How Much Is a White Oak Worth? - Timber Harvest For Wildlife
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- čas přidán 7. 05. 2024
- We're wrapping up the timber harvest on Tom's Indiana farm talking about the value of white oaks and which part of the tree are most valuable. You'll also learn how different cuts, from bottom to top, are used.
Watch this and more wildlife management videos at www.themanagementadvantage.com... Be sure to sign up for our weekly updates that will send our newest wildlife management videos and articles straight to your inbox! - Sport
I love learning from folks who have been around a minute or two, and give you straight answers to straight questions. Thanks for sharing the video and knowledge.
Dangerous and hard work
White oak is what gives whiskey its color and flavor. When he said the second log would go into staves he was talking about whiskey barrel staves.
I was in mark twain national forest and talked to several rangers. They were all proud of the white oak managed forests. The main buyer. Barrel makers.
Thanks!
thanks!
In my Scotland the inside of whisky barrels are burned. Thats what gives whisky it's colour.
@@johnferguson40
That is done here sometimes also which is necessary for whiskey to be classified as Kentucky Bourbon. However the color and flavor is from the tannins in the oak.
By the way many Scottish distillers buy used barrels from US distillers for aging Scotch Whisky.
I worked in a local sawmill in Keokuk Iowa for 5 years. Stacked lots of lumber, operating trim saw, edger training for sawyer. Learnt lumber grading, log grading , loader operation, debarking.
Loved the work, got divorced and moved south for several years, never got back into the business. We cut lots of white and red oak, hickory, maple, cottonwood, sysycamore, walnut. We had a steambath for the walnut and dry kilns, fan sheds, air dry.
Never knew there was so much to sawing up lumber until I was watching Tips from a Shipwright channel Lou was digging through a naval timber yard looking for the perfect logs and slabs.
Hell Yea I live south of Des Moines 🤘🏻🤘🏻🤘🏻 soo much tree variety in Iowa 💚
I tell you right now, a tree is worth al hell of a lot more than money
@alwilliams3275 a tree is always worth a tree. Money gets less valuable ever day
So many idiots cutting em down, its so upsetting.
Not sure why YT sent me here, but it was quite interesting, thanks
Thanks for the video. Short, concise, well done.
After my house was built I went to the local lumber supplier and bought 12 planks of 2" thick White Oak. I built an 8ft dining room table and bench out of it that will be our forever table.
Great episode! Love the basic no-nonsense explanation and actual price for a log.
Thanks for watching!
That little for a log? That seems low I'm not an expert though.
I was just thinking that the price per board foot retail is close to 1$ even for lower quality oak. Does the milling drying and transport process really add 99% of the value to the timber?
If I get offered that little for my oak I would just buy a sawmill for 30k and mill up my own wood. Even if I just sell quarter sawn I'm sure I could sell a tree that size for more than $1.50
@@capitalismftw4757No, lower grade hardwood, that will probably go for pallet wood or ties is selling for 49 cents per bd ft. my stave logs (Whiskey barrel logs) sell for $2.50 a bd ft. As for milling your own, I have a mill, but oak warps a lot, and you need a kiln, and yes, the millwork planing and sanding etc really adds a lot of work and turns a lot of wood into sawdust.
He said a buck fifty not 1.50
White oak was used to build ships because it doesn't wick water like a straw as red oak does. Learned that from the rebuilding of the Tally Ho on the Sampson Boat company where Leo went to the south to get White oak for his work. Check it out.
Are you referring to the Tally Ho in New Orleans?
@@RB-bj9ms Nope. He's rebuilding the 1910 cutter Tally Ho at port Townsend WA. Great channel - Sampson Boat Co.
@janofb it was not white oak he went to the south for it was Live Oak 2 different species.episode 19
@@crzy11000 You are correct. He went to the south for Live Oak. He went to Connecticut (ep63) for White oak for the deck beams.
Fuckin aye. My canoe is called the tally ho as well. And I love learning about wood. Thank you.
One past thing make sure you understand the saw yards and what they buy and use trees for this can change the price some yard will only pay you fourty cents a board foot for anything you bring in and some will buy special trees and pay alot more knowledge is the keys to getting paid more money short your timber out for your best payday man i loved timber i did it for over twenty years and i do miss it so much
Great insights--I learned something today, thanks to you!
