Speaking Fluently - Does It Actually Come From Speaking?
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- čas přidán 12. 03. 2010
- Steve of LingQ.com and The Linguist on Language Blog talks about whether you can learn a language just by speaking.
Timelines:
0:12 An exchange with Benny the Irish polyglot.
1:58 Input based approach VS Speak from day one approach.
4:26 My experience with Japanese.
5:24 Speaking doesn’t bring language into you.
6:09 I don’t believe you can speak your way to fluency.
6:48 There are many things helping you to notice.
7:23 Different language approaches fit different kind of people.
9:33 Summary.
Visit www.LingQ.com
My Blog: blog.thelinguist.com/
My Facebook Page: / lingosteve
My Twitter: / lingosteve
Follow the new LingQ channel: goo.gl/WVnzRS
Follow "Steve's Cafe" channel: / stevekaufmann
As an introvert this approach is heaven sent.
@@rhinohorn9632 for some reasons i speak very well with native english speakers but not that well with people with accents
*reason
@@discordprince cuz you suck
Me self dependent
Speak to yourself , in target language .. . You go out shopping , daily life to , voice the words of target language . This advice I give , and it works . This guy is wrong on this ..
I totally agree with this method. I started learning English on my own 5 months ago, I watched a lot of videos and read a lot of articles about learning a language and all of them agreed on “SPEAKING is the best way to acquire a language”. So, I used these language exchange apps to find someone to speak with, I found a man who is a non-native speaker but he is fluent in English and I started chatting with him. I found myself as you said in your video just listening to him, I was struggling a lot to understand him because I haven’t had too much input and I wasn’t aware of the pronunciation and the way how English native speakers speak in real life and not only I struggled with understanding him, but also with expressing my thoughts and phrasing my sentences. Speaking without having enough input is a waste of time, you can learn faster by listening and reading this really helped me more than speaking. I will keep on listening and put off speaking until I feel ready to speak.
You had a “ bad “ English partner .. I advise people to speak to themselves. Vocalise words sentences, etc , voice your activities during the day m feeling ps observations etc . . It’s 2023 . How is your language learning going . Oh record yourself speaking , listen to mistakes you make and improve on them . Speak to yourself , vocalise . Haven’t watched whole vid . And I’m not going to .l I’m certain helpful advice . But …
"And as long as learning languages is just the PRETENDING to be a native speaker, its very important to LISTEN "
to know the "know the basic word+grammar " you mostly need to listen and read. And then you will find that the basic words are enough, and you will learn more words. You will also then be able to better understand the rules of grammar, gradually.
Sorry, I meant to say that the basic words are not enough. In fact you need a lot of words, and there again listening and reading are key.
Yes, I think everyone needs to listen (and read if possible) a lot more than they speak, in order to get the language in them. No doubt.
Speaking helps you speak, as I said in an earlier video. However, the need for it increases over time. In the early stages you simply cannot say much, so you mostly listen. The best thing about speaking is that it can help you notice your gaps. However,this is not always the case, as there are many people who reach a level and never improve.
Мне кажется, что нужно постоянно выучить новые слова и структуры, чтобы улучшить свой уровень для изучающих любой иностранный язык.
That is true, some people will never improve, except for those who are really motivated to enhance their skills. I am improving all the time just because I spend time on English to reach fluency... Learning a language is definitely not for lazy people!
I have said that people should speak when they feel like it, or when the opportunity arises. Speaking a lot is not a necessary condition for language learning. At a later stage in one's learning the urge to speak gets stronger and one can really benefit from a lot of interaction with native speakers. In the early stages this is less the case. The amount we speak at any stage is entirely up to us, and the opportunities available to us.
I agree with you! Reading and listening are the most important means to learn a language,especially for the people that are introverts and don't have financial backup to get to foreign countries to learn the language. Well,at least,I learned four languages only by reading,writing and listening!
