An introduction to the lorica segmentata
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- čas přidán 24. 07. 2024
- I talk about the lorica segmentata, its origins and how it compared to other Roman armour of the time.
Check out more ancient history content on www.ancientblogger.com and find my podcast, Ancient History Hound wherever you download your podcasts.
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#ancientrome #legionary #ancienthistory #loricasegmentata #romanmilitary #armour
Very nice video, excellent presentation and lovely armour mate :)
Metatron very nice of you!
Keep it up, you are doing a very good job
you know your armor content quality is good when metatron compliments you hahaahaha
If I remember correctly metatron is saying this was more complex and expensive which was probably the reason it was abandoned. Yet here it is called simpler and cheaper. So which is it?
@@lucius5208 ,
The existence of this armor has always made me wonder why no one thought of the concept of the Brigandine far sooner.
Another advantage for logistics is modularity. The segmented bands could be made in several standard sizes and assembled to best fit individual legionaries without having to custom size an entire mail shirt or breastplate
The lorica segmentata was the reason the shields were reduced in size and became more curved. The lorica segmentata could absorb much harder and shaper blows than the lorica Hamata hence the shields could be reduced in size. This in turn gave greater tactical flexibility to the cohort and individual flexibility to legionnaires.
3 words why they adopted the segmentata: arrows and spears. The shoulder segments are positioned as they are to receive and repel projectiles falling from above which the scutum does not cover, especially after they encountered enemies with the range and hitting power of composite bows.
Great video, thanks! Really appreciated the insight at the end with the segmentata being a a symbol of Roman power next to being a piece of equipment.
That made me go check out your podcast, keep it up!
thanks, really appreciate the feedback and I hope you enjoy the podcast.
How the Hell have I not seen this until over two years since it was posted? How the Hell do you not have more subs? Great vid. New sub, and looking forward to going through your vids.
Thanks! Hope you enjoy the other vlogs. Check out my website www.ancientblogger.com for other content if you have the chance.
@@AncientBlogger - Bookmarked. :-)
Nice video, well explained. Greetings from the province of Hispania.
Oscar Ruiz hello back! Thanks for the nice comments.
I really love how well-organized your thoughts are. I came from watching Metatron, and while he creates a good narrative. Your video is simply better structured. The last few FAQ were very nice, too
That's very kind but I think Metatron is excellent, I've got some catching up to do!
Enjoying your content and been listening on Spotify as well. Good work, particularly like how you cover more of the Republic era which I feel gets forgotten by more mainstream Roman history content creators.
many thanks for the nice feedback.
Ave! New sub!! I really like ur videos!! I'm practicing roman renaactment too! I'm in Argentina!
Thank you for this video! I"m looking for some context on how parts of the lorica segmentata function for a character design I have been working on. Most importantly for the shoulder armor. The character is a flying polearm (they exist in a fantasy world where living objects and weapons exist, so uh...yeah, a world populated by mimics). I have this idea of how the character's robot-like wings work, but I realized their shoulders needed some protection from aerial attacks from other flying polearms. I really like the look and design of the segmented pieces of the shoulder armor because it looks flexible for flight. Very light, too.
would love to see the design when you have done it!
I'm a student (currently taking A-Levels) and I love the way that you explain things! Your videos are always so interesting! :)
Elly Tatnell that's very kind of you. If there's ever a topic you'd like to see a vlog or blog article about then just let me know.
5:15 It would have been even cooler if you had a post Dacian War helmet as that would have been even better at proving your point. Awesome video.
One thing that always struck me as strange about this armor is the way its tied up in the front. Won't having one string connecting all of the plates together mean that if it was cut anywhere, the whole armor would be opened up? why didn't they use multiple small strings, one for each pair of loops? That way one of the strings being cut wouldn't loosen all of them.
Good point and it's been suggested to me a few times that there would have been individual ties. I suppose the counter is that anyone getting that close will want to be making a cutting move elsewhere. Also anyone up that close should be easily dealt with.
Who made your lorica segmentata?
From the legionaries point of view, it's weight alone would have been a large enough factor to make it a more popular option. If you look at soldiers through all of history, they almost always choose to carry lighter weapons and armor. And the reason behind that is simple. You are carrying these objects around all day, every day, in all conditions. Very rarely are you actually fighting in them though. Ease of carry and weight are crucial even in the modern era for soldiers.
