Sony FX3 ProRes RAW Workflow with Ninja V and Final Cut Pro (FCPX)
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- čas přidán 5. 08. 2024
- Learn how to set up the Sony FX3 and Atomos Ninja V for ProRes RAW recording plus how to import the footage and prepare it for editing with Final Cut Pro X ( FCPX ) on the mac.
I also show examples of how ProRes RAW can speed up post production and make colour correction so much easier and more efficient with better quality results.
Links discussed:
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Register your Ninja V - my.atomos.com/register
The following are affiliate links, if you use these and go on to purchase something then I make a small commission. Thanks for supporting my channel.
Items shown in the video:
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Sony FX3 - geni.us/Mc4njM
Sony 50mm GM Lens - geni.us/NRL7d
SmallRig half cage - geni.us/No7EPwh
SmallRig 4" carbon rods - geni.us/tnQgRS2
Nitze monitor mount - geni.us/VIGVG9
Atomos Ninja V - geni.us/EuxLa
AndyCine Lunchbox Caddy - geni.us/RxCBmxq
Samsung 1TB T5 (stripped) - geni.us/ICAN7
AngelBird 128GB V90 Card - geni.us/z0p6
8K HDMI Cables - geni.us/j6hg9N
DSTE NP-750 Battery - geni.us/4Oyt
Sabrent SATA - USB Cable - geni.us/loqM
Anker USB MacBook Hub - geni.us/VA2vzFR
Additional kit used making the video:
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Sony 35mm f/1.8 - geni.us/4q4LaB
Rode NTG3 mic - geni.us/rYH3
Tiffen Black Promist Filter 1/8 - geni.us/0yLR5
Miller DS10 Carbon Tripod - geni.us/abFXB5
Tascam DR-100 Audio Recorder - geni.us/ZJLX6dc
Table of Contents:
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00:00 - Intro
00:27 - Sony FX3 Setup
02:20 - Atomos Ninja V Setup
04:11 - Luts & Exposure
05:20 - Base ISO Levels
06:24 - Footage Transfer
07:18 - Importing to FCPX
09:24 - FCPX Clip Settings & Luts
10:27 - Working with ProRes RAW Clips
14:21 - Adjusting ISO
15:28 - Adjusting White Balance
Links:
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Supporting Blog Post - www.pauljoy.com/2021/12/sony-...
HashTags:
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#FX3
#NinjaV
#FCPX - Věda a technologie
my first mirrorless camera is the Sony FX3, had it since Christmas and my life has changed. All i do is watch tutorials on how to use it, so thank you. Still not sure what a Ninja V and all that is, but excited to learn.
Really pleased the videos help. Great choice with the FX3. The Ninja is actually less essential with the FX3 than older cameras however it does give you some additional recording options including ProRes RAW. I made a video about that here czcams.com/video/ZfmOaB5sJ7g/video.html
Thank you for this concise and valuable video! Great work.
Pleased it helped, thanks loads for letting me know.
absolutely like it!!!! thanks Paul
Glad you like it!
Thank you so much for this video! Please make more. :)
Glad it was useful, there’s more on my channel and new ones coming soon :)
Great, thanks for sharing!
So usefull.
My pleasure!
thanks a lot, your video was very informative!
Glad it was helpful!
oh man thank you so much ,,, i was busy yesterday whole day with this topic saw lots of another tutorial....but explain so very well i m glad 1000 thanks :)
You’re very welcome, thanks loads for letting me know :)
@@PaulJoy Right now I m looking your auto focus tutorial :) Man U r great . U describe the things so well. ….🙏👍😊☺️
@@syeddanishuddin2026 Thanks :)
Great tutorial.
Really pleased it helped Jon, thanks for letting me know.
You know Paul...I've been returning to some of your videos in regards to using my FX3 and I really think you should think about putting together a paid course along the lines of what Caleb does over at DSLR Video Shooter with his camera guides. You have a great delivery, explain things in an easily digestible way and you clearly understand the camera very well.
Hi Gerald, Thanks for the nice comment. For now I really just want to grow my channel but maybe I’ll look in to that for the future once I’ve started to figure out this YT thing! Happy New Year to you and yours.
