5 of the Biggest #$@%ing Comic Book COPYCATS!
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- čas přidán 26. 08. 2024
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Shelby Robertson here, artist from the Morbid Angel book. I was a 16 year old Extreme studios bullpen artist; Liefeld pencil finishes, Platt small backgrounds etc. and went off on my own, think I was 19 when I drew that Morbid Angel Hell and Back series. Those were actually my pencils scanned straight to print. I probably used some Sharpies for the black areas. If you did a review of the 2022 Deadpool Bad Blood reprint books of the original 2017 HC, I inked over half of those pages. I'm still drawing comics. Peace.
The inker on Morbid Angel #1 was dope though. ;)
@@MikeTaylor-uw5zy they should totally look at book 1 and 2 as well. Forgot if you were still on inks during 2 or if you were in France. Happy weekend sir!
You penciled some of that Crypt series from Extreme if memory serves. I was freelancing for Rob at the time (shortly before getting the Top Cow gig) driving down to the Anaheim office once a week and getting to hand pick 5-7 pages from random books. I remember grabbing a couple of those pages to Ink, must have been 95? Good times.
Several of us have wondered, was anyone associated with Morbid Angel a fan of the death metal band of the same name?
@@AmericanDischord I only did issue 1 and it was a beast! Still super proud of those inks. Wish I could have done the rest, but then I went to Europe for 3 months. Haha.
Thanx for the kind words. Yeah. My work was VERY Corben-esque, back then. SO much Zip-A-Tone….lol. There’s another nod to Corben in one of the panels, with Den calling out to “Kath!”
YO- I inked that cover for MORBID ANGEL (You can see my name and Shelby's on the cover) and I inked all of issue #1. The interiors from issue 2 on WERE actually pencil scans with some splatter added. ALSO Shelby WAS at Extreme - He did a short Rascal story in one of Dan Fraga's Black Flagg one-shot and some other random fill ins.
I was a house inker at London Night Studios for about 2+ years in the mid 90s fyi. :)
Any relation to the band?
@@chibbykill I’m from Bay Area originally, so I was more into Death Angel. Not 100% sure if the creator of the book Everette Hartsoe was a fan of Morbid Angel. He likely saw fans of his book Razor wearing the shirts at cons and dug it. He did do a licensed Switchblade Sister’s tie in book once with that band.
Frank Miller is on the record saying Sin City was mostly him aping Tracer Bullet from Calvin & Hobbes. Love to see that comparison.
In an interview in '94, Frank Miller was asked about TDKR and its influence on comic storytelling and art in the years since its release. But it can easily be applied to Sin City as well:
"Yeah, there's been a lot of grim and gritty, etc. But a friend of mine once put it perfectly, seeing some of the imitative stuff, just said: 'This isn't grim, it's glum.'"
And, of course, in a letter in an issue of Sin City, Miller explicitly called out Jim Lee, Tim Sale, Mike Netzer and said:
"No, I'm not flattered. Not anymore. If there's anything that you should've gotten from Sin City, it's the inspiration that comes from seeing another artist find his own voice, his own vision."
Shelby Robinson is still around. He has a CZcams channel: AmericanDischord. Has a crowdfunded book also: Rageality’s War. He’s very good but isn’t well known.
The most recent Shelby Robertson work I have appears in Zaid Comics’s CG Vacation (2022). Check out his inks over Dales Keown’s pencils on the cover.
Early on Miller was heavily uses very Ditko panels in a 1980 Spidey annual and had a strong Gil Kane vibe on John Carter of Mars fill in and his early DD run! That being said his storytelling narrative is present right from the beginning and Miller quickly moves on and finds his own way! On a ironic note Miller wasn’t very happy when Jim Lee did a Miller influenced Batman piece in Legends of the Dark Knight 50! Ohh well? Lol! Rich Buckler did some heavy swipes on Kirby in 70’s FF and Thor + Avengers/Nuklon giant size! Ron Frenz also had a Kirby,Ditko and John Buscema influence and I say with alot of ❤️ love NOT scorn! House style with some great storytelling chops 🎯👍⚡️and I could feel the love! George Perez through out his career in a panel here and there would channel Kirby,Kane and Kubert and once again I could feel the love ❤️! The MOST important thing in comics is storytelling/narrative! Thanks guys!This one brought back a lot of great memories and appreciation for my early years of comics!😎🔥 Keep reading and making comix!!🎯
I wonder if that Morbid Angel comic has any crossover or reference whatsoever to the death metal band of the same name!