Very wise, even ten years later. You're the man, Steve. This has never been more relevant than it is today. Input based learning, which you have always advocated for, is the real deal. I'm reading all of the comics and playing all of the games I want to play in Japanese, and I never had to speak a word. I know the output will come when I have fluent comprehension, but I'm not even worried about that. I'm just enjoying the ride. Thanks for your continued advice. It's really a service to the language learning community.
I have Benny's material and respect the work he has done, but the system seems to be more for extroverts. I have no interest in stumbling over 6 words to ask "how are you?" "where are you from?" etc.
I don't strike up a conversation with strangers in my mother tongue, much less in one I am just starting. I would much rather wait until I can have meaningful conversation.
i was thinking exactly this the other day, i dont remember the last time i asked a stranger a question
@@AlexG-wk3nh Exactly for me too
I am a strong introvert, but I won’t learn a language that I don’t try to speak. It isn’t because I can’t (I don’t think), but because speaking to someone is the only thing that keeps me excited about learning it because that is the ultimate goal.
Yes, I study, listen, read, do flash cards, etc. But speaking to someone makes me want to do all of that to speak even better next time.
I was so stoked when I learned to tell someone that their English was better than my Chinese IN Chinese. She smiled and said thank you. Being understood with correct grammar... that is what pushes me to want more.
@@KhallDrake I eventually do speak because I want to converse with people and get to know them and their culture, I just wait until I have enough words to have a meaningful interaction. i also have a tendency to work a lot of my pronunciation at the very beginning so that even if I only say 3 sentences, they will be understood. J
@@jt659 Makes sense and I would definitely agree with that approach. I think it makes sense to work with yourself first before getting more people involved in active conversation ;)
Speaking is also a form of listening since you dont usually speak in front of a mirror, you talk to someone, the people who say that speaking is the right way to achieve fluency dont really realize that they also use input to improve their language skills. They dont improve because they speak a lot but because they listen to the other speakers and end up imitating them. Thats the case with this called"irish polyglot". So input is the unique way to improve our speaking. Even when you spend hundreds of hours studying grammar books you're also getting input since you are reading thousands of examples in that language. The question is to choose the method you like the most, but everything is input in the end.
What pleasure do you derive from your gratuitous insults. You are not interested in what I have to say. No problem. Some are and some are not.
But why keep on yammering ?
Randy, if you think I merely "mutter under my breath and act like a child" in every video and podcast, I imagine we will not have to read your comments here in the future.
Well you speak a lot of languages very well so your technique must work
"enjoy your speaking" that got me.
Yes, this pressure cannot be taken lightly! It changes your motivation and thus your speed. :)
You got it MANY years ago, like a few others in different countries. I wonder why schools, even language schools still don't have this approach. In the past the technical options were limited. I improved my English skills very late and I'm honest; internet, modern devices and media like CZcams made this advance possible. This gave me so much more of necessary input than in my long years of English learning in school.
Hello Steve, as an English learner, my method involves actively listening to English news on the internet for 1 or 2 hours per day during my job, which has helped me a lot!
The best place to speak a language is in the country where it is spoken by natives. If you are not in the country just focus on acquiring more vocabulary so that when you go there you don't have any trouble understanding and, consequently, speaking.
I absolutely agree. Thank you for explaining it so well. It's so true about vocalizing when you read too!
totally agreed with all you said! Reading aloud and listening are the best ways to improve, to listen to natives is a must! I'm glad your method is similar to mine.
Wow! The concept you've explained (...I believe...) is true and because of this...tremendously useful!
Speaking and reading are forms of listening, therefore, listening is a key point (or "the key point") in order to speak better and better
Thanks Steve!
I can relate to what you're saying. The latest language I'm learning is Greek and the constant exposure by listening and reading every day and therefore allowing me to understand more each day has been a massive help to "crack" the language and get into it after struggling for a long time by trying an approach that was more similar to what Benny refers to. Now that I understand more, I can speak a lot more and I progress a lot faster.
I am learning english and always watch yours videos, Steve.
