Just a sneak preview of the progress on the next generation steam turbine, employing some new theory and a more in-depth explanation of the workings. Also, wishing my new boiler was ready!
I would recommend finding a way to pressurize the oil for the shaft of the turbine, and it would probably benefit from the oil circulating through a filter and radiator. It can reduce the wear on the turbine shaft/ bearings.
Indeed. But keep in mind that it's not operating at the speed and temp of an automotive application. I'm running synthetic gear oil in it, to assist in keeping the shaft separate from the journal bearings....so far, so good. Thanks for watching!
Hi, it's not circulating hot engine oil, also not mounted to a hot car exhaust, so cooling may have very little practical effect. I do get your point though, some pressurised oil will help keep surfaces out of contact. Maybe a small electric pump and CPU cooler radiator. In more stressful applications a synthetic lubricant with a small type of CPU cooling device can be tested for longevity. Lots of turbo chargers may have water cooling as KKK ones did.
@@awesomed007 If steam is going through this, it can be hotter then vehicle engine exhaust. Vehicle engine exhaust is about 4-500 F, steam can be up around 1500, granted, that is VERY rare you will reach that temp with a DIY project, but it is possible.
@@anjhindul you are stretching the facts. Remember, turbo is directly connected to manifold, so manifold will exceed 1000+ temp. In night, one can observe the manifold may glow like molten larva. Try placing your hand near an engine manifold. No need for theoretical specs, natural experience is the reality. In this experiment with steam, the user has no such limitations. Further an engine bay is closed and the engine itself is a mass heat generator. Here only a small steam feed in open environment. Try to look at things holistically, otherwise all the technical knowledge in the world is useless. Hope u may employ my advice for life in general. Thanks for your input.
I love this idea. I had never thought of using an ICE car's turbo as a turbine for electricity generation, but it truly is a genius idea. Just a whole load of turbines staring me straight in the face every day! An idea I had while watching this, inspired by steam engine's excess steam pressure, is to use the remaining energy that's in the steam exiting the turbo to drive a pump that circulates oil through the turbine's bearings. Albeit that turbos exist that have different bearings that do not require excessive lubrication if I am correct. Might be worth looking into this if the bearing becomes a problem in the future.
If you've got access to turbos, start playing! Since the steam turbine operates at far less rpm and heat, I've found that 90 weight oil "imitates" pressure, and the shaft floats in the journal bearings nicely. So far...so good. Thanks for the compliment!
@@gwseymour How much power do you get out of the alternator as a fraction of the energy needed to compress the air? I want to store my excess solar power in compressed air and then use the compressed air to generate electricity.
Great progress, looks awesome! Whenever I get the chance to build one, I'd like to noise dampen that high pitch with maybe sorbathane sheets in housing.
Oh wow! I'm also looking for information on steam power generation for off grid living. Do you have any blueprints or documentation on your work so far?
This is what I was hoping to find... Thanks. I recently came across some guys rednecking a burn barrel with a turbo and after a couple minutes I wondered why they didnt try steam and make it useful instead of just hot and noisy for five minutes until it blows. I'm still in the very early stages of deciding what uses I could make from it like cool colored smoke shows or as an air mover perhaps heater but not haven't put too much thought into it yet. Charging batteries seems like a possibility though.
Impressed... I was looking for a similar design to see if anyone had done it. The PTO was the hang up naturally. Given the current burn barrel obsession, the improvements in control systems, and energy storage by way of batteries - I feel an older boiler/steam engine covers low steady rpm, high torque. Could charge batteries etc. But the option could be added to use the firebox as what is effectively the combustion chamber of a jet turbine, to dramatically increase burn rate and output in shorter durations. But if course I'm realizing steam can drive the turbine, so long as I have a way to capture, no need for the nasty combustion chamber, but instead could do a sorta hybrid that uses a steam driven compressor to increase the burn.
You should use an alternator instead of a dc generator because the alernator is way more efficient and you can use a bridge rectifier to turn ac into dc.
As a concept - lab bench experiment it is a nice unit no doubt about it. That said , the electrical energy needed to pressurize the air is greater than the energy produced by the adapted automotive turbo-charger /turbine. Regarding the Tcharger ..they are designed to spool up on pressurized oil, eventually the unit will fail if no pressure is created to create the pressurized pillow of oil inside which the shaft is rotating. One quick way to produce that pressure is to use a relatively inexpensive OIL BURNER PUMP as found in residential heating , specifically the models that do not have a built in delayed oil nozzle valve . not that hard to get , the output to the bearings of the turbo is the nozzle output of the pump. They are driven by the oil burner motors , USA manufacturers like Beckett or Carlin , rated at 120 volts 1/8 HP at roughly 3450 rpm directly through a 1/4 D shaped pump shaft coupled via a slip on coupling that is 3/8 D shaped at the motor shaft connection. They are also available in 1725 rpm versions .. do the math for which one is easier to step down from your turbo speed... yes the same shaft that turns the gen head would drive the pump. These pumps have flange mounts and set screw mounts making them truly universal mount ..the good old days of standardization ... as opposed to the aggravation age , can`t do nothing with it must hack and sack to make it fit .These little pumps can achieve rock steady pressures of over 175 psi and flows of up to 3 GPH at the nozzle output port . The pressure output is fully adjustable bearing in mind that it affects the GPH a bit. They can be gravity fed or can lift oil in single suction line application up to 8 feet from a reservoir ...but for best result if lifting more than 5 feet , a return line configuration back to the reservoir is usually best by the simple insertion of a hex se screw in the appropriate passage . Install a pressure gauge where directed and off you go ...your turbo will be extremely happy with about 85 psi a little lower perhaps even at the full speeds you are achieving with its return line also draining back into the reservoir , what volume ? 1 quart of lubricant in a 2 quart reservoir is more tan enough if on the same level as the turbine .For lubrication you will need an oil that is similar to FUEL OIL ...aka DIESEL viscosity that is still be able to lube and pressurize the turbo and then a return it back to the oil reservoir .The automotive oil must be thinned because those pumps will require more than 1/8 horses to turn with say a straight W30 oil...however ...a mix of 60% automotive oil grade as specified for that turbocharger , mixed with 40% of the forever marvelous, MARVEL MYSTERY OIL in ruby red formulation from the auto parts store will work incredibly well , it will not need any more viscous formulations because you do not have 1600 plus degree exhaust coursing through that turbo ...from a good old fashioned 4 to 8 lungs IC MOTOR, or so it appears at least judging from the size of the TURBO . The pump units are boxed with simple to follow instructions. There were many USA manufacturers making them but probably only one maker is still USA owned. For your convenience and plague like availability ,a French company owned and former USA brand called Sundstrand mini pump 3450 1/4 inch D section shaft, customarily found on Beckett oil burners made in Ridgeville OHIO will do quite well. You will have to under drive it from Turbine power take off shaft by using a belt driven pulley as you are currently doing with the generator head. Other brands include WEBSTER , GRUNDFOS , RIELLO ...Stick with the Sundstrand There is no shortage of belts or pulleys for the application . In fact back in the 1950s there were a few domestic oil burners that used belt drives as opposed to direct shaft drive to make their burners more compact...an evolutionary dead end. This will help the turbine to spin more easily , faster and with considerably less drag. The biggest problem you face ...is that the turbo is not particularly good for what you are doing with it , yes it spins and produces something or other ...but so could a rotary vane air motor ,more efficiently with greater torque and much easier to couple. Even a micro Tesla Bladeless disc steam turbine with an appropriately sized rotor would outperform the auto turbo with a fraction of the input . Setting aside the Tesla viscous disc turbine , it is all about blade design ...simply put a turbine blade spins under pressure impingement while producing the least amount of compression in its environment ..turbocharger impellers do just the opposite therefore require more input pressure in order to produce the same results that a true turbine of similar size can produce with less. As a proof of concept bench experiment , yours is very nice ... too costly to operate for what it produces , if you want to make lots of usable VOLTS backed by lots of usable amps from steam , you must consider a different blade geometry device in order to achieve it.
As far as energy (pumping up the air compressor)...No engine in the world produces equal or more than it consumes. That would be perpetual motion. As far as lubrication, I'm using gravity fed 90 weight gear oil. The unit does not run at the speed or temp of it's automotive design. The heavy viscosity compensates for the lack of pressure. Tesla turbines only work in theory because they require more rpm than we can mechanically sustain. Tesla is my hero, but even he couldn't make it work like he wanted. They don't have any torque, and need to get up to around 300k rpm. Thanks for the info on the oil pumps, and thanks for watching!
