Is education a waste of time for married women? (1961) | RetroFocus
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- čas přidán 14. 09. 2018
- ABC TV's Jean Battersby chairs a debate between two educated women, Jean Inkster and Tony Tompson, on whether education is a waste of time for married women.
This episode of Woman's World aired in 1961.
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So the anti-education argument is basically: If you have to stay home anyway, you better don't know what you're missing out on.
Yup.
Nope, it's that education doesn't create wisdom but instead fills your mind with useless trivia
@@GunnerRDS So we should all stay ignorant? No science, engineering, teaching etc?
@@miriammoriarty8588 Nah I don't think that. But the nature of education in society is to indoctrinate people so they become productive and taxable members of society who dont question authority too much, rather than instill critical thinking skills. You dont gain any life skills from higher education, just learn how to pass exams effectively. My education began after i left school, and with the internet you can study whatever you want on your own terms
@@GunnerRDS You did not have good teachers
I love that they let each other speak. No angry tone, just sticking to their opinion. Love it.
Judy ,yes they are very respectful to each even though there views are poles apart.
Love it too.
@@kevinhuddleston4219 They'd be cancelled and deplatformed within a minute nowadays
I’m glad that they both speak their minds and have a respectful discussion.
That's because they can express their opinions with words, unlike nowadays when people become frustrated and angry because they only have 100 words in their vocabulary and can't express themselves...
This is two women with class, having a disagreement. Love it! 🤗
It's hilarious to me how polite, civil and posh they sound despite disagreeing with each other
Probably because at that time, being calm nd smiling was expected of women
Total ladies
@@agostinacoronel2901 how are they total ?
No this how respectful conversations should happen, which not how happens today.
It’s called being passive aggressive.
What strikes me is how respectful these two women are to each others point of view. Today they would be screaming and shouting at each other and saying how offended they both where. Different times ..More manners and respect.
Shut the fuck up. No one wantd to hear your opinion
You are so right. It's absolutely striking how well-mannered and respectful these two ladies are to each other. Even that warm laugh after the kindergarten teacher was asked "Do you think you'd have been just as satisfied (paraphrasing) looking after a hearth and children?" and she replied "Well, I wouldn't know. I've had too much education" was priceless and funny and yet these two women couldn't have more differing ideas on the matter. It really shows you how self-indulgent outrage can be when it's over-employed. Gives me something to think on for sure.
yeah I’d probably be shouting too haha
I am imagining that highly educated woman screaming inside her head out of frustration though 😂
@Brittany Bennett smug and condescending are an emotional response and that is your interpretation of how think the blond woman is reacting..No one is shouting..No one is being insulting..No one is storming out ..No one is interrupting anyone else..different times..Very different manners
I'm becoming addicted to this videos. Good job ABC, this is like a time capsule for me
Me too!
yes
Who else is here binge watching a bunch of these videos that suddenly showed up in your recommended at 2 am instead of going to sleep
Also the answer is no, not a waste of time. Knowledge is power no matter where you are in life
For me 10:47 pm. Haven't slept..
U RIGHT
Sadly women were expected to quit working once they got married. Society at the time thought it was a bad thing if a married woman did work.. as it reflected poorly on the husbands ability to provide for the family. This is based on my mum’s experience during the 60s... 😒
Knowledge is only power when it's applied. You can have all the knowledge in the world, but if you're too dysfunctional, lazy, or impatient to apply it, it's utterly powerless.
*checks clock*
Nope. 4:22am
This is the most calm debate ever. Both very opposing views but so calm and focused on understanding the other person instead of convincing the other to think the way you think
Or making laws that people should believe what they believe. What a sad world we live in now.
@@Isnt-it-Lovely I wouldn't say that people don't have calm debates nowadays. It is just that news outlets tend to attract more viewers with childish screaming matches than calm discussions, that in my opinion is the sad part.
Been a housewife for 5 years finally made my way to go back to Uni and I feel like a better person and a better Mother...I feel soo happy seeing my son pay more attention to his school work whenever I bring out mine we study together and its the best feeling in the world...Mothers aren't there to just serve the family she needs to set example too. And what better way to do that other than demonstrating for them the way to success?
Glad to read that! All the best for you and your son :)
Completely right, it's a win win situation. Hope your education pays off and you get paid well in whichever career you choose
A mother's job is not there to serve the family.a mother and fayhets should balance their family.
I'll make sure to convince my mom to study with me lol, it must be fun
What's ironic is tht the educated mother seems more caring and pleasant
probaly because they know more about life
They're both educated. Just one feels bad she never got to use it.
That’s not what ironic means... that’s the whole point.
the one who defends education is interrupting the other one too much.. I don’t think that is what education is supposed to teach
That’s not ironic. It’s inevitable.
Me: Wow that woman is so sexist! How can she say these things.
Woman: I think homework is quite wrong.
Me: Let's hear what she has to say.
She doesn’t care about parenting, her idea of parenting is letting the children watch TV as she said. That mindset keeps the family at a lower socioeconomic level, compared to the aspirational middle class woman who is setting up her children for a better future. You don’t get success by being lazy!