Respect to all loggers and anyone pulling lumber!
Wow, excellent video!
We had an old plantation farm logged with a bunch of really old tall black walnut trees. A German firm bought them all standing. They came in themselves and harvested them to ship to Germany to be used for clocks. They paid top dollar.
Several years back in Elkhart Ill a lady passed and heirs sold her farm. The auctioneer discovered 20 acres of black walnut. The farm sold for 175000 and the black walnut sold for 475000
@@bluesky6985 The bad part is that once the forest is cut down it’ll take 100 years to replace it.
@@nzs316 They built houses on the farm
@@bluesky6985 you missed the point. It’s a tree farm. The crop is or are the trees.
@@nzs316you said they discovered it after she died. It was a tree farm. They just came in raped the land and now its stumps and weeds.
That was so informational! Thank you for sharing my friend!
Thanks for watching!
What a big rip off
Great information! About to have some ash taken out as it all dies off, and nice to see how things should look!
Emerald Ash Borer, another "gift" of globalization.
While I cannot disagree with some comments regarding the honesty of some loggers ,I know from personal experience that there are good honest contractors out there. Do your research and hire a reputable consultant forester to mark the sale and administer the sale. They work for you to ensure fair payment and quality work
That is amazing to hear about oak trees dude
thanks for the posting ❤️👍
Great content as usual! I learned something today.
Glad to hear Jordan! Thanks for watching!
Really cool video!
Great vid guys!!👍🏻👍🏻💯
Super interesting!
Super informative
Great overview.
I’ve known the Patrick family my whole life they’re great people!!
Yes they are!
Thank you.
I had a friend who was offered $8000/tree back in the 1980s, but they were black walnut and he didn't sell.
White oak is crazy right now. Especially on the finished end of the product. My son needed hand rails in his house and the previous owner had a white oak stair case. I measured it all out and red oak priced out at $3,500, hickory was $4,200 and white oak was $8,900. It was ridiculous difference. That’s wholesale on the handrails.
WOW!
Its the whiskey barrel market that is driving the cost of white oak. I'm logging about 50 acres now, but still those logs, and not all white oak logs will be accepted, sell for $2.50 a bd ft.
That’s insane. I’m over in the uk it wouldn’t cost anywhere near that with French oak.
Very slow growing. They ain't making more of it. It can't grow in the wild in the Northeast anymore with out human monitoring.
A lot of the demand is coming from the residential finishes market. 5 years ago walnut was all the rage and no one wanted oak anything. We were selling good oak for firewood because you couldn't give the stuff away. Now all the high end interior designers spec white oak for everything and walnut has dropped quite a bit. Still pricey, but nice big white oak is what brings the top money now.
Very interesting
I never knew this very cool. If I had a white oak forest I would let you have at and turn into my house and plant another white oak grove for the next owner in 100 years.
I’m from Mingo county WV and when I was a kid my dad showed me where the Mingo oak was. It’s the largest white oak on record
Awaome thanks for sharing
Fast example walnut whiteoak redoak maple hard soft depends on variety of trees all this stuff can change a price per semi load
Ill never log out our woods again. For the amount of money vs the amount of damages done didnt make it worth it. Tops just pushed in piles, small trees snapped off, huge ruts threw the fields and woods. They came back twice to try and fix the ruts, ultimately had to fix them myself. Not saying all logging companies are like that, just my experience. And it was from a DNR suggested outfit.
Did you work with a hire a forester? Their fee is usually worth the expertise, oversight, and if you need it, witness in legal disputes. I'm convinced the overall yield was better having hired him. The forestry plan that they put together with the landowners goals assures that the logger does what he says he's going to do. I was worried about scarring up the land and all the things you mentioned. I had my 60 acres selective cut three years ago and you can hardly tell they were there.
Every landowner should visit the job every one of the bidders are on before awarding a contract. If they’re not working there’s a reason. Then you select a bidder based on the overall quality of work and the amount bid. After 40 years as a logger I can assure you, a quality job costs more per board foot to perform than a poor job with no regard for damage to the residual stand and the ground being worked.
