If you have a mixed fleet of DC and DCC locos, you need this versatile and brilliant setup! I did this following Mike’s schematic and it’s brilliant! Thank you Mike!
Great video mike very informative helps alot on older locos without dcc that way you don’t have to go unhooking systems all the time just keep it all hooked up and switch between dc and dcc with the flip of a switch that’s great
Love this video. I am getting back into the hobby after decades and I have a lot of old DC engines that belonged to my father and grandfather. I want to run those engines but also be able to run newer DCC engines as well. This gives me a good idea how to tackle that. Thank you!
Thanks a bunch Mr. Mike you thoroughly go thru what you help Describe in your Videos like teacher & student) you remind me of teacher I had in Grade school that didn't yell out the Lesson your Videos are enjoyable to watch and for an ole pup like me I learned allot I may have to go over it again sometimes it takes me a few trips around the Barn to learn & pick-up the concept but it makes watching your Video all over again that much greater.. I can only hope to meet ya'll sometime and shake your Hand for helping me.. Please Keep putting out those Great Videos.. AKA
Thanks for this vid Mike! I've been trying to find one with this information for about a year. As you know I have over 60 dc loco compared to 5 dcc so this is very helpful! Thanks Steve,
My layout I had set up I had used this method. I had some old DC locos and did not want to abandon them yet. This video is old but it was just recommended.
Thank you for making this video. I am planning to get into the hobby, and though I plan to eventually run DCC, to get started on a budget I'll likely start my layout as DC. This video is exactly what I needed to see. I'll simply wire a 3-position DPDT switch in the layout for expansion to DCC in the future. Thanks again!
Thanks for your video. I am currently entering the world of model trains ( haven't played with trains in over 20 years ). I am currently changing my layout from DC to DCC. Your explanation of the switches and the Auto Switch is of great help. Now I am that much more confident that I can take my layout to greater heights. I will be using a NCE Power Cab, so that information regarding how to divert from main line track to program track using the NCE system, priceless!
Awesome Video, This is my plan for my layout as I don't have enough money to have someone to convert all of my locos to DCC and still have to have a way to run them safely until I'm able to get them converted. Thanks for the awesome video & demos.
Thank-you Mike, this was a great explanation. I see that you bring your negative and positive leads to the switch. In my case, i have two DC power packs and selector switches, and my negative leads are pluged together. I think i will have too remove remove a DC power pack and re wire everything. Thank you so much ....... Michel
I have 3 seperate DC controllers running 3 tracks and I have been able to change over to Dcc whenever I wish by using relays and a switch which operates the relays changing the tracks from DC to DCC. I used 14 pin relays and used the normally open contacts fo DC and normally closed contacts for Dcc. There are 3 relays and they all operate from one switch for DC and Dcc. Works very well as you can never have DC and DCC on at the same time.
Great video. This is what we are looking to do on our own home layout is run both DC and DCC on the same tracks without having to unconnect one power source and then rehook the system back up
Pretty much the whole reason why I’m watching haha I only have one DCC locomotive so far and just built a DCC++ base station too everything else is dc.
I am sticking with DCC but I just posted the question for other people to get the info regarding the complexity when you get further in re other decoders. Thanks Mike
Great information Mike. Never thought about doing the dcc/cd thing but makes a lot of sense. Doubles my options on what to run. The good part of the about it is that the wiring is simple.....
Thanks, Mike! I run all DC at this point, acquired a pair of Broadway Limited Locos, and while they run on DC - they don't run well. I have too many locos to convert to DCC, so this may be an option! Thanks again - informative as always!!
I figure this out a few years ago after using DC and Atlas Selectors, Connectors, and all sorts of toggle switches. I did this method and rewired it to accept the Atlas Selectors, Connectors, and toggle switches for both/either power sources. I really expands the flexibility of running your trains, but anybody else that wants to run on your layout. I'm running HO Scale.
Thanks for the info Mike, I intend on getting Nce power cab. I will look into the auto switch as I am considering running DC and dcc on my small layout at first.
GREAT info Mike!! Thanks for sharing. I run a Power Cab and am going to add this to my list of things to do. I don't need DC right now but I do like the idea of having a on/off switch for the layout and a program track.. Thanks again…
thank you so much for this video. i have Many DC locomotives, & a handful of DCC, & last night in bed i was thinking of doin' this very thing, just wasn't sure how.
Outstanding help and assistance with a prevailing question. I really enjoy the logical presentation, with language a starter can follow! I've just received my first DCC locomotive. and didn't want to picture a mess of wire(s) without capability to run and operate _\+
Mike - Many thanks for de-mystifying the issue of DC/DCC combined layouts. I am currently developing a DC (Tri-ang) & DCC (Hornby Zero One) OO Gauge layout. Your suggestion of a DPDT switch will (I think) allow safe integration of both systems, allowing for the fact that both systems are "very old technology" - namely 1960's/1970's. Michael (from Oz)
This is helpful, as running a DC loco on a DCC system as #0000 seems A) not to give you very good control over the DC locomotive, and B) seems to introduce some unpredictable performance issues on the DCC system.
I have a stupid question. If i only have a DC layout, will a DCC loc still run on it? I have bought 2 locs that were converted to DCC by the people i bought them from. I tested them both. One of em is a very tiny little steam engine, Der Glaskasten. The other is a steamloc and tender. The tender being the motor vehicle with 2 axles powered. Both were converted. The tiny one runs, but not like i expected it to run. I thought it would zoom along the track like mad, but it goes slow. Not too slow, but not that fast. The big one, the fleischmann 4170, i thought the loc was powered as well, but seems it only has free spinning wheels. The tender is powered. But this one is also converted. And it runs even slower. Even when applying max power, it runs too slow in my opinion. Does this have to do with the fact that they were converted? Would they run normally on dc track if i were to cut out the conversion bit? @@N-Scale PS: Would you cut out the conversion bit? I got dc track layout, and all the rest of the stuff i got is dc stuff. These 2 are the only ones i got that have been converted (it said so in the text. They originally were not dcc) I think it costs me a lot more trouble to convert everything to dcc than to convert these 2 back to dc.