@@User-cb4jm I think she was more saying that education (formally) is about memorizing information, not about life sense. Homework and basic education is not done to enhance children as it's supposed to. And watching 'documentries' are a better education than assigned after school homework
😂🙌🏼 sameeee ❤❤
Internalized misogyny. These kinds of women are princesses of patriarchy, they often think that the only way to survive in one is to wear the leash, and so they have these kinds of horrendous beliefs and mindsets. Just know that they are also victims of patriarchy and unfortunately internalize it.
If you agree with her on the subject of homework, you may end up like her.
This lady must be used as a motivational speaker. Every time you think of skipping homework, just 30 sec to a minute of this lady opinion of educated women should suffuse.
To be equal you have to be better, smarter, faster and stronger.
I love how they disagree with each other, yet speak calmly, listen, are polite AND laugh together! If there's anything to learn from this interview - the manners are astonishing
👏👏👏👏👏✨
Yes!
We should try doing the same.
sure, but you should also recognize that women were much more expected to have good manners and to be polite
@@blinkbubs3994 which is a good thing.
Ironically the highly educated woman looks happier and less frustrated than the other one
The lady on the right might be embarrassed by her lack of education. She appears threatened by the idea of intelligent women.
Both are educated, but have different points if view on the usefulness of their degrees.
That’s not irony, that’s the whole point.
@@Cassxowary agreed. But usually the stereotype is that we, women who got a higher education and housework and childbearing are not our only chores, are the ones frustrated with life, and find consolation in cats.
@@usagi18 indeed, and that’s obviously coming from misinformed people who don’t want to see the obvious truth.
Then again, probably the fact american degrees are often not worth the paper they are printed on...
It sounded like the darker-haired woman was trying to say that women would be happier if they did not know what they were missing out on. I get why she is saying that. If all you know is housework then why would you want something you don't even know about? As I complete my first college degree I want more things I never knew about before.
Maybe true for some, but not a good reason to not have an education. What you don't know is bad for you.
I don't know that I agree. I have a degree, but I'm very excited to be a housewife and stay at home mom as soon as my husband and I can manage it. I want to be able to teach my children to the best of my ability and so I'll be putting my degree to (in my opinion) the most important use. :)
It's like that scene in Born Yesterday where they say you can't know what you want if you don't know much.
The brunette lady is ridiculously ignorant, submissive and insecure. Women staying at home without question was structure and means of allowing men to build and empower themselves without the trouble of babies and any other hindrance and it worked.
@@robingriffin42 if the only way it worked was because women didn’t know there was more which is essentially “ignorance is bliss” than that should show how little it worked. If anything the truly submissive person here is the one arguing against education
How far we've come. Now you need a bachelor's just to breathe air🤦🏾♀️
For real though. No discrimination there. Men and Women need it to breathe. 😂
Right, there’s a lot of pressure
Women entering the work force and given these responsibilities men should have on their own is saddening
@@gr3saeyend how old are you?
@Mi You and him have issues.
It's these women that walked so we could run
education is NEVER a waste of time, no matter what the topic is. it makes us human and aware of our surroundings. people have build schools and started to write down their knowledge thousands of years ago because education is the very core of being a human. it is in our nature to be curious about the world we are living in. the need to understand what lies beyond it all is what keeps us striving. this is why education is not just neccessary for a carreer, it is what distinguishes us from animals.
I agree. The question of whether individuals based on gender should access to education or not should have never been raised at all. At the end of the day, we are human, and basic human right should be available for everyone.
Wisdom is not nessaserly brought about by education but it's a blessing from God.
@@kevinhuddleston4219 nah, it's not. it is achieved by working hard and experiences in life. as well, not everybody is religious so please, speak for yourself.
The woman with the dark hair delightfully and comprehensibly slaughtered the 2 other so called Educated women .The woman with the dark hair is wiser that the Educated condescending arrogant woman on the left .The educated women said .."education gets you clear thinking" ,-and yet today ,-educated people cant tell the difference between a Male and a Female ,- ah that's the definition of Delusion .
Any education you pay for which will not give you a better capacity to earn money is a waste of time.
If learning is ones goal, then nearly all information is free online.
Schooling is about obtaining certificates,not learning.
I’m a SAHM and have always wanted to be one. My education is not a waste. Knowledge is never a waste. Mothers teach their children what they know. Smart mothers raise smart children.
Well said! I always planned on being a SAHM but earned several associate degrees and a BA while waiting for my wedding. I work part-time now just to get out of the house for sanity. I have no regrets and have my eye on a couple master programs I may pursue in the future.
I don't regret my degree in the knowledge I gleaned, however I do regret my student loans! If I knew then what I know now I would have approached things differently.
Internalized misogyny. These kinds of women are princesses of patriarchy, they often think that the only way to survive in one is to wear the leash, and so they have these kinds of horrendous beliefs and mindsets. Just know that they are also victims of patriarchy and unfortunately internalize it.
They were debating so elegantly
how are they arguing so politely they are still so well spoken
Per Capita oh bloody hell! You can not insult our most wondrous monarch and her most elegant language
People had manners back then.
