Renault Alpine GTA Turbo - Why Great Cars Don't Always Sell
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- čas přidán 12. 05. 2024
- Faster, Lighter and Cheaper that its competitors from Porsche..and better to drive, the Alpine GTA still sold in tiny numbers. Today I find out why...
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Probably one of the most underrated CZcams channels ever IMO.
Can't agree more.
why is that
I had one from new, living in France in the 80s, chosen over a Porsche 911. It was very comfortable and quiet over long distances, very quick, especially for the time and good fun to drive. Some care was needed in the rain. The stereo was memorably good. All in all, a great car. (No rattles at all).
I bought one new in 1988. Sold it 3 years later with 77k on the clock. Loved lt. Red black leather, graphic equaliser and volume control on the steering wheel.
Didn't like driving it much then !!! lol
Your pronunciation of "Grand Tourisme Alpine" wasn't terrible at all. In fact, it was almost perfect.
'Wimbledon' was a bit trickier!
😂😂😂@@samurai-capybara
@@samurai-capybara 😉
Agreed 👍
English pronunciation:
"Gr-Rand Tour-Ris-Me Al-Pine" 😛
I love the dashboard not because it's such a well thought out layout as you'd find in a BMW of that period but because it gives of that nostalgic 80s vibe that we had somehow arrived in the future.
We should have stopped time in the 80s 🥰
@@meersau5690 What a great thought. In a way that’s what I did having left the UK in 1987 and only returning for a handful of visits since, the last time being over 20 years ago. No doubt I’d be shocked to see how things are these days.
I think you're right Jack, selling it as a Renault was a big marketing mistake, when you're going up against a Porsche.
they could have sold it as Facel Alpine
Glorious and way more interesting than a 911.
For those doubting the looks, have a look at the very last of these - the A610.
Wonderful.....
I remember Performance Car did a head-to-head between the Renault GTA V6 Turbo and the Renault 5 GT Turbo and listed the various predictable comparisons between the 2 cars. The R5 GT Turbo did a very good job of keeping up, but the author was completely bowled over by the GTA V6 Turbo. He said something on the lines of "it deserves to be a world class seller".....I then cut out the pictures and put them all on my bedroom wall! 👍
Probably one of the most underrated cars ever IMO.
A few years ago, whilst crossing the Jura, I was lucky enough to witness well over 100 French Alpine Club members racing around the hairpins on route to Geneva. One had to be there to appreciate, but it was quite a spectacle particularly on such a challenging road.
The PRV is basically a V8 with 2 cylinders cut off. That's also why the block angle is not classic V6 and the ignition sequence is a weird odd-fire. Not every mechanic made the genuine effort to understand it.
Fun fact: Volvo re-developed and refined the PRV for the 960 and 780 in which case it was renamed B280F. Power was 20hp more then the old B28.
It i remember correctly the GTA Turbo also uses this improved PRV block design.
I actually came very close to buying one. But altho these cars have a fibreglass body they do have a backbone chassis ( a bit like Lotus? ) and these chassis can and do rust!
So, to prospective buyers, beware and have an inspection done by an Alpine specialist. Well worth it!
Fun fact that hardly anybody knows: when Alfa Romeo needed an engine for their 155Ti DTM race car they realised that the Busso wasn't ideal for the task but the PRV V6 WAS! Not really surprising because the block was a fully alu-alloy casting and the block angle was wide so there was a LOT of space for a generous intake plenum and runners and the angle from the heads into header exhaust manifolds was also good. In the AR 155ti application the PRV was extremely succesful in the hands of Nicola Larini.
Another succesful PRV application was in the MVS Venturi. Another french sportscar, more upmarket (competition for the V8 Ferrari's) and i think some faster models used twin turbo's. They also raced them at LeMans.
Look at that interior! Look at that switch gear! Ugh, gorgeous.
Love it!
Dat french quirkyness, eh
Fab
Not to take the spot light off the Renault, but that group of Ferraris you passed at 7:02 was NUTS!!
Oh my, this IS a surprise!!
Thanks so much Jack, for featuring one of my all time favourites!
Greetings from the Netherlands
Absolutely love this, looks fantastic, rarity.
I’ve never driven one but as an ex-Porsche technician, I know the Porsche range inside out, I can say that the Carrera 3.2 quality of build or driving dynamics are not all they’re cracked up to be…
That might be the best sounding V6 I've ever heard 🥴
Apart from Busso engined Alfa Romeo
you should hear My Na BOA with a full stainless system at full chat
Evor 400/410 would blow it to bits sound wise.. honda nsx at full chat ? U have been living under a rock pal 😂😂😂😂
Volkswagen VR6?