Well, i have seen Der Glaskasten tiny loc running at a friend of mine and it ran like crazy. Like Speedy Gonzales. But he had a dc version on a dc track. Hence why i expected to see something similar. But mine is converted. So, if i understand you correctly, a dcc loc on a dc track runs but not well. So, if i were to re convert them back to dc, as they originally were, it would run better you think? @@N-Scale
Thank you for your information. I have a system running on DC and am thinking of purchasing a DCC layout, as my rolling stock is all DC I need to know if my old stock can be used on the DCC and it appears that I can. So let's watch this space. Thanks again.
Mike, Great video as always. I would like to suggest a couple of topics for future videos. These may not have quite the general market that you are aiming for, but wanted to throw them out anyway. First, I would like to see something on wiring multiple boosters into a layout. I assume it just involves isolating the sections of track and running the control network between the boosters. But no one ever gets quite that far in their explanation of wiring layouts and a video covering that would be helpful. The second video is even more niche oriented. We do large modular layouts and for the DCC operations, we use wireless throttles. But for DC operations, we are relegated to the stationary control unit. I have heard of folks putting a decoder in front of the track bus and supplying DC to the track via the output of the decoder. This would allow the operation of the DC track through the use of wireless throttles from the DCC system. I know that is not an issue for the normal layout, but for larger layouts, it would really help to be able to have the engineer be mobile. And, of course, it would eliminate the need for the DC controller. Thanks, Terry
Thanks Terry , The use of boosters is exactly as you stated and I have never actually done it. The use of the decoder ahead of the track power makes sense but wouldn't one only be able to control a single DC loco? This is something else I have never done and is beyond my scope of trying out. Thanks , Mike
Great informative Video Mike. I have a DC layout wired with multi blocks for 2 train operation with 2 power packs and selctor switches to select between power packs in each block. Can I use my existing DC wiring for DCC with this DPDT switch or do I have to add any additiomal wiring for feeding the dcc side.
Mike, I have NCE power cab. I used a dpdt center off toggle, however from the NCE side I connected one of the Atias power routing switches that allow me to direct input to the mainline or to an isolated siding I used for my "programming track." This is a simple manual approach and worked very well for me. I DID NOT ATTEMPT TO RUN DC When doing any DCC function.
Looking at this two years later, I want to add thank you for the sharing this information. I elected to use a siding for the programming track; it was isolated with insulated joiners from the mainline. Thus a locomotive can be programmed. One that done, mainline power can be connected to the siding and the locomotive moved to the mainline.
Great video Mike, my layout is currently a block DC system with two cabs wired through a single pole switch much like this. Only difference is I have the common wiring not passing through the switch and wired directly to the track in blocks. Would I be able to run DC and DCC separately but on the same layout by just replacing one of my two cabs with a DCC system? Trying not to replace all my existing wiring if possible. Thanks Steve
Thank you for the video! I get the concept of double pole/double throw switches, but have questions about two lines. I am going to be using Peco code 100 track. I will have two parallel tracks, both with double pole / double throw switches with center off, both with a dc and a dcc controller. I also know that there needs to be a siding where a dc loco can go and I can throw a switch to deaden the track, though I am not sure how to insulate the siding from the rest of the line and if there needs to be leads going also to the insulated siding through the switch, though I think that is how it works. But how do I connect the two branchlines so I can shut off one controller and control both tracks with the other? Do I need additional leads the the other track from one of the dc controllers controlled with an on/off switch? Can I use the Peco electrofrog turnouts? how would I connect them so that the power from one controller doesn't go through to the other track? Thanks for the video, and Thanks in advance for the advice!
Originally I built a control panel for two cabs as designed by Lynn Westcott. I believe i can connect the NCE power cab to the second cab and then throw the mini spdtco toggles when I want to use DCC. The DC throttle would be turned off in this situation and turnouts powered by a separate different power supply. I hope this is okay and I don’t have to run a whole new separate bus wire.
Great video! I am converting to scale. I will be building a hollow door layout. I do like switching as well. What do you prefer I use to start? DC or dcc or dcc ready incase I want both?
Very useful & something I've been concerned about handling efficiently. Haven't built yet, and the longer I wait, the more I learn, and the more mistakes I avoid making. When running in DC mode, do the DCC locos need to be physically removed from the tracks (and vice versa)? Planning on having an engine yard and not all locos are converted. Maybe that's why reference to isolating track sections was mentioned. Using the Kato pak with their swtches - will these be deactivated when throwing the switch to operate in DCC mode? Another addition to my collection of how-to's. Thanks, Mike. Jeff
Jeff , If you put one on the yard and one on the track you could leave the DCC's in the yard on DCC and run the layout with the other switch on DC. Otherwise yes they need to come off. Thanks , Mike
Great video for TOTAL switch over. However, I am back into HO after 35 years and have set up a nice DC pike for my grandson as I have lots of motive power for DC and have set up HIS part of the pike in DC. For me, I am putting together a DCC pike (we have 5' X 17' area to use) that overlaps and intertwines with his (DC) system. My question: What 'switch' do I need to add to keep us apart so he can do DC while I do DCC instead of being just one or the other (DC vs DCC)? Wow, just noticed that these other comments are years old. Hope you are still well and healthy for both you and your family. thanks, Dean
This works very well! I had this setup on my old layout. Let me ask this though. What do you do with insulated sidings? Do you just hook the terminal that the feeder wires are connected to, to the center terminal of the DPDT switch?
@@N-Scale The reason I said that was because on my old layout I ran an additional wire from the transformer to the terminal for the sidings. So I would have to hook both of those wires coming off the transformer to one of the terminals on the DPDT.