Great job!! I don't think it was so dumb ;)
Something I think Steve is missing is that I have plenty of input too - I'm not saying to JUST speak... some comments here suggest a combination of the two, but this is what I already do :P As Steve rightly said, without input you have no words to speak!
I still think a combination is ideal when you genuinely want or NEED to speak the language. Since you've gotten over the speaking barrier it will be very easy when you go back to Japan :)
I really agree with your thoughts on reading... once I started reading very simple words. It helped me understand the language a lot more quickly like how Sushi is “Su” and “Shi” together it was very eye opening
Love this explanation! Input is so important. We can’t produce what we don’t hear.
I think the most helpful thing to travel to another country is that we able get the most clear sound of a certain language. That is much clear than we heard in recording. And when we live in a foreign country. We’ve always listening. And basic sound data are inputting subconsciously. At least when I went too another city. Heard a lot dialect, and then when I went to the bed. I feel that sound is still in my ear before I fall asleep. And understand the dialect in a few days
I also think that people are going overboard in those comments - I think we both got our point across fine, and I hugely enjoyed my discussion with Steve :)
We disagree on this issue of speaking (once again, I insist that some people simply don't have the luxury to wait months or years), but we definitely agree on the vast amount of approaches and attitudes required to speak a language. There is no one correct method to learn a language, that's why discussions like this are important ;)
I've been into the languages since I was 9 or 10. I was born in the ussr and had no opportunity to travel outside of the country. The foreign broadcasts were blocked too. So I found a way to learn a language by reading outloud and listening to the french italian english (Beatles were allowed in the ussr). I somehow taught myself to speak both british and later american english. After the end of the USSR I studied in Turkey and learnt Turkish, German and Japanese by myself. Then I studied in Japan and improved my Japanese while working on the other languages like Chinese, Korean, Icelandic and Swedish. I've been living in Korea since 15 years and am said to have almost native korean pronunciation. As a part of my job I occasionally do interpretations between business japanese and korean. So my secret of learning languages by myself is simple: binge listening and binge reading outloud. This made me speak like natives and understand the native speech regardless of the contents and speed.
I think your comment is very useful
Steve your blogs are fantastic. My Chinese is going well and willing to take any tips I can get at this stage. Thanks again!
Iya wanna giv u a teep. Staaaayyyy focwesed round eye
I'm a Korean, and English is a very challenging language to learn for us. We've trying a lot of approaches to make students speak fluently, but nothing has worked well so far.
So I think your point of view is really something we need to consider now. Thank you for your sharing.
I think considering all angles is super important. reading listening writing speaking mimicking mixing odd words together to allow for even more connections. It’s like your building a huge neural network that needs every possible mistake to know when you get it right.
In my opinion you need both. If all you do is read then you won't get that muscle memory forming in regards to how to vocalise the words. but of course you need to read, and listen a lot in order to learn the words. I think of it like playing a sport, I watch a lot of basketball, and so in my mind I know how to shoot a basket in basketball, but I am not very good at it in practice because I haven't actually done it much.
Agreed!!
What a great analogy, agreed too. I watched thousands of movies with english sub, I read thousand of english articles, now I can read and listen to English almost like a native speaker, I guess. But when it comes to speaking, I was like a 4 years old native speaker. My vocabularies are sure broader and deeper than him, but my fluency is a novice. I often misplace she with he, he with she in speaking, because I don't have a minute to think when I speak, I gotta think in seconds. I believe in what you said about MUSCLE MEMORY. You have gotta get you mouth muscle used to pronounce every syllable in your target language, make that a habit until you can do it without thinking (effort) like 'th' sound in english, and this theory is even more relevant when you learn mandarin, with all that zh, ch, sh, z, c, s and the four tones. Even you hear those sounds a thousand time, it doesn't mean you can pronounce them correctly without speaking practice. And not just 1,2,3 times. I am talking about 300 times of speaking practice until your TONGUE memorize them.