I'd say quite good sounds due to the turbo, the NA version doesn't sound great. Certainly not on the level of 12V Busso or Dino V6
When I want to relax I watch this channel. It has this sweet space around it.
I have never heard a PRV engine sound like it does in this video. Kinda cool. Actually sounds a bit like an inline 5 at some moments in the video...
Mine sounded exactly the same. The 2.5 V6 is in a Odd-fire configuration. So different to the 2.7 and 2.8 versions.
@@dj_paultuk7052that explains why is has a bit of a VR6 type sound to it whereas the 2.7 sounded more like a regular V6
This has a even fire crank the normal had the Boxer like crank
Yes, great sounding engine. With the turbo just in the background. Wonderful.
@@matthpotte It does sound a lot like a VR6!
Epic car! imagined being wealthy businessman in 1985 driving around this GTA in la Defence in Paris playing Jean Michel Jarre Zoo Look album🎉
I'd prefer Oxygene, but I get your point. Either way it would be fantastic!
Back in the late eighties, I was working for Renault UK. I drove quite a few of these cars. Once you got used to them, they were a great, surprisingly fast, agile car. I have carried 2 adults in the rear seats, albeit not for many miles. They are still surprisingly inexpensive. Non Turbo versions, which are still a good car, are very good value. There is an excellent specialist, Alpine Renault Restoration, run by Paul Sage. His late father Jean Sage, who I met a few times, was the Renault Sporting Director.
I’ve had two GTA’s and I loved both of them. The first was an ‘86 sold new here in New Zealand. The second was a 1990 which was badged as an Alpine (after the Talbot/Chrysler trade mark expired). The steering rack is straight out of a Fuego, so interesting you felt it steered well. Also the brakes are the same size front and rear and straight off an R30. One of the most disconcerting aspects is the bizarre ‘chine walk’ they do at higher motorway speed - a distinct movement from side to side that you have to power through. Another issue is the rear tyres that are unique to the car - still available from Michelin Heritage. Would I have another today? - ABSOLUTELY!
Snap!
Outstanding! Good of you to review one of my favorite cars, Perhaps, my absolute favorite French classic of the era. As a teenager in the USA, I wouldn't have typically known about Alpine-Renault 310 series, but because of a family friend who was a well-heeled connoisseur and collector I happened to get to know a pair of them quite well. They were a very early A310, with the 6 headlights under glass, and a later series model (directly preceding the one driven here) in white. This gentleman had imported them via gray market, at a non-trivial expense. The newer of the two had the flared wheel arches, deep dish Gotti modular wheels, and an integrated spoiler on the rear deck. Both were spirited rides and the older one of the pair was the first truly "exotic" car I'd ever been in, having been profoundly changed by a ride its owner took me on at the age of 9, shortly after it arrived in the states. It even had an on-board cellular phone, which I (of course) used to call my Mom, at home, excitedly reporting on the whole experience. This was probably 1979 or '80. Your review reminded me of these fond memories. As an aside, regarding your comment about Hoovie, I suspect that given his age and locale, he wouldn't have known how much of a parts bin special the GTA's interior was and, compared to its American "peers", its aesthetic probably seemed retro-futuristic and posh in spite of that. This is merely speculation but seems a reasonable assumption. Anyway, love the channel, do keep up the good work 27! Cheers!
I think this car - while not really admired when new - will go down as one of the most uniquely and interestingly designed cars ever, and may even end up being timeless inside and out, in the same way Mies Van Der Rohe architecture is timeless.
200BHP was a lot of power in the 1980s. Family cars were more like 90BHP.
And also cars of today weigh 40-50% more than their '80s counterparts so the difference in performance isn't even close to as big as youngsters today like to think.
Always drooled over Alpine cars. My favourite was the A610 turbo.
Great video Jack.
Aren’t the A610 and the Renault GTA the same car?
Not quite - the A610 came after and was an evolution of the GTA.
The majority of the car was new, with a more powerful 3.0 engine and a wider track. @@neilturner6749
@@neilturner6749 Not exactly. Of Course, the A610 is inspired by the GTA, but it's another car with increased performance
The A610 was very much evolved from the GTA. Same basic design and layout. New panels all round, except the doors, I think. Improved weight distribution, larger engine (3.0 instead of 2.5). Pop up headlights, and many other changes. It sold even less well! And I have one.
@@andrewberridge4630 Congratulations! My dream is to own one soon... And I have worked on it 😉
Nobody notice the FERRARI’s???? 2 275GTB’s and what looks like a 330GTC??? Holy shit!! Jack!! Pull over!