Very good information. Thanks.
I just got a set, thanks for the great info.
Excellent, hope you enjoy it. Just keeping it maintained is the important thing.
I always wondered what the Romans used to keep their armor and weapons from rusting.The sides of the neck look exposed on the legionnaire. I wonder why they didn't use neck guards like some of the gladiators for draw or slashing cuts?
With any armour there's a payoff between being overly protected and agility. To get to the neck you'd commit to exposing yourself to an easy close strike which was what the legionary was primed to do. There's also the training they would have undertaken to keep these exposed points as safe as possible.
Romans were not medieval knights - their armor was supplied by state officials, which always sought to cut costs...
Top gladiators (prize fighters) on the other hand had de facto unlimited access to best equipment of their day without being concerned about cost or logistics.
Excellent info - thanks !
glad you enjoyed and thanks for the nice comment!
Very well made video kind sir! However, you should note that the upper shoulder plates should be reversed with the pointing bits pointing towards your neck. Based on the Corbrigde Hoard of course!
Considering both this and mail existed at the time, I wonder if any savy legionaries or higher-ranking soldiers realized that they could layer mail underneath their lorica segmentata. It would obviously be an expensive addition to their kit, especially if you are just a conscript or a poorer legionary. Not to mention heavier. But I can't think of a reason why, on a person to person level, someone wouldn't have tried it.
The downside would be weight, combining both would be very heavy and a legionary relied on mobility as much as training to keep him safe.
Great video, thanks. Where did you get the tunic? I like the bit around the neck.
I made the tunic, as for the neck it was called a focale, which prevented chafing. It also adds a bit of style...
Good job. I subbed halfway down the video :p
Love this video .thanks
Good vid - clearly explained!
very kind of you - got a bit too warm in the lorica at times and the mic hated it for some reason.
No doubt constantly wearing armour and training with it would in time mitigate the weight. Even today, the modern infantry man wearing ballistic body armour, webbing and carrying ammunition in pouches, needs training to condition oneself to get used to wearing it.
Very true, after wearing it for a while I get used to it and that's someone way less fit than a younger legionary would be.
11:07 I didn't expect he would be able to dance salsa.
Wondering how many ears got lopped off before the ear thing cover was put on the helmet.
Hey man, awesome video, well done!
I`ve got a question though and I couldn`t find any answers so I thought I could try and ask you:
Recently I got myself a Lorica Segmentata "Kalkriese"/Corbridge A, and although I have no trouble with getting it on my shoulders and fastening it, the lower part of the armor doesn`t seem to quite fit since it stays super round and won`t adopt to my body`s shape, especially on the dorsal side. It looks like I`m wearing a can. Do you have any advice? I`m kind of desperate.
Broxim the shape of the lower part is as you discuss, the bands will mean it has its own shape, not sure it will ever fit snugly. That's something hamata has (often a bit too snug!). It's difficult to say too much without seeing it, are you wearing a tunic underneath or something similar?
I learned a lot of interesting things.
My question is, how do I draw a pattern of segments?
Thanks in advance!👋👍🙏✍
I honestly don't know how you'd draw the segments, it's probably worth looking up lorica segmentata in the context of how they were built. I've seen some good illustrations breaking out the sections (search 'lorica segmentata pattern' and you'll see what I mean). Hope that helps and good luck!
Great video mi man! ¿how did it fare against ranged weapons ?
It'd provide good protection against anything thrown but there would also have been the scutum to help.
So the plates stack up with each other if you set it down? So if I were to buy this and bend over I wouldn't stab myself in the throat because the plates would collapse as I bent over? So this might actually be the perfect armor to wear if you have to do something like sit in a car?
You would also be wearing the Focale scarf for things like that and chaffing
well Romans did have nice straight roads.....
The plates overlap so there's a fair amount of flexibility when you wear it. There may have been chaffing around the next though and Willow makes a good point about how useful the scarf was.
Hey thanks for the reply, I'm just looking for some historical armor that I can actually wear safely while doing things like driving a car, for example, if I am in an accident and my body goes forward I wouldn't want anything to be driven straight into my throat. Even with the scarf I'm not sure that would be safe due to the forces involved, but if it's as flexible as you say perhaps it's not a bad idea. This is very odd though since obviously this wasn't a concern back then lol. Something like a medeival breastplate is probably out of the question since it's a rigid piece that won't move. Segmentata actually looks promising.