@@jrgkristov5383 My friends understand me very well when I speak Mandarin, all I do is reading aloud, also repeating after listening to records
@@jrgkristov5383 The same happening to me
Comme d'habitude, monsieur. J'ôte mon chapeau! Votre vidéo, comme toutes celles que j'ai regardé, est très logique et convaincante. Merci beaucoup.
Bonne année et restez en bonne santé en 2021.
Avec gratitude...
Reading is amazing for language learning. I find when I read allot and write down what I read I hear it in my head and remember.
Well, I think that each person has a way to learn language, when I started learn English I was not sure which method I would follow but in the process of learn everyday I started to develop my own method, with my own habits. Once your own habits are developed learn language will be easier.
I suspect Benny gets a lot more input than he lets on. I mean, you have to have seen or heard a word first, somewhere, in order to be able to even know it exists and then speak it out. Unless he has exceptional memory abilities, he would have to have sees/heard a word at least a few times first before remembering it on his own.
@PolyglotNZ Yet our brains are all structured the same way, so while we may prefer certain ways of learning, I suspect that the learning process is largely the same.
A multi-faceted approach to learning that incorporates listening, reading, writing and speaking will always be best.
+
Steve Kaufmann - lingosteve I approached English language in your method and it worked for me. I can speak it whenever I want to.
Soy de acuerdo.
Well said! There is no ONE best way, even if our priorities are different.
wow steve that was awesome I agree with you 100% on all points by the way I bought your book a while ago its one of my favourites I really wish and hope you write another book one day
You are absolutely right. I have been listeing to many videos on youtube for mor than one year, I can proof that I have improved very well I can speak, find my misteakes through speaking very well. Know how ur mind works, u will learn.
I am trilingual and I do agree that to learn well a language it is important to read and write as much as possible. Also for me it is quite important to learn first the Grammar of the language and pronunciation, before trying to speak. I have a wide knowledge of vocabulary in English thanks to all the reading I have done over years. Besides everyday I dedicate some time to read, listen, learn and practice the languages I know, even my native one since there is always something new to learn. Summarizing, I totally agree with your approach to learn a language. Thanks 👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻
Listing a lot = acquiring a language without any effort in a few time, i can speak different languages without struggling, because i listen as i can and I'm focusing so much with the comprehensive input.
Thanks a lot Steve for another great video, and also for sharing your wisdom with us. I agree to everything you have to say in this video to 101%.
I am a learner who prefer to focus mostly on input in general, and if someone would tell me that I have to speak in order to learn, I would just laugh at that person. If I don't want to speak, I don't speak. Everyone should stick to the method they prefer the most themselves. Because the more fun you're having, the more you're learning.
You are perfect Mr. Kaufmann. A lot of respects. The hardest and most important thing to learn a language is to speak it. How many words do we need to know to speak English effectively? I've been struggling with English for years, but I still can't speak it. Also, the biggest problem is to forget as you take a break. Inevitably, we have to take a break due to life circumstances.
Thanks for the tips
Listening is key for me when learning a new language or even one I know. I use various mediums including good old books. Going to the country or finding natives here is often too difficult but I won't let it discourage me from getting fluency.
I agree. Listening is paramount in my French learning. My attitude is: if I can't understand them, I can't speak to them anyway.
I'm learning Persian and I must say that I'm not a poly. I studied German in school, English and my native Norwegian.
I find it extremely hard to memorize vocabulary, but I've found a "hack" that seems to be working for me. I've started memorizing songs. Spotify have this "karaoke" function, were the lyrics are and timed to the song. That way I can listen and vocalize to the music. For me, it's much, much easier and more fun, that reading some other text, over and over.
For now I don't care about what I'm singing, but what I've realized lately is that suddenly one of those words that I've memorized through song, will come up in a text and then it clicks, I know this word from somewhere. When my so or my teacher tells me what that means, I don't seem to forget it.
@yooanoozarrmay Thanks for the kind words. Cheers!