Basic respect?
I love watching these old programmes. Everyone should watch these to understand how drastically the world has changed in almost 60 years.
Couldn't agree more, people shouldn't criticise these women for their ideas back then. Like you I find it interesting how much change there has been since then, some for the better & some for the worse.
I like how they were respectful of each other and didn't resort to character insults even though they disagreed on this subject. I saw someone below say something about the dark haired lady needing to stay home and shave her mustache. This is the very thing that people do now days when they don't like someone's beliefs, opinions, etc. These women were respectable and treated each other in a mature fashion even though they disagreed. Something we need more of.
I love how respectful they were towards each other despite having very different opinions.
Image men debating on wether higher education is waste of time for a married man. 😂
It is a waste of time for anyone but knuckleheads
well since they usually went to work they would kind of need education no? unless it was a job that didnt require it. then you could argue about that
I'd like to see that because from statistics men go for jobs straight away but women go onto higher education
@@friedegg3732 that goes for both male and female though so the point is still valid
@@r.b7979 i thought the females stayed home more during that time.
Warning: this comments section might make you loose faith in humanity. A lot of sexist twats on here.
Yes...
Despite disagreeing with one another completely, these two women are very kind to one another. Each is living their life how they want, and they have respect for the other. None of the comments here disagreeing with this video have that same respect. This argument hasn’t changed in all these years, but how we argue it has changed.
I love how respectful and dignified this discussion was even though they disagreed ❤️
Indeed! Refreshing! No hatred, just a discussion. 👏👍
See what good manner does?
The hatred is new....the last 25 years has changed from civility to personal verbal assault
Yes, it in contrast to what we have to today
*cough* The View *cough*
Who noticed that this video is 1 year old but comments are so new?
My grandmother was a war widow in austria with 3 children. She worked as a cook, she carried newspapers, she harvested potatoes for other people, she grew her own vegetables, she made firewood, she educated her children and managed for all of them (all girls) a good schooleducation with later on good jobs. If she'd stayed just at home they all would have died...the soul, the mind and the body.
truffaut650 truffaut wow mad respect for her and all the working women 🙏🏻❤️
You've misunderstood the topic of the video and have created your own narrative. Neither of these women would have told your grandmother to stay home.
Your grandmother 👑
@@violetseven4485 true. I have just told my own.👌😁
If anything can be said it’s that I found both ladies so well mannered & aside from their differences in opinion they were both cordial & debated their views very politely
I wonder what made youtube suddenly recommend this to everyone..?
I'm glad though, because this was interesting to watch.
I agree with you 100%! This is so refreshingly random for YT... and reminiscent of how good it used to be.
The fact that this was done 1961 is very sad. My family has always pushed education ; all my grandmothers had masters degrees in 1920
Sadly, still happens in many places.
Here in Brazil, among the poor people, a lot of families still don't have anyone with a university degree. I'm white and middle class, and still my mother was the first to have one with a lot of trouble on her 40's - because when she was young had to work too much to keep living. My boyfriend is black and will be the first of all in the family if he made it. For black and poor people, everything is twice as difficult. And it's crazy how the investments and valorization of education changes along the world (unfortunately). I just have to say: if you have the basics to study, please honor these people who yet doesn't have the conditions or opportunity and do it. Even 100 years later, in global scale it's still a privilege to have a degree. Honor this. Be smart and do something useful for the humanity, for the sake of us all.
@@jinkisland I'll be looking out for your name in the news when your pet decides he is sick of you and you'll pay the toll.
@Lady Macbeth I do think, that the discussion in the video can be applied to apprentenceships and vocational school too, not only university degrees. I think it is about any education for women after basic school (grammar school& middle school) that enables them beyond housework, not about having a university degree.
Arguments aside I love the way they used to talk back then. I wish people still spoke so eloquently.
It takes education to speak like that. You also have to be brought up in a family that values proper elocution. Not too many parents today correct their children's speech or grammar.
300books less about education and grammar and more about respect and practicing conversation.
Nah it’s probably as well because speaking in front of a camera was not a daily thing back then and is was only suitable to speak that eloquently ^^
People side eye if you talk properly nowadays.
The kindergarten teacher is basically saying that being a housewife is so mundane that you need to be ignorant to find it satisfying🤣
She's a beast xD
She’s an idiot she doesn’t know
Ex kindergarten teacher she's no longer kindergarten teacher. Which is probably a good thing. Because I don't think anybody wants to be taught by someone that doesn't value education. Because you can tell when your teacher basically thinks of it as a babysitting job and not as an important job. Which being a teacher is. Because you're not just teaching subjects you're also a role model for children. Because children literally watch everything that you do with a classroom everything that you say Etc. But I find it completely hilarious but that's basically what she saying. But of course she doesn't even understand what she's even saying.
That’s because we are meant for so much more, but housework is a basic everyone should be able to do.
@@rosequeen2461 oh, the irony
I admire how they both carried themselves. Even laughed together at the end.
I love how they can have a difference of opinion without there being any kind of bad language or shouting and arguing. Unlike today.