Mike thanks for the video, I had dc back in the 70’s I started dc n gauge back up. My question is I have a reversing loop with toggle switches, I want to make it a auto reversing loop with the digitrac ar1, can I leave my toggle switches in place, and still use the ar1 for the Dcc engines? I want to switch between dc and Dcc the way you did in this video, but I’m not sure about the toggles switches how that will effect dcc, thanks
Clearly stated and greatly appreciated. On NCS's website describing the Autoswitch, it seems we cannot use the Autoswitch with their Smart Booster SB5 rather than with the Power Cab panel to set this up. Any news, an update, or some sage advice about this would be appreciated?
Hello Mike, I want to use the method that you have explained in your video to use DCC with a DPDT for my DC layout. My question is: I have a reversing loop on my DC layout. Does the wiring that I have done in DC "mode" is compatible with the DCC "mode" or do I have some additionnal wiring to do ? Thks Dany
Thanks Mike, I am a complete dummy when it comes to electricity & wiring. I understand how to rig your switch, but I had absolutely no idea how to wire this up for a dual controller.
Hi, i was just wondering what is the simplest way to run multiple DC trains on a layout is! I was thinking like a layout where there would be a mainline with a train running on it, and then i could have a shunter i could use to shunt with in a yard connected to that mainline.
It is called Block Control. Each area you intend on running a separate train in needs to have a DPDT switch that allows you to use either throttle or an off position. Thanks , Mike
Mike I have a question, If you have your bus connected to dcc and then use a switch to convert to DC and your turnouts are controlled by accessory decoders DS64 for example that are getting their power from the track bus what would happen to the accessory decoders safety wise? Good video Colin
When you went to DC your decoders would not work. If that was the plan I would think that you were deeper into DCC and not need DC. You could run two bus wires and run the DS64's from one that is connected before the switch and the track feeds could be tied in to the second bus beyond the switch. That way you could run on DC and throw the turnouts with the DCC as well with both systems on. Thanks Colin, Mike
Looking into doing this on my layout, wondering about use of DCC Circuit Breakers. I use NCE EB1 and DCC Specialties as well. Is there any issues passing DC current through these DCC Circuit breakers?
I understand the concept BUT when you switch to DC do you have to remove all the locomotives that are DCC only from the payout? The reverse s d you have to remove the DC locomotives when in DCC mode?
This may be a dumb question but would you need power for both the dcc (digitrax) and dc transformer (mrc tranformer)? I am assuming yes as both have power cords. I s this correct.
I have D/C and want to do what you have shown, both D/C and DCC. Now, I have many blocks on my layout wired for two cabs, do I just leave the blocks sections on, and still use the block wiring for the two cabs?
No the pack does not care if it has a load. The only time this would be disconnected from the track would be if the switch was in the center off position or DCC. Thanks Mike
I use NCE Power Cab. I have a oval with a single switch with a spur for the programming track. I put the decoder in the engine then set the engine on the program track with the switch set to the siding. My main track an sidings are powered except I have the program track with insulators during program mode. After the programming is done on the engine NCE returns the power back to the mainline for running. I would like to some time upgrade to the next level up on the NCE system. I do like how you have your layout done on DC an DCC. I would like to do that on my board too.
Hi Mike, Question for you: When running a "DCC Only" system, you would run ONE buss wire pair which would typically power your track and locomotives as well as all your turnouts (in the case of using Kato Unitrack). However, when you add the DC component to your layout, which runs VARIABLE DC power to your track, when your power pack is at "0" (no movement to your locomotives) won't that kill your turnout control? Is it recommended to isolate your turnouts to their own separate "Constant DC" power buss? Thanks in advance for your recommendations!
Hi Mike, how would you wire a reversing loop with this set up? Would you be able to hook both the dc and dcc up to the auto reverser? Sorry I'm just learning the ropes of wiring and my grandpa isn't much better, so the layout wiring is my job.
I'm just starting out with N scale just purchased a ready made layout but want to make it bigger, but the power pack is old and needs to be replaced, any ideas on a DC power pack? I have the Digital Zephyr Xtra 3.0 Starter Set
Very straight forward, but, on a garden railway you need to use 'boosters' on DCC to enhance the signal and power due to the distances involved. One DPDT switch doesn't seem enough? More switches would lead to errors, How do we deal with that issue? AJonTrack, UK.
So if I use the Bachmanns DCC transformer with n scale track, I can use multiple trains at once or what? And if I have that setup with the Bachmanns DCC transformer, do I have to use ONLY DCC or can I also use DC with that setup?
Are you referring to the turnout the switch machine or the switch to operate the turnout? If you are talking about the solenoid to operate the turnout , Yes it can remain the same as now. Thanks , Mike
How would you apply this across multiple tracks? I have a separate DC controller for each track on my layout, so would I need to wire three of these switches, one to each track?
I have a mrc prodigy express 2 dcc system it’s has a hookup for a programming track or it has a hookup for programming on the main does it matter which of those I wire the toggle switch to?
Mike Fifer thanks very much for your help and I have to say you have an absolutely outstanding youtube channel it’s great I’ve seen every video always entertaining I really enjoyed the tour you did of fifer hobby could you do another video tour soon?
Mike - I don't have the need for a switch like this. I run my 30 x 12 dogbone layout with two MRC Command 2000's hooked to my two main lines and run both my DC and DCC locos concurrently without any problems.
Agreed. My only concern is that the Cmd 2000 is old and I won't be able to replace them if one dies. I have looked for more modern systems that support DC/DCC at the same time and haven't found one. Do you have any knowledge of such a system?
