By the time Bruce met him, Jason was already too far gone. Not so far gone that he couldn't be redeemed, but it wasn't like he was dealing with another Dick, who had loving parents and a good life before tragedy.
I mean, Alfred is the only other person who has no problems using guns and using lethal force and as a Veteran he has likely killed before so if there was anybody in the bat family who can see exactly where Jason is coming from it's Alfred because if Alfred comes across the Joker or most of the other Gotham Villains, he's definitely getting the shotgun to make sure they'll never hurt his family ever again
The legendary panel of Alfred loading a shotgun ready to put Booster Gold and Herley down for enteting the batcave (he did not know exactly why they were there but he was ready) Or also his dream of killing the Joker with a shotgun straight to the face.
Given the Fact that Alfred's original background ( before Retcons) was that he was one of the most experienced spies and commandos of the O.S.S. in WW2? Alfred probably has a MUCH higher bodycount than Tim Drake could ever even think of. Alfred wasn't busting up or even putting down simple hoodlums, He was straight up viciously MURDERING National Socialists as a part of the War effort for Queen & Country. That was the pivotal moment of his life which shaped him and why Thomas Wayne Hired and trusted him so.
@@reignick1133 in other words. Yeah he is a trained soldier/spy that has more experience that you would think and more tgan likely has put more people underground that anyone would like to know.
> attends funeral of deceased grandparental figure, even when he was forbidden from doing so, though he respects the others and stays behind > follows them to a bar to celebrate the memory of Alfred > watches as Bruce is blamed for something he couldn’t control > raises his glass, pouring one for Alfred, and tells some fond memories of him > doesn’t pin the blame on Bruce, unlike others (looking at you, babs) > tells him is okay to grieve and mourn his loss, but that he needs to not let this destroy his life completely > elaborates enough > leaves I used to like Jason a lot, but now I think I like him even more
@@joshuarobinson6011 Jason character development in this comic is insane. I wish they don't retcon this ever and turn him back to a villain again just because yes
Alfred's death was a huge mistake by DC, especially the way it happened. But the way they show the Robins dealing with that pain is good. Damien's constant self hatred stemming from the fact that he caused this, Dick trying to do all the good he can from everything he can, Jason trying to be a better person than not just himself but everyone else in the room, Barbara blaming Bruce and being more frustrated about failure than sad about loss. All except Tim (maybe I missed a few comics) because apparently, no one at DC likes him (they might even get him killed by Zur Enn Arh next month - who knows).
Big ups to jason here, he had the decency to not pile onto bruce while he's grieving (unlike Barbara). Says his remembrance, tells Bruce "hey, grieve now but when you're done you need to get your shit together", and leaves
@@KingInBlack69Its his Grandfathers fucken funeral bruh, that is the dumbest excuse for not even going to the funeral of someone who always loved you as family and not the mask you put on.
Can bruce just have one timeline where everything goes good for him? I mean this the era of killing Batman and everyone he loves. Im beginning to think they are hiving him the Spider-Man treatment from DC
@@johnynoway9127 If that's the case then you should blame the Gotham Justice system. Batman isn't Judge, Jury, or Executioner; he simply brings them in.
@@dannyc4550 yea no thats bs excuse. He KNOWS the justice system is sht and still just captures these monsters that kill like ....100s of people weekly. Jason has proven that the whole no kill rule is total bogus too. And no it doesnt make sense that if he starts kiling then hes just gona turn psycho.
I'm legitimately tired of the batfamily drama. When Jason was initially brought back Bruce was remorseful for everything that happened. This constant need to make Batman is the stubborn, paranoid, rigid, and frankly overly violent asshole that everyone since Frank Miller has decided he is, is getting real old. Yeah Batman was always rough and intimidating, but he never was violent unless he was attacked or cruel. He was sympathetic to the problems his villains had, and had a genuine desire to help the city, as seen in his numerous public works and charity projects. We never really see any of this anymore, its now just a contest of lets see how fucked up and edgy we can make batman without having him kill anyone.
Like the BMTAM series Batman was a good balance some of the scarring was there but mostly empathized with certain villains just wanting them to have changed instead of their villainy
It's hard to write for characters who have deep seeded trauma. Most people (writers) don't get it, but some do. That's the magic of comic books: there's just as many stories of Batman being empathetic than there are him being a moody douche with no redeeming qualities. If you have the stomach for it, Night Cries is a really good read (Child abuse warning though). Night Cries explores a side of Bruce that he hides the most from EVERYONE, his vulnerability and anger towards the death of his parents. Batman isn't the Punisher, they both have trauma but how Bruce internalizes it is a lot different from Frank because Bruce was just a child when he lost his parents. Loss affects everyone but when you're a kid it hits you even harder because you're not a fully developed adult. It's confusing, scary and frustrating. How they (Batman/Punisher) use their pain is similar but Batman taps into those feeling of confusion, intimidation and anger to try and change the world around him because he still believes the world can be changed. If he didn't believe the world could still change then he'd just be Frank Castle or Flashpoint Batman.
Couldn't have said it better myself. There were two times where Bruce and Jason reconciled their differences. Both were written well. Both were destroyed by other writers for the sake of making Bruce crueller to Jason than the Joker, for more abusive drama.
Imagine being so hated by the family that they told you to not go to the funeral of the guy who actually helped him though the bad moments of his life Jason deserved better he went through more than any person in the bat family they don’t get him so they hate him
Every right lol he almost always starts something no matter the time or place it's simply who he is but he was being the bigger man this time I won't lie I'm proud of my boy
Wasn't he legally dead at the time? At least this is what I remember: They didn't want to cause a scandal if suddenly the deceased Jason Todd turned up alive.