Stay at home mothers MUST have a mental stimulation that is separate from family and home. Always keep learning. Otherwise you end up very frustrated and depressed. Feed your brain and you will better feed your family!
Depends on the woman. Plus, most women don't need mental stimulation. They need emotional stimulation.
@@Kube_Dog I never thought much of it, but with your reply I would have to say that is true at least for me.
@@Kube_Dog mm well i disagree.
@@fatfullday Maybe because disagreement provides the emotional stimulation you need.
@@Kube_Dog it depends on the iq of the individual 😉
i like how respectful and calm everyone is. compare this to the debates they have on this morning nowadays between two people
It's not a fair comparison. The reason why "debates" are the way they are today is 100% engineered. People like watching people argue. If people didn't like it, it would be watched.
@@First_Lst True. Also depends on the platform its on
My favorite thing about this is how these women were still cordial with each other. Even though they had very different views and opinions about the subject, they didn't act like they were being attacked, the diddnt get offended, they didn't take the subject too personally. And they were able to laugh together at the end. I wish to become someone like that...
That's how people were back then. I always admired that as a millennial. I try to do the same.
I loved how respectful they were
Agreed. This probably wouldn’t occur in today’s society. I feel people are sometimes entitled or lack empathy.
That is the most eloquent debate i've ever witnessesd.
“Ohhh nooo!” The woman on the left is my favorite person ever! Spitting straight facts!
She hates homework because parents are expected to help. "How dare teachers give us reminders on how we're supposed to be present in our own children's lives?!!" "I don't like this idea of having to raise an accident repeated to me!"
It is such a different world now considering the view points put forward. It would be interesting to see how the women would respond to the questions today. The main thing I love about this interview is the way they disagree.... It is clear, kind and respectful and this kind of debating is rarely seen these days!!
I think our generation would be hurling insults and end up shouting at each other... our vocabulary and social etiquette has changed so much since then.
The difference between our time and back then is that generation displayed Internalized misogyny. These kinds of women are princesses of patriarchy, they often think that the only way to survive in one is to wear the leash, and so they have these kinds of horrendous beliefs and mindsets. Just know that they are also victims of patriarchy and unfortunately internalize it.
With a most genteel voice the lady on the left disagrees and shoots finely poisoned arrows...on the surface very polite and ladylike but actually somewhat passive-aggressive - the lady on the right doesn’t stand a chance and that is not only because the weaker arguments are on her side...
What are you talking about? They're both arguing politely which is rare these days since everyone is offended easily
@@tariqalghamdi5871 This is how intelligent discourse used to be conducted among people. The two women differ strongly, yet they're engaged in healthy, interesting, polite and respectful "discussion." Neither interrupts or viciously cuts the other off. There's no studio audience egging them on. This behavior is nearly extinct. Nowadays, people will scream or run offstage dramatically, saying, "I'm done!"
The lady on the right is coping just fine, she doesn't waver whatsoever
They are being polite because women weren’t not allowed to show any kind of anger back in the day. Social norms were strict AF
Finally someone acknowledging how arrogant the lady on the left is. Sadly fake politeness is still appreciated nowadays. It is true that it is nice for them not to scream at each other, but if you still attack in a condescending way, there's a name for that: passive aggressive. I agree with her point of view though.
Plain and simple to me.... Choose whatever you want. Want to stay at home and take care of your babies? Go right ahead. Want to work just as much as anyone else? Go right ahead. I think we need to learn to understand that everyone is different. Different wants, different abbilities, different strengths.
@Deirdre Morris yes and since it's such an important role, she needs at least as much college education as a man. THAT is what the talk is about; you've failed to address the issue at hand
open the same options to men too.
"They're both educated. . . reasonably . . . I suppose."😁😁
That was some funny stuff there!!!!
The shade!
To educate women is to educate a society
Say it louder for those in 1961
🌺💓👏👏👏👏👏
Lady on the left be like 'oh no' every 14 seconds.
Well there's much to contradict 😬
My mom went back to college while I was still in high school to get her Nursing degree and that decision saved my family a couple years after I graduate high school cuz my dad was fired but my mom was able to go to full-time work and take care of us while my dad looked for another job.
That's why I think it's a lie men want a housewife then complain about gold diggers. Not the same thing however deep down men don't want the full responsibility of paying the bills
I really like how they were laughing at the end! Civil disagreement is rare these days.
It's interesting that in all these debates, I've never heard a highly educated woman actually say that women should not be educated. It generally seems to be the case that uneducated people (in the case of Americans, people who did not get an education beyond high school) tend to think that education is somehow bad for the mind or for the quality of life. Is it ignorance speaking or an envy for those who have achieved higher education? I really wonder.
Maybe she's really just angry because she does have the higher education, but she still feels she can't do anything with it.