A couple of years ago I swapped all my HO scale equipment (all locomotives were DC only), straight across for another persons N scale equipment and have since built an N scale layout. My N scale layout is set up for DC. I aquired a lot of N scale locomotives. However, I can only get some of them to run (3 out of 9 engines). The person I swapped with says that some of them are only DC and some of them may either be DCC ready or might even be DCC equippted. He has stated that he got them from another person. The siituation is that some of them run on DC, some of them won't run at all on DC, and some of them will try to move but will not actually move, or they will only move intermitttantly when power from the power pack controller is applied. The problem I have is that I have no historical information on each of these locomotives (such as the original box they came in, what company made them, what type of engine they are, whether they are an SD-40, an EMD SD70A, etc. ). All of the equiment was just thrown haphazardly into a couple of cardboard boxes. Out of 13 switches (turnouts), only 6 were able to be salvaged as they had been haphazardly pried up from a previous layout and had been totally ruined for reuse. So I have no idea if they are either straight DC, DCC Ready, or actually DCC eqippted. I am in the mood for upgrading my layout to work on both DC and DCC. But without knowing what each type of locomotive I have is, or without any previous historical information for each of those locomotive engines, I have no idea if each of them is either DC only, DCC ready, or already DCC equippted. I have tried using the decal number on each of the engines to try and find out that information. Out of all of those engine numbers I only found one that gives me that information and it came back that it is an SD-40. There are a couple of HO scale model Railroadling clubs in my area, but each s in a diferent location and town as they are located either 50 to 100 miles (one-way), from where I live. and the nearest Model Railroading shop (located 50 miles away), has a sign in the door that says - "This shop will be closed untill further notice". So I have to assume that this shop (just like all the others of which have been in the general area in the past 15 years), has once again gone under and closed down due to lack of both business and monetary revenue. So therefore I have no one to consult with for either repair,s upgrading, or information. Without that information or lack of guidence I am at a standstill and in a quandry. Any ideas of how to cure my problems so that I might be able to upgrade To DCC ? ? ? Please advise. Anyway, thanks for a great informational and instructional video. As usual, you were at your best.
If you have a mixed fleet of DC and DCC locos, you need this versatile and brilliant setup! I did this following Mike’s schematic and it’s brilliant! Thank you Mike!
Thanks so much John, Mike
Great video mike very informative helps alot on older locos without dcc that way you don’t have to go unhooking systems all the time just keep it all hooked up and switch between dc and dcc with the flip of a switch that’s great
Thanks so much Ron.
Mike
Love this video. I am getting back into the hobby after decades and I have a lot of old DC engines that belonged to my father and grandfather. I want to run those engines but also be able to run newer DCC engines as well. This gives me a good idea how to tackle that. Thank you!
Thanks so much.
Mike
Thanks a bunch Mr. Mike you thoroughly go thru what you help Describe in your Videos like teacher & student) you remind me of teacher I had in Grade school that didn't yell out the Lesson your Videos are enjoyable to watch and for an ole pup like me I learned allot I may have to go over it again sometimes it takes me a few trips around the Barn to learn & pick-up the concept but it makes watching your Video all over again that much greater.. I can only hope to meet ya'll sometime and shake your Hand for helping me..
Please Keep putting out those Great Videos.. AKA
Thanks for this vid Mike! I've been trying to find one with this information for about a year. As you know I have over 60 dc loco compared to 5 dcc so this is very helpful! Thanks Steve,
Thanks Steve , I am glad it came in handy.
Mike
Thanks Mike. Always helps when you make it so easy to understand. Nice job.
Thanks Craig , I hope folks get some use out of this.
Mike
My layout I had set up I had used this method. I had some old DC locos and did not want to abandon them yet. This video is old but it was just recommended.
Thanks , Mike
Thank you for making this video. I am planning to get into the hobby, and though I plan to eventually run DCC, to get started on a budget I'll likely start my layout as DC. This video is exactly what I needed to see. I'll simply wire a 3-position DPDT switch in the layout for expansion to DCC in the future.
Thanks again!
Thanks Tim , Mike
Thanks for your video. I am currently entering the world of model trains ( haven't played with trains in over 20 years ). I am currently changing my layout from DC to DCC. Your explanation of the switches and the Auto Switch is of great help. Now I am that much more confident that I can take my layout to greater heights. I will be using a NCE Power Cab, so that information regarding how to divert from main line track to program track using the NCE system, priceless!
Thanks so much , Glad to help.
Mike
Really great info Mike! And you explained it very well. Was very easy to follow and understand. Thanks!
Thanks so much Deryk. That is what I am going to try for here on the N Scale How To Channel.
Thanks , Mike
Awesome Video, This is my plan for my layout as I don't have enough money to have someone to convert all of my locos to DCC and still have to have a way to run them safely until I'm able to get them converted. Thanks for the awesome video & demos.
Thanks , Mike
Wow another awesome how to video Mike. I learned another wiring of a switch to change a layout from DC to DCC.
Thanks so much for the kind word Donald.
Mike
DC and DCC in my layout.
Cool.
Fun hours with my DCC locomotives.
Digital control.
As always thank you Mike.
Thanks Pat !!
Very clear explanation, just what I needed!
Thanks so much Jimmy.
Mike
Excellent! Thank you! My next step is using a dual controller so that one train goes "West" and the inner train goes "East".
Thanks Murray
Thank-you Mike, this was a great explanation. I see that you bring your negative and positive leads to the switch. In my case, i have two DC power packs and selector switches, and my negative leads are pluged together. I think i will have too remove remove a DC power pack and re wire everything.
Thank you so much ....... Michel
Or you would just use two of this setup and multiple the DCC to both switches.
Thanks , Mike
I have 3 seperate DC controllers running 3 tracks and I have been able to change over to Dcc whenever I wish by using relays and a switch which operates the relays changing the tracks from DC to DCC. I used 14 pin relays and used the normally open contacts fo DC and normally closed contacts for Dcc. There are 3 relays and they all operate from one switch for DC and Dcc. Works very well as you can never have DC and DCC on at the same time.
Great video. This is what we are looking to do on our own home layout is run both DC and DCC on the same tracks without having to unconnect one power source and then rehook the system back up
Glad to help.
Mike
Thank you Mike for a very nice video. That realy helps when you have some old locos still waiting to get converted to dcc.
Thanks Lars , That is the real reason for having it.
Mike
Pretty much the whole reason why I’m watching haha I only have one DCC locomotive so far and just built a DCC++ base station too everything else is dc.
