shared with the nation railway, not only you need to tap in/out, but the tram itself has its on validator which let the oyster or contactless card know that you have used the tram.
Nice scenic journey. Unlike the underground where you're in a black hole most of the time.
The section between West Croydon - Wimbledon was a rail line until 1997 and was closed to make way for the trams. They both shared some of the same stations Morden Road, Mitcham, Mitcham Junction, Beddington Lane, Waddon Marsh and even use the same Platfrom at Wimbledon.
Cheers for a cracking wee insight, Dylan. Thanks again.
💯👀
I agree that 'London does not really need trams on the scale of the likes of Prague and Vienna.' But you forgot the obvious comparator - Paris. Paris has of course a very extensive metro similar in overall coverage to the London Underground. BUT it also now has TEN modern tram routes dotted around the various suburbs. London has three just routes concentrated in one suburb!
I would agree, but Paris' Metro is only just over half of the length of the London Underground, so I'd say it's probably more needed there.
Not really concentrated in one suburb though. It may be called the Croydon Tramlink, but Elmers End/New Addington to Wimbledon is a fair distance, and passes through multiple suburbs.
Pls do these Reviews
Dfds Dover-Calais/Dunkirk
Megabus M20 Glasgow - London
Glasgow Subway
Great Western Railway London Paddington - Penzance
Appreciate that they are definitely not Central London Trams but Croydon, Wimbeldon and the rest of the trams destinations are definitely still in London so I think the name is still justified
Or smart card with a Travelcard on it
Well, Paris also has a "very somewhat" tram service😅 2 or 3 short lines in the north.
No! Paris now has TEN tram routes. Unlike similar size London, the routes are scatter all around the city's suburbs.
While it's confusing how to pay (I kept looking for a ticket booth) it's great that once you tap in you don't have to tap out....unless you get off at Wimbledon. The only station you have to tap out.
'which serve a very niche little network south of the Thames' mate it honestly isnt that small, it serves many purposes and has really high ridership
Nice video, love the London trams
Thanks!
Good information to know when visiting London.
I love your historical commentary and photos.
Thank you!
It was only until a couple of years ago that every tram stop had a ticket machine (manufactured in the late 1990s) so that you could pay your fare with cash but all the ticket machines have been removed probably due to their age, maintenance costs and that almost nobody ever used them (in over 15 years of using the trams I have never seen anyone using one of the now-removed ticket machines).
I think its also worth noting that I believe you are able to buy tram tickets from the National Rail ticket machines, at Wimbledon at least but I don't know about the other railway interchanges because the stations are not managed by SWR who therefore use a different brand of ticket vending machine (TVM) last I checked at East Croydon Rly Stn.
Used them for my daily commute before retirement. They get very busy at times, do not miss the 6.15am crush-a-thon to Wimbledon.
Still very good value when using with buses.
Valid opinion Dylan. Really need a lot more of these systems all over the country.
It is annoying that they dont run them in pairs to improve capacity.
I hope you'll consider making a video on the London underground and maybe even overground
Amazing videos as always!
Ty
I have done the Chur to Tirano train twice
at different times of year
but have never done the Croydon Trams.
My favourite was my least successful one
We went in October
and it was foggy most of the way
and the announcements
told us in FOUR languages
about the wonderful sites
but we had about 1 metre visibility
LOL
It had cleared by the time we got to
the tethered cow though.
Great Video, lived in Croydon for 7 years and the Trams made life so much easier
Hey, great vid as always, any plans to ride the Edinburgh tram as a video in its own right? Think it featured in the plane vs train race buy only briefly.
I think I will next time I'm in Edinburgh.
@@DylansTravelReports looking forward to it, thanks for the reply Dylan.
Thanks for the Rid Along !! enjoyed it
Very informative Dylan, thank you....
Maybe the modern trams as it were could be used to increase travel in south west London. From Earls Court westwards the train is ok but not great. London is supposedly a 24hour city but you can find it difficult at times to travel as the transport system is a bit hit & miss. I don’t think the “snail rail” as I call the train from south west London is that quick and a comprehensive plan to improve it would probably not just benefit TFL but also the areas effected too. I think there should be a 48hr return ticket on the train so you can stopover night and return the next day, the ticket system is not straight forward and you do have to be careful as each train company makes its own set of rules and exceptions. London deserves better and the trams offer a sensible approach to the current system.
Used to take them rather frequently. A nice little service.
DON'T TAP OUT. YOU COULD LAND UP PAYING TWICE.
you forgot to do Glasgow Central to East Kilbride
Boa tarde Dylan lindo vlt vídeo como sempre incrível Londres
It's a pity they didn't keep expanding it to other suburbs (and that they abandoned the nicer and more Londony red livery).
Amazing video once again! I think you should do what's the best way between Lincoln and Peterborough l. Is it LNER or EMR?
LNER 100%
F
Did the tram challenge back at start of 2020 and it’s good to ride on it
i want to know more about yr bad trip to birmingham!
Hi Sir great video I don’t know that there was a tram service i the london area i have learnt something new thanks
My home city has up graded the transit system with full size buses and added an experimental route. Getting where you need to go may involve midtable transfers on the8 fixed routes that run every hour.. At my age it cost $0.50 with free transfers
Nice to see you visiting my manor dear boy !!!
I have a suggestion, do thameslink from horsham to Peterborough
And another is LNER refurbished class 91 and DVT sets
Or the Azuma, I wanna see one tbe above
Dndjf
You should do Megabus!
System is crying out for expansion.
I challenge you to visit the West Midlands metro
The trams and dlr look very similar but the dlr is express like
I know right
that is because the dlr and trams are both light rail
@@britishmapping1759i see
Great video although you don’t need to touch out when getting off a tram normally
Welcome to the south east..work In Chichester 😊
The first map you showed is well out of date
If we could get trams in SE London connecting busy bus routes like Lewisham - Catford- Bromley that would be great as they aren’t served by anything TfL except buses
London Trams
your awesome love your videos i cant wait till fridays to see them
Thank you 😁
T
Hi Sir
Dylan can u do Buses For the trips?
Light rail
Light Rail me daddy.
@@mildlydispleased3221 that’s what’s it’s called. Not commuter rail or heavy rail or heaven forbid subway.
F
@@Shuttletrain I know.
Tramendous
My local station is East Croydon
Be careful at Wimbledon though as the touch in/out arrangements are not intuitive.
London needs more light rail lines besides the TramLINK.
Got the DLR too 🤷♂️
Ah Very Good Very Nice
Pls Do Glasgow Subway, Glasgow To London Megabus, Sydney Metro, Flixbus Video, Barcelona Metro
Great video. Your pronunciation of Swiss and London station names needs a bit of work though. 😊
Uh oh... Chiltern Mainline is usually hassle-free. It'll be interesting to see what happened.....
Actually it’s generally regarded that the bus network in London is the best part of the overall public transport system. Compared to Paris it does not come out well. For the size of the population (about 3.5 million) Berlin is far superior to London. A decent trolleybus system is desperately needed for London. It had one once and getting rid of it was the worst decision that could have been made. 🤨
London underground trains better transport than buses
F