Thank you for the workflow… big help especially demoing the limitations between xavc and raw… this makes he use of colour masks and eye drop correction so much easier… I love the fact that in post raw doesn’t impact noise amount like Davinci
Glad it helped
Really glad I have found this Video and also you ! I have subscribed and will be checking out all your other Videos. I have a Sony A7S iii but even though these are all about the FX3, they should suit me perfectly. I have been getting into a right mess over the new Ninja being added into my kit, and also the whole Wide Gamut for Sony A7S iii SLOG3 footage, and I didn't realise until seeing the Video it sorts it out FOR you .. When I have chosen Wide Gamut for the Library it has made all my footage more dark, perhaps if I change back to Standard and re-import it will sort things out. Thanks again and keep up the great Videos ...
Thanks Paul, I'm really pleased the videos helped. I have to admit that I really haven'y messed with shooting HDR or wide gamut settings in post yet as I have had no call for it in production. Thanks again for the nice comment.
Hey, sorry if it’s been mentioned already, but the reason for the slight difference in image size between raw and straight from the fx3 is because raw has no calibration added, where as the camera will add this to adjust for distortion etc 😉
Makes sense, thanks for sharing.
That and active image stabilization, which is off by default with prores raw because all pixels are used on the sensor.
Hi Paul Joy great video! I was wondering I noticed that your raw file could change temperature. So if I record pro res on the ninja V the temperature value can be change in final cut? Did you had to use certain setting for that? Or was it just apple pro res?
Hi Friedrich, the ability to adjust colour temperature in FCPX is always possible with footage shot using ProRes RAW.
excellent!
Awesome info!
What M1 Macs have you edited ProRes Raw 4K on?
What was the experience (play back/frame dropping and Scrubbing the timeline) like?
I haven’t tried one yet although I’m planning on upgrading my iMac to a Mac Studio so I’m expecting a big improvement.
Oh man, Paul! I've been waiting for someone to demo this exact setup! Question: The only ProRes RAW I messed with before was with my GH5S and the Ninja V. I did notice that when it came to noise, in particular at higher ISOs, I noticed much more noise in the ProRes RAW clips than the internal 10bit on the GH5S. I assumed this was because the internal 10bit footage still had the camera performing some of the built in noise reduction where as the ProRes RAW was just taking all the raw data from the sensor with the camera doing nothing to the footage which I was fine with as I get better image quality performing all noise reduction in post with something like Neat Video. Do you know if this is also the case with the ProRes RAW on the FX3?
Hi Gerald. Yes it's exactly the same with the FX3. I've found that sticking to the base ISO's even if it means under exposing slightly is the first step to keeping the noise down although I do prefer to over expose by a couple of stops if I can do so without effecting highlights or skin tones.
If you do have to underexpose then noise can become strong, and will appear to be a lot worse than what you get from the internal recordings with the noise reduction applied. After post processing with NEAT video though the results are better than what you get from the camera, it just takes a lot of processing time to achieve it.
Hey Paul, I’m using the FX-3 and the ninja V is there anything to help with the noise? It’s terrible… or maybe you can recommend a plug-in for fcx that will clean it better than the apple version…
You have to be careful to keep the noise to a minimum. Stay on the base ISO's and if you can expose over by 1.7 - 2 stops (if enough headroom). Neat Video is a very good denoiser although it's very cpu intensive and not something you will want to apply until the end of the edit.
Hi Paul, thanks for your great vids. On 0.56 seconds you talk about switching RAW Output to 'ON'. When I. do this on my FX3 I get a message: This operation or setting not available as follows - Log Shooting - Off. Where do I put this Log. on 'ON'?
Since the v2 firmware update the log shooting option has moved to a dedicated setting. I don’t have the camera in front of me but you should see it on the recording menu.
Great video! Can I record just the internal codec that the camera is recording to the Ninja V? I would like smaller file sizes than Pro Rez Raw. Is that possible? I shoot quick turnaround projects where I ingest the footage and put the SSD back into the Ninja V to allow the reporter to script from the footage and use the source timecode as a reference in FCP X. I still want to use the Nijna V as I don't have another way for the reporter to view the footage. It might be possible off the camera if when using internal SD cards. Do you have any ideas or suggestions?