She's in conflict with herself. Not with the fact of its in general worthless, I think. 🤔
I wonder it’s because the 60s, women obviously weren’t as knowledgeable as they are now on the subject of education. And she is still trying to meet the “stereotype”. Maybe she is ashamed because of it? Not sure it’s interesting though
The woman on the right is not “highly educated.” She has a “trained kindergarten certificate.” Although admirable, its not so educated that her perspective is truly reflective of people who have pursued true higher education. This was an unfair debate because the woman on the left is obviously more trained. I respect this woman’s certificate but I think she (at the time of this interview) remains part of the uneducated masses who are compelled to defend their decision not to pursue higher ed. She is thinking at a grammar level, classically speaking. She is not connecting the dots, aka the concepts, and how educational pegs build a foundation for deeper thought and rhetorical application in several areas of life. She was witty though- she admitted that she doesn’t even know if she is contented bc she “has too much education.” It seems like she is blaming the little education she has for her unhappiness when really it’s due to her confined and limited life.
To those who made such nasty personal comments. Tony is my mother and as teenagers we argued with her all the time, but she taught us to always respect each other. She was lacking in vanity and might have laughed at the comments about her appearance, but I am hurt. I would be so ashamed if my children or grandchildren did this. Apart from disrespecting another’s feelings, it’s cowardly, would you say such nasty things to someone’s face. I can understand the harm cyber bullying does.
This was such a delightful interview. I loved how respectful everyone was inspite of their differing opinions
I think Toni looked charming. And her different views should not be a reason to not respect her.. I'm sorry about the people being childish. They're just very triggered and then come up with personal insults instead of staying on the subject.
Thankyou, Loraine
She is the salt of the earth and focused on what was required for her value of family. She is intelligent, wise, witty and respectful. That is pure class :)
This is what you find now on social media. Not all, but a lot of adults that act worse than some kids. Nice interview.
She thought the kids in ‘61 had too much homework... 👀 Would I have news for her. 😁
But you don't know how much homework they got. It could easily be much more than todaym
@@flowerchickenhairsparkle2819 I don’t think so. Back then, many people didn’t always focus on college because they were able to get a job w/ out a degree and be able to pay for bills. But Today’s culture, you’re taught that you have to have good grades to go to a good school to get a good job. This has been instilled in the minds of us, which a lot high school kids take very seriously by enrolling in AP/IB/ Honors courses or even community college courses for higher GPA’s ( not to mention, taking part in a lot of clubs for extracurriculars). To make it even worse, it has gotten extremely competitive to get in certain good colleges (because the demand of applicants are so high, the standards will be extremely high too).
@@briannaalejo9226 you win. That is a phenomenal arguement.
Australian accents have changed quite considerably over the last 60 years.
I honestly didn’t realise the were Australian until a few videos in. I have been binging these
@@jimmyvanilla5285 What'd you think they were? Brits?
@Truth Seeker. "Too many foreigners"
I don't think there's enough! Their unique culture, experiences, etc. are all fascinating and helpful to contribute to Australian society.
Why did I just read this in a 60s Australian accent?
@Truth Seeker. Easy tiger didn't your ancestors colonise Austrailia lol? A bit hypocritical to not want foreigners living there
look how civil they debate. Why can’t people do this nowadays lol
Because of feminazis
@@bakthihapuarachchi3447 so im guessing youre an incel? hows your sexual life if existent treating u?
@@bakthihapuarachchi3447 because of toxic masculinity as well and not to forget corruption
Many people today believe their opinion is superior to others and feel the need to bully those who have a different opinion.
Stephanie LaRocco People think that the louder they talk, the more likely they’ll get their point across (which is obviously wrong). Seriously though, it’s hard to have a civil debate nowadays cause people are so easy to anger. Most will resort to yelling and insulting the person they’re debating against. Especially on the Internet since they can be anonymous.
Wow. Such civilised disagreements. Now everyone would be yelling at each other
QandA.. lol
I was born in 1954, my mother was 30. She was smart and outgoing, full of life and had so much potential. My father was old school and proud, so he made the money, she raised the kids. This eventually led to her drinking, totally out of frustration, then, as she became menopausal, mixed whiskey with valium prescribed by her ill-informed doctor. This led to a bored housewife to madness, a violent and abusive woman who destroyed a family with ease. I have always thought that she should have worked as she wanted to, gaining a higher education if needed, and then keeping the home good too. Jean has such a bright attitude, where Tony is dull and boring, a true teacher. But everyone is different, I was a house husband for years and loved it, so easy to care for 3 girls under 4, all you need is organization. The rest of the time, I spent in the shed, educating myself.
They can disagree without accusing the other of hate speech. Brilliant
An education is never a bad thing even if you don’t use your degree in the work force. An educated woman will be able to educate her children if she chooses to stay at home.
Well only if the children choose something specific to the moms degree
Waste
I love the passive aggressive shade
Never seen such a quiet cat fight 😅
Frame this
do you call all women disagreeing a cat fight?
@@Redmanticore - Nah.. Just thought it was a fun comment ;)
I have never before heard that old school way of speaking in an Australian accent and it is absolutely amazing 😮
I agree with both of them on many points. I really appreciated how respectful they both were to each other and even laughing together at the end. I wish debates these days were more like this. There’s so much anger and vitriol now.