It's weird how Jason is portrayed as the one, who is most alike to Bruce despite how one would assume that they should be the most distant ones in the family.
Jason has experience pain and loss too, and knows Bruce to the point of what he’d say. So Jason acknowledges that Bruce lost the same person who took care of him, but will let him know that Bruce needed to step up soon
Jason has always been the closest to Bruce in that he needs this. Dick, Tim and Barbara don't need to be heroes. They could and often have had stretches of just living normal lives. Bruce and Jason don't have a retirement. Honestly the only difference to them is Bruce pushes his trauma though "Ideals" and Jason through "Truths". Batman tries to live to the ideal, no killing, rehabilitation, not crossing the line. The Redhood lives to the truth that not everyone can be fixed, sometimes you have to cross the line to get things done. This key difference is what makes their relationship interesting because what does Bruce do when Jason is right, there was no other way? What does Jason do when Bruce is right, it could have been solved without taking a life?
Let's be fair here a bit, Bruce has always knew at some point the Bat and the Bruce would cross and it would hit home. He just didn't plan it would be this way, that a version of his father would order the kill of his surrogate father. Not only that but the image of Thomas he has is tainted because he realized that his father is a monster in another universe who would do this and not blink twoce about it. The man lost 2 fathers in one lifetime, yes he needs to steo up but he also needs to be seen through this lense
said it before and imma say it again, bat fam have no right to judge jason, especially after the shit he went through, the fact Alfred is the only one to look out for him breaks my heart
Alfred: “master Jason have you eaten?” Jason: “no not in the last 7 hours-“ *bat mobile smashes through the building* Alfred: “I came as soon I could! I can’t let of my sons starving!”
Bruce is not Jason’s “surrogate father.” He’s his father. Jason was the first kid that Bruce legally adopted. I really hate the whole bringing back the dead Jason thing, just as much as I hated killing him in the first place, but I hate it even more when people try to delegitimize adoption and make it seem less legit biological parenthood.
Off hand. in the modern continuty I don't think of Bruce as his dad. I think Alfred really is Jason's true dad in this situation. Bruce is on paper. Alfred is by choice. Bruce is doing better (but of course batman can't be hapy or nice for some reason so the writers always back track on the progress) but yakno Alfredi s everyones real dad in the end. By choice and by love.
If you think of adoption as nothing more than a shoddy slip of paper at the government office, you’re a disgrace. I’ll honor that scrap or not if I damn well please. Bruce may have the certificate, but he is _not_ his father. He’s never acted like it since Jason died, and anyone who would disown their “son” over a moral dispute isn’t meant to be a real parent - just like Batman. Bruce Wayne is not a father to any of them in the capacity a real parent should be, and for one reason : Alfred Pennyworth is the one who actually steps up and _loves_ those children. He was their father. Bruce was their guardian.
Jason dying , coming back to life and becoming red hood was the best thing for his character because when he was robin he was just a boring carbon copy of Dick he even had the same backstory as Dick
@@undeade.t7044 Not true, Jason was very different from Dick. Dick was an orphaned son of acrobats, Jason was a kid living on the street because his father was in jail and his mother was a drug addict. Bruce took in Dick because he saw in him the similar pain of losing both parents. Bruce took in Jason because at 11 he stole the wheels off the Batmobile without setting off the alarm, an impressive feat and a sign that with those type of skills he would probably be a dangerous villain if left alone or a great hero if he took him under his wing. People disliking Jason's more aggressive, sharp edged take on robin and not being like Dick is why they killed him the first time. Which was a mistake because apparently it was just a very vocal minority that disliked him as robin.
Okay, maybe it's just because I don't read comics. But is it just me or is it an GINORMOUS dick move for them to just tell Jason "yeah, don't come to Alfred's funeral. You aren't welcome." Bastards the lot of them.
On one hand, they didn't want to risk him brawling with Bruce at Alfred's funeral of all places. On the other hand, they of all people should know that Jason cared about Alfred enough to not ruin his funeral, so.... yeah, it was a dick move
Yeah idk why he was told to not attend. I kinda wish Dan explained it, because even reading the panel snippets, it's not explained in what I could read. He snuck in but none of the bat family seems upset he was there. Was he told not to come to avoid possible conflicts with Bruce or because of other matters like him not technically being alive?
To be fair, Jason Todd is not a hero. By any stretch of the word. He's killed and done everything batman-bat family opposed. It's like saying a 1942 German soldier should go to his Jewish dad's funeral. Everyone will hate the soldier, as they should, and it would put everyone at high alert and stress. Like Jason did to the bat family. If someone isn't welcome at a funeral 9/10 it's warranted. We don't even have to go to the extreme. We could say Jason todd would be the equivalent of a drug runner. Odds are most drug runners won't be allowed at family events. Same with Todd
@@Kyle-vq9bx I honestly think he should have been allowed to go anyway. He's part of their family and is grieving too. A funeral is the place to put differences aside.