No the Ninja won’t record XAVC I’m afraid. You have various flavours of ProRes though so you could choose something like ProRes LT for more compact file sizes.
The reason why the raw clips look so bright isn’t because it expects a log clip but because the color space is so much larger in the raw file. It’s REC.2020 HDR.
Interesting, I've not even played with an HDR workflow yet so thats a world of unknown at the moment :)
Great video🎉. Does it work the same way for the Sony fx30 ? Is it worth buying a ninja V for this camera ?
I've not tried the FX30 so I'm not sure, I believe it does though. If you can benefit from ProRes RAW then the Ninja is a great solution and also gives you better exposure and focusing tools. The built in codecs are also very good though.
Great Workflow. One suggestion: Use only Phantom Luts.
I have used them on certain projects but they are not always the right choice. Thanks for the feedback though :)
Hello ! Thanks for video ! So you only had to take the lut of footage recorded on the ninja ? But not the fx3 , pretty much I have a ninja that I don’t use to record , I’m just recording straight from my fx3 in the slog 3 cine gamut , I don’t record with lut baked in , that means I’ll just be able to import my footage to Final Cut Pro and add a lut right , and color grade it ? I saw someone have a video where they put an adjustment layer on footage then put lut , what is that about ?
Yes, recording Log in the FX3 allows you to apply a LUT and then grade from there. Using raw with the Ninja is different because it also requires a raw to log conversion before applying a lut.
An adjustment layer makes it easier to apply a lut or adjustment to many clips at once however it can also makes grading clips individually trickier.
@@PaulJoy oh thanks so much for the reply ! Appreciate your videos , I’ve learned a lot !!
all good thanks, but how can i change this bright and strangely collared in adobe oremiere???
I don’t use Premiere so can’t help with that one. I’m guessing you’re missing a RAW to Log conversion but hard to say I’m afraid.
Hi, did you see any frame drop or any other issues when using lunch box & proress raw?? Thank you
This video was very useful 👌 👍 thank you subscribed
No, I’ve used it quite a bit now and have not seen any kangaroos! Thanks loads for the sub.
@@PaulJoy thank you for replying fast 😊👍
Hey, I was following ProRes Raw when I bought by FS5 and ATOMOS Samari. A few nice advantages on highlight recovery but has there been any significant advances in White Balance control?
Hi there. Yes there is now white balance control using ProRes RAW (in FCPX)
@@PaulJoy Got it - I'll give it another shot with my FX3. Unfortunately Resolve doesn't support WB with ProRes RAW. BRAW looks nice though...
I appreciate all these tips and help but I see your image takes up the whole screen on the ninja and I cannot figure out how to get the output from my fx3 to show on the full screen on the ninja….there are two black side bars like it’s cropped or something
Make sure you have HDMI info turned off otherwise it sends the cropped image out.
Hi Paul, I'm using exactly the same setup: Fx3 + Ninja V. HDMI Output ProRes RAW 4.2Kp25 Compression: ProRes RAW + AndyCine Caddy with a 1TB SSD taken from a T5 drive (freshly formated in the Ninja V).
On your setup it's giving you over 2 hours of record time. I'm only getting 55mins. Do you have any idea why that might be?
Hi Tom, sorry for the late reply. I'm not sure, I'll check later to double check how much recording time I get with PR RAW.
Hi Paul, thanks for sharing your wisdom on all of this. However, how can I make my Ninja V and fx3 record 4k50p instead of 25p? Any idea?
Glad it helped. Yes it is possible, are you using Cine EI?
@@PaulJoy Yes, I do. But I found out that the Ninja V doesn't support 50 frames of 4K. What's annoying is that the fx30 automatically changed the camera settings to 25p without any notification other than the small standard info at the top of the onscreen info. The result was pretty jittering footage.
@@videojournalisten-berlinbe4946 The Ninja V does 4.2K/50 in ProRes RAW with the FX3 so that's not the limitation here. I'd love to try an FX30 but sadly I've not got my hands on one yet. Try switching out of CineEI and see if you're able to send 4K/50 then. First things to check are the HDMI settings and then the 50p option for RAW recording. If you're not using RAW in camera then you wont be able to send 4K to the monitor, it only works with Cine EI recording off or with it on and using ProRes RAW.