This is such a nice turbine set up. Really rooting for your set-up to produce some volts. We would love to try out something like that at our solar lab. My friend and I are putting the final touches on a 10' diameter parabolic solar furnace. It's a repurposed retro tv dish with structural reinforcement added to base so we can safely use it as a solar lab to hook up various devices to, primarily steam powered, brewing, distilling, and some attempts at cooking too no doubt. We'll try to reverse engineer your setup in video. If you share links to the components you use that'd be a bonus of course.
Thanks! I've messed around with Fresnel lenses, but nothing on the scale you are doing. The turbo was just a cheap one I found on-line (just over $100), and same for the charge controller. The rest was just hand-made from raw materials. The only change since the vid is that I've switched to gears instead of the belt drive. Hoping to get my boiler done soon. That's when the real tests will occur.
@@gwseymour _"It was basically the cheapest automotive turbo..."_ I was wondering where the turbine came from. I'm hoping you have posted a steam driven demonstration. I'm going to take a look through your channel.
@@gwseymour Thanks for the quick response. Yesterday I was trying to search for 'steam nozzles'. It's going to take some effort. I want to modify a pressure cooker with a copper tube and a nozzle to see how much steam pressure it will generate.
Was just thinking about your setup looks pretty awesome. Was wondering if you thought about installing a gearbox to the shaft like a 50:1 to further increase speed to generate more?
maybe you know about this but an mppt sola charge controller can accept a a wider range of voltage input and then steps it down to what ever voltage is needed for the battery. for example my controllers can takes a max of 160v ocv and steps it down to nominal 48v battery. if i am using a 12 nominal battery it will allow me to use up to 80v ocv. from the input side. also there are mppt step up controllers, and i have one but havent worked with it much
I'm definitely using a cheap charge controller. Most don't "step down" as that requires a heat sink. Contrary to popular belief, your average charge controller (21 volt panel to 12 volt battery) charges at 21 volts. I don't know much about more complicated ones, so I'll take your word for it. Thanks for watching.
In my experience charge controllers do not work with alternators (voltagesource). Charge controller work with solar panels because they are current sources (not voltage sources).
Great build. Just other day a friend was pondering steam power generation. I thought despite having no knowledge that a car turbo with alternator having rectifier removed may be best viable solution with longevity. Now, so glad to find ur video. Do u have a web page guide with stats or any data as to steam flow rate, kpa consumption, etc. Thank you.
Is this not just a modified turbocharger from a car? Also whats the potential power output when using steam from a boiler? This really interests me BTW... Would love a response and maybe a video detailing the boiler... Many thanks and keep up the good work 👍
Yes, the turbine itself is a modified automotive turbocharger. The available power will be relative to the steam pressure applied. At this point, I'm going to try and get 300 watts using the least amount of steam possible. Boiler construction will resume in the fall. Thanks for watching!
I'm assuming this will be very high pressure steam? I've thought of ways to create a very efficient, heavily insulated, high pressure boiler and the various vessels I could use... Its all theory as I've not attempted anything practical but I settled on modifying a high pressure gas cylinder...
@@davidbent347 I'm hoping to run the turbine at less that 100 PSI. In regards to a boiler, there are many designs. Do a lot of research. The most important rule (there are many) is keeping the water level above the fire. In other words, don't let fire touch steel that doesn't have water behind it. The boiling water is your "coolant" that keeps the steel from weakening and deforming.
Fantastic work! Im considering replicating this, do you have an idea of what sort of sustainable wattage you would expect to get from this? Would be amazing to be able to charge a solar battery bank/tesla power wall up with one in a few hours. Solar power is a bit hitty miss where I come from!
How many amps are you kicking out? What about the corrosive nature of the moisture in the steam, does that have an impact on the turbine or are you running it through a dryer first?
@@gwseymour Rwd is rear wheel drive. Hugh Strickland on CZcams built a similar setup to yours but with a torque converter instead of a turbo. If you cut open a converter you will find it has a impeller and a turbine.
Any heat you can add to the 'blue pipe' will help a bit. In this case its your generator's waste heat. Possibly In a ramjet style/principle container. What happens if the steam goes into the 'blue pipe'? The air will cool the steam, but the increase in air temperature will expand it..? Again a ram jet style/principle 'duct' may help more than one may think.
@@nevillecawood3727 Well, because it's not a turbo, gas turbine or jet. Other than the fact that it spins, they have nothing in common. Picture putting a vacuum cleaner on the tail end to assist with RPM's. That's the theory of super cooling the steam as it exits.
I believe this is how we can extend the range of electric vehicles. Propane would be a practical, reliable fuel to run it. Hydrogen is not that cheap yet. Less would be required from the batteries. Trash trucks, county vehicles could charge themselves, while they are sitting in the yard. Any one with a solar/wind system could include this, with wood pellets as fuel. Everything I'm talking about is proven doable. We need cheap reliable options, no giant monopolies and energy competition. The goverment favors the opposite. Independence should be big business right now. The goverment is sacrificing people for the environment in Europe. They are freezing. We can't move heavy freight down the tracks on solar yet. That is a fantasy world. Real reliable power requires burning something.
Just got my turbocharger today. I already have a boiler. Just curious if you think I could just plum the steam into the line from the compressor side as it enters the steam side? Instead of drilling and tapping into the side of the cast iron.
Hey, dude, I need to power a boat with a turbine. Do you have any suggestions on how to spin a prop with something like that and are there some already manufactured items so I don't have to invent the wheel/turbine? I don't understand the pressure differential but this looks like an exceptionally efficient design. I'd love to be able to make a steam ship that could blast across the Carribean.
We've been discussing the boat, so you're right on time. We are leaning towards turbine / electric for more flexibility. After this project is complete (300 watts of battery charging power), we are moving to the boat. As far as the pressure differential...place your hand over the intake of a vacuum cleaner. Notice how the vacuum motor speeds up? You've reduced the atmospheric density that it has to spin in. Same principle with super condensing the steam after it's done spinning the turbine blade tips ( I hope).
@@gwseymour I hate electric things. I never understood them even though I bought books On it. I'd like to just have a reduction gear spinning the prop shaft and a reverse gear. The simpler the better. Something I can fix in the third world. I like the few moving parts of a turbine. No flywheel, piston, valves and actuator rods. It looks more compact too.
@@jukeboxhero1649 The turbine is definitely superior. Still deciding on the turbine drive or turbine/electric for the boat. The challenges are as you described regarding props, etc. It leads one to a pre-designed boat drive that's already been engineered (and has a reverse). If you want you can e-mail me, and I'll keep you posted on idea exchanges as we move forward. infoglenwoodrd@gmail.com
@@gwseymour I'm so hacked I can't get into my own email. I need to make a new one. You could become very wealthy in less than a year with that turbine running a generator. If you look at Brown Steam Engines of Springfield, Missouri he cannot even keep one of his engines on the floor. Every engine he builds is already spoken for and his are piston. That cannot be as efficient as what you have. I really think you nailed it with a turbine.
@@gwseymour 🤣MB I didn't mean to sound like this wasn't interesting, I only meant it would be interesting to find out how compounding would respond because unless I'm thinking wrong you could spin up just a cold side on one and possibly run a small genset/motor off the removed/unneeded hot side housing meaning (again, if thinking right) you can step up or down in the size of the second modified turbo which would be even colder airflow yet on the second one as well. Would also be interesting to see what going from big to small to big to small to big to small etc. etc. etc. would do because the small ones in that series would be really zinging I believe (or I could just be crazy since I'm half asleep right now 😂).
I’m going to be finished soon with a wood stove heating water, similar to your boiler. I was going to use it for heat and heating water but it’s summer now so I’m thinking to optimize it for heating water. I imagine I can make a lot of steam with it, it’s a high temperature rocket stove. I don’t know if it’s worth it to try to generate electricity with the steam
What size is your air injector and what pressure did you run for this test. What is your turbo inlet size an what steam pressure does it need to produce the same power (noting that steam has 3 X the power of air)?
The injector is 1/8 inch. Iused 70 psi air in the vid. Th turbo inlet is about 65mm. I haven't finished my boiler yet, but the steam prassure will vary depending on the amp (load) being drawn.
@@gwseymour do you have a drawing or specs on your turbo to subshaft coupler design and your bearing block components You mentioned a previous trial without the compressor turbine wheel was that a success that is the what I am considering. I am using you inspiration to try and generate power with my pulse detonation engine with water injection (to flash to steam) .
@@Graemecns The injector is directed sideways at the vanes. Just play around without the housing, using an air hose to find your best angle. For the coupling, I replaced the end nut with 2 standard nuts (reverse thread) a deep well socket slides over these, creating a loose tolerance. The socket is pressed into a shaft. Here's a link to the first unit charging some batteries czcams.com/video/BwsyxRz_eXs/video.html
What would it cost to make? And what the load and duration at a time. I'm talking No of TVs, AC units etc. I will not understand kilowatts or that kinda term. Not that smart.