Excellent video Mr. Kaufman; pretty obvious. Don't really understand why some people don't get your points. Thanks anyway
Which two polyglots are you referring to? BTW Benny is really quite fluent in a number of languages, French, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, German, and I have to assume Esperanto and Irish Gaelic, so he does qualify as a polyglot in my view.
I just wanted to say thank you i really look forward to hearing what advice you have to share. Today you touched on how important listening is to learning and that is what my tutor has been doing with me and i always wondered if i should be talking more or if this is the way it should go. She has said that we are now going to have me talk a lot more and work on my written grammar. I went back and read a text i sent last week to her and I was like-huh ?? why did i do that, what was i trying to say? so i guess that is where that is coming from! :)) Any way's i guess we are on track :)
love ling q!
great to hear it!
Benny here .Thanks for continuing this discussion. I've answered these points in detail on your blog. However, just to summarize:
I never said your approach is wrong. Your approach is fantastic for someone casually interested in a language and with lots of time to learn it. A lot of people DON'T HAVE that luxury and need to speak it soon. I don't write for "the average learner", but for people who genuinely NEED (not want) to speak. We agree on a huge amount despite this priority diff.
Thanks!
Most people DON'T HAVE the luxury of being able to take themselves of to various countries for months on end.
Свака част Стив. За тебе је само небо граница. Greeting from Serbia.
I'd say you need to combine input and output. Here is my advice
1. Get your vocabulary upto 2000 words. If you are using Lingq, then i suggest going to 4000 Lingq's.
2. Then try speaking to other learners who are at the same level or slightly higher than you(A2-B1). Do this for a few weeks at least. Plenty of virtual language meetups these days due to COVID.
3. Then go upto 5000 words and during this time stop actively speaking.
4. Speak to other learners (B1-B2)
5. RINSE repeat
For German a native speaker uses about 12,000 words in day to day conversations.
This way you get best of both worlds.
you're right Steve I'm a truck driver and I'm learning Chinese and the only thing I do is listen to Chinese talk on CZcams listen to Chinese music and I'm learning a lot the only thing that we gotta do is listen listen is the key you're totally right
I think Rosetta Stone is very limited in what it does. It does not get you very far, and is very expensive.
I’m a Chinese English leaner. Studied English for 2years. And rarely make conversation with English speaker. But still improved a lot through listening and reading. If we want to speak a language, we must get the “tools” of it first. (Partners vocabulary grammar structure etc ). But how can we get the tool is through input. And then practice it to make it useful
Agreed.
I think, for me, I'm definitely an introvert. I prefer input activities.
But I also think input and output do two very different things.
Input is meant to give you opportunities to expose yourself to vocabulary and make hypotheses about the language, that is, to discover how words become meaning in that language. You can solidify those hypotheses through high volume input.
Output is an opportunity to further test those hypotheses and clarify issues that were not easy to pick apart in your input studies. It also plays an important role in automatization of your use of these grammatical and vocabulary knowledge that you gained from input.
I think it does benefit to do some output early, but input will always necessarily form the base of your knowledge, because you simply cannot say that which you do not know.
People who are heavy on output tend to have extremely effective use of a few words. People who are input heavy tend to end at a higher level because they had more knowledge to work with, more things they could automatize and more situations they could learn from. One who is too focused on creating output misses out on many of these opportunities because their base grows too slowly, and sometimes barely grows at all.
I think, to speak well and pass for a native speaker, you need both. But I would also so say, be careful to not avoid speaking and writing entirely, it's really not a bad idea to speak and write early on, as it will help to automatize part of what you know. Oddly enough, I do believe there is something about the effect of automatization of your use of the language that improves your ability to understand rapid speech.
I personally felt like my listening comprehension in Spanish suddenly skyrocketed once I started really using the language and getting written corrections. Or perhaps I was about to reach "the breaking point" after so much input anyway. Not sure. I'll test that hypothesis with another language in the future.