@@JohnDoe-on6ru how about not getting into a car accident
Plus the extra weight can actually make it worse
@@steyn1775 Sure, I guess I'll just not wear my seatbelt anymore either then, good idea.
Another issue with hamata is that it is susceptible to thrusting weapons such as the spear, or gladius as the rings can be burst asunder. Flaxen Saxon.
I thought I read somewhere that segmentata became prevalent after the Varus disaster. Being easier to create than hamata when you need to quickly create three legions worth of equipment.
blond knight - interesting point but I'm not sure it was created in responses to one event. I think it was more to help with a growing military. Lorica seg was logistically very useful.
I prefer the Hamata, you can put a normal jacket over it, used to walk with full kit at one point in time,
Hey, I'm doing a project about the lorica segmentata, and I was wondering if you know of any primary sources written about this armor, or if you could name some sources you looked at for this lesson. Thanks.
Hi Aidan, it was a good few years back so I don't have the notes. I can recommend Goldsworthy for overviews. The armour itself doesn't have a great deal of insight from sources, we understand it more from those who have studied it since. Roman Army Talk (www.romanarmytalk.com/) is a very good resource.
@@AncientBlogger Thank you!
Interesting point on denying access to lost loricas. And not only about maintainance, but most enemies would have also had to radically change their fighting style just to fit the newly found armor.
BTW, i think you haven't mentioned (or stressed enough) what was probably its greatest strength: piercing resistance. The hamata offers nearly no protection against arrows and tips of any kind, whilst there is nothin better than the segmentata for that job.
@@es4583 I exaggerated saying "of any kind", as some heads are really not suited to pierce through metal (or break rivets). But i really wouldn't rely on a chainmail under a rain of arrows or, much worse, as the target for a pilum.
Not by chance, the Segmentata came into use right after the disastrous encounter with the Parthians.
Cara!! ficou perfeito essa lórica. 👍
Another note, unlike maille which is incredibly easy to repurpose for any body type, Segmentata will be a pain unless you have a body similar to the previous owner. And if you lack the advanced roman forges needed to make the steel/iron hybrid plates, you can't repair it either.
Wyatt Wilmot interesting point. Legions would have spare parts and good blacksmiths but it would still have been a challenge. Thanks for watching!
Certainly Romans would as they had the logistics to make the plates in the first place, but the enemies of Rome would be hard pressed to come up with the resources to refit a harness. Especially with the annihilation of Gaul and Carthage leaving Romans no peers in western Europe. Goths certainly wouldn't be able to loot it effectively.
Also the main advantage of Hamata and all maille armor is the ease involved in cleaning it. Repairing it or making new sets is incredibly laborious but simple work, but maille is incredibly easy to clean. At least in the middle ages I know that men would roll their maille up in woolen sacks and throw them around like balls for exercise/sport, and sand within the bags/the rings grinding against themselves would prevent the buidlup of rust.
What model of Segmentata is this? I have my eye on the Corbridge A and B but can't seem to make up my mind.
Good question, this is the A type.
What is your confidence that the ridge on the helmet doesn't serve (and or) the purpose of a similar structure on Medieval breast plates and helmets which has been demonstrated to be quite effective at deflecting arrows which when impacting armored surfaces tend to deflect and travel down the armor at weird angles. (demonstrated clearly on Tod's Workshop channel)
I think the ridge was primarily to deflect blows from edged weapons. I'm unsure how much legionaries were exposed to archers at this time. I might have to look into this as it's a good suggestion you have.
Plate Armor like Lorica Segmentata does one thing very well-it makes a hell of a lot of NOISE! "Metetron" showed us thst just ONE soldier jogging towards you from ca 25-20 yards wearing that armor wo`nt hear you if you bark an order at those distances even if you just say "Testudo!" Now add 99 more soldiers or a Cohort(ca 280) or Legion and you get the idea,,,and add the noise from their studded sandals
when I broke into a short run in mine the noise was exactly how you describe!!
If you didn’t wear it while marching in safe country, how did you carry it?