I’m sorry if this has been already mentioned but there IS a Spawn b&w book. The first edition of the Spawn compendium collects the first 50 issues of Spawn completely in b&w, I think you guys would have a blast with it on the show
I call the "everyone tries to do Sin City" era "Franksploitation". So many comics within a short span of time, most not that great except for Stray Bullets and Kane. I can't knock it because at least half the drawings I was doing myself in that era were trying to be Frank Miller.
Excellent episode!
It may be due to what I was reading in the late 80's/early 90's, but I see some of the McFarlane influenced stuff you point out as having a touch of Tim Vigil.
I was excited when Tom Scioli was doing his Kirby homage work in Godland. Would have loved to see him continue in that style.
Look for Kev Walkers stint A.B.C Warriors Jim and Ed. You want mad painted 90s British comics that are following on from Bisley? THAT'S your guy. He's a guy I actually like MORE than Bisley to be fair because I think Bisleys stuff could be far far too messy and Kevs work was... Odd. Because he paints like an inker. It's super hard to explain but if you get a hold of that stuff (Which was following on from Bisleys turn on A.B.C Warriors which was black and white inked comics).
Kev now does a style that's closer to Mike Mignola but it's very much his own.
Also! You want to see where Jamie Hewlett gets his Hewlett hands from (that isn't Mort Drucker?) Check out Slaine with art by Mike McMahon. Mike drew these long gangly weird hands that Hewlett just absorbed and man alive it's interesting. Also get Mike on the channel please. I need more people to know the chap exists and that he's one of my favourite artists and he's the guy who codified Judge Dredd (After Carlos).
OOOH! Another guy you should absolutely check out who we all saw was a sort of Bisley was Carl Critchlow. Carl is an absolute legend. He did more illustration work later and changed his style (His recent style is amazing) and oh my LORD Thrud the Barbarian is spectacular.
Both Kev and Critchlow went on to create some of the most stunning Magic Cards from the late 90's era. Kev's color palettes and smooth transitions are unparalleled.
For anyone who's interested in the super high-contrast black-and-white approach commonly associated with Frank Miller's Sin City, you might want to take a look at two predecessors -
* Jim Steranko's 1976 graphic novel, Chandler: Red Tide, which was published as both a digest-sized softcover and a larger-format TPB;
* The 1953 EC war story, "Atom Bomb!" illustrated by Wally Wood and published in Two-Fisted Tales issue 33 way back in 1953.
I'm betting Woody borrowed this approach from someone, but I can't cite anything.
Shelby Robertson actually DID do some work for Extreme Comics. I wanna say it was the Crypt miniseries but I could be wrong.
If you look at Cliff Chiang pencils it might help give an idea of how Kitson’s no-outline inks are working.
Check out Filip Myszkowski. He's an artist from Poland who is our version of Bisley ;) He created "Eryk", "Bezból" and some others. He has met Simon and they drinked a lot of beers together during some Polish conventions 😂 so there are no bad blood between them im case of similar style.
Worgard looks great, and Im a big mucho corben fan. love his art. Too bad about Sean Patty did not really do too much.
Keith Giffen during his "Kirby" stage... Awesome. Have you looked at it yet?
John Cebollero is a great artist. He did a lot of art for Garbage pale kids. I have several of his pieces and they are truly stunning.
12:54 This looks a lot like the Americanized Manga of the late 80s early 90s, with light lines and fine misting, combined with over done shadows and oddly amateur proportions... Love that shit.