Even in the comics, it’s acknowledged that people think Jason is going to be the most hardheaded and non-neutral. But the truth is, there are many instances of him defying expectations and being a mature figure in these sorts of situations. Another good example is during The Rise and Fall of the Batmen, when Batwoman kills Clayface, who had been working with the Bat-Family and trying to become better, but was manipulated to become unstable and dangerous by a group called the Victim Syndicate. She killed Clayface because she saw no other choice and feared for Cassandra Cain’s safety, but Batman and most of the others were not happy. In the aftermath, Batman called a meeting with the biggest members of the Batfamily(Tim, Dick, Barbara, Damian, and Jason) to consider what to do about Batwoman. Everyone said their honest and most unbiased thoughts on the situation, and of course, when it was Jason’s turn, the reader, and probably the bat-family, were expecting a very pro-Batwoman take. But he doesn’t do that. He acknowledges that they were expecting that, but instead talks about how he used to kill people, but in order to regain a place in the family, he decided to respect Bruce’s rule and adhere to it more. And even though he had killed, he was accepted back. So, rather than advocate for Kate because “She killed a dangerous criminal”, he says that she shouldn’t have done it, but doesn’t deserve to be judged in secret and banished from the family. So yes, Jason can be strongly opinionated, but it’s mostly when it has to do with him and his actions. He is still a reasonable person in times like this one and the one I mentioned.
Frankly Barbara is a hypocrite for blaming Bruce for the things she she abd her family went through....when she was the one to choose this life without Bruce's involvement. The same goes for Tim. The only two people that has any right to say anything to Bruce is Dick and Jason.....
What is so complex about it? They can’t make stories with Red Hood because his whole point his that he kills people and they can have him kill popular villains
@@Indigo_1001 Thats the reason why he can't have any dynamic stories anymore. Like, what are they supposed to do with him after he gets redeemed? Turn him into generic superhero #3456?
At least one member of the family didnt have their head up their ass in this moment. I forget what damian says but its still his fault, and Lazarus island helps him cope, so i wont add him.
How of everybody Jason understands Alfred because when it comes to Alfred he's a type of guy who can lean on he can talk to you can get advice from who can keep secrets but also like a father figure he'll tell you when you're wrong you tell you when you're right or all in all Alfred is the goat
Alfred and Jason would honestly be the most deadliest Vigilantes in the series if they were let off with no one stopping them. They would probably kill the Joker in a week.
I wanna think that the family is aware that they Will eventually fall apart without Bruce, because that technically already happened when he was Lost in the time stream. Cassandra left, Damian nearly went back to his mom, Dick and Tim had the biggest fight of their lives, is it still canon that Jason went to Prison? Freaking reboots. Sadly, parents often have to put aside their grief in the name of their children, as they have to be strong for others and not only themselves.
Alfred is the goat. He doesn’t care what situation you’re in as a vigilante or anything. If you’re his family he’ll break in the police station or even crash the Batmobile to rescue you. we all really need a Alfred
Honestly i genuinely hate this it frames bruce as a blind idiot who just refuses love even though that isn't true. I genuinely wish they did batman justice show his flaws without making him a pos like everyone else did when writing him. Bruce isn't the punisher he is batman.
Off topic but Jason wearing those round shades goes hard for me like strangely enough Jason always seems to be the most dapper member of the family. Heck my Red Hood suit is his three piece suit he wore with his face mask when he took over Penguin's club.
Jason knows what it feels like to be alienated by people you love. That's the last thing he wants to make Bruce feel at a time like this, it's just not humane. On a tangential note, this whole thing where we obliterate the legacy of Batman over different filmmaker's/writer's skewed interpretations of him as some rich psychopath who loves violence is tragic in a really poetic way. What Harvey Dent said is didactic, it's true within his canon and true of this world: _"You either die the hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain."_
aahhh i love them alfred knows jace was street kid so he just figured it out that jace will have some kinda "punisher" style batcave so he saw him what a lovely man
It's still weird realizing Bruce is a boy who lost his biological family then grew up and built a surrogate family unintentionally. A heroic mafia of sorts.
Alfreds death marks the end of the batfamily, and i love it. Its poetic. They each realize they need to move on from bruce. Not that they wont always be there when the going gets rough, but they need to rely on themselves more than just him.
Jason was legally dead, its less that he couldn't attend and more that he couldn't be seen by the public in the ceremony. That's why they didn't make a big deal out of him attending covertly. They just all have really poor communication skills, but they knew he would attend and they wanted him there whether they say it explicitly or not.
@@LordePhantom I guess but still you invite everyone even the crazy family to funerals if you know they won't make a scene and Jason loves Alfred enough not to.
If anything, he's probably making sure that Jason doesn't over rely on them, he's first and foremost, a martial artist thanks to his training with Bruce and even Alfred as well, hell, even Dick helped train him some, He's asking him to not use guns as a crutch as opposed to melee combat, cuz he's right, a gun fight will one day inevitably wind up with him shot and killed, they've even shown instances of him getting mortally wounded, like in Task Force Z when the zombified Deadshot put three rounds through him in the back and It was only thanks to Two-Face hastily applying Lazarus Resin to regenerate the wound that he made it through
@TMF979Resurge Exactly! Thank you for putting it to detail. Alfred knows this precisely because of experience He himself is, after all, a special forces vet, and that in and of himself makes his whole being a weapon just as much as a martial artist
So sick of Bruce's current status in DC comics as the paranoid constantly avid walking disaster he's become The amount of undoing that the writers have done to his humanity to increase the arbitrary stakes of him remaining dense and egotistical is ridiculous. He's constantly become the brunt of everyone elses issues, The Bat-family, His Rogues, Other Heroes. Before batman used to be the antithesis to why these terrible things could happen, he'd help orphans find a place in the world, work peacefully with fellow heroes, and work towards understanding his villain's even if they themselves didn't want redemption. Now what do we have, a sad shambling man in a bat costume who's purpose is a plot device for other better stories to use him a lynch pin for why things go wrong, or get fixed due to his placement as the nutjob. If you cannot imagine batman comforting people, you haven't the slightest clue how batman is supposed to act.