TKS MR. FIFER FOR THE AUTO CHANGE U MAKE EVERYTHING SIMPLE.
Thanks Skip.
Mike
Nice video. This is much simpler than I thought it would be.
Thanks .
I am sticking with DCC but I just posted the question for other people to get the info regarding the complexity when you get further in re other decoders.
Thanks Mike
Thanks Colin , Mike
Great information Mike. Never thought about doing the dcc/cd thing but makes a lot of sense. Doubles my options on what to run. The good part of the about it is that the wiring is simple.....
Thanks , Yep pretty easy and may also serve to let DC friends run on a DCC layout or vice versa.
Mike
Very well explained video.
Many thanks
+CALSASH Glad to help . Mike
Thanks, Mike! I run all DC at this point, acquired a pair of Broadway Limited Locos, and while they run on DC - they don't run well. I have too many locos to convert to DCC, so this may be an option! Thanks again - informative as always!!
It is good for just that purpose !!
Mike
I figure this out a few years ago after using DC and Atlas Selectors, Connectors, and all sorts of toggle switches. I did this method and rewired it to accept the Atlas Selectors, Connectors, and toggle switches for both/either power sources. I really expands the flexibility of running your trains, but anybody else that wants to run on your layout. I'm running HO Scale.
Good .
Mike
Just what I was looking for, thanks.
Thanks so much and glad to help.
Mike
Thanks for the info Mike, I intend on getting Nce power cab. I will look into the auto switch as I am considering running DC and dcc on my small layout at first.
Thanks Peter , It will serve you well.
Mike
Very informative. Thank you!
Thanks Jeff.
Mike
simple but affective love it thanks
Thanks for taking a look and hope it helps.
Mike
GREAT info Mike!! Thanks for sharing. I run a Power Cab and am going to add this to my list of things to do. I don't need DC right now but I do like the idea of having a on/off switch for the layout and a program track.. Thanks again…
Thanks , I hear that the Auto Switch is pretty fool proof.
Mike
thank you so much for this video. i have Many DC locomotives, & a handful of DCC, & last night in bed i was thinking of doin' this very thing, just wasn't sure how.
Thanks Dave , Glad I could help.
Mike
Thanks for that Mike, it worked a treat! only problem was half of my locos all started moving! Must remember to remove them or change cv29! ha ha!
LOL , for sure.
Your channel is very helpful. I recently got into model railroading. I run HO, but the principles are the same as for N.
Thanks , glad to help.
Mike
Outstanding help and assistance with a prevailing question. I really enjoy the logical presentation, with language a starter can follow! I've just received my first DCC locomotive. and didn't want to picture a mess of wire(s) without capability to run and operate _\+
Thanks GA !!!
Mike - Many thanks for de-mystifying the issue of DC/DCC combined layouts. I am currently developing a DC (Tri-ang) & DCC (Hornby Zero One) OO Gauge layout. Your suggestion of a DPDT switch will (I think) allow safe integration of both systems, allowing for the fact that both systems are "very old technology" - namely 1960's/1970's. Michael (from Oz)
It all revolves around 2 wires and should work fine.
Mike
This will be of great help to me as I get ready to wire my layout for running both DC and DCC systems. Thanks.
Thanks Fix-It, Mike
I'm glad this got bought up because I m starting to have problems getting decoders so I might run some DC loco
Good Idea !
Mike
hi Mike.. lots of great info.. thanks for sharing... vinny
Thanks Vinny , Mike
awesome as always
+william russ Thanks so much William.
Mike
This is helpful, as running a DC loco on a DCC system as #0000 seems A) not to give you very good control over the DC locomotive, and B) seems to introduce some unpredictable performance issues on the DCC system.
Great info!
Thanks , Mike
AWSOME, as good today as the day it was published! I have a well established DC layout. This will let me ease into DCC instead of a giant leap.
Thanks , Mike
I have a stupid question.
If i only have a DC layout, will a DCC loc still run on it?
I have bought 2 locs that were converted to DCC by the people i bought them from.
I tested them both.
One of em is a very tiny little steam engine, Der Glaskasten.
The other is a steamloc and tender. The tender being the motor vehicle with 2 axles powered.
Both were converted.
The tiny one runs, but not like i expected it to run. I thought it would zoom along the track like mad, but it goes slow. Not too slow, but not that fast.
The big one, the fleischmann 4170, i thought the loc was powered as well, but seems it only has free spinning wheels. The tender is powered.
But this one is also converted. And it runs even slower.
Even when applying max power, it runs too slow in my opinion.
Does this have to do with the fact that they were converted?
Would they run normally on dc track if i were to cut out the conversion bit?
@@N-Scale
PS: Would you cut out the conversion bit?
I got dc track layout, and all the rest of the stuff i got is dc stuff.
These 2 are the only ones i got that have been converted (it said so in the text. They originally were not dcc)
I think it costs me a lot more trouble to convert everything to dcc than to convert these 2 back to dc.
@@bertjesklotepino Tiny locos , as you have mentioned NEVER run well , IMHO but Yes DCC locos will run on DC track but either way, Not Well
Well, i have seen Der Glaskasten tiny loc running at a friend of mine and it ran like crazy. Like Speedy Gonzales. But he had a dc version on a dc track. Hence why i expected to see something similar. But mine is converted.
So, if i understand you correctly, a dcc loc on a dc track runs but not well.
So, if i were to re convert them back to dc, as they originally were, it would run better you think?
@@N-Scale
Yes , as a decoder rob's power from the DC version.@@bertjesklotepino
Very good…Thanks
Thanks Luis !!
Thank you for your information. I have a system running on DC and am thinking of purchasing a DCC layout, as my rolling stock is all DC I need to know if my old stock can be used on the DCC and it appears that I can. So let's watch this space. Thanks again.
Very informative and very helpful and very interesting to
Thanks so much Jimm
Great video, thaks.
Thanks for taking a look , Mike
Mike,
Great video as always. I would like to suggest a couple of topics for future videos. These may not have quite the general market that you are aiming for, but wanted to throw them out anyway.