Doesnt the air negate the vacum effect of the condensing steam? Wouldnt it be better to have it run through a condensor and have the air blow over it? Or just get rid of the compressor entirely.
All the questions I had (have). I've experimented excessively, and I'll share my results as they happen. First, the "compressor" is not compressing like an auto turbine. The air flows freely. Using air tests only, it seems to add exactly what it steals (math). This leads to the conclusion that it will assist in super contracting the steam on the tail end. There is no question that will be beneficial to the turbine performance. I wish my boiler was ready. Thank you so much for the observations and thoughts.
Thanks! I haven't pulled any amps yet, because my new boiler isn't done. So, while I hope to get 300 watts, I'm not going to try until I have steam. In the vid, I think I used about 70 psi air to spin it up to 18 volts. Steam is way more powerful.
The lubrication is 90 weight gear oil. The unit operates at much lower speeds an temps than automotive use. The heavy oil "simulates" the normal pressurization, and allows the shaft floats nicely.
@@gwseymour Roger that, will follow your progress. Interested in making an exhaust captures steam turbine for my boat and wondering what realistic efficiencies are. I can't be bothered with reciprocating engine - too many moving parts
@@N330AA That's exactly where this project is headed. Considering a turbine/electric pontoon boat. That's the platform needed to support the wood / boiler / batteries. In theory, one could travel endlessly, if there's enough wood along the shore (we have plenty along the St. John's River in Florida). I should have had my boiler completed, but suffered a back injury. I have found turbines to be far superior. They are cleaner, smoother, and just plain fun. Reciprocating engines have a nostalgic sound, but once you've spooled up a turbine, you'll never go back.
@@gwseymour it’s pretty awesome what you’ve made here with this car turbo though! And yeah I’ve seen many people try to make them and just spin them fast and they don’t work. But fortunately the too high of rpm is not an issue actually because, despite what’s claimed over and over again by many people on the interwebs, Tesla turbines work fine, get plenty of torque and output power at low RPMs. I’ve got some copy pasta 🍝 of mine that I’ll share with ya here to explain more. Tesla turbines aren’t made efficient by spinning really fast. That’s only for when the disc stack is being used as a centrifugal pump, because ALL centrifugal pumps’ compressors, performance is tip speed dependent. But spinning the turbine fast will produce a centrifugal head that opposes the incoming fluid flow, reducing the pressure gradient across the nozzle, reducing fluid final velocity, reducing mass flow rates through the nozzle and ultimately reducing power out. Furthermore the faster you spin them the faster the fluid you have has to go just to still be moving faster than the discs and still provide torque. Lastly, they work just fine for industrial use too, despite people saying they can’t scale up in size but they actually can scale up just fine because the torque on the discs is proportional to the difference in the fluid speed and the disc speed. So the disc tip speed is the important factor here. For any given fluid supply in the nozzle will have a max fluid velocity. So the turbine disc tips will have a max speed set at that fluid speed irrelevant if radius. Now considering that centripetal force is proportional to V^2/R, if you keep the tip speed the same but increase the radius the centripetal forces on the disc for the speeds needed will actually decrease. Again despite what MANY have claimed about the Tesla turbine, it does not need to be spun fast to work or work efficiently. TesTurs are made efficient when the slip on the discs is reduced and spinning the discs fast does nothing to reduce the slip, only increase the distance the fluid slips on the disc faces, which is by definition “loss”. Listen to what Tesla himself said in the patents of how to make them work. “Owing to a number of causes affecting the performance, it is difficult to frame a precise rule which would be generally applicable, but it may be stated that within certain limits, and other conditions being the same, the torque is directly proportionate to the square of the velocity of the fluid relatively to the runner and to the effective area of the disks and, inversely, to the distance separating them. The machine will, generally, perform its maximum work when the effective speed of the runner is one-half of that of the fluid; but to attain the highest economy, the relative speed or slip, for any given performance, should be as small as possible. This condition may be to any desired degree approximated by increasing the active area of and reducing the space between the disks.” 1) increase the speed of the fluid relative to the disc, (not increase disc speed) 2) increase surface area 3) decrease disc spacing This is how you actually make a TesTur work. Not by spinning it fast. The fluid interactions with the disc that govern efficiency an torque are adhesion and cohesion. Full stop. And spinning fast does nothing to increasing either to increase the turbines isentropic efficiency. This is why everyone who chases rpm with the TesTur just flat out fails. They aren’t even trying to design them properly so of course they won’t work.
@@gwseymour You just have to know how to design it correctly to actually reduce slip to make them work, not spin them fast. The only reason people think Tesla turbines have to be spun too fast is because EVERYONE has mistaken the part of the patent that is about the turbine being used as a pump as being about it being used as a drive turbine. The only time you want to spin a TesTur fast is when it’s being used as a pump/compressor. This is because ALL centrifugal pumps’/compressors’ performance is tip speed dependent. “I have found that the quantity of fluid propelled in this manner, is, other conditions being equal, approximately proportionate to the active surface of the runner and to its effective speed. For this reason, the performance of such machines augments at an exceedingly high rate with the increase of their size and speed of revolution.” -Nikola Tesla And again, you DO NOT want to spin too fast in a TesTur because the centrifugal head will just counter your incoming fluid flow reducing power. And the faster you spin discs, you’re fluid has to be going even that much faster just to be able to apply a torque on the disc face. “Still another valuable and probably unique quality of such motors or prime movers may be described. By proper construction and observance of working conditions the centrifugal pressure, opposing the passage of the fluid, may, as already indicated, be made nearly equal to the pressure of supply when the machine is running idle. If the inlet section be large, small changes in the speed of revolution will produce great differences in flow which are further enhanced by the concomitant variations in the length of the spiral path. A self-regulating machine is thus obtained bearing a striking resemblance to a direct-current electric motor in this respect that, with great differences of impressed pressure in a wide open channel the flow of the fluid through the same is prevented by virtue of rotation. Since the centrifugal head increases as the square of the revolutions, or even more rapidly, and with modern high grade steel great peripheral velocities are practicable, it is possible to attain that condition in a single stage machine, more readily if the runner be of large diameter. Obviously this problem is facilitated by compounding, as will be understood by those skilled in the art. Irrespective of its bearing on economy, this tendency which is, to a degree, common to motors of the above description, is of special advantage in the operation of large units, as it affords a safeguard against running away and destruction. Besides these, such a prime mover possesses many other advantages, both constructive and operative. It is simple, light and compact, subject to but little wear, cheap and exceptionally easy to manufacture as small clearances and accurate milling work are not essential to good performance. In operation it is reliable, there being no valves, sliding contacts or troublesome vanes. It is almost free of windage, largely independent of nozzle efficiency and suitable for high as well as for low fluid velocities and speeds of revolution.” -Nikola Tesla Tesla both knew it wasn’t meant to spin fast and that it worked great for low speeds IF you design it correctly.
@@CharlieSolis Thanks! I would still submit that HP is always a result of RPM. Any type of power extraction (mechanical, electromagnetic, etc.) creates a load, which reduces RPM. The more initial rpm you have, the greater the resistance to reduction under a given load (due to an increase in HP). I am going to build one someday, but I anticipate some tinkering. Thanks for the input.
@@gwseymour hey thanks for replying. So when doing electricity generation the rpm is always kept constant. And when using turbines there is no need for a flywheel type storage because there is no pulsed torque input that needs to be smoothed out, like with piston engines or pulsed combustion engines. When operating using a dynamic load one does not rely on the turbines kinetic energy to resist changes in rpm/voltage output. If the rpm drops even a little the throttle should automatically open up and admit more motive fluid. Power = Torque * RPM / 5252 Therefore when doing electricity generation, the rpm is always kept constant because voltage output always supposed to remain constant and is dependent upon the turbine/generator RPM. So if the load increases, the turbine momentarily slows down just the slightest bit because of the increase in resistance in load, but then the throttle opens up to admit more fluid to output more torque to get more power out for the same RPM, that counters the increase in load. If you look at all the old pictures of teslas turbine, specifically the one in the museum that everyone has seen, the big ol’ system of valve and pipes above the turbine is pneumatic throttle regulator that operates off the peripheral pressure in the turbine. Because centrifugal head increases at a rate of RPM^2, or even faster, tiny changes in rpm once at speed have great differences in peripheral pressures. So when the load is applied and the turbine momentarily slows down the periphery pressure drops and pressure drop in the piston throttle regulator causes the spring to over come it and it opens up the throttle letting more motive fluid in. When the load is dropped and the rpm wants to jump up real fast the peripheral pressure jumps real fast before much change in the rpm and the piston throttle regulator begins to close off the throttle again.