It's sad that Jason was told not to come to Alfred's damn funeral. I'm assuming it's because he's legally dead and that it'd cause a scandal if he was spotted there, but it's still pretty sad.
And that is why Jason is my boy. Literally been going at it with Bruce for years, yet in this crucial time steps up to say what needs to be said. Alfred is still very much being missed. My grandma was a lot like him when she was still living, so I know how the family feels.
😮 The one true Robin that stated the fact and the flaw of Bruce Wayne. It makes you wonder that Jason Todd will become a better Batman and a better hero out of the entire bat family because he knows his flaws and at least holds himself accountable.
They got my boy Damien acting like Tim😂 Nah. Damien and Jason should've be the two left to have a real talk with Bruce. Not just Jason. Bu I haven't been reading in a long time, so they manage to retcon Damien into regular teen in a costume.
No that's not the case here. Damien was more directly responsible for Alfred's death and it happened in front of his eyes. His was in no condition to have a real talk with anyone at this moment.
@@gavinjohnson6472 Aight. But did this writer forget the devil's day(if remember correctly) Where is mom put a hit on him when he sided with Batman and watched him die slowly on a handicap fight while he pleaded with her to stop, the assault on others. That would be a far traumatic experience, or was that retconned? And that's why he shut down with Alfred death while the rest besides dick are taking it with composure? If the dude who killed Alfred wasn't dead, this boy should've been on the hunt like a mad predator.
Grandparents will always look after their grand children even if their parents fuck them up big time
By the time Bruce met him, Jason was already too far gone. Not so far gone that he couldn't be redeemed, but it wasn't like he was dealing with another Dick, who had loving parents and a good life before tragedy.
Kid named Thomas Wayne after torturing his grandson🌚🌚
Yea no
okay i get it now
Good ones, sure.
But there are shitty grandparents. They do exist.
I mean, Alfred is the only other person who has no problems using guns and using lethal force and as a Veteran he has likely killed before so if there was anybody in the bat family who can see exactly where Jason is coming from it's Alfred because if Alfred comes across the Joker or most of the other Gotham Villains, he's definitely getting the shotgun to make sure they'll never hurt his family ever again
The legendary panel of Alfred loading a shotgun ready to put Booster Gold and Herley down for enteting the batcave (he did not know exactly why they were there but he was ready)
Or also his dream of killing the Joker with a shotgun straight to the face.
@@AugustoEL Exactly so if there's any in the Batfam who'd truly be sympathetic to Jason, It'd be Alfred
Given the Fact that Alfred's original background ( before Retcons) was that he was one of the most experienced spies and commandos of the O.S.S. in WW2? Alfred probably has a MUCH higher bodycount than Tim Drake could ever even think of.
Alfred wasn't busting up or even putting down simple hoodlums, He was straight up viciously MURDERING National Socialists as a part of the War effort for Queen & Country. That was the pivotal moment of his life which shaped him and why Thomas Wayne Hired and trusted him so.
I think there was a comic where Alfred was beating the Joker to death and they panned out and Alfred was having his favorite dream.
@@reignick1133 in other words. Yeah he is a trained soldier/spy that has more experience that you would think and more tgan likely has put more people underground that anyone would like to know.
> attends funeral of deceased grandparental figure, even when he was forbidden from doing so, though he respects the others and stays behind
> follows them to a bar to celebrate the memory of Alfred
> watches as Bruce is blamed for something he couldn’t control
> raises his glass, pouring one for Alfred, and tells some fond memories of him
> doesn’t pin the blame on Bruce, unlike others (looking at you, babs)
> tells him is okay to grieve and mourn his loss, but that he needs to not let this destroy his life completely
> elaborates enough
> leaves
I used to like Jason a lot, but now I think I like him even more
Jason’s growing from the angry person he’s always been to a relatively well adjusted person given all the shit he’s been through
@@joshuarobinson6011 Jason character development in this comic is insane. I wish they don't retcon this ever and turn him back to a villain again just because yes
Jason is Awesome. His development is really good. For an angry person full of issues to a hothead with a heart of Gold lol
Alfred's death was a huge mistake by DC, especially the way it happened. But the way they show the Robins dealing with that pain is good. Damien's constant self hatred stemming from the fact that he caused this, Dick trying to do all the good he can from everything he can, Jason trying to be a better person than not just himself but everyone else in the room, Barbara blaming Bruce and being more frustrated about failure than sad about loss. All except Tim (maybe I missed a few comics) because apparently, no one at DC likes him (they might even get him killed by Zur Enn Arh next month - who knows).
@@lastguardianofthedyinglight It's been awhile since i read a Batman comics, is Alfred still dead?
damn jason really be lookin like matt murdock from the netflix series
I said the same thing
Cleans up real good, doesn't he 😊
i was literally about to comment the same thing
I’m glad I’m not the only one who is thinking it
Is matt Mugdock a new Robin?😮
Big ups to jason here, he had the decency to not pile onto bruce while he's grieving (unlike Barbara). Says his remembrance, tells Bruce "hey, grieve now but when you're done you need to get your shit together", and leaves
He shouldn’t have bothered
@@KingInBlack69Its his Grandfathers fucken funeral bruh, that is the dumbest excuse for not even going to the funeral of someone who always loved you as family and not the mask you put on.