First, I would like to see something on wiring multiple boosters into a layout. I assume it just involves isolating the sections of track and running the control network between the boosters. But no one ever gets quite that far in their explanation of wiring layouts and a video covering that would be helpful.
The second video is even more niche oriented. We do large modular layouts and for the DCC operations, we use wireless throttles. But for DC operations, we are relegated to the stationary control unit. I have heard of folks putting a decoder in front of the track bus and supplying DC to the track via the output of the decoder. This would allow the operation of the DC track through the use of wireless throttles from the DCC system. I know that is not an issue for the normal layout, but for larger layouts, it would really help to be able to have the engineer be mobile. And, of course, it would eliminate the need for the DC controller.
Thanks, Terry
Thanks Terry , The use of boosters is exactly as you stated and I have never actually done it. The use of the decoder ahead of the track power makes sense but wouldn't one only be able to control a single DC loco? This is something else I have never done and is beyond my scope of trying out.
Thanks , Mike
Great informative Video Mike. I have a DC layout wired with multi blocks for 2 train operation with 2 power packs and selctor switches to select between power packs in each block. Can I use my existing DC wiring for DCC with this DPDT switch or do I have to add any additiomal wiring for feeding the dcc side.
Thanks! just want I needed for my show layout
Glad to help.
Happy New Year
Mike & Robin
Mike, I have NCE power cab. I used a dpdt center off toggle, however from the NCE side I connected one of the Atias power routing switches that allow me to direct input to the mainline or to an isolated siding I used for my "programming track." This is a simple manual approach and worked very well for me. I DID NOT ATTEMPT TO RUN DC When doing any DCC function.
Looking at this two years later, I want to add thank you for the sharing this information. I elected to use a siding for the programming track; it was isolated with insulated joiners from the mainline. Thus a locomotive can be programmed. One that done, mainline power can be connected to the siding and the locomotive moved to the mainline.
That is the way I had my last layout and it works really well.
Mike
Since. I have a DC layout, would I need to add DCC boosters to make it work?
Not sure what you are asking? You say you have a DC layout. You would need an entire DCC system for DCC.
Thanks , Mike
I do not know about the use of dcc boosters.
I knew it this thank you
Well done.
Thanks Brother.
Mike
Great video Mike, my layout is currently a block DC system with two cabs wired through a single pole switch much like this. Only difference is I have the common wiring not passing through the switch and wired directly to the track in blocks. Would I be able to run DC and DCC separately but on the same layout by just replacing one of my two cabs with a DCC system? Trying not to replace all my existing wiring if possible. Thanks Steve
Awesome!
Thanks so much Rick. Mike
Does the dc controller take the power from the dcc power pack or does the dc controller have to have its power pack?
Thank you for the video! I get the concept of double pole/double throw switches, but have questions about two lines. I am going to be using Peco code 100 track. I will have two parallel tracks, both with double pole / double throw switches with center off, both with a dc and a dcc controller. I also know that there needs to be a siding where a dc loco can go and I can throw a switch to deaden the track, though I am not sure how to insulate the siding from the rest of the line and if there needs to be leads going also to the insulated siding through the switch, though I think that is how it works. But how do I connect the two branchlines so I can shut off one controller and control both tracks with the other? Do I need additional leads the the other track from one of the dc controllers controlled with an on/off switch? Can I use the Peco electrofrog turnouts? how would I connect them so that the power from one controller doesn't go through to the other track? Thanks for the video, and Thanks in advance for the advice!
Thanks. I was thinking insulated rail joiners but wasn't sure what to do with ends of rails to prevent connection.
Originally I built a control panel for two cabs as designed by Lynn Westcott. I believe i can connect the NCE power cab to the second cab and then throw the mini spdtco toggles when I want to use DCC. The DC throttle would be turned off in this situation and turnouts powered by a separate different power supply. I hope this is okay and I don’t have to run a whole new separate bus wire.
Mike, I understand that and think it is great. But...how do you connect two or more power packs from DC into the selector swtch??
Great video! I am converting to scale. I will be building a hollow door layout. I do like switching as well. What do you prefer I use to start? DC or dcc or dcc ready incase I want both?
I would just go DCC from the get go.
Mike
Very useful & something I've been concerned about handling efficiently. Haven't built yet, and the longer I wait, the more I learn, and the more mistakes I avoid making.
When running in DC mode, do the DCC locos need to be physically removed from the tracks (and vice versa)? Planning on having an engine yard and not all locos are converted. Maybe that's why reference to isolating track sections was mentioned.
Using the Kato pak with their swtches - will these be deactivated when throwing the switch to operate in DCC mode?
Another addition to my collection of how-to's.
Thanks, Mike.
Jeff
Jeff , If you put one on the yard and one on the track you could leave the DCC's in the yard on DCC and run the layout with the other switch on DC. Otherwise yes they need to come off.
Thanks , Mike
Great video for TOTAL switch over. However, I am back into HO after 35 years and have set up a nice DC pike for my grandson as I have lots of motive power for DC and have set up HIS part of the pike in DC. For me, I am putting together a DCC pike (we have 5' X 17' area to use) that overlaps and intertwines with his (DC) system. My question: What 'switch' do I need to add to keep us apart so he can do DC while I do DCC instead of being just one or the other (DC vs DCC)? Wow, just noticed that these other comments are years old. Hope you are still well and healthy for both you and your family.
thanks,
Dean
If the two tracks are separate , no switch needed and you could set both up like this video.
Thanks , Mike
This works very well! I had this setup on my old layout. Let me ask this though. What do you do with insulated sidings? Do you just hook the terminal that the feeder wires are connected to, to the center terminal of the DPDT switch?
This switch would go just beyond the Power Pack or DCC system so EVERYTHING would change when the switch was thrown
@@N-Scale The reason I said that was because on my old layout I ran an additional wire from the transformer to the terminal for the sidings. So I would have to hook both of those wires coming off the transformer to one of the terminals on the DPDT.