Do you have a Newstead style lorica to show?
dog11222 sadly not, just this one
Could it have helped in the Dacian wars against the falx, which was a hefty slashing sword? Although, I understand the lorica segmentata was introduced before the Dacian wars. Flaxen Saxon.
Good question, I'm unsure how it would have fared vs the falx. The defence against such a weapon was primarily the shield and training! I have heard that changes to the helmet were made as a response in region to it specifically.
How thick are the various plates?
The plates on my lorica are around 1mm thick.
which lorica do you recommend. are the indian made ones any good ?
I bought mine over 10 years ago so I don't know what the current market is like. I would suggest either contacting a reinactment group or going on Roman Army Talk. Great resource (they have a fb group as well). Hope this helps.
Muito bom, farei uma dessas um dia.
¡Thanks! for the video but I dont speak English. I like it the Roman Lorica Segmentata.
Which way was the red plumage worn on the helmet? Sideways, or front-to-back?
TheFamilyguy421 centurions would have a lateral crest (like a rainbow). I think it's the optios who would have the crest most people expect to see. In the Republican armies soldiers would have had a mix of feathers (Hastati) or other crests.
Crests were in reality in various colors not just red(that is another popular fetish on Romans propagated mainly by films).EVERY soldier including ordinary one wore his crest oriented from front to back.Centurions are only rank known to wore it from one side to othe side /ear to ear (so called transverse crest) and we know from Romans themselves it was intentionally oriented like that for Centurions.What crest of Optio looked like-absolutely nothing is known about this but is is unlikely it would be the same as that of Centurions.Most likely it was the same as at any other soldier.Perhaps it had some visual marker to distinguish him from others but if so it is not preserved.We only know safely that they had as symbol of their rank a long staff(long as a human) which they perhaps used also during training and in action similarly to spontons of early modern Europeian armies but even this is not securely known and although we even have relief of Optio in action he simply holds a shield and a sword when fighting enemy.If his helmet had any distinctive crest I cant say since relief is interrupted in preserved part of tombstone just above his helmet skull.How exactly were crests used,in what situations and by whom is actually known sometimes better sometimes worse depending on what time of the Roman army are you asking.
i beg you, if you bought it online send me the link, possibly for both armour and helmet
Sadly the vendor no longer exists. Hope you can find one!
@@AncientBlogger this news hurts my heart. Thx for answering
nice video, but you never mentioned metalurgy
Why were the segmentata found only where the auxiliary were stationed?
wic wong, were they? I'm not sure that this is correct.
In recent years archaeologists have found fittings of loricae segmentatae in many fort sites that are thought to have been garrisoned by only auxiliary troops, i.e., where the legions were not based...
wic wong that's very interesting so thanks for sharing. This may be due to a number of reasons, perhaps they were being stored there? I'm unsure we have any records of auxiliaries wearing segmentata. Much of the time they were lighter armed troops. Segmentata wouldn't have worked well with this. It's something to look into!
thank you for replying you are welcome :P
@@AncientBlogger most of the auxiliaries during the principate were heavy infantry
Why not add hamata-segments to the underarm area? Or conversely, why not add segmentata-shoulder pieces to a lorica segmentata, if these soldiers would really want that protection
Technique and training should really be the defense, you can't be too heavy and more armour sacrifices mobility. Good idea though!
I wonder how good Roman soldiers would have been at American Football.
*starts thinking about puns....😄
You say it is better vs blunt force and it seems to have come into use as the Germanic tribes started becoming perhaps the gravest threat to Rome. I could be basing my thought on a stereotype but didn't the Germanics use warclubs quite frequently?
Could this have been one of the reasons for the segmentata? A warclub being swung over the Roman line formation hitting Roman shoulders could have started becoming a common source of injury/death for the Romans.
It's difficult to summise an exact cause, I sense the lorica was simply an option amongst existing armour as much a logistical decision as anything else. I'm not sure it was due to the Germanic tribes though, but it's good to consider all options. Cheers for the input!
love it, you need more subs! Maybe reach out to Skallagrim or Scholagladiatoria for a shout out
I was wondering about sizing for the lorica segmentata, primarily since I'm a woman with a chest size between 39 - 40. I've found ones that are sized 42" chest, but I've also found one that states "available in chest size 44" but states underneath in brackets "Best suited for chest size 38 - 42". Any help would be great.