Theyve probably broken down 😂
That was the camera team of Jack :-)
7:03
I was looking for this comment.
Is it all the various CZcams spanners waiting to rip along the piece of road we all know Harry Metcalfe uses for his road tests? 😎
I remember back in the day that performance car magazine would always rate the A610 (facelift one of these) in their top performance cars. They loved it
those who want also buy..... it is very popular in Europe... it is a collector's car... for people who have 5 or more cars, then this will be the right one
Microsoft Windows is the most UNpopular operating system in the world - but it is the most widely installed... 🤓
Well said.
Why?? Gamers use Windows a lot.. no?
@@Jason.cbr1000rr because it is the most installed system - but that still does not make it popular...
It's the most widely installed desktop operating system.
If you take into account non-desktop systems (phones, routers, IOT devices etc), then Linux is the most widely used, by some margin.
Which makes it the most popular...do not mistake popular with hated.
Always wanted my dad to get one of these. To 8 year old me, the Renault Alpine GTA was a spaceship. I had a poster of a metallic blue turbo on my bedroom wall for years.
Not sure that the 911 is more conventionally pretty, it's just more familiar... Good review, Jack, on another oddball car. Keep them coming
Pretty sure the market has determined that the 911 is as ‘conventionally pretty’ as they come. This thing…yikes. A complete hodge podge of other cars.
@@f.kieranfinney457 911's appeal to some. Not to me. Not the older ones certainly.
Fabulous car very underrated, Renault like Ford have a great racing history and many other cars had a Renault engine, like Lotus, De Lorean.
I’d take one just to be different.
Fantastic review of this glorious and much underrated sports car! Dare to be different anyone? At the present value and prices, I belive there's never been a better time to own one. Congratulations - and thanks - to Greg!
Also, in my opinion, a car - a giant slayer - was released that made such an impact it questioned spending so much more for anything else! The Ford Sierra Cosworth. It really was a game changer.
Thanks again Jack. An excellent review for such a special car.
P.S. So cool you drove past two Ferrari 275GTBs and a 250GT Convertible etc,. saw them yet didn't bat an eyelid!!
Speedo's having a day off so we know it's French.
I noticed that.. it's probably on strike
But at least it is running on a day that ends in "Y" so you know it isn't British.
@@williamegler8771 Fair.
I've got the same problem in my Japanese car, but you could argue that Nissan kind of became a bit of Renault later.
@@anthonydeas2173 It's so weird to me that the French get flak for wanting better conditions for themselves and opposing government tyranny.
We could learn a lot from them.
I love that you get a hold of this kind of thing. Haven't seen one of these for years! In most of the drive-by shots, when you talk about stability, I can see the poise and control it has. I've watched scores and scores of you vids, and you can visually perceive that this was very composed on the bends!
Nice one.....keep em coming
Used to own a 610 turbo back in ‘93. Lovely blue colour. I think there were only 12 registered in the UK that year. It was my company car and my fellow director had one in the same colour. We put them together and I reckon that was a one off. When I filled up with petrol nobody knew what it was. I remember that spares were always a problem. Loved it though.
I liked the GTAs but think the 610s were a step up plus the pop-up headlights ofcourse !
@@michaelbarton4787 They were undoubtedly a step up as you say and personally I really liked the revised styling. They were also badged as an Alpine not a Renault which I think was classier.
A very elegant, sophisticated sports car it probably didn't sell well in the UK because it was too noble and too French in appearance for the masses. It really deserved to sell a lot better in the UK. The general public forgets that Renault competes in Formula 1 and has a rich pedigree heritage in hot hatches that very few manufacturers can match!
My late uncle had a 310, this one here and then the wonderful looking LeMans with 250 PS. I always loved these cars and they were terribly underrated
mR 27,youve outdone yourself and before long the rest of the online community will catch on and then subs will skyrocket ,such a beautiful car filmed in a gorgeous setting 10/10
Yes. Yes yes. I remember it advertised in mt dad's car magazines I read as a kid. Loved the looks... That dash I thought was pure future in the 80's
Great, honest review! Now you can review my A610, when it's roadworthy again. I'm hoping that will be later this year. I'll be in touch!
TY Jack 🙏🙏! Remember seeing my first one when they were new. I knew most cars, but thought 'what was that', it looked like a space ship! Still only seen a few decades since.
This is one of my personal favorite cars! I wish more people remembered it.
I love all the Alpines. The new one should have been made rear engined too.