@@UFO4X Any feeder would need to go through the switch.
Mike
Mike thanks for the video, I had dc back in the 70’s I started dc n gauge back up. My question is I have a reversing loop with toggle switches, I want to make it a auto reversing loop with the digitrac ar1, can I leave my toggle switches in place, and still use the ar1 for the Dcc engines? I want to switch between dc and Dcc the way you did in this video, but I’m not sure about the toggles switches how that will effect dcc, thanks
I would think it would be OK
Nice
Thanks Jay !!
Clearly stated and greatly appreciated. On NCS's website describing the Autoswitch, it seems we cannot use the Autoswitch with their Smart Booster SB5 rather than with the Power Cab panel to set this up. Any news, an update, or some sage advice about this would be appreciated?
I asume you are refering to NCE but I have not used these products.
Mike
Hello Mike, I want to use the method that you have explained in your video to use DCC with a DPDT for my DC layout. My question is: I have a reversing loop on my DC layout. Does the wiring that I have done in DC "mode" is compatible with the DCC "mode" or do I have some additionnal wiring to do ?
Thks Dany
I would not think so as they are totally different in the wiring of each. DCC requires no special wiring and DC does.
Mike
Thanks for the info Mike. I have a two track DC dual controller. How would I wire that up please? Do I need 2 switches ?
Yes you would and BOTH would either have to be set to DC or DCC
Thanks Mike, I am a complete dummy when it comes to electricity & wiring. I understand how to rig your switch, but I had absolutely no idea how to wire this up for a dual controller.
Hi, i was just wondering what is the simplest way to run multiple DC trains on a layout is! I was thinking like a layout where there would be a mainline with a train running on it, and then i could have a shunter i could use to shunt with in a yard connected to that mainline.
It is called Block Control. Each area you intend on running a separate train in needs to have a DPDT switch that allows you to use either throttle or an off position.
Thanks , Mike
great video you use a 5 amp mini switch,is there any chance to use a full size switch with a different rating like 10 or 15 amp
There is no need to, but yes
Mike
Mike I have a question, If you have your bus connected to dcc and then use a switch to convert to DC and your turnouts are controlled by accessory decoders DS64 for example that are getting their power from the track bus what would happen to the accessory decoders safety wise?
Good video
Colin
When you went to DC your decoders would not work. If that was the plan I would think that you were deeper into DCC and not need DC. You could run two bus wires and run the DS64's from one that is connected before the switch and the track feeds could be tied in to the second bus beyond the switch. That way you could run on DC and throw the turnouts with the DCC as well with both systems on.
Thanks Colin, Mike
Great video and advice. What is the switch called? I'd like to use this idea on my layout. Thank you
Thanks , It is a double pole, double throw , center off.
Mike
Thank you Mike. however I'm not sure how that works with track block system? But off to a good start. Thanks.
Harlan TILLMAN I too have a dc double controller system with 10 block sections I think this take a bit of head scratching for me 🤔... Fred
I’d say just try to connect it up to the bus line? Then the feeders would still go to each separate block
Cool
Thanks Andrew, Mike
Looking into doing this on my layout, wondering about use of DCC Circuit Breakers. I use NCE EB1 and DCC Specialties as well. Is there any issues passing DC current through these DCC Circuit breakers?
I do not know that but I would tie in the DC beyond the Circuit breakers
can you use dcc and dc at the same time on the same track?
I understand the concept BUT when you switch to DC do you have to remove all the locomotives that are DCC only from the payout? The reverse s d you have to remove the DC locomotives when in DCC mode?
Not necessarily but in my mind that would be the logical thing to do and the purpose for not going all one way or the other
This may be a dumb question but would you need power for both the dcc (digitrax) and dc transformer (mrc tranformer)? I am assuming yes as both have power cords. I s this correct.
Yes .
Mike
I have D/C and want to do what you have shown, both D/C and DCC. Now, I have many blocks on my layout wired for two cabs, do I just leave the blocks sections on, and still use the block wiring for the two cabs?
That is exactly what you do.
Thanks , Mike
And this should work if you want to run o gauge conventional locomotives or something like lionel legacy?
Do you use 12 V DC or Varible DC when hooking wire from track to power pack?
You need variable 12 VDC for DC operation.
This is what I thought of doing
Good , It works.
Thanks , Mike
thank you so very much .as always you are a great help,once again thank you
Thank You William
just goes to prove at 76 never too old to learn
Or at 72 !!! @@williamruss8830
Wouldn't disconnecting the output side of the power packs cause a problem? Do I need some type of load for the pack not connected to the track?
No the pack does not care if it has a load. The only time this would be disconnected from the track would be if the switch was in the center off position or DCC.
Thanks Mike
I use NCE Power Cab. I have a oval with a single switch with a spur for the programming track. I put the decoder in the engine then set the engine on the program track with the switch set to the siding. My main track an sidings are powered except I have the program track with insulators during program mode. After the programming is done on the engine NCE returns the power back to the mainline for running. I would like to some time upgrade to the next level up on the NCE system. I do like how you have your layout done on DC an DCC. I would like to do that on my board too.
It is an easy conversion. I have since gone to all DCC and no longer use the DPDT switch.
Mike
Hi Mike,
Question for you: When running a "DCC Only" system, you would run ONE buss wire pair which would typically power your track and locomotives as well as all your turnouts (in the case of using Kato Unitrack). However, when you add the DC component to your layout, which runs VARIABLE DC power to your track, when your power pack is at "0" (no movement to your locomotives) won't that kill your turnout control? Is it recommended to isolate your turnouts to their own separate "Constant DC" power buss? Thanks in advance for your recommendations!
The turnout control is a separate entity with both.
Thanks , Mike
@@N-Scale So what I am hearing you say is even when running DCC, I should run separate power to my turnouts?
@@davidsayer354 Yes , you have to
@@N-Scale Thank you so much! I appreciate your guidance.