Why not? @@KingInBlack69
Honestly it feels weird that Barbara was the angry one and Jason was the rational one 💀
@@joshuarobinson6011yea, people tend to do weird things when they grieve
Can bruce just have one timeline where everything goes good for him?
I mean this the era of killing Batman and everyone he loves.
Im beginning to think they are hiving him the Spider-Man treatment from DC
Yeah Bruce needs that rest
nah...he kinda deserves it for letting Joker off the hook so many times.
no sympathy for a murderer.
@johnynoway9127 such a retarded point of view to have on this subject😂
@@johnynoway9127 If that's the case then you should blame the Gotham Justice system. Batman isn't Judge, Jury, or Executioner; he simply brings them in.
@@dannyc4550 yea no thats bs excuse.
He KNOWS the justice system is sht and still just captures these monsters that kill like ....100s of people weekly.
Jason has proven that the whole no kill rule is total bogus too.
And no it doesnt make sense that if he starts kiling then hes just gona turn psycho.
Oh, look, Jason is the only family member showing any empathy again to the respect of no one in the fam. Shocker.
I'm legitimately tired of the batfamily drama. When Jason was initially brought back Bruce was remorseful for everything that happened. This constant need to make Batman is the stubborn, paranoid, rigid, and frankly overly violent asshole that everyone since Frank Miller has decided he is, is getting real old. Yeah Batman was always rough and intimidating, but he never was violent unless he was attacked or cruel. He was sympathetic to the problems his villains had, and had a genuine desire to help the city, as seen in his numerous public works and charity projects. We never really see any of this anymore, its now just a contest of lets see how fucked up and edgy we can make batman without having him kill anyone.
Like the BMTAM series Batman was a good balance some of the scarring was there but mostly empathized with certain villains just wanting them to have changed instead of their villainy
If your Batman wouldn't sit with a dying child to help them feel less alone, you're not writing Batman right, you know?
Frank miller's Batman isn't even that Bad though. Allstar Batman sure but the dark knight returns was cool.
It's hard to write for characters who have deep seeded trauma. Most people (writers) don't get it, but some do. That's the magic of comic books: there's just as many stories of Batman being empathetic than there are him being a moody douche with no redeeming qualities.
If you have the stomach for it, Night Cries is a really good read (Child abuse warning though). Night Cries explores a side of Bruce that he hides the most from EVERYONE, his vulnerability and anger towards the death of his parents.
Batman isn't the Punisher, they both have trauma but how Bruce internalizes it is a lot different from Frank because Bruce was just a child when he lost his parents. Loss affects everyone but when you're a kid it hits you even harder because you're not a fully developed adult. It's confusing, scary and frustrating. How they (Batman/Punisher) use their pain is similar but Batman taps into those feeling of confusion, intimidation and anger to try and change the world around him because he still believes the world can be changed. If he didn't believe the world could still change then he'd just be Frank Castle or Flashpoint Batman.
Couldn't have said it better myself. There were two times where Bruce and Jason reconciled their differences. Both were written well. Both were destroyed by other writers for the sake of making Bruce crueller to Jason than the Joker, for more abusive drama.
Batman beef with the bat family is starting to get really old and lame
And that's why the batfsmily adventures webtoon is superior
@@eueu8219 I’ll be honest. That WEBTOON is my happy place. Now, if only we could get the same treatment for Peter.
@@eueu8219 agreed
@@eueu8219please stop😂💀
@@eueu8219 Nah...I take OG Winick Jason anyday. Battle of the Cowl is better than webtoons.
Jason: **walks in**
Bruce: “Come to gloat?”
Jason: “No… I loved him too.”
**both hug**
Imagine being so hated by the family that they told you to not go to the funeral of the guy who actually helped him though the bad moments of his life Jason deserved better he went through more than any person in the bat family they don’t get him so they hate him
What right would any of them have to tell Jason not to come to alfreds funeral
Hypocrites.
Every right lol he almost always starts something no matter the time or place it's simply who he is but he was being the bigger man this time I won't lie I'm proud of my boy
Wasn't he legally dead at the time?
At least this is what I remember: They didn't want to cause a scandal if suddenly the deceased Jason Todd turned up alive.
Bruce: why is there scratches on the batmobile
Alfred: I haven't the slightest master Bruce
Also alfred: and you'll never find them all master Bruce. *proceeds to walk off with a shotgun*
It's weird how Jason is portrayed as the one, who is most alike to Bruce despite how one would assume that they should be the most distant ones in the family.
Jason has experience pain and loss too, and knows Bruce to the point of what he’d say. So Jason acknowledges that Bruce lost the same person who took care of him, but will let him know that Bruce needed to step up soon
I wouldn't call it weird, jason is the closest to normal among the bat family
they have always been most similar
Jason has always been the closest to Bruce in that he needs this. Dick, Tim and Barbara don't need to be heroes. They could and often have had stretches of just living normal lives. Bruce and Jason don't have a retirement. Honestly the only difference to them is Bruce pushes his trauma though "Ideals" and Jason through "Truths". Batman tries to live to the ideal, no killing, rehabilitation, not crossing the line. The Redhood lives to the truth that not everyone can be fixed, sometimes you have to cross the line to get things done. This key difference is what makes their relationship interesting because what does Bruce do when Jason is right, there was no other way? What does Jason do when Bruce is right, it could have been solved without taking a life?