Vic Bridges definitely wore his John Byrne influences on his sleeve. I wish he did more work, I loved his stuff.
Have you seen the Fazers (AC/Americomics) series by Vic Bridges? Channels John Byrne to the point where at first glance, you think it could be Byrne.
If you're looking for an obscure McFarlane clone, check out Marvel's Over the Edge #1 featuring Daredevil from 1995. The artist Robert Brown mimics McFarlane in a way that's even more loyal to the Todd-father than Clearly.
FYI, McFarlane released Spawn #1-50 in black & white in Spawn Compendium #1 in 2012.
I immediately thought about the backup for Deathblow, Cybernary - with Nick Manabat. He died after just a few issues but those issues are more ink and metal than anything in Metal Hurlant's entire run.
In that Batman comic, I see a little Tim Sale in that art too
As cool as that Frank Miller homage was in Shadowhawk, I remember as a kid being so disapointed in that issue as I wanted to see Liefeld's version of Shadowhawk. I wanted to see how Shadowhwk would look in the Youngblood universe!
I'm seeing some Paul Gulacy in that Wargard as well
Scott McDaniel on Daredevil (the infamous "knee pads" costume) is my favorite Frank Miller Sin City rip off from that era
Hi guys, a quick note on the Barry Kitson issues: the editor wrote about it in one of the letter columns - apparently these are tonal studies that Barry would submit to the editors for approval before tightening up his final artwork. They were so taken with them they asked if he would mind if they just ran these instead, as an experiment (I think the title was running late, so he produced the 3 issues in a month or so). It's an awkward read with the heavy coloring on top, but it was really eye-opening to see as a fan of his very tight finished artwork.
Two modern artists that relect Kirby in very effective ways yet maintain their own style and evolve the medium would be Dale Eaglesham and Ladronn! Eaglesham's FF is the perfect fit to honor Kirby without ripping him off outright.
Wow, I've only heard of a couple of these folks. Love love love.
You need to look at some Chromium Man.
I'm reminded of Liam Sharpe with Sean Patty's style.
I'm not a fan of his work, but Ariel Olivetti channeled a lot of Corben and Bisley in his early work, specially Avengers' Last Story and the argentinian outlaw superhero comic Cazador, together with Jorge Lucas, Mauro Cascioli and Claudio Ramírez, all of them influenced by Corbisley
Great videos - Worgard looks like it's riffing on Mick McMahon's "Slaine" in 2000AD
jim todd released the first like 50 issues black and white in an omnibus
Super fun video. Would love to see more. Also, yay, you showed my very first comic, the one that jumped off the shelf at me in a bus station CHAPEL #2 (and #1)!
Love this episode. So interesting. Surprised someone hasn't put out a book breaking down comic styles of the last 30 years (unless I just don't know about it).
Great video! Heard you guys talking about the Pittsburgh comicon I used to go to that all the time. I still go up there for the Steel City Con these days. It’s definitely different than what it used to be back in the day but it’s still fun. Keep up the great work!! 😎
That Barry Kitson looks a lot like David Lloyd on V for Vendetta influenced it... Cast an eye over Carl Critchlow on Lobo, and his early work on Thrudd The Barbarian, for OTT Biz influenced stuff
Kayfabe Forever! ✌Totally awesome guys. Gotta love Frank Miller! My dream interviews would be to see you guys talk to the big man himself, as well as Alan Moore. The Sin City movie in 2005 had a huge influence on me, and I first found out about Miller through that movie. (Watched it like 3 times in the theater and would go again in a heartbeat if they rerelease it) Really enjoyed your interview with Peter Laird last week! Keep rocking!!!
c'om on people, 15k views and how many likes? show a little appreciation for this finely created video.
10:24 there certainly were some artists "following the example" of McFarlane style at the time ( 80's and 90's ) - and Bob Kane just redrew his Batman later.
London Night Probably didn't pay the Inker, then fired him and left his name off when he complained.