Hey, is there any way that we can record 120fps Proress RAW at 4k with the Ninja recorder?
Ninja + can record up to 120fps however the Sony FX3 is limited to 60fps via the HDMI output unfortunately.
Thought when shooting with external raw on ninja with fx3 it doesn't have any noise reduction applied like it does with shooting internally?
That's correct, there's no noise reduction or lens corrections.
@chris Johnson - broooo wassup ? You still got your ninja v+ ?
I thought base iso for Slog3 on the FX3 are 800 and 12800
Am I wrong?
Since Cine EI was introduced they are 800 and 12800 but for picture profiles it’s still 640 and 12,800. This video was made pre Cine EI.
I was following this but on my Ninja V the record and play button on the lower left is grayed out & my screen is cropped on the edges...does anyone know why? I did a reset and still no luck.
The only thing I can think of is that the SSD wasn’t detected? Did you find the solution?
Hi, I didn't think Sony cameras were supported within FCP for specially colour temperature ProRes Raw changes? I've just checked Alister Chapman's tutorial and indeed the colour temp selector (which on yours in active) on his inspector control box under the ISO exposure control slider the Colour temp doesn't have the slider as yours did. Please can you clarify if you can change the Colour Temp on Sony FX3 or FX6 in FCP using just ProRes Raw? Many thanks, Anderw
Hi Andrew. Yes you can change the colour temp, this was added in an update so I'm guessing Alisters tutorial was done before this was added.
@@PaulJoy Thank you for the fast reply Paul. Apple need to update their supported cameras for ProRes Raw because I checked after watching your tutorial (which is very helpful btw so thank you) and on their website it still say only ISO/Exposure for Sony cameras not colour temp as they put for some of the other make of cameras. It's very confusing without wanting to take the plunge and investing into an Atomos recorder. If they can add highlight / shadow recovery next that would be great.
@@RobinsonAndrew No problem Andrew. I'm not sure what the story is there, I guess it must be tricky because Sony, Atomos & Apple all play a part in it. Certainly though you can adjust white balance with ProRes RAW from the FX3, I've not tried the FX6.
Did I understand correctly, if you increase the iso in final cut it won't necessarily increase the noise?
Yes & No!
As far as I understand it (non expert), noise is the result of not enough light hitting the sensor and reducing the signal to noise ratio. ISO in camera controls the gain that is applied to the readout from the sensor to brighten the image but this also amplifies the noise making it more visible.
The only way to change the amount of noise is to let more light hit the sensor. Where this gets complicated is the dual ISO (gain) stages available. Dual gain ISO is achieved by using two different amplifier paths in the cameras circuitry which is what happens you you change up to 12800 ISO. This still applies to ProRes RAW.
So I tend to stick to shooting at 640 or 12800 ISO as much as possible to keep noise to a minimum at capture and then apply ISO in post.
As stated above increasing the ISO in camera or in post will make the noise more visible if underexposed so you have to expose correctly. ProRes RAW does not allow you to cheat the noise out.
[update]
I've corrected this replay after doing a few more tests.
@@PaulJoy I’m glad you made this video and I’m glad that apple has a free 90 day trial for final cut. I’m gonna test it out.
Also there was something I saw that depending on the exposure level the file size will change based on how much extra information has to be grabbed in shadows/highlights. So the worse the exposure the bigger the file it seemed. I don’t know how much of that is real and how much is just a marketing gimmick. Worth checking out though
@@SigmaRealEstateStudios Have fun with FCPX. ProRes RAW is a variable bitrate codec so will record less data for footage with less complicated content. Even at it's maximum bitrate it's around the same as ProRes 422 HQ. www.apple.com/final-cut-pro/docs/Apple_ProRes_RAW.pdf
@@PaulJoy Found the issue, I wasn't under settings
Hi!