I've witnessed operations like that first hand and just about every one of them that have large skidders and harvesters do exactly that. They are in and out quick with heavy machinery that marks the land and leaves disaster zones.
@@easternyellowjacket276
We'll never log it out again.
I love how the logger down plays all of it, like there’s no money in it, low grade flooring, gonna be used for stays on a truck bed, stuff like that. His stuttering and saying “ah” a lot tells me he’s not giving the whole story…
Northern Indiana: We cleared 2 acres of old growth white & red oak with hickory & walnut in lesser amounts. I had difficulty finding someone to take the logs.
This is the reason no one will ever log my land. I enjoy my forest to much to have it ripped up for next to nothing. I have a forest of hardwood and I guess the animals and I will enjoy them until I die. I am looking into leaving it in a land trust. I live in New England and I understand the economics of this process but it’s just not worth it to me. Everyone I know that has looked into having their land logged has said the same thing, it’s just not worth it. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.
Good for you. Put it into good land trust and let the trees grow. It is extremely rare to see old growth in New England. One day it could be a tourist attraction and make money because some people would love to see old growth trees.
You’re my hero.
One of the times the CZcams algorithm is great. I’m a flight test engineer for the military so I have no need for any of the information in the video but just in case..
Wow. A buck 25/board foot to the tree owner- current market price where I work as a bench carpenter $6-10 range/board foot for clear white oak… seems the tree owner ought to get a bigger share of that. Takes a looonnnngggg time to grow trees, and a very short time to cut them up into lumber.
Residential tree guy here; homeowner please don’t think your tree near your home you need trimmed or removed because they are hazardous or too close are this valuable. It takes a lot of equipment and manpower to remove a single tree especially in tight spaces. These guys also have millions of dollars worth of equipment to pay for that makes movement of this sized wood possible.
This is exactly what I was thinking. Here we go! Can't wait to see the don't low ball me adds all over the internet with trees now.
@@justing6594 haha exactly
It's worth a hell of a lot more then the value of the lumber that comes from it
Worth more to me as fire wood. My place was timbered in 1996 up to 15 inches at breast height. Lost to many other trees so to me fire wood makes more sense
Very nice information, I’ll process my own lumber at that price
I cut a barn beam that has over 300 rings, over 300 years old. After it was shortened splitting began. Wish I knew then about S rings. However it was just for a fireplace mantle
Oak wasn’t bringing good money last year when I select cut my place. The real money was in walnut and maple.
Ive got 38 acres of mature white oaks and hickories…had a timber cruiser say i have dozens of veneer quality white oaks….ive thinned everything else out besides oaks and select hickories…
Hey fellas I work at a saw mill ontario Canada love head sawing
Most costs are processing. What are yard wide white pines worth? I’ve got lots of them. Selling the land so might as well make a bit more from the trees.
OK Nate!
When i use to cut timper i would bring the actual receipt back with me and show the owners
more timber guy please he seems cool
Put up trail cams and document every truck load going out and count every log on the trucks. Loggers (especially east of the Mississippi) are not known for their honest behavior.
Not with this guy.
I've not seen or heard of 1 honest log company.
Biggest logger in my county(VT) just got busted playing with the scales and stealing veneer logs. Had to pay fines and resitution to 100 different clients. They have like 20 trucks.
It was no different in the 80s and 90s. I remember when we bought some land in the early 90s the logger was a crook.
Shit its everywhere....Ya gotta take bids and watch every moves. Horror stories from Missouri.
It’s too bad that the moment it goes into the marketplace it becomes disposable. I was at the landfill last week and there was a man throwing away a pickup load of beautiful oak trim from a remodel project.
Man I have salvaged some lumber from rehab projects. It is incredibly time consuming and difficult to do. Typically there are square nails and stains around the nail holes. Just hard to make it worthwhile.
When I built in 2001, I cut 4 white, and 3 red oaks that were between 120, and 150 years old, about 28" to 30" in diameter, over 75 feet tall, that someone said they would give me $1200 for all of them. After 18 months it was split and stacked, and kept my house warm, It was a shame, as I would like to have seen it be put to better use..
You packed a lot of information into that five minute video.