This was five years after my grandmother had to quit her job because she had her first child, and five years before she started working again as a mother of three :)
Toni was my mother. She was brave enough to voice the dilemma facing women then. Those three were old very good friends who loved arguing and teasing each other. She was playing devils advocate to some extent. She had a university education, was a kindergarten teacher in Fitzroy during the depression, and had a major job looking after “shell-shocked” returned servicemen during the war. Then, it was suddenly children and suburbia in the 1950s, imagine! My daughter is an engineer with two preschoolers. In 1961 combining both would have been intolerable, plus she would have been socially isolated. My sister and I both went to university, and while our careers were part-time post children, our mother was unstinting in emotional and practical support. Now in my seventies, I agree with her more and more. I think wide reading, good television, and knowing and understanding as many others as possible either in person or on social media, is as good an education as any arts degree.
My respects to your mother, may she rest in peace, and thank you for sharing your memories and insight with us.
So, it is authentic, isn't it? I don't want to give any disrespect to the old lady, but she had a strange idea about happiness. Any personal growth cause a lot of frustration with periodical rewards that make a person happier than ever. There is no difference between men and women. And with the earth population growing so fast our main goal is not reproduction, our main goal is self growth. I am a scientist and I am educating myself every day even I an 50 y.o. now. It make me happy. Yes, I go through frustration when I am struggling to understand something new but it give me a real happiness then I am getting it finally. Nothing can give a person bigger happiness than the results of hard work. Sorry, but it is not even a dilemma, it is the only way to live: per aspera ad astra!
Respect to you and your family and your mother toni. And i agree with what she said shes right !
I find that VERY hard to believe seeing that you spelled your own mother’s name Tony in one post but Toni in another.
Hi Loraine, I am sorry to hear that you are being given a hard time about this Video. I personally think it is one of the best videos I have seen for a long time. It displays the truth about women in the 1950/60. How they were treated and what was expected of them. If it wasn't for these women, we wouldn't have the freedoms we have today. It doesn't matter what side of the argument you are on. Talking about a married women being unsatisfied with looking after her husband and children after a higher education is correct. That is why our mothers and grandmothers fought for our right to choose and why women all over the world are still fighting.
Being educated and being wise are different things.
True I agree
Who clicked on this video because it was recommendation to you
Me lol
People were so well spoken and polite back then even when having different view points. The bickering that goes on nowadays on talk shows or the news is so immature and unbecoming
Yes, we are regressing as a society.
Well, back then recording and broadcasting videos were rare and people who get the privilege to be on T.V spent days or even weeks preparing themselves and practicing what they're going to say and do.
And they know full well that this might be their chance, their ONLY chance to be able to be seen on T.V which would be viewed by millions of people so they need to make sure that they make a good impression.
Nowadays, anyone with a smart phone can just get out of bed and record a video stream and have it uploaded and everybody connected to the internet can view it. We are not as meticulous or put much preparation in T.V since it's so mainstream and accessible and television debates are an excellent way to grab ratings, as it turns out, views increase the more outrageous something is, so people go overboard and overly dramatic nowadays.
This comment section is terrifying. Apparently _Woman should go to school_ isn't a given in the 21st century.
Women SHOULD go to school....
You ALWAYS need dinner-ladies!!!
BudG haha
They both are very graceful in their behaviour and way of talking
Yah lol I laughed cause all ik is people yell at eachother today
Yeah its not womanly to get upset by the rules they lived by.
@@jamesa55 I don't think it was about getting upset, because getting upset is alright... But not venting it by shouting and being aggressive... They stay very sincerely polite and well... Graceful. :)
Imagine laughing at a joke, your opposer crack at the end of the show.
@@lumafusion5003 that was the best part :D. Her views might be questionable but she sure does have a witty sense of humour.
At the time this was made, my mother, my aunt, and one grandmother had their Bachelor’s degrees, my other grandmother and my other aunt had their Master’s.
So thankful that in my family women were expected to go to college.
Johny Myers Hahahaha 🤣
Xarcady D I’m happy to hear that. I believe everyone should have education. Regardless if they’re married or not.
If you want to have a family, that's great!
If you want to focus on your career, that's great!
If you want both, great!
Having kids and being married would make me depressed, and I'm focusing on educational/career related matters. It's what personally makes me happy :)
Don't let anyone tell you what to do. Be free and forge your own path.
@emo frap dad
right! We shouldn’t shame others and purposely make others feel terrible about themselves and their choices.
Exactly! I don't know why people feel the need to shame and belittle someone's opinion of how to live their life.
Yes! Also, there is nothing wrong with wanting to focus on yourself and your education and then also want a family at some point. It makes me mad when people say if I really wanted a family I wouldn't be pursuing a career like I am.
@@rainyw1nd Unless they criticise our life choices.
@@Steph-yz4tn I agree but I come from a time when people used to prate rubbish like "Every woman needs a husband and children."
Education is never a waste of time at any age. This world is one great school and we only attend a few formal classes. Most classes are informal.
Most classes don’t help with shit, most people that don’t get good jobs usually get along fine in life. Higher education is overrated.
@@adamd6648 having a good education is not only about having a job. It's about feeling happy with what you know and being able to think about different things and have discussions about them.