@@gavinjohnson6472 The last two lines spell it out so perfectly!
This is why Jason Todd is my favorite out of the whole family.
@@AnthonyTheMVP same
Let's be fair here a bit, Bruce has always knew at some point the Bat and the Bruce would cross and it would hit home. He just didn't plan it would be this way, that a version of his father would order the kill of his surrogate father. Not only that but the image of Thomas he has is tainted because he realized that his father is a monster in another universe who would do this and not blink twoce about it. The man lost 2 fathers in one lifetime, yes he needs to steo up but he also needs to be seen through this lense
said it before and imma say it again, bat fam have no right to judge jason, especially after the shit he went through, the fact Alfred is the only one to look out for him breaks my heart
That was oddly chill of Jason. He's right, though.
Alfred: “master Jason have you eaten?”
Jason: “no not in the last 7 hours-“
*bat mobile smashes through the building*
Alfred: “I came as soon I could! I can’t let of my sons starving!”
Bruce is not Jason’s “surrogate father.” He’s his father. Jason was the first kid that Bruce legally adopted. I really hate the whole bringing back the dead Jason thing, just as much as I hated killing him in the first place, but I hate it even more when people try to delegitimize adoption and make it seem less legit biological parenthood.
I thought Dick Grayson was the first legally adopted
Off hand. in the modern continuty I don't think of Bruce as his dad. I think Alfred really is Jason's true dad in this situation. Bruce is on paper. Alfred is by choice. Bruce is doing better (but of course batman can't be hapy or nice for some reason so the writers always back track on the progress)
but yakno Alfredi s everyones real dad in the end. By choice and by love.
If you think of adoption as nothing more than a shoddy slip of paper at the government office, you’re a disgrace. I’ll honor that scrap or not if I damn well please.
Bruce may have the certificate, but he is _not_ his father. He’s never acted like it since Jason died, and anyone who would disown their “son” over a moral dispute isn’t meant to be a real parent - just like Batman. Bruce Wayne is not a father to any of them in the capacity a real parent should be, and for one reason : Alfred Pennyworth is the one who actually steps up and _loves_ those children. He was their father. Bruce was their guardian.
Jason dying , coming back to life and becoming red hood was the best thing for his character because when he was robin he was just a boring carbon copy of Dick he even had the same backstory as Dick
@@undeade.t7044 Not true, Jason was very different from Dick. Dick was an orphaned son of acrobats, Jason was a kid living on the street because his father was in jail and his mother was a drug addict. Bruce took in Dick because he saw in him the similar pain of losing both parents. Bruce took in Jason because at 11 he stole the wheels off the Batmobile without setting off the alarm, an impressive feat and a sign that with those type of skills he would probably be a dangerous villain if left alone or a great hero if he took him under his wing. People disliking Jason's more aggressive, sharp edged take on robin and not being like Dick is why they killed him the first time. Which was a mistake because apparently it was just a very vocal minority that disliked him as robin.
That's not Jason Todd. That's Matt Murdock
Much like Matt I don't see it.
Exactly why Jason is the best
Okay, maybe it's just because I don't read comics. But is it just me or is it an GINORMOUS dick move for them to just tell Jason "yeah, don't come to Alfred's funeral. You aren't welcome." Bastards the lot of them.
On one hand, they didn't want to risk him brawling with Bruce at Alfred's funeral of all places.
On the other hand, they of all people should know that Jason cared about Alfred enough to not ruin his funeral, so.... yeah, it was a dick move
I just assumed it was because he is legally dead or something
Yeah idk why he was told to not attend. I kinda wish Dan explained it, because even reading the panel snippets, it's not explained in what I could read. He snuck in but none of the bat family seems upset he was there. Was he told not to come to avoid possible conflicts with Bruce or because of other matters like him not technically being alive?
To be fair, Jason Todd is not a hero. By any stretch of the word. He's killed and done everything batman-bat family opposed. It's like saying a 1942 German soldier should go to his Jewish dad's funeral. Everyone will hate the soldier, as they should, and it would put everyone at high alert and stress. Like Jason did to the bat family. If someone isn't welcome at a funeral 9/10 it's warranted. We don't even have to go to the extreme. We could say Jason todd would be the equivalent of a drug runner. Odds are most drug runners won't be allowed at family events. Same with Todd
@@Kyle-vq9bx I honestly think he should have been allowed to go anyway. He's part of their family and is grieving too. A funeral is the place to put differences aside.
Even in the comics, it’s acknowledged that people think Jason is going to be the most hardheaded and non-neutral. But the truth is, there are many instances of him defying expectations and being a mature figure in these sorts of situations.
Another good example is during The Rise and Fall of the Batmen, when Batwoman kills Clayface, who had been working with the Bat-Family and trying to become better, but was manipulated to become unstable and dangerous by a group called the Victim Syndicate. She killed Clayface because she saw no other choice and feared for Cassandra Cain’s safety, but Batman and most of the others were not happy. In the aftermath, Batman called a meeting with the biggest members of the Batfamily(Tim, Dick, Barbara, Damian, and Jason) to consider what to do about Batwoman. Everyone said their honest and most unbiased thoughts on the situation, and of course, when it was Jason’s turn, the reader, and probably the bat-family, were expecting a very pro-Batwoman take. But he doesn’t do that. He acknowledges that they were expecting that, but instead talks about how he used to kill people, but in order to regain a place in the family, he decided to respect Bruce’s rule and adhere to it more. And even though he had killed, he was accepted back. So, rather than advocate for Kate because “She killed a dangerous criminal”, he says that she shouldn’t have done it, but doesn’t deserve to be judged in secret and banished from the family.