Also, I've always been a huge fan of the Roman legion and such, and I was wondering what your thoughts were in regards to women re-enacting as Legionnaires and indulge in the extreme training that comes with it.
I personally have some military training, I was in the air cadets here in my home town for 6 years so being drilled to the bone was pretty regular, especially before CO parades, or when we'd be on the military base, at summer camp etc. That was between age 12 - 18.
We also had "bush weekend" exercises in the middle of nowhere making lean-tos from scratch, digging out fire pits, gathering enough firewood to last the night, which was regarded as that it had to be waist level of the tallest person in your group, and then gather more on top of that, there was some other physical work in that stuff too.
I also worked on a farm for about 10 years (which instead of an advancing army coming toward you and your legion backing you up, rounding up cattle is that a herd and half ton animals is running toward you and you gotta step in front of them to steer them where you want to go... alone), so maybe my attraction to the legion and its demanding physical nature, detailed tactics and strategies and such may come from that pushing my body so much since I was 11 years old playing full contact hockey in a male dominated league..
Great questions about lorica sizing, in short I have no idea but I have tweeted this out (@ancientblogger) so I will see what folk come back with in. I'm not aware of women reinacting in lorica, but I haven't done any reinactment for a few years. As for women reinacting in lorica, I wouldn't have any problems with this, it's not historically accurate but when I reinacted I wasn't speaking latin or an ancient language! If people are enjoying it and engage other people about it then that's what I think is important.
As for the training, I'm unsure whether you're referring to some form of modern training employed by reinactment groups or the stuff the legionaries went through back in the day?
I was actually thinking on the idea of how many inches the strophium would add onto my chest size, so I'll definitely remeasure while wearing a strophium.
To me women reenacting as legionnaires is good since it promotes the act that while we can do a lot of historic reenactment, there can be some things that can evolve to more accommodate for modern people so everyone can have fun, and even more so, possibly draw more people to participate.
When I was referring to training I was referring to the command drills in air cadets, both while stationary and marching which were done as a squadron. A lot of the commands are the same, others have equals, just a different word, for example, where a legion would be commanded to "relax", our command was to "stand easy". So those drill's were the same as used by our military.
The the physical aspect was comparing to the physical aspects of the legion, such as 30km marches while in full kit in less than 5 hours, combat training with a scutum and gladius that are twice as heavy as the service ones, etc.
I really don't know enough about sizing in that context. I will update with any info I get back on twitter.
That would be awesome, thanks.
Perhaps sizing was like Fabrica Cacti and it was all custom. If they made alot of it themselves then it's quite possible they were custom. A theory is that they made stock standard sizes like we have today small, medium and large and the Legionary had to make do. But this my humble opinion mind you.
Lots of People. Show continuous lacing. Top to bottom. One slash and its burst open. Far better the individual laces the. Guard has. Used. Since the 70s.
I have seen that, my lacing up is the lazier version.
Though I would note that if someone is that close to have a free strike then perhaps you have bigger concerns.
Point taken though.
Only if the tv shows and movies have a high enough budget and don't do leather armour
They do have budgets high enough.Still they continue to present shitty image.
Clever folks those Romans ^^
Mh, you remind me of Tom Hardy, the actor
Ave romanus 😮.
... Serbian reforms?
Servian - my pronounciation falters at times!
Andrew Tate?
could not get past a minute of your voice,
spañish!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It´s too big. The slabs are smaller, look more like thicker rigid metal than thin giant curvy sheets
The one that Ben hur use in the old film and in spartacus movies and series that roman centurion uniform from helmet up to body armor looks more realistic. But that sample on this video I think it's for the ordinary roman soldier .
I'd need to watch Ben Hur again but unsure how accurate they were. As you pointed out my armour was largely for regular soldiers and dates to the 1st century AD. As such I wouldn't expect to see it in Spartacus (early 1st century BC). I may have to rewatch that film as well 😀!
@AncientBlogger your roman body armor is nice but as I remember it's for roman legion army because I notice the difference of romans like crassus or any other soldier riding a horse their body armor is not the same as their subordinate. As well as the helmet .
With that kind of armor plating available to even the most lowly rank and file is no wonder the conquered the known world