I replaced the turbine nut with 2 reverse thread hexagonal nuts. A deep well socket is then press fit into the PTO shaft. The socket slides over the nuts with just enough clearance to accommodate flexing. Kind of like a mini u-joint.
I haven't run it on steam yet. Hoping for 300 - 350 watts at 50 - 70 PSI. The DC motor is 350 watts. Thanks for watching. When my new boiler is done, I'll be posting the test vids with more data to share.
Great idea! How is the project going and have you already started on the boiler? Maybe it's an idea to make it a closed loop system with a heat exchanger. Personally I like the idea of using water under a vacuüm, so that it boils far lower than 100°C and you don't have the danger of high pressures.. Do you think this will work also with a turbo charger?
Thanks! It's finally cooling off here, and I'm looking at my boiler parts / welder/ etc. As far as boiling the water in a vacuum? Consider that upon release, it's subject to ambient PSI, thereby neutralizing the gain? I get the "closed loop" part of that....not shooting down your idea... just thinking of fabrication realities. I'm exhausted from another project as I respond, so don't let your mind stop working...good thoughts.
Even if the system is sealed at low pressure I think that the steam released from the water will bring the pressure back up. But I guess if you have a large condenser it will work. Just keep in mind that the steam efficiency goes up with pressure difference, and at relatively low pressures a large difference will be hard to create.
@@Weirdomanification Yess. But I think the real problem with a closed loop system on an automotive turbocharger is the oil bearings. These work under oil pressure. Under a vacuüm or even a closed loop system under pressure. The oil can not fall in a 'pressureless chamber' and not rely on gravity to be pumped back to the bearings..
@@gwseymour anyway nice work man it's a inspirational video 😁 I can see this thing running on Tesla supper heated steam boiler/steam thrower ( it's basically a burner inside a tube surrounded by a mini boiler en after the steam is mixed whit the exhaust gases en them is it supposed to go inside a turbine or engine of some kind
@@gwseymour legal steam is up to 150psi , but turbos are usually used 8-30ish psi, do you have a boost gauge pressure gauge ? I am looking to distill water from a natural source with heat from a constant source that will generate electricity and this seems like the water might remain clean out the exhaust unlike steam engines.
@@David_Mash Well, the steam picks up a small amount of turbine oil that gets past the journal bearings. Also, at the end of each run, a blast of protective oil needs to be introduced thru the intake so that the whole thing doesn't rust up. As far as the psi, the unit is based on an automotive turbo, but doesn't work like one. The power is derived from an injector on the exhaust end, and not from overall flow.
@@dukenukem8381 Well, torque converters are full of non-compressible fluid, and are solidly fixed between the engine and transmission. So the answer is I don't think so. Thanks for watching and contemplating, tho!
Well....I had just learned that a great childhood mentor had passed. He's the one who first showed that to me. In hindsight, perhaps the "stunt" was a bit long, but it was my way of memorializing him.
What would it cost to make? And what the load and duration at a time. I'm talking No of TVs, AC units etc. I will not understand kilowatts or that kinda term. Not that smart.
What would it cost to make? And what the load and duration at a time. I'm talking No of TVs, AC units etc. I will not understand kilowatts or that kinda term. Not that smart.
It cost about $400. It's intended to charge 12 volt batteries, that would then be used thru an inverter to run appliances. The amount of batteries would dictate the charge time, and what you could run.
I would recommend finding a way to pressurize the oil for the shaft of the turbine, and it would probably benefit from the oil circulating through a filter and radiator. It can reduce the wear on the turbine shaft/ bearings.
Indeed. But keep in mind that it's not operating at the speed and temp of an automotive application. I'm running synthetic gear oil in it, to assist in keeping the shaft separate from the journal bearings....so far, so good. Thanks for watching!
Hi, it's not circulating hot engine oil, also not mounted to a hot car exhaust, so cooling may have very little practical effect. I do get your point though, some pressurised oil will help keep surfaces out of contact. Maybe a small electric pump and CPU cooler radiator. In more stressful applications a synthetic lubricant with a small type of CPU cooling device can be tested for longevity. Lots of turbo chargers may have water cooling as KKK ones did.
@@awesomed007 If steam is going through this, it can be hotter then vehicle engine exhaust. Vehicle engine exhaust is about 4-500 F, steam can be up around 1500, granted, that is VERY rare you will reach that temp with a DIY project, but it is possible.
@@anjhindul you are stretching the facts. Remember, turbo is directly connected to manifold, so manifold will exceed 1000+ temp. In night, one can observe the manifold may glow like molten larva. Try placing your hand near an engine manifold. No need for theoretical specs, natural experience is the reality. In this experiment with steam, the user has no such limitations. Further an engine bay is closed and the engine itself is a mass heat generator. Here only a small steam feed in open environment. Try to look at things holistically, otherwise all the technical knowledge in the world is useless. Hope u may employ my advice for life in general. Thanks for your input.
@@awesomed007 what drugs are you on?
I love this idea. I had never thought of using an ICE car's turbo as a turbine for electricity generation, but it truly is a genius idea. Just a whole load of turbines staring me straight in the face every day! An idea I had while watching this, inspired by steam engine's excess steam pressure, is to use the remaining energy that's in the steam exiting the turbo to drive a pump that circulates oil through the turbine's bearings. Albeit that turbos exist that have different bearings that do not require excessive lubrication if I am correct. Might be worth looking into this if the bearing becomes a problem in the future.
If you've got access to turbos, start playing! Since the steam turbine operates at far less rpm and heat, I've found that 90 weight oil "imitates" pressure, and the shaft floats in the journal bearings nicely. So far...so good. Thanks for the compliment!
@@gwseymour
How much power do you get out of the alternator as a fraction of the energy needed to compress the air?
I want to store my excess solar power in compressed air and then use the compressed air to generate electricity.
Did you die ? Or did the whole thing just not work ? 2 years, no video of it running on steam
Probably he is targeted.
Can't wait for a steam test! Looks great!
Me too! Thanks!
Great progress, looks awesome! Whenever I get the chance to build one, I'd like to noise dampen that high pitch with maybe sorbathane sheets in housing.
Thanks! It has a great sound, but it's definitely loud.
@@gwseymour the coupling between the generator and compressor wheel nut is just a 6 point socket that fits over the nut??
@@FirstLast-tx3yj Yes Sir. I'm gonna say 12 point. Also had to replace the original turbo nut with 2 reverse thread standard hex nuts.
@@gwseymour i knew there is more detail to it thanks!!
Freakin sick!
Glad I found you.
Thanks! I expect it to really perform on steam.
Oh wow! I'm also looking for information on steam power generation for off grid living. Do you have any blueprints or documentation on your work so far?
Nothing yet, until I'm sure I have any bugs worked out, and it's running on steam. Gotta get my new boiler welded up.
@@PsilovibeGraham It was really designed to integrate with a solar system, during periods of no sun.
Looking for steam turbine, ended up entertained by your experiment 😂🎉
This is what I was hoping to find... Thanks. I recently came across some guys rednecking a burn barrel with a turbo and after a couple minutes I wondered why they didnt try steam and make it useful instead of just hot and noisy for five minutes until it blows. I'm still in the very early stages of deciding what uses I could make from it like cool colored smoke shows or as an air mover perhaps heater but not haven't put too much thought into it yet. Charging batteries seems like a possibility though.
Impressed... I was looking for a similar design to see if anyone had done it. The PTO was the hang up naturally. Given the current burn barrel obsession, the improvements in control systems, and energy storage by way of batteries - I feel an older boiler/steam engine covers low steady rpm, high torque. Could charge batteries etc. But the option could be added to use the firebox as what is effectively the combustion chamber of a jet turbine, to dramatically increase burn rate and output in shorter durations. But if course I'm realizing steam can drive the turbine, so long as I have a way to capture, no need for the nasty combustion chamber, but instead could do a sorta hybrid that uses a steam driven compressor to increase the burn.
"I would like to start this TED talk with a demonstration" lol
Thanks for watching!
Awesome work!
Thanks!
Very good project
congratulations
Thanks!
You should use an alternator instead of a dc generator because the alernator is way more efficient and you can use a bridge rectifier to turn ac into dc.
As a concept - lab bench experiment it is a nice unit no doubt about it. That said , the electrical energy needed to pressurize the air is greater than the energy produced by the adapted automotive turbo-charger /turbine.
Regarding the Tcharger ..they are designed to spool up on pressurized oil, eventually the unit will fail if no pressure is created to create the pressurized pillow of oil inside which the shaft is rotating.