In 1994-96, any creator doing any kind of comic with a crime element was aping both Sin City AND Tarantino (myself included).
You guys could've done an entire episode on Jim Lee clones from the 90s. I can't tell you the number of comics I bought when I was a kid because the cover looked like Jim Lee art.
Travis Charest started out as a Jim Lee clone but wow did he evolve into his own pretty damn quick.
Matt Martin's Snowman was a great Image style artist back in the 90's. I still have all the issues!
Good call. Have a few of those myself. --Ed
I fondly remember Scott McDaniel's run on Daredevil which was leaning hard into the Miller Sin City style. Also don't forget José Ladrönn's early Marvel work on books like Cable where he was really riffing on Kirby.
John Clearly makes sculptures for all sorts of characters as collecative sculptures now.
Scott Shriver's Warzone 3719 is fucking amazing. I sincerely love that book.
I’ve beaten the Kayfabe effect! I randomly picked up one of those Knight Watchmen a few months ago I’ll have to dig it out tonight and check it out! Thanks!
Ooooohh! I have 7 issues of Shadow Slasher. Good books! Thanks for sharing this video, gentlemen.
Shelby Robertson did a pin-up/comic for Image right before the comics crash. I have an original art page from a Hellborne comic by him, that I've never been able to find. It has a Jae Lee vibe.
John Cleary is a sculptor now.
Great video. I need to find that Ravager comic.
I like the black and white but if they some screen tones for some grey shadows.
I see some Silvestri (on XMen) where Cleary speeds through the Todd style layouts.
If you haven’t already, I’d be interested in seeing a comparison for Miller influence on MacFarlane
This was the most maddening time to try to shop a portfolio around at cons. Editors would look at my portfolio. Crit it and publish stuff that looked way worse with glaring anatomy flaws. I gave up after a couple of years. I think I was one of the two that bought a zine from Jim at Pittsburgh. The one and only time I made it out to that show.
Re: Bisley clones. A lot of people think Glen Fabry was a Bisley fanboy, but actually the opposite was true, Simon has mentioned that early in his career he was heavily influenced by Glen’s painting style. Probably part of why Simon is somewhat friendly towards his own clones…?
Check out those fukn Raoh the Conqueror brows on Chapel's head in that KnightStrike advert in the 2nd Chapel book
👀🤔😅
Williamson would have said: 'Swipe from the best!'
Spawn Tpb 1-50 is in black and white. Old run not new run, And it is amazing
GREAT episode today guys!!! Some of that 'Image' style inking though....UGH!!! LOL!!! 'Couldn't tell if it was a 'hatching' line or part of the costume! LOL! Even Jae Lee copied Biz with his Namor run...Has he ever evolved from that time...like Panosian and others!! Might be cool to see an 'Artist Transition' episode perhaps... BEST WISHES!!
hay todd nauck ......j scott campbell called ....he wants his style back!
You should do an episode on how Fash Miller ripped off Muñoz&Sampayo's Alac Sinner.
Should we? No Sin City by Frank Miller Without Alack Sinner by Jose Munoz!
czcams.com/video/3-8Coj34vog/video.html
@@CartoonistKayfabe I stand corrected, and happy that this exists.
I would love to see you guys do a Brat Pack episode!
It's your lucky day -- Brat Pack:
czcams.com/video/FrSkaoBVJmM/video.html
Glori-Anne Gilbert, the legend.
You didn't go back far enough .Probably 200 guys started out apeing Wally Wood.
Come to think of it, Miller owes a lot to Toth (the king of blacks). And Toth would say he got it from Meskin.
haha, I thought you meant rip-off ideas, like how the new comic "Lovesick" is a rip-off of Eddie P's "Red Room".
Black and White Spawn "Essential": czcams.com/video/Ia-QYorzqO4/video.html
Superman annual 3 from 91 copycats Art Adams
is that Kratos "inspiration" ?
Ariel olivetti was a bisley ripoff in his begginings, check his b&w art in "cazador"
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