Luísa Brito Leite periodt
@@adamd6648 MY college degree means I earn 8 X more than you
LOL, the interviewer say's "they are both educated, Reasonably I suppose" then she asks what their eduction is as she just realized she has zero idea what education they actually have. Then it gets uncomfortable for the interviewer when Jean say's she's a pharmaceutical chemist, so the interviewer responds by downplaying Jeans major accomplishments by saying "that's a fair average sort of an education" and I'm like, are you joking me?
Then we listen to the ladies discussing the topic and we can easily understand why Jean is a well educated lady and Toni has a trained kindergarten cert due to their different outlook on what a woman should be doing and not doing, thank god only men carry Toni's attitude about women and women have Jean's attitude these days, true or true.
Thanks to all those women like the light haired women, I'm getting my education and that i have the sources and freedom to study as much as I want
Darned if you do, darned if you don't. Life is never gonna be perfect for women I guess. I have a bachelor's degree and I am a stay at home mom. I have mixed feelings about it but my education has definitely been a benefit and at the same time I find raising my daughter is fun, rewarding, and challenging. My degree has given me a passion for multicultural issues, collaboration, teaching, learning about people with disabilities, and evidence-based strategies. Those passions benefit me both as a stay at home mom and as a human interacting with the world.
How specifically do your passions benefit you as a stay at home mother?
@@violetseven4485 *It is for your satisfaction and nothing else!* I just don't understand why did women need to explain why she needs to be educated when the entire reason for being educated speaks for itself. If so be the case, why don't you ask men why do they need to be educated? It's is rubbish....that shit is like slavery.
@@violetseven4485 You are so hooked on the fact that it is a woman and not what education truly means. Education is your history, it's learning about the past surrounding, present and future. Education is understanding advancement and discovering new things to be. It's feeding your interest because humans are curious... *WOMEN ARE HUMAN BEINGS TOO* that has curiously and it's that shitting simple.
@@violetseven4485 Violet Seven being an educated mother helps enormously in ensuring your offspring will also be free thinkers capable of navigating the world. Could help with fostering creativity and inquisitiveness (such as shared reading, doing experiments,etc). Not to mention self-esteem ( if mama feels accomplished in pursing her other passions/academic/career goals can't hurt, especially in terms of economic stability for the offspring). There's honestly a lot of benefits....
You are a strong case in point why mothers in particular need to be educated.
At first glance it seems like one woman is more progressive than the other, but when they really delve into what they value as individuals it's clear to see these are two women who find identity in different things: one in education and one in free-thinking and interpersonal relationships. I don't necessarily think the woman on the right is terrible for her views, she just seems like she values different things for her own life.
My issue with the woman on the right is that she is very close minded towards education. Her priorities toward free thinking are fine, but she is so staunchly against education and her reasons are very poor.
Well free-thinking and education aren't supposed to be opposites in any way, shape, or form. Education bolsters free-thinking, and vice-versa.
That she values what she deems as 'free thinking' over education, just goes to show how uneducated she is. The 'free-thinking' she advocates for is to ironically free herself from thinking about education - in other words, what she desires is to not feel bad about not wanting an education, because education frightens her. "I want to be free of caring about my own education" is what she's saying. Fortunately for her, she already is.
To me, it sounded like they both value their families and find them just as important but one is saying that women can have an education and it would even give them a higher quality life. It seems like the woman on the left is supporting the idea that women can have more of a place in the world and not only stay home while still being amazing mothers and wives.
Ashwin Raju
She’s against it because in her time, getting an education and not being able to use it would have been torture. Women didn’t work in any field except teaching, as assistants or receptionists back then
Both women have a point, however I think the woman on the right hasn’t been exposed to the right type of education it seems she’s sees education as a means to an end and for her if you’re going to be educated to obtain a skill it’s a waste of time if youre staying at home. Perhaps if she looked into subjects like psychology or philosophy as they help foster free thinking and theories of interpersonal relationships she might have a different view.
Video: about 59 years ago
Also video: released a year ago
Comments: a week ago
Me: confusion
I love the lack of emotional response.
I think the woman on the right was upholding the common concept that ‘ignorance is bliss.’ In comparison, once you drink fine wine, it’s hard to go back to the cheap boxed stuff. Because household caretaking is not intellectually challenging in a particular way, one only realizes that fact if one has been intellectually challenged. Better to keep with the cheap wine, she says, so one doesn’t realize how bland it is.
That was exactly my interpretation too! Once you discover what is out there in the great wide world, it can be difficult to be content with the state of your previous life.
Wine metaphors for gender equality I thought I'd never see the day
But yeah I agree with that
They are having a conversation. Not ridiculing each other.
The problem is that women want to work but men are not willing to help in the house. That’s what’s holding women down.
Meet Roomba
don't say "men" like you are saying all men, it's like the 10%
@@iiferedoncXclan it’s 66.6%. There is actually a study that showed two-thirds of women do the majority of the housework in the home WHILE working FULL-time jobs. Two-thirds is quite literally 66.6%, meaning 66.6% of men do significantly less housework compared to women despite both of them working full-time jobs. Women are overworked in relationships.
It’s a huge problem that of course many men are happily willing to ignore.