One quick way to produce that pressure is to use a relatively inexpensive OIL BURNER PUMP as found in residential heating , specifically the models that do not have a built in delayed oil nozzle valve . not that hard to get , the output to the bearings of the turbo is the nozzle output of the pump.
They are driven by the oil burner motors , USA manufacturers like Beckett or Carlin , rated at 120 volts 1/8 HP at roughly 3450 rpm directly through a 1/4 D shaped pump shaft coupled via a slip on coupling that is 3/8 D shaped at the motor shaft connection. They are also available in 1725 rpm versions .. do the math for which one is easier to step down from your turbo speed... yes the same shaft that turns the gen head would drive the pump.
These pumps have flange mounts and set screw mounts making them truly universal mount ..the good old days of standardization ... as opposed to the aggravation age , can`t do nothing with it must hack and sack to make it fit .These little pumps can achieve rock steady pressures of over 175 psi and flows of up to 3 GPH at the nozzle output port . The pressure output is fully adjustable bearing in mind that it affects the GPH a bit. They can be gravity fed or can lift oil in single suction line application up to 8 feet from a reservoir ...but for best result if lifting more than 5 feet , a return line configuration back to the reservoir is usually best by the simple insertion of a hex se screw in the appropriate passage . Install a pressure gauge where directed and off you go ...your turbo will be extremely happy with about 85 psi a little lower perhaps even at the full speeds you are achieving with its return line also draining back into the reservoir , what volume ? 1 quart of lubricant in a 2 quart reservoir is more tan enough if on the same level as the turbine .For lubrication you will need an oil that is similar to FUEL OIL ...aka DIESEL viscosity that is still be able to lube and pressurize the turbo and then a return it back to the oil reservoir .The automotive oil must be thinned because those pumps will require more than 1/8 horses to turn with say a straight W30 oil...however ...a mix of 60% automotive oil grade as specified for that turbocharger , mixed with 40% of the forever marvelous, MARVEL MYSTERY OIL in ruby red formulation from the auto parts store will work incredibly well , it will not need any more viscous formulations because you do not have 1600 plus degree exhaust coursing through that turbo ...from a good old fashioned 4 to 8 lungs IC MOTOR, or so it appears at least judging from the size of the TURBO .
The pump units are boxed with simple to follow instructions. There were many USA manufacturers making them but probably only one maker is still USA owned. For your convenience and plague like availability ,a French company owned and former USA brand called Sundstrand mini pump 3450 1/4 inch D section shaft, customarily found on Beckett oil burners made in Ridgeville OHIO will do quite well. You will have to under drive it from Turbine power take off shaft by using a belt driven pulley as you are currently doing with the generator head. Other brands include WEBSTER , GRUNDFOS , RIELLO ...Stick with the Sundstrand
There is no shortage of belts or pulleys for the application . In fact back in the 1950s there were a few domestic oil burners that used belt drives as opposed to direct shaft drive to make their burners more compact...an evolutionary dead end. This will help the turbine to spin more easily , faster and with considerably less drag.
The biggest problem you face ...is that the turbo is not particularly good for what you are doing with it , yes it spins and produces something or other ...but so could a rotary vane air motor ,more efficiently with greater torque and much easier to couple. Even a micro Tesla Bladeless disc steam turbine with an appropriately sized rotor would outperform the auto turbo with a fraction of the input . Setting aside the Tesla viscous disc turbine , it is all about blade design ...simply put a turbine blade spins under pressure impingement while producing the least amount of compression in its environment ..turbocharger impellers do just the opposite therefore require more input pressure in order to produce the same results that a true turbine of similar size can produce with less.
As a proof of concept bench experiment , yours is very nice ... too costly to operate for what it produces , if you want to make lots of usable VOLTS backed by lots of usable amps from steam , you must consider a different blade geometry device in order to achieve it.
As far as energy (pumping up the air compressor)...No engine in the world produces equal or more than it consumes. That would be perpetual motion.
As far as lubrication, I'm using gravity fed 90 weight gear oil. The unit does not run at the speed or temp of it's automotive design. The heavy viscosity compensates for the lack of pressure.
Tesla turbines only work in theory because they require more rpm than we can mechanically sustain. Tesla is my hero, but even he couldn't make it work like he wanted. They don't have any torque, and need to get up to around 300k rpm.
Thanks for the info on the oil pumps, and thanks for watching!
This isn't a tesla turbine but a modified version powered by a steam boiler m.czcams.com/video/ZvhmqVa4qpY/video.html
This is such a nice turbine set up. Really rooting for your set-up to produce some volts. We would love to try out something like that at our solar lab.
My friend and I are putting the final touches on a 10' diameter parabolic solar furnace. It's a repurposed retro tv dish with structural reinforcement added to base so we can safely use it as a solar lab to hook up various devices to, primarily steam powered, brewing, distilling, and some attempts at cooking too no doubt. We'll try to reverse engineer your setup in video. If you share links to the components you use that'd be a bonus of course.
Thanks! I've messed around with Fresnel lenses, but nothing on the scale you are doing. The turbo was just a cheap one I found on-line (just over $100), and same for the charge controller. The rest was just hand-made from raw materials. The only change since the vid is that I've switched to gears instead of the belt drive. Hoping to get my boiler done soon. That's when the real tests will occur.
Any updates? Boiler set up video coming?
Awesome can’t wait to see it completely done. Btw where did you get the turbos/ turbines at?
Thanks! It was basically the cheapest automotive turbo I could find on amazon.
@@gwseymour in my country its not cheap lol. i dont know why but yeah.
@@gwseymour _"It was basically the cheapest automotive turbo..."_
I was wondering where the turbine came from. I'm hoping you have posted a steam driven demonstration. I'm going to take a look through your channel.
@@awaitingthetrumpetcall4529 It came from Amazon. It's an automotive turbocharger. No steam yet...life's trials keep delaying me.
@@gwseymour Thanks for the quick response.
Yesterday I was trying to search for 'steam nozzles'. It's going to take some effort. I want to modify a pressure cooker with a copper tube and a nozzle to see how much steam pressure it will generate.
I'm taking this design and adding a solenoid actuated ball valve that uses voltage as the indicator of open/close
Very cool almost like a PT6 turbo prop engine thanks for sharing
Thanks for watching!
Was just thinking about your setup looks pretty awesome. Was wondering if you thought about installing a gearbox to the shaft like a 50:1 to further increase speed to generate more?
This is awesome, I would love to pick your brain about steam turbines if you have some time in the near future?
Certainly. infoglenwoodrd@gmail.com
Great I like the turbo more than the gas engine mod 😊
I am looking at solar steam 120 or 240 volts generator since I live in Mexico lots of sun here 😊
Way above my intellectual knowledge of this stuff but very glad I stumbled onto your video🇺🇸
Thanks!....Enjoy!
How's the new boiler coming along? Just checking to see if you've recovered from your back injury, hope all is well. 👍💛🙏
Thanks! Just waiting for cooler weather.
Hes like a magician with a screw driver.
Could you please create a detailed video on how to build this? How much PSI of compressed air were you running this with?
I think I was running about 70 psi. Sorry, I don't have a vid
maybe you know about this but an mppt sola charge controller can accept a a wider range of voltage input and then steps it down to what ever voltage is needed for the battery. for example my controllers can takes a max of 160v ocv and steps it down to nominal 48v battery. if i am using a 12 nominal battery it will allow me to use up to 80v ocv. from the input side. also there are mppt step up controllers, and i have one but havent worked with it much
I'm definitely using a cheap charge controller. Most don't "step down" as that requires a heat sink. Contrary to popular belief, your average charge controller (21 volt panel to 12 volt battery) charges at 21 volts. I don't know much about more complicated ones, so I'll take your word for it. Thanks for watching.
In my experience charge controllers do not work with alternators (voltagesource). Charge controller work with solar panels because they are current sources (not voltage sources).
Great build. Just other day a friend was pondering steam power generation. I thought despite having no knowledge that a car turbo with alternator having rectifier removed may be best viable solution with longevity. Now, so glad to find ur video. Do u have a web page guide with stats or any data as to steam flow rate, kpa consumption, etc. Thank you.
Nothing yet. Thanks!
I just noticed I'm building a steam engine based off of your video. And possibly adding a turbine because of your video
Enjoy!
Can change the hot side
Turbine to a Tesla turbine to spool faster and to create higher boost efficiently
Is this not just a modified turbocharger from a car?
Also whats the potential power output when using steam from a boiler?
This really interests me BTW...
Would love a response and maybe a video detailing the boiler...