So yes, Jason can be strongly opinionated, but it’s mostly when it has to do with him and his actions. He is still a reasonable person in times like this one and the one I mentioned.
Man, Jason Todd is so underrated
Frankly Barbara is a hypocrite for blaming Bruce for the things she she abd her family went through....when she was the one to choose this life without Bruce's involvement.
The same goes for Tim.
The only two people that has any right to say anything to Bruce is Dick and Jason.....
Jason deserves his 15 YEARS of fame in the DCEU. This has the potential to be one of the most complex and best stories in comic history.
What is so complex about it?
They can’t make stories with Red Hood because his whole point his that he kills people and they can have him kill popular villains
@@Indigo_1001 Thats the reason why he can't have any dynamic stories anymore. Like, what are they supposed to do with him after he gets redeemed? Turn him into generic superhero #3456?
Alfred has to be the best Grandpa
Amazing video one of your best short series yet. Jason deserves alot of credit and has done alot to get some respect from his family.
At least one member of the family didnt have their head up their ass in this moment. I forget what damian says but its still his fault, and Lazarus island helps him cope, so i wont add him.
Ngl jason with round glasses look dope as fuck
He looks exactly like Superboy from the 90s.
If anyone understands pain and loss its Jason
How of everybody Jason understands Alfred because when it comes to Alfred he's a type of guy who can lean on he can talk to you can get advice from who can keep secrets but also like a father figure he'll tell you when you're wrong you tell you when you're right or all in all Alfred is the goat
WOOO, JASON MY MAN, HELL YEAH
Alfred and Jason would honestly be the most deadliest Vigilantes in the series if they were let off with no one stopping them. They would probably kill the Joker in a week.
The way Alfred looks behind the wheel of the Batmobile is KILLING me 😂
Jason with the blind lawyer drip
I wanna think that the family is aware that they Will eventually fall apart without Bruce, because that technically already happened when he was Lost in the time stream.
Cassandra left, Damian nearly went back to his mom, Dick and Tim had the biggest fight of their lives, is it still canon that Jason went to Prison? Freaking reboots. Sadly, parents often have to put aside their grief in the name of their children, as they have to be strong for others and not only themselves.
Alfred is the goat.
He doesn’t care what situation you’re in as a vigilante or anything. If you’re his family he’ll break in the police station or even crash the Batmobile to rescue you. we all really need a Alfred
Honestly i genuinely hate this it frames bruce as a blind idiot who just refuses love even though that isn't true. I genuinely wish they did batman justice show his flaws without making him a pos like everyone else did when writing him. Bruce isn't the punisher he is batman.
Finally, Jason and Bruce not at each others throats for once
Why wasn't Cass allowed in. The guy is her grandfather.
Yeah fr. I don’t get why she gets excluded so often
Off topic but Jason wearing those round shades goes hard for me like strangely enough Jason always seems to be the most dapper member of the family. Heck my Red Hood suit is his three piece suit he wore with his face mask when he took over Penguin's club.
I frikin love alfred. Hes practically the strongest of the bat family. We got bat-butler in this piece!
Alfred was the papa❤
Jason knows what it feels like to be alienated by people you love. That's the last thing he wants to make Bruce feel at a time like this, it's just not humane.
On a tangential note, this whole thing where we obliterate the legacy of Batman over different filmmaker's/writer's skewed interpretations of him as some rich psychopath who loves violence is tragic in a really poetic way.
What Harvey Dent said is didactic, it's true within his canon and true of this world: _"You either die the hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain."_
Everything aside my boy got that shit on 😂😭
Aldred was a war veteran... he might have even killed more than Jason so i think he knows what jason has been through..
He was a medic in the field,
Jason a real one for that.
I don't know why I never thought of Alfred as the Bat Family Grandpa until now.
aahhh i love them
alfred knows jace was street kid so he just figured it out that jace will have some kinda "punisher" style batcave so he saw him
what a lovely man
Barbara: so anyway i started screaming
The fact they didn't allow him to go is just cruel
The glasses 😂
They are dope though
Can't wait for Alfred to come back and invalidate all of this
It's still weird realizing Bruce is a boy who lost his biological family then grew up and built a surrogate family unintentionally. A heroic mafia of sorts.
Where’s Nightwing in this particular scene?
Around that time he lost his memory, when he took the bullet to the head
He is standing around there though.
This a good guy moment for Jason Todd. I like this. I just hoped Alfred can be remembered forever.
Jason spitting facts as always, this is why he’s the best bat family member
Alfreds death marks the end of the batfamily, and i love it. Its poetic. They each realize they need to move on from bruce. Not that they wont always be there when the going gets rough, but they need to rely on themselves more than just him.
Lets remember that Alfres does not aply himself to Batman's no gun rule, he will pop a cap on you with zero regrets.
It’s honestly fucked up of Bruce to not let Jason attend.
I don't think it was him that said anything
Jason was legally dead, its less that he couldn't attend and more that he couldn't be seen by the public in the ceremony. That's why they didn't make a big deal out of him attending covertly. They just all have really poor communication skills, but they knew he would attend and they wanted him there whether they say it explicitly or not.
Jason loves Bruce , that’s why he was so angry when he came back and saw that he basically did nothing to avenge him
Alfred is a hell of a dad and granddad.