Input alone often does not allow you to catch every concept, though you can certainly catch 90%. That's why there's something good about using a language and automatizing what you think would be correct ways of saying things, even if you're not sure if it's correct. That automatization actually can make it easier for people to correct you, and can sometimes make it easier for you to correct yourself; and putting your foot down on your hypotheses about the language makes the difference between your hypothesis and the correct answer more stark and more easily noticeable. Erroneous speech need not be set in stone. You can always correct it. If you always go by your best understanding of the language and always add to your knowledge, learning why correct sentences are correct and incorrect sentences are incorrect, it's hard to go wrong. Nobody wants to speak with incorrect sentences; it would only garner confusion, so you almost can't go wrong. For this reason, I now have no shame purposefully thinking in Spanish, because it's helping me with automatization, in preparation for testing my hypotheses against native speakers.
The trade off in using output is that you're trading the use of incorrect hypotheses (some of which you may not be aware of for sometime) for an opportunity to automatize your use of the language. Based on what we see in children growing up, who always go by their best understanding of their language as they learn to speak, it actually turns out to be an excellent trade-off, and the mistakes are eventually eliminated anyway, not by use, but by repeated exposure and comparing the reality with their hypotheses about the language, which they made clearer and clearer through their use of the language.
To put it simply, I believe language learning is all about making hypotheses (your base knowledge) through input alone and testing your hypotheses through both input and output together. My view would basically sit somewhere between Steve Kaufmann's and Luca Lampariello's views. If I could learn Spanish again, I would basically try to always keep my input skill 1-2 steps ahead of my output skill, so that I never neglect automatizing my speaking ability.
Went through a lot of back and forth with this but I overall agree a lot more than I disagree based on my experiences. I think you need to start "speaking" as soon as you start learning, like by yourself. Like reading things out loud over and over again and mimicking "native" speaker sounds and intonations in the way they speak the language, but not necessarily conversing immediately when you start learning the language. With more input combined with grammar practice and internalization, then practising speaking is a good place to start. The knowledge in the brain is already pretty good to start stumbling through high-level conversation possibility even though it will not at all be easy at first, but the starting standard is just higher in general. At that point, it is best to continue alternating between listening and reading more and more and then forcing yourself to express complicated thoughts and opinions on tougher topics while speaking. That is basically what made me make a LOT of progress. The speaking struggle is its own separate struggle but I absolutely agree that input is what boosts the standard of what you can say, while practice of speaking subsequently is what ultimately strengthens your confidence and accuracy in the language.
You are right . I always say all I want is speak to people understand them and vicer verce.your advise is gold if benefits me benefits Evey or anyone they have attitudes to learn
This makes sense. The more you take in the more you build a deep rooted understanding of the language so when you start doing output you produce it in a way that just sounds "right" instead of trying to make it up by sticking to the grammar of your native tongue or trying to slowly work out how you're meant to say things.
You don't learn anything through output. If you're outputting then you already know it...
Perhaps the speech approach is good if all you want to do is have passing conversation. That way your input will be concentrated to exactly what you want to use the language for so you then feel advanced in the language because you can use it how you'll want to use it. Regardless, you don't learn from talking if you've not had the suitable input first.
You always give me hope when I'm in doubt lol. I was wondering about that because what I do (i have run out of Lingqs) I watch my favorite movies on dvd in Spanish and all I do is listen. It has helped me. And I was thinking oh no I'm not speaking it, but i notice I'm at the stage now that I can understand when someone speaks to me, but I can't quite build my own sentences yet. So yes, i'll keep listening lol.
Thanks; for your golden advices .
We can compare inputs like a fuel so , more there are lot of fuel in car more it runs longer time .
And more you improve your listening and reading more you can speak easier and longer time.
The best method that
I love when It's comes Learning languages is Listening also I love watching English videos
I am a non-native speaker of English. I have listened to and read a lot of English over the years. Thus, my vocabulary is extensive enough to enable me to understand most spoken and written English effortlessly. I can express myself quite well in writing, as well. So as far as these three basic language skills are concerned, I tend to agree with you.