They are !
This lump was longitudinal, the A110 NG is transverse but still central rear 😅
Remember years ago in a magazine they had a limited edition le mans version sort of metallic purple colour absolutely beautiful.
Beautiful car from every angle. We had a lot of Renaults in Argentina (built there) but never one of these. Thanks I enjoy watching.
I've never seen one of these before, but I kept being reminded of the Starion.
Wow! I have never heard a PRV V6 sound that good! Really cool car!
Great review… quick and to the point…without leaving out important info😊
Awesome stuff as always Jack buddy 👍
Great review...Saw this at a Renault Garage in the West end back in the 80's and it was the most beautiful car that I as a teenager had seen in a metallic white, sort of sparkled...Would love to get one now...
Oh I love these! great episode Jack
Great test drive Jack, always thought an underrated car. I was a RAC patrol in the 80's, working in a posh part of London and was sent out to a Renault Alpine on the morning after the great October storm of 1987. A tree had come down and completely squashed it. I felt for the owner as nothing could be done for days as the storm had ruined any chance of anything being done quickly.
Nice exhaust setup, sounds like a right beast!
That sounds really sweet 😁
Excellent choice Jack!
Excellent vid. Thank you very much.
My old boss had one of these as a weekend car. I had a go on a few occasions as he used to let us drive his cars. Fantastic thing.
Love it! Sounds much better than my father- in-law's Renault 9 AT.... Same speedo problem, must be a 1985 thing.
I'm excited to see this video, given I just saw my very first Renault Alpine on Saturday.
My extra firm High School French teacher would approve your effort. Not sure why or even when I saw my 1st but I have been an Alpine fan for decades. I have 2 RC cars with Alpine A110 bodies and will continue to enjoy those.
Thank you for this video! Fun facts about this car: 1. It was driven by the main antagonist in El Dorado! 2. They had an awesome Desert Raid buggy version!
Wow !! Learned a lot from this video. Very interesting car. Thank you.
wow! I missed this one in the 80's. There is a NA GTA for sale in Australia for $18k plus. Thanks again Jack. Another great video of a car that is very interesting.
Hello Jack,
Great to see a French super car on your channel. Certainly a car ahead of it's time! How about a video on the Venturi Atlantique? Very rare in the uk yet, very understated. Great channel by the way.
I remember, as a kid, being told off for sitting in one of these at the Earls Court Motor show shortly after they were launched. Loved it, and always been a bit sad we don't see more of them around.
Haha, (re)discoverd this one last week. I like it a lot :) Greetz from Holland!
Yay !, amazing cars. I used to have a GTA 2.5 V6 Turbo, slightly tuned to about 220bhp. Given the light weight it was really fast with superb handling.
That's (as usual) a spot on review. Let it settle and use the mid-range is exactly how to do it. As a continental express they just chomp high speed autobahn miles. I have had two of those. The second was a daily driver for 18 years, it had the full leather and aircon when I bought it with only 5k miles on the clock. I'd have another in a heatbeat (but with two Alpines already I'd be pushing my luck!).
It was and still is one of the best cars I have driven. Buying one now would need much care, although mine was utterly reliable it would be very easy to buy a lot of trouble.
A very cool car for not a ton of money that still is enjoyable to drive. This would get a lot of attention at a car meet. Thanks for sharing!
I loved these when they came out but we never got them in Canada. Such a cool looking car and so French and quirky.. what's not to like? Great review, Jack.
Thanks for the history lesson. Always loved the look of these cars.
Always loved these. Here's an extra obscure fact: the sleazy businesses man Ken Masters in the 1980s TV series Howard's Way drove one. This is so of it's time, but somehow still achingly cool. Love your vids Jack 😎
Always had a soft spot for these. This is a seriously cool example.
Another really enjoyable review Jack. I'd love to see a Renault 25 Turbo reviewed if one became available.... Same engine as the GTA, wrapped in a Executive Hatchback .... Renault nailed dashboard design for me in the 80's...
Stunning - always loved it
Jack, what I love, and what keeps bringing me back to your channel, is that somehow you keep reviewing the cars that piqued my interest as a teen. Sure, Porsche, Ferrari, etc., are all easy pickings but you find the cars that fit some reason never went completely mainstream but are beautiful.
I remember walking home from school and seeing this Renault (Alpine) in a dealership window and being awestruck. I feel the same way about so name of the cars you review. Thank you for continually walking me down one of the happiest memory lanes of my childhood.