Im considering the ninja V for my sony ( this will sound strange at first ) because i would like to buy a red komodo in the future and it would be nice to have a backup Raw besides Red code raw , also iv hear that this can use the same angelbird Cfast 2.0 cards as the komodo. Is that true and if it is do i need some adapter to use them with the ninja?
Hi. I'm not sure about the Red as I've not used one however the Ninja uses SSD's if that's what you mean? I know there are adapters to allow the use of MSata cards but I'm not aware of adapters for Cfast cards.
@@PaulJoy Iv found it already , there are adapters for the ninja that is made for Cfast cards ! So it works as a charm
Just updated my FX3 firmware…no matter what I do- I can’t get ProRes output to go ON. It says that it is disabled
Does it give you any other information? Normally when you get that kind of information it gives a setting or camera state thats preventing the setting from switching on.
I'm having an issue that when I extract the footage from the Ninja V. My computer and my editing software shows it graded. As if it baked the LUT 709 I was using. However, the ninja is able to show me the native color files. But I can't seem to be able to edit the native versions ont he computer.
I see that you sort of tackle this issue with fcpx but I'm using premiere pro. Also the colors previewed by my mac are entirely different than the colors previewed on the atomos.
What software are you using? If FCPX then it might be automatically applying a lut on import. Check the clip in the inspector.
@@PaulJoy I found the solution. I'm using premiere pro. Pro Res Raw files on a mac will have an automatic preview on BT709. Premiere pro does the same. Except that by "clicking" on the file on the project. Effects Contols lets you toggle between BT709 and Slog3. I set them all to Slog3 and i can work from a flat profile.
@@israskates Great stuff, thanks for letting me know.
Can I edit/post production the footage from my fx30 without using the Ninja V or anything else? If so what settings should I use when I am creating a project? All the options in the settings are apple pro res
Yes of course, it records x-avc internally. Which NLE are you using? Most recognise X-AVC without you having to do anything.
@@PaulJoy I am using final cut pro, When I try and create a new project all I see is appleres options
That’s just the setting for transcoded media, you can ignore that.
@@PaulJoy Ohhh ok thank you for the information!! I really appreciate it! I am new to all this (about 3 months) and I am trying to learn as much as I can for the podcast I am creating.
Is it correct that you cannot use stabilisation of the camera when recording Prores to the Ninja?
You can use IBIS but not the geo stabilised data thing because that’s not written to the ninja.
I wonder if you can steal the metadata from proxy file and apply to the raw file somehow?
Can the Pro Res Raw edit in Davinci?
No, they don't support ProRes RAW sadly.
Great stuff Paul. I'm delving into producing more content with a raw framework. Can you (or anyone) point me to some Ninja/RAW videos for correct exposure? (couldn't see one on your channel...yet) ;)
Hi Ben. Exposure is the same as a regular (non raw) slog3.
@@PaulJoy That was a SUPER fast reply, thanks Paul! So, you mean aiming for the +1.7(ish) and zebras at 94+ ?
@@Cheekywekamedia Yes all same rules apply so if you like shooting with 1.7 stop over then same applies. The only caveat is that there’s no noise reduction so be careful if you start moving away from the base ISO or just use Cine EI and never set the EI higher than base.
But if you do use Cine EI then be aware the 94+ zebra level will be different depending on the EI set.
@@PaulJoy Not specifically shooting on the FX3 (on the A1) so don't have El, but this is still by far the best workflow video I've come across!
Morning Paul. Thanks for this film. I know it’s good practice to record in camera also but is it possible to record on the ninja v only and by pass the card slots altogether? Everytime I hit record it keeps notifying me that the internal cf slot is empty. Thanks
Yes there’s an option in the HDMI menu where you can choose not to record internally at the same time. In fact if shooting using Cine EI you’ll have to choose that option in order to get 4K out of the HDMI port.
How to switch off internal recording on the Sony FX3 with an Atomos Ninja V? #sonyfx3 #askpj #Atomos
I find it almost impossible to see anything in this monitor when outdoors. Even indoors its not sharp. My iphone somehow manages to do a better job
It's not the sharpest monitor for sure. I find the Atomos sun hood helps outside though.
What are you doing to fix the barrel distortion from the pro res raw?
It’s not something I’ve had a problem with.