@@emilyd6259 give me evidence
@@emilyd6259 okay emily
i wonder what kinds of discussions we will have 60 years from now
Omg yess 😂
But the right women never got higher education so how can she know about the importance of it 🤔
The irony
@Howlin Mad yes, but that lady has an education certificate, not a higher education.
Because critical thinking doesn't just exist in a person just because they are highly educated, there are some people with very little education who're as sharp as a whip and some highly educated people with very little common sense and vice versa too
Piratesfan123 agreed, I didn’t mean in an intelligence sense, I meant how can she know she is lacking something of importance whether it’s a place in society, a general sense of accomplishment, a general change in outlook if she never experienced it? How can she know that education doesn’t add importance and value, if she didn’t get it..I mean if she got higher education and realized it added nothing to her than this might make sense or another side obviously can be she observed other people and concluded it’s of no use 😂. But personal experience kinda trumps that. How can she know she is missing something if she never experienced it. Didn’t mean it in an critical thinking sense 🤔
I think they mean training past high school.
I just love watching these retro videos. So much kindness, respect, dress nicely, hair done nicely.
Very happy that I got my PhD.
I'm very*
@@daianaxi1295 -_-
Congratulations...hope I can get mine too
swimgirl24 good on you
Daiana Xi I’m stupid*
Each to their own. Some people don't want to study as they don't see a degree that fits their career or life goals. Being well read and gaining knowledge in any form is important regardless of how the knowledge is obtained.
You're so beautiful.
👍🏻
whats your life goal to not study? is anyones life goal to be ignorant?
To much education works against them,after years of achieving academically they find themselves past the prime age of being a mother and finding a man to marry her,she won't marry down or settle for anyone less educated and the pool of guys that fit that criteria are they're either already happily married or very small pool. I still believe and see someone who has kids earlier from marriage benefits from the reward in future years and are more appealing to guys threatened by not being smart enough for an educated woman. That's also the confusing part for women as well, they feel guilty by those that say you should have a career over just being a stay at home mother,which is wrong
@@Redmanticore whoosh
education has never been wasted on me. i was reading jane austen novels at 8 years old, got into law and commerce school at 18 and have been studying since. because of all this exposure to education and learning i feel more enlightened, i feel capable and like i can take over the world. education is not some big bad monster like the mustache lady is making it out to be. it makes you powerful. being a good mother and educated are not mutually exclusive and can co-exist hand in hand. i really respect the lady on the left for remaining so mature throughout the whole debate. this is a good sneak peek into history. im glad i was not born a woman back then.
Are you sure you are educated? If so,why is the wording in your comments so immature and unintelligent?
@@MayorOfMoetown this is social media, not a PhD dissertation. Why are you so threatened you choose to play grammar Nazi on YT?
r/iamverysmart
@@timothyo718 yooo
And to think, at the same time this was filmed my grandmother was taking the qualifications to go back to education and get a business degree!
I think self education is very important for anyone. Self education, huh, not a degree or anything else. If I was a stay-at-home mom, I would learn a lot of languages, a bit of science, manual work too...
It's always self education, but many don't realize it.
Remember until the 80s women could not take out their own mortgage .. absolute bs
How backward!
woaaaaaah
Very interesting, totally opposite agreements but no insults or yelling.A very respectful conversation
There is no such thing as too much education for anyone.
The problem comes in when you question what are you using it for??... to work at starbucks
They both are for education, the right one just is against university. but education is so much more than university, it is books, films, talking to people, and generally the ability of being open minded.
Gustav 123 yeah, which is sad, as education can be about anything ! But even nowadays we see some things as having more worth than others
So did this just pop up on everyone's recommends at the same time? Lol
Yes
quarantine put me on random yt content
"I don't believe in homework in any case" . Yes! Preach, lady! 😆
What beautifully spoken women that sit with such poise & respect for each other's opinion.
You can tell the two sides of the debate aren't too happy with each other, yet they maintain composure and remain polite all the same, in spite of their disagreement. People today could learn something from these ladies.
But let's be honest, the woman on the left is far more pleasant. The uneducated woman seems like a real drag to be around.
We went to “women can’t go to school” to “yay we can go now” to “the system is trash, school isn’t even necessary for men” real quick
😂😂😂
So heartwarming to see the level of respect and integrity that women of that age had. Certainly for themselves and most importantly for one another.
Many people equate intelligence and wisdom with higher education. It’s just not so.
I agree but at the same time education opens you up to learning about so many different perspectives and meeting so many different people too. If you just stay in the same small town forever, you don’t get that one on one firsthand experience. Also you do get huge connections. Just for the two reasons of perspective and connections, education makes it worth it IMO.
(Sorry if there are mistakes, not quite well atm)
Depends on what you make of that education.
There are two types of intelligence, fluid and crystallized. The crystallized is through experiences and knowledge. So if you take post secondary education, your IQ won't go up, but your crystallized intelligence will.
This is so fascinating to watch. I have an education. I stay at home BUT I own my own business and work from home. My fiancé and I share the chores and familial responsibilities. Learning doesn’t stop with college. It’s a life long pursuit of knowledge.