PS. Living in the US and owning 5 Alfa Spiders (in varying states of repair) I love your commitment to Italian pronunciation!! Italy 🇮🇹 Ciao
I was born in 76 and I loved a310. Unique design. A french way for sportcars... with no future.
Great to see this car featured. I owned two back in the day.
I Remember reading about these in Autocar when they came out, loved the look of them then, and still do! This one sounds great too😎, I hope to see it on the track one day🙂
Love your reviews
What a coincidence , I have been seriously interested in buying one for a while as admired them when they were new. Thanks Jack for your usual well balanced , informed opinion and review to help me make a decision.
I own a GTA Turbo and most have a category status due to lack of some parts especially body parts i.e. rear lights etc
I've always really liked this car. Thanks for the review.
One of my favorite car of all time! Thanks for this superior review! These old Alpines are sublime, I adore them much better than the overrated Porsches......
Please test a Volvo 480 Turbo as well! :))
I had a GTA in the late 90's. To this day it's one of the favorite cars out of all those I've owned. I do keep an eye out for D206 TWE in case it's ever up for sale again. According to the DVLA the last time a logbook was issued was Dec 2011 and it is currently SORN. It is still Yellow too 😍 (Was painted in Ferrari Giallo when I bought it, still might have a tin of the paint in the garage)
Was everything you said Jack although the one I had needed a new gearbox 6 months after buying it and the fiberglass was a bit weak around the door mounts. I eventually traded it in for a Saxo VTS 16v.
Great car, great times.
If anyone who reads this happens to know D206 TWE please give us a shout 👍 🖖
Excellent video, really enjoyed. May I ask what the current position is with the De Tomaso Pantera is? It must be 6 months since last discussed.
I remember standing at a bus stop aged 11-12 when these were brand new
Someone local had one and I loved it
Most people were driving around in square boxes like the mk4 cortina
So pleased you've tested one, but Jack I think you need to test all x3 variants. The first one I had a "Majorette" Police version as a kid, and I found the styling fascinating. The mk 2 you've driven was great, at a time when Renault was producing the mad 5 Gt Turbo with the grey cardboard dash and just a year or so before that the even madder rear engined ones famous in the movie "Never say never again" with ironically Fatima Bloesch aka Barbara CARRERA ! Speaking of the screen and what reminded me of the mk3 version it's starring role in BBCs doomed soap Eldorado being the arch villain Marcus Tandy's daily driver, which if I'm not mistaken had an untimely (if totally naff) end by blowing up (whatever they blew up had a very passing resemblance to the alpine).
I remember the glossy mags like "Car" comparing it to the 911 but more often the Lotus Esprit.
Thanks again for the video, part 3 pleeeeease.
Best wishes.
Ben 🇬🇧🇺🇦🚌🚐
I liked these cars when new and still like them now. I don't mind the interior either, it is 'of it's time' as they say. Some in the UK have always had a dim view of French cars and it is possibly that Renault just didn't do a good job of marketing this car here so that all adds up. A great review Jack please keep them coming. 👍👍
You forgot the wacky wipers 😊 very cool cars and loved the exhaust ❤️
The wipers came from Panhards 1960 super high tech 2 cyl aluminum coupe 24CT! Was also installed in the older Alpines!
Absolutely brilliant video jack ❤👍what an amazing car absolutely beautiful ❤️❤️ wish I'd been driving that brilliant
Glad you enjoyed it!!
got to love that cockpit! another great quirky classic that reminds us how monothematic modern cars can be...
I have always loved these cars and my mk 8 davrian is very similar in engine set up with even the same gearbox.
Definitely a bargain car especially with the non turbo car.
An excellent review as always
Gave it a LIKE 2 seconds into the video. Thanks for making it!
I so called wanted one when I was a teenager. Maybe now I might just hunt one down. Great review. Thanks Jack 🙏
I like the B-pillar camera addition.
Thanks for the video mate,I wanted one of these in that colour with black leather but the wife wouldn’t let me as we had to put a child seat in the back.Got a 25 V6 turbo with a straight through fat pipe and it was exactly as you describe loads of lag then whoosh up to red line 😊
A Renault 25 Turbo was the top of the pile for me growing up.... what a privilege for you owning one.
I'm almost certain that stereo is the same as the one fitted in the 25's maybe you remember?
Yeah the stereo was very similar plus it had a talking computer that warned you of all sorts of things but the most annoying was when the electric boot closure had been slammed down by wifey and it would repeat “boot not shut” that brings back memories 😊
I am french and your pronunciation is perfect !
Loved these on the rare occasion I saw them back when I was a kid.
Still cool.
That's pretty cool! Never heard of it.