Many thanks and keep up the good work 👍
Yes, the turbine itself is a modified automotive turbocharger. The available power will be relative to the steam pressure applied. At this point, I'm going to try and get 300 watts using the least amount of steam possible. Boiler construction will resume in the fall. Thanks for watching!
@@gwseymour can't wait for the next video!
I'm assuming this will be very high pressure steam? I've thought of ways to create a very efficient, heavily insulated, high pressure boiler and the various vessels I could use... Its all theory as I've not attempted anything practical but I settled on modifying a high pressure gas cylinder...
@@timsirege Thanks!
@@davidbent347 I'm hoping to run the turbine at less that 100 PSI. In regards to a boiler, there are many designs. Do a lot of research. The most important rule (there are many) is keeping the water level above the fire. In other words, don't let fire touch steel that doesn't have water behind it. The boiling water is your "coolant" that keeps the steel from weakening and deforming.
Fantastic work! Im considering replicating this, do you have an idea of what sort of sustainable wattage you would expect to get from this? Would be amazing to be able to charge a solar battery bank/tesla power wall up with one in a few hours. Solar power is a bit hitty miss where I come from!
Thanks. I expect 300 - 350 watts steady.
@@gwseymour you can run an inverter minisplit on 350 watts
How many amps are you kicking out? What about the corrosive nature of the moisture in the steam, does that have an impact on the turbine or are you running it through a dryer first?
From my testing, an appliance (or battery) can draw 25 amps @ 18 volts at 100 psi.
Very cool! You should try using a torque converter from a rwd car/truck.
Interesting. I get torque converters, but what do you mean by rwd? I've converted to gears since the vid, and I'm pleased with them,.
@@gwseymour Rwd is rear wheel drive. Hugh Strickland on CZcams built a similar setup to yours but with a torque converter instead of a turbo. If you cut open a converter you will find it has a impeller and a turbine.
@@bigbrotherfrank2960 Gotcha. I was thinking that you meant a mini one for power transmission. Interesting tho. Thanks!
I bet that setup would work great on a turbo furnace.
Like a turbo charged wood stove?
are you running that with static oil supply? that will kill the turbo pretty fast
Any heat you can add to the 'blue pipe' will help a bit.
In this case its your generator's waste heat. Possibly In a ramjet style/principle container.
What happens if the steam goes into the 'blue pipe'?
The air will cool the steam, but the increase in air temperature will expand it..?
Again a ram jet style/principle 'duct' may help more than one may think.
Actually, I'm trying to keep the blue pipe cold....thanks for the thoughts tho.
@@gwseymour Why? That's the opposite of how a turbo or jet engine works...
@@nevillecawood3727 Well, because it's not a turbo, gas turbine or jet. Other than the fact that it spins, they have nothing in common. Picture putting a vacuum cleaner on the tail end to assist with RPM's. That's the theory of super cooling the steam as it exits.
Did you say how many amps youre making?
Please, i need an update. How much flow and inlet pressure are you making to achieve what power?
I believe this is how we can extend the range of electric vehicles. Propane would be a practical, reliable fuel to run it. Hydrogen is not that cheap yet. Less would be required from the batteries. Trash trucks, county vehicles could charge themselves, while they are sitting in the yard. Any one with a solar/wind system could include this, with wood pellets as fuel. Everything I'm talking about is proven doable. We need cheap reliable options, no giant monopolies and energy competition. The goverment favors the opposite. Independence should be big business right now. The goverment is sacrificing people for the environment in Europe. They are freezing. We can't move heavy freight down the tracks on solar yet. That is a fantasy world. Real reliable power requires burning something.
Just got my turbocharger today. I already have a boiler. Just curious if you think I could just plum the steam into the line from the compressor side as it enters the steam side? Instead of drilling and tapping into the side of the cast iron.
You can go to my pg and see if you think my boiler will run it
Hey, dude, I need to power a boat with a turbine. Do you have any suggestions on how to spin a prop with something like that and are there some already manufactured items so I don't have to invent the wheel/turbine? I don't understand the pressure differential but this looks like an exceptionally efficient design. I'd love to be able to make a steam ship that could blast across the Carribean.
We've been discussing the boat, so you're right on time. We are leaning towards turbine / electric for more flexibility. After this project is complete (300 watts of battery charging power), we are moving to the boat. As far as the pressure differential...place your hand over the intake of a vacuum cleaner. Notice how the vacuum motor speeds up? You've reduced the atmospheric density that it has to spin in. Same principle with super condensing the steam after it's done spinning the turbine blade tips ( I hope).
@@gwseymour I hate electric things. I never understood them even though I bought books On it. I'd like to just have a reduction gear spinning the prop shaft and a reverse gear. The simpler the better. Something I can fix in the third world. I like the few moving parts of a turbine. No flywheel, piston, valves and actuator rods. It looks more compact too.
@@jukeboxhero1649 The turbine is definitely superior. Still deciding on the turbine drive or turbine/electric for the boat. The challenges are as you described regarding props, etc. It leads one to a pre-designed boat drive that's already been engineered (and has a reverse). If you want you can e-mail me, and I'll keep you posted on idea exchanges as we move forward. infoglenwoodrd@gmail.com
@@gwseymour I'm so hacked I can't get into my own email. I need to make a new one. You could become very wealthy in less than a year with that turbine running a generator. If you look at Brown Steam Engines of Springfield, Missouri he cannot even keep one of his engines on the floor. Every engine he builds is already spoken for and his are piston. That cannot be as efficient as what you have. I really think you nailed it with a turbine.
@@jukeboxhero1649 Thanks. Got your email and responded....hope it went thru...
Brilliant! Thank you for sharing!
Thanks!
Hello gwseymour.
Where did you inject the air into the turbo, did you drilled an extra hole into the turbine?
Yes. In the exhaust housing.
I came to see the magic screwdriver! 😮
Lol....it's addictive...
0:10 I know witch craft when I see it sir
This is sorcery!! Teach me your floating spell now!!
I thought I replied earlier, but now I don't see it. Grab a screwdriver and an air compressor, and you'll have it down in no time!
Yea yea i saw your earlier reply in my inbox. But it's missing here somehow. Well i guess thts some....unexplained youtube sorcery... Lol
Compounding turbo's would be interesting.
Indeed....I tried to keep it simple.
@@gwseymour 🤣MB I didn't mean to sound like this wasn't interesting, I only meant it would be interesting to find out how compounding would respond because unless I'm thinking wrong you could spin up just a cold side on one and possibly run a small genset/motor off the removed/unneeded hot side housing meaning (again, if thinking right) you can step up or down in the size of the second modified turbo which would be even colder airflow yet on the second one as well. Would also be interesting to see what going from big to small to big to small to big to small etc. etc. etc. would do because the small ones in that series would be really zinging I believe (or I could just be crazy since I'm half asleep right now 😂).
@@510Redneck Thoughts are always appreciated! If you have access to some old turbos give it a whirl!
I’m going to be finished soon with a wood stove heating water, similar to your boiler. I was going to use it for heat and heating water but it’s summer now so I’m thinking to optimize it for heating water. I imagine I can make a lot of steam with it, it’s a high temperature rocket stove. I don’t know if it’s worth it to try to generate electricity with the steam
Sounds like a great stove. Do lots of research on high pressure steam before embarking on adapting your stove to create or contain it.
Proof that screw drivers become weightless in the presence of compressed air!!
Only when you set them to "Airplane Mode"
Wow! Impressive!
Thanks!
What did you have to do to convert the turbo to steam? I'm in the process of building a burner, boiler and engine and possibly a turbine
It's too long a long process to explain in a comment, but experiment around with a turbo and an air hose and you'll see the effects.
Did you finish the work to re-weld the boiler yet?
No, I had a bad back injury last winter. Now it's getting too hot again in Florida. Sorry for the delay...
What size is your air injector and what pressure did you run for this test.
What is your turbo inlet size an what steam pressure does it need to produce the same power (noting that steam has 3 X the power of air)?
The injector is 1/8 inch. Iused 70 psi air in the vid. Th turbo inlet is about 65mm. I haven't finished my boiler yet, but the steam prassure will vary depending on the amp (load) being drawn.
@@gwseymour do you have a drawing or specs on your turbo to subshaft coupler design and your bearing block components
You mentioned a previous trial without the compressor turbine wheel was that a success that is the what I am considering.
I am using you inspiration to try and generate power with my pulse detonation engine with water injection (to flash to steam) .
@@gwseymour is you 1/8 injector directed at the vanaes through housing or jost going into the inlet.?