Damn that drip with the suit and glasses suits Jay.
Alfred was really the glue who kept the Batfamily together.
Why didn't they invite him?
I think because of his beef with Bruce
@@LordePhantom I guess but still you invite everyone even the crazy family to funerals if you know they won't make a scene and Jason loves Alfred enough not to.
He's probably also legally dead
@@gabrielgills597 Yeah but who's asking for Id's in a funeral. Just put a fake mustaches and alias. He can be Matches Malone the second.
Lighter Malone
Alfred may not have been a dad, but he was the dad who stepped up 💯
🕊RIP🕊 Alfred
Jason's a good son.
I’m so tired of the hate Batman drama is getting boring
You know it's telling when the British Special Forces vet (who still packs guns around the manor) says that his gun will fail him
If anything, he's probably making sure that Jason doesn't over rely on them, he's first and foremost, a martial artist thanks to his training with Bruce and even Alfred as well, hell, even Dick helped train him some, He's asking him to not use guns as a crutch as opposed to melee combat, cuz he's right, a gun fight will one day inevitably wind up with him shot and killed, they've even shown instances of him getting mortally wounded, like in Task Force Z when the zombified Deadshot put three rounds through him in the back and It was only thanks to Two-Face hastily applying Lazarus Resin to regenerate the wound that he made it through
@TMF979Resurge Exactly! Thank you for putting it to detail. Alfred knows this precisely because of experience
He himself is, after all, a special forces vet, and that in and of himself makes his whole being a weapon just as much as a martial artist
This one hits home, my parents had their issues with my grandparents but my grandparents always tried to be in my life and help.
Out of all of them, Jason’s the most like Bruce. Probably why Bruce can’t stand him sometimes.
That's Cass. Has been mentioned a few times.
So sick of Bruce's current status in DC comics as the paranoid constantly avid walking disaster he's become
The amount of undoing that the writers have done to his humanity to increase the arbitrary stakes of him remaining dense and egotistical is ridiculous.
He's constantly become the brunt of everyone elses issues, The Bat-family, His Rogues, Other Heroes. Before batman used to be the antithesis to why these terrible things could happen, he'd help orphans find a place in the world, work peacefully with fellow heroes, and work towards understanding his villain's even if they themselves didn't want redemption.
Now what do we have, a sad shambling man in a bat costume who's purpose is a plot device for other better stories to use him a lynch pin for why things go wrong, or get fixed due to his placement as the nutjob.
If you cannot imagine batman comforting people, you haven't the slightest clue how batman is supposed to act.
The best thing about the Bat family is the character development they’ve had for decades
How is it a family when the three eldest have each been written to hook up with the eldest female smh lol tired ass writing just to get a ride
Ok, but why does he look like Matt Murdock?
It's damn shame Alfred doesn't have any successors.
He has his daughter at least.
@@kwayneboy1524 at best
Man the bat a family is the worst family in comics I swear only saving grace was Alfred
Alfred is indeed the father on the Bat family!!
Alfred: "Pistol grip pump in the lap at all times!"
Jason: "They can be f---ing with others people family, but they can't be f---ing with mine!"
So how long do we reckon it takes before Alfred is alive again?
Alfred always cared about his boys, no matter what.
Why do they keep ☠️ Bat family members?! Is this the only drama they want to put in the comics? 😢
Because Batman and Spider-Man writers only know how to punish the characters and make them miserable these days
I thought Jason was Superboy from the 90s for a second.
Cant wait for DC to walk back this moment in the next few months/years
been dead for close to 4 years now.
jason lookin like matt murdock here. suave
The Raphael of the Bat Family
Barbara was always annoying to me...
It's sad that Jason was told not to come to Alfred's damn funeral. I'm assuming it's because he's legally dead and that it'd cause a scandal if he was spotted there, but it's still pretty sad.
I miss Alfred.
And that is why Jason is my boy. Literally been going at it with Bruce for years, yet in this crucial time steps up to say what needs to be said. Alfred is still very much being missed. My grandma was a lot like him when she was still living, so I know how the family feels.
😮 The one true Robin that stated the fact and the flaw of Bruce Wayne. It makes you wonder that Jason Todd will become a better Batman and a better hero out of the entire bat family because he knows his flaws and at least holds himself accountable.
Batman getting the Grandpa talk from his Son Jason... the person who takes.. the least shit from the Bat- Fam Is crazy..... 😂😂😂😂😂😂😂
Who told Jason not to go? The audacity.
They got my boy Damien acting like Tim😂
Nah. Damien and Jason should've be the two left to have a real talk with Bruce.
Not just Jason.
Bu I haven't been reading in a long time, so they manage to retcon Damien into regular teen in a costume.
No that's not the case here. Damien was more directly responsible for Alfred's death and it happened in front of his eyes. His was in no condition to have a real talk with anyone at this moment.
@@gavinjohnson6472 Aight. But did this writer forget the devil's day(if remember correctly)
Where is mom put a hit on him when he sided with Batman and watched him die slowly on a handicap fight while he pleaded with her to stop, the assault on others.
That would be a far traumatic experience, or was that retconned?
And that's why he shut down with Alfred death while the rest besides dick are taking it with composure?
If the dude who killed Alfred wasn't dead, this boy should've been on the hunt like a mad predator.
This why I love Jason he is a wonderfully complex character
Parents job to raise their kids.
Grandparents job is to spoil em.
Bro imma need that context of alfred stealing the batmobile and saving jason.