What I lack most is fluency in speaking (even though I can put on a decent RP accent that has already fooled a few Americans into thinking I was British). Alas, there is no substitute to living in an English speaking environment for an extended period of time and actually speaking the language, in order to develop one's ability to rapidly access the vocabulary one already possesses and retrieve the appropriate words at a natural speaking speed. It is a skill that has to be acquired through practice, like any other skill. I have never had the chance to do so, which is why my speaking skills fall well behind my other English language skills. In my opinion, based on my experience - no amount of listening and reading will teach you how to speak a language fluently.
@PolyglotNZ I agree, and I doubt that we can just speak our way to fluency as he suggests. As I said, our personalities will determine what we like to do, but the way our brains learn is probably the same, there are no kinetic, auditive, visual etc, learners, we all need a variety of stimulus, but may prefer certain kinds of stimulus.
Is this true sir no kinetic and audial visual
I agree. I used to speak very poor Spanish but it was enough to get a job teaching K-6 Spanish at my school. Now that I am in a position where grammatical errors, or sloppy Spanish, can't be allowed to pass my lips, I have slowed my speaking and check myself often. At first my sentences were three to six words in length to ensure accuracy, but now using LingQ in conjunction with other written and audio materials, my confidence has improved greatly and I use six to ten words. My Catalan...?
It helps me with motivation to be in the country where the language is spoken. I really want to learn the language then. I don't have to force myself.
On another point, I do lots of language exchanges online. There is some value in the interaction with a real native speaker.
12 yrs later 😂 but I agree. I never spoke a lot as a child. I mastered speaking in English by reading books, playing reading games on the computer(Reader Rabbit), and watching television. Speaking became the icing on the cake, developing how I speak (accent, slang, rhythm) in my later years. Now as I tackle the Spanish language, I will use this same approach.
Omg. Bonjour Steve. You make great sense.
LingQ is great!
His technique: "speak whenever you can" is very good ! I always use it to maintain and practice what I already learnt ! But I'm conscius I won't be able to hold the conversation so I'll switch to the local language (which is french here in Brussels). but by doing that I keep myself motivated ! Because those people will try to motivate you to learn the language !
Then when I seriously study the language, after a certain amount of time I'll be able to devlop a conversation with the native speaker
You are so right!
INPUT is just as important as OUTPUT. How can one speak or even write messages in a language effectively if you don't understand what is being said or written to you, and can therefore not have a conversation with someone due to lack of listening and reading input? Excellent points, Mr. Kaufmann.
Really thx for your expression and salute u after 12 yrs！
I completely agree with steve!
Benny system is great but he have to keep in consideration that everyone can't just up and move to other countries especially in 2-3 month increments. People have families, careers, school, or might not have the finances to travel. Steve's way is a great way to learn while still living your ordinary life.
Also, I agree with Steve about not speaking too early. Just think about it! when we first begin speaking as babies around Idk 1 or 2, our parents and families aren't talking to us about Pythagorean theorem or AP calculus. Everyone have very basic conversations with the kids then as their vocabulary grows, they can have more advanced conversations.
A formula pelo que me parece é idêntica a recuperação do STOLL que devemos comandar a aircraft para baixo para tirar ela da perca de sustentação ou seja enquanto muitos se esforça em falar esquecem q ler é a chave.
The formula for what it seems to me is identical to the recovery of the STOLL that we must command the aircraft down to remove it from the loss of support, that is, while many endeavors to speak forget that reading is the key.
Thank you! Seems I should comeback to that time when I was learning Vietnamese (my mother tongue, was born in Russia), I just said to my Vietnamese teacher that I could handle it myself. So I started learning by reading manga every single day!