Not every plot of land has veneer quality logs even the soil it grows in can effect it like iron in New Jersey in the tri state area an iron nail can ruin a log so many factors. I’m wondering why you don’t just cut in the late fall and winter so as to not have problems with sap running ?
One woodsman told me, never cut in a month without an R in the name.
I live in a residential neighborhood in Baltimore County, MD. We have lost hundreds of 100+ yro White Oaks in the past ten years. As far as I know the wood has only been used as firewood. Seems like such a shame it could not have been used for building things out of.
Over explicit years of recourse 😊
Lumber price $8 to $11 a board ft
Never trust a timber buyer
Never trust someone that doesn't trust anyone or says that a whole group of people are crooks. Yes there are crooked timber buyers but there are honest ones too.
Take the high bid from 3 or 4 of them. And watch that they dont rape your woods..
Unless you are one 💕👽
So how much for the tree?
Buyer 🤔 💭 Well not much ! Cost of labor won't even cover what tree is worth in firewood.
If you pay us $3,500 we could remove it 🌳 for you !
Seller: this is the greatest log in the world ! Buyer : I'll take it off your hand as a favor,not great.
I know an Amish guy that owns a sawmill in my town. He is a millionaire. The guys cutting the trees, and driving the skidders and log trucks are not.
Holmes County Ohio here. I know what you mean. I drove cutters to the woods for many years
You need to know how to grade logs and lumber hardwood
I’ve got 30 acres of untouched woods in western Kentucky I bought in 2017 for 47k. Might be time to invest in a sawmill.
People you have to understand that not all timber are the same prices trust me i have cut and sold alot of timber
From a loggers standpoint if you shop around and make the buyers bid you can get $5 to $6 a board foot out of the veneer. The second and third cut if it has any quality at all has been averaging $3.30 a board foot. Hickory need to be cut in the winter. There’s a market in Italy and they average $2.00 a foot but you need to find a good exporter and give the land owner 1/2 of all the grade price. 1/3 on the pallet logs or it’s not worth messing with. Walnut has cooled down a little bit and is bringing about $2.60 a board foot. Red oak has come back to $0.70 a foot for tie logs. Not really worth the trouble. Be honest and you will have moor work than you can handle
In 1992 I cut Black Walnut , Hickory, Red Cedar and some Oak ,
Hauled it to the saw mill myself , had it cut to my Specifications , loaded up the boards and beams and brought them home , I still have some of each along with Cherry , Maple , and a few other woods and I have made so many items I couldn't even begin to count ,
I didn't even have $25 in everything .
I would never sell to a logging company , but I have a Woodshop !
In my shop, $$$$ once turned into fine furniture!
The walnuts i have i tap for syrup
If he is paying you $1.50 he’s probably getting around $4-5 a board foot , but he is also got the overhead of getting it ready and to the mill
He's calling them defects, it's the grain of the wood. It's the best part of using wood.
Oak don't bring any where near that here in Oklahoma. 30 cents a bf is closer to right. Worth more as fire wood than saw logs
That's wild. Wouldn't have guessed there would be such a difference.
@@ManagementAdvantage most oak here goes to pallets. Walnut is as bad since no mills want have to ship to Arkansas or Texas. Really good red oak might get you 75 cents. Red cedar is king here. You can sell every tree ina stand as long as tall and straight. Even the little one 2 inches at 5 foot brings 2.00 as fast as you can cut them
Where do you sell the cedars in Oklahoma at?
We have a lot of white oaks from 5' to over 7' in diameter. Some red oaks are nearly 7'. Virginia Tech is going to send some people to measure and record them.
Why
@@robertbolding4182 Because red oaks don't normally live that long.
I own a tree company on cape cod Massachusetts. my self and all my competitor tree company’s which is a lot of tree companies all dump nice oak and pitch pine log lengths at local pit where it is all put in tub grinders and turned into mulch .. it does kill me seeing all this nice wood turned to mulch, but there isn’t a market here on cape cod . I know of 1 or 2 people with small sawmills .. I try to save as much as I can for firewood.. wish we could re purpose some of this nice wood .. any ideas ?!?
Yes. I'm looking for a beautiful piece of 3'x16" walnut for my boat anchor pulpit.👍😮
I’m in CT and we have some forestry companies that sell shipping containers full of logs overseas. There’s thousands of flooring manufacturers in China. When I lived in Colorado ten years ago people paid $500 or more a cord for quality hardwood firewood.