@@Graemecns The injector is directed sideways at the vanes. Just play around without the housing, using an air hose to find your best angle. For the coupling, I replaced the end nut with 2 standard nuts (reverse thread) a deep well socket slides over these, creating a loose tolerance. The socket is pressed into a shaft. Here's a link to the first unit charging some batteries czcams.com/video/BwsyxRz_eXs/video.html
What would it cost to make? And what the load and duration at a time. I'm talking No of TVs, AC units etc. I will not understand kilowatts or that kinda term. Not that smart.
Doesnt the air negate the vacum effect of the condensing steam? Wouldnt it be better to have it run through a condensor and have the air blow over it? Or just get rid of the compressor entirely.
All the questions I had (have). I've experimented excessively, and I'll share my results as they happen. First, the "compressor" is not compressing like an auto turbine. The air flows freely. Using air tests only, it seems to add exactly what it steals (math). This leads to the conclusion that it will assist in super contracting the steam on the tail end. There is no question that will be beneficial to the turbine performance. I wish my boiler was ready. Thank you so much for the observations and thoughts.
Is there something like this but much more quiet?
What was the air psi required to run to get your 300 watts? Great project! Looking forward to updates of any kind ❤️
Thanks! I haven't pulled any amps yet, because my new boiler isn't done. So, while I hope to get 300 watts, I'm not going to try until I have steam. In the vid, I think I used about 70 psi air to spin it up to 18 volts. Steam is way more powerful.
@@gwseymour hi, when are u going to make video about it. Would love to see it.
@@hurvinekspejbl6229 Thanks. I'm getting there. Other things in life came up....
What type of centrifugal compressor is that? Does it have a model number and brand? Need help for I am trying to build one.
It's just a cheap generic automotive turbo for a 2.5 liter. Amazon.
@@gwseymour thank you for the reply. Hope more power to you sir ☺️
Hi! How goes work on the project?
Lubrication? Water/oil cooled?
The lubrication is 90 weight gear oil. The unit operates at much lower speeds an temps than automotive use. The heavy oil "simulates" the normal pressurization, and allows the shaft floats nicely.
cool trick, what is this brenouilli equation at work?
I think a little more of the Coanda effect. Thanks for watching!
did you get this finished?? im intrested to know the end result
Not yet...too much going on.
Did you record a video with steam?
Not yet....life getting in the way.
So… where are you at with this?
Other than replacing the belt with gears, it's pretty much the same. Too many other things going on right now....
The magnets in that motor are fixed, they are fixed to the case
Yes Sir. I got it backwards narrating, and didn't want to remake the vid....lol. The idea is the same....
Very nice, any idea on the turbine efficiency?
Thanks! Not until I get some real steam thru it!
@@gwseymour Roger that, will follow your progress. Interested in making an exhaust captures steam turbine for my boat and wondering what realistic efficiencies are. I can't be bothered with reciprocating engine - too many moving parts
@@N330AA That's exactly where this project is headed. Considering a turbine/electric pontoon boat. That's the platform needed to support the wood / boiler / batteries. In theory, one could travel endlessly, if there's enough wood along the shore (we have plenty along the St. John's River in Florida). I should have had my boiler completed, but suffered a back injury. I have found turbines to be far superior. They are cleaner, smoother, and just plain fun. Reciprocating engines have a nostalgic sound, but once you've spooled up a turbine, you'll never go back.
@@gwseymour For sure, you can't beat the noise. Ok mate, i have subscribed to your channel! That's a very interesting project indeed.
Where did you get the turbine? What motor/generator you used?
The turbine and Gen were from Amazon. The gen is a 350 watt scooter motor.
@@gwseymour thanks, I've failed to find any steam turbine on Amazon, do you have the name of the product page you've bought?
@@SchioAlves I'm sorry, I wasn't clear. The turbine is an automotive turbocharger that has been converted.
How many Litres of steam at what pressure is required to get it to 12V?
It depends on the load. It would take about 50 psi free wheeling. I was using 70 for the vid, but didn't get anywhere near "full throttle".
can you use a silencer type nozzle on the air exit? it makes the noise reduce if ever.
You could house the whole unit in a box, but don't want to restrict the exhaust in any way.
Have you ever built any Tesla turbines?
No....but one day. It is my understanding they need to reach insane rpm's to become effective. I am a huge Tesla fan, tho.
@@gwseymour it’s pretty awesome what you’ve made here with this car turbo though!
And yeah I’ve seen many people try to make them and just spin them fast and they don’t work. But fortunately the too high of rpm is not an issue actually because, despite what’s claimed over and over again by many people on the interwebs, Tesla turbines work fine, get plenty of torque and output power at low RPMs.
I’ve got some copy pasta 🍝 of mine that I’ll share with ya here to explain more.
Tesla turbines aren’t made efficient by spinning really fast.
That’s only for when the disc stack is being used as a centrifugal pump, because ALL centrifugal pumps’ compressors, performance is tip speed dependent.
But spinning the turbine fast will produce a centrifugal head that opposes the incoming fluid flow, reducing the pressure gradient across the nozzle, reducing fluid final velocity, reducing mass flow rates through the nozzle and ultimately reducing power out.
Furthermore the faster you spin them the faster the fluid you have has to go just to still be moving faster than the discs and still provide torque.
Lastly, they work just fine for industrial use too, despite people saying they can’t scale up in size but they actually can scale up just fine because the torque on the discs is proportional to the difference in the fluid speed and the disc speed.
So the disc tip speed is the important factor here.
For any given fluid supply in the nozzle will have a max fluid velocity.
So the turbine disc tips will have a max speed set at that fluid speed irrelevant if radius.
Now considering that centripetal force is proportional to V^2/R, if you keep the tip speed the same but increase the radius the centripetal forces on the disc for the speeds needed will actually decrease.
Again despite what MANY have claimed about the Tesla turbine, it does not need to be spun fast to work or work efficiently.
TesTurs are made efficient when the slip on the discs is reduced and spinning the discs fast does nothing to reduce the slip, only increase the distance the fluid slips on the disc faces, which is by definition “loss”.
Listen to what Tesla himself said in the patents of how to make them work.
“Owing to a number of causes affecting the performance, it is difficult to frame a precise rule which would be generally applicable, but it may be stated that within certain limits, and other conditions being the same, the torque is directly proportionate to the square of the velocity of the fluid relatively to the runner and to the effective area of the disks and, inversely, to the distance separating them.
The machine will, generally, perform its maximum work when the effective speed of the runner is one-half of that of the fluid; but to attain the highest economy, the relative speed or slip, for any given performance, should be as small as possible.
This condition may be to any desired degree approximated by increasing the active area of and reducing the space between the disks.”
1) increase the speed of the fluid relative to the disc, (not increase disc speed)
2) increase surface area
3) decrease disc spacing This is how you actually make a TesTur work. Not by spinning it fast.
The fluid interactions with the disc that govern efficiency an torque are adhesion and cohesion. Full stop.
And spinning fast does nothing to increasing either to increase the turbines isentropic efficiency.
This is why everyone who chases rpm with the TesTur just flat out fails.
They aren’t even trying to design them properly so of course they won’t work.
@@gwseymour You just have to know how to design it correctly to actually reduce slip to make them work, not spin them fast.
The only reason people think Tesla turbines have to be spun too fast is because EVERYONE has mistaken the part of the patent that is about the turbine being used as a pump as being about it being used as a drive turbine.
The only time you want to spin a TesTur fast is when it’s being used as a pump/compressor.
This is because ALL centrifugal pumps’/compressors’ performance is tip speed dependent.
“I have found that the quantity of fluid propelled in this manner, is, other conditions being equal, approximately proportionate to the active surface of the runner and to its effective speed. For this reason, the performance of such machines augments at an exceedingly high rate with the increase of their size and speed of revolution.” -Nikola Tesla
And again, you DO NOT want to spin too fast in a TesTur because the centrifugal head will just counter your incoming fluid flow reducing power.
And the faster you spin discs, you’re fluid has to be going even that much faster just to be able to apply a torque on the disc face.
“Still another valuable and probably unique quality of such motors or prime movers may be described. By proper construction and observance of working conditions the centrifugal pressure, opposing the passage of the fluid, may, as already indicated, be made nearly equal to the pressure of supply when the machine is running idle. If the inlet section be large, small changes in the speed of revolution will produce great differences in flow which are further enhanced by the concomitant variations in the length of the spiral path. A self-regulating machine is thus obtained bearing a striking resemblance to a direct-current electric motor in this respect that, with great differences of impressed pressure in a wide open channel the flow of the fluid through the same is prevented by virtue of rotation. Since the centrifugal head increases as the square of the revolutions, or even more rapidly, and with modern high grade steel great peripheral velocities are practicable, it is possible to attain that condition in a single stage machine, more readily if the runner be of large diameter. Obviously this problem is facilitated by compounding, as will be understood by those skilled in the art. Irrespective of its bearing on economy, this tendency which is, to a degree, common to motors of the above description, is of special advantage in the operation of large units, as it affords a safeguard against running away and destruction. Besides these, such a prime mover possesses many other advantages, both constructive and operative. It is simple, light and compact, subject to but little wear, cheap and exceptionally easy to manufacture as small clearances and accurate milling work are not essential to good performance. In operation it is reliable, there being no valves, sliding contacts or troublesome vanes. It is almost free of windage, largely independent of nozzle efficiency and suitable for high as well as for low fluid velocities and speeds of revolution.” -Nikola Tesla
Tesla both knew it wasn’t meant to spin fast and that it worked great for low speeds IF you design it correctly.