Hi Mike, how would you wire a reversing loop with this set up? Would you be able to hook both the dc and dcc up to the auto reverser? Sorry I'm just learning the ropes of wiring and my grandpa isn't much better, so the layout wiring is my job.
No , The reversers only work with DCC.
Mike
@@N-Scale Thanks for the info.
Noah
I'm just starting out with N scale just purchased a ready made layout but want to make it bigger, but the power pack is old and needs to be replaced, any ideas on a DC power pack? I have the Digital Zephyr Xtra 3.0 Starter Set
The Zephyr is a DCC unit , are you DC or DCC????
Very straight forward, but, on a garden railway you need to use 'boosters' on DCC to enhance the signal and power due to the distances involved. One DPDT switch doesn't seem enough? More switches would lead to errors, How do we deal with that issue?
AJonTrack, UK.
I do not know as we do N Scale.
Thanks , Mike
So if I use the Bachmanns DCC transformer with n scale track, I can use multiple trains at once or what?
And if I have that setup with the Bachmanns DCC transformer, do I have to use ONLY DCC or can I also use DC with that setup?
Yes it will work but you would also need a DC transformer on the DC side.
Thanks , Mike
Nice idea...but what if I have accessory decoders that use track power? Will they get damaged if I switch the system to DC?
I have no clue , but if you are at that level of DCC you are likely beyond the DC.
Thanks , Mike
Mike Fifer Okay thanks. In that case, I'd recommend a separate setup of Unitrack just to run DC trains then!
love the videos here my question i want to change over to dcc do i have to change over my remote switchtrack or can i leave them power by dc?
I do not know what you mean by remote switch track????
Mike
there older but same as atlas 2700- 2701
i guess they would be called switchmachines
Are you referring to the turnout the switch machine or the switch to operate the turnout?
If you are talking about the solenoid to operate the turnout , Yes it can remain the same as now.
Thanks , Mike
thanks for answers will save some work and cost
Mike, Can you leave the DCC Engines on the track when you switch to DC with damage to them?
You are supposed to be able to but I would not.
Mike
Mike Fifer ok thanks
No it would damage them unless they have a decoder
Can you use a DPDT switch to change DCC from a main line and a programming track.
Great video. thanks you.
Yes
How would you apply this across multiple tracks? I have a separate DC controller for each track on my layout, so would I need to wire three of these switches, one to each track?
Just to clarify, I have 3 tracks on my layout
Yes you would but the DCC would go to all three.
Mike
Mike Fifer thanks for your quick reply! Appreciate the tips!
I have a mrc prodigy express 2 dcc system it’s has a hookup for a programming track or it has a hookup for programming on the main does it matter which of those I wire the toggle switch to?
Yes , Do not hook up to any program connection.
Mike
Mike Fifer thanks very much for your help and I have to say you have an absolutely outstanding youtube channel it’s great I’ve seen every video always entertaining I really enjoyed the tour you did of fifer hobby could you do another video tour soon?
@@ronstrainsandmore Thanks , I will try.
Mike
@@ronstrainsandmore I was there and saw the locos and plans.
Mike - I don't have the need for a switch like this. I run my 30 x 12 dogbone layout with two MRC Command 2000's hooked to my two main lines and run both my DC and DCC locos concurrently without any problems.
Good for you. What ever works makes it fun
Agreed. My only concern is that the Cmd 2000 is old and I won't be able to replace them if one dies. I have looked for more modern systems that support DC/DCC at the same time and haven't found one. Do you have any knowledge of such a system?
@@douglasdunn1836 I do not as most people make the jump to dcc
I am wondering if you can have both a switch to have program track siding and a switch to have DC or DCC?? Can you please help me figure this out?
Yes , Just add the program track and switch and fee that witch with the DCC side of the DC DCC switch.
Thanks , Mike
A couple of years ago I swapped all my HO scale equipment (all locomotives were DC only), straight across for another persons N scale equipment and have since built an N scale layout. My N scale layout is set up for DC. I aquired a lot of N scale locomotives.
However, I can only get some of them to run (3 out of 9 engines). The person I swapped with says that some of them are only DC and some of them may either be DCC ready or might even be DCC equippted. He has stated that he got them from another person.
The siituation is that some of them run on DC, some of them won't run at all on DC, and some of them will try to move but will not actually move, or they will only move intermitttantly when power from the power pack controller is applied.
The problem I have is that I have no historical information on each of these locomotives (such as the original box they came in, what company made them, what type of engine they are, whether they are an SD-40, an EMD SD70A, etc. ). All of the equiment was just thrown haphazardly into a couple of cardboard boxes. Out of 13 switches (turnouts), only 6 were able to be salvaged as they had been haphazardly pried up from a previous layout and had been totally ruined for reuse.
So I have no idea if they are either straight DC, DCC Ready, or actually DCC eqippted.
I am in the mood for upgrading my layout to work on both DC and DCC. But without knowing what each type of locomotive I have is, or without any previous historical information for each of those locomotive engines, I have no idea if each of them is either DC only, DCC ready, or already DCC equippted.
I have tried using the decal number on each of the engines to try and find out that information. Out of all of those engine numbers I only found one that gives me that information and it came back that it is an SD-40.
There are a couple of HO scale model Railroadling clubs in my area, but each s in a diferent location and town as they are located either 50 to 100 miles (one-way), from where I live. and the nearest Model Railroading shop (located 50 miles away), has a sign in the door that says - "This shop will be closed untill further notice". So I have to assume that this shop (just like all the others of which have been in the general area in the past 15 years), has once again gone under and closed down due to lack of both business and monetary revenue.
So therefore I have no one to consult with for either repair,s upgrading, or information. Without that information or lack of guidence I am at a standstill and in a quandry.
Any ideas of how to cure my problems so that I might be able to upgrade To DCC ? ? ? Please advise.
Anyway, thanks for a great informational and instructional video. As usual, you were at your best.
I am sorry but without being there , having the box, or taking the shells off , you will not know.
Mike