@@JamesJones-cx5pk I have a small sized black walnut tree that keeled over and died, going to try and recover it.
Goodness, I have three trailers that I would be delighted to redeck in white oak, if you find yourself taking some down I could swing by with a trailer and some green, 20' logs would be ideal.
Most of the trees on the Cape are stunted and of low quality.
You did not address how many years to grow these trees. Select harvest is how it used to be done. Ask how it is done today.
A white oak is worth everything to the deer and other animals that feed on its acorns every fall
Wow... they pay nothing compared to what you end up paying for that wood at Home Depot. It's like 20X more.
When the Japanese and Germans buy logs the almost exclusively buy veneer logs. Some buyers will have a veneer mill and a sawmill setup on the ship. By the time they get to their respective countries they’ve processed all the logs. I had a tractor and log trailer with a knuckle boom loader back in the 80’s. One time the German buyer hired me to sit on my loader and unload trucks and load the logs into gondola cars on the trail. I had 36 cars loaded with white oak headed for the port of Baltimore to be loaded onto ships. It’s a rough business to make any money.
Commercial contractor here. We're doing some remodels and a customer wants white oak plywood and caps for the plywood we've been paying $15,000 per store just for materials. All white oak.
I want to know how much the logging company will give me for a white or red oak.
Did you have any red oak cut. Just curious on what that brings per board ft to landowner compared to white.?
I have the same exact question
A couple months ago I cut some re oak logs myself and they paid $.55 a board ft at the local sawmill
Red Oak is in the toilet. .55 cents straight through sounds about right.
I got ripped off then I bought a sawmill and now I do the ripping. Not off just ripping boards and building my home.
Did you say $1.25 - $1.50/tree to the property owner?
Per board foot
Board foot and that tree was approx. 550-570 bd. ft.
That's what I was thinking! Like the other guys said, he must have meant per board foot and just said it wrong, because that would be effing nuts.
It was not clear if he meant $1.25 to $1.50 per tree (which is what he actually said), or $1.25 to $1.50 per board foot (which is what I think he meant to say, but didn’t). It’s a shame that he didn’t take care in what he said, because the whole point was to determine what the entire tree is worth.
What would you pay for whole Osage Orange logs, per bd ft? Roughly..
8' Hedge post in Missouri are $8-15 per line post...$15-20 Corner post. Normally is not run trough a mill..
Where are you located?
This was in Indiana.
It's a good thing the return for the trees to the landowner is not that good or there would be more trees of size anywhere. Our trees today are not the massive giants that once stood before the the forest were turned into fields for crops, towns and cities.
It's worth $10 but they'll charge you $30,000
Knew a biologist that worked for a forestry company. Basically hired to pass enviro regs etc. He quit because they were so dishonest and he just couldnt take it anymore
I have a $30,000 canary palm tree in my backyard
Red oak prices? Anybody..have 130 trees like the ones in the video..
Depending on where you are. In north Alabama. Red oak is 65cents bft.
Is that $1.50 per board foot? or 1.50 per tree?
Per board ft, so he said that one big tree had 550-575 board ft, 1.50x550= purchase price.
@@brucejedwabny3473 got it, that makes a heck of a lot more sense
Think
If there is no sawmill around, they cost money to get rid of. We found that out. Stay safe.
It should be used for firewood! ;)
Get em all , then I'll sell and you will pay my price. Those trees are over 300 years old folks. Wait ten year then get a price.
Cutting the trees down and sorting is the easy part.
The process to bring the trees to be sellable to weekend warriors is very expensive and difficult.
Yard trees aren’t worth squat for the commercial market.
It would be a very very rare exception.
I've not had ANY good experience with logging companies
In the past, the logs were cut by the logger, the logger brings them to where they are auctioned, or brought to the mill. Then money is paid to the landholder. Whom pays for road repair, is a matter of debate, but usually the logger, unless the loggers wife is pregnant, lol.
LOL Or his kid is in jail..
White Oak is most valuable when it is in the ground!
Furniture grade construction grade and industrial grade 😊
I got 45 acres of white oaks.