@@CharlieSolis Thanks! I would still submit that HP is always a result of RPM. Any type of power extraction (mechanical, electromagnetic, etc.) creates a load, which reduces RPM. The more initial rpm you have, the greater the resistance to reduction under a given load (due to an increase in HP). I am going to build one someday, but I anticipate some tinkering. Thanks for the input.
@@gwseymour hey thanks for replying. So when doing electricity generation the rpm is always kept constant. And when using turbines there is no need for a flywheel type storage because there is no pulsed torque input that needs to be smoothed out, like with piston engines or pulsed combustion engines.
When operating using a dynamic load one does not rely on the turbines kinetic energy to resist changes in rpm/voltage output.
If the rpm drops even a little the throttle should automatically open up and admit more motive fluid.
Power = Torque * RPM / 5252
Therefore when doing electricity generation, the rpm is always kept constant because voltage output always supposed to remain constant and is dependent upon the turbine/generator RPM.
So if the load increases, the turbine momentarily slows down just the slightest bit because of the increase in resistance in load, but then the throttle opens up to admit more fluid to output more torque to get more power out for the same RPM, that counters the increase in load.
If you look at all the old pictures of teslas turbine, specifically the one in the museum that everyone has seen, the big ol’ system of valve and pipes above the turbine is pneumatic throttle regulator that operates off the peripheral pressure in the turbine. Because centrifugal head increases at a rate of RPM^2, or even faster, tiny changes in rpm once at speed have great differences in peripheral pressures.
So when the load is applied and the turbine momentarily slows down the periphery pressure drops and pressure drop in the piston throttle regulator causes the spring to over come it and it opens up the throttle letting more motive fluid in. When the load is dropped and the rpm wants to jump up real fast the peripheral pressure jumps real fast before much change in the rpm and the piston throttle regulator begins to close off the throttle again.
So how do you couple the shaft to the turbine?
I replaced the turbine nut with 2 reverse thread hexagonal nuts. A deep well socket is then press fit into the PTO shaft. The socket slides over the nuts with just enough clearance to accommodate flexing. Kind of like a mini u-joint.
Will it be possible to buy it from you?
That's very flattering, but it really isn't time tested. I suffered a back injury in the fall, which kept me from completing my new boiler.
Now make the steam with hydrogen
where can i find turbine like this one ?
The core is a generic automotive turbo (for a 2.5 liter 4 cylinder) that was bought on Amazon.
@@gwseymour quick question say for example i have 2Kw electric motor how do how i calculate how much PSI or bar i need to fully turn the motor ? 🧐
@@incodewetrust8862 I wish I had a formula. I can say that you need approximately 1 HP per 750 watts. With steam, your HP will depend on PSI / RPM.
Whats gonna be your steam source? solar collectors? would make sense in florida
Was planning on getting my new boiler done this winter, but injured my back...so it's going to be a bit.
@@gwseymour So a boiler? natural gas I suppose?
@@JuanSanchez-rb4qu Boiler, when my back heals.
Please tell me rated power on generator and inlet and outlet pressure of steam required?
I haven't run it on steam yet. Hoping for 300 - 350 watts at 50 - 70 PSI. The DC motor is 350 watts. Thanks for watching. When my new boiler is done, I'll be posting the test vids with more data to share.
@@gwseymour thank you
Can't you make it more quiet?
You could enclose it in a shed.... I like the sound.
Magnus and Coenda effects.
Yes Sir!
Great idea! How is the project going and have you already started on the boiler? Maybe it's an idea to make it a closed loop system with a heat exchanger.
Personally I like the idea of using water under a vacuüm, so that it boils far lower than 100°C and you don't have the danger of high pressures.. Do you think this will work also with a turbo charger?
Thanks! It's finally cooling off here, and I'm looking at my boiler parts / welder/ etc. As far as boiling the water in a vacuum? Consider that upon release, it's subject to ambient PSI, thereby neutralizing the gain? I get the "closed loop" part of that....not shooting down your idea... just thinking of fabrication realities. I'm exhausted from another project as I respond, so don't let your mind stop working...good thoughts.
Even if the system is sealed at low pressure I think that the steam released from the water will bring the pressure back up. But I guess if you have a large condenser it will work. Just keep in mind that the steam efficiency goes up with pressure difference, and at relatively low pressures a large difference will be hard to create.
@@Weirdomanification Yess. But I think the real problem with a closed loop system on an automotive turbocharger is the oil bearings. These work under oil pressure. Under a vacuüm or even a closed loop system under pressure. The oil can not fall in a 'pressureless chamber' and not rely on gravity to be pumped back to the bearings..
@@Weirdomanification Thanks for the thoughts!
it's magic!
...and fun!
Interesting is it a 2 stage configuration? I think Direct drive whoud be better but hay it's working man , congratulations 🎉👏
It is not a 2 stage. After the vid, I switched the belt to gears. This particular gen requires the reduction.
@@gwseymour anyway nice work man it's a inspirational video 😁 I can see this thing running on Tesla supper heated steam boiler/steam thrower ( it's basically a burner inside a tube surrounded by a mini boiler en after the steam is mixed whit the exhaust gases en them is it supposed to go inside a turbine or engine of some kind
@@oscarverwey Thanks for the thoughts!
@@oscarverwey fancy seeing you here.
How do we get ahold of you?
infoglenwoodrd@gmail.com
Where will the water exit?
Out of the exhaust.
@@gwseymour legal steam is up to 150psi , but turbos are usually used 8-30ish psi, do you have a boost gauge pressure gauge ? I am looking to distill water from a natural source with heat from a constant source that will generate electricity and this seems like the water might remain clean out the exhaust unlike steam engines.
@@David_Mash Well, the steam picks up a small amount of turbine oil that gets past the journal bearings. Also, at the end of each run, a blast of protective oil needs to be introduced thru the intake so that the whole thing doesn't rust up. As far as the psi, the unit is based on an automotive turbo, but doesn't work like one. The power is derived from an injector on the exhaust end, and not from overall flow.
How much PSi?
I haven't run it on steam yet, but I recall using about 70psi air in the vid. Thanks for watching!
Whoooo. yes!!!!
It's even better in person. Hang on for the hook up to real steam. Thanks for watching!
We would love to work with you!
I'm not sure what you mean.
its hilarious how something that could change people lives and lift them out of poverty is just some blase tinker project for you
what pressure do u use and how big is your boiler
I hope to run at 50-70 psi. I'll rate the boiler when it's finished. Thanks for watching!
@@gwseymour thx for reply good luck on your technical adventures
@@gwseymour Coud you make a air coupling not mechanical one? Similar how torque converters work
@@dukenukem8381 Well, torque converters are full of non-compressible fluid, and are solidly fixed between the engine and transmission. So the answer is I don't think so. Thanks for watching and contemplating, tho!
@@gwseymour you can checkout t 80 tank transmission , they use a type of air coupling transmisson
It looks like a buggy- or VR game 😂
Can you build me one :)
Well thanks for the compliment, but I'd certainly want to get all the bugs out, and test the longevity before I built one for someone else.
Junk. You could have saved time and resources if you just read a book on steam turbines.
Pake uap
Saya akan. Terima kasih
300 hp
Next...steam powered Jet Ranger!
Nyemprot
Trust in the LORD of lords Jesus Christ Forever Amen.
Thanks!
Don't show us your stunts🙄
Well....I had just learned that a great childhood mentor had passed. He's the one who first showed that to me. In hindsight, perhaps the "stunt" was a bit long, but it was my way of memorializing him.
What would it cost to make? And what the load and duration at a time. I'm talking No of TVs, AC units etc. I will not understand kilowatts or that kinda term. Not that smart.
What would it cost to make? And what the load and duration at a time. I'm talking No of TVs, AC units etc. I will not understand kilowatts or that kinda term. Not that smart.
It cost about $400. It's intended to charge 12 volt batteries, that would then be used thru an inverter to run appliances. The amount of batteries would dictate the charge time, and what you could run.