I was worried that I am still shy to speak Japanese, even though I’ve been learning for quite long time (I like to learn grammar )))
One thing I would say (not that anyone, and certainly not Steve, has to care about it) is that I personally feel like speaking with someone and having some success in doing so gives me confidence to continue to use the language. This may be because of the unique position I find myself in: after years of ineffective learning in school, one day I decided to take matters into my own hands and began learning English by using the input-based method (although I didn't know anything about the various approaches to learning a language back then, so I didn't even realize that was what I was doing). Since then, I have gone on to obtain a degree in applied linguistics and then I started working as a translator. To this day, however, I struggle with speaking. I believe this is for two reasons: firstly, I am a disabled person and, in addition to not being able to walk, I also have a speech impediment which makes it difficult to understand me when I'm speaking; as a consequence, there are always those inhibitions that people may not be able to understand me (I think this is related to "the attitude" when it comes to the video). Secondly, 99.9% of my speaking happened in an environment, which I consider to be my comfort zone : in a classroom setting with fellow non-native speakers. I have only had the opportunity to talk to a native speaker a handful of times and so far I have achieved mixed results, so, in conclusion, I am still not sure whether my spoken English is good enough to communicate effectively with people, for whom it is their mother tongue. However, even when speaking with non-native speakers, I still feel the satisfaction of using a language which I have learnt "passively" in an active manner (although I do realize that an effort has to be made to learn, even when listening and reading, hence the quotation marks).
Totally agree.
I think you'll get more out of your overseas trip if you can already speak the foreign language and understand it (you don't have to be perfect, but at least be able to have basic conversations.)
only your approach work for me👍👍
thank you
I cannot imagine not being a heavy listener in order to acquire everything from pronunciation to vocabulary to expressions. Even developing a vocabulary of conjugated verb tenses for instant identification is impossible without listening.
My method is to learn enough vocab to get my point accross. But then, you read enough wtihout translating, you can achieve a speed at which you can understand natives speak without translating (which for me is the most difficult & important part for fluency). So I totally agree.
Additionally, having written exposure is important because it allows you to see patterns in spelling, and you can also see grammatical structures used in context. Sure someone may be able to speak a language, but I honestly think being LITERATE in any language is a far greater tool.
Well, I think that the way most of us learn new language is by listening and trying to imitate the way native speakers sound.
Of course in the begining we sound terrible yet we get better as we go on practicing.
Another important point is having something to say, or better still, being available to exchange information. And sometimes it is difficult to find a good environment for that - a place where people are actually willing to speak and share information with whoever it is.
I have taught myself Portuguese, English , working on Italian , French , I speak Spanish fluently , learning the basics of Turkish . my system is to read and repeat all I see and memorize it, Grammar takes place later per say, first I learn to use daily expressions and the accent copying how native speaker use the language and make my own copy . I believe the use of grammar keeps a person from advancing making the process some what boring . if are not having fun learning a language then you are not doing it right...
two questions here,
1) How do you set up your keyboard for multilingual use?
2) What do you think of Fluenz
Common sense approach thank you!
That’s perfectly logical! How can you produce something if there’s no intake beforehand?
Being a polygloy is easy, once you understand the mechanics of language, and make the proper adjustments for grammar and spelling for each additional lamguage.
I like the app thank you
absolutely right
In my opinion person should remember the BASICS before starting to talk with native speakers.
Because if you start speak too early you can be SHOCKED, you can be DISAPPOINTED because the language will sound TOO HARD for you. But if you know the basic word+grammar you'll always remember that its not so difficult. and all you need is time and little bit of patience :)
And as long as learning languages is just the PRETENDING to be a native speaker, its very important to LISTEN
Asking someone, "How are you?" runs the risk of getting a meaningful answer, which now puts the burden on the one asking to respond to a meaningful answer, lol. I laugh, but that's a scary proposition for the asker. It invites a whole host of words and phrases he or she won't understand, and if it's health-related or really important, the responder has been dying to dump on anyone willing to listen to their unresolvable issue with empathy.
Not a good way to introduce oneself in a new country unless one is willing to ignore the risks, dare to expose themselves and show they really care more about the other person than how others will see them for their own inadequacies. In the end that could be mutually beneficial, and it may be a golden opportunity to get past simple polite conversation and on with life.